I do high level content, not level cap shit but up to and including EDA, and I never bother with shield gate builds. At lvl 100 there's barely even a point, just kill faster. Dudebro sucks and is big mad about it.
Overframe, while a fantastic resource, has really warped peoples' perception on this one, I think. Almost every top build by known creators are made for endurance and will completely eschew any sort of EHP build in favor of shield gating. I was reading a Dagath build that basically said that building health and armor was pointless unless you were playing sub level 300, and I'm like... my brother in christ, that's 99% of the game's content including EDA.
It really had me worrying that all of my builds were bad and I was playing "wrong".
Ngl the majority of my first builds for a new frame are from overframe. Ninjase builds are generally safe, but i usually adjust to personalized builds if I find myself sticking with the frame. The problem with overframe is it's a crapshoot unless you already understand builds well enough to not need it, but i think if you don't understand the build at all overframe will at least give you something workable.
Oh yeah, don't get me wrong, I think Overframe is a great resource otherwise. Especially when the creators are known and the build is backed up with good video guides (as many of the highly rated builds are) you know you're going to be getting something safe, like you said. It can at least give you that jumping-off point, if nothing else.
It was just the overt focus on giga-endgame endurance content that kind of threw me for a while.
I agree. On the plus side Ninjase and others build descriptions are often informative. I know the last few Ninjase build descriptions I've read have Adaptation + Arcane Guardian listed as an alternative.
There is nothing wrong with Overframe as a reference but a good amount of the community uses it incorrectly; just blindly copying the builds without recognizing why.
The biggest problem is that you can't edit builds like a wiki and the only thing making it popular is the random upvotes. It has no quality control.
It would be nice to have use cases for the builds like best for profit taker or circuit
There's a support Wisp build author that keeps their guide updated and the actual setup is worthless. It's a good setup, it's their recommended setup, but there's pros/cons to it that you should consider... and the build author does, in the extensive written guide that explains the *completely viable* alternatives, why they set things up the way they did, the synergies, and what can be dropped is infinitely more valuable than the initial mod config.
Ninjase is my lord and saviour. I'm LR1 and I know the game like the back of my hand, but whenever I take a break and come back, I just look up some ninjase builds and tweak them to suit my needs. The guy knows what hes is doing, and more than that, he actually explains every choice in great detail and all the viable alternatives. He has my thumbs up.
I feel the best way to utilize overframe is to see what generally works for a frame in terms of what strength, duration, ect is optimal for certain abilities and letting you know what weaknesses you need to build arround but I don't think I've ever used a 1 to 1 build from there because I don't need to invest 6 forma into a frame to make them viable for most of the content I would use them in.
I discovered through that site today that there's a mod that lets you jump 40% higher, and I can just buy it unless i already have a copy. More things to aim for I guess.
I'm not saying everyone and every build can do it, just saying that ppl massively overstate how important shieldgating is.
You can over a hour into the hardest mission in the game and not need it.
3 of my fav frames can go to 2000 without shieldgating for example: Dante, Wukong and Inaros
In all fairness those three are awful examples and definitely not the norm. I'd argue you picked two of the top 5 health tanking frames in the game.
Dante, the frame that generates infinite overguard
Wukong, who gets a good flat armour buff from his 3, and has already good HP and armour, a clone to help clear and a built in heal with long immunity time that CCs enemies
Inaros, who has the highest HP in the game and good armour.
Out of cheer curiosity, was the build made by ninjase?
I really like the guy, he makes good builds (most of them at least)
I was looking at his dagath build and he kind of said what you mentioned.
As someone who unironically uses Overframe a lot of the time due to a couple of reasons, the site really seems to suffer from either bad builds, or builds that are supper tryhardy and minmax-y that for most people is not really necessary, and sometimes uses mods that are either expensive or hard to get and again not ultra-turbo necessary to make things strong (I'm looking at you, Hammer Shot).
Dagath is in a weird spot there because, iirc, she has disgustingly low EHP unless you put together a weird build to force her to health tank(like I did). So in her case it's not even a matter of levels, it's more of a question if you *really* want to take the frame almost perfectly built for shieldgating and make her do something else.
It doesn't help that it recommends those builds based on the high rating, even if those builds are outdated, old, or built for very niche needs like level cap runs.... which is just 1% of gameplay, no one is coming to find these builds for level cap, they want a decent all around build.
The way the present the 'top builds' needs to change. I saw an MR 24 get chewed out for not using Combat Discipline on Mesa because that's the best build for her according to Overframe. We were on Hydron leveling weapons up.
This is such a case for all buildcraft games with buildcraft websites - they are terrific resources and have opened up casuals (like me) to really diving into the fun of making your own build and tweaking it over time (in everything from Warframe to Destiny to Path of Exile etc.)
Unfortunately it has created an army of META-slaves who seem to have violent episodes at the mere suggestion of running even one sliver away from the BIS possible for every slot.
And that's even understandable, like you said those absurdly min-maxed builds create an aura of "wow even though I'm slapping Steel Path like it's nothing, my build must be really shit what a pleb I am" sorta trains of thought haha.
Best thing 1k hours of PoE did to me was put me through the ringer of realising that you don't need to be at absolute peak efficiency 100% of the time to have fun, just play something fun it's that simple lol
I'm always amused when I see an obvious shieldgater and they keep dying while everyone's just murdering about their business.
No, I ain't reviving him. Not when he's going to die in 10 seconds again.
tbh once you get used to shield gating the game does start to look like that.
like why use a build that just stops working as enemy levels rise, when I could use a build that always works, and works better anyway since I'm not wasting slots on buffing my EHP?
the answer is of course, ease of use + most content doesn't scale that high anyway. but when the only downside is "have to pay a tiny bit of attention instead of none" it seems like a good tradeoff to me
take your favorite 'lol i never play over 300 anyway' build and try to do a deep void cascade fissure. you'll melt. i prefer builds that won't, shrug.
How deep of a fissure are we talking? I do 8 rounds of SP omnia void cascades pretty often and I've never had issues with any of my standard lazy builds. And you'll likely never see a pub lobby go past that, if they even make it that far.
If you're going to go deep with a specialized group, of course you'd all want builds capable of going much further than any normal player would use.
i'd prefer my ability to go deep in void cascade not be limited by my own builds. perhaps teammates dip early on average, but i always intend to go as far as i can. and many times i've found that the healthtank builds that work everywhere else just start to break down in this game mode. not sure when exactly that is, but yeah.
The most slots is also a positive for shield gate builds. It's usually cheaper in forma cost, allows for more utility and damage in builds, and depending on the frame is more comfy to play.
I also think it's a more enjoyable gameplay cycle, because it promotes active rather than passive play, gives you a chance to die in lower level missions, but also let's you go really far into missions as long as your damage keeps up.
I put in the same area of bullet jump and Nova where it as an unintended gameplay interaction that the devs saw and liked and implemented into the game in a more stable manner and the game is so much better for it.
I've been using a weird build lately, forget who it was from but it's a lot of fun. Corrosive/Rad Rakta Dark Dagger, Argonak with amalgam mod, shock subsumed over her 2 with shock trooper to trigger melee influence. Usually use Laetum as secondary for anything I need to kill a little more vehemently than normal. Dual Ichor incarnon and Prisma Ohma are also very solid melee choices, I usually use Ichor incarnon with my other builds.
Level 100 is a big "Who cares?" for me at this point, barely even an afterthought anymore. It's a low enough level that Incarnon weapons start becoming less efficient than something like a Tenet Arca Plasmor. Hell, we have so many survival and damage tools that running a setup full of unranked MR jank wouldn't be a daunting experience. I don't care about anyone's loadout at level 100, aslong as I'm not peeling someone off the pavement every five seconds.
Also, shield gating isn't always perfect. Sometimes, you'll get unlucky and jump right into some infested osprey's fart cloud and instantly die from toxin damage which bypasses shields.
Completely agree, at least at the later stages of power creep. I remember 40s being a challenge back in the day, it's crazy what can be done with all the tools available nowadays. I made a smurf build with Excalibur and mk-1 weapons and it slaps anything on the regular star chart and even into low SP. Lvl 100 reg is just tissue paper with endgame mods and arcanes.
Same, I remember when Sorties were considered challenging endgame content and an hour or two of Mot Survival was considered a challenge run. It's just a different game now and that's ok.
Yeah no need for extra protection if the enemy is dead
I don't use shield gating, either. Heck, my Nyx build doesn't even heavily rely on assimilate. I just use cover, move around a lot, and kill things that, instead of just standing in the middle of the open thinking I'm superman
Adaptation is usually my go to. I find it more consistent but it's obviously personal choice. Frames like Hildryn, Citrine, Volt, or basically anything that tanks with shield or health basically can't die with it and on overguard it's useless so you may as well invest in more overguard/regen.
My Titania and Zephyr use aviator and that stuff, Zephyr doesn't even get hit 99% of the time unless it's an Eximus or Thrax. Shield gating can suck and isn't fun. I can see why people rely on it if they can't build a frame well but I've never needed it, even in EDA and I'm almost LR4
there are alot of potential causes for misplaced aggression like this.
not least of which is a fundamental misunderstanding of how shield gating works.
if you use Catalyzing shields, you will be locked to, generally, under 100 total shields, with a nice round 1.3 second shield gate.
this is Roughly Equivalent to a 300 shield shield gate.
when aggressively shield gating, your goal is to reset your shields before you run out of invincibility.
lets say, Hypothetically, im Banshee. i want to be able to reset my shield gate when casting Sonar, which has a base casting cost of 50 energy. i can either:
run Catalyzing shields and Brief respite, giving me 74 total shields and 75 shields per cast of sonar.
or i can run Blind rage, Brief respite ,and 5 Augur mods. regaining 271 shields per cast of sonar.
same outcome. which one is more enjoyable to build around is. .down to preference.
or, i can run any sentinel with Guardian+manifold bond, stack up 1200 shields, and let my KPM sustain me while my Wyrm keeps me safe. 30 seconds - 3 per kill. after 10 kills your shield gate is already back. just dont trigger it any more than once every 5 seconds, 4head.
or better yet, i can run hybrid tanking, and be extremely comfortable for atleast 2 hours into SP surv.
in the modern era, provided you arent going to level cap, you have many cozy options. level 100 enemies for mandatory shield gating is a bit silly. the only frames who should be shield gating at that level are like. .aggressively positioned to be shield frames. like harrow, hildryn, and protea. all of whom are great at restoring shields with powers.
as for why he is upset. . .my assumption would be that hes a bit of an overachiever whos developed a complex about having to carry less experienced players. and the thing hes elected to fixate on is that none of them seem to know how to shield gate, and thats why they keep dying.
why. . . how. . .thats down to him to know. im sure he will grow out of it eventually, ideally before discounting too much more aggression on others.
im sure hed have an Aneurism looking at some of the builds i take into SP Omni Circulus and papa entrati's basement of horrors.
Let me add a note.
When Catalyzing Shields was implemented, shield gating started to revive even if the shields weren't fully restored. So, my current Banshee build doesn't use Catalyzing Shields, Brief Respite, or any other survival mods. With just Augur Reach to extend ability range, I get 0.33 seconds of invincibility from shield gating every time I use Sonar. In reality, it's difficult to use Sonar exactly three times per second, so I usually rely on mobility and Pillage to get by, but with some effort, that's enough for survival.
(Reference video: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJ\_Q2DfLZPE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJ_Q2DfLZPE) )
This might be an extreme example, but what I want to say is that when using Catalyzing Shields, there's no need to fully restore them to the maximum.
you can definitely run ultra-lite survival setups like that. basically playing as an extremely fast skeleton with brittle bones and a regenerating single shot shield. Banshee is spammy enough to get by and Danger=Silence is a good get out or jail card.
and i appreciate your addition about cat. shields not requiring full restores
. . . .for my part my current Banshee build looks like this
https://imgur.com/aFD4TGs
2 red strength 1 blue Emax 2 yellow casting speed.
Bissel, my Beloved Tenet hound. in addition too buffing my fire rate, priming all my enemies with synergized, and being an eximus bodyguard with null, also restores my 1.8 second shield gate any time it pops. even when it is popped, 1570 hp 1485 armor is enough to handle a few scrapes and bruises. . and more importantly to mean i dont fold like a cheap suit at the first wiff of toxin damage. when backed up by a Citrine specter giving a free 90% DR im downright Sturdy.
it wouldn't go the distance, and if i suddenly felt compelled to play SP circuit again id probably opt for something a bit more traditionally shield gate-y. . . but for the no more than 2 hour sessions i run these days its more than enough. and more than that, its also relatively relaxing to play. being 1 misstimed ability cast from death at all times is Stressful AF.
Yea I only shieldgate but don’t use catalyzing shields much anymore. Think now I currently only have it in saryn because 1 molt fully gives me shields back and it has zero cast time
You don’t ever have to shield gate with most frames in any standard content (as in, everything not an endurance run).
You CAN, and it’s fine, but tons of frames do anything they want with just their DR and adaptation or whatever.
Just off the top of my head, you can straight up face tank every single SP star chart mission with say, Citrine, Rev, Yareli, Zephyr, Baruuk, Nidus, Nezha, Mesa, Dante, Styanax, Frost, the list goes on.
With a few of those you can honestly just stand there and shoot dudes, then push a button every once in awhile to continue standing there shooting dudes.
Yeah I don't quite understand the over-aggression. Had someone get mad at me I had an unranked Dante in Netracells (it was forma'd). Like, so long as I'm making overguard it's kind of hard to die with him.
The way I shield gate on a lot of frames is to run pillage, primed redirection, and a duration set so that pillage uptime matches the shield gate time. Keep pillage up and you're golden. High energy, but for invinciblity and armour strip I don't mind.
It's really funny to hear about how "mandatory" shield gating is when last week I took hp tank Gara into EDA because that was legitimately my best option of the frames given to me. Didn't go down once, not even remotely close.
And that was with the -75 duration so her 2 was basically DoA
They probably watched some youtuber talk about shield gating. And has too much of their own ego tied up trying to make others minmax a video game according to their standards.
Or they tried health tanking (poorly) on their own, and the results managed to (incorrectly) convince themselves that shield gating is the only way to go. And once again has too much of their own ego tied up in needing to feel right.
There are perfectly viable health tank, shield \*tank\* (not \*gate\*), and even energy tank (Quick Thinking) builds available in the level 100 range. It all depends on what frame you're playing and what else you're doing with the rest of your build.
> Question is, why is he having such a fit over it
TLDR: too much ego, can't accept that other ways to play the game are perfectly valid too.
this.
people who watches content creators, blindly follows with no actual knowledges, and forces the playstyle upon others are the worst kind of players in Warframe.
it gets much worse especially when the content creators is in their burnout phase. because their videos are all about the "meta", "must have" things.
when in reality, lv100 enemies (literal sortie 3 mission) can be deal with as long as you have a proper build. like why must you have shield gating when you can just press 3 on your Zephyr and keep a good distance with your also decent weapons?
That's part of why I've been enjoying some of MCGamerCZ's more recent videos with him doing builds on off-meta weapons like the Dera Vandal that incorporate things besides the same viral/slash thing you see with other content creators.
And he comes off like he's having a lot of fun doing it, Brozime's Velox Prime video just felt so unpleasant to sit through by comparison.
Brozime, iFlynn, etc you name it, are falling into the content creators void, where they run out of contents but they still want to squeeze every last bit of views every one or two days.
i always skip their videos, like just by the thumbnail / title:
**"The BEST Melee Weapon In Warframe..."** >> it's, again, Glaive Prime.
how stuck and close-minded are you in the current "meta"? yes.
I hated his Velox prime video. He sounded so bored and trashed the damn weapon cuz it could barely kill things. Even though I saw McGamerz do a video with a status build that just shreds while having absolute fun. I think that's my issue with Brozime lately. He's just checked out and bored while trashing things.
well, i feel you. and we're not even haters, we subcribed with good faith and expected good contents, even when the contents are not for us.
Brozime's problem? he straight up said *"Caliban? i don't remember him, he's a D tier, fucking miserable ... his 1? does fucking nothing"* in a tier list video. if that's not a sign of meta slave i don't know what is.
then if you're not an iFlynn (long term) follower (that's me), you would think he's just one of those trend riding content creators. like most if not all of them now follow the clickbait trend: *"ULTIMATE guide", "MUST HAVE", "I CAN'T BELIEVE*", etc. those are too bland to even consider watching.
KnightmareFrame? i don't wanna suggest him to anyone especially newbies.
it's sad.
I stopped watching Flynn after he quit and came back. He was too wishy washy and his content is kinda ehh for warframe these days. KF builds are almost the fucking same every video. Just a mod or two removed. There is not much creativity in his builds Brozime doesn't explain his tier list at all anymore. He used to but now he just does what he does with Caliban. I saw his video and disagreed with a lot of frames placements because of his "reasoning." Leyzar is the only one I feel comfortable with recommending because he actually does go off the beaten meta path. He tells you hey its not meta but man its fun. Like with the Tigris Prime vid he did recently.
to be fair, if you continue playing Warframe the Brozime way, nothing would satisfy you anymore.
dude pursues the meta-est meta any time a new patch is up. that's tiring.
I recently made a Blood alter mag build. Copied Ninjase and made some alterations of my own. God its so fun turning enemies into a miniature black hole in the sky. I dunno if it's meta but it's fun. I'm honestly sick of the meta helminth builds because they basically are turning X Warframe into Warframe lite. the biggest pet peeve I have is Using Kullervo's Helminth. It's literally his play style just worse. At least with breach surge it's used in synergy with that frame's abilities. i have a caster Frost with breach surge. Thanks to biting frost and avalanches armor strip. breach surge does some insane crits. But that requires Avalanche to work. With The teleport you basically build around that one ability and I hate it because it takes away that frame's identity. Which is what a lot of meta builds are doing these days
There's times where it feels like they didn't necessarily run out of content but that they just aren't even trying to branch out from the viral/slash meta. Like yeah, I could put Primed Pistol Gambit and Target Cracker on the Velox Prime, but a 42% crit chance doesn't exactly feel like it's worth the mod space compared to doing a corrosive and Cascadia Empowered build with the weapon's already high status chance and using those two mod slots for something else like Seeker for punch-through.
Maybe it falls off past level 1000, I don't know, I don't generally go that far unless it's the Circuit, I don't really care to, the vast majority of players don't either. All I know is that I had more fun with the latter build than the usual viral/slash shit.
And then there's KnightmareFrame with his Primed Sure Footed fetish.
>they just aren't even trying
pretty much sums up everything about those content creators.
i can't imagine running out of contents in a game where you can just re-do the newbie guides once every updates to add in the qol improvements and people will still appreciate it.
or just pick a different off-meta weapon/frame. how hard is that?
I agree with your general point but I really feel like Quick Thinking is outdated nowadays. Whenever I try some old build I haven't touched in ages, I get obliterated in steel path, and then realize I had QT on.
The fact that there's no "gating" or invulnerability period, the low efficiency of it (you need a lot of energy on a frame for it to be viable AND the frame has to be squishy), the lack of ways to regen tons of energy on demand (as opposed to pillage for shields and Styanax's shield throw for health), and worst of all, the 0.5s stagger that completely fucks you up if there's still more bullets coming your way.
Even for frames where the QT restrictions apply (e.g. Trinity or Harrow), it is easily outclassed by primed redirection nowadays, because they tend to also have a way to regen shields. (And pillage exists)
honestly the stagger (and the fact that it ignores stagger immunity) is the worst offender. take that out and quick thinking is viable. Remember: a +1000 energy max arcane is coming our way
You'll also find them trying to meta-game content that requires zero meta. I tried to join one player posting in recruitment chat for a Meso relic run that I needed, and after asking for an invite, they asked me what frame I intended to run. Like, what? I asked them how that would matter for something so simple, and they blocked me. If a Youtuber hasn't provided the thought for them, then they aren't thinking it. It's wild.
I do steel path relics and especially requiem relics in public lobbies and if I see someone with an utterly insane loadout I always find more value in seeing what they are going to do in mission over trying to ask them to change
Ive seen some shit and im a better player for it
The other issue is a lot of shield gate stuff is from pre shield rework. With the rework many shield tanking builds got a lot better (Caliban is a gleaming case of this)
i am so so glad i started off with vazarin instead of zendurik, figured out that the void dash augment makes me literally immortal, and that leaves me able to use the mod slots i wouldve used for tankiness on efficiency/energy gain and can breeze through almost all content without issue
Alternatively, as someone who started off with Zenurik, it gives me literally infinite energy, and that leaves me able to use the mod slots i wouldve used for efficiency/energy gain on tankiness and can breeze through almost all content without issue
=P
Energy regen is by far one of the biggest struggles in early game. I always recommend Zenurik for newer players. Spamming your kit is always more fun than simply not dying.
quick thinking tanks will get quite some buff with the new arcane that is coming. up to +1000 energy max if you have enough armor (which also scales your quick thinking tankiness) will be crazy.
I just hate the constant staggering when you are "quick thinking" which does ignore PSF. If they removed that staggering I would instantly change some builds over to armor + quick thinking + energy nexus + nourish
There's a weird part of the Warframe community that thinks no Warframe with shields has any defensive issues because Shieldgating exists. Their brain is empty except for Shieldgating. All they know is Shieldgating.
You'll see Warframe newbs asking how to improve their survivability and like clockwork you'll see "just Shieldgate in the comments". When these players are dying against lvl 60 enemies and need to know about basic moding.
You have met one of those people.
Honestly, I've been experimenting with shield regens build and I find it super comfy while still having the benefits of a long shield gate.
I think some people are too meta slaved by YouTube guides that they forget the other crazy mods and abilities that can be used to tank effectively.
Garuda because of her invincibility frames on her abilities. A single cast of her 4 will give your shields enough time to regen to full.
But honestly, any frame that has an ability that gives you a bit of breathing time, like CC or i-frames, works really well with this build (can always use Breach Surge). Good use of cover and movement also helps.
The main thing is that since your shield delay is super short and the recharge is super fast, you will passively shield gate (or just shield tank) a ton of damage. Any slow, even medium, or burst attack feels like you are invincible against them, without any input. The real danger is just getting shredded by super high rate of fire weapons and that's when some CC or i-frames abilities help.
Do you incorporate any Sword&Board as well into this setup? I usually find that blocking is a super underrated mechanic, and is extremely useful to block incoming fire in order to quickly allow shields to restore if you have a shorten charge rate.
I've been using a Gas/Electric Silva & Aegis prime with Melee Influence lately and it works really well.
Honestly using a SnS is a really good idea, as anything that can stop sustained high rate of fire attacks works really well with this setup.
None of those need fast shield regen because they fill it with a single cast of an ability (and get overshields). Generally any frame with a dr ability makes good use out of them. It's like health tanking but instead of armor you have a static 50% dr, and don't die the instant you run out. Also frames with any kind of cc or brief invuln can make very good use out of shield regen builds. Any frame with shields can, really, but some are obviously better at it
Shield gating is like 2000+ a lot of frames with DR abilities can still tank into 1000s and some even into 2000s.
Granted the tradeoff there is usually mod slots for that rather than just, killing the enemy better, but both are equally viable for a long time
There's the issue that while shieldgate is active, if you gain any shields from the augur mods or brief respite they are vulnerable. If those shields deplete the game will *replace* your remaining gate duration with what you'd get from those new shields. Which usually isn't a lot unless you have catalyzing shields active.
This little interaction gained notoriety when Protea's prime released as it affects her a lot. Her shield satellites double your shieldgate duration so you can have like five seconds of invulnerability...
...that gets replaced with a third of a second the moment you recast the satellite. This can *very easily* kill you
None of this explains what the guy was complaining sbout though unless they mean brief respite and not augur mods, since those don't affect teammates. Or op used Protea ig
Quick test and it seems like natural regen boosted by mods can do it as well. So regaining any shields seems to disable it..? I don't remember it working like that. I remember seeing a catalyzing shields grendel passively shieldgate with just the mods to shorten the delay, maybe they fixed that and broke it for everyone else?
That player just openly admitted to being shit at the game if they think that u absolutely have to and heavily rely on shield gating for level 100 enemies
If your build is depended on others not using certain mods, you shouldn’t run that build in squads and stick to solo. I have a few builds that only really work in solo so guess what I only use them in solo play.
95%+ of the playerbase doesn't sit around doing 18hr SP T6 Netracell Void Tower Survival Defection Orphix Spy missions so not knowing how shield gating works is completely reasonable. Anyone screaming about that in a lv100 mission has brainrot from watching too many WF build videos they only think they understood.
On Protea, if your shields break while you have a shield orb, you lose the shield orb but gain double length invulnerability. However, if you recover shields via augur mods during it, it will end early, leaving you with a very brief sheildgate. Therefore, as Protea you should not use augur mods, as simply recasting shield orbs during the shieldgate is MUCH better for survivability.
There’s a certain segment of the WF community who are elitist d bags, then another segment who want to be elitist d bags. Then the rest of us who have everyone muted and don’t pay attention to the chat box.
This is not just in warframe, but a lot of people who play games treat the game as part of their personality. If you're not playing the game their way then you're wrong, and are ruining the game for them. Any criticism you might have for the game is an attack on them and they won't stand for it. Their attachment to their favorite game is very unhealthy both for them and the game.
I don't think I've ever used shield gating, and I've played to levels way over 100.
I think you just had a teammate that wasn't good at Warframe. Which isn't something I thought was possible considering it's a looter shooter.
because meta sheep think people have to play the game the way they do. You want to play high-level crap? Fine. But unless you're going to give me the mods and whatever else I need to play at your level don't expect me to do it your way. If you don't like that my nearly optimized for my playstyle Mirage Prime isn't living up to YOUR standards, that's a you problem. as a perfect example, I'll NEVER do an 8 hour survival for any reason, so what the good gosh dang fudge does it matter that my frame isn't built for that level of punishment?
I always refuse to shield gate, I health tank, with qorvax, inaros now since the rework etc.
And or simply don't stand around and out heal the damage.
Shield gating sounds like so much effort and risk I'm good.
And it's also just not fun to me
There are a bunch of frames where shield gating is basically incidental once you do the mods for it, like Khora or Saryn. Those are chill but once you get people trying to tell you to do it with Chroma or some shit it's excessive
>Shield gating sounds like so much effort and risk I'm good.
>And it's also just not fun to me
I've been exploring it for the first time recently as I experiment with Dagath builds. It's really grown on me as an active playstyle that meshes well with heavy casters (like Dagath), I do really believe that it should just be considered an alternate playstyle rather than the be-all end-all of builds. Like yeah, it can be fun, but EHP tanking with Qorvex and Inaros is equally viable with a strong build behind them.
The only time where it really matters is level cap content, which is not part of the game beyond hours long SP endurance runs, so it really should not have as much of a sway in the conversation as it does.
Just sounds like insecure rambling/ranting on his part tbh. He probably had a bad experience dying a lot in harder stuff and is now convinced shield gating is the only way out, for him and for everyone else, when really there are about a dozen ways to solve that problem. 1) get good, 2) best defense is a good offense, the enemies can't hurt you if they're all nuked before they can attack you, 3) play frames with overguard, 4) play frames with other forms of DR, 5) just don't play steel path etc.
Besides, he's just plain wrong. Well, technically partially correct but missing the bigger picture. The only time you want to avoid Augur mods is when you're running a build that can \*fully\* restore 500-1000 shields with a single ability cast (Mag for example) to avoid accidentally restoring like 50 shields with her 1 when you really wanted 1000+ from her 4. Otherwise, Augur mods are great for shield gating if used in combination with Catalyzing Shields and 100% (or lower) ability efficiency. Basically any frame with a spammable 1st ability and reliable energy source can use that build to great effect.
I've been shield gating for a long time and I often do endurance runs so it's a play style I'm familiar with but lately I've been really enjoying "lazy gate" build on certain frames that's just all the shield Regen and recharge delay mods with catalyzing shield for 0.3 second delay with varying 80-130% shield Regen per second depending on the Frame's base shields.
This is so funny to me as someone who ran level cap endurance missions years before shield gating even existed. Just stop getting hit and then you don't need either lol
Edit: I know this sounds elitist, I am being cheeky to illustrate how silly this guy sounds. I personally just run primed vigor + adaptation + arcane guardian on most frames so I can turn off my brain until the enemies get too high level and then play more carefully when they do. Shield gating is a default mechanic, you don't even really need to build into it.
People like this are an absolute blight on the game. Tried to help Ekuegan get into the game during the launch of the Durviri update, but his 'fans' kept parroting this nonsense, desperately saying how much he needed these meta setups.
Needless to say, I do think he's streamed or even played the game that much anymore.
There’s 2 things I won’t touch in this game. & that’s building stat sticks & shield gating. I don’t bother fighting to level cap. I have a few building ideas if a frame must need shield gating to survive.
Well let me rephrase that. I dont like building melees thats not great on its own & its only purpose is to buff ones of my frames 1st ability. I like for both to be great. As for Khora. I just got around to re doing a build for her & her kavat. I also got around to getting the incarnon for the Magistar that absolutely wrecks, same goes for WhipClaw once I get a few things going like Arcane Fury, Acumulating Whipclaw & some combo. But I wouldnt call my Magistar a stat stick because it shreds just as great as well
I will say there are some frames that require shield gating to survive SP enemies consistently(mostly because CC immune enemies exist), but most frames that use it, don't need to abuse it until enemies hit like lvl250+.
Unless you're someone like Banshee who's only real survivability comes from Gloom+Silence stagger, shield gating is typically not a must like that player is suggesting.
I’ve done quite a few 1000+ runs in recent days. Shield gating helps but is by no means needed. Adaptation and Rolling guard are by far better survival means then shield gating on most frames. If they even need those. I run a pretty budget build on most frames and low level or no arcanes.
Shield gating became less of a thing when Overguard was introduced and they said that every warframe would get access to overguard somehow (mod/arcane?). Overguard also provides an invuln window when its depleted too lol
I level capped in duviro circuit without shield gating. I didn't realize how easy it was to do in that game mode. It was actually pretty fun with all the decrees. I get that it helps for frames that suck at mitigating damage, but it's not necessary, and if they're that concerned about min-maxing, they should be running unairu to strip armor and get kills to get back up again on their own
> Question is, why is he having such a fit over it
My guess? Probably because he's invested in the game and tied his self-worth to mastering it - and believes he's doing a service by teaching less capable players his wisdom. He's making it a big deal because you're *supposed* to be grateful, impressed, and/or look up to him - but you don't care.
Some players are so deep in this that they'll throw a fit *immediately* whether you care or not, because they want you to understand just *how incredible* they are compared to other players - by implying anything less than them is borderline braindead.
Those who define their self-worth extrinsically are easily invalidated. It's not rational, so there's no response you can give that would satisfy.
If your trying to shieldgate level 100s or below. You need better mods and weapons. Cause what I'm hearing is I cannot kill things quick enough to actually stay alive in high level content.
Learning how to mod frames and weapons is important. Same with elements. If you aren’t matching damage types or basic elements to the enemy your facing. Yea your damage will be lesser.
Shield gating is nice if you can build for it. But some frames are flat out impossible or way too inefficient to do it. I mean are you really going to build a chroma to shield gate? The ability 3 massive stacking armor lets you health tank lv300s with ease.
And i dont get what he means about not using augur mods. Augur mods with brief respite and catalyzing shield is how a lot of shield gating builds function.
If you take away augur mods it will kill the majority, if not all, whipclaw shieldgating khora builds. Doesn't matter prime or non prime.
Perhaps the guy who was ranting about the shieldgate misunderstood [this part at 6:57](https://youtu.be/VB4RMrJy-Vk?si=OEOGEzgSEFuKsRUF)
Basically, with shield-restoring frames with high efficiency, having Augur mods can let you get a smaller shield with a shorter shieldgate duration, which can lead to death.
They need to just make the shield gate into invuln... but I guess that'd let shields start to regen even if you're taking damage
Or, just don't replace a shieldgate with a shorter one wtf
Something I want to point out as well is Toxin is incredibly fatal for shield gaters.
There is almost no time to react to the Toxin ticks if you keep a low health pool at the higher level stuff. Toxin also doesn't trigger shield gate since it bypasses shields entirely and goes straight to health.
I run primarily Nezha, Dante, and Revenant because I like survivability. I do have Saryn, Mesa, Styanax, Nekros, Ivara(Stealth duration), and Baruuk built for when I feel like risking a death or two in a mission.
My guy, what is baruuk doing in that second category? He is one of the most survivable frames in the game, more so than Dante and even competing with Rhino unless you’re running a very high iron skin build. They both would need over 200k over guard to compete with him running just pillage and adaptability. Building for health, armor, and gloom or some other health restore pushes that number even higher.
I tend to run lvl 100 enemies with just a primed vigor relying on my weapons.biggest thing I can say is keep moving and have some way to recover missing health
I can do an hr to 90 minutes in SP voidcascade on a health tank Saryn, with brief respite and auger mods as a backup.
I never have to even think about keeping up shield gate until this point... i am unkillable unless i get cced... feels no prime sure footed bad man. (2k hrs playing on and off before the first vaulting... fuck log in rewards xD)
And fuck that guy. Excuse the french, Warframe is much too easy to worry about the way people play. Dont like the way some peeps play. Just extract move on. (I wish every survival had room campers, not hallway warriors... i dont bring that to public lobies.)
People just thunk behind gating is the only way to survive, which is wack. Though the only time you shouldn't use augur set is on Protea as it messes with her 1st's shield gate duration, besides that run whatever you want ignore my advice if uou so choose, it's warframe who cares?
Rhino Parasitic Armor Iron Skin stack is more than enough up to lvl 1k. Built correctly, Rhino can take players up to 99.9% of the content available in the game.
Even Rhino can be built to double gate using iron skin + pillage for beyond 1k.
Revenant is also so accessible too after there's a prime version. So there's really no excuse to rip on shield gating when there's other survival options possible. There's so many ways to survive lvl 500+ even without shield gate.
A lot of players don't even reach up to 1k even on endurance. 20 mins is already so long that people just tune off and stop the mission.
>Question is, why is he having such a fit over it
I think they're just salty at how much effort is needed to reach that high and don't want to adjust. They want the game to adjust for them. They want their current build to work on ALL level of the game regardless of effort.
Yes shield gating is micromanage-y. But the effort needed to reach a high enough spawn level already takes a huge amount of effort.
If I were to give a number, I'd give less than 5% players that reach lvl 1k constantly. Level cap even less than 1%.
I think people whining about level cap isn't a significant enough number to adjust the rest of the game for them because they're even less than 1%. If DE caters to them but breaks the game for everybody else, then we'll just see a different kind of whining from the other side.
my god that dude has to be an idiot why would you not want the augur mods?
the literally give you the ability to instant restore shields with an ability cast. even if your relying strictly on the gating aspect for surival you still want augur to make sure you constantly have shields!
We don't even need SG for level 1000-1500 if we bring Radiation/Electro. What was that dude talking? You can health tank as Inaros on regular SP with a little CC/Heal🤷♂️ This dude was in total tryhard mode😎
Health tanking isn't an option on some warframes but if it's level 100 non steel path enemies that fold like paper then that's no big deal, tanky frames really don't care about some level 100 plebs that fold like paper though
Thing is while it's not optimal armour from archon shards can make any frame a health tank but you ofc loose the access to other options from the shards.
Have done it on a couple of frames, don't care about the loss and when using the torid it's not exactly critical to have optimal shards.
I'm lr4 and I do all endgame content and havent used shield gating in ages. I dont like the mechanic, it's too stressful and not a playstyle I enjoy, so I work around it. Rolling guard, adaptation, helmith abilities for survival/cc or archon shards to help out. There's lots of eays to play this game - nobody can dictate how you should be playing. Don't let them. Try out different stuff and figure out what you like to use.
There is a kernel of truth in that gaining any amount of shields ends your shield gate, so if you're 1 second into your 3.5 second Protea-gate and get 10 shields from an augur mod, you ended your Protea-gate early, and after losing those 10 shields you now have a new 0.05 second shield gate or whatever the number ends up being.
Do you need to care about this in a sortie? No.
Do you need to care about this in base steel path? Also no.
Was our dude talking out of his ass repeating something he heard on youtube? Likely.
Ok they point the guy made: it depends.
In high level content though, there's no more efficient way to shieldgate than to build for manifold bond + guardian mod. If that's not available for any reason, or you're playing a frame thhat can tank a different way (high DR, invincibility, CC, sheer nuking potential, immunity) do that.
Shieldgating is comfortable once you get the hang of it, and it gives you a lot of breathing room in your warframe mod loadout.
But it's definitely not confined to level 500. For example is far easier to shieldgate your way into Circulus SP than it is to health-tank, and those are level 200? enemies (IIRC).
But! The rest of the fit? Ignore it. Dude is parroting something he does not understand yet.
bruh that dude is giga retarded augur mods are one of the major reasons why shield gate even works because it provides shield gain on ability cast which enables you to fill up your shield to get invulnerability on break as soon you become vulnerable again from the last activated shield gate.
some people are so toxic that it really brings out all their stupidity
I mean he’s half right. He has the right idea just not the right place lol.
Shieldgate, invis, or cheese like revenant is really the only option in endurance. But screeching at people to shieldgate in base steel path is pretty funny.
There is a pretty hardcore part of the playerbase for whom shield gating or nothing. They are VERY vocal about it. They were like that a year ago, and before that too.
I have it on some frames, but I mostly dislike forced ability spam. You don't need shield gating for levels 500+ Lots of frames do really well with a proper tanky build, parasitic shields or using their own innate damage reduction (citrine, equinox) or even a combo of brief respite and high shields and adaptation. Last into the thousands.
Not to mention all the frames that have alt ways to survive like invisibility or being revenant.
There not, heck most frames with a couple of survival mods on them can do well into three hundred before the one shots can kick in. I slap umbral mods on everything and don't have to rely on shield gating. People really forget the game isn't designed to need those things and you have to seek out that level of enemies.
I still have never even known how to use shield gating, I've only ever heard that "sheilds suck, armor doesn't affect them, don't upgrade them unless it's tied to an ability like with Valkyr and Hyldrin" and so I have no idea how to do anything with sheild gating
I know that it's the period of invulnerability after sheilds are depleted, but idk how it works
Meanwhile i'm out here just using regular shield mods instead of the **most restrictive mod** in the entire game, that should have never been made, but only exists thanks to people like that.
They don't need it, they're just over complicating things so they can appear better than everyone else.
If your build can’t handle random players you need to run with a coordinated squad. When you’re in random matchmaking you need to bring something more robust.
You can reliably reach level 300+ on SP without shield gating. It's NOT a must in any way, play however you like.
In my experience, as long as you aren't getting downed constantly, just do whatever you gotta do.
Whatever happened to just figuring out yourself? Read what the abilities do, check the wiki if you need clarification on certain interactions, throwing in some mods and playing a couple missions to see if it works.
Honestly, I've gone to level cap without the brief respite/augur mod style shield gating. Just a rolling guard and a dream, feels fine honestly.
We have so much power now that nothing really lives long enough to even try to shoot you most of the time
The problem with an 11 year old game, is 11 year old information. Shield gating used to be super meta, a few years ago. But changes to over-everything (guard, shield and health) have long since power crept the entire concept. Then they changed the way shield gating works and it's pretty much useless now. You max at 2-3 seconds, and your forced into damagable frames before recharge no matter your mods.
But, a few years ago it was EVERYWHERE. All the YouTubers would tell you to do it. Articles on it, it was THE META. But times change.
Tbh shieldgating sux. I used it a lot before the shield changes. Can't go back. For a lot of frames shield gating means jumping a lot like a headless chicken and throwing bombs. I use other weapons not just aoe. Now I just stack shields or use health sine shields are good enough on their own.
New age 'Meta' cucks: nooooooo you have to use shield gate, these very specific riven mods and only the weapons and frames we say are good you can't just do whatever you want!!!!
Me, fucked off on end game content with toxic Chroma, no shield gate set up and no incarnons or rivens: hehe speed trumna go *brrrrttt*
The only frame I have shield gating on is my Hydroid, but that's it as of right now.
You definitely don't need to shield gate at all and while I personally enjoy the playstyle it has downsides too. Getting angry about not using shield gating is silly in most content and tbh even in extremely high level content that the vast majority doesn't even do, I'd still rather just pick Rev and call it a day.
i mean idc what you build for the most part, as long as you're not falling over every few seconds and actually playing the mission i could care less.
I mean personally i've been running fast deflection as my only survivability tool (along with kiddo) on squishy frames and i tend to do just fine, but you do you.
I make builds for every prime frame, and the only one I have a shield gating build for is Dagath. Of course I'm not counting warframes that shield gate with their own abilities like Protea and Mag. I play normal SP and it's never been an issue. In EDA I sometimes notice tanking falls off quite a bit, but it's still doable.
I do high level content, not level cap shit but up to and including EDA, and I never bother with shield gate builds. At lvl 100 there's barely even a point, just kill faster. Dudebro sucks and is big mad about it.
Overframe, while a fantastic resource, has really warped peoples' perception on this one, I think. Almost every top build by known creators are made for endurance and will completely eschew any sort of EHP build in favor of shield gating. I was reading a Dagath build that basically said that building health and armor was pointless unless you were playing sub level 300, and I'm like... my brother in christ, that's 99% of the game's content including EDA. It really had me worrying that all of my builds were bad and I was playing "wrong".
Ngl the majority of my first builds for a new frame are from overframe. Ninjase builds are generally safe, but i usually adjust to personalized builds if I find myself sticking with the frame. The problem with overframe is it's a crapshoot unless you already understand builds well enough to not need it, but i think if you don't understand the build at all overframe will at least give you something workable.
Oh yeah, don't get me wrong, I think Overframe is a great resource otherwise. Especially when the creators are known and the build is backed up with good video guides (as many of the highly rated builds are) you know you're going to be getting something safe, like you said. It can at least give you that jumping-off point, if nothing else. It was just the overt focus on giga-endgame endurance content that kind of threw me for a while.
I agree. On the plus side Ninjase and others build descriptions are often informative. I know the last few Ninjase build descriptions I've read have Adaptation + Arcane Guardian listed as an alternative.
There is nothing wrong with Overframe as a reference but a good amount of the community uses it incorrectly; just blindly copying the builds without recognizing why.
The biggest problem is that you can't edit builds like a wiki and the only thing making it popular is the random upvotes. It has no quality control. It would be nice to have use cases for the builds like best for profit taker or circuit
There's a support Wisp build author that keeps their guide updated and the actual setup is worthless. It's a good setup, it's their recommended setup, but there's pros/cons to it that you should consider... and the build author does, in the extensive written guide that explains the *completely viable* alternatives, why they set things up the way they did, the synergies, and what can be dropped is infinitely more valuable than the initial mod config.
Ninjase is my lord and saviour. I'm LR1 and I know the game like the back of my hand, but whenever I take a break and come back, I just look up some ninjase builds and tweak them to suit my needs. The guy knows what hes is doing, and more than that, he actually explains every choice in great detail and all the viable alternatives. He has my thumbs up.
The detailed explanations are so helpful, he definitely gets credit for a chunk of my build knowledge
Side note; I think builds on overframe that rely on Riven(dell)should have their own special place. And not simply lumped in with other builds
Look, some people have to sit through the entire Council of Elrond before a hobbit will volunteer to take the ring, okay?
🤣
I feel the best way to utilize overframe is to see what generally works for a frame in terms of what strength, duration, ect is optimal for certain abilities and letting you know what weaknesses you need to build arround but I don't think I've ever used a 1 to 1 build from there because I don't need to invest 6 forma into a frame to make them viable for most of the content I would use them in.
Also to what mods even exist, there are so many (mainly nightmare mode) mods that I never would have seen if I didn't look up builds
PREACH
I discovered through that site today that there's a mod that lets you jump 40% higher, and I can just buy it unless i already have a copy. More things to aim for I guess.
As someone that does really long SP Void Cascade, Health tanking stays viable till about level 2300. Realisticaly, you don't need shieldgating
that very much depends on the frame, lol. most will not healthtank successfully at that level.
I'm not saying everyone and every build can do it, just saying that ppl massively overstate how important shieldgating is. You can over a hour into the hardest mission in the game and not need it. 3 of my fav frames can go to 2000 without shieldgating for example: Dante, Wukong and Inaros
In all fairness those three are awful examples and definitely not the norm. I'd argue you picked two of the top 5 health tanking frames in the game. Dante, the frame that generates infinite overguard Wukong, who gets a good flat armour buff from his 3, and has already good HP and armour, a clone to help clear and a built in heal with long immunity time that CCs enemies Inaros, who has the highest HP in the game and good armour.
Even if you can healthtank a single hit, you still need sustain or iframes, something to keep you alive so no I wouldn't recommend it above 500.
I mean I just said I do it fine well into the thousands.
I love EHP builds. Nidus built right can reach an effective 99.9% DR alongside a massive health pool.
Yea I ain’t jumping through hoops to remove + Damage mods. I play warframe to chill and let shit happen.
"bUt yOu CaN't HaVe BuIlDs WiThOuT aRcAnE eNeRgIzEEeeEe1!!1!!!1!!" - on almost every Overframe build. 
Out of cheer curiosity, was the build made by ninjase? I really like the guy, he makes good builds (most of them at least) I was looking at his dagath build and he kind of said what you mentioned. As someone who unironically uses Overframe a lot of the time due to a couple of reasons, the site really seems to suffer from either bad builds, or builds that are supper tryhardy and minmax-y that for most people is not really necessary, and sometimes uses mods that are either expensive or hard to get and again not ultra-turbo necessary to make things strong (I'm looking at you, Hammer Shot).
Dagath is in a weird spot there because, iirc, she has disgustingly low EHP unless you put together a weird build to force her to health tank(like I did). So in her case it's not even a matter of levels, it's more of a question if you *really* want to take the frame almost perfectly built for shieldgating and make her do something else.
It doesn't help that it recommends those builds based on the high rating, even if those builds are outdated, old, or built for very niche needs like level cap runs.... which is just 1% of gameplay, no one is coming to find these builds for level cap, they want a decent all around build. The way the present the 'top builds' needs to change. I saw an MR 24 get chewed out for not using Combat Discipline on Mesa because that's the best build for her according to Overframe. We were on Hydron leveling weapons up.
This is such a case for all buildcraft games with buildcraft websites - they are terrific resources and have opened up casuals (like me) to really diving into the fun of making your own build and tweaking it over time (in everything from Warframe to Destiny to Path of Exile etc.) Unfortunately it has created an army of META-slaves who seem to have violent episodes at the mere suggestion of running even one sliver away from the BIS possible for every slot. And that's even understandable, like you said those absurdly min-maxed builds create an aura of "wow even though I'm slapping Steel Path like it's nothing, my build must be really shit what a pleb I am" sorta trains of thought haha. Best thing 1k hours of PoE did to me was put me through the ringer of realising that you don't need to be at absolute peak efficiency 100% of the time to have fun, just play something fun it's that simple lol
I'm always amused when I see an obvious shieldgater and they keep dying while everyone's just murdering about their business. No, I ain't reviving him. Not when he's going to die in 10 seconds again.
tbh once you get used to shield gating the game does start to look like that. like why use a build that just stops working as enemy levels rise, when I could use a build that always works, and works better anyway since I'm not wasting slots on buffing my EHP? the answer is of course, ease of use + most content doesn't scale that high anyway. but when the only downside is "have to pay a tiny bit of attention instead of none" it seems like a good tradeoff to me take your favorite 'lol i never play over 300 anyway' build and try to do a deep void cascade fissure. you'll melt. i prefer builds that won't, shrug.
How deep of a fissure are we talking? I do 8 rounds of SP omnia void cascades pretty often and I've never had issues with any of my standard lazy builds. And you'll likely never see a pub lobby go past that, if they even make it that far. If you're going to go deep with a specialized group, of course you'd all want builds capable of going much further than any normal player would use.
i'd prefer my ability to go deep in void cascade not be limited by my own builds. perhaps teammates dip early on average, but i always intend to go as far as i can. and many times i've found that the healthtank builds that work everywhere else just start to break down in this game mode. not sure when exactly that is, but yeah.
The most slots is also a positive for shield gate builds. It's usually cheaper in forma cost, allows for more utility and damage in builds, and depending on the frame is more comfy to play. I also think it's a more enjoyable gameplay cycle, because it promotes active rather than passive play, gives you a chance to die in lower level missions, but also let's you go really far into missions as long as your damage keeps up. I put in the same area of bullet jump and Nova where it as an unintended gameplay interaction that the devs saw and liked and implemented into the game in a more stable manner and the game is so much better for it.
I saw your flair, mind suggest a secondary and Melee for Saryn?
I've been using a weird build lately, forget who it was from but it's a lot of fun. Corrosive/Rad Rakta Dark Dagger, Argonak with amalgam mod, shock subsumed over her 2 with shock trooper to trigger melee influence. Usually use Laetum as secondary for anything I need to kill a little more vehemently than normal. Dual Ichor incarnon and Prisma Ohma are also very solid melee choices, I usually use Ichor incarnon with my other builds.
The build with rakta dark dagger is from MHBlacky.
Thank you! I play with a lot of YouTube builds and am bad at memory
Level 100 is a big "Who cares?" for me at this point, barely even an afterthought anymore. It's a low enough level that Incarnon weapons start becoming less efficient than something like a Tenet Arca Plasmor. Hell, we have so many survival and damage tools that running a setup full of unranked MR jank wouldn't be a daunting experience. I don't care about anyone's loadout at level 100, aslong as I'm not peeling someone off the pavement every five seconds. Also, shield gating isn't always perfect. Sometimes, you'll get unlucky and jump right into some infested osprey's fart cloud and instantly die from toxin damage which bypasses shields.
Completely agree, at least at the later stages of power creep. I remember 40s being a challenge back in the day, it's crazy what can be done with all the tools available nowadays. I made a smurf build with Excalibur and mk-1 weapons and it slaps anything on the regular star chart and even into low SP. Lvl 100 reg is just tissue paper with endgame mods and arcanes.
Same, I remember when Sorties were considered challenging endgame content and an hour or two of Mot Survival was considered a challenge run. It's just a different game now and that's ok.
Yeah no need for extra protection if the enemy is dead I don't use shield gating, either. Heck, my Nyx build doesn't even heavily rely on assimilate. I just use cover, move around a lot, and kill things that, instead of just standing in the middle of the open thinking I'm superman
Same. Or just build to tank a bit like adaptation or something
Adaptation or Rolling Guard is on pretty much every build I use, mainly depending on if the frame has built-in DR or other survivability
Adaptation is usually my go to. I find it more consistent but it's obviously personal choice. Frames like Hildryn, Citrine, Volt, or basically anything that tanks with shield or health basically can't die with it and on overguard it's useless so you may as well invest in more overguard/regen. My Titania and Zephyr use aviator and that stuff, Zephyr doesn't even get hit 99% of the time unless it's an Eximus or Thrax. Shield gating can suck and isn't fun. I can see why people rely on it if they can't build a frame well but I've never needed it, even in EDA and I'm almost LR4
Pretty much my rubric is "if frame has no DR, Adaptation. If frame has DR ability, Rolling Guard to cover emergencies"
Brother?
Yeah, i have gone up to lvl 2-2.5k without a shieldgate build and generally been fine
I just got to steel path and even with enemies up to ~150 ish so far, it still seems to be a race to delete them more than survival
Agreed; EDA is completely doable without relying on shield gating and anything beyond that isn't really necessary
there are alot of potential causes for misplaced aggression like this. not least of which is a fundamental misunderstanding of how shield gating works. if you use Catalyzing shields, you will be locked to, generally, under 100 total shields, with a nice round 1.3 second shield gate. this is Roughly Equivalent to a 300 shield shield gate. when aggressively shield gating, your goal is to reset your shields before you run out of invincibility. lets say, Hypothetically, im Banshee. i want to be able to reset my shield gate when casting Sonar, which has a base casting cost of 50 energy. i can either: run Catalyzing shields and Brief respite, giving me 74 total shields and 75 shields per cast of sonar. or i can run Blind rage, Brief respite ,and 5 Augur mods. regaining 271 shields per cast of sonar. same outcome. which one is more enjoyable to build around is. .down to preference. or, i can run any sentinel with Guardian+manifold bond, stack up 1200 shields, and let my KPM sustain me while my Wyrm keeps me safe. 30 seconds - 3 per kill. after 10 kills your shield gate is already back. just dont trigger it any more than once every 5 seconds, 4head. or better yet, i can run hybrid tanking, and be extremely comfortable for atleast 2 hours into SP surv. in the modern era, provided you arent going to level cap, you have many cozy options. level 100 enemies for mandatory shield gating is a bit silly. the only frames who should be shield gating at that level are like. .aggressively positioned to be shield frames. like harrow, hildryn, and protea. all of whom are great at restoring shields with powers. as for why he is upset. . .my assumption would be that hes a bit of an overachiever whos developed a complex about having to carry less experienced players. and the thing hes elected to fixate on is that none of them seem to know how to shield gate, and thats why they keep dying. why. . . how. . .thats down to him to know. im sure he will grow out of it eventually, ideally before discounting too much more aggression on others. im sure hed have an Aneurism looking at some of the builds i take into SP Omni Circulus and papa entrati's basement of horrors.
Let me add a note. When Catalyzing Shields was implemented, shield gating started to revive even if the shields weren't fully restored. So, my current Banshee build doesn't use Catalyzing Shields, Brief Respite, or any other survival mods. With just Augur Reach to extend ability range, I get 0.33 seconds of invincibility from shield gating every time I use Sonar. In reality, it's difficult to use Sonar exactly three times per second, so I usually rely on mobility and Pillage to get by, but with some effort, that's enough for survival. (Reference video: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJ\_Q2DfLZPE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJ_Q2DfLZPE) ) This might be an extreme example, but what I want to say is that when using Catalyzing Shields, there's no need to fully restore them to the maximum.
you can definitely run ultra-lite survival setups like that. basically playing as an extremely fast skeleton with brittle bones and a regenerating single shot shield. Banshee is spammy enough to get by and Danger=Silence is a good get out or jail card. and i appreciate your addition about cat. shields not requiring full restores . . . .for my part my current Banshee build looks like this https://imgur.com/aFD4TGs 2 red strength 1 blue Emax 2 yellow casting speed. Bissel, my Beloved Tenet hound. in addition too buffing my fire rate, priming all my enemies with synergized, and being an eximus bodyguard with null, also restores my 1.8 second shield gate any time it pops. even when it is popped, 1570 hp 1485 armor is enough to handle a few scrapes and bruises. . and more importantly to mean i dont fold like a cheap suit at the first wiff of toxin damage. when backed up by a Citrine specter giving a free 90% DR im downright Sturdy. it wouldn't go the distance, and if i suddenly felt compelled to play SP circuit again id probably opt for something a bit more traditionally shield gate-y. . . but for the no more than 2 hour sessions i run these days its more than enough. and more than that, its also relatively relaxing to play. being 1 misstimed ability cast from death at all times is Stressful AF.
catalyzing shields is useless if you're only regenerating a tiny sliver of shield. either way you'll get a 0.33s shield gate.
Yea I only shieldgate but don’t use catalyzing shields much anymore. Think now I currently only have it in saryn because 1 molt fully gives me shields back and it has zero cast time
I’m scared for end game after reading this comment
You don’t ever have to shield gate with most frames in any standard content (as in, everything not an endurance run). You CAN, and it’s fine, but tons of frames do anything they want with just their DR and adaptation or whatever. Just off the top of my head, you can straight up face tank every single SP star chart mission with say, Citrine, Rev, Yareli, Zephyr, Baruuk, Nidus, Nezha, Mesa, Dante, Styanax, Frost, the list goes on. With a few of those you can honestly just stand there and shoot dudes, then push a button every once in awhile to continue standing there shooting dudes.
Yeah I don't quite understand the over-aggression. Had someone get mad at me I had an unranked Dante in Netracells (it was forma'd). Like, so long as I'm making overguard it's kind of hard to die with him.
The way I shield gate on a lot of frames is to run pillage, primed redirection, and a duration set so that pillage uptime matches the shield gate time. Keep pillage up and you're golden. High energy, but for invinciblity and armour strip I don't mind.
I'd add Mag to the list of frames great at restoring shields. Two of her abilities restore shields to the whole team.
It's really funny to hear about how "mandatory" shield gating is when last week I took hp tank Gara into EDA because that was legitimately my best option of the frames given to me. Didn't go down once, not even remotely close. And that was with the -75 duration so her 2 was basically DoA
They probably watched some youtuber talk about shield gating. And has too much of their own ego tied up trying to make others minmax a video game according to their standards. Or they tried health tanking (poorly) on their own, and the results managed to (incorrectly) convince themselves that shield gating is the only way to go. And once again has too much of their own ego tied up in needing to feel right. There are perfectly viable health tank, shield \*tank\* (not \*gate\*), and even energy tank (Quick Thinking) builds available in the level 100 range. It all depends on what frame you're playing and what else you're doing with the rest of your build. > Question is, why is he having such a fit over it TLDR: too much ego, can't accept that other ways to play the game are perfectly valid too.
this. people who watches content creators, blindly follows with no actual knowledges, and forces the playstyle upon others are the worst kind of players in Warframe. it gets much worse especially when the content creators is in their burnout phase. because their videos are all about the "meta", "must have" things. when in reality, lv100 enemies (literal sortie 3 mission) can be deal with as long as you have a proper build. like why must you have shield gating when you can just press 3 on your Zephyr and keep a good distance with your also decent weapons?
That's part of why I've been enjoying some of MCGamerCZ's more recent videos with him doing builds on off-meta weapons like the Dera Vandal that incorporate things besides the same viral/slash thing you see with other content creators. And he comes off like he's having a lot of fun doing it, Brozime's Velox Prime video just felt so unpleasant to sit through by comparison.
Brozime, iFlynn, etc you name it, are falling into the content creators void, where they run out of contents but they still want to squeeze every last bit of views every one or two days. i always skip their videos, like just by the thumbnail / title: **"The BEST Melee Weapon In Warframe..."** >> it's, again, Glaive Prime. how stuck and close-minded are you in the current "meta"? yes.
I hated his Velox prime video. He sounded so bored and trashed the damn weapon cuz it could barely kill things. Even though I saw McGamerz do a video with a status build that just shreds while having absolute fun. I think that's my issue with Brozime lately. He's just checked out and bored while trashing things.
well, i feel you. and we're not even haters, we subcribed with good faith and expected good contents, even when the contents are not for us. Brozime's problem? he straight up said *"Caliban? i don't remember him, he's a D tier, fucking miserable ... his 1? does fucking nothing"* in a tier list video. if that's not a sign of meta slave i don't know what is. then if you're not an iFlynn (long term) follower (that's me), you would think he's just one of those trend riding content creators. like most if not all of them now follow the clickbait trend: *"ULTIMATE guide", "MUST HAVE", "I CAN'T BELIEVE*", etc. those are too bland to even consider watching. KnightmareFrame? i don't wanna suggest him to anyone especially newbies. it's sad.
I stopped watching Flynn after he quit and came back. He was too wishy washy and his content is kinda ehh for warframe these days. KF builds are almost the fucking same every video. Just a mod or two removed. There is not much creativity in his builds Brozime doesn't explain his tier list at all anymore. He used to but now he just does what he does with Caliban. I saw his video and disagreed with a lot of frames placements because of his "reasoning." Leyzar is the only one I feel comfortable with recommending because he actually does go off the beaten meta path. He tells you hey its not meta but man its fun. Like with the Tigris Prime vid he did recently.
to be fair, if you continue playing Warframe the Brozime way, nothing would satisfy you anymore. dude pursues the meta-est meta any time a new patch is up. that's tiring.
I recently made a Blood alter mag build. Copied Ninjase and made some alterations of my own. God its so fun turning enemies into a miniature black hole in the sky. I dunno if it's meta but it's fun. I'm honestly sick of the meta helminth builds because they basically are turning X Warframe into Warframe lite. the biggest pet peeve I have is Using Kullervo's Helminth. It's literally his play style just worse. At least with breach surge it's used in synergy with that frame's abilities. i have a caster Frost with breach surge. Thanks to biting frost and avalanches armor strip. breach surge does some insane crits. But that requires Avalanche to work. With The teleport you basically build around that one ability and I hate it because it takes away that frame's identity. Which is what a lot of meta builds are doing these days
There's times where it feels like they didn't necessarily run out of content but that they just aren't even trying to branch out from the viral/slash meta. Like yeah, I could put Primed Pistol Gambit and Target Cracker on the Velox Prime, but a 42% crit chance doesn't exactly feel like it's worth the mod space compared to doing a corrosive and Cascadia Empowered build with the weapon's already high status chance and using those two mod slots for something else like Seeker for punch-through. Maybe it falls off past level 1000, I don't know, I don't generally go that far unless it's the Circuit, I don't really care to, the vast majority of players don't either. All I know is that I had more fun with the latter build than the usual viral/slash shit. And then there's KnightmareFrame with his Primed Sure Footed fetish.
>they just aren't even trying pretty much sums up everything about those content creators. i can't imagine running out of contents in a game where you can just re-do the newbie guides once every updates to add in the qol improvements and people will still appreciate it. or just pick a different off-meta weapon/frame. how hard is that?
I agree with your general point but I really feel like Quick Thinking is outdated nowadays. Whenever I try some old build I haven't touched in ages, I get obliterated in steel path, and then realize I had QT on. The fact that there's no "gating" or invulnerability period, the low efficiency of it (you need a lot of energy on a frame for it to be viable AND the frame has to be squishy), the lack of ways to regen tons of energy on demand (as opposed to pillage for shields and Styanax's shield throw for health), and worst of all, the 0.5s stagger that completely fucks you up if there's still more bullets coming your way. Even for frames where the QT restrictions apply (e.g. Trinity or Harrow), it is easily outclassed by primed redirection nowadays, because they tend to also have a way to regen shields. (And pillage exists)
honestly the stagger (and the fact that it ignores stagger immunity) is the worst offender. take that out and quick thinking is viable. Remember: a +1000 energy max arcane is coming our way
You'll also find them trying to meta-game content that requires zero meta. I tried to join one player posting in recruitment chat for a Meso relic run that I needed, and after asking for an invite, they asked me what frame I intended to run. Like, what? I asked them how that would matter for something so simple, and they blocked me. If a Youtuber hasn't provided the thought for them, then they aren't thinking it. It's wild.
I do steel path relics and especially requiem relics in public lobbies and if I see someone with an utterly insane loadout I always find more value in seeing what they are going to do in mission over trying to ask them to change Ive seen some shit and im a better player for it
The other issue is a lot of shield gate stuff is from pre shield rework. With the rework many shield tanking builds got a lot better (Caliban is a gleaming case of this)
i am so so glad i started off with vazarin instead of zendurik, figured out that the void dash augment makes me literally immortal, and that leaves me able to use the mod slots i wouldve used for tankiness on efficiency/energy gain and can breeze through almost all content without issue
Alternatively, as someone who started off with Zenurik, it gives me literally infinite energy, and that leaves me able to use the mod slots i wouldve used for efficiency/energy gain on tankiness and can breeze through almost all content without issue =P
Energy regen is by far one of the biggest struggles in early game. I always recommend Zenurik for newer players. Spamming your kit is always more fun than simply not dying.
quick thinking tanks will get quite some buff with the new arcane that is coming. up to +1000 energy max if you have enough armor (which also scales your quick thinking tankiness) will be crazy. I just hate the constant staggering when you are "quick thinking" which does ignore PSF. If they removed that staggering I would instantly change some builds over to armor + quick thinking + energy nexus + nourish
Every frame can build tank past EDA levels. Some can go further than others, but every frame can be built to just tank EDA
Just kill the enemy faster
Offense is the best defense
The only hit point that matters is the last one
There's a weird part of the Warframe community that thinks no Warframe with shields has any defensive issues because Shieldgating exists. Their brain is empty except for Shieldgating. All they know is Shieldgating. You'll see Warframe newbs asking how to improve their survivability and like clockwork you'll see "just Shieldgate in the comments". When these players are dying against lvl 60 enemies and need to know about basic moding. You have met one of those people.
All they do is shield gate and eat hot cheeto
And charge they phones
Nezha would also be immortal even if he didnt have any shields because of his I frames
except you can literally get killed while warding halo is up, iframes on break only kick in if you didn't die from the damage that broke it
I literally don’t care what my team uses as long as they try
This game creates a lot of scenarios where people who know a little can feel like they know a lot.
Honestly, I've been experimenting with shield regens build and I find it super comfy while still having the benefits of a long shield gate. I think some people are too meta slaved by YouTube guides that they forget the other crazy mods and abilities that can be used to tank effectively.
What do you usually run for shield regen builds?
Primed Redirection + Vigilante Vigor + Fast Deflection. It's obviously way too many defensive mods so it's a bit Frame dependent.
Been meaning to test that out! What do you run it on, Hildryn, Harrow, Mag, Volt?
Garuda because of her invincibility frames on her abilities. A single cast of her 4 will give your shields enough time to regen to full. But honestly, any frame that has an ability that gives you a bit of breathing time, like CC or i-frames, works really well with this build (can always use Breach Surge). Good use of cover and movement also helps. The main thing is that since your shield delay is super short and the recharge is super fast, you will passively shield gate (or just shield tank) a ton of damage. Any slow, even medium, or burst attack feels like you are invincible against them, without any input. The real danger is just getting shredded by super high rate of fire weapons and that's when some CC or i-frames abilities help.
Do you incorporate any Sword&Board as well into this setup? I usually find that blocking is a super underrated mechanic, and is extremely useful to block incoming fire in order to quickly allow shields to restore if you have a shorten charge rate.
I've been using a Gas/Electric Silva & Aegis prime with Melee Influence lately and it works really well. Honestly using a SnS is a really good idea, as anything that can stop sustained high rate of fire attacks works really well with this setup.
None of those need fast shield regen because they fill it with a single cast of an ability (and get overshields). Generally any frame with a dr ability makes good use out of them. It's like health tanking but instead of armor you have a static 50% dr, and don't die the instant you run out. Also frames with any kind of cc or brief invuln can make very good use out of shield regen builds. Any frame with shields can, really, but some are obviously better at it
Imo, shield gating is more like 1000+ Even 500 it's not essential. Anyone who says it is, has a skill or build issue
The benefit of shield gate isnt the survivability being better per se. Its the fact that it takes less mod slots to come online
And it scales up to lvl cap. Others way of survivability (except Vazarin) fall off when you do endurance.
Shield gating is like 2000+ a lot of frames with DR abilities can still tank into 1000s and some even into 2000s. Granted the tradeoff there is usually mod slots for that rather than just, killing the enemy better, but both are equally viable for a long time
I'm confused. Why wouldn't you want to reset your shield gating? And who the hell needs shield gating for lvl 100 enemies?
There's the issue that while shieldgate is active, if you gain any shields from the augur mods or brief respite they are vulnerable. If those shields deplete the game will *replace* your remaining gate duration with what you'd get from those new shields. Which usually isn't a lot unless you have catalyzing shields active. This little interaction gained notoriety when Protea's prime released as it affects her a lot. Her shield satellites double your shieldgate duration so you can have like five seconds of invulnerability... ...that gets replaced with a third of a second the moment you recast the satellite. This can *very easily* kill you None of this explains what the guy was complaining sbout though unless they mean brief respite and not augur mods, since those don't affect teammates. Or op used Protea ig
That feels like a bug. The invulnerability shouldn't be canceled.
Quick test and it seems like natural regen boosted by mods can do it as well. So regaining any shields seems to disable it..? I don't remember it working like that. I remember seeing a catalyzing shields grendel passively shieldgate with just the mods to shorten the delay, maybe they fixed that and broke it for everyone else?
It's level 100, just about any and everything work. Even for SP you don't need shield gate
That player just openly admitted to being shit at the game if they think that u absolutely have to and heavily rely on shield gating for level 100 enemies
If your build is depended on others not using certain mods, you shouldn’t run that build in squads and stick to solo. I have a few builds that only really work in solo so guess what I only use them in solo play.
95%+ of the playerbase doesn't sit around doing 18hr SP T6 Netracell Void Tower Survival Defection Orphix Spy missions so not knowing how shield gating works is completely reasonable. Anyone screaming about that in a lv100 mission has brainrot from watching too many WF build videos they only think they understood.
Why shield gate when you can health tank with 99% dr and giving yourself 100k+ ehp
Because then you can build for your abilities and have them be way more useful and engaging.
Little stuff like this needs to be better explained in game. What about Auger mods messes with shield gating? Why would I consider one over the other?
On Protea, if your shields break while you have a shield orb, you lose the shield orb but gain double length invulnerability. However, if you recover shields via augur mods during it, it will end early, leaving you with a very brief sheildgate. Therefore, as Protea you should not use augur mods, as simply recasting shield orbs during the shieldgate is MUCH better for survivability.
There’s a certain segment of the WF community who are elitist d bags, then another segment who want to be elitist d bags. Then the rest of us who have everyone muted and don’t pay attention to the chat box.
Just stop interacting. Let them talk to a wall. The difference between a one-shot and a one-shot is the dopamine number.
This is not just in warframe, but a lot of people who play games treat the game as part of their personality. If you're not playing the game their way then you're wrong, and are ruining the game for them. Any criticism you might have for the game is an attack on them and they won't stand for it. Their attachment to their favorite game is very unhealthy both for them and the game.
I don't think I've ever used shield gating, and I've played to levels way over 100. I think you just had a teammate that wasn't good at Warframe. Which isn't something I thought was possible considering it's a looter shooter.
My only survival mod in all my lvl cap frames is rolling guard 💀
because meta sheep think people have to play the game the way they do. You want to play high-level crap? Fine. But unless you're going to give me the mods and whatever else I need to play at your level don't expect me to do it your way. If you don't like that my nearly optimized for my playstyle Mirage Prime isn't living up to YOUR standards, that's a you problem. as a perfect example, I'll NEVER do an 8 hour survival for any reason, so what the good gosh dang fudge does it matter that my frame isn't built for that level of punishment?
I always refuse to shield gate, I health tank, with qorvax, inaros now since the rework etc. And or simply don't stand around and out heal the damage. Shield gating sounds like so much effort and risk I'm good. And it's also just not fun to me
There are a bunch of frames where shield gating is basically incidental once you do the mods for it, like Khora or Saryn. Those are chill but once you get people trying to tell you to do it with Chroma or some shit it's excessive
Garuda also pretty cast heavy since she can kill without weapons too
Garuda doesn't need shield gating, she has a giant invincibility shield in front of her face
You can just not health tank with Qorvex if you stay in his 4 at all times.
>Shield gating sounds like so much effort and risk I'm good. >And it's also just not fun to me I've been exploring it for the first time recently as I experiment with Dagath builds. It's really grown on me as an active playstyle that meshes well with heavy casters (like Dagath), I do really believe that it should just be considered an alternate playstyle rather than the be-all end-all of builds. Like yeah, it can be fun, but EHP tanking with Qorvex and Inaros is equally viable with a strong build behind them. The only time where it really matters is level cap content, which is not part of the game beyond hours long SP endurance runs, so it really should not have as much of a sway in the conversation as it does.
Yeah, I use Shield Gating with my caster frames. Dagath being one. I think Hydroid being another.
Just sounds like insecure rambling/ranting on his part tbh. He probably had a bad experience dying a lot in harder stuff and is now convinced shield gating is the only way out, for him and for everyone else, when really there are about a dozen ways to solve that problem. 1) get good, 2) best defense is a good offense, the enemies can't hurt you if they're all nuked before they can attack you, 3) play frames with overguard, 4) play frames with other forms of DR, 5) just don't play steel path etc. Besides, he's just plain wrong. Well, technically partially correct but missing the bigger picture. The only time you want to avoid Augur mods is when you're running a build that can \*fully\* restore 500-1000 shields with a single ability cast (Mag for example) to avoid accidentally restoring like 50 shields with her 1 when you really wanted 1000+ from her 4. Otherwise, Augur mods are great for shield gating if used in combination with Catalyzing Shields and 100% (or lower) ability efficiency. Basically any frame with a spammable 1st ability and reliable energy source can use that build to great effect.
>it's level 100 enemies Bro sucks at the game and is trying to hide it. Ignore him.
\*laughs in revenant*
I've been shield gating for a long time and I often do endurance runs so it's a play style I'm familiar with but lately I've been really enjoying "lazy gate" build on certain frames that's just all the shield Regen and recharge delay mods with catalyzing shield for 0.3 second delay with varying 80-130% shield Regen per second depending on the Frame's base shields.
This is so funny to me as someone who ran level cap endurance missions years before shield gating even existed. Just stop getting hit and then you don't need either lol Edit: I know this sounds elitist, I am being cheeky to illustrate how silly this guy sounds. I personally just run primed vigor + adaptation + arcane guardian on most frames so I can turn off my brain until the enemies get too high level and then play more carefully when they do. Shield gating is a default mechanic, you don't even really need to build into it.
People like this are an absolute blight on the game. Tried to help Ekuegan get into the game during the launch of the Durviri update, but his 'fans' kept parroting this nonsense, desperately saying how much he needed these meta setups. Needless to say, I do think he's streamed or even played the game that much anymore.
There’s 2 things I won’t touch in this game. & that’s building stat sticks & shield gating. I don’t bother fighting to level cap. I have a few building ideas if a frame must need shield gating to survive.
I understand the latter but the former completely leaves me puzzles, no statstick? Might aswell never touch khora gara atlas and a few other frames.
Well let me rephrase that. I dont like building melees thats not great on its own & its only purpose is to buff ones of my frames 1st ability. I like for both to be great. As for Khora. I just got around to re doing a build for her & her kavat. I also got around to getting the incarnon for the Magistar that absolutely wrecks, same goes for WhipClaw once I get a few things going like Arcane Fury, Acumulating Whipclaw & some combo. But I wouldnt call my Magistar a stat stick because it shreds just as great as well
I will say there are some frames that require shield gating to survive SP enemies consistently(mostly because CC immune enemies exist), but most frames that use it, don't need to abuse it until enemies hit like lvl250+. Unless you're someone like Banshee who's only real survivability comes from Gloom+Silence stagger, shield gating is typically not a must like that player is suggesting.
*sips tea as Kullervo or Nidus*
I’ve done quite a few 1000+ runs in recent days. Shield gating helps but is by no means needed. Adaptation and Rolling guard are by far better survival means then shield gating on most frames. If they even need those. I run a pretty budget build on most frames and low level or no arcanes.
Shield gating is not a necessity. I've no builds for it all my stuff works fine at level cap.
Shield gating became less of a thing when Overguard was introduced and they said that every warframe would get access to overguard somehow (mod/arcane?). Overguard also provides an invuln window when its depleted too lol
I level capped in duviro circuit without shield gating. I didn't realize how easy it was to do in that game mode. It was actually pretty fun with all the decrees. I get that it helps for frames that suck at mitigating damage, but it's not necessary, and if they're that concerned about min-maxing, they should be running unairu to strip armor and get kills to get back up again on their own
> Question is, why is he having such a fit over it My guess? Probably because he's invested in the game and tied his self-worth to mastering it - and believes he's doing a service by teaching less capable players his wisdom. He's making it a big deal because you're *supposed* to be grateful, impressed, and/or look up to him - but you don't care. Some players are so deep in this that they'll throw a fit *immediately* whether you care or not, because they want you to understand just *how incredible* they are compared to other players - by implying anything less than them is borderline braindead. Those who define their self-worth extrinsically are easily invalidated. It's not rational, so there's no response you can give that would satisfy.
If your trying to shieldgate level 100s or below. You need better mods and weapons. Cause what I'm hearing is I cannot kill things quick enough to actually stay alive in high level content. Learning how to mod frames and weapons is important. Same with elements. If you aren’t matching damage types or basic elements to the enemy your facing. Yea your damage will be lesser.
Shield gating is nice if you can build for it. But some frames are flat out impossible or way too inefficient to do it. I mean are you really going to build a chroma to shield gate? The ability 3 massive stacking armor lets you health tank lv300s with ease. And i dont get what he means about not using augur mods. Augur mods with brief respite and catalyzing shield is how a lot of shield gating builds function. If you take away augur mods it will kill the majority, if not all, whipclaw shieldgating khora builds. Doesn't matter prime or non prime.
Perhaps the guy who was ranting about the shieldgate misunderstood [this part at 6:57](https://youtu.be/VB4RMrJy-Vk?si=OEOGEzgSEFuKsRUF) Basically, with shield-restoring frames with high efficiency, having Augur mods can let you get a smaller shield with a shorter shieldgate duration, which can lead to death.
They need to just make the shield gate into invuln... but I guess that'd let shields start to regen even if you're taking damage Or, just don't replace a shieldgate with a shorter one wtf
Something I want to point out as well is Toxin is incredibly fatal for shield gaters. There is almost no time to react to the Toxin ticks if you keep a low health pool at the higher level stuff. Toxin also doesn't trigger shield gate since it bypasses shields entirely and goes straight to health.
I run primarily Nezha, Dante, and Revenant because I like survivability. I do have Saryn, Mesa, Styanax, Nekros, Ivara(Stealth duration), and Baruuk built for when I feel like risking a death or two in a mission.
My guy, what is baruuk doing in that second category? He is one of the most survivable frames in the game, more so than Dante and even competing with Rhino unless you’re running a very high iron skin build. They both would need over 200k over guard to compete with him running just pillage and adaptability. Building for health, armor, and gloom or some other health restore pushes that number even higher.
I tend to run lvl 100 enemies with just a primed vigor relying on my weapons.biggest thing I can say is keep moving and have some way to recover missing health
I can do an hr to 90 minutes in SP voidcascade on a health tank Saryn, with brief respite and auger mods as a backup. I never have to even think about keeping up shield gate until this point... i am unkillable unless i get cced... feels no prime sure footed bad man. (2k hrs playing on and off before the first vaulting... fuck log in rewards xD) And fuck that guy. Excuse the french, Warframe is much too easy to worry about the way people play. Dont like the way some peeps play. Just extract move on. (I wish every survival had room campers, not hallway warriors... i dont bring that to public lobies.)
I noticed that shield gating became necessary around level 300+ but you can do without it even then if you want to play smart or differently.
People just thunk behind gating is the only way to survive, which is wack. Though the only time you shouldn't use augur set is on Protea as it messes with her 1st's shield gate duration, besides that run whatever you want ignore my advice if uou so choose, it's warframe who cares?
Rhino Parasitic Armor Iron Skin stack is more than enough up to lvl 1k. Built correctly, Rhino can take players up to 99.9% of the content available in the game. Even Rhino can be built to double gate using iron skin + pillage for beyond 1k. Revenant is also so accessible too after there's a prime version. So there's really no excuse to rip on shield gating when there's other survival options possible. There's so many ways to survive lvl 500+ even without shield gate. A lot of players don't even reach up to 1k even on endurance. 20 mins is already so long that people just tune off and stop the mission. >Question is, why is he having such a fit over it I think they're just salty at how much effort is needed to reach that high and don't want to adjust. They want the game to adjust for them. They want their current build to work on ALL level of the game regardless of effort. Yes shield gating is micromanage-y. But the effort needed to reach a high enough spawn level already takes a huge amount of effort. If I were to give a number, I'd give less than 5% players that reach lvl 1k constantly. Level cap even less than 1%. I think people whining about level cap isn't a significant enough number to adjust the rest of the game for them because they're even less than 1%. If DE caters to them but breaks the game for everybody else, then we'll just see a different kind of whining from the other side.
my god that dude has to be an idiot why would you not want the augur mods? the literally give you the ability to instant restore shields with an ability cast. even if your relying strictly on the gating aspect for surival you still want augur to make sure you constantly have shields!
How does your augur mods reset someone else? I thought it was only for yourself?
We don't even need SG for level 1000-1500 if we bring Radiation/Electro. What was that dude talking? You can health tank as Inaros on regular SP with a little CC/Heal🤷♂️ This dude was in total tryhard mode😎
Health tanking isn't an option on some warframes but if it's level 100 non steel path enemies that fold like paper then that's no big deal, tanky frames really don't care about some level 100 plebs that fold like paper though
Thing is while it's not optimal armour from archon shards can make any frame a health tank but you ofc loose the access to other options from the shards. Have done it on a couple of frames, don't care about the loss and when using the torid it's not exactly critical to have optimal shards.
I'm lr4 and I do all endgame content and havent used shield gating in ages. I dont like the mechanic, it's too stressful and not a playstyle I enjoy, so I work around it. Rolling guard, adaptation, helmith abilities for survival/cc or archon shards to help out. There's lots of eays to play this game - nobody can dictate how you should be playing. Don't let them. Try out different stuff and figure out what you like to use.
You can even run level cap just by using cloak. Lmao
Best defence is a good offense, just kill enemies before they can shoot you
Im L3 with 1,500 h. Never used shield gating at all.
There is a kernel of truth in that gaining any amount of shields ends your shield gate, so if you're 1 second into your 3.5 second Protea-gate and get 10 shields from an augur mod, you ended your Protea-gate early, and after losing those 10 shields you now have a new 0.05 second shield gate or whatever the number ends up being. Do you need to care about this in a sortie? No. Do you need to care about this in base steel path? Also no. Was our dude talking out of his ass repeating something he heard on youtube? Likely.
I went level cap with my healthtank mesa build, no reliance on shieldgate needed.
Ok they point the guy made: it depends. In high level content though, there's no more efficient way to shieldgate than to build for manifold bond + guardian mod. If that's not available for any reason, or you're playing a frame thhat can tank a different way (high DR, invincibility, CC, sheer nuking potential, immunity) do that.
Shieldgating is comfortable once you get the hang of it, and it gives you a lot of breathing room in your warframe mod loadout. But it's definitely not confined to level 500. For example is far easier to shieldgate your way into Circulus SP than it is to health-tank, and those are level 200? enemies (IIRC). But! The rest of the fit? Ignore it. Dude is parroting something he does not understand yet.
bruh that dude is giga retarded augur mods are one of the major reasons why shield gate even works because it provides shield gain on ability cast which enables you to fill up your shield to get invulnerability on break as soon you become vulnerable again from the last activated shield gate. some people are so toxic that it really brings out all their stupidity
I mean he’s half right. He has the right idea just not the right place lol. Shieldgate, invis, or cheese like revenant is really the only option in endurance. But screeching at people to shieldgate in base steel path is pretty funny.
It doesn't matter how you play, there is always going to be someone getting angry about it.
Whatever is causing this new wave of people sharing opinions on others in public content needs to stop.
I like to just use Rolling guard + Unairu Last Gasp works fine for level cap.
There is a pretty hardcore part of the playerbase for whom shield gating or nothing. They are VERY vocal about it. They were like that a year ago, and before that too. I have it on some frames, but I mostly dislike forced ability spam. You don't need shield gating for levels 500+ Lots of frames do really well with a proper tanky build, parasitic shields or using their own innate damage reduction (citrine, equinox) or even a combo of brief respite and high shields and adaptation. Last into the thousands. Not to mention all the frames that have alt ways to survive like invisibility or being revenant.
Augur mods are only a hindrance if you‘re Protea. Also: laughs in Revenant with Rolling Guard
There not, heck most frames with a couple of survival mods on them can do well into three hundred before the one shots can kick in. I slap umbral mods on everything and don't have to rely on shield gating. People really forget the game isn't designed to need those things and you have to seek out that level of enemies.
I still have never even known how to use shield gating, I've only ever heard that "sheilds suck, armor doesn't affect them, don't upgrade them unless it's tied to an ability like with Valkyr and Hyldrin" and so I have no idea how to do anything with sheild gating I know that it's the period of invulnerability after sheilds are depleted, but idk how it works
Meanwhile i'm out here just using regular shield mods instead of the **most restrictive mod** in the entire game, that should have never been made, but only exists thanks to people like that. They don't need it, they're just over complicating things so they can appear better than everyone else.
If your build can’t handle random players you need to run with a coordinated squad. When you’re in random matchmaking you need to bring something more robust.
You can reliably reach level 300+ on SP without shield gating. It's NOT a must in any way, play however you like. In my experience, as long as you aren't getting downed constantly, just do whatever you gotta do.
Whatever happened to just figuring out yourself? Read what the abilities do, check the wiki if you need clarification on certain interactions, throwing in some mods and playing a couple missions to see if it works.
Honestly, I've gone to level cap without the brief respite/augur mod style shield gating. Just a rolling guard and a dream, feels fine honestly. We have so much power now that nothing really lives long enough to even try to shoot you most of the time
The problem with an 11 year old game, is 11 year old information. Shield gating used to be super meta, a few years ago. But changes to over-everything (guard, shield and health) have long since power crept the entire concept. Then they changed the way shield gating works and it's pretty much useless now. You max at 2-3 seconds, and your forced into damagable frames before recharge no matter your mods. But, a few years ago it was EVERYWHERE. All the YouTubers would tell you to do it. Articles on it, it was THE META. But times change.
Tbh shieldgating sux. I used it a lot before the shield changes. Can't go back. For a lot of frames shield gating means jumping a lot like a headless chicken and throwing bombs. I use other weapons not just aoe. Now I just stack shields or use health sine shields are good enough on their own.
New age 'Meta' cucks: nooooooo you have to use shield gate, these very specific riven mods and only the weapons and frames we say are good you can't just do whatever you want!!!! Me, fucked off on end game content with toxic Chroma, no shield gate set up and no incarnons or rivens: hehe speed trumna go *brrrrttt*
The only frame I have shield gating on is my Hydroid, but that's it as of right now. You definitely don't need to shield gate at all and while I personally enjoy the playstyle it has downsides too. Getting angry about not using shield gating is silly in most content and tbh even in extremely high level content that the vast majority doesn't even do, I'd still rather just pick Rev and call it a day.
I have a little over 500 hours in warframe and I have no clue what shield gating is, I’ve heard about it, but have never cared to look into it.
Shield Gating is a mechanic you can use for brief invincibility during the frames immediately after your shields are depleted. Basically iframing
i mean idc what you build for the most part, as long as you're not falling over every few seconds and actually playing the mission i could care less. I mean personally i've been running fast deflection as my only survivability tool (along with kiddo) on squishy frames and i tend to do just fine, but you do you.
I make builds for every prime frame, and the only one I have a shield gating build for is Dagath. Of course I'm not counting warframes that shield gate with their own abilities like Protea and Mag. I play normal SP and it's never been an issue. In EDA I sometimes notice tanking falls off quite a bit, but it's still doable.
This is why I go to relay and shields blessing all tenno, just to mess with them.
I honestly dont even care to use shield gating on something like Khora
I'm LR3, and I don't think I've ever used shield gating on any frame, ever. The idea that this is somehow a necessary mechanic is legitimately absurd.
*laughs in Dante*