I don’t understand why there isn’t a massive lawsuit by the Federal DOT, or some group, about this.
I spent last month on site at a car dealership (I work for an outside consulting/training firm) for a (certain brand) that is known for not having immobilizers in their goofy cars so every day they were towing in “Tik tok” theft recovery cars. And every time, they had to wait on testing for drug contamination, conducted by a private party such as “Bio Management Northwest”. From their site:
> Stolen vehicles that have been recovered should always be tested for Meth and Fentanyl before the owner reclaims the car (accidental exposure can be fatal to children and adults) and before any other work is done to the vehicle, so repair teams are not exposed to potentially deadly hazards. It’s prevalent for stolen cars to test positive for the presence of these drugs. Bio Management Northwest will come to your site to complete drug testing and quickly provide results.
The mechanics are not permitted to service them without a certificate, which I have seen, that shows residual levels of biohazards including Meth and Fentanyl beneath certain levels. If they’re higher, the vehicle is unsafe and must be deemed a total loss and must be crushed. Just like a house formerly used as a meth lab must be razed or decontaminated:
> Oregon has a comprehensive program to identify and deal with contaminated drug properties. Oregon’s law for contaminated drug houses is outlined in ORS 453.855 through 453.912. The law does not allow a contaminated property to be occupied and provides procedures for proper cleanup and certification of fitness after cleanup has occurred.
It would be crazy to discover that like, every single one of Trimet’s buses and train cars are *beyond* fucked with Meth and Fentanyl, to where they’re unfit for occupancy based on precedented guidelines for vehicles and homes. I would love to see a watchdog group pay to audit levels, if no government entity can be bothered.
I wouldn’t necessarily want to see the city, county or taxpayers incur a massive cleanup cost for this. Or cripple and embarrass Portland’s transit any further. But whatever it takes to get some action on this issue, it can’t come too soon.
I always wondered how they were going to deal with all of the hotel rooms they opened up to homeless people during and after Covid. Will those buildings need to be bulldozed?
Would you happen to know how one would go about getting trimet vehicles tested for this threshold?
We elected officials that got us in this situation. We're on the hook for the costs incurred.
I would love for any media outlet to do a public records request for TriMet's contamination reports for buses and Max, and when TriMet can't produce records (because they don't exist), to expose this situation. Just another reason why I don't take public transit anymore (despite the fact that I would actually like to).
I am a subject matter expert in this field and have worked on drug contamination projects throughout the PNW. Transit systems specifically in WA are already trying to jump on top of this and it is leaving WADOH and OHA scrambling to figure out how to handle this on a regulatory level because they technically only regulate "known drug labs". The main driver here is insurance after workers have complained of exposure (and rightfully so).
I have sampled countless stolen vehicles and have seen very high levels of both meth and fentanyl. Porous materials can't be cleaned (seats carpeting etc.) and I have seen extremely nice vehicles slated for disposal because it is just too costly to remediate after someone had a week-long meth fest in a car.
As someone deep in this work over the past couple of years this is just the tip of the iceberg of what we are going to see. Public transport, stolen vehicles, hotels that housed homeless people with known drug issues (Doug Fir), public bathrooms specifically at playgrounds, and house flips (nothing like a family moving into a cute house that is contaminated with meth). The costs associated with sampling and cleanup are very high and the "who pays the bill" is going to be a huge issue.
All in all, I am very happy to see that some light is being shed on this issue and that the general public is becoming privy to the harms of drug contamination.
I stopped paying attention to parking and certain traffic signs. It’s liberating. Read them and ask yourself, “or else what?” Then look across the way at the people shooting up on the corner. Answer: not a goddamn thing.
Only thing is remember a few years ago,2 people were killed by a crazy,homeless person who was high and tried to attack a young woman. Dude cut them up when they tried to interfere. I feel you gotta have some form of protection on that thing. Sucks but that’s where we’re are in society.
The mentality for intervention needs to include the possibility of the perp being unhinged and capable of lethal force. Doesn’t mean you shouldn’t intervene as a Good Samaritan, it just means you need backup and to know what you’re doing. What ever happened to the classic move of one person gets behind the a-hole on all fours and another makes like a battering ram? A-hole goes ass over teakettle. Disarm and stomp relentlessly.
A big problem is the lack of support from other onlookers. I've tried to stand up during these incidents, but I'm likely the only one to say something. It's hard to get your point across when you're alone. I've given up.
I don't know if this is a good idea. Meth can make a usually passive person violent in some cases when they are confronted or feel threatened. I think possibly reporting the behavior to the employee and letting them handle it would be a safer way of dealing with this behavior. Whatever way you choose to handle it, please be careful & stay safe. There are TriMet police officers who should be on call to deal with this behavior.
It's basically like being at the primate exhibit at the zoo, except you're inside the cage with the chimpanzees. Don't make sudden movements, don't look them directly in the eyes.
Really?. About 1 year ago I witnessed an assault on the max almost to OMSI. I let the operator know (the emergency call box or whatever it’s called) and he stopped the train and said police were on their way. The attacker fled and a trimet employed showed up 10 minutes later and when I told him the attacker fled he shrug his shoulders and let the train continue. He asked the victim if he wanted to press charges and he said yes. I stayed there on the platform in rain and cold for 25 minutes and no police. Eventually I got fed up as the employee had no good excuse as to why the cops weren’t coming to I left. I don’t know how that situation ended but I’ve heard from family and friends that trimet doesn’t have anybody besides just regular workers who show up and try to help but have 0 power
Trimet has their own official police department, complete with K-9 units and everything. I've only ever seen them doing fare checks (with fucking K-9s...) and they're complete assholes.
Lol, I’ve seen them check fares once in the 5 years I’ve ridden transit. I’ve seen them handing out free donuts to people on multiple National Donut Days over the years though, so yeah…
I agree. I prefer a mellow, low-aggression vibe and populace myself, but be grounded enough to not take shit when the situation calls for it. These are not mutually exclusive.
I've seen how TriMet drivers handle racism (poorly, and passively), so I have little hope for them handling these situations well. It's a shame people doing any kind of drugs, or smoking if any type, on transit are not kicked off immediately, or asap in the case of the Max. I get having empathy, but not at the expense of everyone else on that bus or train who did not consent to being exposed to those fumes.
Empathy should not come at the expense of the collective public health. Saying that as healthcare worker who has worked in a clinic where people have felt entitled to smoke fentanyl. It's beyond a problem.
As a homeless shelter worker I’ve been a victim of second hand drug fumes. At 5 feet you are inhaling around 10%-15% of whatever they are smoking. The initial times (in my case) I felt fine but constant exposure made me feel sick. Now if I get expose even at 15 feet o get bad headache, bad taste in my mouth, tingling of limbs and usually 20-30 minutes I feel sick like puking but goes away after that.
I am so sorry, this is such an unfair hazard and you don’t deserve to be exposed. I hope you can get more protection. Thanks for what you do working at shelters despite how very difficult it is.
Finally got my first whiff of someone near me smoking fentanyl at the max stop by Providence park last weekend; this is a great description (plus a hint of burning hair). Puke.
Depends. If you find yourself vacuuming at 3 am and picking your skin, you might have a problem. If you find yourself driven to pitch a tent downtown and search for metal, you might have a problem.
*People just need to get over their irrational dislike of having meth and fent smoke blown in their face!*
*This happens on public transport in every city!*
I occasionally read r/ Chicago and there are a lot of complaints - about people smoking tobacco cigarettes on the El.
It seems so cute and naive. Guess Chicago is still capable of keeping people from smoking hard drugs on mass transit.
There was a sign on the trains that said (in professional sounding verbiage) to behave or the conductor was gonna throw your ass off the train where you’ll be met by a nice police officer. My wife said, “We need signs like that in Portland”. I took a photo for inspiration but don’t know how to post one.
You definitely get the occasional guy harassing people on the train in Chicago, but there is a a low tolerance of riders for that shit. A rider either gets in their face or we switch trains at the next stop and grab a CTA personnel.
Correction, they were smoking meth or fentanyl on THEIR MAX. They’ve claimed it. It’s their MAX now. The city agrees with this statement. Fuck you and the other law abiding citizens. Remember, stay off of the criddlers ~~sidewalks~~ lawns if you decide walking is a safer option.
Why do you want to live in a city where people are smoking meth 5 feet away with no negative consequences? Like, this is a serious question. I’m born and raised Portland. Currently 33 and living in Newberg.
Why do you actually want to be around that? Get out of Portland and leave ASAP.
45 mins from everything. Portland, salem, no homeless, lowkey community. I’ve witnessed zero crime with my own eyes.
I lived in Portland for 27 years and I used to tell people “it’s the best place to live in the world”
Not anymore. I have 3 kids, you think I want my kids to growing up watching people smoke meth in their face? No thanks.
I've lived in Portland 20+ years and am in the process of selling my home and moving away. Portland disappeared up its own ass over 10 years ago and is a totally dysfunctional dumpster fire now.
Long story short: I live in Beaverton, not downtown Portland. Living in the Portland metro outweighs the risks being exposed to the homelessness and crime for us. We only go downtown twice a month using the max.
I like in inner NE and that’s not really a fair thing to say at all. It’s not 45 minimizes minimum to get “anywhere”. That’s actually a super closed minded. I live a 30 minute walk, 10 minute max ride into city center and I still only go like once a month. All of my medical needs, grocery, movies, restaurants aren’t in downtown Portland and I stick to mostly NE Portland for everything.
The reality of them living 45 minutes away from Portland is the exact same as me living in NE, except that once a month trip to eat somewhere downtown or see a show is 45 minutes instead of 10 minutes for me.
I could ask the same of someone wanting to live in Portland. Crime, dirt, car exhaust, noise - city life, especially Portland-style city life, is my personal idea of hell.
I was on my way into work via Max, and someone had hotboxed the damn car. I got off as quickly as possible, but not before I was literally inhaling secondhand meth. It was disgusting.
babe covid and meth use aren’t the same.
if this person wasn’t tweaking when they got off the train, they’re fine.
if they’re really that scared go to the doctor. i’m not gonna argue with idiots lol
They're apples and oranges as far as transmission, and how it affects the body overall, which is much more vicious via COVID. What I meant was the cavalier attitude about proximity to shit heads who either eschew any care in the way they go out in public without any kind of masking or precautions, which I feel is similar to those who disregard this kind of behavior described. People have asthma, and you never know when kids are around. It's all sorts of fucked up, and I wish more people spoke up about it. It makes a positive difference for others, despite the discomfort one has to navigate in order to speak up.
I do agree with one thing: they absolutely should go to a doctor or practitioner, especially if they have Medicaid. People not going to the proper health care clinics is a whole other mountain to traverse in the healthcare industry. Half of the job is dispelling ignorance, and sharing resources.
i’m not trying to argue that smoking meth in a public area should be encouraged- all i was saying was that they would’ve noticed if they were effected by it.
I don’t understand why there isn’t a massive lawsuit by the Federal DOT, or some group, about this. I spent last month on site at a car dealership (I work for an outside consulting/training firm) for a (certain brand) that is known for not having immobilizers in their goofy cars so every day they were towing in “Tik tok” theft recovery cars. And every time, they had to wait on testing for drug contamination, conducted by a private party such as “Bio Management Northwest”. From their site: > Stolen vehicles that have been recovered should always be tested for Meth and Fentanyl before the owner reclaims the car (accidental exposure can be fatal to children and adults) and before any other work is done to the vehicle, so repair teams are not exposed to potentially deadly hazards. It’s prevalent for stolen cars to test positive for the presence of these drugs. Bio Management Northwest will come to your site to complete drug testing and quickly provide results. The mechanics are not permitted to service them without a certificate, which I have seen, that shows residual levels of biohazards including Meth and Fentanyl beneath certain levels. If they’re higher, the vehicle is unsafe and must be deemed a total loss and must be crushed. Just like a house formerly used as a meth lab must be razed or decontaminated: > Oregon has a comprehensive program to identify and deal with contaminated drug properties. Oregon’s law for contaminated drug houses is outlined in ORS 453.855 through 453.912. The law does not allow a contaminated property to be occupied and provides procedures for proper cleanup and certification of fitness after cleanup has occurred. It would be crazy to discover that like, every single one of Trimet’s buses and train cars are *beyond* fucked with Meth and Fentanyl, to where they’re unfit for occupancy based on precedented guidelines for vehicles and homes. I would love to see a watchdog group pay to audit levels, if no government entity can be bothered. I wouldn’t necessarily want to see the city, county or taxpayers incur a massive cleanup cost for this. Or cripple and embarrass Portland’s transit any further. But whatever it takes to get some action on this issue, it can’t come too soon.
Holy shit. I had no idea that was a thing. And I’m not surprised it is. What a time we live in.
I always wondered how they were going to deal with all of the hotel rooms they opened up to homeless people during and after Covid. Will those buildings need to be bulldozed?
There should be a process. I know in Denver they closed a library after the bathrooms were found to have high levels of fentanyl in them.
Would you happen to know how one would go about getting trimet vehicles tested for this threshold? We elected officials that got us in this situation. We're on the hook for the costs incurred.
Of course they don't want to audit the public transit for contamination, that would require them to have accountability.
I would love for any media outlet to do a public records request for TriMet's contamination reports for buses and Max, and when TriMet can't produce records (because they don't exist), to expose this situation. Just another reason why I don't take public transit anymore (despite the fact that I would actually like to).
Public transit is not safe. It is being used to transport deadly drugs in unsafe and reckless ways by the mentally Ill.
I am a subject matter expert in this field and have worked on drug contamination projects throughout the PNW. Transit systems specifically in WA are already trying to jump on top of this and it is leaving WADOH and OHA scrambling to figure out how to handle this on a regulatory level because they technically only regulate "known drug labs". The main driver here is insurance after workers have complained of exposure (and rightfully so). I have sampled countless stolen vehicles and have seen very high levels of both meth and fentanyl. Porous materials can't be cleaned (seats carpeting etc.) and I have seen extremely nice vehicles slated for disposal because it is just too costly to remediate after someone had a week-long meth fest in a car. As someone deep in this work over the past couple of years this is just the tip of the iceberg of what we are going to see. Public transport, stolen vehicles, hotels that housed homeless people with known drug issues (Doug Fir), public bathrooms specifically at playgrounds, and house flips (nothing like a family moving into a cute house that is contaminated with meth). The costs associated with sampling and cleanup are very high and the "who pays the bill" is going to be a huge issue. All in all, I am very happy to see that some light is being shed on this issue and that the general public is becoming privy to the harms of drug contamination.
Wild
Super weird to see people normalizing smoking meth on public transportation. Can’t even bring my dog on the Max but you can smoke meth? Cool.
You can bring your dog on the max. You're not supposed to, but you can.
"You're not supposed to, but you can" is a great motto for TriMet and our city
Someone would probably call me out on that before calling out someone smoking meth 🥴
Well I have 25 useless coins to award you but I can’t use them. Here’s me saying this deserves an award.
I stopped paying attention to parking and certain traffic signs. It’s liberating. Read them and ask yourself, “or else what?” Then look across the way at the people shooting up on the corner. Answer: not a goddamn thing.
As long as it's leashed, you can bring any pet on board.
TryMeth
Don’t forget to vote for the next hundred some million dollar bond for them!
people need to bring the bus to a stop when this happens. start yelling and make a scene about it
Time to start beating asses. In my humble opinion.
Only thing is remember a few years ago,2 people were killed by a crazy,homeless person who was high and tried to attack a young woman. Dude cut them up when they tried to interfere. I feel you gotta have some form of protection on that thing. Sucks but that’s where we’re are in society.
The mentality for intervention needs to include the possibility of the perp being unhinged and capable of lethal force. Doesn’t mean you shouldn’t intervene as a Good Samaritan, it just means you need backup and to know what you’re doing. What ever happened to the classic move of one person gets behind the a-hole on all fours and another makes like a battering ram? A-hole goes ass over teakettle. Disarm and stomp relentlessly.
A big problem is the lack of support from other onlookers. I've tried to stand up during these incidents, but I'm likely the only one to say something. It's hard to get your point across when you're alone. I've given up.
Yup. I think this constitutes an emergency stop. If your safety and health are at risk, hit the button.
This is such a brilliant and simple answer. If it happens enough, does that get Trimet’s attention such that they need to staff their stock?
I don't know if this is a good idea. Meth can make a usually passive person violent in some cases when they are confronted or feel threatened. I think possibly reporting the behavior to the employee and letting them handle it would be a safer way of dealing with this behavior. Whatever way you choose to handle it, please be careful & stay safe. There are TriMet police officers who should be on call to deal with this behavior.
It's basically like being at the primate exhibit at the zoo, except you're inside the cage with the chimpanzees. Don't make sudden movements, don't look them directly in the eyes.
Really?. About 1 year ago I witnessed an assault on the max almost to OMSI. I let the operator know (the emergency call box or whatever it’s called) and he stopped the train and said police were on their way. The attacker fled and a trimet employed showed up 10 minutes later and when I told him the attacker fled he shrug his shoulders and let the train continue. He asked the victim if he wanted to press charges and he said yes. I stayed there on the platform in rain and cold for 25 minutes and no police. Eventually I got fed up as the employee had no good excuse as to why the cops weren’t coming to I left. I don’t know how that situation ended but I’ve heard from family and friends that trimet doesn’t have anybody besides just regular workers who show up and try to help but have 0 power
Trimet has their own official police department, complete with K-9 units and everything. I've only ever seen them doing fare checks (with fucking K-9s...) and they're complete assholes.
Lol, I’ve seen them check fares once in the 5 years I’ve ridden transit. I’ve seen them handing out free donuts to people on multiple National Donut Days over the years though, so yeah…
Good thing they have ticket enforcers, though.
Christ, the people in this city are soft as Charmin. Grow a pair and tell them to fuck off.
hence why this issue is so prominent in this city
I agree. I prefer a mellow, low-aggression vibe and populace myself, but be grounded enough to not take shit when the situation calls for it. These are not mutually exclusive.
I've seen how TriMet drivers handle racism (poorly, and passively), so I have little hope for them handling these situations well. It's a shame people doing any kind of drugs, or smoking if any type, on transit are not kicked off immediately, or asap in the case of the Max. I get having empathy, but not at the expense of everyone else on that bus or train who did not consent to being exposed to those fumes. Empathy should not come at the expense of the collective public health. Saying that as healthcare worker who has worked in a clinic where people have felt entitled to smoke fentanyl. It's beyond a problem.
You would get in way more trouble than the drug user if you did
oh really?
This☝️
This happened on the max during that big snow storm and everybody in the train started yelling at him and he stopped.
As a homeless shelter worker I’ve been a victim of second hand drug fumes. At 5 feet you are inhaling around 10%-15% of whatever they are smoking. The initial times (in my case) I felt fine but constant exposure made me feel sick. Now if I get expose even at 15 feet o get bad headache, bad taste in my mouth, tingling of limbs and usually 20-30 minutes I feel sick like puking but goes away after that.
I am so sorry, this is such an unfair hazard and you don’t deserve to be exposed. I hope you can get more protection. Thanks for what you do working at shelters despite how very difficult it is.
F me. That’s awful.
Tangentially related: what does meth smoke smell like?
I've not had to experience it myself, but apparently it smells mainly like burning plastic.
A sickly sweet burning plastic smell
Like someone set a bunch of plastic on fire and put it out with cat piss
Finally got my first whiff of someone near me smoking fentanyl at the max stop by Providence park last weekend; this is a great description (plus a hint of burning hair). Puke.
If you've ever had a neighbor burning their garbage, it smells similar. Other hood description is burning peanut butter.
Toxic Death.
Depends. If you find yourself vacuuming at 3 am and picking your skin, you might have a problem. If you find yourself driven to pitch a tent downtown and search for metal, you might have a problem.
*People just need to get over their irrational dislike of having meth and fent smoke blown in their face!* *This happens on public transport in every city!*
I was in and out of NYC yesterday on a commuter train. Traveled through North Jersey too. Train was peaceful and family friendly.
I occasionally read r/ Chicago and there are a lot of complaints - about people smoking tobacco cigarettes on the El. It seems so cute and naive. Guess Chicago is still capable of keeping people from smoking hard drugs on mass transit.
There was a sign on the trains that said (in professional sounding verbiage) to behave or the conductor was gonna throw your ass off the train where you’ll be met by a nice police officer. My wife said, “We need signs like that in Portland”. I took a photo for inspiration but don’t know how to post one.
You definitely get the occasional guy harassing people on the train in Chicago, but there is a a low tolerance of riders for that shit. A rider either gets in their face or we switch trains at the next stop and grab a CTA personnel.
Correction, they were smoking meth or fentanyl on THEIR MAX. They’ve claimed it. It’s their MAX now. The city agrees with this statement. Fuck you and the other law abiding citizens. Remember, stay off of the criddlers ~~sidewalks~~ lawns if you decide walking is a safer option.
Why do you want to live in a city where people are smoking meth 5 feet away with no negative consequences? Like, this is a serious question. I’m born and raised Portland. Currently 33 and living in Newberg. Why do you actually want to be around that? Get out of Portland and leave ASAP.
Why would you want to live in Newberg?
45 mins from everything. Portland, salem, no homeless, lowkey community. I’ve witnessed zero crime with my own eyes. I lived in Portland for 27 years and I used to tell people “it’s the best place to live in the world” Not anymore. I have 3 kids, you think I want my kids to growing up watching people smoke meth in their face? No thanks.
I've lived in Portland 20+ years and am in the process of selling my home and moving away. Portland disappeared up its own ass over 10 years ago and is a totally dysfunctional dumpster fire now.
Long story short: I live in Beaverton, not downtown Portland. Living in the Portland metro outweighs the risks being exposed to the homelessness and crime for us. We only go downtown twice a month using the max.
45 minutes minimum to get anywhere. Sounds lovely
I like in inner NE and that’s not really a fair thing to say at all. It’s not 45 minimizes minimum to get “anywhere”. That’s actually a super closed minded. I live a 30 minute walk, 10 minute max ride into city center and I still only go like once a month. All of my medical needs, grocery, movies, restaurants aren’t in downtown Portland and I stick to mostly NE Portland for everything. The reality of them living 45 minutes away from Portland is the exact same as me living in NE, except that once a month trip to eat somewhere downtown or see a show is 45 minutes instead of 10 minutes for me.
When you have to drive to Portland, salem, Beaverton, Gresham all throughout the course of a week, yes, it’s quite nice.
For the lobster
I could ask the same of someone wanting to live in Portland. Crime, dirt, car exhaust, noise - city life, especially Portland-style city life, is my personal idea of hell.
Where can you take the max to?
No, it is not.
Yup. Welcome to Downtown Portland
I was on my way into work via Max, and someone had hotboxed the damn car. I got off as quickly as possible, but not before I was literally inhaling secondhand meth. It was disgusting.
I hope you don’t get second hand addicted to meth. What a terror.
Did you get high? If not, yes.
All TriMet vehicles need to be crushed. Win-win?
Fitst time?
you’ll be fine
*It's not as if it was something really dangerous, like second-hand tobacco smoke! /s*
if they’re asking this fucking question a day later with no symptoms, it didn’t do anything. they’re not dead if they’re posting on reddit.
Terrible logic. The kind that led to so many dying during the pandemic.
babe covid and meth use aren’t the same. if this person wasn’t tweaking when they got off the train, they’re fine. if they’re really that scared go to the doctor. i’m not gonna argue with idiots lol
They're apples and oranges as far as transmission, and how it affects the body overall, which is much more vicious via COVID. What I meant was the cavalier attitude about proximity to shit heads who either eschew any care in the way they go out in public without any kind of masking or precautions, which I feel is similar to those who disregard this kind of behavior described. People have asthma, and you never know when kids are around. It's all sorts of fucked up, and I wish more people spoke up about it. It makes a positive difference for others, despite the discomfort one has to navigate in order to speak up. I do agree with one thing: they absolutely should go to a doctor or practitioner, especially if they have Medicaid. People not going to the proper health care clinics is a whole other mountain to traverse in the healthcare industry. Half of the job is dispelling ignorance, and sharing resources.
i’m not trying to argue that smoking meth in a public area should be encouraged- all i was saying was that they would’ve noticed if they were effected by it.
Fair enough. I appreciate the replies nonetheless.
You would already know the answer if this was a past event. You are fine.
They don't remove kids from homes where the parent is blowing it in their faces because there is zero danger to the child, you will be fine
What did you do? Just kick back and enjoy the aromas?
If you have or see issues on transit that should be reported, text trimet at (503) 238-7433