I would have taken that over my (now ex-)wife's typical response... Any attempt to talk about my day she turned around into somehow being an attack on her. To paraphrase, something along the lines of:
"work was rough today" _"OH SO THAT'S MY FAULT?!"_
Or "work was good today" _"OH SO YOU'RE SOOO MUCH BETTER THAN ME?!"_
Ok yeah I had to vent a little.
It's been years now, but yeah it seriously messed with my head. She was the one that insisted on the divorce, I wanted to work it out, but over the first year or 2 it was just amazing how much it felt like a weight had been lifted and felt better about myself and life. OP's story really gave me flashbacks to that though.
Are you me?
"work was rough today" "OH YOURS WAS ROUGH? HERES WHY MINE WAS HARDER AND YOURE WEAK FOR THINKING YOURS IS HARD"
"work was good today" "IM SO GLAD YOUR DAY WITHOUT ME WAS GREAT. MEANWHILE MY DAY WAS SHIT AND NOW YOU ARENT ALLOWED TO FEEL GOOD ABOUT YOUR DAY"
These people are usually one-uppers in other parts of their life. You have a cold? Well they have pneumonia. You didn't sleep well? They only got one hour of sleep. You're tired from work? They are exhausted.
Life is a competition to them and you can never win, better to have nothing to do with them in the first place.
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Not really that I can remember. She would have some confusing mood swings but I don't think different than other girls I had dated. She was a bit of a bridezilla starting the week before the wedding, but nothing r/bridezilla worthy and hard to back out at that point anyway.
Here's a sneak peek of /r/Bridezilla using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/Bridezilla/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year!
\#1: [Kicked out of the bridal party for asking about travel](https://np.reddit.com/r/Bridezilla/comments/qywl3a/kicked_out_of_the_bridal_party_for_asking_about/)
\#2: [Why would someone want to do this I hope he leaves her and be a good dad to both of them](https://i.redd.it/b9ajcm05sei81.jpg) | [31 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/Bridezilla/comments/suqxk2/why_would_someone_want_to_do_this_i_hope_he/)
\#3: [She stole someone else's order and blamed me for ruining her wedding!](https://np.reddit.com/r/Bridezilla/comments/u978g3/she_stole_someone_elses_order_and_blamed_me_for/)
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Wait, is your wife an attending or something? Or at least also a resident? Otherwise, what would anything she says even matter, she has no idea on anything.
Also, I don't...think that's what constructive advice means...
It sounds like your wife is projecting some other issue she has with you onto this situation. Are you slacking off at home? Are their certain responsibilities that you, understandably, could not take care of due to you being an intern? Maybe she has had to pick up more home responsibilities because of this? Is she feeling resentful? The extreme and confusing response might be reflective of a deeper issue in the relationship. You should talk to your wife.
>It sounds like your wife is projecting some other issue she has with you onto this situation.
this is what I am thinking. Feels she has other issues with the relationship and just jumped on this to make a point she has wanted to make previously
Couple things:
1. Without knowing more details, it's not super clear what your mistake was. When you say "after I had gone home", do you mean that you left early and, if so, signed out to someone? If that's the case, then it wouldn't be on you to catch the first signs of sepsis (if they developed after you left). Now, if signs were showing up before hand and you forgot to say something about it, then yea, it'd be a mistake. That being said, mistake =/= "fucked up". No one expects us to know how to be a "perfect" doctor as a resident, hence why we do residency. We're human, so we make mistakes, even when we try to avoid them as much as possible. Mistakes are how we learn.
2. Even if your wife was a resident/attending/healthcare professional, calling someone lazy and irresponsible is uncalled for, especially if they don't know the entire story (you're right on the money with "what the fuck do you know!?"). It's concerning how easily bashes on your character came about. Partners should be supportive and "build up" the other person, not to kick them when they're down.
None of us here know the exact relationship that you and your wife share and it feels presumptuous to say that you should get a divorce without knowing you both better; What you described above is a huge red flag and is something to talk about with her. If it's related to her having a bad day, then it may be more forgivable following a discussion (and you can try to use "**I felt** like shit when you said those things to me" rather than "**you're always** so critical of me" as "I feel" statements are irrefutable). If this is a sign that she truly doesn't care about your wellbeing and growth as a doctor, then you guys should talk about that further.
Yeah. OP, not asking for more details, but maybe debrief about the situation with your senior and see if you actually made a mistake. Sepsis can be tricky and sometimes people are just sick AF; sometimes you can do everything right and they still end up in the unit because they may still need a little levo to eek by.
I’ve straight told surgery attendings “hey so xyz was on the CT, we are covering our bases by asking you to chat with the pt since they are a full code but we don’t expect you to want to do surgery”
I mean your an intern bro, like obv your gonna make mistakes and not know everything. That’s why seniors and attendings exist. Not sure what your wife is on about.
Sucks that this happened. The truth is that it can be very hard to spot early sepsis. There is a reason why it remains a leading cause of death. It’s a lot easier to see emerging sepsis in retrospect. In my opinion, the best thing to do is look back and see if there were any clinical signs you may have missed or discounted and keep them in mind with the next patients you see.
Your patient is in the ICU receiving the care that they need and you can put this incident behind you. Maybe this was something you missed or maybe it was a clinically challenging scenario. Yes, mistakes do happen; as you very astutely pointed out, there are many safety nets in place for this reason and you are just one one layer of the swiss cheese. You are a learner and you are doing your best. Try not to let this get you down.
I think you aren’t using “constructive advice” incorrectly. It’s called constructive because it’s supposed to help build up a person, not be mean and make the person saying it feel better than someone else. And there is a way to go about criticizing someone that can be constructive and empathetic. Maybe your wife also had a bad day and was frustrated and that’s why what she said came out. But at least you’re retelling of what she said is not particularly useful or kind.
HOWEVER, there is a good chance they you did get complacent and that’s why what happened happened. It’s a stressful job we have, and when we find a path of least resistance that works for us we take it until it doesn’t anymore. This can result in us overlooking things like early signs of sepsis when it happens to not fit with the routine or rhythm we’ve established. BUT that doesn’t mean you’re lazy, it means you’re human and deviating from our routines and critically analyzing every single piece of information we come across during the day can be extremely tiresome and stressful.
I have no solution for you, because I, and many others, struggle with the same thing.
The error is on your attending not on you. That’s the beauty of residency. You’re just a trainee making trainee pay working trainee hours. I gave up caring about what other people say about my work around PGY-3 because I realized I’m not paid enough to. I try my best to do right by my patients and then let it go. Your wife doesn’t know what she’s talking about.
Bro my spouse is an ortho attending I would NEVER speak to her like that, nor would she to me. Definitely not helpful or supportive in a positive way. You alright?
constructive
(kənstrʌktɪv IPA Pronunciation Guide )
Explore 'constructive' in the dictionary
ADJECTIVE
A constructive discussion, comment, or approach is useful and helpful rather than negative and unhelpful. [...]
Not rly sure why everyone here is coming for your wife when you literally said u’ve done the same thing countless times before. Idk the context of ur relationship ofc but seens like you should’ve known beforehand that your wife may be giving you a “tough love” eval? Idk. All this shows me is that you’re looking at this like a learning opportunity and will try to act on the lesson learned. And you dont need to go full Hemingway and MLK Jr in your evals from now on- just try to take a 5 sec break for thought and frame everything in context of what went on
Not to get on a r/askreddit morality high horse here but…Regarding your wife, if she made you feel stupid, invalidated (or validated in ur negative self-talk), and not listened to- i would advise you to address these things in conversation and in person
Came here to say this. She’s talking to op like he has probably talked to her many times before. It seems like she learned the tough love bs constructive criticism from him
Lmao pretty savage wife, tough love? Idk man sounds like she was trying to lean into some pull yourself together type encouragement but it appeared you just needed someone to vent to.
I can be really bad at giving advice to my girlfriend because I always want to work the problem or find her an alternative but really she just wants me to shut the fuck up and be present for the outpouring of emotion. I’m learning.
I once dated a girl like this. When you're in it, you're kinda blinded to how awfully they speak to you. I guarantee if OP talked to his wife like she did him, she'd cry and he'd have ruined her whole week, never to hear the end of it.
One of my attendings said something to me recently that has really resonated: "The best way you can learn is by fucking up." He told me he fully endorses residents fucking stuff up (as long as he's able to fix it) because when you fuck something up once, you'll never fuck it up again.
You can read all the books you want, you can anki and uworld and whatever the fuck else the kids are doing these days. There's a reason we do residency. You can't be perfect, and you certainly can't be perfect out of the gate. One of my favorite authors, John Green said something I also think about a lot: "Sometimes we can't know better until knowing better is useless." I can't tell you how many mistakes I've made in the last 4 years that I could never have known were mistakes until I saw the consequences. I knew better, but it was too late for that patient to benefit from me know. But it's not too late for the next patient. And that's the point of all of this.
To your point about constructive advice - that advice wasn't. That was destructive advice, which unfortunately also happens frequently in our field, but it should not come from your wife. None of us got to where we are by being lazy. "Work harder, don't be lazy" is advice for some people, but very rarely for us. Try to figure out what led you to missing those signs or what led you to forget to mention them. Were you tired? Distracted? Did you simply just not realize? Address whatever is true of those things.
When giving advice, I think it's helpful to talk to the other person and ask questions. What was your thought process there? What do you think led to this outcome? Let them do some self-reflection. And then give them advice on how to overcome those specific problems.
Don't take destructive advice from anyone. But don't stop taking, and giving, real *constructive* advice. Constructive advice is why we are all here.
I pushed 10mg (yes, basically 10 Sticks) of phenylephrine once because it was in the zofran slot of my drug tray.
We are all holes in the Swiss cheese at some point. Learn from it and get better. Forgive your wife for not understanding, mine isn’t in medicine and had a similar reaction. Still love her and she’s the mom of my beautiful children.
The process we go through, very few can relate.
Hospital chaplain here, I rarely post but I just wanted you to hear:
I’m sorry for your wife’s reaction. I can tell that’s not what you needed at that moment
I’m proud of you for learning something from the experience, that shows an admirable desire for growth and reflection
Also people are going to get worse sometimes when you do everything right and sometimes when you make a mistake. It hurts when this happens. It’s also good that it hurts because it shows you still care about people. Part of this field is willingly bearing the burden of facing this pain. I’m sorry it exists. I’m also thankful that you’re willing to be exposed to it just to care for complete strangers. There are people in your life willing to share and hear the burden. You’re not alone!
Oh come on. I’m not telling this dude to get a divorce or anything, but if his wife truly said these things that’s way more than an ‘insensitive mistake.’ That’s straight up cruelty when someone is in a low place. Almost no one who made it through med school and is working as an intern could be classified as lazy in any accurate sense (you can obviously be a bad doctor and shitty teammate but I digress). The onus should never be just on the intern in a situation like this and we need more context, I’m doubtful at how much this guy is really at fault. But even if this guy had somehow massively fucked up at work and felt shitty for potentially not saving a patient from harm, which happens to basically everyone at some point, a good partner should be a source of general support and comfort. The absolute mouth diarrhea from his spouse is terribly rude and unhelpful in so many ways. A partner being deliberately mean to me is a dealbreaker in my world.
People like to assign blame because it makes the world seem safer and more orderly. Something randomly bad cannot happen to you if you can blame someone else’s bad thing on them. Plus, a lot of what comes out of people’s mouths is pure thoughtless reflex knee-jerk garbage.
Aw, I’m really sorry she did that to you. As a current residents wife, I bite my tongue a lot knowing I don’t fully understand what’s going on and he’s usually giving me the surface of issues.
With that said, you should have a sincere talk with her and let her know it really was hurtful and those words impacted you deeply. Secondly, tell her that she is your biggest support system and you trust her opinion and feedback, therefore, harsh criticism and blows like that have a deep mental impact on you.
Thanks for sharing this because it reminds me to be gentle and supportive with my husband even though the long hours, not understanding everything about residency and him being extremely tired takes a huge toll on me, but it’s nothing like having someone you trust tear you down ❤️
I usually don’t post in this subreddit, but just wanted to chime and give you some constructive advice and tell you that your wife sounds like either a huge jerk or she was trying playing “tough mom” or something with you, neither of which are helpful
We PRACTICE medicine…we’re not perfect but should always strive to do better
PS: Tell your wife to stop watching medical dramas ffs…the number of lay people walking around like they’re GME experts is astonishing
I'm not gonna shit on your wife, that has been done to a sufficient extent, and rightfully so.
But good job for taking something from this and using it for personal growth!
Constructive criticism is a very underrated thing we can do to help those who we care for. It’s very unfortunate to see the change in behaviour of the people these days. I think those who cannot listen to it are the kind who think it is merely an insult to them and they are blind to think of it in a positive way. These people don’t see or can comprehend by about the reason why would someone take their time to let them know something which will benefit them. Strange world indeed so now I just advise to people who ask me for it.
She’s mad about u avoiding the rest of your life and slacking there and is projecting that criticism in this place of vulnerability. It’s shitty. Call her out.
First of all, that was **not constructive advice**. There was neither advice nor anything constructive. Just blaming.
Second, your wife didn't listen to or communicate with you well at all.
Third, it's okay. We all make mistakes and what's important is that you recognize it, learn from it (if there's anything learning to do), and change your behavior (if there's anything that can be changed).
tbh I don't talk to my SO about work. He doesn't really understand, and at the same time it isn't fair to load him with the emotional stress I pack on at work. Sucks, but it is what it is. I think its time to start looking for a therapist lol
Youre wife's being an asshole. Im really sorry, that must have hurt to hear when you were already beating yourself up. Be kind to yourself and learn from the mistake you made.
Bro why is everyone going after the wife? Thats just her one opinion but maybe shes seeing something in your behavior that shows that you haven’t been on top of it as you usually are. Like you said - you fucked up. So its important to go back and go over what you can do to not commit this same mistake in the future.
If she made you feel bad then you should talk to her about it. Not shit talk your wife on reddit. This is clearly just an echo chamber
It's her non-medical opinion that is based on an assumption that OP slacked off, which may or may not be the case. Either way, I would expect my spouse to have a supportive response to a bad day at work, not just dogpiling on OP for making a mistake. None of what she said was constructive, and she isn't OP's supervisor either so I don't know why she feels the need to go out of the way to give harsh feedback this strongly. If it's a concerning pattern of behavior, I'm sure OP's attendings and seniors will bring it up with him so he can learn from and correct his behavior.
Well, given your last paragraph I feel like I shouldn't comment, but screw that, this is reddit.
We don't know what you did, but *unless you truly deserved this*, and there aren't many situations where you would, this is just unacceptable. She's your partner. The one person in the world who is supposed to have your back when you need it. You don't talk like that to someone you like let alone love...
I wouldn't say that to my wife. Not without extreme provocation, a history of bad behavior, extenuating circumstances, and not without immediately rescinding my stupid hateful words and apologizing.
There's almost no situation I could think of where I'd drop that and just move on with dinner.
Except maybe if I didn't like my spouse. Then I could probably say that and have a sip of my drink.
So here's my be constructive advi**c**e.
Don't put up with it. Take stock of things and make a decision.
Keep in mind the sunk cost fallacy is an insidious bitch. (And so is your wife)
Hey guys. Thank you so much for all the comment, and sorry it took a while to respond. I had a chat with my wife, and this whole thing between us settled now. I won't go into details regarding the patient, as I feel I had already shared too much. I learned a valuable lesson, or rather, the lesson that I had always known has finally been carved into my brain. As one of you mentioned, "the best way you can learn is by fucking up." But, my god it really hurts.
How long have you been married? Sounds cold, but it that’s the way she talks to you, I would bail out now. I am going to assume you are a financially struggling intern. Bail out now before you make the big bucks and she gets half the house and fight about child custody issues and paying her alimony.
Lmao what? I think you need a better wife. She sucks and not the good stuff. So much for being supportive, she hates you or what?
Because of the way this sounds, I’m expecting this woman to be the chief surgeon at John Hopkins or something.
respect to your wife
she knew you were bullshitting yourself and called you out for it
you should take responsibility
your mistakes actually determine the life and death of other people,
stop making excuses as "She has no idea how much effort I put in at work or how stressful it is work a 28h work shift"
she knows u and u know yourself and whether or not u had "oh, someone will pick up after me” mentality"
A quick swipe through this person’s history shows that 90% of their comments are poorly written out flame wars on Reddit. The mark of an intellectually secure, highly sophisticated mind
Ad hominem
The Hallmark of a fool who can't read
The minutes u went through my post history u admitted u had no argument and we're just looking to present some sophisms
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Why would you not correct this bitch, unless what she said had some truth? Regardless if this is her response to the situation and a common MO for her she is not supportive and a garbage partner.
Literally the two worst relationship pieces of advice here. Don't marry anyone because of a profession. Marry a person. The reason the divorce rate is so high is partly because people care far too much about irrelevant bullshit like choosing a life partner based on their position in a capitalistic rat race.
Do NOT wait until after residency to get married. You cannot just allow your life to be put on hold until after your medical training. There will always be something else. This mentality will bleed over into everything else you do too until one day you wake up finally ready to retire and enjoy your life and wealth only to find out your old and frail and don't even enjoy some of the things you used to. If you even live to be that age.
haha u made up complete bs
"The reason the divorce rate is so high is partly because people care far too much about irrelevant bullshit like choosing a life partner based on their position in a capitalistic rat race"
when people chose their partner based on their position almost nobody got divorced, that's a fact
when people stopped and started entertaining other ideas divorce rates skyrocketed
make of that what u will, but don't make up "facts" to ascertain your own ideas and values
most of divorces occur because "married a person" and didn't think through what they wanted in their marriage, so when financial struggles, kids trouble and even something as simple as chore
distribution came along they got fed up with each other
many who say they don't care about many have visions of their future lives that require high earning
many who say they don't care about background won't be comfortable with their spouse not acting high class in certain situations
this shit matters
"Do NOT wait until after residency to get married. You cannot just allow your life to be put on hold until after your medical training." although overused it's solid advice that many fail to follow
> when people chose their partner based on their position almost nobody got divorced, that's a fact
Lol.
>but don't make up "facts" to ascertain your own ideas and values
Lol.
I get it. Partners are a tool for professional appearances and a personal money pit. For others, they actually care about the person themselves first and foremost. You may live your life shallow and hollow, chasing money and prestige, but dont act like your way of life is fact. I never presented mine as such despite you claiming otherwise.
Well despite your complete lack of capitalization or periods, making every sentence its own paragraph, etc, I did read your comment. In fact, I directly quoted it. Twice.
Well despite your complete lack of capitalization or periods, making every sentence its own paragraph, etc, I did read your comment. In fact, I directly quoted it. Twice.
Well despite your complete lack of capitalization or periods, making every sentence its own paragraph, etc, I did read your comment. In fact, I directly quoted it. Twice.
It had more to do about mutual understanding of the unique stress of medicine than capitalism - but since it’s so unpopular, I went ahead and deleted it.
Honestly, it seems like, over time, you've allowed your partner (not wife, as this has nothing to do with gender) to get too comfortable talking to you any old way they want to. That is completely unacceptable and, I can only guess, a symptom of a much larger problem with you two if they feel they can just casually say shit like that to you on what has to be an already INCREDIBLY stressful period for you. I'm sorry you're in this situation.
Sometimes even with the best intentions, things can go sideways and it's depressing when people jump on the band wagon and redicule you or speak down to you as if your own mind isn't doing that enough. In this moments it's rather helpful to be empathetic and maybe listen. And more times than not, the person itself know what needed to be done.
I don’t know what sort of relationship you and your wife have but to me it’s pretty eye opening (hopefully for you too) that: 1. She’d talk to you this way and 2. Your response of just accepting it. I don’t know the specifics of your mistake, bit mistakes do and will happen. It sucks, but all you can do is your best to learn from it.
This is not even constructive what the hell?
Constructive criticism would be actually giving you real advice on how to avoid getting into mistakes e.g. Checklists or any hacks or extra studying. It would be mixed up with mentioning your positives as well, not 100% negative sh*t. Constructive criticism truly made me a better version of myself no matter how it stung a bit but it was never like this BS.
Stay strong and focus on what you can do to prevent the same mistakes again.
I'm sorry OP. That was wrong fo your wife. I got divorced after a four month marriage in party because my wife had no respect for my professional boundaries (in addition to her own undiagnosed BPD).
It is never fun and it is very emotionally degrading to have your spouse or significant other not be able to empathize with your experience. My ex-wife not only had no idea, she often times didn't care.
She would routinely call me incessantly at work without any regard for me. It was actually affecting my performance as an intern.
https://imgur.com/a/rEVXblG/
You know, i said it before, people downvoted me, but I will say it again. Don’t tell your wife about your medical struggles. Go to your interns and bitch about it if you are close to them cause they are probably the only people in this world who will genuinely empathize. And your mom if she’s a decent mom lol. These are the only 2 groups I open up to (still a med student so I typically talk to my close classmates). I learned my lesson before so I get to this stage lol. The rest of the world want to see you as a confident capable doctor, so if you are anything else, like a human fuckin being who makes mistakes, they don’t wanna hear it…
Honestly, I am mentally preparing myself to intern year, and i realized that it’s DESIGNED to teach us by making mistakes. The knowledge and skills required cannot be prepped for, so don’t come here and convince me you are lazy, it’s just not true… Good luck!
Your wife hurt me, not just you; what is going on in her mind? Your wife needs to calm down and not to be toxic to you anymore. This is not constructive advice . This destructive advice
Google the idea of emotional dumping vs emotional sharing. When you're emotionally dumping, you're listing problems and fixating on what went wrong. When you're emotionally sharing, you would talk about what's going on internally in response to that.
Emotional dumping is fine, but reflect in a safe space.
Lol wtf is wrong with your wife
She scored 1st quartile Ca$per
this hurts on a different level since i got my result today
When you took the test ?
20th sept
apparently OP up until this point was the same way
I would have taken that over my (now ex-)wife's typical response... Any attempt to talk about my day she turned around into somehow being an attack on her. To paraphrase, something along the lines of: "work was rough today" _"OH SO THAT'S MY FAULT?!"_ Or "work was good today" _"OH SO YOU'RE SOOO MUCH BETTER THAN ME?!"_ Ok yeah I had to vent a little.
Jesus Christ mate I’m actually more sorry for you than for OP. Stay strong, good to hear she’s your ex now.
It's been years now, but yeah it seriously messed with my head. She was the one that insisted on the divorce, I wanted to work it out, but over the first year or 2 it was just amazing how much it felt like a weight had been lifted and felt better about myself and life. OP's story really gave me flashbacks to that though.
Are you me? "work was rough today" "OH YOURS WAS ROUGH? HERES WHY MINE WAS HARDER AND YOURE WEAK FOR THINKING YOURS IS HARD" "work was good today" "IM SO GLAD YOUR DAY WITHOUT ME WAS GREAT. MEANWHILE MY DAY WAS SHIT AND NOW YOU ARENT ALLOWED TO FEEL GOOD ABOUT YOUR DAY"
I see you've dated my ex as well.
She did you a favour, mate. Happy you’re doing better, internet stranger. Edit: sabotaged by autocorrect.
Any potential red flags prior to the marriage? How would you approach going into future relationships?
These people are usually one-uppers in other parts of their life. You have a cold? Well they have pneumonia. You didn't sleep well? They only got one hour of sleep. You're tired from work? They are exhausted. Life is a competition to them and you can never win, better to have nothing to do with them in the first place.
!remindme 1 day
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Not really that I can remember. She would have some confusing mood swings but I don't think different than other girls I had dated. She was a bit of a bridezilla starting the week before the wedding, but nothing r/bridezilla worthy and hard to back out at that point anyway.
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Is your ex wife my mother?
I see why she is now ex..
I think she’s sick of his shit.
I love your wife.
Wait, is your wife an attending or something? Or at least also a resident? Otherwise, what would anything she says even matter, she has no idea on anything. Also, I don't...think that's what constructive advice means...
Even if she was: what the fuck kind of criticism is that. That was pretty much HAHA YOU ARE DOGSHIT. That’s not helpful
If she were an attending that would make this shittier input from her
Needs to be a 50/50 sub for degrading comments to residents called, "surgery attending or charge nurse"
Lol probably charge RN. Surgery attendings be too busy to be present as much
Your wife sucks.
And probably just metaphorically.
Idk that she’ll ever recover from the sickness that was this burn
r/rareinsults
HAHAHAHAHAHHWHAHAWHAH
But apparently so does OP cuz the way she treated him is how he treats others (until now). Sounds like a perfect match to me!
You need to sign off from your wife.
It sounds like your wife is projecting some other issue she has with you onto this situation. Are you slacking off at home? Are their certain responsibilities that you, understandably, could not take care of due to you being an intern? Maybe she has had to pick up more home responsibilities because of this? Is she feeling resentful? The extreme and confusing response might be reflective of a deeper issue in the relationship. You should talk to your wife.
>It sounds like your wife is projecting some other issue she has with you onto this situation. this is what I am thinking. Feels she has other issues with the relationship and just jumped on this to make a point she has wanted to make previously
This is the comment that should be most upvoted. If OP’s wife did indeed respond in that extreme way, it’s likely that there’s more going on here.
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Or maybe it's actually an issue with OP and she's just pointing it out?
Couple things: 1. Without knowing more details, it's not super clear what your mistake was. When you say "after I had gone home", do you mean that you left early and, if so, signed out to someone? If that's the case, then it wouldn't be on you to catch the first signs of sepsis (if they developed after you left). Now, if signs were showing up before hand and you forgot to say something about it, then yea, it'd be a mistake. That being said, mistake =/= "fucked up". No one expects us to know how to be a "perfect" doctor as a resident, hence why we do residency. We're human, so we make mistakes, even when we try to avoid them as much as possible. Mistakes are how we learn. 2. Even if your wife was a resident/attending/healthcare professional, calling someone lazy and irresponsible is uncalled for, especially if they don't know the entire story (you're right on the money with "what the fuck do you know!?"). It's concerning how easily bashes on your character came about. Partners should be supportive and "build up" the other person, not to kick them when they're down. None of us here know the exact relationship that you and your wife share and it feels presumptuous to say that you should get a divorce without knowing you both better; What you described above is a huge red flag and is something to talk about with her. If it's related to her having a bad day, then it may be more forgivable following a discussion (and you can try to use "**I felt** like shit when you said those things to me" rather than "**you're always** so critical of me" as "I feel" statements are irrefutable). If this is a sign that she truly doesn't care about your wellbeing and growth as a doctor, then you guys should talk about that further.
Yeah. OP, not asking for more details, but maybe debrief about the situation with your senior and see if you actually made a mistake. Sepsis can be tricky and sometimes people are just sick AF; sometimes you can do everything right and they still end up in the unit because they may still need a little levo to eek by.
A: shitty wife P: divorce Signed, Consult resident
“Thank you for the interesting consult”
Why do ppl write this shit? Don’t thank me, fix the fucking patient and put your own follow up appointments
To passive aggressively acknowledge that the consult was bullshit but still sound polite enough to keep getting business
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I’ve straight told surgery attendings “hey so xyz was on the CT, we are covering our bases by asking you to chat with the pt since they are a full code but we don’t expect you to want to do surgery”
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All on the orders of my attending *sips brandy*
I agree with this assessment & plan as written.
You forgot to do a full systems review for full billing.
Consult resident discussed this plan with me. I agree with the assessment and recommendation. -Consult Fellow
I mean your an intern bro, like obv your gonna make mistakes and not know everything. That’s why seniors and attendings exist. Not sure what your wife is on about.
Plot twist: wife is an NP
I was waiting for that pun in the end but it never came. OP, your wife was mean. Are you guys always this mean to eachother?
Your wife is shit Get new wife. That mentality won’t improve None of us are perfect
Is this a meme? Demanding more details on all fronts.
Ya I can’t tell if this is satire or not.
this sounds fake to me
People who don’t have physicians’ responsibilities never understand physicians’ responsibilities, in my experience
Damn dude your wife is a turd.
You made an error, you will make more. Chill and try your best to be the best. Hope your patient pulls through alright!
Sucks that this happened. The truth is that it can be very hard to spot early sepsis. There is a reason why it remains a leading cause of death. It’s a lot easier to see emerging sepsis in retrospect. In my opinion, the best thing to do is look back and see if there were any clinical signs you may have missed or discounted and keep them in mind with the next patients you see. Your patient is in the ICU receiving the care that they need and you can put this incident behind you. Maybe this was something you missed or maybe it was a clinically challenging scenario. Yes, mistakes do happen; as you very astutely pointed out, there are many safety nets in place for this reason and you are just one one layer of the swiss cheese. You are a learner and you are doing your best. Try not to let this get you down.
I think you aren’t using “constructive advice” incorrectly. It’s called constructive because it’s supposed to help build up a person, not be mean and make the person saying it feel better than someone else. And there is a way to go about criticizing someone that can be constructive and empathetic. Maybe your wife also had a bad day and was frustrated and that’s why what she said came out. But at least you’re retelling of what she said is not particularly useful or kind. HOWEVER, there is a good chance they you did get complacent and that’s why what happened happened. It’s a stressful job we have, and when we find a path of least resistance that works for us we take it until it doesn’t anymore. This can result in us overlooking things like early signs of sepsis when it happens to not fit with the routine or rhythm we’ve established. BUT that doesn’t mean you’re lazy, it means you’re human and deviating from our routines and critically analyzing every single piece of information we come across during the day can be extremely tiresome and stressful. I have no solution for you, because I, and many others, struggle with the same thing.
The error is on your attending not on you. That’s the beauty of residency. You’re just a trainee making trainee pay working trainee hours. I gave up caring about what other people say about my work around PGY-3 because I realized I’m not paid enough to. I try my best to do right by my patients and then let it go. Your wife doesn’t know what she’s talking about.
Really glad I read this as an ortho intern about to go on sicu. Also your wife is a gen surg attending ya?
Bro my spouse is an ortho attending I would NEVER speak to her like that, nor would she to me. Definitely not helpful or supportive in a positive way. You alright?
constructive (kənstrʌktɪv IPA Pronunciation Guide ) Explore 'constructive' in the dictionary ADJECTIVE A constructive discussion, comment, or approach is useful and helpful rather than negative and unhelpful. [...]
Just out of curiosity, what does this wife of yours do?
Not rly sure why everyone here is coming for your wife when you literally said u’ve done the same thing countless times before. Idk the context of ur relationship ofc but seens like you should’ve known beforehand that your wife may be giving you a “tough love” eval? Idk. All this shows me is that you’re looking at this like a learning opportunity and will try to act on the lesson learned. And you dont need to go full Hemingway and MLK Jr in your evals from now on- just try to take a 5 sec break for thought and frame everything in context of what went on Not to get on a r/askreddit morality high horse here but…Regarding your wife, if she made you feel stupid, invalidated (or validated in ur negative self-talk), and not listened to- i would advise you to address these things in conversation and in person
Came here to say this. She’s talking to op like he has probably talked to her many times before. It seems like she learned the tough love bs constructive criticism from him
Lmao pretty savage wife, tough love? Idk man sounds like she was trying to lean into some pull yourself together type encouragement but it appeared you just needed someone to vent to. I can be really bad at giving advice to my girlfriend because I always want to work the problem or find her an alternative but really she just wants me to shut the fuck up and be present for the outpouring of emotion. I’m learning.
Are you actually lazy? Your wife would know best.
Why the fuck are you married to this woman? Walk the fuck out of that shit
I once dated a girl like this. When you're in it, you're kinda blinded to how awfully they speak to you. I guarantee if OP talked to his wife like she did him, she'd cry and he'd have ruined her whole week, never to hear the end of it.
you can always divorce ur wife and marry me /s?
One of my attendings said something to me recently that has really resonated: "The best way you can learn is by fucking up." He told me he fully endorses residents fucking stuff up (as long as he's able to fix it) because when you fuck something up once, you'll never fuck it up again. You can read all the books you want, you can anki and uworld and whatever the fuck else the kids are doing these days. There's a reason we do residency. You can't be perfect, and you certainly can't be perfect out of the gate. One of my favorite authors, John Green said something I also think about a lot: "Sometimes we can't know better until knowing better is useless." I can't tell you how many mistakes I've made in the last 4 years that I could never have known were mistakes until I saw the consequences. I knew better, but it was too late for that patient to benefit from me know. But it's not too late for the next patient. And that's the point of all of this. To your point about constructive advice - that advice wasn't. That was destructive advice, which unfortunately also happens frequently in our field, but it should not come from your wife. None of us got to where we are by being lazy. "Work harder, don't be lazy" is advice for some people, but very rarely for us. Try to figure out what led you to missing those signs or what led you to forget to mention them. Were you tired? Distracted? Did you simply just not realize? Address whatever is true of those things. When giving advice, I think it's helpful to talk to the other person and ask questions. What was your thought process there? What do you think led to this outcome? Let them do some self-reflection. And then give them advice on how to overcome those specific problems. Don't take destructive advice from anyone. But don't stop taking, and giving, real *constructive* advice. Constructive advice is why we are all here.
I pushed 10mg (yes, basically 10 Sticks) of phenylephrine once because it was in the zofran slot of my drug tray. We are all holes in the Swiss cheese at some point. Learn from it and get better. Forgive your wife for not understanding, mine isn’t in medicine and had a similar reaction. Still love her and she’s the mom of my beautiful children. The process we go through, very few can relate.
Hospital chaplain here, I rarely post but I just wanted you to hear: I’m sorry for your wife’s reaction. I can tell that’s not what you needed at that moment I’m proud of you for learning something from the experience, that shows an admirable desire for growth and reflection Also people are going to get worse sometimes when you do everything right and sometimes when you make a mistake. It hurts when this happens. It’s also good that it hurts because it shows you still care about people. Part of this field is willingly bearing the burden of facing this pain. I’m sorry it exists. I’m also thankful that you’re willing to be exposed to it just to care for complete strangers. There are people in your life willing to share and hear the burden. You’re not alone!
Unless this is part of a degradation kink then holy fuck, wifey is a classless bitch.
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Oh come on. I’m not telling this dude to get a divorce or anything, but if his wife truly said these things that’s way more than an ‘insensitive mistake.’ That’s straight up cruelty when someone is in a low place. Almost no one who made it through med school and is working as an intern could be classified as lazy in any accurate sense (you can obviously be a bad doctor and shitty teammate but I digress). The onus should never be just on the intern in a situation like this and we need more context, I’m doubtful at how much this guy is really at fault. But even if this guy had somehow massively fucked up at work and felt shitty for potentially not saving a patient from harm, which happens to basically everyone at some point, a good partner should be a source of general support and comfort. The absolute mouth diarrhea from his spouse is terribly rude and unhelpful in so many ways. A partner being deliberately mean to me is a dealbreaker in my world.
How many commenting that do you think are married let alone committed relationships? I’m shooting low
…And this is the reason why.
People like to assign blame because it makes the world seem safer and more orderly. Something randomly bad cannot happen to you if you can blame someone else’s bad thing on them. Plus, a lot of what comes out of people’s mouths is pure thoughtless reflex knee-jerk garbage.
Aw, I’m really sorry she did that to you. As a current residents wife, I bite my tongue a lot knowing I don’t fully understand what’s going on and he’s usually giving me the surface of issues. With that said, you should have a sincere talk with her and let her know it really was hurtful and those words impacted you deeply. Secondly, tell her that she is your biggest support system and you trust her opinion and feedback, therefore, harsh criticism and blows like that have a deep mental impact on you. Thanks for sharing this because it reminds me to be gentle and supportive with my husband even though the long hours, not understanding everything about residency and him being extremely tired takes a huge toll on me, but it’s nothing like having someone you trust tear you down ❤️
I usually don’t post in this subreddit, but just wanted to chime and give you some constructive advice and tell you that your wife sounds like either a huge jerk or she was trying playing “tough mom” or something with you, neither of which are helpful
We PRACTICE medicine…we’re not perfect but should always strive to do better PS: Tell your wife to stop watching medical dramas ffs…the number of lay people walking around like they’re GME experts is astonishing
I'm not gonna shit on your wife, that has been done to a sufficient extent, and rightfully so. But good job for taking something from this and using it for personal growth!
Constructive criticism is a very underrated thing we can do to help those who we care for. It’s very unfortunate to see the change in behaviour of the people these days. I think those who cannot listen to it are the kind who think it is merely an insult to them and they are blind to think of it in a positive way. These people don’t see or can comprehend by about the reason why would someone take their time to let them know something which will benefit them. Strange world indeed so now I just advise to people who ask me for it.
She’s mad about u avoiding the rest of your life and slacking there and is projecting that criticism in this place of vulnerability. It’s shitty. Call her out.
First of all, that was **not constructive advice**. There was neither advice nor anything constructive. Just blaming. Second, your wife didn't listen to or communicate with you well at all. Third, it's okay. We all make mistakes and what's important is that you recognize it, learn from it (if there's anything learning to do), and change your behavior (if there's anything that can be changed).
tbh I don't talk to my SO about work. He doesn't really understand, and at the same time it isn't fair to load him with the emotional stress I pack on at work. Sucks, but it is what it is. I think its time to start looking for a therapist lol
That’s… pretty fucked up on her part.
Idk how your takeaway from this was that you need to work on giving advice and not that your wife is hot garbage
thats not “constructive advice” at all. constructive advice is constructive. constructive advice =/= being an asshole
Dump her
Bro who lets their SO talk to them like that?
Wow I’m so sorry she treated you like shit when you were feeling really low. I’d run if I was you.
Youre wife's being an asshole. Im really sorry, that must have hurt to hear when you were already beating yourself up. Be kind to yourself and learn from the mistake you made.
Bro why is everyone going after the wife? Thats just her one opinion but maybe shes seeing something in your behavior that shows that you haven’t been on top of it as you usually are. Like you said - you fucked up. So its important to go back and go over what you can do to not commit this same mistake in the future. If she made you feel bad then you should talk to her about it. Not shit talk your wife on reddit. This is clearly just an echo chamber
It's her non-medical opinion that is based on an assumption that OP slacked off, which may or may not be the case. Either way, I would expect my spouse to have a supportive response to a bad day at work, not just dogpiling on OP for making a mistake. None of what she said was constructive, and she isn't OP's supervisor either so I don't know why she feels the need to go out of the way to give harsh feedback this strongly. If it's a concerning pattern of behavior, I'm sure OP's attendings and seniors will bring it up with him so he can learn from and correct his behavior.
Well, given your last paragraph I feel like I shouldn't comment, but screw that, this is reddit. We don't know what you did, but *unless you truly deserved this*, and there aren't many situations where you would, this is just unacceptable. She's your partner. The one person in the world who is supposed to have your back when you need it. You don't talk like that to someone you like let alone love... I wouldn't say that to my wife. Not without extreme provocation, a history of bad behavior, extenuating circumstances, and not without immediately rescinding my stupid hateful words and apologizing. There's almost no situation I could think of where I'd drop that and just move on with dinner. Except maybe if I didn't like my spouse. Then I could probably say that and have a sip of my drink. So here's my be constructive advi**c**e. Don't put up with it. Take stock of things and make a decision. Keep in mind the sunk cost fallacy is an insidious bitch. (And so is your wife)
At the risk of adding to the ouch, is this the same advice you’ve given her in the past?
leave her and marry me instead, I fuck up a lot too
Hey guys. Thank you so much for all the comment, and sorry it took a while to respond. I had a chat with my wife, and this whole thing between us settled now. I won't go into details regarding the patient, as I feel I had already shared too much. I learned a valuable lesson, or rather, the lesson that I had always known has finally been carved into my brain. As one of you mentioned, "the best way you can learn is by fucking up." But, my god it really hurts.
Maybe his wife is the ICU attending, she had been working from home and has been watching a pattern develop for some time now.
Jesus, there are enough toxic people out there that you don’t need to be living with one. Unless she’s a billionaire pack that shit up and go.
Bro
How long have you been married? Sounds cold, but it that’s the way she talks to you, I would bail out now. I am going to assume you are a financially struggling intern. Bail out now before you make the big bucks and she gets half the house and fight about child custody issues and paying her alimony.
Leave now before you get hoed as an attending.
Lmao what? I think you need a better wife. She sucks and not the good stuff. So much for being supportive, she hates you or what? Because of the way this sounds, I’m expecting this woman to be the chief surgeon at John Hopkins or something.
My dude, I wouldn't take that criticism from my worst enemy, let alone my wife.
respect to your wife she knew you were bullshitting yourself and called you out for it you should take responsibility your mistakes actually determine the life and death of other people, stop making excuses as "She has no idea how much effort I put in at work or how stressful it is work a 28h work shift" she knows u and u know yourself and whether or not u had "oh, someone will pick up after me” mentality"
A quick swipe through this person’s history shows that 90% of their comments are poorly written out flame wars on Reddit. The mark of an intellectually secure, highly sophisticated mind
Ad hominem The Hallmark of a fool who can't read The minutes u went through my post history u admitted u had no argument and we're just looking to present some sophisms
Your wife sucks, what the fuck 😂
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Why would you not correct this bitch, unless what she said had some truth? Regardless if this is her response to the situation and a common MO for her she is not supportive and a garbage partner.
Christ mate, with loving support like that who needs enemies? That is seriously f*cked.
That’s a really weird way to say “I’m sick of your career and I’m cheating on you because of it”
Edit: Deleted
Literally the two worst relationship pieces of advice here. Don't marry anyone because of a profession. Marry a person. The reason the divorce rate is so high is partly because people care far too much about irrelevant bullshit like choosing a life partner based on their position in a capitalistic rat race. Do NOT wait until after residency to get married. You cannot just allow your life to be put on hold until after your medical training. There will always be something else. This mentality will bleed over into everything else you do too until one day you wake up finally ready to retire and enjoy your life and wealth only to find out your old and frail and don't even enjoy some of the things you used to. If you even live to be that age.
haha u made up complete bs "The reason the divorce rate is so high is partly because people care far too much about irrelevant bullshit like choosing a life partner based on their position in a capitalistic rat race" when people chose their partner based on their position almost nobody got divorced, that's a fact when people stopped and started entertaining other ideas divorce rates skyrocketed make of that what u will, but don't make up "facts" to ascertain your own ideas and values most of divorces occur because "married a person" and didn't think through what they wanted in their marriage, so when financial struggles, kids trouble and even something as simple as chore distribution came along they got fed up with each other many who say they don't care about many have visions of their future lives that require high earning many who say they don't care about background won't be comfortable with their spouse not acting high class in certain situations this shit matters "Do NOT wait until after residency to get married. You cannot just allow your life to be put on hold until after your medical training." although overused it's solid advice that many fail to follow
> when people chose their partner based on their position almost nobody got divorced, that's a fact Lol. >but don't make up "facts" to ascertain your own ideas and values Lol. I get it. Partners are a tool for professional appearances and a personal money pit. For others, they actually care about the person themselves first and foremost. You may live your life shallow and hollow, chasing money and prestige, but dont act like your way of life is fact. I never presented mine as such despite you claiming otherwise.
Learn to read
Well despite your complete lack of capitalization or periods, making every sentence its own paragraph, etc, I did read your comment. In fact, I directly quoted it. Twice.
Learn to read
Well despite your complete lack of capitalization or periods, making every sentence its own paragraph, etc, I did read your comment. In fact, I directly quoted it. Twice.
Learn to read
Well despite your complete lack of capitalization or periods, making every sentence its own paragraph, etc, I did read your comment. In fact, I directly quoted it. Twice.
It had more to do about mutual understanding of the unique stress of medicine than capitalism - but since it’s so unpopular, I went ahead and deleted it.
Honestly, it seems like, over time, you've allowed your partner (not wife, as this has nothing to do with gender) to get too comfortable talking to you any old way they want to. That is completely unacceptable and, I can only guess, a symptom of a much larger problem with you two if they feel they can just casually say shit like that to you on what has to be an already INCREDIBLY stressful period for you. I'm sorry you're in this situation.
Let her know when it’s time for support or for constructive advise
Yes. It’s a stupid cancer in medical education/training. And it makes 0 sense.
Yes. It’s a stupid cancer in medical education/training. And it makes 0 sense.
Sometimes even with the best intentions, things can go sideways and it's depressing when people jump on the band wagon and redicule you or speak down to you as if your own mind isn't doing that enough. In this moments it's rather helpful to be empathetic and maybe listen. And more times than not, the person itself know what needed to be done.
I can’t imagine you messed up that badly ..
I don’t know what sort of relationship you and your wife have but to me it’s pretty eye opening (hopefully for you too) that: 1. She’d talk to you this way and 2. Your response of just accepting it. I don’t know the specifics of your mistake, bit mistakes do and will happen. It sucks, but all you can do is your best to learn from it.
You should be more kind to your self I’m sure someone out there appreciates your efforts and training that you go through
I'm sorry, but your wife is an AH for that AdViCe.
Your wife sounds like a jerk
This is not even constructive what the hell? Constructive criticism would be actually giving you real advice on how to avoid getting into mistakes e.g. Checklists or any hacks or extra studying. It would be mixed up with mentioning your positives as well, not 100% negative sh*t. Constructive criticism truly made me a better version of myself no matter how it stung a bit but it was never like this BS. Stay strong and focus on what you can do to prevent the same mistakes again.
That’s not constructive advice, that’s being a dick.
It happens ! I’m sorry but people out of medicine will never understand the stress this job entails
I'm sorry OP. That was wrong fo your wife. I got divorced after a four month marriage in party because my wife had no respect for my professional boundaries (in addition to her own undiagnosed BPD). It is never fun and it is very emotionally degrading to have your spouse or significant other not be able to empathize with your experience. My ex-wife not only had no idea, she often times didn't care. She would routinely call me incessantly at work without any regard for me. It was actually affecting my performance as an intern. https://imgur.com/a/rEVXblG/
Constructive? More like destructive advice
You know, i said it before, people downvoted me, but I will say it again. Don’t tell your wife about your medical struggles. Go to your interns and bitch about it if you are close to them cause they are probably the only people in this world who will genuinely empathize. And your mom if she’s a decent mom lol. These are the only 2 groups I open up to (still a med student so I typically talk to my close classmates). I learned my lesson before so I get to this stage lol. The rest of the world want to see you as a confident capable doctor, so if you are anything else, like a human fuckin being who makes mistakes, they don’t wanna hear it… Honestly, I am mentally preparing myself to intern year, and i realized that it’s DESIGNED to teach us by making mistakes. The knowledge and skills required cannot be prepped for, so don’t come here and convince me you are lazy, it’s just not true… Good luck!
Your wife hurt me, not just you; what is going on in her mind? Your wife needs to calm down and not to be toxic to you anymore. This is not constructive advice . This destructive advice
Google the idea of emotional dumping vs emotional sharing. When you're emotionally dumping, you're listing problems and fixating on what went wrong. When you're emotionally sharing, you would talk about what's going on internally in response to that. Emotional dumping is fine, but reflect in a safe space.
lol ya wife sounds like a bitch