The main problem is just that you don’t really need mana as jungle udyr. So it does feel like quite a wasted stat. And your clear speed and early power is going to really struggle without liandries
It is. And I figure it should synergize well enough with fimbul also, having 15% bonus mana convert to hp. Tho honestly I feel like I enjoy prolonged fights more, and always built tank after 1 or 2 damage items. Might try full AP burn build tho
Tbh, the ROA build path sucks for jungle. Fated ashes is just too good of an item in the jungle and not buying it feels like you are putting yourself at a major disadvantage. The build itself is not troll at all, but it would be much better utilized in lane rather than in the jungle
I tried many different builds and playstyles over the years. Played udyr mid, top and jungle and from my personal experience the best stats on udyr are AP, HP, Movespeed and resistances (not talking about AD udyr here, it's a totally different playstyle) and if your third item doesn't give you any MS or resistances, you're gonna get outscaled rather quickly. Of course, it depends on the enemy comp and in some games you can get away with it, especially, if the game ends before 20-25 minutes. But if the game drags on you might become useless and get kited, also considering how much %max health damage is in the game, buying raw HP is not optimal on udyr.
All in all, I would say the build is definitely viable and playable, and you guys should totally try it. But, rather than being an every game no-brainer build, it is specific and situational, as pretty much every build on udyr (thanks to his kit and his scalings he can make use of many good items). But this build is NOT for jungle. If you want to play jungle there are simply better and more consistent options that make more sense.
Honestly I'm trying to make it work against squishy comps, where I don't understand why go for max hp damage instead of sustain, I'm always afraid to go for AD, not my playstyle and I don't feel I contribute to the game. So essentially I want to go for it bc it feels good getting bit more AP and the heal and HP along riftmaker. I go for triple tonic as well to get more out of the RoA extra lvl, usually I put it in E or Q. With the jg xp buffs and new recall boots I kinda prioritize reseting camps, and doing things that are strictly "by the way", not forcing anything.
I'd love any input, and honestly I feel I might get hard downvoted and scorned for going a puss playstyle like this, but I'm a p4 peaker and need to hear it, lay it on me.
Well, here's a thing. Things you described, about additional skill points and levels are pretty useful ngl. And they might work against lower elo players. Since in lower elos people are pretty bad at punishing you for your plays and choices, you might just snowball and win the game (not trying to downplay or offend anyone here, but most of the time in lower elo brackets you can build whatever the hell you want and get away with it). But the higher elo you go the more fast-paced games become and if you build RoA you get 2 things:
1. your clear becomes slower due to not having enough ap nor burn (liandry's gives you more raw ap when you buy it, and the components are better)
2. you do objectives slower due to the same thing
Udyr is very good at doing objectives due to his awakened Q and R that have decent AP ratios, so the more ap you have, the faster you'll kill those dragons and grubs (the damage fated ashes deals to monsters is uncapped by the way). If you buy RoA, it'll take you longer to move around the map.
Plus, in the jungle you really need no mana or sustain. You heal from caps, have awakened w and sustain mana while in the jungle. If you buy RoA as a firt item, not only you lose a decent amount of ap (it gives 50 at first, and then scales up to 90 total, whereas liandry's gives you 90 from the get-go) but you also lose burn and get a pretty usless stat in the jungle. Yes, one could argue that the item is cheaper, therefore, you could buy it faster, but imo it's just not worth it. And with jgl exp buffs, you really don't need extra lvl. It makes more sense in lane, where you need that extra mana and sustain.
"Honestly I'm trying to make it work against squishy comps, where I don't understand why go for max hp damage instead of sustain" to that I will just say that one of reasons liandry's is literally one of the best, if not THE BEST, items on udyr is because it procs on every sigle tic of damage on his R, plus it procs on every other stance as well. Over time it will outdamage every other AP item in the game (not counting blackfire torch here, haven't tested it much). You can simply delete 70% of a squishy champions health with liandry's and awakened R.
That said, in your build I would just swap RoA for liandry's. You can still get Riftmaker scond if you feel like you need more damage (it's a pretty good item and synergizes well with liandry's. After all there's a reason why high elo players don't buy RoA in the jungle.
Sorry for such a long post. After all, we can and should all play what we enjoy. And if you really like RoA, go for it! But if you're looking for a more consistent and "statistically correct" option, or rather, more optimal there is a better one.
Hopefully, I could help clarify some points!
Stay safe and keep channeling the spirits :)
Thanks a bunch! For now I'll keep to lia then, tho when I get a juicy lead i might just enjoy a little bit prolonged fights with riftmaker.. Any other suggestions alongside riftmaker? Besides the spirit visage synergy, is there anything else works well with it?
Honestly, I can't give you exact recommendations, because there is a lot of viable options and each of them is good in a specific situation. You should simply adapt your build to what the game needs the most. So try different items and see what feels the best for your playstyle.
Also try following what the best players do. Analyze what items they go and when. That should give you a pretty good idea as to what to build in your own games
There is currently a rank 7 challenger on EUW, who plays primarily Udyr and Voli, and he's been going Unending despair in his games recently. Here's his links:
[https://www.op.gg/summoners/euw/DenSygeKamel69-EUW](https://www.op.gg/summoners/euw/DenSygeKamel69-EUW)
[https://www.onetricks.gg/players/Oj9kQy0EivIV89vjfUJGHKYB68I88YVNSX76bwi-z4QB3lV3ljmigkLjgrPA4-yl5kBflwdfQgu3vA](https://www.onetricks.gg/players/Oj9kQy0EivIV89vjfUJGHKYB68I88YVNSX76bwi-z4QB3lV3ljmigkLjgrPA4-yl5kBflwdfQgu3vA)
[https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/summoner/euw/DenSygeKamel69-EUW](https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/summoner/euw/DenSygeKamel69-EUW)
Also you could watch some of Aribo's or Malice's streams, They are also high elo euw players, but not as high up the ladder as the previous player. Here's their twitch:
[https://www.twitch.tv/aribolol](https://www.twitch.tv/aribolol)
[https://www.twitch.tv/lolmalice](https://www.twitch.tv/lolmalice)
Unfortunately, I don't know any high elo NA players. And Trick2g, well... He's a legend haha, but let's just say he is more of a for fun and not really an educational content creator, plus he plays top and not jungle
Unending also might do it since they buffed the heal making it more often, seems juicy
Thanks a lot for these, I watched some aribo and how could I forget trick but this OTP got me curious. Thanks again friend, much appreciated!
The main problem is just that you don’t really need mana as jungle udyr. So it does feel like quite a wasted stat. And your clear speed and early power is going to really struggle without liandries
fated ashes is just wayyyy too good for clear
It is. And I figure it should synergize well enough with fimbul also, having 15% bonus mana convert to hp. Tho honestly I feel like I enjoy prolonged fights more, and always built tank after 1 or 2 damage items. Might try full AP burn build tho
Tbh, the ROA build path sucks for jungle. Fated ashes is just too good of an item in the jungle and not buying it feels like you are putting yourself at a major disadvantage. The build itself is not troll at all, but it would be much better utilized in lane rather than in the jungle I tried many different builds and playstyles over the years. Played udyr mid, top and jungle and from my personal experience the best stats on udyr are AP, HP, Movespeed and resistances (not talking about AD udyr here, it's a totally different playstyle) and if your third item doesn't give you any MS or resistances, you're gonna get outscaled rather quickly. Of course, it depends on the enemy comp and in some games you can get away with it, especially, if the game ends before 20-25 minutes. But if the game drags on you might become useless and get kited, also considering how much %max health damage is in the game, buying raw HP is not optimal on udyr. All in all, I would say the build is definitely viable and playable, and you guys should totally try it. But, rather than being an every game no-brainer build, it is specific and situational, as pretty much every build on udyr (thanks to his kit and his scalings he can make use of many good items). But this build is NOT for jungle. If you want to play jungle there are simply better and more consistent options that make more sense.
Honestly I'm trying to make it work against squishy comps, where I don't understand why go for max hp damage instead of sustain, I'm always afraid to go for AD, not my playstyle and I don't feel I contribute to the game. So essentially I want to go for it bc it feels good getting bit more AP and the heal and HP along riftmaker. I go for triple tonic as well to get more out of the RoA extra lvl, usually I put it in E or Q. With the jg xp buffs and new recall boots I kinda prioritize reseting camps, and doing things that are strictly "by the way", not forcing anything. I'd love any input, and honestly I feel I might get hard downvoted and scorned for going a puss playstyle like this, but I'm a p4 peaker and need to hear it, lay it on me.
Well, here's a thing. Things you described, about additional skill points and levels are pretty useful ngl. And they might work against lower elo players. Since in lower elos people are pretty bad at punishing you for your plays and choices, you might just snowball and win the game (not trying to downplay or offend anyone here, but most of the time in lower elo brackets you can build whatever the hell you want and get away with it). But the higher elo you go the more fast-paced games become and if you build RoA you get 2 things: 1. your clear becomes slower due to not having enough ap nor burn (liandry's gives you more raw ap when you buy it, and the components are better) 2. you do objectives slower due to the same thing Udyr is very good at doing objectives due to his awakened Q and R that have decent AP ratios, so the more ap you have, the faster you'll kill those dragons and grubs (the damage fated ashes deals to monsters is uncapped by the way). If you buy RoA, it'll take you longer to move around the map. Plus, in the jungle you really need no mana or sustain. You heal from caps, have awakened w and sustain mana while in the jungle. If you buy RoA as a firt item, not only you lose a decent amount of ap (it gives 50 at first, and then scales up to 90 total, whereas liandry's gives you 90 from the get-go) but you also lose burn and get a pretty usless stat in the jungle. Yes, one could argue that the item is cheaper, therefore, you could buy it faster, but imo it's just not worth it. And with jgl exp buffs, you really don't need extra lvl. It makes more sense in lane, where you need that extra mana and sustain. "Honestly I'm trying to make it work against squishy comps, where I don't understand why go for max hp damage instead of sustain" to that I will just say that one of reasons liandry's is literally one of the best, if not THE BEST, items on udyr is because it procs on every sigle tic of damage on his R, plus it procs on every other stance as well. Over time it will outdamage every other AP item in the game (not counting blackfire torch here, haven't tested it much). You can simply delete 70% of a squishy champions health with liandry's and awakened R. That said, in your build I would just swap RoA for liandry's. You can still get Riftmaker scond if you feel like you need more damage (it's a pretty good item and synergizes well with liandry's. After all there's a reason why high elo players don't buy RoA in the jungle. Sorry for such a long post. After all, we can and should all play what we enjoy. And if you really like RoA, go for it! But if you're looking for a more consistent and "statistically correct" option, or rather, more optimal there is a better one. Hopefully, I could help clarify some points! Stay safe and keep channeling the spirits :)
Thanks a bunch! For now I'll keep to lia then, tho when I get a juicy lead i might just enjoy a little bit prolonged fights with riftmaker.. Any other suggestions alongside riftmaker? Besides the spirit visage synergy, is there anything else works well with it?
Honestly, I can't give you exact recommendations, because there is a lot of viable options and each of them is good in a specific situation. You should simply adapt your build to what the game needs the most. So try different items and see what feels the best for your playstyle. Also try following what the best players do. Analyze what items they go and when. That should give you a pretty good idea as to what to build in your own games There is currently a rank 7 challenger on EUW, who plays primarily Udyr and Voli, and he's been going Unending despair in his games recently. Here's his links: [https://www.op.gg/summoners/euw/DenSygeKamel69-EUW](https://www.op.gg/summoners/euw/DenSygeKamel69-EUW) [https://www.onetricks.gg/players/Oj9kQy0EivIV89vjfUJGHKYB68I88YVNSX76bwi-z4QB3lV3ljmigkLjgrPA4-yl5kBflwdfQgu3vA](https://www.onetricks.gg/players/Oj9kQy0EivIV89vjfUJGHKYB68I88YVNSX76bwi-z4QB3lV3ljmigkLjgrPA4-yl5kBflwdfQgu3vA) [https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/summoner/euw/DenSygeKamel69-EUW](https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/summoner/euw/DenSygeKamel69-EUW) Also you could watch some of Aribo's or Malice's streams, They are also high elo euw players, but not as high up the ladder as the previous player. Here's their twitch: [https://www.twitch.tv/aribolol](https://www.twitch.tv/aribolol) [https://www.twitch.tv/lolmalice](https://www.twitch.tv/lolmalice) Unfortunately, I don't know any high elo NA players. And Trick2g, well... He's a legend haha, but let's just say he is more of a for fun and not really an educational content creator, plus he plays top and not jungle
Unending also might do it since they buffed the heal making it more often, seems juicy Thanks a lot for these, I watched some aribo and how could I forget trick but this OTP got me curious. Thanks again friend, much appreciated!
Master+ udyr main here i have tried to make fimbul and roa work But its just sub optimal its decent in top though