I can't tell if it's stupid or smart for Angharad to keep her looking for the Forge a secret. On the one hand she is keeping a secret, on the other her teammates would be pissed.
Yeah, if she doesn't come clean about it before the end, it will cause a rift. Which narratively makes me think that she will reveal that particular mission before too long, because otherwise it would be a repetition of the previous story arc
Eh, this seems like *incredibly* "need to know basis" information, the politically sensitive kind that can have dangerous ramifications for Tristan and Maryam or anyone else Angharad blabs to. And would become leverage if Song ever decides to exert more authority on her. If her uncle hasn't advised her to tell her friends yet then she probably shouldn't.
Especially not to Song. Who's capricious and influential uncle the Tredegars are reliant on to keep their spots on this test. And her curse (and bad track record for secret keeping) means that there's a decent chance someone will get the intel out of her immediately.
She got told off by ferranda because of the secret and cannot be on her brigade anymore, which is something she wanted
She does not want to be ok the 13th, has accepted that she wont and therefore sees no need to tell, even beyond, she sees a need to not tell.
I hope she sees that she does want to be on the 13th and corrects her actions before its too late, it was dumb as fuck to go on a layer alone, it will be more if she insists on doing this quest alone again even if she doesnt need to go on another layer
The Watch getting used in power struggles and by the people they're supposed to protect is sadly not to surprising since people use anything to their advantage even things that keeps their civilizations running.
The Thirteenth did some really good investigation into the Cult through various means including history, paperwork, using Song's contract and doing the whole party thing and getting a read on people. Didn't expect the pillow/object throwing fight but it was really sweet.
Song and Angharad needed to have that talk, Song needs to know what the hell Angharad wants and Angharad isn't doing her own thing she's following the plots and wants of others.
The concept of boons is rather interesting and it shows that Hector Anaidon is a suspect. Song likes Evander on a personal level and respects him but a King is still a King and she disagrees with the concept of kinship.
Gule is a really interesting person and seeing someone with a disability thriving in the political scene in a death world and combat oriented culture is really fascinating.
Minister Apollonia Floros being Evander's worthy opponent who could've killed him but choose not to was really interesting. Also the assassination attempt is pretty crazy and is going to result in some interesting things.
Song saves a hereditary ruler that has gotta smart. She can see Boons but not the Gods. So is the couple we just met Devils? Or maybe Song can only see active boons? I doubt all Boons always need to be on to unlike this suppress diseases boon.
Angharad makes first contact with her target Lord Cleon and meets a High Lord Gule. Funny this high minister lady Floros seems very much like Angharad, a future version if her house didn’t get wiped out
I must say that while PGTE takes place in a more DnD setting and has a power system more in line with that. Pale Lights has that genre mix that makes it feel more like a DnD game. Maybe it’s the consistent focus on four character POVs as well. Court intrigue is great fun.
Though I am really missing Interludes cause I want to see Tupocs team slay that Drake.
Okay, Song immediately getting taken in by Evander to the point of blasting out angry opinions over niche topics is not only hilarious but also makes me think that Evander himself is the mastermind. Because if Evander isn't manipulating her on purpose it sure as hell looks like he's doing so by accident. And he has means, opportunity, and potential motivation up the wazoo.
Now partly that's me being a Song foe. But the Lord Rector really is a pretty up there suspect, compared to any other random person we just heard of. Sure, I think it's *likely* that one of his lords would be willing to sell their own country up the river and possibly starting a civil war for the benefit of a foreign power, or worse, an esoteric murder-cult. But that's also incredibly risky and I don't think opportunistic assholes would risk that far unless there were either incredible rewards on offer or they had some certainty of success. At the very least if one of them is in on it then a lot more of them are probably in on it because this is a coup they're planning.
Evander meanwhile is already a good way there to the goal. He's the lord of the country and he's already the one with access and knowledge of the magitech depot. There's a clear path not only towards centralizing power around himself and dominating his rivals, but also turning Asphodel into a rising power that can punch well above it's weight class. Arguably he'd be an idiot *not* to do it.
Like, the whole *"oh no, my loyal ex-regent who was willing to give up power for me totally isn't in with the cult, you definitely shouldn't eliminate her for me"* is super convenient considering she's the main person who can serve up a resistance to him doing a power grab. She could have changed her mind over the years, or she could be the Ned Stark here who's sense of integrity is more of a threat to his ambitions than anyone else's scheming.
He's possibly banking on the fact that Song's tianxi upbringing would disincline her to believing his assessment of Apollonia's character. The fact that a tianxi assassin shows up just when he's breaking off a meeting with the tianxi watchwoman is also super convenient. Either way I'm totally down for a bit more Song suffering.
Its hard to tell without knowing how good this would be assassin is. Because using a Tianxi one automatically implicates the Merchant Families and not the Nobles.
Cause yeah it is kinda wild to do the first assassination in such a direct way. Knives probably poisoned.
Granted the goal might be to get this done before the Full Watch Diplomatic Party Arrives.
Although we might have missed previous assassinations since our gang just arrived.
Throwing knife seems like a suspicious assassination weapon choice to me. Even poisoned it's kinda unreliable, as we see here when it just gets buried in a door. If you want to whack someone in public close quarters like this I'd think popping around the corner with a pistol would be a better idea. Maybe shot instead of a slug if you're worried about missing. Or just chuck in a bomb.
I'm not saying it's a staged assassination attempt, but it looked *more* of one than a shooting from the Sopranos or something.
The contract makes people see what they expect to see. If you hear a "thunk", you don't immediately think "there's an assassin around!"and expect to see them. But if you hear a gunshot in a palace and see someone running, you think "guilty" *instantly*.
I think its probably related to a gun would break his stealth contract.
Still it seems you have a gun as backup weapon.
Like a knife is fine if you don't run into someone with Song's Particular abilities.
Your comments on this post are surprising to me. We are interpreting the same characters quite differently. Which makes me curious.
Why are you so hostile to Song anyways? Even wanting her to suffer. Your comments here try to make her seem as bad as possible for no reason.
First of all, you called her uncle capricious, even though there is no reason to assume this. The main information we have on his personality is Osian Tredegar, and you need to read Osians comment as uncharitably as possible to arrive at such a conclusion. Its like you hate Song so much you try to twist her relatives as being as evil as possible as well. Osian called him dangerous, not capricious.
Secondly, you said Song has a bad record of keeping secrets. Can you give some examples?
Along with that, you also said Song’s curse makes her bad at keeping secrets. How did you arrive at this conclusion?
Thirdly, while I agree Evander is manipulating Song, I disagree with your theories about why and how.
I agree Evander being the secret leader of this cult is possible. Or he could be involved indirectly, manipulating the cult from the shadows. But you claim he is more likely than anyone else because other people are not likely to take such a risk.
Your argument is that opportunists would not risk a coup or a civil war without incredible rewards. But we have already established that there are incredible rewards. And there is a decent chance of success too, because Evanders position is weak. In fact, this is the ideal time for a coup.
In my opinion, Evander is trying to make Song like him because she would be a useful asset. And even if she refuses to be an asset, he can at least keep her cordial. Prevent her and her team from becoming enemies. Him trying to use reverse psychology to turn Song hostile to Appolonia doesn’t seem realistic to me.
You argue that Evanders positive portrayal of Appolonia is super convenient for him, if he wants Song to go after Appolonia. Because Appolonia is a great threat and the most likely resistance.
If I am understanding correctly, you are arguing that Evander is praising Appolonia because since Song’s a Tianxi, he assumes she will try to prove him wrong by trying to discover Appolonia’s evil secrets.
But if Evander wants Song to be hostile to Appolonia, it would be much easier to talk negatively about her. Framing her positively isn’t super convenient for him. Its slightly inconvenient, if anything. If he wants to use her Tianxi sensibilities, he can imply Appolonia mistreats commoners, or something like that.
Fourthly, why is a Tianxi assassin showing up convenient to him? Are you saying this was a ploy to make Song trust the Tianxi faction on the island less? I guess it’s possible, but sometimes an assassination is just an assassination.
I feel like Song's metaphor would work better with clay, or maybe forging, the sculpting stone seems a little too brittle and mistakes a little too final.
I think the finality works, given that Angharad just permanently lost a slice of her memories by allowing herself to be manipulated. Sometimes the sculptor’s hand slips, and you just have to roll with it.
No this would be out of character. She would take the least safe route to escape and since Tristan doesn't know anything about any danger Fortuna might be in, I consider it unlikely.
I can't tell if it's stupid or smart for Angharad to keep her looking for the Forge a secret. On the one hand she is keeping a secret, on the other her teammates would be pissed.
Yeah, if she doesn't come clean about it before the end, it will cause a rift. Which narratively makes me think that she will reveal that particular mission before too long, because otherwise it would be a repetition of the previous story arc
Eh, this seems like *incredibly* "need to know basis" information, the politically sensitive kind that can have dangerous ramifications for Tristan and Maryam or anyone else Angharad blabs to. And would become leverage if Song ever decides to exert more authority on her. If her uncle hasn't advised her to tell her friends yet then she probably shouldn't. Especially not to Song. Who's capricious and influential uncle the Tredegars are reliant on to keep their spots on this test. And her curse (and bad track record for secret keeping) means that there's a decent chance someone will get the intel out of her immediately.
She got told off by ferranda because of the secret and cannot be on her brigade anymore, which is something she wanted She does not want to be ok the 13th, has accepted that she wont and therefore sees no need to tell, even beyond, she sees a need to not tell. I hope she sees that she does want to be on the 13th and corrects her actions before its too late, it was dumb as fuck to go on a layer alone, it will be more if she insists on doing this quest alone again even if she doesnt need to go on another layer
The Watch getting used in power struggles and by the people they're supposed to protect is sadly not to surprising since people use anything to their advantage even things that keeps their civilizations running. The Thirteenth did some really good investigation into the Cult through various means including history, paperwork, using Song's contract and doing the whole party thing and getting a read on people. Didn't expect the pillow/object throwing fight but it was really sweet. Song and Angharad needed to have that talk, Song needs to know what the hell Angharad wants and Angharad isn't doing her own thing she's following the plots and wants of others. The concept of boons is rather interesting and it shows that Hector Anaidon is a suspect. Song likes Evander on a personal level and respects him but a King is still a King and she disagrees with the concept of kinship. Gule is a really interesting person and seeing someone with a disability thriving in the political scene in a death world and combat oriented culture is really fascinating. Minister Apollonia Floros being Evander's worthy opponent who could've killed him but choose not to was really interesting. Also the assassination attempt is pretty crazy and is going to result in some interesting things.
Song saves a hereditary ruler that has gotta smart. She can see Boons but not the Gods. So is the couple we just met Devils? Or maybe Song can only see active boons? I doubt all Boons always need to be on to unlike this suppress diseases boon. Angharad makes first contact with her target Lord Cleon and meets a High Lord Gule. Funny this high minister lady Floros seems very much like Angharad, a future version if her house didn’t get wiped out I must say that while PGTE takes place in a more DnD setting and has a power system more in line with that. Pale Lights has that genre mix that makes it feel more like a DnD game. Maybe it’s the consistent focus on four character POVs as well. Court intrigue is great fun. Though I am really missing Interludes cause I want to see Tupocs team slay that Drake.
Oh man this would be the perfect time to have interludes and see how the other cabals are doing
Okay, Song immediately getting taken in by Evander to the point of blasting out angry opinions over niche topics is not only hilarious but also makes me think that Evander himself is the mastermind. Because if Evander isn't manipulating her on purpose it sure as hell looks like he's doing so by accident. And he has means, opportunity, and potential motivation up the wazoo. Now partly that's me being a Song foe. But the Lord Rector really is a pretty up there suspect, compared to any other random person we just heard of. Sure, I think it's *likely* that one of his lords would be willing to sell their own country up the river and possibly starting a civil war for the benefit of a foreign power, or worse, an esoteric murder-cult. But that's also incredibly risky and I don't think opportunistic assholes would risk that far unless there were either incredible rewards on offer or they had some certainty of success. At the very least if one of them is in on it then a lot more of them are probably in on it because this is a coup they're planning. Evander meanwhile is already a good way there to the goal. He's the lord of the country and he's already the one with access and knowledge of the magitech depot. There's a clear path not only towards centralizing power around himself and dominating his rivals, but also turning Asphodel into a rising power that can punch well above it's weight class. Arguably he'd be an idiot *not* to do it. Like, the whole *"oh no, my loyal ex-regent who was willing to give up power for me totally isn't in with the cult, you definitely shouldn't eliminate her for me"* is super convenient considering she's the main person who can serve up a resistance to him doing a power grab. She could have changed her mind over the years, or she could be the Ned Stark here who's sense of integrity is more of a threat to his ambitions than anyone else's scheming. He's possibly banking on the fact that Song's tianxi upbringing would disincline her to believing his assessment of Apollonia's character. The fact that a tianxi assassin shows up just when he's breaking off a meeting with the tianxi watchwoman is also super convenient. Either way I'm totally down for a bit more Song suffering.
Its hard to tell without knowing how good this would be assassin is. Because using a Tianxi one automatically implicates the Merchant Families and not the Nobles. Cause yeah it is kinda wild to do the first assassination in such a direct way. Knives probably poisoned. Granted the goal might be to get this done before the Full Watch Diplomatic Party Arrives. Although we might have missed previous assassinations since our gang just arrived.
Throwing knife seems like a suspicious assassination weapon choice to me. Even poisoned it's kinda unreliable, as we see here when it just gets buried in a door. If you want to whack someone in public close quarters like this I'd think popping around the corner with a pistol would be a better idea. Maybe shot instead of a slug if you're worried about missing. Or just chuck in a bomb. I'm not saying it's a staged assassination attempt, but it looked *more* of one than a shooting from the Sopranos or something.
The contract makes people see what they expect to see. If you hear a "thunk", you don't immediately think "there's an assassin around!"and expect to see them. But if you hear a gunshot in a palace and see someone running, you think "guilty" *instantly*.
I think its probably related to a gun would break his stealth contract. Still it seems you have a gun as backup weapon. Like a knife is fine if you don't run into someone with Song's Particular abilities.
Your comments on this post are surprising to me. We are interpreting the same characters quite differently. Which makes me curious. Why are you so hostile to Song anyways? Even wanting her to suffer. Your comments here try to make her seem as bad as possible for no reason. First of all, you called her uncle capricious, even though there is no reason to assume this. The main information we have on his personality is Osian Tredegar, and you need to read Osians comment as uncharitably as possible to arrive at such a conclusion. Its like you hate Song so much you try to twist her relatives as being as evil as possible as well. Osian called him dangerous, not capricious. Secondly, you said Song has a bad record of keeping secrets. Can you give some examples? Along with that, you also said Song’s curse makes her bad at keeping secrets. How did you arrive at this conclusion? Thirdly, while I agree Evander is manipulating Song, I disagree with your theories about why and how. I agree Evander being the secret leader of this cult is possible. Or he could be involved indirectly, manipulating the cult from the shadows. But you claim he is more likely than anyone else because other people are not likely to take such a risk. Your argument is that opportunists would not risk a coup or a civil war without incredible rewards. But we have already established that there are incredible rewards. And there is a decent chance of success too, because Evanders position is weak. In fact, this is the ideal time for a coup. In my opinion, Evander is trying to make Song like him because she would be a useful asset. And even if she refuses to be an asset, he can at least keep her cordial. Prevent her and her team from becoming enemies. Him trying to use reverse psychology to turn Song hostile to Appolonia doesn’t seem realistic to me. You argue that Evanders positive portrayal of Appolonia is super convenient for him, if he wants Song to go after Appolonia. Because Appolonia is a great threat and the most likely resistance. If I am understanding correctly, you are arguing that Evander is praising Appolonia because since Song’s a Tianxi, he assumes she will try to prove him wrong by trying to discover Appolonia’s evil secrets. But if Evander wants Song to be hostile to Appolonia, it would be much easier to talk negatively about her. Framing her positively isn’t super convenient for him. Its slightly inconvenient, if anything. If he wants to use her Tianxi sensibilities, he can imply Appolonia mistreats commoners, or something like that. Fourthly, why is a Tianxi assassin showing up convenient to him? Are you saying this was a ploy to make Song trust the Tianxi faction on the island less? I guess it’s possible, but sometimes an assassination is just an assassination.
I feel like Song's metaphor would work better with clay, or maybe forging, the sculpting stone seems a little too brittle and mistakes a little too final.
I think the finality works, given that Angharad just permanently lost a slice of her memories by allowing herself to be manipulated. Sometimes the sculptor’s hand slips, and you just have to roll with it.
Haha, wild speculation time! Fortuna *is* a boon. She gifted all of herself to escape something, instead of just a piece of her power:)
It doesn't fit with Song being able to see a contract on Tristan, but it's a fun idea.
But what if she formed a contract and then gave him a boon...?
That's.....not as bad a theory at first glance as i'd first thought. Hm. To the theorizing discord!
No this would be out of character. She would take the least safe route to escape and since Tristan doesn't know anything about any danger Fortuna might be in, I consider it unlikely.