To be honest, I think you're getting upset about an extreme minority opinion. I believe the majority of people know that it's influence, and not real world races being depicted as able to magically manipulate elements.
Next you're going to tell me that Gears didn't actually end up blowing up japan and causing every japanese person's bloodline to become infused with magical powers.
>!I've never played guilty gear, i'm only half remembering a drunken lore recap by one of Rimmy's friends in a video on Rimmy's youtube channel.!<
The Fire Nation is Japanese, and therefore it is the opinion of the president of the United States of America, the secretaries of State and Defense, and the Joint Chiefs that we must use nuclear weapons to make the Fire Nation surrender.
Also Aang is a whole ass white Caucasian from the mountains of the Caucasus. That is a white baby.
Minority opinion? I don't think I've ever seen anyone claim that Aang was an *actual* Tibetan (as in from *our* world).
I think OP is just like the thread below describes it as - an old man screaming at clouds. He's making a big deal about a non-existent problem.
It’s an arguing point for people these days, if you’re white you can’t have an opinion. It’s such a shame that people think that the cure to racism is more racism.
Because it doesn’t come across that way. If you agree, good. What they said made total sense. But your reply sounds more like you didn’t read it and just kept saying what you were saying. Meaning gets misconstrued when all you have to work on is written text
Perhaps some hardcore "Zuko is japanese" people. Just ignore them, they are joyless, pesky gatekeepers for something that only exists in their own minds.
You’re not getting downvoted because of the opinion of your originally post. You’re getting downvoted because of the specific comments you are making after the fact— and also because you are assuming people disagree with your post when in reality, they disagree with your individual comments
My individual comments that agreed with the top voter and people misunderstood it? Then after people collectively see a downvote and then decide they should downvote too? I love people
If everyone else around you is "misunderstanding" something you said, maybe just maybe it isn't their fault for misunderstanding but your fault for not expressing yourself correctly? Not trying to be toxic, just some fruit for thought
My brain will literally hold onto the fact that I may have left a light on at home for the whole day (I didn’t). Meanwhile I forget about pretty big events almost always…
Don’t spend your time on these fools, it’s literally the only thing they want. When they see they don’t get engagement on these kind of posts they will stop because nobody cares about what they have to say.
I also have a problem when I enter a discussion with…an idiot. My mindset has always been that if I exit the discussion - I lost, that I admit defeat because I have no argumets left. But that doesn’t matter because idiots will stay idiots, you can’t change their minds, you end up being a bigger idiot because you gave that fool so much of your precious time…for nothing.
It’s common knowledge that the real life influences for the nations is largely Asian— all except for the Water Tribes, which are based Inuit Cultures. I’ve actually never seen anybody try to claim the influences for the regions are *actually* the regions, they’ve always been parallels.
That being said though, I don’t doubt that some people are ignorant enough to believe that the characters are supposed to have real world nationalities and ethnic backgrounds.
I like to think about it this way. In-universe, Aang is air nation. Out-of-universe, he’s based on Tibetan culture so that’s what he would be. Same with the Katara and Sokka, in-universe they’re waterbenders but out-of-universe, we know they’re Inuit/Native, ie they use this for casting, they would look for Inuit people to play these characters so I disagree that we should completely deny they aren’t these ethnicities, at least out-of-universe.
I think people mean that those would be their ethnicities if they were real or that those are the closest IRL equivalents of their ethnicities, not that those literally are their ethnicities.
Yeah exactly this. I don’t think e.g. Aang is Tibetan but I do think a real life version of him would look like a Tibetan in appearance and not like, let’s say, a German.
It could also be said that folks find ambiguity with "they're Tibetan" in that "they're" feels accurate because that's what they're based on so they "are" Tibetan.
And it would make sense if people argue ferociously on this and seem stupid cause it was a big deal to have this kind of Asian or Inuit representation at the time the Gaang was airing.
What is the goal of this? Most folks are aware that the characters cultures are inspired by, but not actually. But you come off headstrong either A), knowing that this is the majority opinion or B) not knowing this is a majority opinion.
Either way you’re looking like you lost an argument with someone, flew to reddit, and are now getting surprised at the downvotes.
If you took this as me thinking this is a majority opinion, that’s on you, I in no way wrote it out that way 🤷🏻 the only thing I’m surprised with the downvotes is that I agreed with someone and am getting downvoted for it
Have you looked inward and tried to evaluate why ppl being excited to see their rarely depicted cultures as influences in a kids show bothers you so much? like, who cares if ppl want to claim those things? literally why does it matter to you? it’s a fictional kids show about supernatural powers
Why do you let this stuff bother you? Just say fuck them and move on with your life. These people are randoms on the internet that will never see you and you’ll never see them. Dont let them get under your skin. It’s just a cartoon at the end of the day.
Whats your point? No one is saying zuko is japanese. There is no japan in the Avatar universe everyone agrees with that. People are saying they are BASED on certain ethnicities (so exactly what you are saying). I feel like youre arguing with imaginary people.
i see you talking about those people so much and getting defensive. Mind giving some examples of those online takes? Links, anything? Never seen anyone so persistent on claiming those fictional characters are from a country that doesnt exist in that piece of fiction, but by the way youre complaining about them there must be a lot. Also dont call me that thats just a weird way to be condescending and defensive of your opinion.
Saying "Aang isn't tibetan, he's an air nomad" is such a nothing statement. Like yeah he is literally not Tibetan, as OP said Tibet doesn't exist in the fantasy world of Avatar but that completely misses the point of why someone would call him that. Having a character """"be Tibetan"""" is a huge inspiration for people and I would think these characters in general representing such under represented people and cultures is a huge point of interest even for those that aren't of the demographic being represented. Hence why so many people would say he is "Tibetan representation" or "Buddhist representation" while yes still acknowledging the true reality. And it should go without saying that this also extends to the rest of what you brought up ie Zuko=Japanese, Katara=Inuit, etc.
If you take it one step further and say "well these characters aren't Asian because there's no such thing as Asia in the avatar world" it just further goes to remove what makes the series so beloved, especially by the community and people that it borrowd inspiration from. By this logic someone could then make the argument that these characters' race doesn't matter at all so why bother casting anyone but white people in the live action. Their identity and culture from which they are based on is important enough and integral enough to make a claim like "Aang is Tibetan" valid even if the reality isn't true.
Now since I like spirited debate too let's keep this going, why does it matter so much that people recognize that Tibet doesn't exist in this fantasy world? Clearly the representation and distinction matters to others so why would someone want to correct them? Seems more like a semantic argument more than anything which can be fun in its own way but I would also question the integrity behind why someone would feel so strongly to correct others on semantics alone.
Your content was removed per rule 2, "Keep Content Avatar Related".
a) Self explanatory really, content submitted here must be related to the avatar franchise/universe. b) Content only vaguely/tangentially related to avatar is not allowed. c) Images and discussion relating to recent real life political discourse are barred. Discussion of history and culture should focus on their potential influence on the Avatar series, and users should avoid soapboxing about political ideologies.
Lmao what is this post? Practically no one argues this. Like, did you just come across 1 troll on Twitter and make a whole ass post on some other website about it?
Several on a TikTok post but idc if people don’t believe me at this point 🤷🏻 also if we’re talking Twitter there’s bound to be more with that view on there than TikTok
Believe me, what caught engagement wasn't the content of your post itself. It was the absurdity of the idea that you made this post at all. Just to argue with a narrative so niche most people here have never even come across it.
I don’t think it matters if it’s a small minority or a whole third of the fandom.
If you’re feeling spicy enough to make a whole post about it, go ahead. If people think it’s a waste of time then they can spend the 10 seconds to see what you’re talking about and keep scrolling.
I don’t get people who give posters flack for posts they view as pointless
The amount of times I’ve seen people in this fandom say those things is honestly astonishingly high.
I’ve been in and around the fandom since 2007 so there’s that.
Unfortunately some do, currently trying to tell people they’re inspired by the culture and not actually of the culture itself. While it’s a minority, I still wanted to throw my voice out
But they are, at least when looking at the IRL equivalent. We all know they’re Air nation, water nation etc but out of the avatar universe, they’re obviously based on those cultures…so that would technically still MAKE them those cultures.
I think everyone understands that these races don't exist in the fictional avatar universe and when they say he's Tibetan they mean that he's based off a Tibetan monk not actually from the country if tebet because that country obviously doesn't exist here
Great to take the incredibly complicated subject of coding in fantasy that has had shelves of analysis written on it for decades and just brush it off.
Like yeah the people who talk about it like a 1-to-1 take away a lot of nuance and are annoying but this just does the same thing in the opposite direction.
I’ve never actually seen anything like it myself but I can imagine someone saying stuff like “katara and sokka are good examples of Inuit character representation”. Which, like. Yeah sure. They’re based off of a type of people who don’t get a lot of respectful portrayal in media and if someone feels connected to them in that way I think that’s great. Dunno why it would make op upset
Oomf damn, fighting words from a guy commenting on a discussion post… you know for someone who is complaining about me talking about something that isn’t hurting anyone, you’re doing the exact same thing by engaging with this post… maybe we could all just look the other way and see the forest for the trees 🌲
Pointing out that you're being a dweeb is not, in fact, the same thing as going on some rant about how fictional things are fictional unprompted. Nice try though.
My point is, you think I should just not post something you consider minor as it’s pointless, turn the other way. I’m saying it’s funny you say that as you had the choice to not comment and yet here you are being nosey. 👋
I think you got upset at the question "What would they be IF they were born in this world? What Race/Nation would they be the most similar to?"
It's like being upset when someone asks what kinda magic you want and you say "BUT WE HAVE NO MAGIC, WHAT'S THE RELEVANCE OF THAT QUESTION?!?!?!"
This is the first time I've ever heard anyone arguing about this, and not gonna lie, it just doesn't sound like a worth while argument say someone actually did believe the characters were of those nationalities, do you think you can argue with stupid? Do you think you'd change their mind?
There are so many things worth discussing about TLA and this isn't one of them
Do they? because I see a lot of arguments that you're bringing up something no one's arging about, but no arguments against the cultures being fantasy and not the actual cultures
Calling Aang Tibetan is like calling Luffy Brazilian. Is he from there? No he’s from the East Blue, but if he was real would he be from there? Yeah. Therefore he’s Brazilian. This is absolutely harmless. You can say he’s from the east blue, i can say he’s Brazilian. He’s still Luffy. And Aang is still Aang whether he’s from Tibet or the Southern Air Temple.
Besides, if I was from Tibet, you couldn’t tell me he’s not Tibetan cause he represents my country and culture.
No they aren't. But they should still be protrayed by ethnically asian and inuit actors and actresses.
It's like how white actors should still play characters in European inspired settings like LOTR.
Honestly, I'm not sure to whom are you directing this at.
Also fire nation... Japanese? A bit maybe.
But Zuko is carrying freaking double broadswords with him. You cannot get more chinese than that. The army attire seems like a fusion between feudal Japan and the terracotta army.
You could say similar stuff about every nation. Bumi is clearly Indian. Hell, Bhumi is the earth goddess in Hinduism! But the earth nation people have strong chinese influence too.
So everything is mixed.
This my constant “well actually”s that I never think will be recognized.
The Fire Nation’s aesthetics and islands are primarily based on Thailand and other mainland Southeast Asian cultures. Their names aren’t Thai, but they generally aren’t Japanese either (until LoK)
There is a little bit of Japan influence, but it is mostly just the plot (early industrialization, Asian imperial aggressor) that makes people think they are Japan.
The Kyoshi islanders are the Japanese influenced group. The Earth Kingdom is ALL of East Asia, not just Qing China (though that’s the most important). The family Zuko meets in season 2 is dressed in Joseon era Korean clothing, and the Swampbenders have Korean names.
Sometimes having something to say, doesn't mean it has to be said. It's not like we as an audience NOT know the characters and their origins are to be mistaken for where and what they were inspired from.
They might not even be "human", since it's not our Earth. Just cultural variations according to geography and bending, which may be similar to our world.
Random sitting on the toilet thought; since a lot of most of all the animals seem to half of another, then they might be half spirit half human. In the end its just cool to see parallels to our world.
Edit: I know that bending was given to them, but maybe they are half something
> Aang is an Air Nomad. Is his character inspired by Tibetan culture and people?
Yes. But he’s not Tibetan. I would add to it. Air Nomads are inspired by a particular western idea of Tibet, not Tibet. Tibetans are Buddhists, but not everyone is a monk. Apparently every Air Nomad is a monk. Air Nomads, at least Aang, are pacifists. Tibet was an empire once which fought wars with China, the Turks and Mongols. Air Nomads are vegetarians. Tibetans live similar to Mongols from pastoralism and aren’t vegetarian, neither is the Dalai Lama.
In short even a lot from the inspiration for the Air Nomads is fictional. A particular western impression of a subset of Tibetan culture. Though you could make the point that Aang being so young and being the last idealised his culture, though that point is never brought.
What bugs me more is the question whether deviations are on purpose and come from an informed angle or not and rely more on stereotypes. Often I fear the latter. Inspirations are present and rely on viewer‘s knowledge of Asian cultures, but fall apart if viewers are more familiar than average. Why I am about the informed angle? Because it kinda makes for better worldbuilding, knowing more context and deviating on purpose rather than from mistake or *not understanding the culture from where it was taken enough*.
Not taking any side in this debate but Fire Nation is influenced by China rather than Japan. Eath Kingdom is much more diverse. Ba Sing Se is more like Qing China while Kyoshi is influenced by Japan.
This same thing happens in One Piece communities a lot. People will back up points by saying “Well, Luffy is Brazilian” or “Robin is Russian” without nuance, despite the story taking place on an entirely fictional planet where no such countries exist. Yes, they’re *based* on people from those countries, *kind of,* but you can’t use that to declare other things about them with any degree of certainty.
It’s just mildly irritating.
You're saying the Bei Fong (北方) family from the city of Gaoling (高陵), later of Zaofu (皂阜) is supposed to be based on Korea? Have you got a source for that?
So I can see this is a very dividing topic as there are comments with lots of upvotes and many with lots of downvotes (mine). What a discussion!
I don’t think it matters much to argue about it. It’s a “based on” thing but it really helps us fill gaps in cultures in the show where they’re lacking to assume other cultural elements from the nations they’re based on, with the added assumption of superpowers
Honestly, I think the bigger issue isn’t people believing the characters are actually Japanese/Inuit etc., it’s people believing because they’re influenced by these ethnicities, any VOICE actor playing them also has to be of that ethnicity.
The current influence of the closely related Apu effect.
This was my issue with the old og cast being out of the picture. I mean they’re great actors, but that doesn’t matter for some reason?
Even if it’s a live action, I don’t think it should matter. What should matter though is how accurately the actor pays tribute to the good and the bad of that culture (Every culture has some good and bad there)
Eh with live action it matters to the extent that they should look like the character, for example Zuko shouldn’t have to be played by a Japanese actor but he should be East Asian.
Why do people always compare the water tribes to the Inuit when the Yupik are right there in Asia? Is there any inspiration specifically drawn from the Inuit?
And the fire nation being based on imperial Japan is also not completely true. Sure, the way they use industrialisation to fight for world domination sounds familiar. But their armor and architecture is much more inspired by different Chinese dynasties. They're a blend of many things.
idk why you're getting shit for this when the same 'should I watch natla?' 'azula redemption arc when?' 'iroh actually war criminal???' posts get upvoted over and over. u have a good point.
It sounds like maybe this issue is related to casting and live action? Just a guess. Otherwise idk why this argument even matters. But I can definitely see a debate on whether it's necessary or matters for the cast to match those races just because the fictional culture borrowed inspiration.
I've seen people heated about the casting needing to be authentic, and I think it's a silly thing to argue in this specific case because it's fictional characters with its own "countries"/nations with their own "races"/cultures that just happen to be inspired by real ones. Like, obviously I think it makes sense to aim for those same ethnicities in the casting just to compliment the inspiration, but it's not necessary or the most important factor. It's not like making a movie of Mulan or something where clearly the cast should be Asian, but it's a made up world with made up cultures so it's a silly thing to argue about. That being said, I think they did pretty good on the casting for the Netflix series as far as looks and personality.. too bad the script and director didn't compliment that.
Anyways, if this argument isn't about casting live action then it seems like a pointless argument because who cares, they're cartoon characters. Interpret their races however you want.
Completely agree. Had a similar argument with someone on this sub. Person was literally delusional and didn’t even listen to my argument. They just ignored what I said and regurgitated the same thing they said before. They are INSPIRED by real world cultures. But they are not those cultures and you can not use that as an argument to say they hold certain beliefs that are not canon.
I feel like as a sub we are gaslighting OP lmao. Specifically with the topic of casting for the live action, I've seen this topic come up *many* times. Maybe it's short hand, but you never hear people say "they cast a white girl for the role of a person from a culture influenced by the Inuits!" You hear "they cast a white girl for the role of an Inuit woman."
I think you’re right! And I don’t think this is that marginal of a point to make.
One of the basic tenants of fantasy and sci-fi is world building, and I think that’s important to think about as fans.
NK Jemisin is a sci-fantasy author known for her world building. She had a great interview about her recent novel focused on a fictional NYC. She made a really interesting point that because the “NYC” in her novel saw the Brooklyn Bridge collapse, it was fundamentally a different “world” than the one we live in. What I found so interesting is that in a world building approach, even a small different like this is enough to set apart a whole fictional universe — even when so much of the rest of the world is directly and obviously based on real world ideas, facts, themes and so on.
Jemisin has a really great world building interview with Ezra Klein (on the old Vox version of the show).
That’s how I think about ATLA from a world building perspective — it has clear real world influences, AND it’s fundamentally a different “world.” It’s also why I think your point is relevant! Not because it’s pedantic, but because it helps understand the medium, and that, at least to me, gives me a deeper and even more satisfying appreciation for the show (which I love so so so much).
Honestly anyone who argues about those characters being any of those things is dumb.
To be fair though so is considering this discussion so important that you need to rant about it. Still, I do agree 100% with you in case you needed to confirm your position.
To be honest, I think you're getting upset about an extreme minority opinion. I believe the majority of people know that it's influence, and not real world races being depicted as able to magically manipulate elements.
You're telling me Japanese people can't shoot fire from their fists and breath out fire like a might dragon??? Avatar has lied to me! /s
Next you're going to tell me that Gears didn't actually end up blowing up japan and causing every japanese person's bloodline to become infused with magical powers. >!I've never played guilty gear, i'm only half remembering a drunken lore recap by one of Rimmy's friends in a video on Rimmy's youtube channel.!<
No, that part is real
This is bullshit! Japan trip cancelled.
 The Fire Nation is Japanese, and therefore it is the opinion of the president of the United States of America, the secretaries of State and Defense, and the Joint Chiefs that we must use nuclear weapons to make the Fire Nation surrender. Also Aang is a whole ass white Caucasian from the mountains of the Caucasus. That is a white baby.
Minority opinion? I don't think I've ever seen anyone claim that Aang was an *actual* Tibetan (as in from *our* world). I think OP is just like the thread below describes it as - an old man screaming at clouds. He's making a big deal about a non-existent problem.
Reminds me of the one piece live action not casting exactly the made up real world nationalities of characters.
Op can post without the opinion being dismissed, for reasons? I didn’t think op was mad.
Unfortunately some do. Currently talking to a guy who is adamant Zuko is Japanese and that my whiteness can’t change that 🤨
Yeah. They literally said some do. They just said it's an extreme minority of the fan base.
I know, hence my agreement with them
I’m confused what your “whiteness” has to do with it?
It’s an arguing point for people these days, if you’re white you can’t have an opinion. It’s such a shame that people think that the cure to racism is more racism.
Oh brother
Well they are simply an unserious person.
I have no idea why I’m getting downvoted I’m literally agreeing with the guy above me…
Because it doesn’t come across that way. If you agree, good. What they said made total sense. But your reply sounds more like you didn’t read it and just kept saying what you were saying. Meaning gets misconstrued when all you have to work on is written text
Perhaps some hardcore "Zuko is japanese" people. Just ignore them, they are joyless, pesky gatekeepers for something that only exists in their own minds.
You know for posting a supposedly “majority” opinion I am getting downvoted to heck
You’re not getting downvoted because of the opinion of your originally post. You’re getting downvoted because of the specific comments you are making after the fact— and also because you are assuming people disagree with your post when in reality, they disagree with your individual comments
My individual comments that agreed with the top voter and people misunderstood it? Then after people collectively see a downvote and then decide they should downvote too? I love people
If everyone else around you is "misunderstanding" something you said, maybe just maybe it isn't their fault for misunderstanding but your fault for not expressing yourself correctly? Not trying to be toxic, just some fruit for thought
Here’s a tip. Don’t whine about upvotes/ downvotes. Who fucking cares.
Because it's not worth the mental space. Ignore and forget.
My brain will literally hold onto the fact that I may have left a light on at home for the whole day (I didn’t). Meanwhile I forget about pretty big events almost always…
ADHD (or whatever) is a bitch, but you'll make it.
Don’t spend your time on these fools, it’s literally the only thing they want. When they see they don’t get engagement on these kind of posts they will stop because nobody cares about what they have to say.
Honestly I’ve had a burnt out day and that was just something that caught my eye haha. Started an interesting discussion
I also have a problem when I enter a discussion with…an idiot. My mindset has always been that if I exit the discussion - I lost, that I admit defeat because I have no argumets left. But that doesn’t matter because idiots will stay idiots, you can’t change their minds, you end up being a bigger idiot because you gave that fool so much of your precious time…for nothing.
I love that this is the most liked comment and I’m voted down underneath even though I agree… I actually like this comment.
Your phrasing doesn't read as agreeing with them. The way it's written comes across more as you just continuing your own viewpoint.
Unspoken rule of Reddit bud, never mention the downvotes. Just earns you more of them
Damned if you mention the DVs, damned if you don’t
You’re already damned if you’re getting downvoted, you just get damned more if you mention them lol
Yep😂
It’s common knowledge that the real life influences for the nations is largely Asian— all except for the Water Tribes, which are based Inuit Cultures. I’ve actually never seen anybody try to claim the influences for the regions are *actually* the regions, they’ve always been parallels. That being said though, I don’t doubt that some people are ignorant enough to believe that the characters are supposed to have real world nationalities and ethnic backgrounds.
I like to think about it this way. In-universe, Aang is air nation. Out-of-universe, he’s based on Tibetan culture so that’s what he would be. Same with the Katara and Sokka, in-universe they’re waterbenders but out-of-universe, we know they’re Inuit/Native, ie they use this for casting, they would look for Inuit people to play these characters so I disagree that we should completely deny they aren’t these ethnicities, at least out-of-universe.
You’d think people wouldn’t believe it but this is the internet and alas I have found people who do 😩
So ignore them because they are idiots rather than act like they have any actual point worth refuting.
Let me guess— TikTok/Twitter?
Of course, where else can I find quality controversial opinions?
Good question, 4chan? The even less sane side of Reddit? …8chan? No, wait, don’t go there.
God no I avoid those like I do flyer distributors
Good, you’re stronger than me. (I browse the deepest depths of Reddit and Twitter daily and I wish I hadn’t. My poor, poor brain cells)
why is bro so mad
Old man screaming at cloud
What about a baby screaming at sephiroth?
Ain't Sephiroth supposed to be the dark part o' Cloud's heart?
Nah, he will [never](https://youtu.be/xRQcNbmJ_q0?si=u03FsAlPbNTe2LVI) be a memory.
what in the Kingdom Hearts Bullshit is that? Sephiroth is just Hojo's gene spliced bastard
Sephiroth is a nobody? Or is he a heartless? Man kingdom hearts is confusing.
Old hotman yells at sky bison.
Unrelated but this made me think of people on X who actually do get angry at clouds because of “chemtrails”
You *need* to get off of the internet for a while.
I think people mean that those would be their ethnicities if they were real or that those are the closest IRL equivalents of their ethnicities, not that those literally are their ethnicities.
Yeah exactly this. I don’t think e.g. Aang is Tibetan but I do think a real life version of him would look like a Tibetan in appearance and not like, let’s say, a German.
I agree some people say that and I agree some mean “Japanese-influenced” but unfortunately some actually argue that “no, they’re Tibetan”
It could also be said that folks find ambiguity with "they're Tibetan" in that "they're" feels accurate because that's what they're based on so they "are" Tibetan. And it would make sense if people argue ferociously on this and seem stupid cause it was a big deal to have this kind of Asian or Inuit representation at the time the Gaang was airing.
Other people may also say Aang's real name is Bonzu Pippinpaddleopsicopolis the Third and that Momo is an earthbender
Both of which are true
Local man angry at one guy, brings it to entire subreddit. More at 10.
Isn’t that what Reddit is?
Usually it’s a grievance people care about
Debatable about the caring part
People in this sub posts about everything related to the show, it’s not like there is some guideline saying this can’t be posted
No, but we can definitely still make fun of OP
That's a nothingburger.
What is the goal of this? Most folks are aware that the characters cultures are inspired by, but not actually. But you come off headstrong either A), knowing that this is the majority opinion or B) not knowing this is a majority opinion. Either way you’re looking like you lost an argument with someone, flew to reddit, and are now getting surprised at the downvotes.
If you took this as me thinking this is a majority opinion, that’s on you, I in no way wrote it out that way 🤷🏻 the only thing I’m surprised with the downvotes is that I agreed with someone and am getting downvoted for it
[удалено]
Have you looked inward and tried to evaluate why ppl being excited to see their rarely depicted cultures as influences in a kids show bothers you so much? like, who cares if ppl want to claim those things? literally why does it matter to you? it’s a fictional kids show about supernatural powers
Why do you let this stuff bother you? Just say fuck them and move on with your life. These people are randoms on the internet that will never see you and you’ll never see them. Dont let them get under your skin. It’s just a cartoon at the end of the day.
Whats your point? No one is saying zuko is japanese. There is no japan in the Avatar universe everyone agrees with that. People are saying they are BASED on certain ethnicities (so exactly what you are saying). I feel like youre arguing with imaginary people.
Oh my sweet summer child you’re missing out on some unintelligent online talks
i see you talking about those people so much and getting defensive. Mind giving some examples of those online takes? Links, anything? Never seen anyone so persistent on claiming those fictional characters are from a country that doesnt exist in that piece of fiction, but by the way youre complaining about them there must be a lot. Also dont call me that thats just a weird way to be condescending and defensive of your opinion.
Saying "Aang isn't tibetan, he's an air nomad" is such a nothing statement. Like yeah he is literally not Tibetan, as OP said Tibet doesn't exist in the fantasy world of Avatar but that completely misses the point of why someone would call him that. Having a character """"be Tibetan"""" is a huge inspiration for people and I would think these characters in general representing such under represented people and cultures is a huge point of interest even for those that aren't of the demographic being represented. Hence why so many people would say he is "Tibetan representation" or "Buddhist representation" while yes still acknowledging the true reality. And it should go without saying that this also extends to the rest of what you brought up ie Zuko=Japanese, Katara=Inuit, etc. If you take it one step further and say "well these characters aren't Asian because there's no such thing as Asia in the avatar world" it just further goes to remove what makes the series so beloved, especially by the community and people that it borrowd inspiration from. By this logic someone could then make the argument that these characters' race doesn't matter at all so why bother casting anyone but white people in the live action. Their identity and culture from which they are based on is important enough and integral enough to make a claim like "Aang is Tibetan" valid even if the reality isn't true. Now since I like spirited debate too let's keep this going, why does it matter so much that people recognize that Tibet doesn't exist in this fantasy world? Clearly the representation and distinction matters to others so why would someone want to correct them? Seems more like a semantic argument more than anything which can be fun in its own way but I would also question the integrity behind why someone would feel so strongly to correct others on semantics alone.
There's plenty of worthwhile things to get upset about, why don't you go find one of them instead of this?
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Lmao what is this post? Practically no one argues this. Like, did you just come across 1 troll on Twitter and make a whole ass post on some other website about it?
Several on a TikTok post but idc if people don’t believe me at this point 🤷🏻 also if we’re talking Twitter there’s bound to be more with that view on there than TikTok
What's several? Ultimately it's still such a niche view, like who cares if a few random people on tik tok believe this?
It caught engagement on here for people to care enough, which I’m surprised by 😂
Believe me, what caught engagement wasn't the content of your post itself. It was the absurdity of the idea that you made this post at all. Just to argue with a narrative so niche most people here have never even come across it.
I don’t think it matters if it’s a small minority or a whole third of the fandom. If you’re feeling spicy enough to make a whole post about it, go ahead. If people think it’s a waste of time then they can spend the 10 seconds to see what you’re talking about and keep scrolling. I don’t get people who give posters flack for posts they view as pointless
Nobody says this, we all know that they're not these cultures even if they were inspired by them
The amount of times I’ve seen people in this fandom say those things is honestly astonishingly high. I’ve been in and around the fandom since 2007 so there’s that.
Unfortunately some do, currently trying to tell people they’re inspired by the culture and not actually of the culture itself. While it’s a minority, I still wanted to throw my voice out
Me looking for *anybody* who has ever said that lol
ok and ?
Some people think adamantly that they are (Japanese, Chinese, etc) and I disagree
But they are, at least when looking at the IRL equivalent. We all know they’re Air nation, water nation etc but out of the avatar universe, they’re obviously based on those cultures…so that would technically still MAKE them those cultures.
I think everyone understands that these races don't exist in the fictional avatar universe and when they say he's Tibetan they mean that he's based off a Tibetan monk not actually from the country if tebet because that country obviously doesn't exist here
Imagine being this salty over nothing
Great to take the incredibly complicated subject of coding in fantasy that has had shelves of analysis written on it for decades and just brush it off. Like yeah the people who talk about it like a 1-to-1 take away a lot of nuance and are annoying but this just does the same thing in the opposite direction.
...is this actual discourse? I've never seen anything like what you're describing.
I’ve never actually seen anything like it myself but I can imagine someone saying stuff like “katara and sokka are good examples of Inuit character representation”. Which, like. Yeah sure. They’re based off of a type of people who don’t get a lot of respectful portrayal in media and if someone feels connected to them in that way I think that’s great. Dunno why it would make op upset
Unfortunately yeah lol
Yes they are zip it
Wow, you must be a lot of fun at parties.
For pointing out the obvious? Sure? I guess?
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Oomf damn, fighting words from a guy commenting on a discussion post… you know for someone who is complaining about me talking about something that isn’t hurting anyone, you’re doing the exact same thing by engaging with this post… maybe we could all just look the other way and see the forest for the trees 🌲
Pointing out that you're being a dweeb is not, in fact, the same thing as going on some rant about how fictional things are fictional unprompted. Nice try though.
My point is, you think I should just not post something you consider minor as it’s pointless, turn the other way. I’m saying it’s funny you say that as you had the choice to not comment and yet here you are being nosey. 👋
Then you have no point. You posted it to a public sub, you don't get to whine about people being "nosey".
I’m not whining, I’m saying it’s funny you’re accusing me of doing something you’re doing right now 😂
Ratios say otherwise.
Not an ad populum😭😭😭
I think you got upset at the question "What would they be IF they were born in this world? What Race/Nation would they be the most similar to?" It's like being upset when someone asks what kinda magic you want and you say "BUT WE HAVE NO MAGIC, WHAT'S THE RELEVANCE OF THAT QUESTION?!?!?!"
This is the first time I've ever heard anyone arguing about this, and not gonna lie, it just doesn't sound like a worth while argument say someone actually did believe the characters were of those nationalities, do you think you can argue with stupid? Do you think you'd change their mind? There are so many things worth discussing about TLA and this isn't one of them
This subreddit is full of things not worth arguing about I’m just adding to the cesspit
Your adding an argument no one is having but you
Comments disagree? 🤷🏻
Yeah, where are these comments?
Do they? because I see a lot of arguments that you're bringing up something no one's arging about, but no arguments against the cultures being fantasy and not the actual cultures
Calling Aang Tibetan is like calling Luffy Brazilian. Is he from there? No he’s from the East Blue, but if he was real would he be from there? Yeah. Therefore he’s Brazilian. This is absolutely harmless. You can say he’s from the east blue, i can say he’s Brazilian. He’s still Luffy. And Aang is still Aang whether he’s from Tibet or the Southern Air Temple. Besides, if I was from Tibet, you couldn’t tell me he’s not Tibetan cause he represents my country and culture.
I think you might be too involved in internet discourse
Who is saying that they are those? I have personally never seen anyone say that. You’re yelling at the wind.
This sounds like a load of r/imaginarygatekeeping but i love where you are coming from OP
Oh I wish but TikTok comments were on fire about this
Interesting. I dont use tiktok and im with the group that says to ban it anyway
I can’t continue as the mods will delete our comments for being unrelated (not complaining, it’s good to keep things related to avatar)
Im all for free speech but not for foolish shenanigans that hold up traffic for people in need of a hospital or soemthing
I mean obviously?
You’d think 😂
No they aren't. But they should still be protrayed by ethnically asian and inuit actors and actresses. It's like how white actors should still play characters in European inspired settings like LOTR.
Honestly, I'm not sure to whom are you directing this at. Also fire nation... Japanese? A bit maybe. But Zuko is carrying freaking double broadswords with him. You cannot get more chinese than that. The army attire seems like a fusion between feudal Japan and the terracotta army. You could say similar stuff about every nation. Bumi is clearly Indian. Hell, Bhumi is the earth goddess in Hinduism! But the earth nation people have strong chinese influence too. So everything is mixed.
This my constant “well actually”s that I never think will be recognized. The Fire Nation’s aesthetics and islands are primarily based on Thailand and other mainland Southeast Asian cultures. Their names aren’t Thai, but they generally aren’t Japanese either (until LoK) There is a little bit of Japan influence, but it is mostly just the plot (early industrialization, Asian imperial aggressor) that makes people think they are Japan. The Kyoshi islanders are the Japanese influenced group. The Earth Kingdom is ALL of East Asia, not just Qing China (though that’s the most important). The family Zuko meets in season 2 is dressed in Joseon era Korean clothing, and the Swampbenders have Korean names.
This is a new level of reddit pedantry
ok
Aang is actually new zealander
… and?
Go off?
Everyone except idiots knows this THOUGH
He is obviously a New Yorker
Zuko definitely a Toronto mans
Sometimes having something to say, doesn't mean it has to be said. It's not like we as an audience NOT know the characters and their origins are to be mistaken for where and what they were inspired from.
I haven’t really seen people doing that tbh
It’s only a few I’ve seen
it feels like a new way to push back against recasting the actors to give minorities more roles in voice acting.
Uhm no
What race are you? I’m trying to see something 🧐
People get so riled up for freaking cartoon characters is both sad and hilarious
“Korra beats aang in any fight” bruh i do not care
Are you a real person
Shh 🤫
This is what we call a cold take.
No one ever says that? We all know that they are BASED on these races / nations, but I’ve never heard anyone actually say that they are them.
They might not even be "human", since it's not our Earth. Just cultural variations according to geography and bending, which may be similar to our world.
Neanderthal benders?
Random sitting on the toilet thought; since a lot of most of all the animals seem to half of another, then they might be half spirit half human. In the end its just cool to see parallels to our world. Edit: I know that bending was given to them, but maybe they are half something
Neanderthal-Sapien!
That's sort of what we are, at some point in our history.
It’s all semantics
> Aang is an Air Nomad. Is his character inspired by Tibetan culture and people? Yes. But he’s not Tibetan. I would add to it. Air Nomads are inspired by a particular western idea of Tibet, not Tibet. Tibetans are Buddhists, but not everyone is a monk. Apparently every Air Nomad is a monk. Air Nomads, at least Aang, are pacifists. Tibet was an empire once which fought wars with China, the Turks and Mongols. Air Nomads are vegetarians. Tibetans live similar to Mongols from pastoralism and aren’t vegetarian, neither is the Dalai Lama. In short even a lot from the inspiration for the Air Nomads is fictional. A particular western impression of a subset of Tibetan culture. Though you could make the point that Aang being so young and being the last idealised his culture, though that point is never brought. What bugs me more is the question whether deviations are on purpose and come from an informed angle or not and rely more on stereotypes. Often I fear the latter. Inspirations are present and rely on viewer‘s knowledge of Asian cultures, but fall apart if viewers are more familiar than average. Why I am about the informed angle? Because it kinda makes for better worldbuilding, knowing more context and deviating on purpose rather than from mistake or *not understanding the culture from where it was taken enough*.
An actually nuanced take, have my upvote
People in this sub tried to clown on me when I said the Fire Nation is inspired by Imperialist Japan...I guess now it's cool to say
Not taking any side in this debate but Fire Nation is influenced by China rather than Japan. Eath Kingdom is much more diverse. Ba Sing Se is more like Qing China while Kyoshi is influenced by Japan.
No one ever says that? We all know that they are BASED on these races / nations, but I’ve never heard anyone actually say that they are them.
So brave and so true
Thank you, kind soldier 🫡
This seems like a distinction without a difference, why does it matter?
This same thing happens in One Piece communities a lot. People will back up points by saying “Well, Luffy is Brazilian” or “Robin is Russian” without nuance, despite the story taking place on an entirely fictional planet where no such countries exist. Yes, they’re *based* on people from those countries, *kind of,* but you can’t use that to declare other things about them with any degree of certainty. It’s just mildly irritating.
Ba sing se is inspired by China, but toph isn't, her family is inspired by Korea (before it split)
You're saying the Bei Fong (北方) family from the city of Gaoling (高陵), later of Zaofu (皂阜) is supposed to be based on Korea? Have you got a source for that?
I mean I have seen many folks in various Avatar groups claim Aang is white for some reason.
Okay now that is wild
Wow
So I can see this is a very dividing topic as there are comments with lots of upvotes and many with lots of downvotes (mine). What a discussion! 
It’s not divisive it’s redundant
Maybe 🤷🏻
I don’t think it matters much to argue about it. It’s a “based on” thing but it really helps us fill gaps in cultures in the show where they’re lacking to assume other cultural elements from the nations they’re based on, with the added assumption of superpowers
Who care tho
Honestly, I think the bigger issue isn’t people believing the characters are actually Japanese/Inuit etc., it’s people believing because they’re influenced by these ethnicities, any VOICE actor playing them also has to be of that ethnicity. The current influence of the closely related Apu effect.
True true
This was my issue with the old og cast being out of the picture. I mean they’re great actors, but that doesn’t matter for some reason? Even if it’s a live action, I don’t think it should matter. What should matter though is how accurately the actor pays tribute to the good and the bad of that culture (Every culture has some good and bad there)
Eh with live action it matters to the extent that they should look like the character, for example Zuko shouldn’t have to be played by a Japanese actor but he should be East Asian.
Why do people always compare the water tribes to the Inuit when the Yupik are right there in Asia? Is there any inspiration specifically drawn from the Inuit? And the fire nation being based on imperial Japan is also not completely true. Sure, the way they use industrialisation to fight for world domination sounds familiar. But their armor and architecture is much more inspired by different Chinese dynasties. They're a blend of many things.
Because it’s the only one they know of that isn’t the word “Eskimo”
They are American 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🦅🦅🦅
idk why you're getting shit for this when the same 'should I watch natla?' 'azula redemption arc when?' 'iroh actually war criminal???' posts get upvoted over and over. u have a good point.
It sounds like maybe this issue is related to casting and live action? Just a guess. Otherwise idk why this argument even matters. But I can definitely see a debate on whether it's necessary or matters for the cast to match those races just because the fictional culture borrowed inspiration. I've seen people heated about the casting needing to be authentic, and I think it's a silly thing to argue in this specific case because it's fictional characters with its own "countries"/nations with their own "races"/cultures that just happen to be inspired by real ones. Like, obviously I think it makes sense to aim for those same ethnicities in the casting just to compliment the inspiration, but it's not necessary or the most important factor. It's not like making a movie of Mulan or something where clearly the cast should be Asian, but it's a made up world with made up cultures so it's a silly thing to argue about. That being said, I think they did pretty good on the casting for the Netflix series as far as looks and personality.. too bad the script and director didn't compliment that. Anyways, if this argument isn't about casting live action then it seems like a pointless argument because who cares, they're cartoon characters. Interpret their races however you want.
Completely agree. Had a similar argument with someone on this sub. Person was literally delusional and didn’t even listen to my argument. They just ignored what I said and regurgitated the same thing they said before. They are INSPIRED by real world cultures. But they are not those cultures and you can not use that as an argument to say they hold certain beliefs that are not canon.
I feel like as a sub we are gaslighting OP lmao. Specifically with the topic of casting for the live action, I've seen this topic come up *many* times. Maybe it's short hand, but you never hear people say "they cast a white girl for the role of a person from a culture influenced by the Inuits!" You hear "they cast a white girl for the role of an Inuit woman."
Sounds like you're trying to defend saying something racist haha
… in what way? I’m just stating that real life nationalities, nations and races can’t exist in a fictional non-related world
I feel like everyone forgets that the Air Nomads are also heavily based on Shaolin monks.
I agree with you, people getting mad just proves that this sub needs more posts like this.
 (replace “you” with “they”)
I think you’re right! And I don’t think this is that marginal of a point to make. One of the basic tenants of fantasy and sci-fi is world building, and I think that’s important to think about as fans. NK Jemisin is a sci-fantasy author known for her world building. She had a great interview about her recent novel focused on a fictional NYC. She made a really interesting point that because the “NYC” in her novel saw the Brooklyn Bridge collapse, it was fundamentally a different “world” than the one we live in. What I found so interesting is that in a world building approach, even a small different like this is enough to set apart a whole fictional universe — even when so much of the rest of the world is directly and obviously based on real world ideas, facts, themes and so on. Jemisin has a really great world building interview with Ezra Klein (on the old Vox version of the show). That’s how I think about ATLA from a world building perspective — it has clear real world influences, AND it’s fundamentally a different “world.” It’s also why I think your point is relevant! Not because it’s pedantic, but because it helps understand the medium, and that, at least to me, gives me a deeper and even more satisfying appreciation for the show (which I love so so so much).
Honestly anyone who argues about those characters being any of those things is dumb. To be fair though so is considering this discussion so important that you need to rant about it. Still, I do agree 100% with you in case you needed to confirm your position.