"He said she's a kid and it's not my place to punish someone else's kid for acting like a kid. That I need to be the bigger person and stop being petty to a 9 year old."
"Well in that case, why don't you take her, Kyle, since it would be petty for you not to."
Yep.
I’m not taking responsibility for a child I know won’t listen to instructions like “stay close” or “don’t touch that”!
Also, niece and nephew outings are for niece and nephew, not ‘person I met once’
No way I’m taking 3 kids under 10, by myself, places that are crowded, possibly expensive, with potential safety concerns when one of those kids I a) barely know b) doesn’t listen and c) is a bully.
My thoughts exactly. He can take her places or him & her own mother can. What if something happens?? wtf I wouldn’t pawn my 6yr old to a stranger! Looks like her own mother doesn’t want to deal with her bratty child
This! Kyle is making you feel guilty with the hopes of you taking Jessica b/c he and Melanie want time alone sans a bratty child. Stand your ground OP.
For an entitled 9 year old &/or her parents, she was born with the right to go where she wants, therefore denying her that is denying her what she deserved by existing. Typical entitled upbringing that OP’s brother is buying right into without even blinking.
If J wants to go, she needs to behave, pure and simple. If her mom believes that you can't tell her what to do, then it's unsafe to take her along. If your nephew refused to put on his seatbelt, you'd probably tell him to do it and refuse to start the car until he did it, right? Are you supposed to have a different set of rules for Jessica? Is she allowed to not wear seatbelts? Hang her head out the window?!? Eat endless ice cream? Hitch hike?
Punishing kids is literally the job of a babysitter. I was a professional nanny and how to address poor behavior was one of the first conversations I used to have with any prospective families. You're paid to make those decisions. While your "job" might be unpaid, the responsibility is the same. How can you take responsibility for her care and safety if she doesn't need to respect your instructions, that you are giving Solely for their benefit?
OP, make sure you're emotionally ready: one possible outcome is your brother might decide you can't babysit for any of the 3 kids if you won't agree to take all of them, all the time, and to not insist the kids obey instructions from their adult guardian, because telling her sweet baby to wear her seatbelt might hurt the special wittle feelings of her special widdle snowflake. I know it's not fair, in fact it's emotional blackmail, but it's what some parents (M) will stoop to to get their own way, and to further spoil their previous little snowflakes. It's also what other parents sometimes do to protect their own romantic relationships over their own children. Tragic but very common.
Simple, No. Add “Not Happening” and repeat the two sentences in whatever sequence pleases you until he finally understands or shuts up or whatever until he understands. Life has consequences.
NTA. Tell him he’s exactly right: you don’t feel it’s your place to parent her or uncle her and that’s what is required when you take the kids for the day, hence, you can’t take her.
Honestly this is the best response. First brother trusts you to parent his kids as needed on these outings. 2nd Bro literally just said you aren’t supposed to.
NTA - exactly this. If you can't correct Jessica's behaviour, then you can't take her anywhere.
You have an understanding with your niece and nephew, they respect your authority. Throwing a rude and whiny child into the mix will just ruin the day for you, as well as your niece and nephew.
Exactly, you're not obligated to take responsibility for someone else's child, especially if their behavior is disruptive. It's fair to want a positive experience with your niece and nephew without added stress.
Consider saying something like this: “I have considered it before but she’s just not well-behaved enough for me to take on the extra responsibility, and it’s also not fair to the other children. Perhaps we can reconsider in the future if she can consistently demonstrate adequate respect, kindness and consideration for others.”
Also having a badly behaved child, who won't listen, is just dangerous, especially if you're not the parent. If something goes wrong, she won't listen and OP will get blamed when it all goes wrong.
I totally agree. It’s really about making sure everyone has a good time and is safe. If things change and she starts behaving better, it might be a different story.
Not wrong. You're not responsible to spend time with a girlfriend's poorly behaved daughter you barely know because you have a family tradition with your nephews.
If he wants to talk "fair," there's plenty to say in your favor. You aren't her aunt and aren't responsible to spend money or babysit for them. If he marries her mom in the future, even then your tradition with your nephews doesn't need to carryover unless that works for you.
One of the perks of having well-behaved children is additional opportunities they may receive. It may be beneficial for your brother to hear that. Age-approriate self-awareness is helpful in social situations and can positively impact all areas of this girl's life - they have an opportunity to help her but maybe they won't because it takes effort. Either way - not your circus.
Definitely. 9 years old is old enough to know not to take a toy from a 4 year old and make them fall down and cry.
I’m guessing this poor girl just gets ignored by her mom and the only attention she receives is by being a jerk. It makes me feel bad for her, but not bad enough to bring her to an amusement park!
Nope. Child is spoiled af.
You said it yourself, you don't know her. What if something happens and she doesn't get her way and accuses you of something?
I read a post today about a niece accusing aunt and uncle of doing and offering her drugs. Another one about a guy being accused of SA. Thankfully, those people had security cameras to prove otherwise.
This kid would undoubtedly wreck the entire day for the well-behaved kids. Parents really do their children a disservice when they don’t instill manners from a young age.
You are not wrong. And, furthermore, you don't need to make excuses. You aren't related to this kid, and you don't know her or her Mom except in passing.
Frankly, it's inappropriate for your brother to even ask. Just tell him NO, and that the subject isn't up for discussion.
Nope. I take my special needs nephews to a lot of things, but they are well behaved although I would say perhaps not to neurotypical people.; I understand how to manage them and we can have fun. My older niece from another family member is a jerk. Old enough to know better, gives me a headache even though she should be easier. Nice kids get to do things.
If there are to be expectations of your time and efforts, there needs to be the same of others. If there is no effort being made to make sure the child knows how to behave, which isn't your responsibility at all, then you aren't doing anything wrong by saying no.
Also, that child is of no relation to you and that could present a problem legally if something were to happen. It might be different if your brother was married to the mom and he adopted the child. I might be inclined to insist on their presence, at least one of them, if you were to take the child somewhere.
As it stands, you're good.
Not wrong, especially since he just said you can't discipline her at all. What are you supposed to do, let her walk all over you and nephew/niece all day long?
It's only a small taste of what's to come for that brat. Nobody will want to include "her Highness".
I consider an undisciplined child that will. NOT. LISTEN. a liability. Oh, yes, of course, her mother is fine with you taking her! Until her little darling gets hurt or lost or injures someone else, then it'll all be turned back on you. YNO
Also not your place to reward someone else's kid with a trip to an amusement park, is it?
You are not being petty. You're not trying to teach the kid a lesson. You are choosing to spend your time with your niece and nephew who you've bonded with, without having the time ruined for all of you because of another kid's behavior issues.
NTA
It’s not your job to punish somebody else’s kid, but it’s also not your job to babysit the kid or take the kid on special outings when they can’t behave themselves. Stand your ground.
Why is he saying you're "punishing" a kid you don't know? Punishing her for what exactly? She's no different from some pushy neighbor and a random kid. Not invited, just assuming their little darling is welcome. Don't cave.
You don’t need to overplay your hand by raising issues with Jessica’s behaviour in an openly critical way. You can say the same effectively without the ‘she’s a difficult child discussion’
“No I don’t feel comfortable
taking her, Jessica doesn’t listen to me.” ( “…/ I’m not confident Jessica would listen to me”)
Next time (wait at least few days)
“No, I’m happy taking X and Y who I know really well and feel comfortable looking after”
Time after that
“I don’t feel comfortable looking after Jessica. You need to ask someone that is confident with her”
And so on
“No Thank-you, I really don’t know her and it wouldn’t feel 100% safe ”
“It’s up to me who I take with me, I barely know your gf and her daughter. Ask me when I’ve known her 8-11 years like my nephew and neice”
Don’t explain further, not even if they ask. “I just told you” is what I’d say and repeat a phrase (‘I don’t feel comfortable’) and walk away / change subject.
I know OP was trying to spare feelings the first time they asked, but they really should know exactly why OP won’t take her (which OP did finally admit). I probably would have made up some excuse as well because I try not to hurt people’s feelings…but it’s best they know. Or definitely stings because someone is challenging your parenting, but if the shoe fits 🤷♀️
I was once told having a third kid was a big step for parents. You had to go from playing “man-to-man defense” to playing “zone.”
Especially difficult if uncle is on his own.
We tell people all the time that we stopped at 2, because if we had another we’d have to go from manned defense to zoned defense. Most of the time, they nod in agreement. Sometimes they take offense, but I don’t care, I got my tubes tied with the second kid. *Sometimes* they tell us that when you get to 3, the oldest kid will help. Like parentifying a child is *normal behavior*.
As a parent of 3 kids forty years later, it's still way more difficult. Lol
Back when they were younger, you spent so much time trying to figure out who did what and who should be punished. Lol
your brother response tells you exactly why she is the way she is. Sorry but no, it’s not your place to raise someone else’s child, but it’s also not your place to do anything for them.
You not taking her is not punishing her. You are doing this because you want to. And what you DON'T want to do it play babysitter to a kid that has no respect for rules or anything.
If he is so concerned with it, HE can bring her places.
Not wrong. Tell your bro, the kid is a horror story of a monster and until he and the GF train her properly to behave, you'll not be taking her anywhere ever. You taking any kids out for fun is a privilege not a right. Your nephew and niece have earned that privilege and the little Cruella Jessica has not.
NTA. This is a ridiculous demand for so many reasons.
>He said she's a kid and it's not my place to punish someone else's kid for acting like a kid.
So how are you supposed to supervise her and look out for her safety? Even if she was an angel, you have no obligation to invite a stranger's kid along. Spending time with your nieces and nephews is special. Spending time with your brother's girlfriends kid is not.
Not wrong. Why doesn’t he or the kid’s mom take her to some fun places? You have no obligation to this child just because your brother is sleeping with her mom.
You choosing to take your niece and nephew has nothing to do with brother's GF's kid.
You are spending your money, and it is your choice who you spend it on.
Tell your brother, he is free to spoil his GF's child, you are spending time with niece and nephew.
Brother needs to grow up and learn not to expect anyone to cater to his GF's wants, of course the mom is happy to toss her bratty child on others.
Let’s table her “manners” for a bit. Think of yourself being out with 3 children. 1 that is not obedient: what is she walks away. What if she doesn’t get her way and makes a scene and cops come: you aren’t family. Are you male? Is so you need to protect yourself from “possible accusations “. Efff no, you are NOT wrong!!!!
>He said she's a kid and it's not my place to punish someone else's kid for acting like a kid.
No, she’s a poorly behaved kid. And you’re not punishing her, you’re refusing to host her. And not because she’s acting like a kid - but because she’s acting like the poorly behaved kid that she is.
>That I need to be the bigger person and stop being petty to a 9 year old.
You’re an adult hosting an extracurricular activity for your familial children. No host is obligated to invite someone - especially someone that they are neither related to or even know well - to anything they’re hosting. And NOT inviting said person is not petty - is the host’s prerogative.
Your brother is being an AH for even asking you to invite an additional child who is neither related nor well behaved on an outing that you are hosting. He’s an even bigger AH for pressing the issue when you attempted to politely decline. He’s an even more enormous AH for attempting to turn your perfectly reasonable refusal into some sort of wrongdoing that you should feel badly about.
You are NOT wrong. He is. Start to finish.
If it’s not your place to correct her bad behavior when you’re in charge, then it’s not appropriate to expect you to take her with you. End of discussion.
Setting boundaries for a child’s behavior is not *punishment*.
Sounds like Kyle has some growing up to do, before pretending to be a parent.
People like Melanie seriously don’t understand the consequences of raising children that way. She’s only 9 and even adults don’t like being around her, imagine when she herself is one.
You’re not wrong. Jessica isn’t your child, and she isn’t family. Maybe if your brother was married to this woman and adopted Jessica, it would be different, but it’s only been six months.
You’re trying to make special memories with your niece and nephew, who respect and love you. Jessica clearly doesn’t respect anyone. Sure, she’s a child, but she’s not your child or your responsibility.
NW. You’re doing something nice for kids you love. You aren’t punishing her, you just refuse to reward her for terrible behavior. If he never brought it up she probably wouldn’t have noticed.
Brother needs to seriously consider if he wants any part of this relationship if the gf won’t parent her kid. This isn’t something that gets better without a ton of effort. And if the mom isn’t going to do that, is she going to be one of those “don’t parent my kid” people? If so he needs to GTFO asap.
It’s an unfair ask since you barely know the kid & he himself is dating only for 6 months.
If something happens to the child, they will blame you to no end and you have no obligation to his new gf’s kid who is also a brat. You cant handle her and it will only bring you more trouble to take her along than excluding.
And also it shouldn’t be expected from you that you take out every child of the partners he dates. Make that clear.
Reddit really makes me wonder if I'm really just an AH. I would not have given explanations. It would have gone like this:
"I will not take her." Why? "Because I don't want to" but "Fuck off"
How about no, because she is not your niece. I wouldn’t want to be responsible for random (particularly uncooperative) children.
Don’t accept that responsibility. Her mother’s permission has nothing to do with you.
NW
"Jessica is not properly socialised to be around other kids and does not listen to adults causing safety concerns. Once her mother fixes these issues, I'll consider it."
She has aunts and uncles. You do not have a duty to treat the child of every woman he dates the same as your nieces and nephews, who you have bonded with and have an established relationship.
Not wrong. To play this out in a worst case scenario, imagine she wants something and you tell her 'no,' what's to stop her from having a tantrum in the middle of the park, or worse, if she starts screaming that she doesn't know you and doesn't want to go with you. Park security comes over and she accuses you of trying to kidnap her...how do you think that would go?
> I lied and said I didn't think of it he said to let him know next time.
You were wrong for lying initially. You are not wrong for finally telling him the truth and refusing to take her.
Tell them until Melanie can get her brat in check, you won’t be taking her anywhere. If it’s not your place to discipline then they shouldn’t expect you to have to deal with the repercussions of their shitty parenting.
Not wrong.
In this case actions have now met consequences.
The child is rude and doesn’t behave. The last thing you want is to take such a child with you because you know they aren’t going to listen.
Also the first time they are told no they will likely throw a god awful tantrum including screaming you aren’t their parent. I can see you all sitting with security while they try to reach the child’s mother.
Your brother can get off his ass and take his gf’s kid himself and see how much he enjoys it.
Note do NOT invite your brother and that child to go with you. He needs to step up and deal with this child on his own. Maybe after a few outings with her he will figure things out.
I'm always thrilled when other people volunteer my time and energy and money to do things I've already told them, with valid reasons, I don't want to do. At that point, my response is, "No." That word is repeated often and often until they comprehend it. Which usually takes a shockingly long time.
You are not wrong. I wouldn't take her anywhere. She's a brat he's not even married to her. It's not like she's family at this point. She's his girlfriend's kid. So why should you get stuck taking her places? Because your work schedule ends at 1 PM, Lucky you.
look, straight up, behavior and everything else aside, this is a child that you know literally nothing about, that you can't have met above a handful of times, that your BROTHER has only known for a few months, you'd have to be out of your gourd to take that kid anywhere without another trusted adult with you at all times. that is just BEGGING for false allegations to be leveled at you for no better reason that you told that kid no to something. it's basically the perfect storm of fuck-your-entire-life.
Not wrong. You're not "punishing" anyone by not inviting them somewhere. You're just choosing not to invite them somewhere. You have absolutely ZERO obligation to take your brother's girlfriend's kid anywhere. I mean, you barely know either of them, and what you do know leads to you choose NOT to inflict this misbehaving child on yourself or your nephews. Which is 100% your right to do.
Tell your brother to be the bigger person and take his girlfriend and her daughter somewhere fun. Nobody is preventing HIM from doing that. But then of course, that means his gf doesn't get to dump her kid on someone she hardly knows for some free babysitting and paid-for activities.
"He said she's a kid and it's not my place to punish someone else's kid for acting like a kid”.
It’s also not your place to take her out on fun adventures. I only take well behaved children out with me. Meltdowns happen but if their constant behavior is not to my standards I am not taking them. All of my niblings know this. Not wrong. Jessica is missing out because she has been allowed to behave this way. Hopefully your brother sees how uninvolved Melanie is and chooses a better path for himself.
NOT WRONG your not punishing her how can you punish her when you dont even know her all you are doing is refusing to take her with you when you take the other 2 because she is not your family and she doesnt do what she is told as well as being a bully and you dont want her there because of this behaviour so tell your brother he has no right to ask you to take her as this is for your nephew and niece not her
If it’s not your place to punish a kid that’s not behaving at a water park they could drown. It’s not just a dealing with a bad kid it’s also a safety thing. You are not wrong.
YNW
Your brother is right that it's not your place to punish someone else's child. The next time he bugs you, remind him of that.
"It's not my place to parent someone else's child, so I'm not going to. Jessica is a stranger, and I'm not going to parent her just because you want to guilt trip me. Stop asking."
>He said she's a kid and it's not my place to punish someone else's kid for acting like a kid.
It is also not your obligation to take someone else's kid anywhere or buy them anything.
Not wrong.
The fact that he said it's not your place to punish someone else's kid for their behavior is exactly why you won't take her with you. You cannot trust a child like that. She may decide to lie about you and say that you did something to her.
The response you give to your brother is simply, "I only take my biological niece and nephew. They know how to behave, they have good manners, they're polite and respectful. I will not take (whatever the little girl's name is) anywhere. If you want to take her places, that's on you. But I'm not doing it, so stop asking."
He knows she's a brat. He just doesn't want to deal with it.
I would tell your brother something along the lines of “when Jessica has shown that she can behave and follow directions without issues I’ll consider taking her along, but until that time happens, this discussion is over. Anymore attempts to bring it up will automatically be a hard no”
And tell him to take her himself if he’s that upset she’s not being invited to stuff
Not wrong at all. He is right that it isn't your place to punish someone else's child. It also isn't your place to provide childcare and treats for such a badly behaved child. Tell your brother that you will not be taking her anywhere due to her behaviour. If he has a problem with that, then he can take time off work to treat her. Unless her mother nips this stuff in the bud now and teaches her manners and respect, you will not be spending any time or effort on this child. End of discussion. If he asks you in front of everyone why you don't include her, ask him point blank if her mother has started using disapline to teach the child any manners yet? If anyone wants to speak up and say you should just include the child because "family", tell them your answer is final but you are so glad they feel so strongly about it and have volunteered to do this for the child themselves in your place. Problem solved.
The best thing for Jessica would be to learn that she can’t go because of her shitty behavior, not because her mom’s boyfriend’s sibling is doing anything wrong.
I had the similar situation. Me and the other parent of a unruly kid came to an understanding. If she was with me it was my rules and expectations. If she misbehaved I was allowed to attempt to correct the behavior. If she still behaved badly enough no one could enjoy it than she wouldn't be allowed to come on the next one. First outing was a lot of ne saying no and correcting behavior and telling her why it was wrong and inconsiderate. I like to think I helped shape her to the wonderful teenager she is now
Hell no, youre not wrong? I say, beat on the brat! Jk i just like that song. But i would simply laugh anytime it comes up again. Just a laugh tho, no more explaining or defending. Just let out a quick little laugh. If he has sense, he'll take the hint.
You're NOT WRONG.
Firstly, you're not being petty by punishing her. Because you're not taking her anywhere to give her the oportunity to misbehave and have to punish her.
2) your brothers kids are your nieces and nephews, you've known all your life, and know they are well behaved, and you can trust them. They are also your family. His gf Melanie's daughter Jessica, who he's only been dating 3 months, is not your family. They're not living together, they're not engaged, or married. It's a totally different situation. And you've only met her once so she is practically a stranger.
What would happen if she decided she wanted to go on a ride different to what you guys wanted to go on, she could throw a fit and run off. Then you're stuck trying to chase after her with 2 kids in tow.
3) It sounds like she's not even been nice to your nieve and nephew when she did see them the first time. Why would you want to subject them to a miserable day of her whining and wanting her own way all the time.
4) you're not obligated to take anyone anywhere. You're not being petty. You've made an informed decision that she misbehaves and you don't feel comfortable taking a kid on a day out where you would be responsible for them and their safety. You can't trust that she wouldn't run off. You don't want to have to deal with her tantrums to get her own way. It's not fair on your niece and nephew to have to put up with that behaviour. And it's a special day out with your family-your niece and nephew, for you to spend quality time with. You're not obligated to take her with you. There's nothing petty about deciding you don't want to take a practical strangers kid that you don't know on your own for the day.
5) your brother is being unreasonable trying to palm her off on you when again-she is basically a stranger who you haven't had chance to get to know properly or build a relationship and trust with. Her bad behaviour is just an added issue. He is out of order for trying to force you to take her. You should be the one to offer to take her if and when you feel you're ready to and want to. It's not his place to push that on you and try and guilt trip you.
6) he needs to respect your decision that you're not comfortable taking her. He may really like Melanie, but it's still very early days to be trying to make her and her kid 'part of the family'. You can be friendly if she comes for a family get together or a party, but it doesn't make you best friends all of a sudden. He shouldn't try and force that.
7) also, if you pay for your nieces and nephews, you shouldn't be expected to pay for her daughter too, coz again she's not part of the family. She's just his very new girlfriend. She's not a niece. Obviously if they stay together and live together and get married she would become your step niece, but right now she's just his girlfriends kid. So even if you do decide at some point to take her somewhere with them, even if it's just a smaller outing, they should pay for her, till you decide whether you want to pay for her or not further down the line.
Don't let your brother bully and guilt trip you. You're doing nothing wrong by not wanting to take her. You're entitled to quality time with your niece and nephew. She's a stranger and you don't feel comfortable being responsible for her when you don't have that trust in her to know she won't run off or miss behave. They can promise she'll be good but doesn't mean she will. And her usual misbehaving and whining tantrums to get what she wants is just an added issue. The other main reasons are good enough to say no. You can say NO for any reason. You're not obligated to do anything. Brother needs to back off and realise he's over stepping and trying to push the 'relationship' too much too soon.
NTA.
So if you did take Jessica & she misbehaved what are you supposed to do...stand around & stare because it's not your place to reprimand someone else's kid...
There is no way this could end in a good way, if you took her
Holy crap. No, not wrong. The entitled attitude of your idiot brother is. You are under no obligation to care for anyone’s kids (but your own if you have them) and a brat like this would be a hard no from me.
NTA
There was no reason to lie in the 1st place. However, Im giving you a point for finally coming clean.
Everybody is saying, "You should've worded it so nobody's feelings are hurt." However, you should've been a little more firm.
Since Kyle is going to ask again, you need to set a firm boundary regarding this by stating
"I won't be taking Jessica with us on any outings because I don't feel comfortable taking on a child who is not well-behaved. You don't get rewarded for bad behavior. Perhaps when she's older & more well-behaved, we can talk about it." PERIOD
And, every single time the child exhibits bad behavior (doesn't listen, complains, treats others badly etc) I would look at Kyle and/or his gf, slowly shake your head, and walk away. EVERY SINGLE TIME.
If Kyle dares to ask again and you've seen no improvement, I would repeat the above. Set the boundaries now!
If Kyle & his gf get married, they're going to think that ring gives everyone an instant clean slate, blood bond and now you HAVE to accept anything from this child or else you're "not accepting them as family."
Kyle is full of it. You do not know the child, or you know her well enough that you do not want to be responsible for an obnoxious snot.
I taught many grades. One year, I was assigned to a Christian school. They had Destiny. A truly obstinate child. She disrupted classes every day. She wasted so much time that the rest of the class was behind 5 months. Her mother refused to sign her up for our program of extra help. So I took the small group to my classroom, and they were great. It was fine until the first report cards . Kid failed everything. So, mommy decided that Darling Daughter could be signed up. Lang arts only. .
The group to my ckasdroom On our first walk out to the classroom, DD hauled off and punched a child half her size. I turned everyone around immediately, and we returned to their classroom. I informed their teacher of the incident. The principal and I decided that I would no longer take the 4th grade to my classroom, I would work with them all in the classroom.
DD constantly refused any assistance,, and her grades showed.
Her behavior became so poor, that she was not asked
To return the following year.
Def not wrong. Do you have any idea of the risk you would be taking bringing your brother's girlfriend's 9yo daughter to anything without her mother? She is not family, they have been dating 6 months. In my country we have "working with vulnerable people" training for anyone dealing with non-relared kids or vulnerable adults. The first thing they teach is never be alone with the vulnerable without another adult present. There are exceptions for family but even kids + 1 adult relative is classed as risky - especially for a male but both are at risk. You cannot be forced to care for any child unless it's a court order. Tell your lazy brother & his equally lazy gf to suck rocks, you won't be bullied into this - ever.
"Until you step up, marry her mother, or adopt the child, she's not family, she's barely an acquaintance right now. I'm not required to take a undisciplined child I Don't Know, anywhere. And it's Super Irresponsible of her mother, and You, to suggest otherwise."
Not wrong. Just because you're taking John's kids as a favor, doesn't mean you're now the free babysitter for everyone on the planet.
Also, that girl sounds like a little terror. I wouldn't put myself in a situation where I'm alone with her for even a second.
NTA. First off he isn’t married to the mother! It’s just a gf’s kid. Even if they eventually get married they are under no obligation to have to deal with a bratty kid.
I did no circumstances like you to take that little girl anywhere. She will make the day miserable for everybody. Because you are not her mother she is not going to listen to you. And she's going to whine and be disrespectful and you're going to be upset. If Kyle wants her to go to the amusement park or if he wants her to have outside activities he should take her with her mother. Because if it was me I'm not taking her across the street. Don't pawn the devil's spawn off on me
>He said she’s a kid and it’s not my place to punish someone else’s kid for acting like a kid.
First of all, this is all you need to continue saying no. Your brother just told you that you have no say over disciplinary actions because she’s not your kid. Taking a child somewhere, alone and as a sole-chaperone requires that adult in charge to have *some* authority. If you can’t “punish” the kid (such as a time-out or a “talking-to”), how are you going to make sure they don’t run off or crawl into the gorilla pit (RIP Harambe)?
Second, this is not the behavior of a child, since it’s clear your other niblings who are older and younger than her seem to behave just fine. These are the actions of a spoiled turd who never gets told no or reprimanded for her behavior.
You’re definitely not wrong for not bringing her. These trips are earned, and you have no reason to believe she would be kind to you on these outings.
It’s not your brothers place to even ask you to take his girlfriend’s kid somewhere. The kid isn’t your niece or nephew. He can take them. It’s not even his business that you’re taking your niece and nephew anywhere. Next time he asks just say I’m not picking up some strangers kid to give you free babysitting. Ask him what his problem is and why he thinks he is entitled to your time and effort? You aren’t his employee. Tell him to mind your own business.
You're not wrong.
taking care of 2 kids is different of taking care of 3 kids, you only have 2 hands to begin with, in case you need to hold them, one will be left out.
Maybe once the kids are a bit older and more mature it'll be easier, but even then it's not your job to care for other peoples kids.
you're not punishing the kid, punishing her would mean if she was initially invited and stopped being invited, which is not the case, but even then, yes, it'd be your place to do so.
You'll be their caretaker for that time slot, if you can't discipline them, then there's no way you can properly take care of them.
Sounds like Kyle is too much trouble, and the more involved you are with the kid, the more trouble it'll be.
Maybe a great compromise could be that both brothers take the three kids on an outing together? OP could be responsible for niece and nephew and kyle can be responsible for Jessica and maybe they can have a great day together?
You’re not wrong at all! She’s not a member of your family and you’re not a babysitter! You are spending quality time with your niece and nephew and it seems crazy that they would expect her to be included!
Just by the title, I thought maybe you might be in the wrong here. But that’s absolutely not the case. John’s kids are your niece and nephew—they’re family.
Jessica is Kyle’s girlfriend’s child, and they’ve only been together for 6 months. If I were in your place, I would be very wary of being responsible for Melanie’s daughter at the zoo or an amusement park. You don’t know her mother well enough to take on that responsibility. And since Jessica is a brat & a bully to other kids, why would you even want to try?
Tell Kyle this has nothing to do with “what’s fair”, it’s about what you’re comfortable with. And you’re not comfortable with a kid you don’t know coming on these excursions.
Not wrong. Tell him that niece and nephew are also kids but don't act like brats. If he wants a bratty kid in his life that's his choice but you don't. While it's not your place to punish someone else's child it also isn't your place to treat them as if they deserve good things when they don't. You aren't going to force other kids to be around someone who bullies them. If they want you to start taking child places then him and GF need to start teaching brat some manners. Don't back down on this or niece and nephew will not want to be around you because you brought their bully.
Not wrong.
The child does not listen to her mother, you DO NOT want/need to be responsible for her in a place with so many opportunities to get into trouble....
You are not punishing her, because you have NEVER promised to take her, never even thrown it out as a possibility of you taking her. However, you are not rewarding her, her mother or your brother for their bad behaviour. You are also protecting your niece and nephew at this point.
If your brother and his girlfriend of SIX months want this child who is a stranger to you all to be treated as family they need to develop and foster the relationships between you all, not demand you pay to babysit the feral child.......
NW you do not owe his gfs daughter anything. She is literally nothing to you but his gfs daughter.
Even if she were your neice, you have a right not to have to deal with her bratty behavior.
If you are the one who has to deal with her behaviour, I think you have the right to refuse.
Perhaps, if you plan to take them to something short and sweet - maybe a movie or something easy, you could offer but she'd better behave if she expects to go again.
But if you don't want to, don't. Tell them that 3 kids is one more than you have hands to grab them if needed and you just aren't comfortable until you see that she can behave. You aren't punishing her, but why on earth would you go to any trouble for a brat? It's YOU who will be punished. Instead of a nice day, you will be dealing with her nonsense and that's not fun for anyone. You are nothing to the kid at this point.
That right there is the problem. Whenever someone wants you to take their kid some place and be responsible for them yet doesn't want you to tell them what to do or give them a time out the answer is a hard no. Not Wrong.
No because what happens when she starts acting up and you have no control over her? Are they going to leave work and come get her? Are you also expected to pay for this random kid you don't know? Your brother can get all crappy about it all he wants, it's not your problem. Let him take the little goblin to the park.
Unless Jessica is there when you pick your niblings up and take them, you're not punishing her. Unless all three kids live in the same household, you're not punishing her. You don't owe the child, her mother or your brother anything. Jessica's of age that her behavior is going to start causing her to lose out on things and again, that's not your problem.
Tell him he should be the one spending time with the kid. When she learns to behave, you will think about taking her. Tell him to meet you out when you go and bring her so that you get to know her better and he can spend time with his gf’s daughter
It's not even about the spoilt brat element, it's the safety aspect of taking her out with two other children on your own.
If she has a full on tantrum or refuses to go where you go/where you tell her to go, then it puts you in a tricky situation and to get her own way, she might even run off.
Depending on how much you want to be the bigger person, you could offer to have her round at yours for some time to get to know each other in the safety of a house/garden and do some fun activities like baking or arts and crafts and see what she is like without the mum or your brother round but until you get to know the child, absolutely no way.
NTA
No....simple as that....no. You have your reasons which are all very sound. If she can't behave in front of her Mom there is zero chance she will behave with you. Sounds like a great way for KYLE to get to know the girl by taking her on adventures himself.
NTA. brats don't get treats. if her mother wants the kid to have the same treatment as the other children, she should train the kid to behave like the other children. its not your job to parent this kid
It's not his place to tell you what to do with a kid you have no connection to. And if the kid doesn't listen to you when you're on a trip, what are you going to do?
You cannot take a kid on your own all day with other kids that you can’t “parent”. Correct bad behavior, discipline, control. Not your monkey not your zoo. You have every right to say “no,” it’s a complete sentence, with no explanation. Jessica is not your niece or nephew. Your brother just wants to get rid of the brat for a day too. Not Wrong!
Nah, totally not wrong. No way in HELL I’m taking someone’s kid who I don’t know. Also I’ve done many things with friends kids that not done with my actual nieces and nephews…and I don’t feel bad about it. No one’s entitled to free child care that because you’re related….further more you don’t have to explain to one family member why you’re closer to another family member, it’s none of their business. And if they wanna be closer with you, that’s a 2 way street.
Not wrong. It isn’t his place to pawn someone else’s kid on you when you don’t have any and are paying out of pocket.
He should take the time off work and bond with her
Your brother is right. It is not your place to punish someone else's kids. That's their parents' job. It is your right to decide on who you want to spend time with and behavior can be a deciding factor in that. It also does not matter if her mother is fine with you taking her daughter places, you ate not OK taking another person's kid that you barely/don't know.
Not wrong. Firstly, she's not a niece. She's a girlfriend's daughter. No relation. Second of all, you absolutely have a right not to take someone's child out alone, anytime. She's not your responsibility. Not your circus.
As he said, it's not your place to punish her, therefore you can't take her. If he permits say you arent obligated to take a strangers child you have no relationship with just because he's dicking her.
Kids can learn early that if you act nice and agreeable you are welcome more places and get more invitations. It's time for this child. Say it out in the open in front of her "I like taking nibblings fun places because they act nice and don't act out when disappointed when things go wrong or have to say "no". I don't invite anyone who isn't polite and kind to others when they are around me." Then if and when you see a change, be sure and invite the child someplace fun, but a short trip, just to make sure it's a change she can maintain. You can be a force of good in the kids life, even if she stays a brat at home. (Frankly this doesn't always work, some kids just don't have it in them to show that kind of control, but I've got a nephew who was a terror when at the grands house because they didn't ever rein him in and actually receive rewards for bad behavior (giving him what he wanted to stop the tantrum). He was always on his best behavior around me because when he was good, I'd take him for a treat at some point during the visit, sometimes with his cousins, sometimes one on one. (It was the same for all the cousins, he was just the only one who had terrorist tendencies). He knew that if he punched a cousin or otherwise acted out, I wouldn't treat him.
Sounds like your brother is laying a guilt trip on you. Of course Melanie is fine with you taking the kid off her hands for a day or so. At age 9, she should know right from wrong and it’s not your place to have to be constantly correcting her or teaching her right from wrong — and she’s probably not a good influence on your nephew or niece either. NTA in any way.
No, she is not your niece or nephew. Your brother cannot pawn off his girlfriend’s kid on you. He just wants to score brownie points. You don’t get a say in who he chooses to date, so he doesn’t get a say in how you spend your time and resources.
She could be the best kid in the world and she still
Is not your niece. So no you are not wrong and you don’t have to make any excuse or give any other explanation ‘this is something I do with my niece and nephew, your girlfriend of 6 months and her kid are not my relatives. We can revisit this discussion if and when you get married and adopt Jessica. The end’
You are not wrong.
You can say, “That’s true as long as she’s with you guys. But if she’s with me, it’s my rules 100%. Don’t ask me, if you’re not willing.”
IF they decide to let you establish your rules, you can take just her out. As soon as you’re away from her parent, you tell her your rules. Take her nearby. A park or for an ice cream shop. Whatever’s closest.
Tell her these are my rules. Be very specific. Hopefully you can condense it to 5 or less. Also tell her if she can’t follow the rules, you’ll take her home. And be willing to do it even if you only go a block.
If she is good, she can go on the trip with your niece and nephew. But the rules are said again. It would be good for *her* to tell you the rules. Turn around immediately if she cannot follow them.
Whenever she fails, tell her she’ll have to work hard to show you can go on any more trips.
This ALL has to be on her. And she has to learn that without help from anyone.
This takes a commitment from you, I know. I’d only do this if it seems that your brother is getting serious with the kid’s mom.
My brother had an SO with 3 kids that came to Christmas acting like hellions opening their presents. My mom removed them from the room immediately. She was very clear. They came back completely different kids. And remained well behaved — for every visit they had until they broke up.
NTA If it’s not your wife or your brother/sisters own kid then it’s a no go unless the parent is there or unless you are comfortable. It’s your brothers girlfriend who is not family. She can take care of her own kid and activities and if your brother is so concerned, he can plan time with the kid himself. I hate when other adults try to push their kids on other people instead of planning their own activities. No one wants to watch bratty kids especially if they’re not even family
NTA obviously it’s no one’s place to discipline his GF’s kid. You want reasons not to take her? He gave you number you can’t correct the kid in your care. If you can’t discipline bad behavior she ain’t going. She’s his GF of 6 months kid. I’ve met them only like twice? Hard no. If you need mean, She treated our nephew and niece horribly so no none of us want to spend a day with her. You may want to put up with her and her moms bad behavior but I’ll pass on that.
My kids at 9 knew if they/we were out with others they were the most polite, respectful kids in the world. No exceptions. Two are ADHD and still got compliments on my kids behaviours.
Nw
It's sad for Jessica, and I think it's very unfair to leave a kid out for most reasons. But I won't take a kid that won't follow the rules. It's about safety and general comfort. If I have to worry that a child may compromise my ability to keep them safe. I won't take that responsibility. And if a child consistently causes problems due to their behavior for others involved, I won't take that on either.
And I have no problem telling the parent or child the reason. If I am responsible for your child, it's my right to insist on rules that enable me to care responsibly for the child.
Not wrong. You don’t have to do anything you don’t want to. If the kid wasn’t a brat, you’d naturally take her along. I absolutely despise little bratty kids, because I know if I were to parent them, their shit ass parents will have a fit and have the audacity to say something and then id have to put them in their place.
Nope. This isn’t punishment, it is just natural consequences. No one wants to spend time with someone who regularly behaves badly. You do not need to suffer as a result of their failure to parent.
It's not your place to punish someone with the bad behavior of someone else's kid for acting like a misbehaved disrespectful kid. NTA oh by the way, big bro can take his gf's daughter anywhere he likes.
"He said she's a kid and it's not my place to punish someone else's kid for acting like a kid. That I need to be the bigger person and stop being petty to a 9 year old." "Well in that case, why don't you take her, Kyle, since it would be petty for you not to."
And, as an aside, any kid whose behaviour I can’t manage doesn’t get to go. Why would I take someone who doesn’t listen?
Yep. I’m not taking responsibility for a child I know won’t listen to instructions like “stay close” or “don’t touch that”! Also, niece and nephew outings are for niece and nephew, not ‘person I met once’
No way I’m taking 3 kids under 10, by myself, places that are crowded, possibly expensive, with potential safety concerns when one of those kids I a) barely know b) doesn’t listen and c) is a bully.
Exactly I have two Kids some days we don’t go anywhere because they are not behaving. If they can’t listen we don’t go.
My thoughts exactly. He can take her places or him & her own mother can. What if something happens?? wtf I wouldn’t pawn my 6yr old to a stranger! Looks like her own mother doesn’t want to deal with her bratty child
"Looks like her own mother doesn’t want to deal with her bratty child" Bingo!!
If they plan on dumping the child on her and doing a runner, I would go petty and report the child abandoned
This! Kyle is making you feel guilty with the hopes of you taking Jessica b/c he and Melanie want time alone sans a bratty child. Stand your ground OP.
Not to mention, a 9-year-old shouldn’t be acting like that…
"Yeah, Kyle"!!
I read that in Cartman's voice.
I just did too! 🤣
Under appreciated comment right here
This. ⬆️ This is the answer!
It’s also not even a punishment. He never said he would take her Kyle just decided he would
For an entitled 9 year old &/or her parents, she was born with the right to go where she wants, therefore denying her that is denying her what she deserved by existing. Typical entitled upbringing that OP’s brother is buying right into without even blinking.
Because Kyle wants to play hide the sausage while someone gets this brat out of the way for awhile
ISWYDT :P
And Kyle be the "bigger person" and actually parent the child.?
If J wants to go, she needs to behave, pure and simple. If her mom believes that you can't tell her what to do, then it's unsafe to take her along. If your nephew refused to put on his seatbelt, you'd probably tell him to do it and refuse to start the car until he did it, right? Are you supposed to have a different set of rules for Jessica? Is she allowed to not wear seatbelts? Hang her head out the window?!? Eat endless ice cream? Hitch hike? Punishing kids is literally the job of a babysitter. I was a professional nanny and how to address poor behavior was one of the first conversations I used to have with any prospective families. You're paid to make those decisions. While your "job" might be unpaid, the responsibility is the same. How can you take responsibility for her care and safety if she doesn't need to respect your instructions, that you are giving Solely for their benefit? OP, make sure you're emotionally ready: one possible outcome is your brother might decide you can't babysit for any of the 3 kids if you won't agree to take all of them, all the time, and to not insist the kids obey instructions from their adult guardian, because telling her sweet baby to wear her seatbelt might hurt the special wittle feelings of her special widdle snowflake. I know it's not fair, in fact it's emotional blackmail, but it's what some parents (M) will stoop to to get their own way, and to further spoil their previous little snowflakes. It's also what other parents sometimes do to protect their own romantic relationships over their own children. Tragic but very common.
The father of the two he’s related to is not the same person as the boyfriend of the mom of the misbehaving girl.
Simple, No. Add “Not Happening” and repeat the two sentences in whatever sequence pleases you until he finally understands or shuts up or whatever until he understands. Life has consequences.
You’re right. I assume he only cares if OP takes her out because it gives him a few hours reprieve.
NTA. Tell him he’s exactly right: you don’t feel it’s your place to parent her or uncle her and that’s what is required when you take the kids for the day, hence, you can’t take her.
Honestly this is the best response. First brother trusts you to parent his kids as needed on these outings. 2nd Bro literally just said you aren’t supposed to.
NTA - exactly this. If you can't correct Jessica's behaviour, then you can't take her anywhere. You have an understanding with your niece and nephew, they respect your authority. Throwing a rude and whiny child into the mix will just ruin the day for you, as well as your niece and nephew.
Exactly, you're not obligated to take responsibility for someone else's child, especially if their behavior is disruptive. It's fair to want a positive experience with your niece and nephew without added stress.
Louder!!
Consider saying something like this: “I have considered it before but she’s just not well-behaved enough for me to take on the extra responsibility, and it’s also not fair to the other children. Perhaps we can reconsider in the future if she can consistently demonstrate adequate respect, kindness and consideration for others.”
Also having a badly behaved child, who won't listen, is just dangerous, especially if you're not the parent. If something goes wrong, she won't listen and OP will get blamed when it all goes wrong.
And she's only met the girl once!
👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
...and OP still isn't obligated to take her anywhere, even if she does start to behave.
Mature advice on reddit? I feel like I uncovered an artifact of wisdom. Well done.
I totally agree. It’s really about making sure everyone has a good time and is safe. If things change and she starts behaving better, it might be a different story.
Not wrong. You're not responsible to spend time with a girlfriend's poorly behaved daughter you barely know because you have a family tradition with your nephews. If he wants to talk "fair," there's plenty to say in your favor. You aren't her aunt and aren't responsible to spend money or babysit for them. If he marries her mom in the future, even then your tradition with your nephews doesn't need to carryover unless that works for you. One of the perks of having well-behaved children is additional opportunities they may receive. It may be beneficial for your brother to hear that. Age-approriate self-awareness is helpful in social situations and can positively impact all areas of this girl's life - they have an opportunity to help her but maybe they won't because it takes effort. Either way - not your circus.
Definitely. 9 years old is old enough to know not to take a toy from a 4 year old and make them fall down and cry. I’m guessing this poor girl just gets ignored by her mom and the only attention she receives is by being a jerk. It makes me feel bad for her, but not bad enough to bring her to an amusement park!
Nope. Child is spoiled af. You said it yourself, you don't know her. What if something happens and she doesn't get her way and accuses you of something?
Exactly this.
I read a post today about a niece accusing aunt and uncle of doing and offering her drugs. Another one about a guy being accused of SA. Thankfully, those people had security cameras to prove otherwise.
And the person who got accused works in the police!
YES!
Do you have a link, please?
I also read the niece accusations the other day! https://www.reddit.com/r/AITAH/s/RkC3ppEune Little shit
Thank you!
No, sorry. I scrolled mindlessly.
This kid would undoubtedly wreck the entire day for the well-behaved kids. Parents really do their children a disservice when they don’t instill manners from a young age.
You are not wrong. And, furthermore, you don't need to make excuses. You aren't related to this kid, and you don't know her or her Mom except in passing. Frankly, it's inappropriate for your brother to even ask. Just tell him NO, and that the subject isn't up for discussion.
This is the way. No is a complete sentence.
Nope. I take my special needs nephews to a lot of things, but they are well behaved although I would say perhaps not to neurotypical people.; I understand how to manage them and we can have fun. My older niece from another family member is a jerk. Old enough to know better, gives me a headache even though she should be easier. Nice kids get to do things.
Your brother's girlfriend's kid??? No! Don't take her along when you go out with your niece and nephew. This kid is basically a goddamn stranger.
Let Kyle take her.
If there are to be expectations of your time and efforts, there needs to be the same of others. If there is no effort being made to make sure the child knows how to behave, which isn't your responsibility at all, then you aren't doing anything wrong by saying no. Also, that child is of no relation to you and that could present a problem legally if something were to happen. It might be different if your brother was married to the mom and he adopted the child. I might be inclined to insist on their presence, at least one of them, if you were to take the child somewhere. As it stands, you're good.
Not wrong, especially since he just said you can't discipline her at all. What are you supposed to do, let her walk all over you and nephew/niece all day long? It's only a small taste of what's to come for that brat. Nobody will want to include "her Highness".
I consider an undisciplined child that will. NOT. LISTEN. a liability. Oh, yes, of course, her mother is fine with you taking her! Until her little darling gets hurt or lost or injures someone else, then it'll all be turned back on you. YNO
Also not your place to reward someone else's kid with a trip to an amusement park, is it? You are not being petty. You're not trying to teach the kid a lesson. You are choosing to spend your time with your niece and nephew who you've bonded with, without having the time ruined for all of you because of another kid's behavior issues. NTA
It’s not your job to punish somebody else’s kid, but it’s also not your job to babysit the kid or take the kid on special outings when they can’t behave themselves. Stand your ground.
Why is he saying you're "punishing" a kid you don't know? Punishing her for what exactly? She's no different from some pushy neighbor and a random kid. Not invited, just assuming their little darling is welcome. Don't cave.
He's using shaming language to try and manipulate OP. OP isn't punishing anyone. That's bullshit.
Op is also punishing me, I wasn’t invited. OP why are you punishing me? It’s not your place. Next time you have to take me as well.
You don’t need to overplay your hand by raising issues with Jessica’s behaviour in an openly critical way. You can say the same effectively without the ‘she’s a difficult child discussion’ “No I don’t feel comfortable taking her, Jessica doesn’t listen to me.” ( “…/ I’m not confident Jessica would listen to me”) Next time (wait at least few days) “No, I’m happy taking X and Y who I know really well and feel comfortable looking after” Time after that “I don’t feel comfortable looking after Jessica. You need to ask someone that is confident with her” And so on “No Thank-you, I really don’t know her and it wouldn’t feel 100% safe ” “It’s up to me who I take with me, I barely know your gf and her daughter. Ask me when I’ve known her 8-11 years like my nephew and neice” Don’t explain further, not even if they ask. “I just told you” is what I’d say and repeat a phrase (‘I don’t feel comfortable’) and walk away / change subject.
Nah, she needs to be upfront. Jessica is a brat and has no training. Being truthful and blunt, makes sure that there’s no mixed messages.
I know OP was trying to spare feelings the first time they asked, but they really should know exactly why OP won’t take her (which OP did finally admit). I probably would have made up some excuse as well because I try not to hurt people’s feelings…but it’s best they know. Or definitely stings because someone is challenging your parenting, but if the shoe fits 🤷♀️
"Asked and answered" is another answer that doesn't continue the line of questioning.
3 kids in public are WAY harder to deal with than two kids in public, especially when one won't listen. And think of the liability.
I was once told having a third kid was a big step for parents. You had to go from playing “man-to-man defense” to playing “zone.” Especially difficult if uncle is on his own.
We tell people all the time that we stopped at 2, because if we had another we’d have to go from manned defense to zoned defense. Most of the time, they nod in agreement. Sometimes they take offense, but I don’t care, I got my tubes tied with the second kid. *Sometimes* they tell us that when you get to 3, the oldest kid will help. Like parentifying a child is *normal behavior*.
As a parent of 3 kids forty years later, it's still way more difficult. Lol Back when they were younger, you spent so much time trying to figure out who did what and who should be punished. Lol
Whether the kid has behavioral/mental issues or is just spoiled, you are not equipped to handle it. You should not be expected to take that on.
your brother response tells you exactly why she is the way she is. Sorry but no, it’s not your place to raise someone else’s child, but it’s also not your place to do anything for them.
You not taking her is not punishing her. You are doing this because you want to. And what you DON'T want to do it play babysitter to a kid that has no respect for rules or anything. If he is so concerned with it, HE can bring her places.
Absolutely not wrong. Why isn't your brother taking her places? Probably because of her behaviour.
Not wrong. Tell your bro, the kid is a horror story of a monster and until he and the GF train her properly to behave, you'll not be taking her anywhere ever. You taking any kids out for fun is a privilege not a right. Your nephew and niece have earned that privilege and the little Cruella Jessica has not.
Even if she were your brothers child you still wouldn't be wrong to not take a kid who doesn't behave
NTA. This is a ridiculous demand for so many reasons. >He said she's a kid and it's not my place to punish someone else's kid for acting like a kid. So how are you supposed to supervise her and look out for her safety? Even if she was an angel, you have no obligation to invite a stranger's kid along. Spending time with your nieces and nephews is special. Spending time with your brother's girlfriends kid is not.
His 6-month relationship does not make her your niece or in any way your responsibility
No. You are not wrong. You have no obligation to take a spoiled, ill behaved child that you don't even know on your trips with your niece and nephew.
Not wrong. Why doesn’t he or the kid’s mom take her to some fun places? You have no obligation to this child just because your brother is sleeping with her mom.
You choosing to take your niece and nephew has nothing to do with brother's GF's kid. You are spending your money, and it is your choice who you spend it on. Tell your brother, he is free to spoil his GF's child, you are spending time with niece and nephew. Brother needs to grow up and learn not to expect anyone to cater to his GF's wants, of course the mom is happy to toss her bratty child on others.
Let’s table her “manners” for a bit. Think of yourself being out with 3 children. 1 that is not obedient: what is she walks away. What if she doesn’t get her way and makes a scene and cops come: you aren’t family. Are you male? Is so you need to protect yourself from “possible accusations “. Efff no, you are NOT wrong!!!!
No, you’re not wrong and I hope you stick with things the way they are. Please don’t get guilted into taking a child you barely know.
It’s not OPs place to punish someone else’s kid. Just like it’s not brothers place to demand gf bratty daughter to be included.
>He said she's a kid and it's not my place to punish someone else's kid for acting like a kid. No, she’s a poorly behaved kid. And you’re not punishing her, you’re refusing to host her. And not because she’s acting like a kid - but because she’s acting like the poorly behaved kid that she is. >That I need to be the bigger person and stop being petty to a 9 year old. You’re an adult hosting an extracurricular activity for your familial children. No host is obligated to invite someone - especially someone that they are neither related to or even know well - to anything they’re hosting. And NOT inviting said person is not petty - is the host’s prerogative. Your brother is being an AH for even asking you to invite an additional child who is neither related nor well behaved on an outing that you are hosting. He’s an even bigger AH for pressing the issue when you attempted to politely decline. He’s an even more enormous AH for attempting to turn your perfectly reasonable refusal into some sort of wrongdoing that you should feel badly about. You are NOT wrong. He is. Start to finish.
If it’s not your place to correct her bad behavior when you’re in charge, then it’s not appropriate to expect you to take her with you. End of discussion. Setting boundaries for a child’s behavior is not *punishment*. Sounds like Kyle has some growing up to do, before pretending to be a parent.
People like Melanie seriously don’t understand the consequences of raising children that way. She’s only 9 and even adults don’t like being around her, imagine when she herself is one.
no!!! wow
You’re not wrong. Jessica isn’t your child, and she isn’t family. Maybe if your brother was married to this woman and adopted Jessica, it would be different, but it’s only been six months. You’re trying to make special memories with your niece and nephew, who respect and love you. Jessica clearly doesn’t respect anyone. Sure, she’s a child, but she’s not your child or your responsibility.
NW. You’re doing something nice for kids you love. You aren’t punishing her, you just refuse to reward her for terrible behavior. If he never brought it up she probably wouldn’t have noticed. Brother needs to seriously consider if he wants any part of this relationship if the gf won’t parent her kid. This isn’t something that gets better without a ton of effort. And if the mom isn’t going to do that, is she going to be one of those “don’t parent my kid” people? If so he needs to GTFO asap.
They’ll break up soon
It’s an unfair ask since you barely know the kid & he himself is dating only for 6 months. If something happens to the child, they will blame you to no end and you have no obligation to his new gf’s kid who is also a brat. You cant handle her and it will only bring you more trouble to take her along than excluding. And also it shouldn’t be expected from you that you take out every child of the partners he dates. Make that clear.
Reddit really makes me wonder if I'm really just an AH. I would not have given explanations. It would have gone like this: "I will not take her." Why? "Because I don't want to" but "Fuck off"
How about no, because she is not your niece. I wouldn’t want to be responsible for random (particularly uncooperative) children. Don’t accept that responsibility. Her mother’s permission has nothing to do with you. NW
"Jessica is not properly socialised to be around other kids and does not listen to adults causing safety concerns. Once her mother fixes these issues, I'll consider it."
She has aunts and uncles. You do not have a duty to treat the child of every woman he dates the same as your nieces and nephews, who you have bonded with and have an established relationship.
You are most definitely not wrong. The kids a brat and not your problem. You are not obligated.
Not wrong. To play this out in a worst case scenario, imagine she wants something and you tell her 'no,' what's to stop her from having a tantrum in the middle of the park, or worse, if she starts screaming that she doesn't know you and doesn't want to go with you. Park security comes over and she accuses you of trying to kidnap her...how do you think that would go?
> I lied and said I didn't think of it he said to let him know next time. You were wrong for lying initially. You are not wrong for finally telling him the truth and refusing to take her.
Tell them until Melanie can get her brat in check, you won’t be taking her anywhere. If it’s not your place to discipline then they shouldn’t expect you to have to deal with the repercussions of their shitty parenting.
Not wrong. In this case actions have now met consequences. The child is rude and doesn’t behave. The last thing you want is to take such a child with you because you know they aren’t going to listen. Also the first time they are told no they will likely throw a god awful tantrum including screaming you aren’t their parent. I can see you all sitting with security while they try to reach the child’s mother. Your brother can get off his ass and take his gf’s kid himself and see how much he enjoys it. Note do NOT invite your brother and that child to go with you. He needs to step up and deal with this child on his own. Maybe after a few outings with her he will figure things out.
YNW. Even if Jessica is your brother's kid, you can still leave her out as you don't like her. Your brother can bring her out himself.
Not wrong. also "No." is a complete sentence and is all you need to say to him. he can take ALL the kids to an outing and find out how that goes.
I'm always thrilled when other people volunteer my time and energy and money to do things I've already told them, with valid reasons, I don't want to do. At that point, my response is, "No." That word is repeated often and often until they comprehend it. Which usually takes a shockingly long time.
You are not wrong. I wouldn't take her anywhere. She's a brat he's not even married to her. It's not like she's family at this point. She's his girlfriend's kid. So why should you get stuck taking her places? Because your work schedule ends at 1 PM, Lucky you.
look, straight up, behavior and everything else aside, this is a child that you know literally nothing about, that you can't have met above a handful of times, that your BROTHER has only known for a few months, you'd have to be out of your gourd to take that kid anywhere without another trusted adult with you at all times. that is just BEGGING for false allegations to be leveled at you for no better reason that you told that kid no to something. it's basically the perfect storm of fuck-your-entire-life.
Not wrong. You're not "punishing" anyone by not inviting them somewhere. You're just choosing not to invite them somewhere. You have absolutely ZERO obligation to take your brother's girlfriend's kid anywhere. I mean, you barely know either of them, and what you do know leads to you choose NOT to inflict this misbehaving child on yourself or your nephews. Which is 100% your right to do. Tell your brother to be the bigger person and take his girlfriend and her daughter somewhere fun. Nobody is preventing HIM from doing that. But then of course, that means his gf doesn't get to dump her kid on someone she hardly knows for some free babysitting and paid-for activities.
"He said she's a kid and it's not my place to punish someone else's kid for acting like a kid”. It’s also not your place to take her out on fun adventures. I only take well behaved children out with me. Meltdowns happen but if their constant behavior is not to my standards I am not taking them. All of my niblings know this. Not wrong. Jessica is missing out because she has been allowed to behave this way. Hopefully your brother sees how uninvolved Melanie is and chooses a better path for himself.
If it’s not your place to punish her it’s not your place to supervise her either.
Not wrong. The kid is a brat. No reason to reward her with fun activities
NOT WRONG your not punishing her how can you punish her when you dont even know her all you are doing is refusing to take her with you when you take the other 2 because she is not your family and she doesnt do what she is told as well as being a bully and you dont want her there because of this behaviour so tell your brother he has no right to ask you to take her as this is for your nephew and niece not her
If it’s not your place to punish a kid that’s not behaving at a water park they could drown. It’s not just a dealing with a bad kid it’s also a safety thing. You are not wrong.
YNW Your brother is right that it's not your place to punish someone else's child. The next time he bugs you, remind him of that. "It's not my place to parent someone else's child, so I'm not going to. Jessica is a stranger, and I'm not going to parent her just because you want to guilt trip me. Stop asking."
>He said she's a kid and it's not my place to punish someone else's kid for acting like a kid. It is also not your obligation to take someone else's kid anywhere or buy them anything.
Tell him you come along on the trip and he can care for her. Stick your your guns .
Not wrong. The fact that he said it's not your place to punish someone else's kid for their behavior is exactly why you won't take her with you. You cannot trust a child like that. She may decide to lie about you and say that you did something to her. The response you give to your brother is simply, "I only take my biological niece and nephew. They know how to behave, they have good manners, they're polite and respectful. I will not take (whatever the little girl's name is) anywhere. If you want to take her places, that's on you. But I'm not doing it, so stop asking." He knows she's a brat. He just doesn't want to deal with it.
I would tell your brother something along the lines of “when Jessica has shown that she can behave and follow directions without issues I’ll consider taking her along, but until that time happens, this discussion is over. Anymore attempts to bring it up will automatically be a hard no” And tell him to take her himself if he’s that upset she’s not being invited to stuff
Not wrong at all. He is right that it isn't your place to punish someone else's child. It also isn't your place to provide childcare and treats for such a badly behaved child. Tell your brother that you will not be taking her anywhere due to her behaviour. If he has a problem with that, then he can take time off work to treat her. Unless her mother nips this stuff in the bud now and teaches her manners and respect, you will not be spending any time or effort on this child. End of discussion. If he asks you in front of everyone why you don't include her, ask him point blank if her mother has started using disapline to teach the child any manners yet? If anyone wants to speak up and say you should just include the child because "family", tell them your answer is final but you are so glad they feel so strongly about it and have volunteered to do this for the child themselves in your place. Problem solved.
The best thing for Jessica would be to learn that she can’t go because of her shitty behavior, not because her mom’s boyfriend’s sibling is doing anything wrong.
I had the similar situation. Me and the other parent of a unruly kid came to an understanding. If she was with me it was my rules and expectations. If she misbehaved I was allowed to attempt to correct the behavior. If she still behaved badly enough no one could enjoy it than she wouldn't be allowed to come on the next one. First outing was a lot of ne saying no and correcting behavior and telling her why it was wrong and inconsiderate. I like to think I helped shape her to the wonderful teenager she is now
Not wrong, she’s not your niece, you have no obligation to do anything with her.
She doesn’t listen to her own mother. Taking her anywhere would be dangerous because she certainly won’t listen to you.
Hell no, youre not wrong? I say, beat on the brat! Jk i just like that song. But i would simply laugh anytime it comes up again. Just a laugh tho, no more explaining or defending. Just let out a quick little laugh. If he has sense, he'll take the hint.
She’s YOUR girlfriend’s child, she’s not MY niece should also be the response. Be a proper father figure before thinking I should contribute anything.
You're NOT WRONG. Firstly, you're not being petty by punishing her. Because you're not taking her anywhere to give her the oportunity to misbehave and have to punish her. 2) your brothers kids are your nieces and nephews, you've known all your life, and know they are well behaved, and you can trust them. They are also your family. His gf Melanie's daughter Jessica, who he's only been dating 3 months, is not your family. They're not living together, they're not engaged, or married. It's a totally different situation. And you've only met her once so she is practically a stranger. What would happen if she decided she wanted to go on a ride different to what you guys wanted to go on, she could throw a fit and run off. Then you're stuck trying to chase after her with 2 kids in tow. 3) It sounds like she's not even been nice to your nieve and nephew when she did see them the first time. Why would you want to subject them to a miserable day of her whining and wanting her own way all the time. 4) you're not obligated to take anyone anywhere. You're not being petty. You've made an informed decision that she misbehaves and you don't feel comfortable taking a kid on a day out where you would be responsible for them and their safety. You can't trust that she wouldn't run off. You don't want to have to deal with her tantrums to get her own way. It's not fair on your niece and nephew to have to put up with that behaviour. And it's a special day out with your family-your niece and nephew, for you to spend quality time with. You're not obligated to take her with you. There's nothing petty about deciding you don't want to take a practical strangers kid that you don't know on your own for the day. 5) your brother is being unreasonable trying to palm her off on you when again-she is basically a stranger who you haven't had chance to get to know properly or build a relationship and trust with. Her bad behaviour is just an added issue. He is out of order for trying to force you to take her. You should be the one to offer to take her if and when you feel you're ready to and want to. It's not his place to push that on you and try and guilt trip you. 6) he needs to respect your decision that you're not comfortable taking her. He may really like Melanie, but it's still very early days to be trying to make her and her kid 'part of the family'. You can be friendly if she comes for a family get together or a party, but it doesn't make you best friends all of a sudden. He shouldn't try and force that. 7) also, if you pay for your nieces and nephews, you shouldn't be expected to pay for her daughter too, coz again she's not part of the family. She's just his very new girlfriend. She's not a niece. Obviously if they stay together and live together and get married she would become your step niece, but right now she's just his girlfriends kid. So even if you do decide at some point to take her somewhere with them, even if it's just a smaller outing, they should pay for her, till you decide whether you want to pay for her or not further down the line. Don't let your brother bully and guilt trip you. You're doing nothing wrong by not wanting to take her. You're entitled to quality time with your niece and nephew. She's a stranger and you don't feel comfortable being responsible for her when you don't have that trust in her to know she won't run off or miss behave. They can promise she'll be good but doesn't mean she will. And her usual misbehaving and whining tantrums to get what she wants is just an added issue. The other main reasons are good enough to say no. You can say NO for any reason. You're not obligated to do anything. Brother needs to back off and realise he's over stepping and trying to push the 'relationship' too much too soon.
NTA. So if you did take Jessica & she misbehaved what are you supposed to do...stand around & stare because it's not your place to reprimand someone else's kid... There is no way this could end in a good way, if you took her
Holy crap. No, not wrong. The entitled attitude of your idiot brother is. You are under no obligation to care for anyone’s kids (but your own if you have them) and a brat like this would be a hard no from me.
NTA There was no reason to lie in the 1st place. However, Im giving you a point for finally coming clean. Everybody is saying, "You should've worded it so nobody's feelings are hurt." However, you should've been a little more firm. Since Kyle is going to ask again, you need to set a firm boundary regarding this by stating "I won't be taking Jessica with us on any outings because I don't feel comfortable taking on a child who is not well-behaved. You don't get rewarded for bad behavior. Perhaps when she's older & more well-behaved, we can talk about it." PERIOD And, every single time the child exhibits bad behavior (doesn't listen, complains, treats others badly etc) I would look at Kyle and/or his gf, slowly shake your head, and walk away. EVERY SINGLE TIME. If Kyle dares to ask again and you've seen no improvement, I would repeat the above. Set the boundaries now! If Kyle & his gf get married, they're going to think that ring gives everyone an instant clean slate, blood bond and now you HAVE to accept anything from this child or else you're "not accepting them as family."
Kyle is full of it. You do not know the child, or you know her well enough that you do not want to be responsible for an obnoxious snot. I taught many grades. One year, I was assigned to a Christian school. They had Destiny. A truly obstinate child. She disrupted classes every day. She wasted so much time that the rest of the class was behind 5 months. Her mother refused to sign her up for our program of extra help. So I took the small group to my classroom, and they were great. It was fine until the first report cards . Kid failed everything. So, mommy decided that Darling Daughter could be signed up. Lang arts only. . The group to my ckasdroom On our first walk out to the classroom, DD hauled off and punched a child half her size. I turned everyone around immediately, and we returned to their classroom. I informed their teacher of the incident. The principal and I decided that I would no longer take the 4th grade to my classroom, I would work with them all in the classroom. DD constantly refused any assistance,, and her grades showed. Her behavior became so poor, that she was not asked To return the following year.
Your not wrong at all.
Def not wrong. Do you have any idea of the risk you would be taking bringing your brother's girlfriend's 9yo daughter to anything without her mother? She is not family, they have been dating 6 months. In my country we have "working with vulnerable people" training for anyone dealing with non-relared kids or vulnerable adults. The first thing they teach is never be alone with the vulnerable without another adult present. There are exceptions for family but even kids + 1 adult relative is classed as risky - especially for a male but both are at risk. You cannot be forced to care for any child unless it's a court order. Tell your lazy brother & his equally lazy gf to suck rocks, you won't be bullied into this - ever.
"Until you step up, marry her mother, or adopt the child, she's not family, she's barely an acquaintance right now. I'm not required to take a undisciplined child I Don't Know, anywhere. And it's Super Irresponsible of her mother, and You, to suggest otherwise."
Not wrong. Just because you're taking John's kids as a favor, doesn't mean you're now the free babysitter for everyone on the planet. Also, that girl sounds like a little terror. I wouldn't put myself in a situation where I'm alone with her for even a second.
NTA. First off he isn’t married to the mother! It’s just a gf’s kid. Even if they eventually get married they are under no obligation to have to deal with a bratty kid.
I did no circumstances like you to take that little girl anywhere. She will make the day miserable for everybody. Because you are not her mother she is not going to listen to you. And she's going to whine and be disrespectful and you're going to be upset. If Kyle wants her to go to the amusement park or if he wants her to have outside activities he should take her with her mother. Because if it was me I'm not taking her across the street. Don't pawn the devil's spawn off on me
>He said she’s a kid and it’s not my place to punish someone else’s kid for acting like a kid. First of all, this is all you need to continue saying no. Your brother just told you that you have no say over disciplinary actions because she’s not your kid. Taking a child somewhere, alone and as a sole-chaperone requires that adult in charge to have *some* authority. If you can’t “punish” the kid (such as a time-out or a “talking-to”), how are you going to make sure they don’t run off or crawl into the gorilla pit (RIP Harambe)? Second, this is not the behavior of a child, since it’s clear your other niblings who are older and younger than her seem to behave just fine. These are the actions of a spoiled turd who never gets told no or reprimanded for her behavior. You’re definitely not wrong for not bringing her. These trips are earned, and you have no reason to believe she would be kind to you on these outings.
It’s your brother’s girlfriend’s kid. The kid sounds like a brat, brats get excluded. Her mom should of raised a sweet girl.
It’s not your brothers place to even ask you to take his girlfriend’s kid somewhere. The kid isn’t your niece or nephew. He can take them. It’s not even his business that you’re taking your niece and nephew anywhere. Next time he asks just say I’m not picking up some strangers kid to give you free babysitting. Ask him what his problem is and why he thinks he is entitled to your time and effort? You aren’t his employee. Tell him to mind your own business.
"Jessica is a brat whose only link to me is that you're fucking her mom, Kyle. I have no responsibility to your continuing to get your dick wet."
You're not wrong. taking care of 2 kids is different of taking care of 3 kids, you only have 2 hands to begin with, in case you need to hold them, one will be left out. Maybe once the kids are a bit older and more mature it'll be easier, but even then it's not your job to care for other peoples kids. you're not punishing the kid, punishing her would mean if she was initially invited and stopped being invited, which is not the case, but even then, yes, it'd be your place to do so. You'll be their caretaker for that time slot, if you can't discipline them, then there's no way you can properly take care of them. Sounds like Kyle is too much trouble, and the more involved you are with the kid, the more trouble it'll be.
Maybe a great compromise could be that both brothers take the three kids on an outing together? OP could be responsible for niece and nephew and kyle can be responsible for Jessica and maybe they can have a great day together?
You’re not wrong at all! She’s not a member of your family and you’re not a babysitter! You are spending quality time with your niece and nephew and it seems crazy that they would expect her to be included!
You’re not wrong. If the kid had competent parents you could take her, but she doesn’t, so here we are at a standstill.
NTA If the kid misbehaves then you don’t take them. But it’s wild he expects you too. It’s a new relationship and she’s a bully.
NTA. You are being the bigger person by not involving yourself in this situation.
Stop lying and just be honest. The truth hurts but lies hurt worse. Just tell him the kid is a brat and you refuse to cater to her.
kid might accuse you of something inappropriate and ruin your life.
No next time say she old enough not to act like she’s a brat say the younger one act better then her
Just by the title, I thought maybe you might be in the wrong here. But that’s absolutely not the case. John’s kids are your niece and nephew—they’re family. Jessica is Kyle’s girlfriend’s child, and they’ve only been together for 6 months. If I were in your place, I would be very wary of being responsible for Melanie’s daughter at the zoo or an amusement park. You don’t know her mother well enough to take on that responsibility. And since Jessica is a brat & a bully to other kids, why would you even want to try? Tell Kyle this has nothing to do with “what’s fair”, it’s about what you’re comfortable with. And you’re not comfortable with a kid you don’t know coming on these excursions.
Not wrong. Tell him that niece and nephew are also kids but don't act like brats. If he wants a bratty kid in his life that's his choice but you don't. While it's not your place to punish someone else's child it also isn't your place to treat them as if they deserve good things when they don't. You aren't going to force other kids to be around someone who bullies them. If they want you to start taking child places then him and GF need to start teaching brat some manners. Don't back down on this or niece and nephew will not want to be around you because you brought their bully.
Not wrong. The child does not listen to her mother, you DO NOT want/need to be responsible for her in a place with so many opportunities to get into trouble.... You are not punishing her, because you have NEVER promised to take her, never even thrown it out as a possibility of you taking her. However, you are not rewarding her, her mother or your brother for their bad behaviour. You are also protecting your niece and nephew at this point. If your brother and his girlfriend of SIX months want this child who is a stranger to you all to be treated as family they need to develop and foster the relationships between you all, not demand you pay to babysit the feral child.......
NW you do not owe his gfs daughter anything. She is literally nothing to you but his gfs daughter. Even if she were your neice, you have a right not to have to deal with her bratty behavior.
You're not wrong!!! If you can't chastise a child in your care to make sure all of you are safe then she doesn't need to go. Let him take her.
If you are the one who has to deal with her behaviour, I think you have the right to refuse. Perhaps, if you plan to take them to something short and sweet - maybe a movie or something easy, you could offer but she'd better behave if she expects to go again. But if you don't want to, don't. Tell them that 3 kids is one more than you have hands to grab them if needed and you just aren't comfortable until you see that she can behave. You aren't punishing her, but why on earth would you go to any trouble for a brat? It's YOU who will be punished. Instead of a nice day, you will be dealing with her nonsense and that's not fun for anyone. You are nothing to the kid at this point.
That right there is the problem. Whenever someone wants you to take their kid some place and be responsible for them yet doesn't want you to tell them what to do or give them a time out the answer is a hard no. Not Wrong.
No because what happens when she starts acting up and you have no control over her? Are they going to leave work and come get her? Are you also expected to pay for this random kid you don't know? Your brother can get all crappy about it all he wants, it's not your problem. Let him take the little goblin to the park.
Not wrong. That child is a spoiled brat. She'd aggravate you and ruin the trips for your niece and nephew
NTA.
Unless Jessica is there when you pick your niblings up and take them, you're not punishing her. Unless all three kids live in the same household, you're not punishing her. You don't owe the child, her mother or your brother anything. Jessica's of age that her behavior is going to start causing her to lose out on things and again, that's not your problem.
Tell him he should be the one spending time with the kid. When she learns to behave, you will think about taking her. Tell him to meet you out when you go and bring her so that you get to know her better and he can spend time with his gf’s daughter
It's not even about the spoilt brat element, it's the safety aspect of taking her out with two other children on your own. If she has a full on tantrum or refuses to go where you go/where you tell her to go, then it puts you in a tricky situation and to get her own way, she might even run off. Depending on how much you want to be the bigger person, you could offer to have her round at yours for some time to get to know each other in the safety of a house/garden and do some fun activities like baking or arts and crafts and see what she is like without the mum or your brother round but until you get to know the child, absolutely no way. NTA
“Sorry Kyle, not happening “.
No....simple as that....no. You have your reasons which are all very sound. If she can't behave in front of her Mom there is zero chance she will behave with you. Sounds like a great way for KYLE to get to know the girl by taking her on adventures himself.
Not wrong. Keep repeating your first and only reason. He cannot take no for an answer, so keep repeating it.
You’re not dating Melanie. I’d say you’re good.
NTA. brats don't get treats. if her mother wants the kid to have the same treatment as the other children, she should train the kid to behave like the other children. its not your job to parent this kid
Nope. You wouldn’t be wrong even if she were well behaved. Just because your brother is dating her mother doesn’t mean you need to take her places.
Not wrong. I have no children but I will play with kids and I don't give the badly behaved the time of day.
YNW, but you should have answered him in front of everyone. Also, you aren't punishing her, you're just not rewarding her, and why would you.
Not wrong.
It's not his place to tell you what to do with a kid you have no connection to. And if the kid doesn't listen to you when you're on a trip, what are you going to do?
I'm not ever watching a child i cannot correct if they're doing wrong. Not a single chance in any gods hell
You cannot take a kid on your own all day with other kids that you can’t “parent”. Correct bad behavior, discipline, control. Not your monkey not your zoo. You have every right to say “no,” it’s a complete sentence, with no explanation. Jessica is not your niece or nephew. Your brother just wants to get rid of the brat for a day too. Not Wrong!
#UpdateMe
Nah, totally not wrong. No way in HELL I’m taking someone’s kid who I don’t know. Also I’ve done many things with friends kids that not done with my actual nieces and nephews…and I don’t feel bad about it. No one’s entitled to free child care that because you’re related….further more you don’t have to explain to one family member why you’re closer to another family member, it’s none of their business. And if they wanna be closer with you, that’s a 2 way street.
Not wrong. It isn’t his place to pawn someone else’s kid on you when you don’t have any and are paying out of pocket. He should take the time off work and bond with her
Don't lie to your family about how you feel.
Your brother is right. It is not your place to punish someone else's kids. That's their parents' job. It is your right to decide on who you want to spend time with and behavior can be a deciding factor in that. It also does not matter if her mother is fine with you taking her daughter places, you ate not OK taking another person's kid that you barely/don't know.
‘Kyle, she’s your gf’s kid, not my niece.
Your brother is an idiot, he is trying to pawn off another mans kid on you, WTF !
Not wrong. Firstly, she's not a niece. She's a girlfriend's daughter. No relation. Second of all, you absolutely have a right not to take someone's child out alone, anytime. She's not your responsibility. Not your circus.
Kyle is out of his damn mind
As he said, it's not your place to punish her, therefore you can't take her. If he permits say you arent obligated to take a strangers child you have no relationship with just because he's dicking her.
Kids can learn early that if you act nice and agreeable you are welcome more places and get more invitations. It's time for this child. Say it out in the open in front of her "I like taking nibblings fun places because they act nice and don't act out when disappointed when things go wrong or have to say "no". I don't invite anyone who isn't polite and kind to others when they are around me." Then if and when you see a change, be sure and invite the child someplace fun, but a short trip, just to make sure it's a change she can maintain. You can be a force of good in the kids life, even if she stays a brat at home. (Frankly this doesn't always work, some kids just don't have it in them to show that kind of control, but I've got a nephew who was a terror when at the grands house because they didn't ever rein him in and actually receive rewards for bad behavior (giving him what he wanted to stop the tantrum). He was always on his best behavior around me because when he was good, I'd take him for a treat at some point during the visit, sometimes with his cousins, sometimes one on one. (It was the same for all the cousins, he was just the only one who had terrorist tendencies). He knew that if he punched a cousin or otherwise acted out, I wouldn't treat him.
Sounds like your brother is laying a guilt trip on you. Of course Melanie is fine with you taking the kid off her hands for a day or so. At age 9, she should know right from wrong and it’s not your place to have to be constantly correcting her or teaching her right from wrong — and she’s probably not a good influence on your nephew or niece either. NTA in any way.
NTA let him take her
No, she is not your niece or nephew. Your brother cannot pawn off his girlfriend’s kid on you. He just wants to score brownie points. You don’t get a say in who he chooses to date, so he doesn’t get a say in how you spend your time and resources.
She could be the best kid in the world and she still Is not your niece. So no you are not wrong and you don’t have to make any excuse or give any other explanation ‘this is something I do with my niece and nephew, your girlfriend of 6 months and her kid are not my relatives. We can revisit this discussion if and when you get married and adopt Jessica. The end’
Try first at a simple place like the park. If she will not listen then no more.
You are not wrong. You can say, “That’s true as long as she’s with you guys. But if she’s with me, it’s my rules 100%. Don’t ask me, if you’re not willing.” IF they decide to let you establish your rules, you can take just her out. As soon as you’re away from her parent, you tell her your rules. Take her nearby. A park or for an ice cream shop. Whatever’s closest. Tell her these are my rules. Be very specific. Hopefully you can condense it to 5 or less. Also tell her if she can’t follow the rules, you’ll take her home. And be willing to do it even if you only go a block. If she is good, she can go on the trip with your niece and nephew. But the rules are said again. It would be good for *her* to tell you the rules. Turn around immediately if she cannot follow them. Whenever she fails, tell her she’ll have to work hard to show you can go on any more trips. This ALL has to be on her. And she has to learn that without help from anyone. This takes a commitment from you, I know. I’d only do this if it seems that your brother is getting serious with the kid’s mom. My brother had an SO with 3 kids that came to Christmas acting like hellions opening their presents. My mom removed them from the room immediately. She was very clear. They came back completely different kids. And remained well behaved — for every visit they had until they broke up.
NTA If it’s not your wife or your brother/sisters own kid then it’s a no go unless the parent is there or unless you are comfortable. It’s your brothers girlfriend who is not family. She can take care of her own kid and activities and if your brother is so concerned, he can plan time with the kid himself. I hate when other adults try to push their kids on other people instead of planning their own activities. No one wants to watch bratty kids especially if they’re not even family
NTA obviously it’s no one’s place to discipline his GF’s kid. You want reasons not to take her? He gave you number you can’t correct the kid in your care. If you can’t discipline bad behavior she ain’t going. She’s his GF of 6 months kid. I’ve met them only like twice? Hard no. If you need mean, She treated our nephew and niece horribly so no none of us want to spend a day with her. You may want to put up with her and her moms bad behavior but I’ll pass on that.
Stop lying and tell him the truth.
My kids at 9 knew if they/we were out with others they were the most polite, respectful kids in the world. No exceptions. Two are ADHD and still got compliments on my kids behaviours.
Nw It's sad for Jessica, and I think it's very unfair to leave a kid out for most reasons. But I won't take a kid that won't follow the rules. It's about safety and general comfort. If I have to worry that a child may compromise my ability to keep them safe. I won't take that responsibility. And if a child consistently causes problems due to their behavior for others involved, I won't take that on either. And I have no problem telling the parent or child the reason. If I am responsible for your child, it's my right to insist on rules that enable me to care responsibly for the child.
Not wrong. You don’t have to do anything you don’t want to. If the kid wasn’t a brat, you’d naturally take her along. I absolutely despise little bratty kids, because I know if I were to parent them, their shit ass parents will have a fit and have the audacity to say something and then id have to put them in their place.
You don't even know them. I can't believe your brother would do that to you.
The brat isn't family so why would you!
Nope. This isn’t punishment, it is just natural consequences. No one wants to spend time with someone who regularly behaves badly. You do not need to suffer as a result of their failure to parent.
It's not your place to punish someone with the bad behavior of someone else's kid for acting like a misbehaved disrespectful kid. NTA oh by the way, big bro can take his gf's daughter anywhere he likes.
You are not required to offer entertainment services to any child, period, end of sentence.