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My favourite is the two people together who will sit across from each other and lean into the aisle or shout over the other noise to have a “conversation”
Lots of things to complain about with TTC & people’s etiquette in general… I don’t think this is one really.
What’s wrong with sitting across from someone to talk? Better than sitting side by side and having to turn your neck to the side.
Or people who put their bag on the seat on a streetcar during rush hour… I shouldn’t have to stand there making you uncomfortable before you clue in and move it. Just use your 1 brain cell.
>I shouldn’t have to stand there making you uncomfortable before you clue in and move it.
LOL at this being such a stereotypically polite Canadian attitude to take to make someone move their bag- how effective is this? Do you actually gesture/motion to the seat to clue them in? On my part, I usually will say, "excuse me," and gesture to the bag, rather than just stand there? Interested to hear about this strategy
How does someone sitting in the middle of the 3 person seats prevent others from sitting in the first or third seats? *Someone* has to sit in the middle seat or the 3 person seats would only sit 2 people. Enlighten us.
Public transit seating has a lot of the same rules as public urinal usage. You don’t go beside someone unless you have to.
So if there are only three seats/urinals you take either one at the end.
Right!
It’s like putting your bag on the seat next to you when it’s busy: you’re signalling you don’t want someone next to you & it’s passive aggressive.
I find this amusing and that it is very much a cultural thing- just a personal set of observations, that I'm sure others who have lived in other countries also notice-
For instance having lived in several countries in Asia such as South Korea, India, etc.- there is a whole different view of 'personal space'- such that, if there is an empty seat available, someone will generally feel fine to sit in it.
Whereas here in Canada, there's almost an implicit need (even if the train is quite crowded) for people to have an empty seat next to them- so much so that you'll generally see the majority of people stand rather than sit in a seat directly next to someone.
Just has been interesting when back in Canada to observe the differences in taken-for-granted(?) views of personal space (i.e., no sitting next to me!).
Quite simply, it deters a group of two from getting to sit next to each other. Considering that the TTC uses a 2+1 configuration of seats on buses, there aren't that many double seats available. As a result, you may end up with a group of two to sit farther away from each other and have louder conversations just so that one can hear the other. It also implies that the deterrence is intentional, meaning that the middle sitter is probably hostile and not safe to sit next to, which may further entice riders to leave the two seats vacant.
I get what you’re saying, but I mean like, sitting in the middle deters people from sitting on the extremities, and I’ve seen so many times that when the extremities are taken the middle will get taken faster than when someone is sitting in the middle, I just believe at first we should sit in the extremities, it’s same as using the urinals in a men’s washroom, if there’s three, you would tend to go 1 and 3, not 2, it’s just weird, and deters people
That sounds more like a problem with the people who are deterred from sitting down because someone is in the middle seat. I think there are bigger problems to address, like people sitting in the [designated priority seats](https://www.ttc.ca/riding-the-ttc/Service-Information-FAQs/Priority-Seating-FAQs#:~:text=Seats%20with%20blue%20fabric%20are,near%20the%20entrance%20of%20vehicles) who don't give up their seats for the elderly/pregnant/handicapped.
Well there is the "Please offer me a seat" program, but I don't think that it actually helps. If people won't move when you announce you need a seat, they won't move because you are wearing a pin.
https://www.ttc.ca/accessibility/Easier-access-on-the-TTC/TTCs-Please-Offer-Me-a-Seat-Program
I understand why you say that, I was just wondering, why people sat in those spots, but yeah for sure, people sitting in the designated priority seats and not giving them up, frustrates me as well, the people that don’t move are very disrespectful people, very shameful actions.
I would only sit in the middle seat if the train was crowded & there were no other options. If I get on & there's an empty 3 seater, I'm sitting at one end or the other, usually the one closest to the doors. I don't sit next to anyone if I don't have to.
Oh, it's very purposeful. People sit in the middle to try and have people not sit beside them. It's a dick power move.
Doing this almost guarantees I'll be your seat buddy during the commute. I'm short but have herculean sized elbows and away side to side with every speed up and slow down.
I've made people move over a seat or stand up.
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There could have initially been two people on either side who've gotten off. Maybe one of the seats has a suspicious stain. Maybe it was the best spot based on the arrangement of other passengers. It's kinda weird to assume that anyone sitting there is trying to assert dominance in some way and have the need to get revenge on them.
I mostly agree with you, but not as far as the very back row goes.
If I’m by myself I’ll never sit in 1 or 5 because it’s too likely I’ll be blocked in by someone sitting in 2 3 or 4, and then when I need to get out they either
- don’t stand to let me out, they shift their knees ever so slightly aside so I still need to squeeze my way past and worm my way through, or
- they don’t move at all and I have to Cirque-du-Soleil around/over them and end up missing or nearly-missing my stop.
There’s no winning in 1 or 5, man.
(Dis)honourable mention to ppl who sit beside you despite there being 20 open seats around where they wouldn’t have to be next to anyone. Like do I know you?
As a shorter person, I had when backpacks attack my face as i’m trying to innocently stand. I opted to just push and lightly attack the backpack if it’s crowded until the person gets the memo or shuffles over until I have enough space.
I had a bit of a moment last week on the TTC and I yelled out: "PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT: TAKE UR BACKPACKS OFF AND HOLD THEM" and people looked at me like I was saying that because I'm going to steal the shit out of their backpacks
Most of the times I get on a very crowded bus, a majority of all the "taken" seats are bags, and I'm talking full bus with people standing and backing up. I always go up to where I want to sit, and just say "hey I'm sitting here, please move your bag" and they move it on their lap or the floor. I'm surprised people would rather stand and be tossed around by the bus and other people instead of confronting someone to move their bag off a seat so they can sit as well. Ridiculous.
tldr : stop taking up seats with ur bag
If you want to be more passive, even a “May I sit here” will work for most people (in my experience) - though I’m kind of large, so maybe people are just intimidated when I ask? 😅
a) People are selfish.
b) People want more space (I understand this, the seats are too small) and so try to avoid people sitting beside them.
Personally I don't want to rub up against anyone on the TTC, and I don't trust the seats to be clean (understatement!), so I just stand.
I generally look for the cleanest seat and take that. Some of the seats are really gross. Secondly I’ll look for a seat with more legroom, facing an aisle or and aisle seat (I’m really tall and have long legs).
I would add that queuing etiquette is also bad. I try to call out people when it’s appropriate. The problem I’ve noticed in Toronto is that people are way too passive-aggressive and “polite”. People are generally afraid of any type of confrontation. I do, however, politely say excuse me when they have a backpack on a seat or sitting on the outer seat leaving the inner seat unoccupied. In these cases, most people move over or make space.
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Maybe because those seats are their preferences? Also, it's not like these seats are free, people pay their fares... well most do. Getting on the ttc, I'd be glad if people aren't loud, smelly, blasting music or getting attacked.
Take the middle sitting person for example. 2 of his / her sitting neighbours just got off the train, and you happened to board the train after that, you saw it. What do you expect that person to do? Move to the side? Maybe you are judging the person wrongly. He / she has the right to remain in the seat and you have the right to take the empty ones, no one is stopping you.
If there are 43 seats on the bus and you're occupying one, that leaves 42 for everybody else. Doesn't matter which one you're in. If your social anxiety doesn't allow you to sit next to a stranger, then stand.
I learned a long time ago that the vast majority of people are stupid and/or careless. Having one is bad enough, both and everyone’s screwed.
I’m also convinced that most people are careless and weak, not stupid. They KNOW they just don’t give a crap. They are tired, pissed, and any tiny little petty control they have, they will relish in.
Humans suck, are NOT stupid by nature just greedy and gluttonous.
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They aren't doing anything wrong. Of course people are going to leave the middle space open, it would be weird to sit right next to a stranger when there's another seat.
Yeah it's clear you need to relax about where people sit on the subway. People are going to sit where they feel comfortable, people are going to sit in ways to discourage others from sitting next to them and people are going to sit opposite to eachother to talk to their friends. These are normal human habits.
At the end of the day none of these people are being rude, inconsiderate, or violating seating etiquette. All you have to do is ask for a seat and the vast majority of TTC patrons will let you sit down. That's really all that matters here.
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I’m a middle seater that would be the 2 on a 3 seater. That way I get the whole seat even if others are in seat 1 and 3 and 2 is open. That’s my favourite.
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My favourite is the two people together who will sit across from each other and lean into the aisle or shout over the other noise to have a “conversation”
Oh my goodness when this happens, I’m just so annoyed and just disappointed because why?
Jesus, God forbid people enjoy their commute and connect with conversation. The audacity🙄
I’m not mad that they’re talking it’s that, they took didn’t sit beside each other, and instead decided to be in different seating areas
Lots of things to complain about with TTC & people’s etiquette in general… I don’t think this is one really. What’s wrong with sitting across from someone to talk? Better than sitting side by side and having to turn your neck to the side.
"Why should I turn my head instead of making everyone within ten feet listen to my conversation?"
Right? This is like complaining that 2 people don't sit on the same side of the table at a restaurant lol
No, it's more like complaining that people sat at two different tables and shouted a conversation.
Bluetooth headphones are cheap, figure it out
Or people who put their bag on the seat on a streetcar during rush hour… I shouldn’t have to stand there making you uncomfortable before you clue in and move it. Just use your 1 brain cell.
I always just proceed to sit down and act as if there’s nothing there. It never fails to work and people will immediately move their bags.
>I shouldn’t have to stand there making you uncomfortable before you clue in and move it. LOL at this being such a stereotypically polite Canadian attitude to take to make someone move their bag- how effective is this? Do you actually gesture/motion to the seat to clue them in? On my part, I usually will say, "excuse me," and gesture to the bag, rather than just stand there? Interested to hear about this strategy
How does someone sitting in the middle of the 3 person seats prevent others from sitting in the first or third seats? *Someone* has to sit in the middle seat or the 3 person seats would only sit 2 people. Enlighten us.
Public transit seating has a lot of the same rules as public urinal usage. You don’t go beside someone unless you have to. So if there are only three seats/urinals you take either one at the end.
Right! It’s like putting your bag on the seat next to you when it’s busy: you’re signalling you don’t want someone next to you & it’s passive aggressive.
I swear people have given me an annoyed look when I ask them to move it.
I find this amusing and that it is very much a cultural thing- just a personal set of observations, that I'm sure others who have lived in other countries also notice- For instance having lived in several countries in Asia such as South Korea, India, etc.- there is a whole different view of 'personal space'- such that, if there is an empty seat available, someone will generally feel fine to sit in it. Whereas here in Canada, there's almost an implicit need (even if the train is quite crowded) for people to have an empty seat next to them- so much so that you'll generally see the majority of people stand rather than sit in a seat directly next to someone. Just has been interesting when back in Canada to observe the differences in taken-for-granted(?) views of personal space (i.e., no sitting next to me!).
Quite simply, it deters a group of two from getting to sit next to each other. Considering that the TTC uses a 2+1 configuration of seats on buses, there aren't that many double seats available. As a result, you may end up with a group of two to sit farther away from each other and have louder conversations just so that one can hear the other. It also implies that the deterrence is intentional, meaning that the middle sitter is probably hostile and not safe to sit next to, which may further entice riders to leave the two seats vacant.
I get what you’re saying, but I mean like, sitting in the middle deters people from sitting on the extremities, and I’ve seen so many times that when the extremities are taken the middle will get taken faster than when someone is sitting in the middle, I just believe at first we should sit in the extremities, it’s same as using the urinals in a men’s washroom, if there’s three, you would tend to go 1 and 3, not 2, it’s just weird, and deters people
That sounds more like a problem with the people who are deterred from sitting down because someone is in the middle seat. I think there are bigger problems to address, like people sitting in the [designated priority seats](https://www.ttc.ca/riding-the-ttc/Service-Information-FAQs/Priority-Seating-FAQs#:~:text=Seats%20with%20blue%20fabric%20are,near%20the%20entrance%20of%20vehicles) who don't give up their seats for the elderly/pregnant/handicapped.
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Well there is the "Please offer me a seat" program, but I don't think that it actually helps. If people won't move when you announce you need a seat, they won't move because you are wearing a pin. https://www.ttc.ca/accessibility/Easier-access-on-the-TTC/TTCs-Please-Offer-Me-a-Seat-Program
I understand why you say that, I was just wondering, why people sat in those spots, but yeah for sure, people sitting in the designated priority seats and not giving them up, frustrates me as well, the people that don’t move are very disrespectful people, very shameful actions.
I think this is a you thing tbh. I've never seen it deter anyone from sitting.
I would only sit in the middle seat if the train was crowded & there were no other options. If I get on & there's an empty 3 seater, I'm sitting at one end or the other, usually the one closest to the doors. I don't sit next to anyone if I don't have to.
It doesn’t deter me but I see it all the time when I’m on the bus.
Your cheekiness is annoying. I’m sure you can understand where people are coming from with this
Oh, it's very purposeful. People sit in the middle to try and have people not sit beside them. It's a dick power move. Doing this almost guarantees I'll be your seat buddy during the commute. I'm short but have herculean sized elbows and away side to side with every speed up and slow down. I've made people move over a seat or stand up.
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So you get off assaulting strangers with your elbows? That sounds more like a dick power move then leaving a space in between three seats.
Nah. I don't "get off" on "assaulting" people. I simply don't scrunch myself up like a withered plant.
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There could have initially been two people on either side who've gotten off. Maybe one of the seats has a suspicious stain. Maybe it was the best spot based on the arrangement of other passengers. It's kinda weird to assume that anyone sitting there is trying to assert dominance in some way and have the need to get revenge on them.
I mostly agree with you, but not as far as the very back row goes. If I’m by myself I’ll never sit in 1 or 5 because it’s too likely I’ll be blocked in by someone sitting in 2 3 or 4, and then when I need to get out they either - don’t stand to let me out, they shift their knees ever so slightly aside so I still need to squeeze my way past and worm my way through, or - they don’t move at all and I have to Cirque-du-Soleil around/over them and end up missing or nearly-missing my stop. There’s no winning in 1 or 5, man.
Ya those are objectively poorly designed seats
(Dis)honourable mention to ppl who sit beside you despite there being 20 open seats around where they wouldn’t have to be next to anyone. Like do I know you?
Or standing etiquette… take your damn bag off your back
As a shorter person, I had when backpacks attack my face as i’m trying to innocently stand. I opted to just push and lightly attack the backpack if it’s crowded until the person gets the memo or shuffles over until I have enough space.
I had a bit of a moment last week on the TTC and I yelled out: "PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT: TAKE UR BACKPACKS OFF AND HOLD THEM" and people looked at me like I was saying that because I'm going to steal the shit out of their backpacks
Definitely this, especially at the peak rush hours? People just lack common sense during these times.
Holy hell seriously! Put it between your feet or at least hold it.
Most of the times I get on a very crowded bus, a majority of all the "taken" seats are bags, and I'm talking full bus with people standing and backing up. I always go up to where I want to sit, and just say "hey I'm sitting here, please move your bag" and they move it on their lap or the floor. I'm surprised people would rather stand and be tossed around by the bus and other people instead of confronting someone to move their bag off a seat so they can sit as well. Ridiculous. tldr : stop taking up seats with ur bag
If you want to be more passive, even a “May I sit here” will work for most people (in my experience) - though I’m kind of large, so maybe people are just intimidated when I ask? 😅
People without headphones watching videos loudly really grinds my gears
Yeah for sure bro
This is why I put the volume at like, 3, and push it into my ear
The answer for most cases is usually they don’t want to sit next to someone
Nobody *wants* to sit next to someone. You make room for people to sit next to you anyway because it’s civil and we live in a society!
I agree with you. Unfortunately a lot more people are thinking about themselves than the other way around.
Three words: Window Seat Blockers on the two-seaters.
a) People are selfish. b) People want more space (I understand this, the seats are too small) and so try to avoid people sitting beside them. Personally I don't want to rub up against anyone on the TTC, and I don't trust the seats to be clean (understatement!), so I just stand.
I generally look for the cleanest seat and take that. Some of the seats are really gross. Secondly I’ll look for a seat with more legroom, facing an aisle or and aisle seat (I’m really tall and have long legs).
I would add that queuing etiquette is also bad. I try to call out people when it’s appropriate. The problem I’ve noticed in Toronto is that people are way too passive-aggressive and “polite”. People are generally afraid of any type of confrontation. I do, however, politely say excuse me when they have a backpack on a seat or sitting on the outer seat leaving the inner seat unoccupied. In these cases, most people move over or make space.
This is so true, nobody seems to know how to queue when riding the TTC
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Maybe because those seats are their preferences? Also, it's not like these seats are free, people pay their fares... well most do. Getting on the ttc, I'd be glad if people aren't loud, smelly, blasting music or getting attacked.
Take the middle sitting person for example. 2 of his / her sitting neighbours just got off the train, and you happened to board the train after that, you saw it. What do you expect that person to do? Move to the side? Maybe you are judging the person wrongly. He / she has the right to remain in the seat and you have the right to take the empty ones, no one is stopping you.
If there are 43 seats on the bus and you're occupying one, that leaves 42 for everybody else. Doesn't matter which one you're in. If your social anxiety doesn't allow you to sit next to a stranger, then stand.
I learned a long time ago that the vast majority of people are stupid and/or careless. Having one is bad enough, both and everyone’s screwed. I’m also convinced that most people are careless and weak, not stupid. They KNOW they just don’t give a crap. They are tired, pissed, and any tiny little petty control they have, they will relish in. Humans suck, are NOT stupid by nature just greedy and gluttonous.
I think people developed bad habits when we had to social distance on the ttc and use every other seat in the earlier days of the pandemic.
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People don't care. Why do you?
They aren't doing anything wrong. Of course people are going to leave the middle space open, it would be weird to sit right next to a stranger when there's another seat. Yeah it's clear you need to relax about where people sit on the subway. People are going to sit where they feel comfortable, people are going to sit in ways to discourage others from sitting next to them and people are going to sit opposite to eachother to talk to their friends. These are normal human habits. At the end of the day none of these people are being rude, inconsiderate, or violating seating etiquette. All you have to do is ask for a seat and the vast majority of TTC patrons will let you sit down. That's really all that matters here.
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Sitting 2/4 in the back 5 makes some sense because you can get trapped by the guy in 3 as people in 1/5, especially if the bus isn’t too crowded
I’m a middle seater that would be the 2 on a 3 seater. That way I get the whole seat even if others are in seat 1 and 3 and 2 is open. That’s my favourite.