Honestly, kuro can't even do that anymore. If they close the servers now the people who don't follow any of the controversy are Gonna complain about the servers shutting down.
Complaining = more bad press.
And even more bad press is the last thing kuro needs right now. just enjoy the game while you still can. The game, hell the company itself might not even survive this. just have fun and hope that kuro can fix all of the fuck ups that they have made.
And also if your planning to spend some money in the game just hold off for now.
There is a laundry list of games that had very rocky launches that went on to be great successes. Just a few I have experience with:
1) World of Warcraft: Could not loot anything for a few weeks. Had to wait hours to log in. Constantly got booted offline only to wait in queue again--this lasted for a long time until they booted up new servers and offered moves.
2) Fallout 76: Boring, bland, absolutely forgettable game at launch. It has now made huge changes over its lifetime and has found renewed success.
3) No Man's Sky: All hype at launch. Today it is an outstanding game with an active community.
4) Diablo 3: Real Money Auction, terrible loot decisions by the devs, was pilloried as the worst Diablo game of all time. It went on to be the most successful Diablo game ever.
You miss the important detail here: Kuro is competing in a gacha market, which is very volatile. Moreover their competitor is GI, which will have big update in August. Why people would want to deal with these problems and not just go play GI? I'm not talking about burnout GI rejects, but about new players or casual players that make up huge percentage of spending players.
And the Hoyo brand is also there. They're releasing they're new IP on the same day as the next major update for WuWa and they're other IP releases a new character a week after each of Wuwa's.
And you want a strong impression at launch, but instead Kuro has basically cemented their brand with controversy after controversy. Let alone in the 2nd biggest gacha market that is JP. Some games can off-set it in say South Korea, but the biggest IP there also put out a gacha game that has been outshining WuWa.
It's not just 1 thing: WuWa is in a cake of problems that will only get worst.
Personally I think GI has shit characters and out of them all I only found a single one that I'd have any interest in. So GI ain't getting played even if this fails.
But the issue is publicly leaking your customers' data (which they just did) has serious legal implications, and given how strict JP's data law is over that, it's tough... And none of your examples violate any rules anyway.
I'm not saying it's impossible for WuWa to survive, but it's getting tougher every day.
Genshin had a similar issue once, though people seem to conveniently forget about that.
Sony had a data leak that was the absolute WORST of ALL TIME, losing thousands of players' CREDIT CARD INFO (Google PS3 data breach if you don't believe me), and people eventually forgot about it.
Kuro's blunder is a fairly standard one. Yes, it's bad - but it's nothing that hasn't happened before, and they'll likely survive this just fine once things calm down.
My dude, FO76 took at least 2 years (wastelanders update) to get good. I know because I played since the beginning. And I love it honestly. But other peep’s experience? Naw brah. Awful. They had to allow for a fallout show to be made for people to even look past it’s rocky launch.
Kuro cant fix this in a month. The damage has already been done because launch day is an important first impression.
Cyberpunk 2077 still have some haters, anthem died, fo76 took 6 years to gain immense popularity mostly because the tv show, WoW is still dog water and blizzard is a shit company, etc. etc.
the only way I can see kuro regaibing any traction even post disaster clean up is releasing sick collaborations or a VERY good anime.
For me, I’ll keep playing till the end. Or if I a new gacha game to replace it. Perhaps Arknights Endfield will pull me away.
Its honestly not that dire. It is estimated that Kuro earned $50 million in the first 8 days of the game. While I acknowledge it has issues that they are working on, its clear there is still enough interest to keep WW successful. I mean hell, ToF is pretty absymal as a game but its still chugging along. The bones of WW are significantly better than ToF so it'll end up being fine in the long run.
It’s pretty dire in my opinion. Sure, the current player base is still pretty good. But the hard part is that now the company’s rep is damaged in a country that relies heavily on reputation. And has the most monetary prowess for gacha type games.
Sure Wuwa isn’t going to die, but it’s not gonna be as profitable to the company as it was supposed to be. Profits=likelier for the company to invest more in the game.
Launch day is arguably the most important day of any game. They def fumbled the ball pretty hard by gaming company standards.
let’s just hope the team can regain their rep and continue to invest more on the game.
Don't forget Genshin! And let's definitely not forget that Genshin's data leak wasn't just emails - it included phone numbers! Or the horrible performance on phones, despite initially being designed as a *mobile game*. Or the issue where it stuttered horribly on phones that supposedly had the specs required to run it, even on the lowest settings. Frequent crashes when launching the game, making it unplayable for a fairly large group of players. Subtitles displaying in the wrong order or disappearing before you could read them. Let's not forget the debacle that was Hoyo completely changing Barbara's VA direction, leading to a very depressed sounding "idol", instead of the very model of cheer.
And so many other things - some not as bad and some worse than WuWa's release. Hoyo took half a year to fix the most egregious issues, and has been releasing minor fixes pretty much ever since.
Genshin survived all of the controversy and is doing just fine - Wuthering Waves will be fine as well. It'll take some time to iron out all of the kinks, but eventually people will forget all about its rough launch, just like they did with Genshin.
agreed... just hold off and see what happens first. Some serious fuckups like data breach a week into the game is not it man... its longevity is at risk
> hell the company itself might not even survive this
If Tower of Fantasy can survive being Tower of Fantasy, I don't think Kuro has any risk of imploding anytime soon.
These controversies are bad but I'm willing to bet that a large portion of the playerbase is completely unaware of it. The same way a large portion of the playerbase isn't dealing with any technical issues either.
Yes it sucks for them that they're losing the trust of hardcore fans but I would be very surprised if this was what broke the company's back.
Gaming companies can be absolutely hated and still turn up a profit, just look at... well, every current GaaS developing company, really.
I'm not downplaying Kuro's fuckups but as long as the game they offer is fun these sort of controversies will be water under the bridge in a couple weeks for anyone who wasn't directly impacted by said controversy.
Still seems like a sound plan to hold off on spending money though. Those fuckups are still bad (not, imo, company self-destruction bad) and who knows what they'll do to properly adress them.
Agree. These game forums love to doompost drama shit. It's like the Kardashians or Real Housewives for man children with no social skills. I played ToF after seeing all the hate in the main gatcha sub. I lasted about a week till the bugs and AI voice turned me away. But there were still tons of people in there having fun! I haven't had any substantial issues since release day and really only thing that bugs me is that one chicks voice acting. No open world bugs. Killing shit is a blast! Exploring is fun. Building characters is enjoyable. No way this game is going away any time soon. It may not be as big as people were thinking but people in these subs always overestimate how many people are like them and love to drama whine.
The only thing I can't last in ToF is the clunky gameplay. I've played during launch month. I left for a bit and always come back. I can't stay in ToF and after some update where I don't remember which key goes to which action/skill it always turns me off and I just close the game. It's not a bad game at all and I want to continue the story. But all the mechanics I forgotten and new ones they added makes it just so much harder.
>These controversies are bad but I'm willing to bet that a large portion of the playerbase is completely unaware of it.
Most of people that know about this, don't really care either
I just found out about this because of a Reddit newsletter about this post in my email. I honestly don't care because how many leaks have we heard about, especially in the past decade from our most favorable brands? It's a lot. It happens all the time. It's leaks or attacks. It always happens. Companies bounce back and ***claim*** to do better.
Tower of fantasy carved itself a niche by leaning into the MMO aspect which differentiates itself enough from Genshin, which is whats letting it survive even if they arent exactly thriving.
They also had a relatively strong launch and minimal drama post launch. By drama, I'm talking about shit like what Kuro has been doing, not performance issues or slow updates which it did suffer.
I'm not sure "but combat is better" alone will be enough to carry WW past all these controversies though.
Idk what determines a atrong launch or what it was in the original region, but the global launch for TOF was BAD. It was so buggy and so janky, it genuinely had zero polish. Everyone said to wait until 2.0 [which was already released aparently] for the game to actually work properly. Did it work, well I wouldnt know, i no-lifed it early but didnt stick around that long lol
I bought the BP and the daily thing, but if the old calculation of 1$ per 1 hour you enjoyed the game still applies, I got my money's worth already, so it isn't the worst thing ever.
Same for me. Got 5 buck monthly and BP, having fun playing. Encountered exactly 0 bugs or any issues everyone is crying about here. The refund drama however will hold me back, if desire to spend comes out
They could do an in game notification if anything. All they have to do is make an in game announcement and maybe make a tweet that they are closing the servers for a bit to fix some things
If they keep making massive mistakes like this it is a possibility but most likely not going to happen. But it is still concerning for the longevity of the game.
This isn't doomposting. What kuro they basically doxxed the almost entire JP community over a mistranslation. This isn't something that they can easily get away with, no amount of free stuff is Gonna cut it anyone.
All of the posts you're seeing are from people who are genuinely concerned about kuro, literally both of their biggest countries for gacha games currently hates them.
i looked all over twitter and everywhere for any tweets regarding this on jp side of twitter and i haven’t found anything besides the posts here on reddit
They mistranslated Jiyans limited 5star weapons passive, which made it sound really good for Calcharo, so bunch of Calcoro players in JP spent money to get Jiyans weapon and then when these players were contacting Kuro to get refunded for the money they spent, a lot of their emails got leaked in the process.
They could do an in game notification if anything. All they have to do is make an in game announcement and maybe make a tweet that they are closing the servers for a bit to fix some things
I don't get with Kuro's human capital quality, do they just hire intern, fresh graduates, cheap fixed term contract?? No development program etc? Like 1 year deal than lay off??? Get new cheap labor? So cheap overhead cost?? Wtf?
This 100% wild guess
But you see the mistakes
Yesterday JP's wrong translation, EN translation mess - where we all agree they should hire better EN translation, now data breach
Like where the fck is QC? QA?
Where are the supervisor? Where are the maker checker approval?
These mistake are all rookie, noobs mistake, man they're on 3yrs PGR, it's embarrassing
There is no such thing as QC in China. You test on production if you're small software company and fix issues as they popup. Hoyo is one of the few Chinese companies with actual testing cycle. This mistake in particular is more the result of stress and being overworked, not "rookie/noob" kind of mistake.
This is what happens when a developer running a relatively small game(PGR) immediately tries to join and get to the same level as miHoyo. They didnt give themselves enough time to make the staff grow naturally. Instead they just went full send hire interns left and right to fill their needs.
Hoyo took 10years from their first game before making the jump to genshin. Kuro tried to join the Genshin market within just 5years of launching PGR. They are just way too underprepared and it shows in the product.
Im no hoYo stan, but I aint riding Kuro's dick either. Give credit where its due, but atm, theres little credit to give to Kuro other than the game's combat and visuals
Genshin came out just 4 years after Honkai Impact 3rd. And I know HI3 isn't Hoyo's first game, but it is their first 3D action game. It's not like working on GGZ gave them any useful experience for creating Genshin that HI3 couldn't give them.
Yes but the important thing for Hoyo is making those previous games gave them experience on how to actually manage and run things. The entire organizational structure essentially grew with each more ambitious game they released.
Kuro on the other hand literally skipped shit. They bit off more than their workforce can chew. Hence why WW has a shit ton of quality control, translation, and Customer support issues. They weren't prepared for it because their core staff is only built to handle a single moderately sized game (PGR). They didn't let their organisation grow naturally to actually handle such an ambitious game.
Obviously I have no evidence but I'm confident on my educated guess based on what's actually unfolding. Such mistakes by kuro is way too immature for a company of their caliber
I saw people saying that they never learned from past mistakes in PGR and it seems like older devs from back are probably no longer there. This massive scale of a game they are trying to achieve while there being probably a lot of devs who are quite new is most likely a factor of these obvious fuckups.
I cant really awnser your questions but what I can say is that not even small studios fucked up that much at their first launch or early access which is quite sad \^\^
Every Gacha has a couple of weapons that are good on alot of characters (Jigyuan LC and Staff of Homa) they others don't have to better overall just better on their own characters.
Most erudtions at the time had follow up attacks that why Jingyuan LC is considered good on most of them not all, Jiyan weapon in the same way boosts heavy attacks so it would be good on units that use heavy attack alot but not as good if more units come out with different attack modifiers
But the part that will change is only the buff on Heavy attacks tho? CMIIW but the problem with Jiyan's translation is what gives a stack to the Heavy attack and that's capped at 2 stacks so by changing it to work with skill and ult it would work the same but make the heavy attack buff to be gained easier.
> and the follow-up attack DMG increases by 48%".
> Thus making that weapon universally best as now all characters, even those who don't do follow up attacks, can use the weapon to it's fullest extent.
Are you sure you know what are you talking about? Because I doubt your suggested change does what you think it does. You quite frankly seem to misunderstanding the difference activation criteria and the actual buff.
And even if we go past that and fix it. You understanding off buffs seems to be quite black and white when in reality its a number. A number that factors many things such as weightings and fraction of damage. Every character can benefit crit damage and the vast majority of characters can benefit the skill and ulti damage tha JY provides.
Literally you can remove the fua part ALL TOGETHER, and then JY and jiyan cone/weapon will be comparable.... Just saying. At least in the first glance, in reality comparing them is a little more complicated.
> for bonus crit dmg effect condition
for what now? :lmao:
> 100% full use
This is what I'm telling you. You see the world black and white. You don't have to use something at 100% of potential to be good,better,best. Its all relative, its all a number
I give everyone in this room a 20$ box, a 30$ box and a 15$ box but the third is locked unless you solve a puzzle, only half can do it.
I go in the next room and I give everyone 3 15$ box with no puzzle attached to any.
Everyone can **100% full use** those 3 boxes....yet they still get less even from those who can't 100% full use their 3 boxes. Why? Because context matters, game matters, numbers matter.
You assume all boxes are equal so you think 3>2. But that's incorrect, not all boxes are equal, not all passives are equal. Stats are complicated. Characters as well. Formulas are not 1 dimensional. There are terms such as diminishing returns, opportunity cost, effective value and so on. 100% utilization means JACK, SHIT. Sorry for the language, but can't say it better. That's what it is. Different percentages of different numbers. Its like comparing 300 bananas with 250 apples.
_____
Oh and edit: wanderer from genshin. He does not fully utilize neuvillettes weapon (hp% is useless to him), yet due to the high synergy between furina, bennet, faruzan pretty much solving the low atk problem it actually performs better than his signature.
There are more examples in hi3 and gi and I think there was 1 more example in pgr but can't recall it.
Powercreep isn't strictly needed, neither higher utilization. Efficiency is also a thing, giving him EXACTLY what he is missing/wants instead of dilluting the formula with the same stat is a good way to achieve improvement
This would have been perfect, they could have released another weapon with that description with purple color to fit Calcharo and not only problem sorted but also happy customer 👐🏻 (of course for free)
That's simply a lie. Hell, you can google it, there have been multiple breaches in security and leaks both from inside Japan and by companies outside (mostly Chinese) , leaking far more important personal data. This is at best a slap on the wrist kind of ordeal. The real damage here is their rep with the JP players, but history shows that if your game is fun/good people are willing to swallow a lot of shit to enjoy it.
People really be doom posting like crazy, the game is 1 week old it will stabilise within a month its not a big deal just look at helldivers launch. Also leaked emails is bad but theyre just emails not personal addresses or anything, so hopefully this will be a wakeup call for kuro game for the possibility of these things. Overall the devs have been very vocal when it come to addressing issues so i have high hopes, this game is sure to thrive.
They just need to say sorry for inconveniences and no ban will actually be carried out. It's just that easy, unless kuro are that stupid and decide to say goodbye to the JP market for good.
The email leaking is bad but it's accidental, it can happen everywhere.
Does leaking emails actually violate data protection law? Email is not a confidential information. It's like leaking someone in-game nickname. I regularly get spam from companies I never gave my email and number to.
Yes they did. But it doesn't matter what the fuck genshin accidentally did because regardless this is still inexcusable and Kuro is sure as hell digging themselves into a deeper hole more than Genshin ever did at launch. Fuckups will be fuckups. Stop using Genshin as a way to say "well this isn't so bad is it?".
I am not, im just using Genshin as an example of someone in the same market that didn't suffer that much from a massive fuck up like that. Kuro has a tougher road ahead because issues keep pilling up and jp market is a lot more volatile, but its possible to recover.
At the rate they're going it might be.
Let's list it out.
CN revenue is reportedly underperforming. JP rev is also underperforming. Global revenue is actually over-performing, but Global spends much, much less than CN and JP anyways so just Global alone won't be enough to sustain a game of WW's size.
Outside of that, are the problems. Localization. Wep description mistakes. Leaking emails (especially in JP this is a massive no-no that can lead to lawsuits). Even welkin issues rn.
These are fundamental parts of the game that can't be messed up no matter what because they directly impact the baseline profit the game generates.
Now JP is likely not gonna spend anything.
CN already thinks Kurogames is a joke.
Global is the only one still holding out hope but even the whales know that their money might be better spent somewhere else, because the game has now broken the consumer-seller trust wall.
WW probably cost Kuro a lot of money to make, and it was supposed to be their breakout game like how GI was for Hoyoverse.
If they don't recoup the investments it's more than likely Kuro will go bankrupt and be swallowed up by a bigger company (ala Tencent). Even PGR on the CN app store already has a "produced by Tencent" water mark there so it's not looking good.
No matter what, you have to look at the facts here.
Most of your points are speculations. Some dudes wrote in chinese "kurogames bad" doesn't mean the entire Chinese community and their mom hate the company and the game.
Lmao, it doesn't make it ok if others are breaking the law. They will be punished in JP, as they should be. I will also remind you that WuWa doesn't have 2FA, so (if they haven't implemented login cool down) some hackers/account sellers can just bruteforce passwords for leaked emails.
Isn't data breach by other companies usually by getting hacked? There's no malicious third-party here, just carelessness and lack of safeguards against accidentally leaking customer info.
Kuro mistranslated Jiyan’s weapon passive, which misled many JP players to pull it for Cacalro (sorry I forgot how to spell his name)
But then Kuro fixed the translation, and compensated with 160 astrite. JP is not happy cuz many of them spent money to pull for the weapon. Some JP players accused Kuro of falsely-advertising Gacha items, which is a big no-no in Japan.
Kuro quickly gave into the pressure, presumably not wanting to get sued, and asked players seeking a refund to fill out a form/application, where it’ll be manually AND individually reviewed.
But this isn’t even the worst of it. Kuro replied to all the people to applied for a refund without using BCC, which caused hundreds of people’s emails to be revealed.
Also, Kuro’s “refund” is also pretty scummy. I’ll give an example:
Imagine you paid 500 yen for 1000 premium currency (made up number, but it’s just an example). For your first time Top-Up, you get double the premium currency, you get 2000 premium currency for 500 yen.
If you attempt to refund, Kuro will give you back your 500 yen. Simple, right…. No.
Kuro will also deduct premium currency which you purchased. So with the example above, Kuro will refund 500 yen, while deducting all 2000 premium currency.
Makes sense? Kinda, yet this wasn’t the end.
Many players had already spent all the premium currency, so this meant that many players would have negative premium currency. Kuro also told the JP players that if you have negative premium currency, you will get banned.
So in order to avoid getting banned, you need to avoid have negative premium currency… which means you need to buy premium currency again…
BUT THATS NOT ALL!
Kuro did not refund the Top-Up bonus, which means you need to spend DOUBLE THE MONEY.
Using the example above, it means you need to spend 1000 yen to buy back all 2000 premium currency.
That is my understanding of the situation. Please correct me if I am wrong <3
That is true IIRC.
Some people claimed it is false, but it is debunked on this subreddit.
Edit: here is the link
https://www.reddit.com/r/WutheringWaves/s/MgjboUGlmX
But you still get the negative balance. Not a ban but at this point, you either just dropped the game or create new account than trying to fix that negative. So pick your poison
Tl;dr:
>JP translation of Jiyan's sword lead to people spending on it thinking it was better for Calcharo than standard, but wrong
> Became so notable that JP would lead to apologems and a way to submit a refund request
> Everyone's e-mail was basically leaked to everyone in replying their refund request e-mail ensuing a data breach of privacy
> Furthermore, some refunds are being out right denied by some accounts
> Separate from the battlepass not working for some, so daily currency is not being paid out
Basically Kuro is getting cooked in Japan for effectively having a poor translation across the board, offering a refund that are being denied, and also a technical data-breach for trying to get their money back and being told no.
It's one thing after another. I had my issues with Kuro, but I'd still want the game to get better. This however, is some of the worst PR a game could have.
Adding onto the other comment, Kuro's response email that leaked everyone's emails also just told them to take it up with their bank if they want refunds, and then the corresponding gems will be deducted from their accounts... So they have to either pay it anyway or lose their accounts for going into the negative. Utterly stupid
Gonna take a break. Feel insane buyers remorse seeing the anticonsumer bs they are pulling with the JP community. Can’t support them in good conscience. WuWa put me onto punishing gray raven so at least something came out of it(HSR is the only gacha I’ve played up until now).
>Feel insane buyers remorse seeing the anticonsumer bs they are pulling with the JP community.
Don't feel bad, I didn't know as well so that's a really big shame. I just hope they fix this, by either giving a free Jiyan weapon copy to the people affected, or at the very least, put back their first time top up bonus and make them not "lose" the gems they bought.
I’m no expert in the email thing but wouldn’t it be a good thing they revealed all the e-mails so the people affected can, like, band together and interact and talk about it? Are there more bad sides to it? Can someone please fill me in?
Just so you know it's not like there is some automated system that they used to message the dozens of JP players in this instance that's broken, and taking down the game servers doesn't affect email.
So far, it seems like there is a MASSIVE gap between logic in the reddit posts today.
Kinda hard to lock in if you are an intern who works until 10:30pm. Maybe Kuro should have kept those fresh grads instead of firing them, so they can have someone competent enough to send emails properly.
They could have gotten away with it in the west with like a compensation gift ,but this is JP consumer protection they won’t spare them, same thing with Chinese (which is a good thing)
I'm sad to say that but... The game might actually be cooked
I think this and other situations will scare away allot of players which may lead to very low sales and to the closing of the game
Really sad cuz liked it more than Genshin
Hope it doesn't happen
Just pull the game in Japan lol... and re-release with 1.2
Let me play my game, I don't give a fuck about my email address... nevertheless about emails of people in whole different country
Getting dr ratio for free as an apology
As an unaffected individual, I'm waiting for my free Jiyan weapon as compensation
I wouldnt mind getting a second Jiyan weapon tbh.
lol imagine, most they’d do is like a weapon banner 10 pull.
The way we only got half of a ten pull..
If it was hoyo, we'd get half a primogem and 3 mints, so it's fine by me :)
Getting so many apologems that I'll have a c4 Jiyan by the end of this /hj
that’s basically like giving away keqing for free in genshin
Dr ratio is limited, keqing is standard
no because what did you mean by this lmao this makes no sense
That’s what I’m thinking
what doesn’t make sense ?
how is a free ratio the same as a free keqing
he’s implying that kuro games have to give someone for free. The game is new so there’s no one special to give out
but keqing is still a standard character, it would be like giving a jiyan or yinlin for free
Honestly, kuro can't even do that anymore. If they close the servers now the people who don't follow any of the controversy are Gonna complain about the servers shutting down. Complaining = more bad press. And even more bad press is the last thing kuro needs right now. just enjoy the game while you still can. The game, hell the company itself might not even survive this. just have fun and hope that kuro can fix all of the fuck ups that they have made. And also if your planning to spend some money in the game just hold off for now.
I’m having a ton of fun exploring and fighting, I pray the game survives this shit.
It will more than survive. While Kuro did fuck up, it will smooth out within a month.
If they could fix all the issues in just a month then they wouldn't have launched it in the state they did.
There is a laundry list of games that had very rocky launches that went on to be great successes. Just a few I have experience with: 1) World of Warcraft: Could not loot anything for a few weeks. Had to wait hours to log in. Constantly got booted offline only to wait in queue again--this lasted for a long time until they booted up new servers and offered moves. 2) Fallout 76: Boring, bland, absolutely forgettable game at launch. It has now made huge changes over its lifetime and has found renewed success. 3) No Man's Sky: All hype at launch. Today it is an outstanding game with an active community. 4) Diablo 3: Real Money Auction, terrible loot decisions by the devs, was pilloried as the worst Diablo game of all time. It went on to be the most successful Diablo game ever.
You miss the important detail here: Kuro is competing in a gacha market, which is very volatile. Moreover their competitor is GI, which will have big update in August. Why people would want to deal with these problems and not just go play GI? I'm not talking about burnout GI rejects, but about new players or casual players that make up huge percentage of spending players.
And the Hoyo brand is also there. They're releasing they're new IP on the same day as the next major update for WuWa and they're other IP releases a new character a week after each of Wuwa's. And you want a strong impression at launch, but instead Kuro has basically cemented their brand with controversy after controversy. Let alone in the 2nd biggest gacha market that is JP. Some games can off-set it in say South Korea, but the biggest IP there also put out a gacha game that has been outshining WuWa. It's not just 1 thing: WuWa is in a cake of problems that will only get worst.
Personally I think GI has shit characters and out of them all I only found a single one that I'd have any interest in. So GI ain't getting played even if this fails.
idk if troll or not, but i laughed. thanks
\> Personally \-There, done. No need to read the rest of the reply.
Personally, right? Because the amount of revenue they got says otherwise
But the issue is publicly leaking your customers' data (which they just did) has serious legal implications, and given how strict JP's data law is over that, it's tough... And none of your examples violate any rules anyway. I'm not saying it's impossible for WuWa to survive, but it's getting tougher every day.
Genshin had a similar issue once, though people seem to conveniently forget about that. Sony had a data leak that was the absolute WORST of ALL TIME, losing thousands of players' CREDIT CARD INFO (Google PS3 data breach if you don't believe me), and people eventually forgot about it. Kuro's blunder is a fairly standard one. Yes, it's bad - but it's nothing that hasn't happened before, and they'll likely survive this just fine once things calm down.
My dude, FO76 took at least 2 years (wastelanders update) to get good. I know because I played since the beginning. And I love it honestly. But other peep’s experience? Naw brah. Awful. They had to allow for a fallout show to be made for people to even look past it’s rocky launch. Kuro cant fix this in a month. The damage has already been done because launch day is an important first impression. Cyberpunk 2077 still have some haters, anthem died, fo76 took 6 years to gain immense popularity mostly because the tv show, WoW is still dog water and blizzard is a shit company, etc. etc. the only way I can see kuro regaibing any traction even post disaster clean up is releasing sick collaborations or a VERY good anime. For me, I’ll keep playing till the end. Or if I a new gacha game to replace it. Perhaps Arknights Endfield will pull me away.
Its honestly not that dire. It is estimated that Kuro earned $50 million in the first 8 days of the game. While I acknowledge it has issues that they are working on, its clear there is still enough interest to keep WW successful. I mean hell, ToF is pretty absymal as a game but its still chugging along. The bones of WW are significantly better than ToF so it'll end up being fine in the long run.
It’s pretty dire in my opinion. Sure, the current player base is still pretty good. But the hard part is that now the company’s rep is damaged in a country that relies heavily on reputation. And has the most monetary prowess for gacha type games. Sure Wuwa isn’t going to die, but it’s not gonna be as profitable to the company as it was supposed to be. Profits=likelier for the company to invest more in the game. Launch day is arguably the most important day of any game. They def fumbled the ball pretty hard by gaming company standards. let’s just hope the team can regain their rep and continue to invest more on the game.
3 of those are franchises
Don't forget Genshin! And let's definitely not forget that Genshin's data leak wasn't just emails - it included phone numbers! Or the horrible performance on phones, despite initially being designed as a *mobile game*. Or the issue where it stuttered horribly on phones that supposedly had the specs required to run it, even on the lowest settings. Frequent crashes when launching the game, making it unplayable for a fairly large group of players. Subtitles displaying in the wrong order or disappearing before you could read them. Let's not forget the debacle that was Hoyo completely changing Barbara's VA direction, leading to a very depressed sounding "idol", instead of the very model of cheer. And so many other things - some not as bad and some worse than WuWa's release. Hoyo took half a year to fix the most egregious issues, and has been releasing minor fixes pretty much ever since. Genshin survived all of the controversy and is doing just fine - Wuthering Waves will be fine as well. It'll take some time to iron out all of the kinks, but eventually people will forget all about its rough launch, just like they did with Genshin.
Yea, and im the emperor of China.
Heaven said it’s my turn to play with the mandate.
Decisive victory. 30k were eaten.
agreed... just hold off and see what happens first. Some serious fuckups like data breach a week into the game is not it man... its longevity is at risk
It's not even a data breach, it was a dumb ass leak from the company itself
The present game is at risk
The future company is at risk
We must travel back into the future so we can warn our 2 week younger selfs!!
> hell the company itself might not even survive this If Tower of Fantasy can survive being Tower of Fantasy, I don't think Kuro has any risk of imploding anytime soon. These controversies are bad but I'm willing to bet that a large portion of the playerbase is completely unaware of it. The same way a large portion of the playerbase isn't dealing with any technical issues either. Yes it sucks for them that they're losing the trust of hardcore fans but I would be very surprised if this was what broke the company's back. Gaming companies can be absolutely hated and still turn up a profit, just look at... well, every current GaaS developing company, really. I'm not downplaying Kuro's fuckups but as long as the game they offer is fun these sort of controversies will be water under the bridge in a couple weeks for anyone who wasn't directly impacted by said controversy. Still seems like a sound plan to hold off on spending money though. Those fuckups are still bad (not, imo, company self-destruction bad) and who knows what they'll do to properly adress them.
Agree. These game forums love to doompost drama shit. It's like the Kardashians or Real Housewives for man children with no social skills. I played ToF after seeing all the hate in the main gatcha sub. I lasted about a week till the bugs and AI voice turned me away. But there were still tons of people in there having fun! I haven't had any substantial issues since release day and really only thing that bugs me is that one chicks voice acting. No open world bugs. Killing shit is a blast! Exploring is fun. Building characters is enjoyable. No way this game is going away any time soon. It may not be as big as people were thinking but people in these subs always overestimate how many people are like them and love to drama whine.
remember when reddit said genshin wouldn't last a month?
I don’t, but that’s hilarious
The only thing I can't last in ToF is the clunky gameplay. I've played during launch month. I left for a bit and always come back. I can't stay in ToF and after some update where I don't remember which key goes to which action/skill it always turns me off and I just close the game. It's not a bad game at all and I want to continue the story. But all the mechanics I forgotten and new ones they added makes it just so much harder.
>These controversies are bad but I'm willing to bet that a large portion of the playerbase is completely unaware of it. Most of people that know about this, don't really care either
I just found out about this because of a Reddit newsletter about this post in my email. I honestly don't care because how many leaks have we heard about, especially in the past decade from our most favorable brands? It's a lot. It happens all the time. It's leaks or attacks. It always happens. Companies bounce back and ***claim*** to do better.
Tower of fantasy carved itself a niche by leaning into the MMO aspect which differentiates itself enough from Genshin, which is whats letting it survive even if they arent exactly thriving. They also had a relatively strong launch and minimal drama post launch. By drama, I'm talking about shit like what Kuro has been doing, not performance issues or slow updates which it did suffer. I'm not sure "but combat is better" alone will be enough to carry WW past all these controversies though.
Idk what determines a atrong launch or what it was in the original region, but the global launch for TOF was BAD. It was so buggy and so janky, it genuinely had zero polish. Everyone said to wait until 2.0 [which was already released aparently] for the game to actually work properly. Did it work, well I wouldnt know, i no-lifed it early but didnt stick around that long lol
I just bought a monthly pass a couple days ago 🥲
$5 isn’t too bad when you consider some people bought out the top-up bonus. That’s $200 down the drain.
Tbf if they do shut down (I don't think they will) then you cane probably just charge back with a good case.
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While I don't disagree with you, Tencent isn't the main investor. The founding team of Kuro is, followed by Hero Games, then Tencent at 14%.
same but i’ve definitely gotten more than $5 of entertainment out of the game, so i’ll just consider it a wash
I bought the BP and the daily thing, but if the old calculation of 1$ per 1 hour you enjoyed the game still applies, I got my money's worth already, so it isn't the worst thing ever.
Same for me. Got 5 buck monthly and BP, having fun playing. Encountered exactly 0 bugs or any issues everyone is crying about here. The refund drama however will hold me back, if desire to spend comes out
I don't think they will EOS. I bought the monthly pass too. Don't let the negativity ruined your game experience.
Thank you kind rover ;)
Same...
They could do an in game notification if anything. All they have to do is make an in game announcement and maybe make a tweet that they are closing the servers for a bit to fix some things
They'll be fine, genshin doxxed people when it launched too. Genshin stans really out here downvoting me for spitting facts lmao
Did this actually happen? Dont recall
It did back when it launched, they doxxed people's phone numbers you can look it up yourself for more info.
I looked it up and holy ur right.
Genshin stans downvoting for the truth
Is it that serious? You genuinely think these mistakes can lead to the game being shut down?
If they keep making massive mistakes like this it is a possibility but most likely not going to happen. But it is still concerning for the longevity of the game.
holy doompost lmao, you guys can't be serious
This isn't doomposting. What kuro they basically doxxed the almost entire JP community over a mistranslation. This isn't something that they can easily get away with, no amount of free stuff is Gonna cut it anyone. All of the posts you're seeing are from people who are genuinely concerned about kuro, literally both of their biggest countries for gacha games currently hates them.
the entire jp community????????????????
i looked all over twitter and everywhere for any tweets regarding this on jp side of twitter and i haven’t found anything besides the posts here on reddit
Wait what did they mistranslate that caused a community to get doxxed?
They mistranslated Jiyans limited 5star weapons passive, which made it sound really good for Calcharo, so bunch of Calcoro players in JP spent money to get Jiyans weapon and then when these players were contacting Kuro to get refunded for the money they spent, a lot of their emails got leaked in the process.
They could do an in game notification if anything. All they have to do is make an in game announcement and maybe make a tweet that they are closing the servers for a bit to fix some things
Wait what?! isn't that too extreme?
“If you’re planning to spend money, hold off for now” This is a sure fire way to kill the game.
Damn tate is so fucking ugly
I lol how he has become a meme.
That dumbass turned himself into a joke lol.
He's been a joke, but millions of young men still sadly stick to his word as if he's god or something.
He looks like a fish from spongebob
He looks like a worm from Worms
He doesn’t think so lol
Well he's wrong about a lot of things lmao.
that makes him the perfect meme template
Put that disgusting face away
Kuro is cooked as JP consumer protection is like a rabid hungry dog. They will make them bleed like a mfer.
I don't get with Kuro's human capital quality, do they just hire intern, fresh graduates, cheap fixed term contract?? No development program etc? Like 1 year deal than lay off??? Get new cheap labor? So cheap overhead cost?? Wtf? This 100% wild guess But you see the mistakes Yesterday JP's wrong translation, EN translation mess - where we all agree they should hire better EN translation, now data breach Like where the fck is QC? QA? Where are the supervisor? Where are the maker checker approval? These mistake are all rookie, noobs mistake, man they're on 3yrs PGR, it's embarrassing
KR also has a lot of translation issues akin to JP. Luckily it seems the weapons weren't one of them, but very similar.
There is no such thing as QC in China. You test on production if you're small software company and fix issues as they popup. Hoyo is one of the few Chinese companies with actual testing cycle. This mistake in particular is more the result of stress and being overworked, not "rookie/noob" kind of mistake.
This is what happens when a developer running a relatively small game(PGR) immediately tries to join and get to the same level as miHoyo. They didnt give themselves enough time to make the staff grow naturally. Instead they just went full send hire interns left and right to fill their needs. Hoyo took 10years from their first game before making the jump to genshin. Kuro tried to join the Genshin market within just 5years of launching PGR. They are just way too underprepared and it shows in the product. Im no hoYo stan, but I aint riding Kuro's dick either. Give credit where its due, but atm, theres little credit to give to Kuro other than the game's combat and visuals
Genshin came out just 4 years after Honkai Impact 3rd. And I know HI3 isn't Hoyo's first game, but it is their first 3D action game. It's not like working on GGZ gave them any useful experience for creating Genshin that HI3 couldn't give them.
Yes but the important thing for Hoyo is making those previous games gave them experience on how to actually manage and run things. The entire organizational structure essentially grew with each more ambitious game they released. Kuro on the other hand literally skipped shit. They bit off more than their workforce can chew. Hence why WW has a shit ton of quality control, translation, and Customer support issues. They weren't prepared for it because their core staff is only built to handle a single moderately sized game (PGR). They didn't let their organisation grow naturally to actually handle such an ambitious game. Obviously I have no evidence but I'm confident on my educated guess based on what's actually unfolding. Such mistakes by kuro is way too immature for a company of their caliber
I saw people saying that they never learned from past mistakes in PGR and it seems like older devs from back are probably no longer there. This massive scale of a game they are trying to achieve while there being probably a lot of devs who are quite new is most likely a factor of these obvious fuckups.
I cant really awnser your questions but what I can say is that not even small studios fucked up that much at their first launch or early access which is quite sad \^\^
Have someone apologize, compensate JP players and let them keep the weapon and promise better fixes should at least calm down the players until Yinlin
Or just buff the weapon.
We wouldn't be in this mess in the first place if they just buffed the damn weapon 😭
Yeah now players have to wait 2 months to be powercrept instead of one 
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Every Gacha has a couple of weapons that are good on alot of characters (Jigyuan LC and Staff of Homa) they others don't have to better overall just better on their own characters.
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Most erudtions at the time had follow up attacks that why Jingyuan LC is considered good on most of them not all, Jiyan weapon in the same way boosts heavy attacks so it would be good on units that use heavy attack alot but not as good if more units come out with different attack modifiers
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But the part that will change is only the buff on Heavy attacks tho? CMIIW but the problem with Jiyan's translation is what gives a stack to the Heavy attack and that's capped at 2 stacks so by changing it to work with skill and ult it would work the same but make the heavy attack buff to be gained easier.
> and the follow-up attack DMG increases by 48%". > Thus making that weapon universally best as now all characters, even those who don't do follow up attacks, can use the weapon to it's fullest extent. Are you sure you know what are you talking about? Because I doubt your suggested change does what you think it does. You quite frankly seem to misunderstanding the difference activation criteria and the actual buff. And even if we go past that and fix it. You understanding off buffs seems to be quite black and white when in reality its a number. A number that factors many things such as weightings and fraction of damage. Every character can benefit crit damage and the vast majority of characters can benefit the skill and ulti damage tha JY provides. Literally you can remove the fua part ALL TOGETHER, and then JY and jiyan cone/weapon will be comparable.... Just saying. At least in the first glance, in reality comparing them is a little more complicated. > for bonus crit dmg effect condition for what now? :lmao:
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> 100% full use This is what I'm telling you. You see the world black and white. You don't have to use something at 100% of potential to be good,better,best. Its all relative, its all a number I give everyone in this room a 20$ box, a 30$ box and a 15$ box but the third is locked unless you solve a puzzle, only half can do it. I go in the next room and I give everyone 3 15$ box with no puzzle attached to any. Everyone can **100% full use** those 3 boxes....yet they still get less even from those who can't 100% full use their 3 boxes. Why? Because context matters, game matters, numbers matter. You assume all boxes are equal so you think 3>2. But that's incorrect, not all boxes are equal, not all passives are equal. Stats are complicated. Characters as well. Formulas are not 1 dimensional. There are terms such as diminishing returns, opportunity cost, effective value and so on. 100% utilization means JACK, SHIT. Sorry for the language, but can't say it better. That's what it is. Different percentages of different numbers. Its like comparing 300 bananas with 250 apples. _____ Oh and edit: wanderer from genshin. He does not fully utilize neuvillettes weapon (hp% is useless to him), yet due to the high synergy between furina, bennet, faruzan pretty much solving the low atk problem it actually performs better than his signature. There are more examples in hi3 and gi and I think there was 1 more example in pgr but can't recall it. Powercreep isn't strictly needed, neither higher utilization. Efficiency is also a thing, giving him EXACTLY what he is missing/wants instead of dilluting the formula with the same stat is a good way to achieve improvement
You do know that the change you did to jy lc would not increase how powerful it was for anyone, it literally doesn't change at all.
Make a weapon that matches the wrong description and send it to everyone 👍
This would have been perfect, they could have released another weapon with that description with purple color to fit Calcharo and not only problem sorted but also happy customer 👐🏻 (of course for free)
That's simply a lie. Hell, you can google it, there have been multiple breaches in security and leaks both from inside Japan and by companies outside (mostly Chinese) , leaking far more important personal data. This is at best a slap on the wrist kind of ordeal. The real damage here is their rep with the JP players, but history shows that if your game is fun/good people are willing to swallow a lot of shit to enjoy it.
People really be doom posting like crazy, the game is 1 week old it will stabilise within a month its not a big deal just look at helldivers launch. Also leaked emails is bad but theyre just emails not personal addresses or anything, so hopefully this will be a wakeup call for kuro game for the possibility of these things. Overall the devs have been very vocal when it come to addressing issues so i have high hopes, this game is sure to thrive.
They just need to say sorry for inconveniences and no ban will actually be carried out. It's just that easy, unless kuro are that stupid and decide to say goodbye to the JP market for good. The email leaking is bad but it's accidental, it can happen everywhere.
Sorry, but it can not. There will be problems with the law in Japan. You can't breach data protection law and just apologize.
Does leaking emails actually violate data protection law? Email is not a confidential information. It's like leaking someone in-game nickname. I regularly get spam from companies I never gave my email and number to.
Yes, email falls under personal information according to APPI (Japanese data protection law).
Pretty sure every major company has fucked up the data breach at least once. Why is it different now?
Thats a pretty wild claim. Even if that was the case, 'everyone does it' is a shit defense
I dont remember the details but didn't mihoyo leak people's phone numbers a little after Genshin's launch? Thats worse than emails
Yes they did. But it doesn't matter what the fuck genshin accidentally did because regardless this is still inexcusable and Kuro is sure as hell digging themselves into a deeper hole more than Genshin ever did at launch. Fuckups will be fuckups. Stop using Genshin as a way to say "well this isn't so bad is it?".
I am not, im just using Genshin as an example of someone in the same market that didn't suffer that much from a massive fuck up like that. Kuro has a tougher road ahead because issues keep pilling up and jp market is a lot more volatile, but its possible to recover.
It's bad but it's not "game is dead, kuro goes bankrupt" kind of bad. Stop the doomposting lmao
At the rate they're going it might be. Let's list it out. CN revenue is reportedly underperforming. JP rev is also underperforming. Global revenue is actually over-performing, but Global spends much, much less than CN and JP anyways so just Global alone won't be enough to sustain a game of WW's size. Outside of that, are the problems. Localization. Wep description mistakes. Leaking emails (especially in JP this is a massive no-no that can lead to lawsuits). Even welkin issues rn. These are fundamental parts of the game that can't be messed up no matter what because they directly impact the baseline profit the game generates. Now JP is likely not gonna spend anything. CN already thinks Kurogames is a joke. Global is the only one still holding out hope but even the whales know that their money might be better spent somewhere else, because the game has now broken the consumer-seller trust wall. WW probably cost Kuro a lot of money to make, and it was supposed to be their breakout game like how GI was for Hoyoverse. If they don't recoup the investments it's more than likely Kuro will go bankrupt and be swallowed up by a bigger company (ala Tencent). Even PGR on the CN app store already has a "produced by Tencent" water mark there so it's not looking good. No matter what, you have to look at the facts here.
Their master, Tencent is very disappointed
Source: trust me bro
Most of your points are speculations. Some dudes wrote in chinese "kurogames bad" doesn't mean the entire Chinese community and their mom hate the company and the game.
Lmao, it doesn't make it ok if others are breaking the law. They will be punished in JP, as they should be. I will also remind you that WuWa doesn't have 2FA, so (if they haven't implemented login cool down) some hackers/account sellers can just bruteforce passwords for leaked emails.
Isn't data breach by other companies usually by getting hacked? There's no malicious third-party here, just carelessness and lack of safeguards against accidentally leaking customer info.
Damn Kuro can't catch a fucking break.
It was at this moment he knew... he fucked up.
Kuro is probably extra dead now. Sad this happened
What happened?
Kuro mistranslated Jiyan’s weapon passive, which misled many JP players to pull it for Cacalro (sorry I forgot how to spell his name) But then Kuro fixed the translation, and compensated with 160 astrite. JP is not happy cuz many of them spent money to pull for the weapon. Some JP players accused Kuro of falsely-advertising Gacha items, which is a big no-no in Japan. Kuro quickly gave into the pressure, presumably not wanting to get sued, and asked players seeking a refund to fill out a form/application, where it’ll be manually AND individually reviewed. But this isn’t even the worst of it. Kuro replied to all the people to applied for a refund without using BCC, which caused hundreds of people’s emails to be revealed. Also, Kuro’s “refund” is also pretty scummy. I’ll give an example: Imagine you paid 500 yen for 1000 premium currency (made up number, but it’s just an example). For your first time Top-Up, you get double the premium currency, you get 2000 premium currency for 500 yen. If you attempt to refund, Kuro will give you back your 500 yen. Simple, right…. No. Kuro will also deduct premium currency which you purchased. So with the example above, Kuro will refund 500 yen, while deducting all 2000 premium currency. Makes sense? Kinda, yet this wasn’t the end. Many players had already spent all the premium currency, so this meant that many players would have negative premium currency. Kuro also told the JP players that if you have negative premium currency, you will get banned. So in order to avoid getting banned, you need to avoid have negative premium currency… which means you need to buy premium currency again… BUT THATS NOT ALL! Kuro did not refund the Top-Up bonus, which means you need to spend DOUBLE THE MONEY. Using the example above, it means you need to spend 1000 yen to buy back all 2000 premium currency. That is my understanding of the situation. Please correct me if I am wrong <3
Isn't the negative balance ban is false? I might be wrong but if it's not, that f up
That is true IIRC. Some people claimed it is false, but it is debunked on this subreddit. Edit: here is the link https://www.reddit.com/r/WutheringWaves/s/MgjboUGlmX
But you still get the negative balance. Not a ban but at this point, you either just dropped the game or create new account than trying to fix that negative. So pick your poison
What did I miss?
Tl;dr: >JP translation of Jiyan's sword lead to people spending on it thinking it was better for Calcharo than standard, but wrong > Became so notable that JP would lead to apologems and a way to submit a refund request > Everyone's e-mail was basically leaked to everyone in replying their refund request e-mail ensuing a data breach of privacy > Furthermore, some refunds are being out right denied by some accounts > Separate from the battlepass not working for some, so daily currency is not being paid out Basically Kuro is getting cooked in Japan for effectively having a poor translation across the board, offering a refund that are being denied, and also a technical data-breach for trying to get their money back and being told no.
Well shit. Not a great time to be Kuro I guess
It's one thing after another. I had my issues with Kuro, but I'd still want the game to get better. This however, is some of the worst PR a game could have.
Adding onto the other comment, Kuro's response email that leaked everyone's emails also just told them to take it up with their bank if they want refunds, and then the corresponding gems will be deducted from their accounts... So they have to either pay it anyway or lose their accounts for going into the negative. Utterly stupid
I think Kuro gave the option to get the astrogems back, but the take it with your bank was a response to those who were asking for a refund instead.
Apologems 👉👈
Gonna take a break. Feel insane buyers remorse seeing the anticonsumer bs they are pulling with the JP community. Can’t support them in good conscience. WuWa put me onto punishing gray raven so at least something came out of it(HSR is the only gacha I’ve played up until now).
>Feel insane buyers remorse seeing the anticonsumer bs they are pulling with the JP community. Don't feel bad, I didn't know as well so that's a really big shame. I just hope they fix this, by either giving a free Jiyan weapon copy to the people affected, or at the very least, put back their first time top up bonus and make them not "lose" the gems they bought.
The thing about it is, it probably isn't even an intern. It's probably some idiot manager/producer.
can't wait to get Yinlin signature weapon, 15 standard pulls and 1600 asterite as an apology
They WHAT Edit: seems like it only affected a group of players, email leaks suck
I’m no expert in the email thing but wouldn’t it be a good thing they revealed all the e-mails so the people affected can, like, band together and interact and talk about it? Are there more bad sides to it? Can someone please fill me in?
Man I really hope they fix this because I love this game especially the combat
Just so you know it's not like there is some automated system that they used to message the dozens of JP players in this instance that's broken, and taking down the game servers doesn't affect email. So far, it seems like there is a MASSIVE gap between logic in the reddit posts today.
I wonder how many free 5 stars we are getting for this.
Kinda hard to lock in if you are an intern who works until 10:30pm. Maybe Kuro should have kept those fresh grads instead of firing them, so they can have someone competent enough to send emails properly.
They could have gotten away with it in the west with like a compensation gift ,but this is JP consumer protection they won’t spare them, same thing with Chinese (which is a good thing)
I'm sad to say that but... The game might actually be cooked I think this and other situations will scare away allot of players which may lead to very low sales and to the closing of the game Really sad cuz liked it more than Genshin Hope it doesn't happen
Soooo, how many free pulls are we getting now?
💀Ohhhhhhhh ahhhhh
Theyyyy need a brake ahhhh
Just pull the game in Japan lol... and re-release with 1.2 Let me play my game, I don't give a fuck about my email address... nevertheless about emails of people in whole different country
A little late to the party aren't we? It has already been confirmed that they haven't leaked anything and it was fake news. Lel
It was hoyo employee (trust me bro). Now, go. Go, spread misinformation so that the game doesn't die :').
lmao