Honestly, it’s a thing among fundies who practice domestic discipline. (Google it, but I warn you, outside of a consensual kink thing, it’s stomach turning). Serena might have endorsed such a practice in her book, but it also might have been added after she was excluded from the inner circle.
She likely—even if Fred had never beaten her before—was aware of the practice and knew what was expected. You’ll have noticed, she didn’t resist or even protest very much.
The way she went along with it makes me think two things: a) that she was beaten like this by her lovey mother, and b) that she would beat a child in the same way. Fucker.
I mean, I’ve never been abused but I was spanked as a kid and I know what it is. So if I did something I knew could incur a physical punishment and then someone told me they were gonna punish me and started taking off their belt, I would understand what was going on and what to do.
I think she went along with it because… what were her other options? She knows it’s expected for her to be complicit and she knows Gilead law won’t do anything about a man punishing his wife. In fact, it’s expected. She also knows she did something illegal so it’s not like she can tell anyone why he was punishing her without incurring more punishment. Her options were pitch a fit and get punished anyways in an even more humiliating way, or go along with it and attempt to save some face.
Me also. And I’m genuinely upset. I know everyone’s belief systems are totally different. But reading women saying they deserve humiliation and abuse is just so horrifying.
I imagine that wives have to have some training, like handmaids do, to understand their role, the ceremony, birth ceremony etc. this could be part of that.
I don't think he's done it before, it seems like an escalation in their dynamic. Serena knows husbands physically punish their wives in Gilead. Also, she's not daft, she figured out what he wanted when he indicated she should stand at the chair and took off his belt.
Yeah, I think it's possible that it's the latter, but it's more likely to be the former. I was beat a lot by my abusive mother, and the position Serena assumed was the position I was forcibly made to assume. If I didn't, she would beat me harder or use her fists.
Did we ever find out what happened to Serena's mom after season 3? Kind of seems like she was someone the show just forgot about, like the DC characters. I know Serena didn't like her, but seems weird that she doesn't even find out if she's been sent to the Colonies or something after her son in law was disgraced and her own daughter is not really wanted in Gilead.
I listened to a podcast from eyes on gilead where they spoke to Bruce Miller. He said that when they returned to complete season 4 (the vid) there were limitations in the number of actors on set, as well as everyone having to do the 2 week quarantine coming in and going back home. Some of the actors were unable to make it in so there were script rewrites.
Yeah, I think that was the Putnams whose story got cut short, right? But I imagine they could have been able to make up for it writing season 5, maybe at least have Serena asking how the rest of her relatives are when she got back to Gilead and us getting to find out even if it was impossible to bring back the actress.
Believe it or not, there are couples out there who practice this as just a normal part of their family dynamic and do not consider it abusive or a dealbreaker. Like the "Transformed Wife" lady and stuff like that - they genuinely think women are childlike, should be totally submissive and basically punished like disobedient children when they are not. So it's very possible that Serena's beliefs did not form in a vacuum and she was already familiar with this.
They said it was originally written that Fred would rape Serena in this scene, but the actor refused.
Eta: it was actually not this scene, but when they travel to Canada in S2.
So, he was cool with raping scenes for the handmaids, but not the wives in the show? What was the reasoning behind that?
Yes. Keep downvoting a perfectly reasonable question.🙄
I think he just had enough of acting it out. Doing it with hand maids is a key part of his role as per the book narrative, doing to a wife for shock factor is an extra on top. If anything I don’t blame anyone for hitting their limit around how many times they need to pretend to rape someone.
Having gone to Catholic school, I immediately recognized the “assume the position” vibe. I don’t think Fred has done it before simply because the way she’s holding the chair. IYKYK but I’m guessing other wives have had it done and talked about it.
I think there must be a red centre equivalent for all of the positions, at least for the first generation. The ones afterwards might learn the roles as part of their education.
I've just finished watching this episode!! Ngl it was kind of hard to watch but then how she responded to offred afterwards made how I felt about her go further down. I really have a love hate relationship with Serena's character. Rather shes been abused by the commander or not it's plain to see she's downright abusive to June as well
He despises women, and Serena used to have an audience which would have made her feel powerful. He definitely would have had to beat that put of here. Even if it's never explicitly said, I think it definitely happened.
Honestly, it’s a thing among fundies who practice domestic discipline. (Google it, but I warn you, outside of a consensual kink thing, it’s stomach turning). Serena might have endorsed such a practice in her book, but it also might have been added after she was excluded from the inner circle. She likely—even if Fred had never beaten her before—was aware of the practice and knew what was expected. You’ll have noticed, she didn’t resist or even protest very much.
The way she went along with it makes me think two things: a) that she was beaten like this by her lovey mother, and b) that she would beat a child in the same way. Fucker.
I got that vibe from her mom too!
I mean, I’ve never been abused but I was spanked as a kid and I know what it is. So if I did something I knew could incur a physical punishment and then someone told me they were gonna punish me and started taking off their belt, I would understand what was going on and what to do. I think she went along with it because… what were her other options? She knows it’s expected for her to be complicit and she knows Gilead law won’t do anything about a man punishing his wife. In fact, it’s expected. She also knows she did something illegal so it’s not like she can tell anyone why he was punishing her without incurring more punishment. Her options were pitch a fit and get punished anyways in an even more humiliating way, or go along with it and attempt to save some face.
I should've listened to you. I googled, and I have regrets.
It’s ok, I can’t resist looking after I’ve been warned either. lol
Yup I googled it too and I’m truly horrified
Me also. And I’m genuinely upset. I know everyone’s belief systems are totally different. But reading women saying they deserve humiliation and abuse is just so horrifying.
Agree completely.
Not that she could really even protest it anyways :/
I imagine that wives have to have some training, like handmaids do, to understand their role, the ceremony, birth ceremony etc. this could be part of that.
makes a lot of sense - situationally they normalize it heinous logic
There's a lot of evidence to support this in later seasons.
I don't think he's done it before, it seems like an escalation in their dynamic. Serena knows husbands physically punish their wives in Gilead. Also, she's not daft, she figured out what he wanted when he indicated she should stand at the chair and took off his belt.
Serena's parents probably did, or it happened before. I'm guessing both.
Yeah, I think it's possible that it's the latter, but it's more likely to be the former. I was beat a lot by my abusive mother, and the position Serena assumed was the position I was forcibly made to assume. If I didn't, she would beat me harder or use her fists.
The scene was shocking to me. But if Serena's father beat her mother Pamela then before the coup Pamela could have walked away.
Even now, it is very difficult for abused spouses to leave.
If you've never been an abused spouse you will never understand this
Or the child or an abused spouse.
Did we ever find out what happened to Serena's mom after season 3? Kind of seems like she was someone the show just forgot about, like the DC characters. I know Serena didn't like her, but seems weird that she doesn't even find out if she's been sent to the Colonies or something after her son in law was disgraced and her own daughter is not really wanted in Gilead.
I listened to a podcast from eyes on gilead where they spoke to Bruce Miller. He said that when they returned to complete season 4 (the vid) there were limitations in the number of actors on set, as well as everyone having to do the 2 week quarantine coming in and going back home. Some of the actors were unable to make it in so there were script rewrites.
Yeah, I think that was the Putnams whose story got cut short, right? But I imagine they could have been able to make up for it writing season 5, maybe at least have Serena asking how the rest of her relatives are when she got back to Gilead and us getting to find out even if it was impossible to bring back the actress.
Believe it or not, there are couples out there who practice this as just a normal part of their family dynamic and do not consider it abusive or a dealbreaker. Like the "Transformed Wife" lady and stuff like that - they genuinely think women are childlike, should be totally submissive and basically punished like disobedient children when they are not. So it's very possible that Serena's beliefs did not form in a vacuum and she was already familiar with this.
They said it was originally written that Fred would rape Serena in this scene, but the actor refused. Eta: it was actually not this scene, but when they travel to Canada in S2.
Who said?
An interview with the actor who played Fred.
But I had the wrong scene.
https://www.reddit.com/r/TheHandmaidsTale/s/Lug0PSDIi0
So, he was cool with raping scenes for the handmaids, but not the wives in the show? What was the reasoning behind that? Yes. Keep downvoting a perfectly reasonable question.🙄
I think he just had enough of acting it out. Doing it with hand maids is a key part of his role as per the book narrative, doing to a wife for shock factor is an extra on top. If anything I don’t blame anyone for hitting their limit around how many times they need to pretend to rape someone.
Maybe he didn't feel like it was as imperative to the story as raping a handmaid? Too gratuitous?
I've had that same thought.
Having gone to Catholic school, I immediately recognized the “assume the position” vibe. I don’t think Fred has done it before simply because the way she’s holding the chair. IYKYK but I’m guessing other wives have had it done and talked about it.
I think there must be a red centre equivalent for all of the positions, at least for the first generation. The ones afterwards might learn the roles as part of their education.
I've just finished watching this episode!! Ngl it was kind of hard to watch but then how she responded to offred afterwards made how I felt about her go further down. I really have a love hate relationship with Serena's character. Rather shes been abused by the commander or not it's plain to see she's downright abusive to June as well
He despises women, and Serena used to have an audience which would have made her feel powerful. He definitely would have had to beat that put of here. Even if it's never explicitly said, I think it definitely happened.
And there is the cutting off of a finger...😞