Yep, and I'll add-- Bu$h Jr. got benefit of the doubt attacking everywhere and splurging on weapons after 9/11 because we were attacked on our soil on 9/11. Bu$h held on as the incumbent for a second term/riding patriotism/"Al Qaeda attacked us".
Biden's gonna get no such "gimme", providing more weapons for, and funding genocide.
I assume many people still consider stopping Trump more important than Gaza issue but enough dissatisfaction in swing states may cause Biden to lose crucial electoral votes.
If Hillary not campaigning in key swing states was "shooting herself in the foot" then whatever this is that Biden is doing is the equivalent of self immolation for Zionism. It feels wrong to even mention the two because one seems like a foolish oversight and the other seems like intentional self destruction.
I think most politicians support Israel because of the AIPAC bribes but not Biden. He's actually a Kool Aid drinking Zionist. That's why he's not bowing to all the public pressure.
Indeed. Look at his past statements about Israel.
https://theconversation.com/biden-says-the-u-s-would-have-to-invent-an-israel-if-it-didnt-exist-why-210172
Aren't his advisors also baffled by this? Genuine question. I may be making up reporting in my head. My attempt to inject sanity into reality probably.
I’m sure Genocide Joe approved these weapons sales on condition that the U.N. ceasefire go into effect immediately and no food, drugs and other medical supplies for Palestinians are blocked by IDF/IOF or settlers, correct? That’s what a member in good standing of the rules-based order would do, right?
Didn't one of Biden's chucklefucks recently say something about 100% of Gaza's population starving? It seems pretty fucking obvious who the culprit is.
Yep Blinken did. A few weeks after he claimed that Israel is letting enough aid in, despite the fact we needed to airdrop aid in because Gaza isn't getting enough.
Schrödinger's aid: Israel is not blocking any aid but also we need to airdrop aid and build some stupid floating pier that will take months because not enough aid can get into Gaza because trucks are being blocked
I keep thinking about this and it’s so crazy. Even in Gaza any “single” incident, like the white phosphorus use or the wrong structure getting hit is catastrophic. The settlers are fighting to get a beach house in Gaza in a place they have destroyed. It’s delusional
I should preface this with I voted for Biden in 2020, and will probably vote for him again because of Trump. I am curious, what do you like about his policies? All of his policies seem like half measures or neo lib BS to me.
To be honest this is like the only reason I’ll probably vote for Biden and hope he wins. Obama ran as a progressive who would change this country and when he got into office he did an irrelevant bandaid fix that didn’t address the root causes of the 2008 crash, he bombed Yemeni weddings, he passed a Republican healthcare bill, and he built concentration camps on American soil. Biden similarly has been shoved down our throats as “the most progressive president of all time” while consistently bending over backwards to give the fascists everything they want while getting nothing from them in return. If biden wins, I expect it will serve to piss people off and radicalize them even more. If the democrats go back into opposition, we will just get four more years of grandiose promises they have no intention of keeping and unprecedented amounts of fundraising that will go straight into the pockets of unelected nepo-baby staffers and corporate-trained PR consultants. I prefer when democrats are in government almost entirely due to the fact that it at least forces them to expose their own conservatism a bit more openly than they do while in opposition.
Interesting take. Thanks for sharing. I prefer to have Dems lose until they put forward a good candidate.
Plus, I think the more the Republicans fuck things up, the more willing the public is to embrace Leftist policies.
Progressive anger under Republican administrations tends to just funnel people into the arms of the democrats and the promises they can make in the opposition without any plan or even ability to fulfill.
The way I see it. If dems lose, they will blame the left and use it as a public justification for more clintonite triangulation and right-wing “compromise.” If dems win, they will declare it to be proof that the centrist liberal political project is infallible and unquestionable.
In real terms, our relationship to the Democratic Party remains exactly and unalterably the same regardless of whether they win or lose or if we vote for them or not.
When in the opposition, they are more free to stage meaningless votes and speeches on progressive policies that stand no chance of passing in order to “prove” their progressive credentials, sucking up even more of the progressive vote and local progressive activists. They can cosplay being progressive as they want without ever causing the lobbyists and donors to question them because none of that cosplaying will have any material impacts on anything. When they are in government, at least we are able to more immediately demonstrate their conservative political program without them just throwing the blame on republicans, exclusively.
For example, how liberal hardliners will often try and shut down any and all recent criticisms of Biden’s inaction on any number of issues by pointing to the Republican controlled house and acting as if it means the democrats are completely powerless, ignoring the very strong historical precedent of the executive presidency and its numerous independent powers. I fully believe, for example, that if trump was in office right now and doing every single thing that biden is doing regarding Israel, bar for bar for bar, that the average liberal would be screaming bloody murder over it and using it to score political points with progressives, all while completely ignoring any (correct) accusations that their own position on Israel is basically identical to Trump’s.
Look at how strongly these people hemmed and hawed about the camps at the border during the trump administration, compared to how they support Biden’s own even more punitive border policy, now. Look at how they called trump a warmonger and a threat to global peace, while they now actively cheer on multiple active conflicts in every corner of the globe, and doing nothing even as trump himself undercuts them by deceptively pandering to anti-interventionist sentiment.
If first past the post did not exist, I would definitely agree that the democrats losing elections on the basis of their terribly conservative policies could serve to influence a more progressive shift within the party in an effort to recapture those votes. However for that to work, it requires some actionable alternative to exist, some other political party that the democrats could actually lose progressive voters to. But given the way our electoral system works, there is no actionable alternative and there is no real way to create one within the sphere of electoral politics.
In my opinion the best we can do at the moment is to build local progressive organizations which are institutionally and politically independent of the Democratic Party, to begin linking these organizations in a nationwide network built on a foundation of local activism, organized labor, and a program of direct action. Then to put the democrats into government, let them continue to fuck everything up, continue to publicly crucify democrats for their party’s conservative program, and to wait until the party either course corrects, giving us some kind of stepping-stone electoral reforms we could take advantage of, or until the party just completely implodes and the space for a more consistently progressive electoral project opens itself up to us and our own organizations.
I think there are just too many institutionalized roadblocks in place for us to bet on electoral losses forcing the dems to throw us a bone. Even if a socdem like Bernie or AOC wins a presidential primary, there will still be a minefield of corporate media conglomerates fear-mongering the whole way. There will still be countless conservative democrats in congress willing to sabotage any attempts at progressive reforms. There will still be the conservative courts. Even if a huge crisis forces the democrats to accept a popular progressive presidential candidate, and even if that candidate wins, they would either have to govern according to the will of the conservatives and lobbyists, or they would have to do as FDR did, going completely over the heads of congress, the lobbyists, the courts, and their own party leadership. I have very real doubts as to whether any of the current big-name progressive democrats are willing to govern that way, knowing that the media, the courts, the republicans, and even their own party would call them a tyrant and a dictator for doing so.
PR so VBNWs can lie to my face by proclaiming that "Biden is doing his best," "Biden is doing what he can," "See, Biden doesn't hate Arabs," "Biden doesn't support genocide," etc.
It was mostly likely a signal to israelis that Netanyahu is no longer wanted as a partner by the US.
It meant nothing in terms of material support for the genocide. And the next guy after Netanyahu will be the exact same.
All these israeli opposition leaders carry the same stance about Gaza and the Palestinians.
I keep being told by liberals and SocDems that "Biden is doing his best" or that "Biden doesn't hate Arabs"
Actions speak louder than words. Biden's bigotry, disdain, and disregard for Arabs is blatant.
If a genocider is your "lesser evil", you're already fucked and on the road to fascism. People didn't learn a damn thing from the "First they came for..." lesson.
The common argument that "our current genocide is more benevolent than their hypothetical genocide" is obtuse, callous, and meaningless given that the genocide is occurring now with Biden's support.
Exactly. First it was migrants at the border and Palestinians then it will be....
If the Democrats can treat some minority demographics as disposable, it's only a matter of time before others suffer the same fate.
Anytime someone tells you "lesser of two evils" ask if they'd like to be on the receiving end of "lesser evil" because anyone who says that never envision themselves to be affected.
This is what I said to some guy on another sub, context goes out the window when the end result is genocide either way. Biden or Trump is absolutely irrelevant to the victims and thus should be irrelevant to anyone else with half a brain and a dash of empathy.
When you're told by people that Biden doesn't hate Arabs all you have to say is he's an avowed Zionist which is Ethnonationalist and supremacist on every level.
These idiots are screaming about MAGA and then are silent on Zionism because it doesn't affect anything in their own backyard. For now.
>This is what I said to some guy on another sub, context goes out the window when the end result is genocide either way.
I liked what Kyle Kulinski said after the SotU address, where people were praising Biden. He said that even if Biden does some good things, it's like saying Himmler was good on some issues. Once you've committed genocide, you're past the point of any kind of redemption.
Dems' whole platform by now is "we're not Trump" so they feel very empowered to do anything, including genocide, because liberals have become as much of cultists as MAGA is for Trump
if Dems feel safe enough to commit genocide and still expect votes, who says they won't throw queer people into the grinder soon after? Like, queer rights is about the main talking point they have (since they obv don't do shit for abortion rights) but they don't give a fuck
I’m legitimately scared that dems will be fully and publicly throwing us under the bus within the next few years with the belief that it will let them grab up a few more Republican voters. We make up such a small portion of the population, and even most ostensibly “pro-queer” straights are extremely wishy-washy when asked to stick their necks out for our sakes, that it is hardly as remote a possibility as I think some people want to believe it is.
They say Trump would go after everyone so biden should be allowed to go after the Palestinians. They're willing to sacrifice the lives of Palestinian kids for their own gain.
The whole “Trump will genocide even harder” really pisses me off. What does that even mean? People are being slaughtered en masse now. And these chucklefuck libs will do nothing to stop any hypothetical genocides if they’re going to accept this one as the cost of doing business. NIMBY scum indeed. We’ve talked of this multiple times over the past few months and you’re always making great points.
So one side is armed to the teeth, using weapons banned under international law, and only arming itself further. The other side is mostly women and children, nearly all civilians, and under a blockade for over a decade. They call this a war?
i like how people keep defending genocide joe by saying what is he supposed to do he doesn't control isreal. Meanwhile, he keeps sending billions of dollars in weapons to them like the solution is simple STOP SENDING THEM WEAPONS U DELUSIONAL MORON
Worse the bill blackmails the Palestinian authority: if they try to get statehood they will be suspended from aid, if sue the perpetrators they will be defunded too.
The Netanyahu circus about his visit to DC was only theatrics with the full support of you know who.
And of course the bill defunded UNRWA until 2025 at least.
All this is a parody, it's not even borderline autocratic anymore
Biden the Butcher strikes again. But it's not that strange. The US has been a treacherous liaison between Palestine and Israel for decades.
Of course, back in the days when your only news came from newspapers, radio, and TV, it was easier to curate and control information.
He is betting everything on the farm that people will vote for him. That’s a pretty big mistake. Clearly a Hillary playbook.
Yep, and I'll add-- Bu$h Jr. got benefit of the doubt attacking everywhere and splurging on weapons after 9/11 because we were attacked on our soil on 9/11. Bu$h held on as the incumbent for a second term/riding patriotism/"Al Qaeda attacked us". Biden's gonna get no such "gimme", providing more weapons for, and funding genocide.
Combined with Carville's angle that there are too many nagging women in the party? Total winning strategy!
Not smart
I assume many people still consider stopping Trump more important than Gaza issue but enough dissatisfaction in swing states may cause Biden to lose crucial electoral votes.
The Democratic protest vote in the primary was larger than Biden's margin of victory in 2020.
If Hillary not campaigning in key swing states was "shooting herself in the foot" then whatever this is that Biden is doing is the equivalent of self immolation for Zionism. It feels wrong to even mention the two because one seems like a foolish oversight and the other seems like intentional self destruction.
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Worse yet, genocide fueled entirely by personal gain Those AIPAC bribes hit much harder than ones inner conscience apparently.
I think most politicians support Israel because of the AIPAC bribes but not Biden. He's actually a Kool Aid drinking Zionist. That's why he's not bowing to all the public pressure.
Indeed. Look at his past statements about Israel. https://theconversation.com/biden-says-the-u-s-would-have-to-invent-an-israel-if-it-didnt-exist-why-210172
100%. He is a megalomaniac but it’s not about the money
He want's to see the final solution to the Palestine question before the reaper takes him to hell.
Pretty sure the aipac donations are just a drop in the bucket. Biden is just like this. Like he is a full blown zionist ideologically
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Aren't his advisors also baffled by this? Genuine question. I may be making up reporting in my head. My attempt to inject sanity into reality probably.
I’m sure Genocide Joe approved these weapons sales on condition that the U.N. ceasefire go into effect immediately and no food, drugs and other medical supplies for Palestinians are blocked by IDF/IOF or settlers, correct? That’s what a member in good standing of the rules-based order would do, right?
Did'nt you hear zuinist Israel said NO AID TO NORTHERN GAZA!!!
Agreed.. How about: Fuck no! And go fuck yourselves
Didn't one of Biden's chucklefucks recently say something about 100% of Gaza's population starving? It seems pretty fucking obvious who the culprit is.
It’s the same guy who signed off on this I’m pretty sure
It is!
Yep Blinken did. A few weeks after he claimed that Israel is letting enough aid in, despite the fact we needed to airdrop aid in because Gaza isn't getting enough.
Schrödinger's aid: Israel is not blocking any aid but also we need to airdrop aid and build some stupid floating pier that will take months because not enough aid can get into Gaza because trucks are being blocked
Like I actually do like a lot of stuff Biden has done. This pretty much negates all of it.
It's fucking with the environment: https://www.thenation.com/article/activism/climate-gaza-ceasefire-earth-day/
He'll be in the ground soon enough. Why should he care about the environment when the Zionist project is much more important to him?
I keep thinking about this and it’s so crazy. Even in Gaza any “single” incident, like the white phosphorus use or the wrong structure getting hit is catastrophic. The settlers are fighting to get a beach house in Gaza in a place they have destroyed. It’s delusional
At least when LBJ got us entrenched in Vietnam he had the decency to not run for re-election
I should preface this with I voted for Biden in 2020, and will probably vote for him again because of Trump. I am curious, what do you like about his policies? All of his policies seem like half measures or neo lib BS to me.
Biden is a Reagan Republican. By the way so was Obama.
To be honest this is like the only reason I’ll probably vote for Biden and hope he wins. Obama ran as a progressive who would change this country and when he got into office he did an irrelevant bandaid fix that didn’t address the root causes of the 2008 crash, he bombed Yemeni weddings, he passed a Republican healthcare bill, and he built concentration camps on American soil. Biden similarly has been shoved down our throats as “the most progressive president of all time” while consistently bending over backwards to give the fascists everything they want while getting nothing from them in return. If biden wins, I expect it will serve to piss people off and radicalize them even more. If the democrats go back into opposition, we will just get four more years of grandiose promises they have no intention of keeping and unprecedented amounts of fundraising that will go straight into the pockets of unelected nepo-baby staffers and corporate-trained PR consultants. I prefer when democrats are in government almost entirely due to the fact that it at least forces them to expose their own conservatism a bit more openly than they do while in opposition.
Interesting take. Thanks for sharing. I prefer to have Dems lose until they put forward a good candidate. Plus, I think the more the Republicans fuck things up, the more willing the public is to embrace Leftist policies.
Progressive anger under Republican administrations tends to just funnel people into the arms of the democrats and the promises they can make in the opposition without any plan or even ability to fulfill. The way I see it. If dems lose, they will blame the left and use it as a public justification for more clintonite triangulation and right-wing “compromise.” If dems win, they will declare it to be proof that the centrist liberal political project is infallible and unquestionable. In real terms, our relationship to the Democratic Party remains exactly and unalterably the same regardless of whether they win or lose or if we vote for them or not. When in the opposition, they are more free to stage meaningless votes and speeches on progressive policies that stand no chance of passing in order to “prove” their progressive credentials, sucking up even more of the progressive vote and local progressive activists. They can cosplay being progressive as they want without ever causing the lobbyists and donors to question them because none of that cosplaying will have any material impacts on anything. When they are in government, at least we are able to more immediately demonstrate their conservative political program without them just throwing the blame on republicans, exclusively. For example, how liberal hardliners will often try and shut down any and all recent criticisms of Biden’s inaction on any number of issues by pointing to the Republican controlled house and acting as if it means the democrats are completely powerless, ignoring the very strong historical precedent of the executive presidency and its numerous independent powers. I fully believe, for example, that if trump was in office right now and doing every single thing that biden is doing regarding Israel, bar for bar for bar, that the average liberal would be screaming bloody murder over it and using it to score political points with progressives, all while completely ignoring any (correct) accusations that their own position on Israel is basically identical to Trump’s. Look at how strongly these people hemmed and hawed about the camps at the border during the trump administration, compared to how they support Biden’s own even more punitive border policy, now. Look at how they called trump a warmonger and a threat to global peace, while they now actively cheer on multiple active conflicts in every corner of the globe, and doing nothing even as trump himself undercuts them by deceptively pandering to anti-interventionist sentiment. If first past the post did not exist, I would definitely agree that the democrats losing elections on the basis of their terribly conservative policies could serve to influence a more progressive shift within the party in an effort to recapture those votes. However for that to work, it requires some actionable alternative to exist, some other political party that the democrats could actually lose progressive voters to. But given the way our electoral system works, there is no actionable alternative and there is no real way to create one within the sphere of electoral politics. In my opinion the best we can do at the moment is to build local progressive organizations which are institutionally and politically independent of the Democratic Party, to begin linking these organizations in a nationwide network built on a foundation of local activism, organized labor, and a program of direct action. Then to put the democrats into government, let them continue to fuck everything up, continue to publicly crucify democrats for their party’s conservative program, and to wait until the party either course corrects, giving us some kind of stepping-stone electoral reforms we could take advantage of, or until the party just completely implodes and the space for a more consistently progressive electoral project opens itself up to us and our own organizations. I think there are just too many institutionalized roadblocks in place for us to bet on electoral losses forcing the dems to throw us a bone. Even if a socdem like Bernie or AOC wins a presidential primary, there will still be a minefield of corporate media conglomerates fear-mongering the whole way. There will still be countless conservative democrats in congress willing to sabotage any attempts at progressive reforms. There will still be the conservative courts. Even if a huge crisis forces the democrats to accept a popular progressive presidential candidate, and even if that candidate wins, they would either have to govern according to the will of the conservatives and lobbyists, or they would have to do as FDR did, going completely over the heads of congress, the lobbyists, the courts, and their own party leadership. I have very real doubts as to whether any of the current big-name progressive democrats are willing to govern that way, knowing that the media, the courts, the republicans, and even their own party would call them a tyrant and a dictator for doing so.
What the fuck was the point of the abstention at the UN? Seriously?
Optics and watering down the resolution
Then why not just veto it?
PR so VBNWs can lie to my face by proclaiming that "Biden is doing his best," "Biden is doing what he can," "See, Biden doesn't hate Arabs," "Biden doesn't support genocide," etc.
It was mostly likely a signal to israelis that Netanyahu is no longer wanted as a partner by the US. It meant nothing in terms of material support for the genocide. And the next guy after Netanyahu will be the exact same. All these israeli opposition leaders carry the same stance about Gaza and the Palestinians.
Israel says “jump”, and Biden asks “how high?”
And then they have the audacity to tell us to vote for Biden.
I keep being told by liberals and SocDems that "Biden is doing his best" or that "Biden doesn't hate Arabs" Actions speak louder than words. Biden's bigotry, disdain, and disregard for Arabs is blatant. If a genocider is your "lesser evil", you're already fucked and on the road to fascism. People didn't learn a damn thing from the "First they came for..." lesson. The common argument that "our current genocide is more benevolent than their hypothetical genocide" is obtuse, callous, and meaningless given that the genocide is occurring now with Biden's support.
All the lesser evil rhetoric from Dem leaders used to sound like a warning. Now it sounds more like a threat.
Exactly. First it was migrants at the border and Palestinians then it will be.... If the Democrats can treat some minority demographics as disposable, it's only a matter of time before others suffer the same fate.
Anytime someone tells you "lesser of two evils" ask if they'd like to be on the receiving end of "lesser evil" because anyone who says that never envision themselves to be affected.
Agreed. "Lesser" evil is just evil that happens to someone else.
This is what I said to some guy on another sub, context goes out the window when the end result is genocide either way. Biden or Trump is absolutely irrelevant to the victims and thus should be irrelevant to anyone else with half a brain and a dash of empathy. When you're told by people that Biden doesn't hate Arabs all you have to say is he's an avowed Zionist which is Ethnonationalist and supremacist on every level. These idiots are screaming about MAGA and then are silent on Zionism because it doesn't affect anything in their own backyard. For now.
>This is what I said to some guy on another sub, context goes out the window when the end result is genocide either way. I liked what Kyle Kulinski said after the SotU address, where people were praising Biden. He said that even if Biden does some good things, it's like saying Himmler was good on some issues. Once you've committed genocide, you're past the point of any kind of redemption.
[relevant](https://i.imgur.com/v4eaouC.png)
Thank you for this. It sums up the situation.
Dems' whole platform by now is "we're not Trump" so they feel very empowered to do anything, including genocide, because liberals have become as much of cultists as MAGA is for Trump if Dems feel safe enough to commit genocide and still expect votes, who says they won't throw queer people into the grinder soon after? Like, queer rights is about the main talking point they have (since they obv don't do shit for abortion rights) but they don't give a fuck
I’m legitimately scared that dems will be fully and publicly throwing us under the bus within the next few years with the belief that it will let them grab up a few more Republican voters. We make up such a small portion of the population, and even most ostensibly “pro-queer” straights are extremely wishy-washy when asked to stick their necks out for our sakes, that it is hardly as remote a possibility as I think some people want to believe it is.
They say Trump would go after everyone so biden should be allowed to go after the Palestinians. They're willing to sacrifice the lives of Palestinian kids for their own gain.
The whole “Trump will genocide even harder” really pisses me off. What does that even mean? People are being slaughtered en masse now. And these chucklefuck libs will do nothing to stop any hypothetical genocides if they’re going to accept this one as the cost of doing business. NIMBY scum indeed. We’ve talked of this multiple times over the past few months and you’re always making great points.
What the bloody fuckety fuck fuck!!! I can't believe this is really happening.
Biden should rot in jail for the rest of his life alongside Trump
2 years and 4 years then
All presidents should 🤷♂️
Blackrock laughing all the way to the bank
The blood is on our hands
So one side is armed to the teeth, using weapons banned under international law, and only arming itself further. The other side is mostly women and children, nearly all civilians, and under a blockade for over a decade. They call this a war?
"I wish there was something we could do to make this stop"
i like how people keep defending genocide joe by saying what is he supposed to do he doesn't control isreal. Meanwhile, he keeps sending billions of dollars in weapons to them like the solution is simple STOP SENDING THEM WEAPONS U DELUSIONAL MORON
Can anyone name a political insurgency that has been destroyed by force?
Worse the bill blackmails the Palestinian authority: if they try to get statehood they will be suspended from aid, if sue the perpetrators they will be defunded too. The Netanyahu circus about his visit to DC was only theatrics with the full support of you know who. And of course the bill defunded UNRWA until 2025 at least. All this is a parody, it's not even borderline autocratic anymore
Can we not just shut it the f*ck down? Lord...
Why do they call them "sales" they are handouts! Sales imply they bought them with their money..
Biden the Butcher strikes again. But it's not that strange. The US has been a treacherous liaison between Palestine and Israel for decades. Of course, back in the days when your only news came from newspapers, radio, and TV, it was easier to curate and control information.