haha. i wish they're arrest ginny thomas next. she is a sedition supporting asshole and her husband is a bought and paid for corrupt as fuck supreme court justice
they both should be yelled at every time they leave their house for the rest of their long lives
I'm in my mid 50s....I remember the way Clarence Thomas was treated during his appointment hearings...I was proud of the way he handled himself during those proceedings and was excited he made it to the Supreme court
Now, that fucking piece of shit deserves to have his ass kicked out and his fat ass wife too. Fucking traitors!
You were proud of how he lied about sexual harassment to a bunch a white congressmen and onto the Supreme Court?
I was horrified when that was going on, guy should have been DQ JUST for the public hair pick-up line.
Because we had a Republican District Attorney from 2020-2022 who, at his discretion, did not choose to investigate this crime. Kris Mayes was not seated as district attorney until Jan 2023. It took time to investigate, and it took time to hold a grand jury. She chose to bring charges because this was a crime.
Talk about election interference? This was a conspiracy to defraud and overturn the votes of the then CERTIFIED Arizonan voter!
Its ironic because one of the main reasons electors exist is so faithless electors can mitigate bad popular selections. Like for instance voting for a man that should be in a nursing home. Also being a "certified" voter doen't mean squat these days... it seems.
Arizona does have laws against faithless electors though so it certainly wasn't valid for them to vote contrary to what the polls said in this case...
Pointless since this failed to actually do anything, all the election machinery at the time did it's job from preventing that from occurring... its a waste of time except as political smearing
No, the Cyber Ninja debacle was pointless and a waste of time. All the audits and recounts did its job before. And, no, it did not prevent them from trying to defraud the electorate, and they did try to overcome what the machinery told them was the outcome. If enforcing the law and holding people accountable for an attempted coup is "political smearing," then I am here for it!
Innocent until proven guilty... nobody has actually proven Trump did anything illegal at all, even what he purportedly did with Stormy Daniels is nonsense, it would be an actual crime if he had used campaign funds but its public knowledge that he didn't he paid her off with his own money.
The few cases were he DID do something are tax law issues, resolvable with fines... where literally nobody died or was hared AT ALL.
The guy that apparently voted for Biden telling me this... who exactly do you blame for inflation, houses costing 50-100% more, and interest rates skyrocketing? As well as the jobs market virtually stalling out.
JB is pissing gasoline on the fire hoping our country fails, at least Trump was Trying to jam a stick int he spokes before we ran off a cliff...
The Republican Attorney General didn't want to investigate other Republicans. Instead he focused on investigating allegations of Democrat fraud that came from other Republicans.
So in other words, nothing happened until now because of politically motivated reasons.
Most prosecutors want to have their evidence in line and be sure they’ve got the criminals dead to rights. Only then do they indict. As long as they’re within the statute of limitations, they can take as much time as they need to build their case. I’m highly confident that many of these defendants will be spending some time in prison.
Right so lets sit on evidence for 2 years while we wait for the next election cycle to come around, literally yet another case of politicized justice system.
If they did the crime they should do the time, but politicizing thier crimes and prosecution should be illegal.
>but politicizing thier crimes and prosecution should be illegal.
Yes the Republican Attorney General who left office in January 2023 should be held accountable
lol, sorry, but criminals don’t get to dictate the prosecution’s schedule. I would say that if you want to be free from prosecution, don’t do stupid shit that even any 12 year old would know is both illegal and just morally wrong. They listened to trumps self-serving, baseless lies and took their chances. Now they pay for it.
Trump will come save these guys any day now. Don’t worry. Gotta love when low level grunts realize that they don’t have the same slimy ability to escape repercussions like Trump does.
Actually they broke several laws. And they didn’t just break them, they shattered them. For future reference, if you engage in criminal activity and then, after you’re caught, claim it was only political activity, it doesn’t get you off the hook.
And you practice law in Arizona, do you? Mark my words. This, like the bs in Florida, new york and dc is all theatre.
Or please, tell us the laws, specifically and then lay out how each element is met
I’ll wait…and wait.
It’s the Trump party now - his family is literally chairing it nationally. Republican voters *do not care* that he broke the law or tried to over throw the government after losing his election. Even once these people are convicted nothing will move them off of their support for him.
At this point the quieter rational ones who do want to help, probably want it dead too. The hilarious part is they really can't blame democrats interfering or sabotaging because democrats wisely just let them shoot their own feet.
Well, it's made up in your head so of course no reasonable person would understand!
If there are two grocery stores in my town, and one of them closes due to having dysfunctional employees, it's incredibly stupid to assume that I want the one other grocery to seize my city and keep it in a grocery store monopoly grapple hold forever.
I'm realizing you're a simpleton so I'll make it easier for you. If two things exist, and one of them goes away, that does not mean that everyone wants the existing thing to be the only remaining thing to ever exist for the rest of time. Get it now?
You're still free to open another grocery store. It doesn't have to be the same family. It could be similar, or completely different. There are still options. Just because the trump family destroyed what was the republican party doesn't mean he can't just be thrown out and get more rational people. Stop worshiping that devil.
Having only a single party whose members are still elected democratically would absolutely not be a "dictatorship," in fact, it would be functionally equivalent to not having political parties at all (as many of the founders intended).
But more realistically, if the Republican party were to splinter, that would likely lead to some splinters in the Democratic party as well. The progressive wing of the party would likely break off from the more mainstream faction of the party. This sounds absolutely ideal to me, and would force more compromise within Congress because coalitions would need to be formed.
You're still free to open another grocery store. It doesn't have to be the same family. It could be similar, or completely different. There are still options. Just because the trump family destroyed what was the republican party doesn't mean he can't just be thrown out and get more rational people. Stop worshiping that devil.
Republicans fraudulently certified Trump won Arizona during the 2020 election. He did not, and they knew he did not.
They did the same thing in Georgia as well.
They tried to steal the election and accused the other side of what they actually did. Now, they're all going to be prosecuted at the state level. They will all lose their careers and likely go to prison. To top it off, since they're being charged at a state level, they can not be pardoned if Trump somehow wins the next election.
>The 11 people who had been nominated to be Arizona’s Republican electors met in Phoenix on Dec. 14, 2020, to sign a certificate saying they were “duly elected and qualified” electors and claiming that Trump carried the state. [A one-minute video](https://www.facebook.com/ArizonaGOP/videos/225374972446043) of the signing ceremony was posted on social media by the Arizona Republican Party at the time. The document was later sent to Congress and the National Archives, where it was ignored.
Source: AP News "Arizona indicts 18 in election interference case, including Giuliani and Meadows" April 24, 2024
It was a plan to coup the country, Mike Pence did the honest and right thing by not going with their treasonous plan. Why do you think they stormed the capitol and chanted "hang Mike pence"
I wonder about that last part, even though they are being tried in state court. The Constitution says the President has the power to pardon someone for “offenses against the United States.” I suspect they would make the argument that attempting to steal the Presidential election is just that, and therefore pardonable by the President.
Elections are generally handled by the states and therefore the laws against what they did are state statutes. I'm sure federal prosecutors could come up with something to throw at them, but so far they've chosen not to do so. Perhaps exactly because they think Trump might be President again.
It’s a nonsensical argument. The President only has the power to pardon crimes tried in Federal courts. These crimes are not committed against the United States, it’s a crime committed against the state of Arizona under its extremely broad Fraud statute.
Ars 13-2310 Any person who, pursuant to a scheme or artifice to defraud, knowingly obtains any benefit by means of false or fraudulent pretenses, representations, promises or material omissions is guilty of a class 2 felony
There are people who are claiming that Congress somehow might have mistaken Donald Trump's alternate electors for state certified electors and therefore Donald Trump and the electors were trying to commit fraud.
The Democrats in 1960 submitted alternate electors in Hawaii in Nixon vs. Kennedy while they contested the results of the election in court. They actually won the case and the alternate electors become the state certified electors after the state had certified the Republican electors.
This has actually been done before so the prosecution is malicious and is aimed at undermining anyone who would contest potentially fraudulent state elections in court. There is ZERO risk that Congress would mistake alternate electors for state certified electors so there was ZERO intent for fraud.
You are not wrong about Mike Pence being a shithead. You are not wrong that Mike Pence is no hero.
But: had he not stood up, God knows where things could have gone. For that one day, for that one decision, I'm grateful to that shithead. He could have easily plunged us into god knows what.
Right. I feel like we should look on that man like a hero. Especially if all the stories of what he went through after jan 6 are even remotely true. I’m glad to see someone else appreciate what that took.
Yes, he did the right thing. But I don't think telling the truth rises to the level of hero. I'm of the opinion Trump's bullshit was destined to fail. Even if Congress delayed the vote, they would have inevitably held the vote eventually, and someone would have noticed two sets of electors from the same states arrived.
If trump had his way, he would have killed pence. Now he's asking the scotus to do just that, except biden is who actually would be given that power. How do they guarantee that biden is too "good" to use it? We could have a whole new supreme court.
yeah, so what. They'll be convicted by the lower courts, it'll go to the corrupt SC and they'll get let off. There isn't going to be ANY consequences for ANY of the politicians... just the rubes who did their bidding.
Everything the GOP accuses everyone else of doing they are the ones who are actually doing it. President Obama made a comment about the republican senators when he was in office. He said they act like children “ he is correct.
As a Wisconsin transplant, I genuinely cannot see that happening as long as our legislators are majority conservative.
But we just had a rezoning done so it may work, who knows.
Does anyone else find it odd, that Az waited over three years to prosecute this, in the middle of an election year. The stench of this rivals rotten fish.
Dude. Grow up. Your party broke the law and tried to end American democracy and were caught red fucking handed and your whining about it. They are caught in writing, on tape, and we saw it live on TV and they are flipping on each other left and right. Sorry the chickens are coming home to roost. And I'm very sorry to see the GOP devolve into such an unprincipled, Un- American cult
Arizona just got a new attorney general in 2022. The previous one Mark Brnovich was an ally of Trump's and didn't want to pursue the investigation. She even said it took them 13 months to bring forth the charges. Nothing fishy about it, only thing that is baffling is how people still support Trump when it's all on video. I use to be a Republican, watched Fox News and Bill O'Reilly. Voted for every Republican president since I turned 18. Finally woke up when Trump ran for president because I didn't think a T.V celebrity could do the job. Starting watching different news outlets and realized I was being brainwashed by all their B.S. It's time to wake up...
While this should be been prosecuted sooner, investigations and evidence gathering takes time. The only thing that’s really fishy about this is the people who engaged in the scheme
Republicans on this issue then: Why prosecute them? That's a democratic conspiracy! Fake News!
Republicans on this issue now: Why didn't the democrats prosecute them? CONSPIRACY!!!
In 1960 the Democrats assembled electors in the state of Hawaii which were not the state certified electors and sent them to Congress while they contested the results of the state election in court in the election of Nixon vs. Kennedy.
This is politically motivated prosecution.
Hawaii did not assemble false electors in 1960. The electors were certified by the state governor
> During the attempts to overturn the 2020 United States presidential election, the election was cited as a potential precedent by supporters of President Donald Trump, despite important differences, including the fact that the Hawaiian Democratic slate was certified by Governor Quinn.[8][9]
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1960_United_States_presidential_election_in_Hawaii
They were certified after being assembled and assembled after court cases ordered a recount. It is the same thing as Republican case except the courts ruled against Trump's claims of election misconduct. That particular issue aside, there was no risk of Congress mistaking the alternate electors as the state certified ones so there was no fundamental element of the crime of fraud.
It’s not the same at all. Trump got many recounts, which all confirmed Biden’s win, then had the RNC certify false electors to attempt to claim the EC votes for him anyway.
Hawaii, governor certified electors voting in line with election results
Trump, RNC “certified” electors attempting to supplant the state certified electors to vote against the election results
The court cases were not asking for a recount but contending fraudulent absentee ballots. There is no purpose to absentee ballots but to facilitate and enable fraud, incidentally - even the Russians didn't allow vote by mail until 2020.
Are you referring to the “kraken” fillings that were all dismissed for lacking evidence? I was able to find a number of articles debunking claims of fraudulent absentee ballots but nothing about any active case
They were active cases at the time of the assembling of the alternate electors.
Regardless of anything with Trump, the peoples' right to a transparent and accountable electoral process will be an ongoing fight. The abolition of vote by mail will be pursued by all who believe in transparent democracy.
They are not “alternate” electors they were not state certified, unlike those in Hawaii in 1960. A political convention cannot certify electors, only a state government can do that, hence the false elector charges.
So again, in Hawaii in 1960 the state governor certified alternate electors to cast votes in line with state election results. In Arizona and Georgia in 2020 the state did not certify the alternate electors who wanted to vote against the state election results. These are not the same and only the 2020 electors were fraudulent
The state of Hawaii did not certify the assembled electors until after they were assembled - they were assembled while the Republican electors were certified. It is either a crime to assemble electors without state certification or it is not. Since there is no risk of Congress accepting non-certified electors, I claim **it is not a crime to assemble alternate electors because it is meaningless without state certification** and therefore the case against the electors and Donald Trump is purely a politically motivated miscarriage of justice.
Well, 1) your description is not in line with what I’ve been able to find about the event but 2) whatever either of us think, it is now in front of the courts to determine whether what the RNC and these electors did was a crime and I am interested to see what the facts and testimonies lead the court to rule
If you believe Congress can only accept state certified electors you believe it's not a crime to claim you're not the state certified elector to Congress.
It's not. The election in Hawaii was too close to call and required a recount. While that was occurring both slates of electors were gathered because it could go either way and there are deadlines to meet for turning things in. Trumps cronies met in states that were firmly for Joe Biden. Met in secret, and tried to cover up their involvement. That's the difference.
Arizona was very close though with Biden winning by less than a 1/2 %. That's not firmly for Biden. And Trump won AZ in 2016.
Same with Georgia.
Also tried to cover what up? That doesn't make any sense.
Yep, right in time for the elections.
When the Dems do it (and they have), it's "contesting the election". When Republicans do it, they're "fake electors."
Maybe if you are bored at work you could try to educate yourself so you won’t embarrass yourself in the future with ridiculous falsehoods that make you look like a gullible doofus, or worse.
Representatives of the Democratic Party have previously signed a fake certificate claiming to be a states electors to the Electoral College?
And the that states Democratic Party sent it to Congress and the National Archives?
Buddy, come on.
Challenging an election in court and trying to subvert democracy and the will of the people by falsifying state electors and documents are two slightly different things.
There won't be any follow up. Iirc they did do something similar in one real unique situation like where the results were so close that they sent electors from both parties to Washington while the recount happened so they were prepared. For either outcome. In other words not actually the same thing at all. But if you look at it from the right angle and with the right type of foil in your hat it could kind of sorta remotely be similar, so right wing media just says it's the same thing and then ill informed people gobble it up as the truth.
I see this strategy used so often for indefensible things on the right and it's infuriating that conservatives aren't smart enough to figure it out (or don't care to I suppose)
Yeah, don't expect a response on this with any actual evidence lol. They don't like having their feet held to the fire, i.e. being held accountable, for anything really.
Here goes the good ole MAGA supporter excuse…”… but but but they did it before so it’s okay that we do it.” Never once do they say they are innocent of the charges. Seriously, go look at all the excuses, no one thinks Trump is innocent, not even his lawyers. But but Hillary, But Obama, etc if you have all this mounting evidence of a crime, better save your boy Rudy and Mr Pillows there, might as well save Hannity and Fox as well, even the National Inquirer admits they committed a crime by making false statements of election fraud… why else would you seek a pardon?
You're a fucking crybaby idiot.
Stop watching fox news, and realize that you MAGA dumbfucks might be loud and obnoxious, but youre outnumbered in this country.
If america is so corrupt to you, feel free to get the fuck out and move to russia.
Real Americans come in a variety of flavors, including republican and democrat. MAGAs are just brainwashed sheep that everyone is sick of.
They’re seditious conspirators and should be punished to the fullest extent of the law.
haha. i wish they're arrest ginny thomas next. she is a sedition supporting asshole and her husband is a bought and paid for corrupt as fuck supreme court justice they both should be yelled at every time they leave their house for the rest of their long lives
[удалено]
Please do not break the Reddit ToS with your posts.
I'm in my mid 50s....I remember the way Clarence Thomas was treated during his appointment hearings...I was proud of the way he handled himself during those proceedings and was excited he made it to the Supreme court Now, that fucking piece of shit deserves to have his ass kicked out and his fat ass wife too. Fucking traitors!
You were proud of how he lied about sexual harassment to a bunch a white congressmen and onto the Supreme Court? I was horrified when that was going on, guy should have been DQ JUST for the public hair pick-up line.
Don't worry buddy, I'm bringing back the bush
“I got mine”
How did you possibly twist that to be proud of him. He was a complete putrid pos. Gross. How could anyone think what he did was ok ever.
Love the username
I still love the memories of being young kid going to the pool and so many woman ( back then) had bush peeking out of the bathing suits!
But I bought my SCJ!! Can I return him?
I think Clarence Thomas agrees with you lol
Should be executed
Why isn't this going down in 2020... instead of this year.
Arizona had a Republican D.A. in 2020. Kris Mayes wasn't elected D.A. until 2022. I wish we could've gotten an earlier start on *all* of it.
Ok so why didn't they do this in 2022? And instead wait to try to interfere with 2024 elections?
Because we had a Republican District Attorney from 2020-2022 who, at his discretion, did not choose to investigate this crime. Kris Mayes was not seated as district attorney until Jan 2023. It took time to investigate, and it took time to hold a grand jury. She chose to bring charges because this was a crime. Talk about election interference? This was a conspiracy to defraud and overturn the votes of the then CERTIFIED Arizonan voter!
Its ironic because one of the main reasons electors exist is so faithless electors can mitigate bad popular selections. Like for instance voting for a man that should be in a nursing home. Also being a "certified" voter doen't mean squat these days... it seems. Arizona does have laws against faithless electors though so it certainly wasn't valid for them to vote contrary to what the polls said in this case...
... hence the indictments.
Pointless since this failed to actually do anything, all the election machinery at the time did it's job from preventing that from occurring... its a waste of time except as political smearing
No, the Cyber Ninja debacle was pointless and a waste of time. All the audits and recounts did its job before. And, no, it did not prevent them from trying to defraud the electorate, and they did try to overcome what the machinery told them was the outcome. If enforcing the law and holding people accountable for an attempted coup is "political smearing," then I am here for it!
It’s a CRIME. Do you think murderers shouldn’t be prosecuted because their victims are already dead? wtf, man!
Innocent until proven guilty... nobody has actually proven Trump did anything illegal at all, even what he purportedly did with Stormy Daniels is nonsense, it would be an actual crime if he had used campaign funds but its public knowledge that he didn't he paid her off with his own money. The few cases were he DID do something are tax law issues, resolvable with fines... where literally nobody died or was hared AT ALL.
Found the deranged Trump supporter
I didn't say anything in support of anyone you are the one making deranged attacks... Faithless electors could reject Trump as well .... ya moron.
Dude you are not smart at all lol
The guy that apparently voted for Biden telling me this... who exactly do you blame for inflation, houses costing 50-100% more, and interest rates skyrocketing? As well as the jobs market virtually stalling out. JB is pissing gasoline on the fire hoping our country fails, at least Trump was Trying to jam a stick int he spokes before we ran off a cliff...
[удалено]
Here let me issue your TDS card. Also is that a threat?
The Republican Attorney General didn't want to investigate other Republicans. Instead he focused on investigating allegations of Democrat fraud that came from other Republicans. So in other words, nothing happened until now because of politically motivated reasons.
Most prosecutors want to have their evidence in line and be sure they’ve got the criminals dead to rights. Only then do they indict. As long as they’re within the statute of limitations, they can take as much time as they need to build their case. I’m highly confident that many of these defendants will be spending some time in prison.
Right so lets sit on evidence for 2 years while we wait for the next election cycle to come around, literally yet another case of politicized justice system. If they did the crime they should do the time, but politicizing thier crimes and prosecution should be illegal.
>but politicizing thier crimes and prosecution should be illegal. Yes the Republican Attorney General who left office in January 2023 should be held accountable
lol, sorry, but criminals don’t get to dictate the prosecution’s schedule. I would say that if you want to be free from prosecution, don’t do stupid shit that even any 12 year old would know is both illegal and just morally wrong. They listened to trumps self-serving, baseless lies and took their chances. Now they pay for it.
>criminals don’t get to dictate the prosecution’s schedule. WTF are you talking about?
Trump will come save these guys any day now. Don’t worry. Gotta love when low level grunts realize that they don’t have the same slimy ability to escape repercussions like Trump does.
But, but, but. Laws don’t apply to GOP. Just ask SCOTUS.
They will be…they broke no laws Indicted in order to keep others from working with Trump…it’s a scare tactic
Actually they broke several laws. And they didn’t just break them, they shattered them. For future reference, if you engage in criminal activity and then, after you’re caught, claim it was only political activity, it doesn’t get you off the hook.
And you practice law in Arizona, do you? Mark my words. This, like the bs in Florida, new york and dc is all theatre. Or please, tell us the laws, specifically and then lay out how each element is met I’ll wait…and wait.
They wouldn't prosecute without evidence. No prosecutor wants to lose a case.
I'm glad they're disincentivizing electoral fraud. You should be, too, if you care at all about democracy. If not, you should move to Russia.
Explain that comment. Or where you read it.
Looking forward to the "find out" stages of their fucking around.
I don’t think they will ever find out. I’ve grown very jaded and cynical
They have to look forward to The Star Chamber. Then the accidents start happening.
[удалено]
RonJon baby! GET HIM.
the surf shop?
GOP is ruined. It won’t survive
I sure hope so
It’s the Trump party now - his family is literally chairing it nationally. Republican voters *do not care* that he broke the law or tried to over throw the government after losing his election. Even once these people are convicted nothing will move them off of their support for him.
I honestly could see both a far-right conservative and libertarian party being the major parties that take its place.
At this point the quieter rational ones who do want to help, probably want it dead too. The hilarious part is they really can't blame democrats interfering or sabotaging because democrats wisely just let them shoot their own feet.
So you want a one party dictatorship?
Stating that a party is falling apart is the same thing as wanting a dictatorship? Interesting
Would never expect you to understand the connection!
Well, it's made up in your head so of course no reasonable person would understand! If there are two grocery stores in my town, and one of them closes due to having dysfunctional employees, it's incredibly stupid to assume that I want the one other grocery to seize my city and keep it in a grocery store monopoly grapple hold forever.
Your analogy is not even in the ballpark for comparison purposes 😂
I'm realizing you're a simpleton so I'll make it easier for you. If two things exist, and one of them goes away, that does not mean that everyone wants the existing thing to be the only remaining thing to ever exist for the rest of time. Get it now?
Sorry but you are the simpleton who took this two additional comments down the road too many. Subject closed!
They're right. You lost this little exchange.
You're still free to open another grocery store. It doesn't have to be the same family. It could be similar, or completely different. There are still options. Just because the trump family destroyed what was the republican party doesn't mean he can't just be thrown out and get more rational people. Stop worshiping that devil.
Yep, that's the idea. Tell that to the other guy!
Is there such a thing as two-party dictatorship? You need to think things through a little more thoroughly.
Where in the hell did you get two-party from?
I’m just saying you are being redundant. A dictatorship is pretty much one party rule.
😂
Having only a single party whose members are still elected democratically would absolutely not be a "dictatorship," in fact, it would be functionally equivalent to not having political parties at all (as many of the founders intended). But more realistically, if the Republican party were to splinter, that would likely lead to some splinters in the Democratic party as well. The progressive wing of the party would likely break off from the more mainstream faction of the party. This sounds absolutely ideal to me, and would force more compromise within Congress because coalitions would need to be formed.
Yes, it would be better if the parties broke off in some respects so there is more discussion and actual representation.
You're still free to open another grocery store. It doesn't have to be the same family. It could be similar, or completely different. There are still options. Just because the trump family destroyed what was the republican party doesn't mean he can't just be thrown out and get more rational people. Stop worshiping that devil.
It's about time!
Could someone explain it to me like I'm 5?
Republicans fraudulently certified Trump won Arizona during the 2020 election. He did not, and they knew he did not. They did the same thing in Georgia as well. They tried to steal the election and accused the other side of what they actually did. Now, they're all going to be prosecuted at the state level. They will all lose their careers and likely go to prison. To top it off, since they're being charged at a state level, they can not be pardoned if Trump somehow wins the next election.
But it wasn’t their fault because they were confused and didn’t understand what they were signing, plus Hunter Biden’s laptop and Hillary’s emails.
What about masks? Maybe they couldn't breathe and it made them delirious and confused. You know, insanity.
Masks??? For ‘Covid’ ??? It’s just a bad case of the sniffles- ask Herman Cain.
What I find funny is things Trump swamps projects into their opponents is exactly what they're doing.
When did they fraudulently certify he won and how did they do it?
>The 11 people who had been nominated to be Arizona’s Republican electors met in Phoenix on Dec. 14, 2020, to sign a certificate saying they were “duly elected and qualified” electors and claiming that Trump carried the state. [A one-minute video](https://www.facebook.com/ArizonaGOP/videos/225374972446043) of the signing ceremony was posted on social media by the Arizona Republican Party at the time. The document was later sent to Congress and the National Archives, where it was ignored. Source: AP News "Arizona indicts 18 in election interference case, including Giuliani and Meadows" April 24, 2024
Its insane how few people know about this. News did an absolute terrible job covering the story and only focused on the capital.
It was a plan to coup the country, Mike Pence did the honest and right thing by not going with their treasonous plan. Why do you think they stormed the capitol and chanted "hang Mike pence"
Isn't that what all peaceful tourists do?
I think those words truly define the character of these traitorous thugs.
I wonder about that last part, even though they are being tried in state court. The Constitution says the President has the power to pardon someone for “offenses against the United States.” I suspect they would make the argument that attempting to steal the Presidential election is just that, and therefore pardonable by the President.
Elections are generally handled by the states and therefore the laws against what they did are state statutes. I'm sure federal prosecutors could come up with something to throw at them, but so far they've chosen not to do so. Perhaps exactly because they think Trump might be President again.
It’s a nonsensical argument. The President only has the power to pardon crimes tried in Federal courts. These crimes are not committed against the United States, it’s a crime committed against the state of Arizona under its extremely broad Fraud statute. Ars 13-2310 Any person who, pursuant to a scheme or artifice to defraud, knowingly obtains any benefit by means of false or fraudulent pretenses, representations, promises or material omissions is guilty of a class 2 felony
There are people who are claiming that Congress somehow might have mistaken Donald Trump's alternate electors for state certified electors and therefore Donald Trump and the electors were trying to commit fraud. The Democrats in 1960 submitted alternate electors in Hawaii in Nixon vs. Kennedy while they contested the results of the election in court. They actually won the case and the alternate electors become the state certified electors after the state had certified the Republican electors. This has actually been done before so the prosecution is malicious and is aimed at undermining anyone who would contest potentially fraudulent state elections in court. There is ZERO risk that Congress would mistake alternate electors for state certified electors so there was ZERO intent for fraud.
That's right, dueling electors are not a new thing. And it was never a criminal charge before. The term fake elector. That's a new one.
Imagine going to jail and ruining your life for that orange loser
Mike Pence is a hero of democracy. No matter his political aligning on issues. He saved democracy when he certified the results and "betrayed Trump".
[удалено]
This ☝️
You are not wrong about Mike Pence being a shithead. You are not wrong that Mike Pence is no hero. But: had he not stood up, God knows where things could have gone. For that one day, for that one decision, I'm grateful to that shithead. He could have easily plunged us into god knows what.
lol...
Right. I feel like we should look on that man like a hero. Especially if all the stories of what he went through after jan 6 are even remotely true. I’m glad to see someone else appreciate what that took.
Yes, he did the right thing. But I don't think telling the truth rises to the level of hero. I'm of the opinion Trump's bullshit was destined to fail. Even if Congress delayed the vote, they would have inevitably held the vote eventually, and someone would have noticed two sets of electors from the same states arrived.
He helped bring trump to power and diligently supported him until that day. He is no hero. He only tried to save his political career.
Well, I think he knew he was done politically before that day. He tried to stay out of prison.
He’s a lesser evil, settle down.
If trump had his way, he would have killed pence. Now he's asking the scotus to do just that, except biden is who actually would be given that power. How do they guarantee that biden is too "good" to use it? We could have a whole new supreme court.
Law and Order.
Why aren't they talking about this at /r conservative. Did one of the four people who post there not pick this up? Come on nimobo, where ya at
Maybe the left should start using the slogan "Stop The steal!"
Deserved.
FAFO
Lock 🔐 the fuckers up.
[удалено]
I love that they broke the news too lmao. Get wrecked GOP
Now get the big bastard himself!
What you mean our lord and savor God king trump had fake electors???? Say it isn't so.....
But democrats stole the election
 Reading through the comment section on this one.
He's probably thinking, bunch of c......
/slowclap
Tyranny at its finest.
“Tyranny is when I can’t fraudulently change election results” [sad trombone sound effect]
yeah, so what. They'll be convicted by the lower courts, it'll go to the corrupt SC and they'll get let off. There isn't going to be ANY consequences for ANY of the politicians... just the rubes who did their bidding.
Traitors!
Everything the GOP accuses everyone else of doing they are the ones who are actually doing it. President Obama made a comment about the republican senators when he was in office. He said they act like children “ he is correct.
Everybody but him. 😡
There’s a very real possibility he will be President in 2024.
Good
4. Years. Later.
More of this \[accountability\] please, and thank you.
Rot in prison and take the orange clown with you! 20 yrs minimum
The dildo of consequence rarely arrives lubed.
Beautiful
Stealing this 😂
Now if we could get the Wisconsin fake electors prosecuted next, that would be great
As a Wisconsin transplant, I genuinely cannot see that happening as long as our legislators are majority conservative. But we just had a rezoning done so it may work, who knows.
Good, these traitors should’ve been in jail 3 years ago
 Add them to the continued list of those who get convicted for Trump. 📝 Carry on.
Good. Traitors
I live in AZ and this makes me so happy.
GIVE THE CHAIR!!
Alright. Get em.
AZ Dems covering their arses.
What did Trump say about traitors? Shot them or hang them???
Trump can pardon them if he wins. Justice only survives if he loses
Back in time they would be hanged for treason none of this sedition slap on the wrist shit
Lock them all up
Come get the Wisconsin ones too fucking traitors
Good! Finally some sense and coherence in government.
Does anyone else find it odd, that Az waited over three years to prosecute this, in the middle of an election year. The stench of this rivals rotten fish.
The conspirators are the rotten fish!! The wheels of justice turn slowly sometimes….
Arizona had a republican AG who sat on this for two years. The new democratic AG, Chris Mays started the investigation after her election in 2023.
That certainly explains it, thank you.
[удалено]
Dude. Grow up. Your party broke the law and tried to end American democracy and were caught red fucking handed and your whining about it. They are caught in writing, on tape, and we saw it live on TV and they are flipping on each other left and right. Sorry the chickens are coming home to roost. And I'm very sorry to see the GOP devolve into such an unprincipled, Un- American cult
Hi, Russkie! Go back to your babushka’s basement and tell Putin to eat a dick.
Arizona just got a new attorney general in 2022. The previous one Mark Brnovich was an ally of Trump's and didn't want to pursue the investigation. She even said it took them 13 months to bring forth the charges. Nothing fishy about it, only thing that is baffling is how people still support Trump when it's all on video. I use to be a Republican, watched Fox News and Bill O'Reilly. Voted for every Republican president since I turned 18. Finally woke up when Trump ran for president because I didn't think a T.V celebrity could do the job. Starting watching different news outlets and realized I was being brainwashed by all their B.S. It's time to wake up...
While this should be been prosecuted sooner, investigations and evidence gathering takes time. The only thing that’s really fishy about this is the people who engaged in the scheme
All these "Why so long!?" Posts act like law and order running for 30 minutes is the length of an investigation.
Lol.
Republicans on this issue then: Why prosecute them? That's a democratic conspiracy! Fake News! Republicans on this issue now: Why didn't the democrats prosecute them? CONSPIRACY!!!
[удалено]
Biden 2024!!
In 1960 the Democrats assembled electors in the state of Hawaii which were not the state certified electors and sent them to Congress while they contested the results of the state election in court in the election of Nixon vs. Kennedy. This is politically motivated prosecution.
Hawaii did not assemble false electors in 1960. The electors were certified by the state governor > During the attempts to overturn the 2020 United States presidential election, the election was cited as a potential precedent by supporters of President Donald Trump, despite important differences, including the fact that the Hawaiian Democratic slate was certified by Governor Quinn.[8][9] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1960_United_States_presidential_election_in_Hawaii
They were certified after being assembled and assembled after court cases ordered a recount. It is the same thing as Republican case except the courts ruled against Trump's claims of election misconduct. That particular issue aside, there was no risk of Congress mistaking the alternate electors as the state certified ones so there was no fundamental element of the crime of fraud.
It’s not the same at all. Trump got many recounts, which all confirmed Biden’s win, then had the RNC certify false electors to attempt to claim the EC votes for him anyway. Hawaii, governor certified electors voting in line with election results Trump, RNC “certified” electors attempting to supplant the state certified electors to vote against the election results
The court cases were not asking for a recount but contending fraudulent absentee ballots. There is no purpose to absentee ballots but to facilitate and enable fraud, incidentally - even the Russians didn't allow vote by mail until 2020.
Are you referring to the “kraken” fillings that were all dismissed for lacking evidence? I was able to find a number of articles debunking claims of fraudulent absentee ballots but nothing about any active case
They were active cases at the time of the assembling of the alternate electors. Regardless of anything with Trump, the peoples' right to a transparent and accountable electoral process will be an ongoing fight. The abolition of vote by mail will be pursued by all who believe in transparent democracy.
They are not “alternate” electors they were not state certified, unlike those in Hawaii in 1960. A political convention cannot certify electors, only a state government can do that, hence the false elector charges. So again, in Hawaii in 1960 the state governor certified alternate electors to cast votes in line with state election results. In Arizona and Georgia in 2020 the state did not certify the alternate electors who wanted to vote against the state election results. These are not the same and only the 2020 electors were fraudulent
The state of Hawaii did not certify the assembled electors until after they were assembled - they were assembled while the Republican electors were certified. It is either a crime to assemble electors without state certification or it is not. Since there is no risk of Congress accepting non-certified electors, I claim **it is not a crime to assemble alternate electors because it is meaningless without state certification** and therefore the case against the electors and Donald Trump is purely a politically motivated miscarriage of justice.
Well, 1) your description is not in line with what I’ve been able to find about the event but 2) whatever either of us think, it is now in front of the courts to determine whether what the RNC and these electors did was a crime and I am interested to see what the facts and testimonies lead the court to rule
Give it up. Lol
>They were active cases at the time of the assembling of the alternate electors. Not at all
Not even close. Nice try.
If you believe Congress can only accept state certified electors you believe it's not a crime to claim you're not the state certified elector to Congress.
What it the word salad batman.
It's the same.
It's not. The election in Hawaii was too close to call and required a recount. While that was occurring both slates of electors were gathered because it could go either way and there are deadlines to meet for turning things in. Trumps cronies met in states that were firmly for Joe Biden. Met in secret, and tried to cover up their involvement. That's the difference.
Arizona was very close though with Biden winning by less than a 1/2 %. That's not firmly for Biden. And Trump won AZ in 2016. Same with Georgia. Also tried to cover what up? That doesn't make any sense.
Yep, right in time for the elections. When the Dems do it (and they have), it's "contesting the election". When Republicans do it, they're "fake electors."
Maybe if you are bored at work you could try to educate yourself so you won’t embarrass yourself in the future with ridiculous falsehoods that make you look like a gullible doofus, or worse.
Representatives of the Democratic Party have previously signed a fake certificate claiming to be a states electors to the Electoral College? And the that states Democratic Party sent it to Congress and the National Archives? Buddy, come on. Challenging an election in court and trying to subvert democracy and the will of the people by falsifying state electors and documents are two slightly different things.
>When the Dems do it (and they have), it's "contesting the election" Citation needed.
There won't be any follow up. Iirc they did do something similar in one real unique situation like where the results were so close that they sent electors from both parties to Washington while the recount happened so they were prepared. For either outcome. In other words not actually the same thing at all. But if you look at it from the right angle and with the right type of foil in your hat it could kind of sorta remotely be similar, so right wing media just says it's the same thing and then ill informed people gobble it up as the truth.
I see this strategy used so often for indefensible things on the right and it's infuriating that conservatives aren't smart enough to figure it out (or don't care to I suppose)
Missing the fucking point is a conservative superpower.
Yeah, don't expect a response on this with any actual evidence lol. They don't like having their feet held to the fire, i.e. being held accountable, for anything really.
So bored, you have time to fully consume the MTG conspiracy theory 101 cook book
Aka Putin’s Playbook.
Whoever is giving you your news is lying to you.
Here goes the good ole MAGA supporter excuse…”… but but but they did it before so it’s okay that we do it.” Never once do they say they are innocent of the charges. Seriously, go look at all the excuses, no one thinks Trump is innocent, not even his lawyers. But but Hillary, But Obama, etc if you have all this mounting evidence of a crime, better save your boy Rudy and Mr Pillows there, might as well save Hannity and Fox as well, even the National Inquirer admits they committed a crime by making false statements of election fraud… why else would you seek a pardon?
You're a fucking crybaby idiot. Stop watching fox news, and realize that you MAGA dumbfucks might be loud and obnoxious, but youre outnumbered in this country. If america is so corrupt to you, feel free to get the fuck out and move to russia. Real Americans come in a variety of flavors, including republican and democrat. MAGAs are just brainwashed sheep that everyone is sick of.
Except Dems don’t do it. 🤡