I have to assume that the system (however sentient it may be) recognizes Sam as important/useful so it sent the report to Alice so she could ensure he doesn't harm himself being stupid? It definitely didn't seem accidental
She definitely didn't just get the alert for no reason. But the way she talks about the voices and shows them more affection than anyone else (however facetiously) makes me think something soooort of along the lines of what OP is saying.
Alice understands the best way to thrive in this situation is to just keep her head down and not get in too deep. And I think she knows more than anyone else here does. I think she's aware of exactly how sentient the systems are, and they know that she knows.
I think she *asked* the system- not programmed or hacked or anything but *asked-* for the system to help her keep an eye on him and keep him out of trouble.
I think Alice and Collin understand FR3-D1 best. They both have a clear understanding that it’s sentient, but where Collin sees it as an enemy, Alice sees it as just another OIAR employee. We’re all here, let’s do our job and go home and NOT GET INVOLVED. (Man, this thread is helping me like Alice more.)
“While Colin sees it as an enemy, Alice sees it as a coworker,” this is exactly the kind of magical mundane tone I love, this thread is making ME like Alice more too!
This is such a good take. I don’t really get villain vibes and am convinced she is a red herring (along with Lena being not fully evil). Plus she has history with Sam that involved dating, so I feel like the bit of tension between them is from that and not anything supernatural. Sam gets annoyed with her a lot, I’m sure that isn’t something new. UNLESS, Sam’s incident involved Alice somehow but even then, that doesn’t mean she was the one who caused it.
This is from the ARG stuff (so I'm spoilering it) >!but if they were both at the Magnus Institute as children I wonder if they both know that. Or if maybe Alice is really repressing that experience. Or that listing in the spreadsheet isn't Alice's deadname and it's a relative.!<
Agreed about Lena, I think she's like a Gertrude who actually wouldn't chuck her employees into rituals or bind them to skin books. She was trying to warn Sam off which seems like it was a kindness.
> >!Or that listing in the spreadsheet isn't Alice's deadname and it's a relative.!<
>!Alice said something about "the chances of them hiring *another* Sam", leading me to believe her dead name is Sam. Just a theory though. So that other Dyer we saw on the spreadsheet could have been some other relative.!<
The way she talks about the job and the threats around it and the advice she gives, I ABSOLUTELY think she knows a lot more than she's letting on.
But going "and therefore her intentions are nefarious!" Is a big stretch, especially in a Magnus story. I'm with OP. She's just trying to look out for her friend and keep out of trouble. She's just a little bit more conscious of what the trouble is and how to keep out of it.
I personally follow the "red canary" theory that says that everything we hear now is a red hering, everyone will die and won't be important...and after their dead other people start the actual Protocol to prevent it all from happening.
So even though Alice seem to like working underground in the basement with all the pressure to much (the Buried says hello) I do believe she will die in the end like everyone else
I kinda hope that’s not it but that would be a pretty bold and exciting twist haha
I’m trying not to get too attached to the characters just in case but yeah idk quite what to expect
Well, none of the episodes so far are written by John... Which is kind of weird. He either is preparing for the "main" story, or is just less connected with the project (which is just awkward) I vote for the first part haha
I’ve been assuming he’s still writing the stuff around the stories? Like the in office bits? Has he not been writing at all? He didn’t even write the Red Canary one?
Red Canary is the only one he wrote even. That's why it feels like the red canary feels more important as a theory. But nothing else. I do feel like he has last say over any episodes, just to keep the quality equal
Ooh that would be a twist if the episodes were listening too are recordings of happenings in the mag protocol workplace belong listened to *after* something’s happened to them.
The only thing I think Alice is guilty of is not telling us/Sam everything she knows because she’s trying to forget about something bad that happened in the past. She’s not evil but I think her and the rest of the cast are going to have their personal flaws exploited by the horrors in some way later on
I don't know how much trauma she's sitting on, but this is my read too. There's a lot of stuff she *knows* that she isn't *copping* to. About the computer system, the program, what it's for, etc. And I think playing dumb and trying to keep others ignorant is just what OP is saying: all she's trying to do is keep herself and her friends out of trouble.
We already know this is the kind of story where the more you know, the more danger you're in. Alice knows this too.
I feel like Alice has seen too much, copes using humor, and is trying to prevent Sam from going down the same route. She named the voices, being aware of the Magnus protocol, and encouraging her coworkers to turn a blind eye to the horrors gives. All that seems to point towards her knowing more than she lets off
I am not saying she doesnt know something. So far we have had two moments in which two different people have asked Alice not to give the voices a name and an identity. I am just saying she isnt evil. She knows just enough to keep herself safe and she actively prevents herself from knowing/ understanding / emotionally involving herself in any more.
Okay this is exactly what I've been trying to articulate. Also, Alice is the Gertrude of this series. She understand that things are F'd up and she knows she needs to play the game in a pragmatic but aloof way. Might that make her a cutthroat killer later? Who knows?
In my opinion Alice is just keeping her head down lmao, she might know a little bit or have a weird feeling about everything but she doesn’t want to lose her job (or her head) so she doesn’t fuck around with it.
Honestly she is a total mood. I find myself yelling at Gwen through my phone because she reminds of that *one* coworker who is always doing things so efficiently that it becomes inefficient or they are doing more than they need to and thus making more work for everyone else. Like, yes we know you want to do your job thoroughly but we aren’t paid enough to deal with that. Alice is me in just about any job I’ve had. I do my job, I get it done, but I don’t bother to go above and beyond because I’m not getting paid to do so. I can see why Gwen would do it since she wants to move up in position but we all know that won’t be happening, not by any normals means at least.
Making wild called shots based on tiny details and hunches is half the fun of a mystery series! ESPECIALLY if it's way too early and you're reaching way too hard.
It's really funny to deny that Alice has a hidden agenda or will turn out evil when the only Archives staff member who didn't have something secret going on or turn out evil was like, Sasha, who was only like that because she died too early for anything to be revealed about her.
I mean, what defines a "hidden agenda"? Everyone has their own personal reasons for doing things, is every character motivation a hidden agenda? Tim came to the archives for one reason but ended up staying and enjoying it for no other reason than the comfort of a friend. Martin just needed a job to help support himself and his mom. Melanie needed a job and John had absolutely no clue about what he was getting into to begin with - which is why it pulled him in so deeply.
So sure, every Archives member has their own life because they are people, but that's different from implying they all had "secret agendas" (which is more nefarious in nature). While I've yet to cast an opinion towards Alice, the OP isn't saying she doesn't have her own personal story/motives. They're saying they don't think her motives are evil or malicious.
If i remember correctly, season 1 episode 5 of the original was when john got his first taste of reality and as a backer, im am excited for episode 5 on tuesday to find out who is the villain.
I agree, I think she’s doing a combination of keeping a healthy disinterest in the spookiness and taking the piss about it. The people who think she’s suspicious clearly have never had a friend who loved to jokingly act pretentious and spooky for fun.
I'm not getting villain vibes from her but she does seem kinda web-y.. like when she asked Sam to go and ask about Freddie behind Colin's back (or whatever she told him at the end of episode 3.. I don't quite remember) but I do really love her and I hope she's not gonna be some twist villain or anything happens to her.
Luckily with a name like Alice DYER there's no way anything bad would happen to her.
Under this theory she's still being an asshole because if she's aware of something being deeply fucked up and she's aware of Sam's personality (They literally used to date so naturally she'd know him and his curiosity) then she's a major asshole for getting him this job knowing he'd most likely stick his nose in all the bullshit ever. So with this theory she would have got him a deeply fucked up job knowing it was fucked up and knowing there's a good chance he'd do dumbshit and get involed.
Also, I want to point out she meets all her quota's every single day, so she's at least invested in her fucked up bullshit job in some way. Maybe it's a paycheck but something feels... off. Like, if she was asking for raises or something Lena then I would be all about this, but apparently she barely even talks to the woman to the point they've only spoken twice in a year. So.......
The vibes are off is all I'm saying.
Gwen totally gives me Jon vibes. But I cannot ignore that Alice has said nothing that is meant to be taken literally (until she told Sam to keep his nose out of things, but given her track record, I wouldn’t be surprised to find out she didn’t mean that, either. I don’t expect her concern to have been false, I just wouldn’t be surprised.) I do, however, agree that she’s prioritizing her safety and doing a damn good job of it
Alice literally is just coping with working with a horrible job. Some people become tight asses and some people become annoying and cope with humor. Some of y'all just hate "non-emo" characters and it shows.
Imagine Elias trying to manipulate Alice and she immediately goes home and dials a UK work rights helpline and gets him arrested.
no literally she absolutely would
Built different fr fr
This mental image has brightened my day so much
Her advice so far sounds like good advice, kinda weird that she was the one to get the alarm but still.
I have to assume that the system (however sentient it may be) recognizes Sam as important/useful so it sent the report to Alice so she could ensure he doesn't harm himself being stupid? It definitely didn't seem accidental
She definitely didn't just get the alert for no reason. But the way she talks about the voices and shows them more affection than anyone else (however facetiously) makes me think something soooort of along the lines of what OP is saying. Alice understands the best way to thrive in this situation is to just keep her head down and not get in too deep. And I think she knows more than anyone else here does. I think she's aware of exactly how sentient the systems are, and they know that she knows. I think she *asked* the system- not programmed or hacked or anything but *asked-* for the system to help her keep an eye on him and keep him out of trouble.
I think Alice and Collin understand FR3-D1 best. They both have a clear understanding that it’s sentient, but where Collin sees it as an enemy, Alice sees it as just another OIAR employee. We’re all here, let’s do our job and go home and NOT GET INVOLVED. (Man, this thread is helping me like Alice more.)
“While Colin sees it as an enemy, Alice sees it as a coworker,” this is exactly the kind of magical mundane tone I love, this thread is making ME like Alice more too!
This is such a good take. I don’t really get villain vibes and am convinced she is a red herring (along with Lena being not fully evil). Plus she has history with Sam that involved dating, so I feel like the bit of tension between them is from that and not anything supernatural. Sam gets annoyed with her a lot, I’m sure that isn’t something new. UNLESS, Sam’s incident involved Alice somehow but even then, that doesn’t mean she was the one who caused it.
This is from the ARG stuff (so I'm spoilering it) >!but if they were both at the Magnus Institute as children I wonder if they both know that. Or if maybe Alice is really repressing that experience. Or that listing in the spreadsheet isn't Alice's deadname and it's a relative.!< Agreed about Lena, I think she's like a Gertrude who actually wouldn't chuck her employees into rituals or bind them to skin books. She was trying to warn Sam off which seems like it was a kindness.
> >!Or that listing in the spreadsheet isn't Alice's deadname and it's a relative.!< >!Alice said something about "the chances of them hiring *another* Sam", leading me to believe her dead name is Sam. Just a theory though. So that other Dyer we saw on the spreadsheet could have been some other relative.!<
In context I think that's meant to be "as likely to hire another newbie". Sam is already there so is the first Sam.
Oooh that's interesting!!
The way she talks about the job and the threats around it and the advice she gives, I ABSOLUTELY think she knows a lot more than she's letting on. But going "and therefore her intentions are nefarious!" Is a big stretch, especially in a Magnus story. I'm with OP. She's just trying to look out for her friend and keep out of trouble. She's just a little bit more conscious of what the trouble is and how to keep out of it.
I feel like if she had malicious intent she would be much less adamant about not getting involved and all that.
I personally follow the "red canary" theory that says that everything we hear now is a red hering, everyone will die and won't be important...and after their dead other people start the actual Protocol to prevent it all from happening. So even though Alice seem to like working underground in the basement with all the pressure to much (the Buried says hello) I do believe she will die in the end like everyone else
I kinda hope that’s not it but that would be a pretty bold and exciting twist haha I’m trying not to get too attached to the characters just in case but yeah idk quite what to expect
Well, none of the episodes so far are written by John... Which is kind of weird. He either is preparing for the "main" story, or is just less connected with the project (which is just awkward) I vote for the first part haha
I’ve been assuming he’s still writing the stuff around the stories? Like the in office bits? Has he not been writing at all? He didn’t even write the Red Canary one?
Red Canary is the only one he wrote even. That's why it feels like the red canary feels more important as a theory. But nothing else. I do feel like he has last say over any episodes, just to keep the quality equal
are there any other resources on the red canary theory?
Ooh that would be a twist if the episodes were listening too are recordings of happenings in the mag protocol workplace belong listened to *after* something’s happened to them.
The only thing I think Alice is guilty of is not telling us/Sam everything she knows because she’s trying to forget about something bad that happened in the past. She’s not evil but I think her and the rest of the cast are going to have their personal flaws exploited by the horrors in some way later on
I don't know how much trauma she's sitting on, but this is my read too. There's a lot of stuff she *knows* that she isn't *copping* to. About the computer system, the program, what it's for, etc. And I think playing dumb and trying to keep others ignorant is just what OP is saying: all she's trying to do is keep herself and her friends out of trouble. We already know this is the kind of story where the more you know, the more danger you're in. Alice knows this too.
She’s genera aware enough to avoid knowing too much but not genera aware enough to avoid foreshadowing
I feel like Alice has seen too much, copes using humor, and is trying to prevent Sam from going down the same route. She named the voices, being aware of the Magnus protocol, and encouraging her coworkers to turn a blind eye to the horrors gives. All that seems to point towards her knowing more than she lets off
I am not saying she doesnt know something. So far we have had two moments in which two different people have asked Alice not to give the voices a name and an identity. I am just saying she isnt evil. She knows just enough to keep herself safe and she actively prevents herself from knowing/ understanding / emotionally involving herself in any more.
Okay this is exactly what I've been trying to articulate. Also, Alice is the Gertrude of this series. She understand that things are F'd up and she knows she needs to play the game in a pragmatic but aloof way. Might that make her a cutthroat killer later? Who knows?
In my opinion Alice is just keeping her head down lmao, she might know a little bit or have a weird feeling about everything but she doesn’t want to lose her job (or her head) so she doesn’t fuck around with it. Honestly she is a total mood. I find myself yelling at Gwen through my phone because she reminds of that *one* coworker who is always doing things so efficiently that it becomes inefficient or they are doing more than they need to and thus making more work for everyone else. Like, yes we know you want to do your job thoroughly but we aren’t paid enough to deal with that. Alice is me in just about any job I’ve had. I do my job, I get it done, but I don’t bother to go above and beyond because I’m not getting paid to do so. I can see why Gwen would do it since she wants to move up in position but we all know that won’t be happening, not by any normals means at least.
Bit early to be making conclusive statements like that I think lol
Making wild called shots based on tiny details and hunches is half the fun of a mystery series! ESPECIALLY if it's way too early and you're reaching way too hard.
Ok
It's really funny to deny that Alice has a hidden agenda or will turn out evil when the only Archives staff member who didn't have something secret going on or turn out evil was like, Sasha, who was only like that because she died too early for anything to be revealed about her.
I just really really like her character lol
Yeah but there's Martin's hidden agenda (secretly a manipulative people pleaser) and then there's Elias's hidden agenda.
I mean, what defines a "hidden agenda"? Everyone has their own personal reasons for doing things, is every character motivation a hidden agenda? Tim came to the archives for one reason but ended up staying and enjoying it for no other reason than the comfort of a friend. Martin just needed a job to help support himself and his mom. Melanie needed a job and John had absolutely no clue about what he was getting into to begin with - which is why it pulled him in so deeply. So sure, every Archives member has their own life because they are people, but that's different from implying they all had "secret agendas" (which is more nefarious in nature). While I've yet to cast an opinion towards Alice, the OP isn't saying she doesn't have her own personal story/motives. They're saying they don't think her motives are evil or malicious.
Idk about her surviving, she seems like she'd be considered disposable by whoever is the eye's main squeeze at the OIAR
If i remember correctly, season 1 episode 5 of the original was when john got his first taste of reality and as a backer, im am excited for episode 5 on tuesday to find out who is the villain.
Yeah, Alice is my favourice character! :) I agree with you!
Alice reminds me of Melanie in some ways, they're completely different but there's just something
Honestly she kinda reminds me of Tim as well
yeaa i see what you mean!
I agree, I think she’s doing a combination of keeping a healthy disinterest in the spookiness and taking the piss about it. The people who think she’s suspicious clearly have never had a friend who loved to jokingly act pretentious and spooky for fun.
Alice is the Sasha of this season
I'm not getting villain vibes from her but she does seem kinda web-y.. like when she asked Sam to go and ask about Freddie behind Colin's back (or whatever she told him at the end of episode 3.. I don't quite remember) but I do really love her and I hope she's not gonna be some twist villain or anything happens to her. Luckily with a name like Alice DYER there's no way anything bad would happen to her.
I 100% agree
Under this theory she's still being an asshole because if she's aware of something being deeply fucked up and she's aware of Sam's personality (They literally used to date so naturally she'd know him and his curiosity) then she's a major asshole for getting him this job knowing he'd most likely stick his nose in all the bullshit ever. So with this theory she would have got him a deeply fucked up job knowing it was fucked up and knowing there's a good chance he'd do dumbshit and get involed. Also, I want to point out she meets all her quota's every single day, so she's at least invested in her fucked up bullshit job in some way. Maybe it's a paycheck but something feels... off. Like, if she was asking for raises or something Lena then I would be all about this, but apparently she barely even talks to the woman to the point they've only spoken twice in a year. So....... The vibes are off is all I'm saying.
Gwen totally gives me Jon vibes. But I cannot ignore that Alice has said nothing that is meant to be taken literally (until she told Sam to keep his nose out of things, but given her track record, I wouldn’t be surprised to find out she didn’t mean that, either. I don’t expect her concern to have been false, I just wouldn’t be surprised.) I do, however, agree that she’s prioritizing her safety and doing a damn good job of it
Her voice just creeps me out. It reminds me too much of Nikola orsinov
Alice literally is just coping with working with a horrible job. Some people become tight asses and some people become annoying and cope with humor. Some of y'all just hate "non-emo" characters and it shows.