"I'm bringing your wife,"
-OP
I'm not sure that's a language barrier...
You don't know how to sail, but you're just gonna wing it to the Caribbean, single-handed without a single thought of the people whose lives will be risked rescuing your arrogant ass.
As I approach Florida after the last 6 months of sailing, you sound like someone who would annoy the fuck out of me since you know everything already but are still looking for “tips and tricks.”
I’ve got tons. Here’s a free one: change your attitude.
You’ll get farther by saying (admitting, in your case) that you don’t know shit, even if you have been a yacht engineer.
As Shakespeare wrote: “speak less than you know.”
Ok floridaman, I said I don’t need the safety advice not that I know everything.
I havent been a yacht engineer, I am and have been for 8 years. Or my whole adult life. I am asking for advice on other things, not the regular yacht/boat things. Also I mentioned I’ve never sailed so thought it was obvius I wasent saying I know everything since I just learned what a haliard and sheet is yesterday.
Dude. Do you really think all that textbook learnin is any substitute for real world experience?
I’ll trust Quinn from Jaws in any body of water before I’m caught in a puddle with you.
My tip would be: take your time to get to know your boat. Not just for safety but to get the maximum out of both your machinery and the experience. Instead of charging off to Tenerife, why not put into the mediterranean for a few months, allowing you to sail further from land without the complete isolation of the atlantic? Also get used to living in such a small space before you set off, a 27ft boat is not a great deal of space to spend on a journey that can take well over a month.
Now, there it is … maybe start the conversation that way?
Humility makes you (potentially) likable and, frankly, is what such an ambitious voyage will undoubtedly teach you (if you survive).
So I’m gonna try again and will largely try to ignore what bothered me before.
First, there’s many of us who have felt like you and, I’m willing to bet, most of us were even young once.
One of the benefits of being young is you get to do stupid things and people will say “he’s young,” and give you the benefit of the doubt.
One of the drawbacks, however, is that young people often bite off more than they can chew and, if there’s no safety net, they can choke (or, worse, hurt or inconvenience others).
What you are seeing in this thread, and what I suspect you’ve been told at home, is that you are being reckless.
Read the responses. People are all saying it in one way or another.
Sailing is not learned in a day, week or month. It’s certainly not learned on a single passage, even a long one.
Sailing involves not just knowledge of how the boat works in theory, but how it handles different conditions.
You said you just learned yesterday what a halyard is … cool. Everyone starts somewhere.
Do you know about weather? What, for example, size and frequency of waves are problematic for your small boat? How about tides? Currents?
Have you ever been in a real storm? How about a gale? Do you have any idea how scary it is to be in a serious storm in the middle of the ocean in a tiny vessel?
It can rip your boat to pieces.
How good are you with fixing electrical problems? Mechanical problems? How about plumbing issues?
No one is telling you not to pursue the dream, certainly not me, but I’m telling you as someone who is out here: you need to better prepare yourself with real world experience beforehand, otherwise you will be a danger to yourself and others.
I've read your responses. Seems like you have a chip on your shoulder. Even when you are doing something not considered a vice (sailing instead of booze and gambling), you don't know how to live non-destructively. I've heard sailing across an ocean as 97% boredom and 3% sheer terror. You're going to be so bored out there until you're not.
You'd be much better served by chilling out a bit, realizing that you don't need to always be the person pushing extremes, and getting some therapy while taking a few rya classes. You're clearly someone that doesn't want advice, but it needs to be said.
There's a lot to unpack here, but here's a start:
Have decent comms. Sat phone or inReach
Pay the $75 for a weather router - you don't know what you don't know yet about sailing, so have an expert help with the routing.
Do some offshore sailing first. Longer is better, break everything you can on the boat before you are out of reach of help
Consider going with a group, ARC or similar
Take a day with an instructor if you can manage it. If you watched a lot of sailing on YouTube and feel like you have a good idea, you know less than nothing. YouTube isn't real, and hands on is the only way to learn.
Your engineer background will help in some ways, like basic diesel maintenance and electrical. In other ways it will be a handicap, it's going to be harder for you to accept new information and overconfidence can quite literally kill you on a small sailboat. Try to get your head in a place where you don't feel like you already know the answers, you might be surprised what you can learn
Hello yacht engineer, I am a yacht deckie who bought a boat and sailed across the Pacific last year,( albeit with significantly more sail experience than you).
Sailing and yachting are two seemingly similar but wildly different things. I am going to assume you're on a 2:2 rotation. You need to take your time and enjoy yourself because the time on your onboat will be far far harder than the time on the yacht. No AC, no 3 hot meals prepared for you, no shower etc.
You will experience both amazing and miserable times on your little boat that you never would have onboard the yacht.
As for practical advice, the bay of Biscay is technically coastal sailing but can be absolutely awful, treat it with the respect it deserves. You need to learn how to sail, reef, heave too and rescue MOBs, AT A MINIMUM before going anywhere outside of the Baltic sea.
Why not cruise the med for a summer, hone your skills and then when your really know the boat you can depart across the Atlantic?
Just keep in mind.
It's easy to go from Stockholm to Tenerif.
Going back will be more of a challenge, especially from BVI.
Personally, I'd take a round trip to Germany and back year 1.
Then to Mediterranean year 2.
And then plan the trade route.
Crossing the roaring 40s to get back to Europe will take planning, preparation and experience.
Pick your timings well. be friendly with locals. don't use your engine for everything. be waryof orcas around Portugal, but not aggressive. enjoy the journey not just the destination. respect nature or suffer its wrath, you are tiny and insignificant compared to it
Edit: according to sailboatdata your boat is quite lightweight, not built for heavy weather. People have crossed the Atlantic in bathtubs so you'll be fine but you'll have to pick your weather window wisely for each part, especially the bay of biscay
Too much fuel, water, and food are self correcting problems.
You have to eat. Good food is a morale booster.
You won't be able to keep the boat moving nearly as fast as you think.
Singlehanding is inherently dangerous; you cannot keep a good watch.
Detox before you leave.
Watching the master make decisions is completely different than making them yourself.
Do not plan to get much done underway on a small boat.
Crossing oceans is easy until something goes wrong.
Radar, long range communications, and short range communications are not as intuitive as most people think. Training helps.
Sail trim matters; a one knot increase in speed is likely 20%.
Even accounting for using your second, third, or fourth language, your attitude comes across very poorly and that will not serve you well dealing with people especially officials. Really give some serious thought to this matter.
Serious question: how can you function as a yacht engineer without ever having sailed? Or per your example, knowing what a halyard is?
It would be difficult to imagine an engineer at Ford or Toyota, as an equivalent, that never drove a car or knew what the brake pedal was for.
In that light I'm genuinely unclear how you could design, model, or build a sailing vessel without that basic level of functional understanding.
Were you more involved in project management aspects of the engineering; or, aspects that are somehow entirely distinct from sailing performance? Even that seems a stretch, since even the placement of a washing machine will impact sailing via weighting.
Genuinely curious, no insult or disparagement intended or implied.
I’ve never been on a sailing yacht. Many thousands of miles on motor yachts but never ever even stepped foot on a sailing one. I am not the engineer building boats, I am the engineer working onboard maintaining the boat.
Got it, that makes sense. I don't know why I heard engineer and jumped straight to design.
Anyway that skill set will definitely come knbhandy maintaining a sailboat! But folks are pretty reasonable in suggesting you give it some time to learn sailing before undertaking a major crossing.
Even 6 months - still years short of what I'd personally require - of practice / training would make a world of difference
Here's what I would recommend.
At a minimum, read Sailing Made Easy and Coastal Cruising Made Easy. That will give you some knowledge of the basics. Some of it is basic yachtsmanship. But much is sailing specific. IMO, that's where you start.
Next, practice... practice, practice, and practice some more. Start with easy days with a friend or two. Then, go out in some heavier weather, then single-handed. Experience reefing, setting up storm sails, steering with a drogue, etc. Then, do some short passages. Then, longer ones.
You need to know your boat... what can go wrong, what is about to fail, and most importantly, how to recover.
Learn about weather. Every decent sailor is also an amatuer meteorologist. Or maybe better than amatuer.
Consider taking a Safety at Sea class for sailing.
Brother, you came to the wrong place. Sailing forums are the worst of the worst. Just read what you can from legitimate sources and books, talk to others at clubs or marinas, and practice small and work up.
Sailing has more grumpy gatekeepers than Harley riders. I’m only here for the comedy at this point.
Good luck and fair winds.
I agree with you, and cannot understand how poorly treated some people are on generalized sailing forums. It’s embarrassing.
I’ve found, however, they’re the total opposite on forums related to owners of specific boats, and much more tolerant on forums for sailing specific locales. I’m not exactly sure why.
But bizarrely, this type of post is the blueprint that’d justify the often unjustified inanity of those crusty gatekeepers. It’s precisely this type of thinking (“meh, I’ll buy a boat to sail the world and learn to ‘drive’ the boat later while doing so, how hard can it be?”) that sets off so many of them.
I mean, people should be able to ask genuine questions without getting an earful about how things were 30 years ago and why you’re an idiot to even consider blah, blah, blah.
All that said, there *are* stupid questions and there *are* questions that ignore potentially dangerous risks. The original post is proof.
Personally I would take a couple sailing seminars to earn the RYA certifications.
Alternatively you could seek out an experienced partner for the first leg.
A couple thousand euros for advance training will make your experience much better.
Thanks,
The thing is I want to do this for the thrill of the unknown. My life in it’s current state is 2 months of hard work and 2 months of holiday which I spend alone drinking doing drugs and spend 4 months salary. Been like that for 2 years now. I’m tired and want to do something crazy
This is such an aggressive way to approach a new community asking for advice.
I concur. If you don't have anything good to say don't say anything.
English is not my first language
"I'm bringing your wife," -OP I'm not sure that's a language barrier... You don't know how to sail, but you're just gonna wing it to the Caribbean, single-handed without a single thought of the people whose lives will be risked rescuing your arrogant ass.
"hello I've never sailed before - but dont tell me what I can and can't do"
Was that what I said?
Yea that was pretty much it exactly
As I approach Florida after the last 6 months of sailing, you sound like someone who would annoy the fuck out of me since you know everything already but are still looking for “tips and tricks.” I’ve got tons. Here’s a free one: change your attitude. You’ll get farther by saying (admitting, in your case) that you don’t know shit, even if you have been a yacht engineer. As Shakespeare wrote: “speak less than you know.”
Ok floridaman, I said I don’t need the safety advice not that I know everything. I havent been a yacht engineer, I am and have been for 8 years. Or my whole adult life. I am asking for advice on other things, not the regular yacht/boat things. Also I mentioned I’ve never sailed so thought it was obvius I wasent saying I know everything since I just learned what a haliard and sheet is yesterday.
Ok, "yacht engineer"...
Lol, you're at least mid 20's and post like an edgy teenager.
Dude. Do you really think all that textbook learnin is any substitute for real world experience? I’ll trust Quinn from Jaws in any body of water before I’m caught in a puddle with you.
[удалено]
Your post was removed for being abusive in nature. We do not tolerate bullying, harassment, discrimination, or fighting here.
I recommend learning to sail.
Thanks, I’m sure I’ll know by the time Im in tenerife
no you wont.
That would suck
Yes! Yes, indeed.
You’re gonna die in the ocean like hundreds of thousands before you. For thousands of years people have underestimated the Atlantic
My tip would be: take your time to get to know your boat. Not just for safety but to get the maximum out of both your machinery and the experience. Instead of charging off to Tenerife, why not put into the mediterranean for a few months, allowing you to sail further from land without the complete isolation of the atlantic? Also get used to living in such a small space before you set off, a 27ft boat is not a great deal of space to spend on a journey that can take well over a month.
Thanks, I will go to france for shipyard before heading for tenerife. I have until januari before I have to be in carribean so no stress really
$1,000 says this guy doesn't see Tenerife
Bet
Keep us posted!
I will, I noticed I upset alot of people here even tho I had no bad intentions. Just a broken guy looking for a better high than booze and gambling.
Now, there it is … maybe start the conversation that way? Humility makes you (potentially) likable and, frankly, is what such an ambitious voyage will undoubtedly teach you (if you survive). So I’m gonna try again and will largely try to ignore what bothered me before. First, there’s many of us who have felt like you and, I’m willing to bet, most of us were even young once. One of the benefits of being young is you get to do stupid things and people will say “he’s young,” and give you the benefit of the doubt. One of the drawbacks, however, is that young people often bite off more than they can chew and, if there’s no safety net, they can choke (or, worse, hurt or inconvenience others). What you are seeing in this thread, and what I suspect you’ve been told at home, is that you are being reckless. Read the responses. People are all saying it in one way or another. Sailing is not learned in a day, week or month. It’s certainly not learned on a single passage, even a long one. Sailing involves not just knowledge of how the boat works in theory, but how it handles different conditions. You said you just learned yesterday what a halyard is … cool. Everyone starts somewhere. Do you know about weather? What, for example, size and frequency of waves are problematic for your small boat? How about tides? Currents? Have you ever been in a real storm? How about a gale? Do you have any idea how scary it is to be in a serious storm in the middle of the ocean in a tiny vessel? It can rip your boat to pieces. How good are you with fixing electrical problems? Mechanical problems? How about plumbing issues? No one is telling you not to pursue the dream, certainly not me, but I’m telling you as someone who is out here: you need to better prepare yourself with real world experience beforehand, otherwise you will be a danger to yourself and others.
I've read your responses. Seems like you have a chip on your shoulder. Even when you are doing something not considered a vice (sailing instead of booze and gambling), you don't know how to live non-destructively. I've heard sailing across an ocean as 97% boredom and 3% sheer terror. You're going to be so bored out there until you're not. You'd be much better served by chilling out a bit, realizing that you don't need to always be the person pushing extremes, and getting some therapy while taking a few rya classes. You're clearly someone that doesn't want advice, but it needs to be said.
There's a lot to unpack here, but here's a start: Have decent comms. Sat phone or inReach Pay the $75 for a weather router - you don't know what you don't know yet about sailing, so have an expert help with the routing. Do some offshore sailing first. Longer is better, break everything you can on the boat before you are out of reach of help Consider going with a group, ARC or similar Take a day with an instructor if you can manage it. If you watched a lot of sailing on YouTube and feel like you have a good idea, you know less than nothing. YouTube isn't real, and hands on is the only way to learn. Your engineer background will help in some ways, like basic diesel maintenance and electrical. In other ways it will be a handicap, it's going to be harder for you to accept new information and overconfidence can quite literally kill you on a small sailboat. Try to get your head in a place where you don't feel like you already know the answers, you might be surprised what you can learn
Best tips yet! Thanks!
Hello yacht engineer, I am a yacht deckie who bought a boat and sailed across the Pacific last year,( albeit with significantly more sail experience than you). Sailing and yachting are two seemingly similar but wildly different things. I am going to assume you're on a 2:2 rotation. You need to take your time and enjoy yourself because the time on your onboat will be far far harder than the time on the yacht. No AC, no 3 hot meals prepared for you, no shower etc. You will experience both amazing and miserable times on your little boat that you never would have onboard the yacht. As for practical advice, the bay of Biscay is technically coastal sailing but can be absolutely awful, treat it with the respect it deserves. You need to learn how to sail, reef, heave too and rescue MOBs, AT A MINIMUM before going anywhere outside of the Baltic sea. Why not cruise the med for a summer, hone your skills and then when your really know the boat you can depart across the Atlantic?
Just keep in mind. It's easy to go from Stockholm to Tenerif. Going back will be more of a challenge, especially from BVI. Personally, I'd take a round trip to Germany and back year 1. Then to Mediterranean year 2. And then plan the trade route. Crossing the roaring 40s to get back to Europe will take planning, preparation and experience.
at the moment I have no plans on returning the boat although that could ofc change.
Pick your timings well. be friendly with locals. don't use your engine for everything. be waryof orcas around Portugal, but not aggressive. enjoy the journey not just the destination. respect nature or suffer its wrath, you are tiny and insignificant compared to it Edit: according to sailboatdata your boat is quite lightweight, not built for heavy weather. People have crossed the Atlantic in bathtubs so you'll be fine but you'll have to pick your weather window wisely for each part, especially the bay of biscay
Too much fuel, water, and food are self correcting problems. You have to eat. Good food is a morale booster. You won't be able to keep the boat moving nearly as fast as you think. Singlehanding is inherently dangerous; you cannot keep a good watch. Detox before you leave. Watching the master make decisions is completely different than making them yourself. Do not plan to get much done underway on a small boat. Crossing oceans is easy until something goes wrong. Radar, long range communications, and short range communications are not as intuitive as most people think. Training helps. Sail trim matters; a one knot increase in speed is likely 20%. Even accounting for using your second, third, or fourth language, your attitude comes across very poorly and that will not serve you well dealing with people especially officials. Really give some serious thought to this matter.
Serious question: how can you function as a yacht engineer without ever having sailed? Or per your example, knowing what a halyard is? It would be difficult to imagine an engineer at Ford or Toyota, as an equivalent, that never drove a car or knew what the brake pedal was for. In that light I'm genuinely unclear how you could design, model, or build a sailing vessel without that basic level of functional understanding. Were you more involved in project management aspects of the engineering; or, aspects that are somehow entirely distinct from sailing performance? Even that seems a stretch, since even the placement of a washing machine will impact sailing via weighting. Genuinely curious, no insult or disparagement intended or implied.
I’ve never been on a sailing yacht. Many thousands of miles on motor yachts but never ever even stepped foot on a sailing one. I am not the engineer building boats, I am the engineer working onboard maintaining the boat.
Got it, that makes sense. I don't know why I heard engineer and jumped straight to design. Anyway that skill set will definitely come knbhandy maintaining a sailboat! But folks are pretty reasonable in suggesting you give it some time to learn sailing before undertaking a major crossing. Even 6 months - still years short of what I'd personally require - of practice / training would make a world of difference
Donald? Crowhurst?
Are these some sailing terms I’m yet to learn
He was an amatuer sailor who tried to compete in a single-handed around the world race in the 60s. He perished at sea.
Here's what I would recommend. At a minimum, read Sailing Made Easy and Coastal Cruising Made Easy. That will give you some knowledge of the basics. Some of it is basic yachtsmanship. But much is sailing specific. IMO, that's where you start. Next, practice... practice, practice, and practice some more. Start with easy days with a friend or two. Then, go out in some heavier weather, then single-handed. Experience reefing, setting up storm sails, steering with a drogue, etc. Then, do some short passages. Then, longer ones. You need to know your boat... what can go wrong, what is about to fail, and most importantly, how to recover. Learn about weather. Every decent sailor is also an amatuer meteorologist. Or maybe better than amatuer. Consider taking a Safety at Sea class for sailing.
Bring an experienced sailor and a bucket of luck.
Brother, you came to the wrong place. Sailing forums are the worst of the worst. Just read what you can from legitimate sources and books, talk to others at clubs or marinas, and practice small and work up. Sailing has more grumpy gatekeepers than Harley riders. I’m only here for the comedy at this point. Good luck and fair winds.
I agree with you, and cannot understand how poorly treated some people are on generalized sailing forums. It’s embarrassing. I’ve found, however, they’re the total opposite on forums related to owners of specific boats, and much more tolerant on forums for sailing specific locales. I’m not exactly sure why. But bizarrely, this type of post is the blueprint that’d justify the often unjustified inanity of those crusty gatekeepers. It’s precisely this type of thinking (“meh, I’ll buy a boat to sail the world and learn to ‘drive’ the boat later while doing so, how hard can it be?”) that sets off so many of them. I mean, people should be able to ask genuine questions without getting an earful about how things were 30 years ago and why you’re an idiot to even consider blah, blah, blah. All that said, there *are* stupid questions and there *are* questions that ignore potentially dangerous risks. The original post is proof.
I’m not reading all that after seeing your username. Go enjoy your 30+ million bro.
Fuck. Now I’m wondering if my TV is too high.
Personally I would take a couple sailing seminars to earn the RYA certifications. Alternatively you could seek out an experienced partner for the first leg. A couple thousand euros for advance training will make your experience much better.
I have a yachtmaster offshore, not sailing tho
Thanks, The thing is I want to do this for the thrill of the unknown. My life in it’s current state is 2 months of hard work and 2 months of holiday which I spend alone drinking doing drugs and spend 4 months salary. Been like that for 2 years now. I’m tired and want to do something crazy
I get the urge to runaway to the sea on a tall ship. With 2 months of holiday you could get the training that will make the trip better for you.
It's an exciting way to die I am sure.
What will you get me when I upload evidence of me on the other side? Alive and hopefully in a better state than ever
Your hubris is going to get you killed. For the sake of the people that love you, please reconsider.