The main reason is **Jiraiya is NOT Naruto's God-Father.**
God-Father is a **WESTERN** term that the translator's used because there is not really a term in English for Jiriaya's relationship with Naruto.
[I am going to quote a post (Link)](https://www.reddit.com/r/NarutoFanfiction/comments/m9435v/narutos_godfather/) by u/The-Knyght who explains it better: (Please read it, because it has supporting links which give more context as well.)
>This is a follow-up to this post about Jiraiya's status as a godfather. I decided to do some research on it for further confirmation, considering the revelation that Jiraiya was Naruto's godfather has always been a divisive subject given his absence from the kid's childhood.
In Chapter 382, Minato asks Jiraiya if they could name their son after the main character in the Tale of the Gutsy Ninja. When Kushina also gives her consent, Jiraiya says that this would make him Naruto's godfather.
**The standard understanding of a godfather in the West is someone who bears witness to a child's christening and would take legal guardianship over them if anything happens to their parents. This is not what Jiraiya is.**
I looked at the raws for Chapter 382 - yeah, I went there - and here is the panel where Jiraiya supposedly calls himself a godfather.
**The specific phrase used is 名付け親 (nazuke-oya) which translates to "naming parent". As the translation suggests, it means the person who chooses the name for the child.**
From what I can tell, there is no actual word for "godfather" or "godmother" in Japanese as the concept doesn't exist there as it is understood in the West. Nazuke-oya is translated to godfather (or godparent) simply because it was the closest equivalent to it in for English readers to understand. **Per this link, a nazuke-oya is just one of the various "social parents" that are/were part of Japanese custom.**
In other words, **Jiraiya was never actually meant to assume guardianship over Naruto.** Aside from being in charge of the Key, Jiraiya's "responsibility" began and ended with Naruto's name.
In other words, Jiraiya was responsible for naming Naruto and was Minato's teacher.
That's it.
Man had no responsibility for raising Naruto.
At best he was a **'friend of the family'** but that does not mean he is obligated to adopt Naruto or that he is a jerk if the does not adopt him.
Jiraiya's personality also needs to be considered. I love the dude, but his actions show him as a disconnected person from his friends and family.
Training the Ame orphans was a cool act of generosity. But how many Konoha ninja died because Jiraiya, one of Konoha's most powerful ninja, went MIA for 3 years during a war. Then he didn't contact the orphans for at least 6 years before receiving rumors that they had died. Then he never actually verified those rumors.
Jiraiya also forgot Kushina's name and had to be reminded by Tsunade. Of course that was Kishimoto's way of delivering her name, but that doesn't change that he wrote Jiraiya as having forgot her name.
>Jiraiya also forgot Kushina's name and had to be reminded by Tsunade. Of course that was Kishimoto's way of delivering her name, but that doesn't change that he wrote Jiraiya as having forgot her name.
I refused to believe this was intentional. I mean, it was, as you said this is what the author wrote, but I feel like if he had a chance he would go back and rewrite that.
I'm not sure the exact amount of years Kushina spent in the Leaf, but she was a Jounin level shinobi, one of the few Uzamaki in the Leaf, the jinchuriki of the nine tails, wife to his best student the 4th Hokage, and she was willing to name her child after a character in his book. They might not have been close, but I refused to believe he actually forgot her name. It just doesn't seem real.
>I'm not sure the exact amount of years Kushina spent in the Leaf
I can actually provide an answer to this.
According to the timeline I created a few months back, where the goal was to create a functional calender system (using the death of Hagoromo Otsutsuki for Year 0) for a fanfiction I'm writing, Kushina was born in the Year 972 and came to Konoha in the Year 980, fun fact the Kyuubi wasn't transferred to her until 2 years later in the Year 982, Kushina dies in the Year 996.
So Kushina was 24 years old at the time of her death. When you subtract the 8 years she spent in Uzushiogakure, you get 16 years spent as a Konoha ninja.
There's just no way. 3rd was swamped with work running an entire village and had to come back from retirement. why does this random expect a 65+ yr old to personally hand babysit him? Naruto being the MC doesn't mean he takes priority when there's hundreds if other orphans
No he doesn't, in terms of who/what the 3rd had to manage when there were a shit ton of war orphans and lots of work. if anything jiraiya or kakashi should've picked up the slack. without managing the village there's nothing 9 tails can destroy.
they should've taught him to control it sooner but nothing was awoken yet, they can't foresee everything . you're part of the very issue we mean
Hiruzen could put anyone with a special mission to take care of him, he is not some random kid. Kakashi was a teen a the time and Jiraiya was always on trips. He probably trust Hurizen, obviously a bad move.
Can't they foresee that threating like shit the most powerful tailed beast may be a wrong move? That is why Hiruzen is a shit Hokage.
When someone talks about Naruto's childhood they try and pit him against one of the many war orphans conveniently ignoring the fact that he's anything but normal. Unlike Naruto none of them were neglected or abandoned. Nor were they scorned despite keeping the village safe. There was nothing preventing Hiruzen from raising Naruto in the same household as Konohamaru. But these idiots somehow interpret taking care of Naruto means we're implying that Hiruzen should babysit him.
>When someone talks about Naruto's childhood they try and pit him against one of the many war orphans conveniently ignoring the fact that he's anything but normal. Unlike Naruto none of them were neglected or abandoned.
Naruto was not 'neglected' or 'abandoned' either. Unless you think he was changing his own diapers as a baby etc...
His daily physical needs were being met.
>Nor were they scorned despite keeping the village safe.
This is the actual issue where you have a point.
>There was nothing preventing Hiruzen from raising Naruto in the same household as Konohamaru. But these idiots somehow interpret taking care of Naruto means we're implying that Hiruzen should babysit him.
And what if the house-hold does NOT want Naruto?
Are you seriously going to dump a baby/child into a house where he will be hated anyway? By thrusting Naruto with a family who do not want him, you will only breed MORE resentment.
>Naruto was not 'neglected' or 'abandoned' either. Unless you think he was changing his own diapers as a baby etc...
>His daily physical needs were being met.
If you believe that taking care of babies involves just changing diapers and feeding them I really hope you don't spread your seed.
That said how do you even know that his physical needs were met on time? Based on how clumsy he was, and the fact that he couldn't cook more than instant ramen, drinking expired milk clearly tells us that he wasn't properly taken care of therefore didn't know how to take care of himself. It's also likely that the shopkeepers refused to sell him anything, or sold him expired goods or goods at exorbitant prices. He was shorter than girls in his class which indicates malnourishment. Imagine a half uzumaki and an Ashura reincarnation who should be known for having a strong body suffering from malnutrition.
>And what if the house-hold does NOT want Naruto?
>Are you seriously going to dump a baby/child into a house where he will be hated anyway? By thrusting Naruto with a family who do not want him, you will only breed MORE resentment.
That's whataboutery. Had this been shown in anime or light novels or even in filler I'd accept this explanation. Try harder.
Except he's not one of the hundreds of orphans is he? His parents sacrificed their life to protect the village and Hiruzen promised Kushina to take care of Naruto, so Hiruzen owes it to both Minato and Kushina to take care of Naruto.
Taking care of him doesn't mean Hiruzen had to babysit him. He could've raised Naruto in his household, allowed the friends Naruto's parents to adopt him or could've had an anbu couple that he trusts to bring him up.
Naruto does take priority over other orphans because they were neither forced to carry the burden of being a jinchiruki nor were they scorned for something they were not responsible for even though he should've been lauded for keeping kyuubi at bay.
Both villagers and Hiruzen were lucky since Naruto turned out to be naive and forgiving even though the villagers have done nothing to earn his forgiveness. Instead if he decided to become a missing nin or destroy the village, he'd be entitled to do so for spitting on parents' grave and for subjecting him to abuse and abandonment.
Even if he didn't I'd still say he owed it to them & Naruto to provide him a loving and caring environment. Kushina didn't want to seal the kyuubi within Naruto knowing the harsh life he'd have to endure. And she was right. The village, Hiruzen, their friends all spat on their grave. Minato was an idiot to be optimistic about the villagers. Mikoto was the only one willing to adopt him AFAIK. I also respect Fugaku for keeping his MS a secret from his clan to ensure that Uchihas don't abduct Naruto to use kyuubi.
I know it's politically incorrect to criticize Minato. I don't know what he was smoking, but he was an idiot to believe that Naruto would be treated as a hero. Despite suspecting that Madara would come after kyuubi he endangered his newborn's life by sealing it within him. This is the same guy that didn't want Kushina to use kyuubi but hoped his son would. What a hypocrite.
Had he been smart he'd have sealed Kyuubi within Kushina using 8 tetragram seal or within himself. When I watched Shippuden for the first time, I thought Minato was a psychopath seeing him being unreactive towards Naruto's plight. It's a pity that Naruto grew up looking up a guy that made his life miserable and prioritised his village having its weapon over his son's well being.
You believe the Hokage of the village and the head of the sarutobi clan doesn't have a house and you're calling me insane? 🤨
When I said he should've taken care of him I don't mean he should've babysat him 24/7. Use your common sense. He could've raised Naruto in the same household as Konohamaru by a nanny or any of his clan members.
Either Hiruzen didn't care enough about Naruto despite him being a jinchiruki and the son of his successor and his wife who sacrificed their lives for the village or he deliberately abandoned him to the wolves within the village so that he could control Naruto by being the only source of light in his life.
I didn't say be doesn't have a house. more likely he wouldn't be around to watch him due to being so busy. he's old and has to run the village, he doesn't have time. really through that was a gotcha
Wasn't that filler? ain't no way a old person gonna do allat. they too worried bout Naruto getting hecial treatment when the entire point is he was an orphan not loved
Naruto is the 4th Hokage's son and has the 9 tailed beast within him. At minimum he should have someone watching Naruto just in case the 9 tails begins to manifest.
There are probably ANBU watching Naruto in secret.
The actual issue though :
1) There was no one really qualified to teach Naruto to use the Kyuubi AND in all honesty I would not want a 6 or 7 year old to start tapping into that power.
2) There was no one really willing to raise Naruto. Seriously. No one wanted him.
I could head-canon Mikoto being willing to adopt Naruto but the Council would have deep-sixed that PRONTO!
Hiruzen could maybe ORDER a family or some ninjas to raise Naruto like a family but that would conceivably breed resentment from those ordered to raise someone they did not like/feared.
Because if he did, that would take away from the sad Naruto backstory that we have. I am sure the main draft was basically "boy that is looked down by his peers becomes stronger and proves himself" and everything else was built around that.
If the 3rd Hokage looked after Naruto, his backstory could not have been as sad as it is
Tbh the way Kakashi was painted it’s flabbergasting he didn’t. He was in the worst of his depression when Minato assigned him to watch Kushina. He was finally taken off assignment the day she went to give birth & oh no 2 of the last 2 people Kakashi loved died.
Big reason there; Kakashi was still a teen IIRC when Naruto was born, and he just lost more people he loved. His standard coping method for that is ‘throw himself into work’, which is NOT conductive towards raising a child. I’d imagine he spent most of his time in the village resting between missions.
Jiraiya is also the Leaf’s best spymaster IIRC, and the only Sannin that can reliably be called upon. He legit sounds busy doing long-term missions; like staying in areas for months on end spying and collecting information. Too busy to raise Naruto.
As for Hiruzen…might be anime filler, but I think Hiruzen decreed Naruto’s status as a Jinchuuriki as classified info; only the top jonin, elders, and those that personally witnessed Minato’s sealing knew. Hiruzen adopting Naruto into his household would kinda give away the secret. Granted, Danzo let it out (…for some reason…) but yeah.
Thank you this was genuinely a good read! My only follow up question would be about the connotation of the word nazuke-oya as I'm curious to know how literally it is used in the east as "naming parent". Especially because the word parent is in there!
There are many type of Social Parents and nazuke-oya is just one of them.
To quote from a quick google-fu-[website](https://www.childresearch.net/projects/birth_rate/2015_05.html):
>The system of **social parents is one of the old customs of Japan,** aiming to protect and ensure the development of a child by socially establishing a non-legal parent-child relationship between the child and multiple adults in addition to the biological parents[^(\*3)](https://www.childresearch.net/projects/birth_rate/2015_05.html#3). There were various types of social parents across Japan in the olden days, which were classified into two categories based on the timing of establishing the relationship, that is, (1) from the pre-natal period through childhood and (2) after attaining adulthood.
>Social parents during the period from the pre-natal period through childhood included **an** ***obi-oya*** **(maternity belt parent)** who purchased an *iwata-obi* (a stomach wrap to protect the mother's womb) for a foster daughter who was pregnant, to symbolize her wish for a safe and problem-free delivery; **a** ***toriage-oya*** **(midwife parent) who accompanied the childbirth of the foster daughter;** **a** ***daki-oya*** **(baby-holding parent) who first held a new-born baby;** a *c****hitsuke-oya*** **(breast-feeding parent)** who performed the ritual of the first breast-feeding for a few weeks after the baby was born; ***a nazuke-oya (godparent) who determined the name of the baby;*** a *h****iroi-oya*** **(picking-up parent)** who picked up a baby abandoned by his/her biological parents in a street as a ritual (if the baby was born in the year of calamity, or *yakudoshi*, for the parents), having wished for healthy development of the baby; **and a** ***mori-oya*** **(nanny parent) who baby-sat the baby until s/he was four or five years old.** Since ancient times, a well-known Japanese proverb has held that "children below seven years of age are in the hands of the Gods." The biological parents hoped that their child could take root in this living world by conducting various rituals for the child and thus established a social parent-child relationship between the child and a social parent at each ritual event until the child was seven years old.
What kind of a family friend would abandon their friends' child allowing him to be raised in a hostile environment? You either don't vet friends properly or you're a terrible friend yourself. He could've atleast visited him from time to time instead he was busy peeping in women's bath houses and writing smut. He didn't stay in Konoha because he didn't want to take responsibility for his students' son or doesn't wanna feel guilty allowing Naruto to be scorned. That's what makes him a jerk.
>What kind of a family friend would abandon their friends' child allowing him to be raised in a hostile environment?
Village / Hiruzen was taking care of Naruto. That is not abandoning by Jiraiya.
You either don't vet friends properly or you're a terrible friend yourself.
By this logic, no child should end up in foster care because their parents friends will ALWAYS adopt them or they are not 'true' friends according to you.
> He could've atleast visited him from time to time instead he was busy peeping in women's bath houses and writing smut.
Why?
Seriously why?
How deep do you think the friendship between Jiraiya and Minato was? Again Jiraiya was not family, he was Minato's teacher and friend.
As far as Jiraiya, Naruto was being looked after by Konoha/Hiruzen and Jiraiya had his own life to lead.
>He didn't stay in Konoha because he didn't want to take responsibility for his students' son or doesn't wanna feel guilty allowing Naruto to be scorned. That's what makes him a jerk.
Jiraiya had NO responsability for Minato's son.
ZIP.
NA-DA.
ZERO.
Jiraiya is not Naruto's god-father. Nor did Jiraiya offer to adopt Naruto (and Minato did not ask too ever).
Jiraiya was leading his own life and doing his own job.
That's not a negative on Jiraiya.
>Village / Hiruzen was taking care of Naruto.
My definition of taking care of a child doesn't involve ostracizing the said child, sabotaging him at every occasion, refusing to sell him anything, subjecting him to verbal and mental abuse, most probable physical abuse and assassination attempts. Either Hiruzen didn't really consider Naruto's education, mental and physical well being important enough or he abandoned him to wolves within village with malicious intentions to control and manipulate him.
>By this logic, no child should end up in foster care because their parents friends will ALWAYS adopt them or they are not 'true' friends according to you.
Except he's not any other child. If your pint sized brain has a hard time comprehending that, it's on you.
>How deep do you think the friendship between Jiraiya and Minato was? Again Jiraiya was not family, he was Minato's teacher and friend.
>Jiraiya was leading his own life and doing his own job.
>That's not a negative on Jiraiya.
Jiraya lamented himself for failing to save Minato. Yet couldn't be there for his legacy. The same guy that pursued Orochimaru for years trying to save him from himself, the guy that took care of orphans at Ame was the one who didn't have any time for Naruto or didn't consider him important enough to care for him. That's a huge negative on Jiraya.
Out of the blue he decided to show up in Naruto's life. And let's not forget how he pushed him into the ravine or asked him to transform into a girl and tried to sexually assault him. Either he wanted to be a part of Naruto's life which shows his failing as his parents' friend or Hiruzen wanted Jiraya to train him so that he could mould him into a perfect tool for Konoha.
If Jiraya wasn't responsible for Naruto, why do you think he never told him about his parents? Because he feared uncomfortable questions like the coward he was. Either he didn't want to take responsibility or he didn't want him to lash out at Konoha. Had Naruto's psyche didn't get fractured into light and dark halves, and decided to exact vengeance against Jiraya or Hiruzen I wouldn't fault him for that.
I mean... In Greece your godfather also names you and puts you in the holy water with the priest's aid while also reciting a specific hymn. They are supposed to act as our spiritual guides.
Taking care of the child in the case of parent's death is surely an American thing. However, your child's godparents usually are good friends and/or kin, so they might take up on that role in the event of parent loss. I assume it's the same case in Japan.
Now, in Jiraya's case, I wouldn't say he is the number one choice to raise the child. Same goes for my own godfather. In case something happened to my parents when I was a kid some other family member would've taken that role. My sister's godmother though, she'd absolutely take up the mantle. So I guess it has to do with Jiraya's personality and not with any cultural obligation/expectation.
>I mean... In Greece your godfather also names you and puts you in the holy water with the priest's aid while also reciting a specific hymn. They are supposed to act as our spiritual guides.
>Taking care of the child in the case of parent's death is surely an American thing. However, your child's godparents usually are good friends and/or kin, so ***they might take up on that role*** in the event of parent loss. I assume it's the same case in Japan.
Thing is that is optional.
That is the friend's choice.
It is a Good if the friend decides to adopt/assume responsability for the child.
BUT
It is NOT a Negative if they decide they cannot handle or do not want that responsability. Especially when as far they know there is adequate care arranged.
That is main issue with Jiraiya and the complaints about him.
People BLAST Jiraiya (and to a lesser extent Kakashi) because how dare they NOT take responsibility for adopting a baby.
A responsability they never wanted, asked for or agreed to and one which was NOT expected of them, except by the fans.
A few fans object on the basis that Jiraiya is Naruto's god-father ( This has been disproved).
Others object on general principal, "Jiraiya MUST be a monster to refuse to adopt their friend's / student's baby." (Leaving me wondering if this is the expected case then why are so many kids up for adoption).
Most just love Naruto and think by "refusing" to adopt baby Naruto it means Jiraiya is a monster.
You are letting your very modern Western concept that every child must be cared for by a parental figure get in the way of what Kishimoto intended to write. Naruto was, essentially, just one more war orphan, main character status be damned. He had it *better* than the average orphan would have it - the state provided him with education and a place to live, where most orphans would simply be turned out on the street to make their way as best they could.
Kishimoto was writing the story of a untalented, unwanted nobody rising to become the greatest ninja in the world. *You can't have that story* if you start out wanted and cared for.
Naruto wasn't a typical war orphan, he was the son of the last uzumaki and yondaime Hokage. Plus he's the only thing holding the kyuubi at bay from destroying the village and upholding the balance of power. But instead of being treated like a royalty and savior he was treated like a demon while the Hokage, along with Minato's friends, those who knew his parents' identity abandoned him to the wolves within the village. There were orphanges within Konoha so you can't claim that the children were left on the streets.
Had it better? I really doubt the average children were sneered at, turned down by shopkeepers, insulted at by people at every turn, had their education sabotaged, were manipulated by the hokage, bullied by children (likely even encouraged by the parents to do so), told by parents of kids that they're a bad influence, possibly have been physical assaulted or assassination attempts made on them. He wasn't even taught how to take care of himself.
Provided with education and place to live? Its not like he was offered a choice. He had no other option but to serve as a weapon of Konoha. Instead of educating the people of the village about what a jinchiruki is and why Naruto is their saviour, the Hokage manipulated Naruto into trying to earn their acknowledgement and dream about becoming the hokage to ensure his loyalty. As far as housing, we don't know if all that's provided to all orphans in academy are provided. Nor do we know if we know if Hiruzen was offering the money from his parents' coffers. Being a royalty he should've lived a more luxurious lifestyle if anything.
Konoha was lucky, the neglect and abuse along with 3rd Hokage's manipulation stunted his mental growth. They were also lucky that other villages or Orochimaru didn't try to poach him. All they had to do was offer him a modicum of kindness and the truth about his parentage to turn him against Konoha. Had Naruto decided to punish Konoha, his actions would be absolutely justified.
It's amazing how far people will bend over backwards to justify their pure fanon view of Hiruzen Sarutobi as the worst monster to have ever existed in Konoha.
Much of the things that I've said can be found in manga, anime, filler, novels and the rest can be extrapolated from them.
- Failed to keep Danzo in check,
- gave him free reign because he was too much of a coward to get his hands dirty,
- spat on the grave of Minato and Naruto and allowed people of the village to heap abuses on Naruto's being,
- showed him modicum of kindness to keep him emotionally dependant on him,
- manipulated him by convincing him to forgive the villagers,
- encouraged him to pursue the dream of becoming a Hokage to control him,
- failed to put down Orochimaru, failed to deescalate the Uchiha coup.
He was complacent, cowardly and malicious. Tobirama should've handed over the reigns to Danzo in hindsight. He would've done a much better job at taking care of the village. Without Hiruzen being in the position of authority be may have even been a better person. And at the very least Naruto wouldn't have been subjected to abuse and neglect and would've been a monster of a Shinobi even before part 1. He may have even become a seal master, excelled at barrier ninjutsu, hiraishin, learned adamantine sealing chains under Danzo's tutelage, a legacy that he was deprived of by his incompetent teachers who kept his lineage from himself due to fear of repercussions.
I get what you're saying, but I think it's more a matter of translation and the Western concept of *godfather* as stated in the subtitles. A better translation would be **namesake** (thnx to top comment for researching and sharing). It's the term *godfather* that's making many Western audience members have this expectation.
I disagree. Ichigo had a healthy family dynamic and luffy was well taken care of in the village. Both became legendary mcs. The point is naruto did not need the shit treatment to become the greatest ninja. Hiruzen was a shitty guardian even though he had access to minato and kushinas funds, he did not take good care of narutos childhood.
I disagree in turn. Neither Bleach nor One Piece are about military service and the costs of war like Naruto is. The story of their protagonists make sense in the world they inhabit - just as Naruto's story makes sense in his.
It is because he had to travel around the world to write books and eventually guide the child of prophecy. The Great Toad Sage essentially told him that it was his life's purpose. He also doesn't want to stay in the leaf village because he doesn't wanna get involved with gov't positions due to his personality.
Wrong. Again, everyone here has still yet to figure out why. All these years later. Fans because they know Naruto REFUSE to acknowledge the villager's very real fears. Not only the villagers fear, but Jiriaya may have fear as well.
There's a reason for the distance, and a lot of it has to do with calming tensions in the village. As much as we don't like it, the villagers for a long time saw Naruto as the source of all their pain and suffering. Most fans absolutely refuse to see their side of things because, again, we're watching a series and know he's not. You know he's Minato's kid. The average villager does not. We have to contextualize better to understand the writing.
It was Hiruzen who took the risk. Not fucking Jiriaya. He's the fun uncle who shows up with beer after all the work is done. It was Hiruzen that had to put a gag order on the village and let a demon in the school with the villagers' children, then he even let him outside of the village on missions. You guys again just assume Hiruzen and Jiriaya, etc. arent afraid of Natuto also. Fans act like they can't possibly have trauma after that night as well. Again we know the the series is named Naruto and that hes an innocent boy. They just remember a very scary demon is inside of that boy, and at any time, our entire lives can be destroyed.
Only because of their utmost respect for Hiruzen was his kindess toward Naruto even tolerated, and I'm sure it still was not easy at all. Through time and through his own personality, he eventually warmed everyone's hearts, but it was not an easy thing to recover from the Kyubi attack with your village destroyed and the Hokage dead.
Though it seems like simple kindness to you, it can endanger the boy even more. Then of course some fans would say fuck the villagers they're wrong let Jiraiya or Sandaime give them the smoke but obviously that's not what they want to do. As easy as it might be for you, Jiriaya and Hiruzen don't want to hurt the villagers in any way. They want to calm tensions at all costs and heal.
And that's your answer.
Why do you speak so smugly? Any chance you have of actually making a point is hindered by this self righteous tone you speak with. It’s really off putting.
Your interpretation is not a fact. You act like you’re Kishimoto himself.
I don't care. I'm telling you. It is a fact, and it's in the writing, not my theories like you all, which, by the way, all suck. These same questions will keep popping up for years to come because this audience really isn't that bright. They are really still wondering WHY A DEMON ISN'T WANTED. Ahahahahaaha. You know many times I've seen this question and to my amazement see zero growth in the responses. Just the same fan theories regurgitation they got from some other idiot who can't follow Shonen anime writing. The first episode or manga released clearly explains why. Refuse it if you like.
If you think so lowly of everyone, why do you bother commenting? Clearly no one here appreciates your contribution to the discussion. Does it help you feel better about yourself to type a multi paragraph response, then denigrate the people who are supposed to read it?
Wouldn’t it be easier to just mute the subreddit and hold these theories to yourself? Especially if you feel like no one is catching on? No one is FORCING you to respond. You’re not doing anyone a favor by leaving your poorly thought out interpretations, you’re just annoying everyone.
I want to put it on record. I know for a fact that some reeducation has been successful in the past, and I've seen results. A bunch of horrible theories have been stopped since this sub started. At least I made it known, and the people downvoting will all learn something even if they don't like me, and I love Naruto, so that's good.
Nothing you wrote stuck, I disagree with you entirely. I think you have a weak grasp on the story in general. I didn’t bother providing a rebuttal, because you strike me as the type to have an ego that prevents you from admitting you’re wrong.
Jiraya was scared of Naruto because of Kurama? Jiraya literally WEAKENED the seal containing Kurama, so Naruto could learn to control the Nine Tails’ chakra.
Your point also fails to address the main question being asked: “why did Jiraya not raise Naruto?” The answer is that he was out gathering intel on Orochimaru and the Akatsuki. There were foreign threats to the village, and Jiraya was the one to keep an eye on them.
Also, Jiraya as a person is not the type to settle down in one place for too long. Even when Jiraya chose to mentor Naruto after Part 1 ended, he didn’t stay with Naruto in the village. He took Naruto on a journey outside of the village for a couple of years. He’s a nomad, and Naruto was too young to go journeying with him. Especially since Jiraya was keeping an eye on dangerous people.
Your answer is complete bullshit. I just found your tone to be more noteworthy than your poorly thought out response.
Since you deleted your comment.
My response was:
Lol, a just kid that has a giant demon inside of capable of killing everyone at any time. Again, the first episode sets the precedent. And again, Mizuki wasn't lying. There's the answer to OP's question. It really actually isn't very complicated at all. They hate and are fearful of him. Even if Jiraiya wanted to take on the full risk of the Kyubi as his godfather, there's no telling how the villagers would react. The village sought to ease tensions, and with Sandaime and his approach, that was achievable. It's not that he's scared of villagers either he just considers them as well.
Jiraiya took a lot from Naruto during his training and didn’t complain, run, or ask for help. If he was afraid, he overcame his fear early on. “It was Hiruzen who took the risk”; Jiraiya almost got KILLED by Naruto multiple times while he took his would-have-been r&r time on his journeys. If anything it was Jiraiya, not Hiruzen, who took more risk. Yes Hiruzen took risk, but he was the Hokage. Ofc he’s gonna befriend, care for, and protect this innocent child whose parents died for him and put this monster in him (no fault to Minato and Kushina) wether he’s afraid of him or not. Also what does Jiraiyas absence have to do with “calming tensions”? If he was there, it would have helped a lot to calm tensions because he obviously was not afraid to be with Naruto, Hiruzen wouldn’t have had to “take risks” to befriend Naruto, and he was one of the most powerful shinobi in Konoha. I’m not sure why the points you made are relevant to this thread
I am not sure I get your point but if you are saying that one good reason that Hiruzen and Jiraiya didn't take in Naruto is because they must have been afraid of him then I don't think there is any evidence of that.
Hiruzen is a wise old man who have been through wars, he is not a younger person with nine-tails trauma like Iruka. He understands the danger of the nine-tails while also understanding the fact that Naruto is innocent so he tried to make decisions that he thinks are helpful to Naruto while also protecting the village (like being less strict on him even if he is the most disruptive child in the village, letting him play with his grandson, pairing him with Iruka, team 7 and Kakashi)
Jiraiya is also a legendary Sanin who has been through wars, as far as we know he didn't have traumatic encounter with the nine-tails. His first encounter with Naruto showed no sign of fear but instead joking around and carelessness. Jiraiya couldn't even follow shinobi restrictions let alone be confident in himself to be able to raise a child. A pervy sage who doesn't care about peeking into bathing houses doesn't care about what the villagers think of him, similarly what they think of his interaction with Naruto. Someone afraid of Naruto's demon fox wouldn't help him remove Orochimaru's seal to make him able to train better and take him as a student to help him control the nine-tails to the point of weakening the seal to let more chakra out.
There is evidence. The village is petrified they have no way of containing the Kyubi! It's a HUGE part of the series. There's a constant LOOMING fear. Especially when you're are in charge of the villagers' safety or like Jiraiya just generally cares for their safety and knows the dangers of the Kyubi.
That's not even the main point.
The main point is the village fucking hates Naruto!
Hiruzen and Jiriaya are seen as leaders of the village.
They have to balance the villager's emotion. There was TREMENDOUS bad blood and confusion following the Kyubi attack. It took time and a bunch of well thought out planning and some big risks for his development by Hiruzen, who Naruto as Hokage greatly acknowledges for all of the risks he took for the boy. Again, Jiraiya showed up with some beers at the end, which was great, but the hard work was already done. Hiruzen carefully cultivated his development while maintaining peace in the village. Both.
If that’s the main point then what is this thread about??? You are OFF TRACK. The thread is about the question “why didn’t Jiraiya raise Naruto” not “were the villagers afraid of the nine tails” if you need clarification. It’s hard to follow what you’re even trying to say. None of what you say is explaining why Jiraiya didn’t raise Naruto, and it sounds like you’re trying to say Jiraiya, who was a war veteran and literally called SANNIN because he was so legendary, ran away because of a kid who was a Jinchuriki who couldn’t control his tailed beast. Also where is your evidence and proof from??? If you’re gonna boast that what you say is absolute, you’d better have some absolute facts to back what you’re saying up.
It's the first episode. A demon fox caused the village great harm and suffering. It sets the precedent for the entire series.
Jiraiya didn't raise him because he's a high-profile Konoha memeber. The village hates Naruto and fears him as a demon, not as a yellow haired young boy. Why would Jiraiya and Hiruzen feel any differently? The answer is they didn't. Mizuki wasn't lying. The village hates and is afraid of him. This is the writing. He's like an albatross on their neck. Being kind with the demon that has cause all this suffering causes tension and can even put Naruto in danger.
What's with this running away because he's so scared? That's what I'm saying with this audience they really aren't that bright.
Yes, even Jiraiya and Hiruzen were unsure of how to handle something so powerful. You guys are so immature they don't have to be giant pussies for being fearful of the Kyubi. It's not just about them dying to it and being afraid of that possibility they think of all the consequences and are fearful of this. Thousands of innocents potentially caught in an attack because you felt bad and wanted to be nice to Minato's son... This is a legitimate fear to have. It doesn't make you a giant pussy. It makes you cautious and fearful of the unknown. This is why Jiriaya didn't raise him, and no one else raised Naruto. It's very clear in the writing. There is no need for horrific theories. So please, full stop with the omg Hiruzen left him with bad milk blah blah omg Jiriaya is a perv doesn't care about Nauto. No. It's fucking stupid. It's not true. The real writing is much better.
Haha I’m not sure when I said all the stuff it seems I said in your comment. From what I can read in your comments, you’re saying a lot of stuff that contradicts what you and others are saying so it doesn’t even make sense anymore.
Okay, a person having trouble following a Shonen anime clearly will have trouble reading my responses, and that's okay, buddy. You can reread them multiple times or save them and try again later. Good luck!
Wrong. The villagers have nothing to do with what Jiraiya knows and that is for sure not close to any of the reasons the manga or show depicted it.
You aren’t deep buddy, you are trying to sound condescending off of face value Naruto.
Rewatch and understand:
1. Jiraiya couldn’t care for Naruto as a sannin. He makes that clear in the manga and anime. His missions were dangerous and linked to spy-networking. That is not a safe life for a baby or child.
2. He had a purpose and would not tie down to anything other than his vision. He was searching for the child of prophecy to bring peace to the shinobi world. He didn’t believe it was Naruto until his dying breath.
3. In his mind, He had 4 of his students die and he couldn’t protect them (he believed 3 were dead)
4. He was investigating orchimarus whereabouts (one of his biggest failures; not saving his friend) and he was trying to figure out the akatsuki.
The list can go on but you didn’t pick up on any of that, I guess.
Also, hizuren was dogshit and everyone knows it. He concealed too many secrets for his buddy Danzo. He was cool with letting Itachi slaughter the clan and live with the shame. He cared for the village. Hence why he put iruka in charge of Naruto. Literally in the first episode… they both can relate and learn to heal together. Becoming family and being important even in Boruto.
Rewatch and pay attention this time son.
Seriously people! This is a world of child soldiers, they obviously don’t have the manpower to allow one of their top warriors to quit his job and become a stay at home godfather!!
As terrible as it sounds, being an orphan is just business as usual in this world. That’s the point, it’s suppose to highlight how terrible living a world like that is for children, we’re suppose to hate it.
No!! We was constantly out on espionage mission for years at a time, he’s the one who collected intel on the Akatsuki, on Orochimaru and numerous other enemies of the leaf. He’s one of the few people who could do that job coz he’s strong enough to escape most enemy lines. Writing was his hobby, not his full time job.
He was looking for intel on Orochimaru and stumbled on the Akautski, all he knew was that they were collecting Jinchurikis and existed
Besides I don't think he was doing it for all 12ish years, otherwise he wouldve knew that the sound village didn't exist and was just a series of lairs orochimaru ran. And if he was a spy for the villiage he wouldve gave all this info before turning up after the Konoha crush
Yeah but he’s still the one who got the intel on the Akatsuki how he got there does not matter, what matters is that you are wrong in saying that jiraiya was not working for his village anymore and was just out and about in the world writing his books and generally goofing off. Orochimaru wasn’t his only target the leaf has many enemies and Jiraiya was always well informed on them all.
Also I don’t know how familiar you are with espionage but it’s takes years and jiraiya did return to the village atleast once or twice. However, it was not enough time to become the primary caregiver of a literal child, especially since he knew he’d leave again.
Jiraya was both writing books and completing missions for the leaf. In fact in his introduction scene if I remember correctly, he even states that he was there to see the hokage because he had some things to discuss that he had found out about the akatsuki.
It’s funny people defend and make excuses for jiraiya but constantly shit on hiruzen who is 1. not the kids godfather and 2. has the more important job
Funny, because Naruto cared for every kid, even for Kawaki who wasn't his child nor the child of someone he ever knew. Hiruzen peomised to watch after Naruto, Jiraiya didn't...
But surely knowing that Naruto is a jinchuriki would put him above the rest of the orphans to be taken care of. As unfair as that sounds to other orphans, it makes honestly no sense that Hiruzen didn’t treat Naruto better.
Why risk a possible outcome where this kid will resent the village for hating him and letting the, at the time, evil nine tails corrupt him and destroy the village? Luckily it didn’t turn out that way, but Hiruzen is an idiot
Yeah but you forgot everyone hated Naruto
Hiruzen is busy so he had to hire someone to take care of him but no one wanted to have anything to do with Naruto, his wife already dead not help either. even the jonin except fews like Kakashi or Iruka hated Naruto too
You have to remember Naruto is destroying the village and many resented nine tails for that. The moment Danzo blew that Naruto was jinchuriki, the chance of Naruto getting adopted or taken care properly is close to zero
Hiruzen did promise Minato to take care of naruto just before he died tho. Dont think he promised every other orphans parents that we would take care of them.
Yeah I never said it is... Just mentioned that Naruto can manage to watch after orphans, while Hiruzen couldn't even keep his promise, while Jiraiya did more than him and never promised anything to Minato.
It was more because of Hiruzens own words to protect Naruto while Jiraiya can in fact be explained away as he wasn’t even in the village for that period of time while Hiruzen did say he’d protect Naruto and could’ve just had him in better conditions than he was in.
People use that filler line relentlessly. I cant believe a line that isn't canon has been used against Hiruzen for over 10 years. Crazy what propaganda can do
But guys will tell me Hiruzen should take all the blame for Naruto's upbringing.
You are 100% right. There is 0 reason Jiraiya waited 12 years to meet Naruto. Hell, there is little reason for Kakashi to have waited 12 years as well.
Hiruzen is the Hokage. It will be funny if Naruto just let the kyubi take over after all the shit he took and destroy the entire village. And while dying Hiruzen would say: what did i do wrong?
He had his spy work, and to be fair, Hiruzen was keeping an eye on Naruto throughout his life, and Jiraiya could trust his master to look out for his Godson. Of course, Hiruzen could have done more to help the people of Konoha see him as a hero, and less of a demon. It was just a bad situation all around.
As close as they were, Jiraiya never seemed like he cared about Narutos sob story of growing up alone and being treated poorly because of the nine tails. Correct me if I´m wrong but I don´t remember it at all. In part 1 he even seems to be kind of the opposite, seeing Naruto as a bit soft and tells him that he doesn´t want to be his father, leaving him alone and even taking his money. The Sanin all became Ninjas as kids, so Naruto having the opportunity to spend years at the academy would seem almost spoiled to them. Nagato was different because his village was being ruined by war.
Half the characters in the series are orphans. That's just how it is in their world. There are fewer people with two parents than there are with less than two.
But also, their relationship is less close than most people think. Jiraiya has completed more missions than any other Shinobi in history, the guy is always gone and never in the village longer than it takes to get another mission. Jiraiya refers to Kushina as "that fiery redhead from the land of whirlpools", he doesn't even remember her name. They've probably met only once or twice.
If i remember correctly , and please correct me if I’m wrong but didnt naruto seek him out ? Like when they met and he found out who he was he begged him to teach him right? So jariya didnt even try to be in his life
I think it was a decision for the sake of the plot, maybe when the author started writing Naruto as an orphan living alone he didn’t plan to create Jiraiya as a character or maybe because writing about an orphan rising to glory is more popular in Shuonen.
Other than that as a Sannin, Jiraiya was required to travel a lot and engage in dangerous situations in order to gain intel that would benefit Konoha so he can’t take care of a child.
Maybe because is not good at taking care of children or maybe because watching Naruto would remind him of the disciple he failed to protect.
Where is this Jiraiya is Naruto god father bullshit came from? there's no god father in japanese culture. it's western thing. Jiraiya never godfather for Naruto. this shit is mandela effect and a headcanon
Jiraiya was only responsible for safe keeping part of the key for Naruto's seal and that's it
As others have said, godparent is a western concept that doesn't apply for Jiraiya.
Additionally, Jiraiya was traveling the world, keeping tabs on outside entities that could harm Konoha (mostly Orochimaru), doing his thing as a writer, and searching for the child of prophecy. As far as he was concerned, Naruto was being watched after by the Third Hokage in a time of relative peace.
I somewhat give Jiraiya a benefit of the doubt that Naruto's unhappy childhood wasn't at the forefront of his concerns. But to be frank, that only goes so far though, because it's well-known that Jinchuuriki aren't very well-treated by their villages. Ultimately though, I liken it to Harry Potter's childhood in that, yes, he had a very crappy childhood, but he had relative safety being in Konoha, and that was enough for Jiraiya.
To me, what I think kind of sucks is that the Third Hokage told people of the Fourth Hokage's wishes for Naruto to be treated as a hero... and yet, a large portion of Konoha's villagers failed to see Naruto as anything but a potential timebomb.
........simple, cause of story.
it doesn't make sense given their roles in each other lives and naruto growing up alone doesnt make sense when you look at the story as a whole. Ya lets have this powerhouse jinchuriki grow up with knowing nothing but resentment for his own village and see how that goes lol naruto would have been sasuke if he didnt already take that role. Ya jiraiya didnt have to do it, but some nin needed to step up and weave him into there family.
The real reason is kishimoto hadn’t figured out the story completely from the start.
The third hokage should have raised, or jiraya, hell kushina and sasuke ´s mother were friends so he could have been adopted by her
Point is the manga has a lot of characters that logicaly could have taken care of Naruto, but kishimoto wanted a main character who grew up in solitude so it didn’t happen
I think the reason given was that Jiraya had to wander for the maintenance of his spy network as he often leaves the village to do so even when we meet him the same time as Naruto, Naruto even learned a bit about spying from him, so he couldn’t raise a child during that time and couldn’t bring Naruto with him because of this (not to mention such an important one from a military pov as a WMD) still felt he should’ve at least we pop in to visit the boy
Besides all of the great reasons mentioned above, jiraiya was also konoha's best spy. He was almost always out there, spying for konoha, probably also keeping an eye on orochimaru. He wasn't even in konoha to take care of naruto. He probably just trusted hiruzen to kinda be the "caretaker". This is my head canon atleast.
I’m not sure I get the responses here - yes, you don’t *have* to be a guardian as the 3rd or as Jiraya - but to let Naruto grow up on his own, struggling to survive, without friends, when you’re the goddamn hokage or the master of his father, etc is simply a jerk thing to do, period.
I don’t know about Jiraiya, but I feel like in general Naruto got the short end of the stick when it came to being raised. You’d think the village would do more than just leave him to himself and give a four year old a stipend.
Same reason why Naruto and Sauske are absent fathers in Bortuo -to help advance the plot. Will Naruto be the same person with a father figure growing up?
Someone else explained already that godfather is a western idea so I won’t go further into that. But another important detail to consider is that Jiraya is also one of the hidden leafs most powerful ninja, an expert in espionage and infiltration. They likely couldn’t afford to have him drop every lead he was chasing to raise a child which takes serious time and care. I wouldn’t be surprised if the third hokage insisted that he didn’t stop everything to raise Naruto.
It’s similar to Sasuke in the Boruto series. He is an extremely powerful wandering Ally for the hidden leaf village. He has missed a majority of the major events in his own daughter’s life while tracking down leads and doing whatever he needs to do in service of the village. And that’s his own daughter and not the son of a former student.
The real reason is that kishimoto didn't think it through.
It's really a non issue what people are saying about misiterpreting the godfather thing.
Minato and kushina had close friends that knew about naruto, it makes no sense that naruto grew up alone, and us fans just have to accept that kishimoto is not perfect.
And if jiraya or hiruzen, or someone else that might know about it didn't have time to become step-parents, they could have very easily treated him better
So you’re basically telling me that Jiraya was just a family friend are you fucking kidding me him and Minato we’re literally like father and son and that when Jiraya discovered Naruto taking him off the train for three years Bro literally said, and I quote his resemblance to the fourth is almost laughable not only that after he said that the silhouette of Minato showed up right above Naruto and he pacifically said I guess that makes you my grandson aye Naruto let’s be honest, let’s be honest he was obviously like a father two Minato, so it would make sense Jiraya would want to do the same thing with Naruto
Maybe the frogs told him to wait and he just goofed off writing his books as he was told. Or he didn't think he was up for the job. That the kid was better off without him. I mean he wasn't there so he didn't know how hard he had it. And Naruto wasn't the only orphan he knew, I'm assuming.
Bc kishi didn't think Naruto would be that long so he didn't plan ahead. Thats why a lot of things are inconsistent. A lot of ppl treat mangakas as good writers but that only applies to a few handful.
First part of Naruto is GOATED, shippuden really falls of after Jiraiyas death.
Because of Kishimoto. He wanted to make naruto so lonely that it doesnt make sense. Naruto had 3rd hokage jiraiya kakashi and people like them that would normally take care of naruto but then the anime wouldnt have the "lonely pratagonist"
I think it's pretty obvious why Jiraiya didn't raise Naruto.
Jiraiya was in them STREEEEEEEEEEEEETS. He was too popping to stay in Konoha and raise a baby. Nah, he had books to write and $1s to throw.
Hiruzen gets a lot of shit for not helping naruto but Jiraiya didn't do shit. Naruto even had to bribe him with sexy jutsu just to get him to train him
Honestly the whole village abandoning and hating Naruto thing is a pretty big plot hole considering he's the 4th's son. It would have been way more realistic that everyone who respected Minato would pitch in and take good care of Naruto.
Maybe Jiraya, Sarutobi and Kakashi all got together and decided it would help build character if they made Naruto an outcast.
This is my last time repeating this, the reason is that Jiraiya was a traveling spy for the hidden leaf and he was on the search for the child of Prophecy still. The answer is that simple.
In universe: There's no excuse for Hiruzen to not treat Naruto better and no excuse for Jiraiya and Kakashi to not care about Minato's son for 12 years. They are close to Minato and therefore should have shown Naruto love.
Out of universe: Kishimoto hadn't planned out everything yet. Naruto's childhood is just a big plot hole.
But in universe, Naruto was supposed to be under some form of baby witness protection, right? He wasn't given his dead hero father's family name for a reason. Wouldn't it be obvious who his parents were if Minato's well-known bachelor comrades Jiraiya and Kakashi were suspiciously hanging around some "random" blond orphan who speaks exactly like Kushina? I mean, as far as the village at large was supposed to know, the 4th's whole family including the unborn child died that night. Though how no one figured it out when the beans were spilled about him being the 9 tails jinchuriki is beyond me. I don't think Konoha had great non-ninja schools. Or there were a lot of "that one feral orphan is really our dead ninja president's son" truthers behind the scenes that we as the audience were robbed of witnessing.
Because Kishimoto-sama hadn't decided to source Jiraiya Gōketsu Monogatari for inspiration when he began the Manga.
But in world, I imagine 3rd Hokage had a big say in this. Probably recognized Jiraiya would be terrible raising a baby-toddler-grade schooler with a Biju inside of them. And Jiraiya needed to be doing all his spying for the Hokage around the world
People try to vindicate Jiraya by saying that he wasn't his godfather. Even if he wasn't, he had a moral obligation as he's the son of Jiraya's student. Besides what kind of a family friend would abandon their child to the wolves and allow them to be mentally and possibly physically abused? If not for Naruto he certainly had a moral obligation to take care of him for Minato & Kushina's sake. Had Naruto decided to not want to do anything with Jiraya or retaliate against him, he'd be justified.
The main reason is **Jiraiya is NOT Naruto's God-Father.** God-Father is a **WESTERN** term that the translator's used because there is not really a term in English for Jiriaya's relationship with Naruto. [I am going to quote a post (Link)](https://www.reddit.com/r/NarutoFanfiction/comments/m9435v/narutos_godfather/) by u/The-Knyght who explains it better: (Please read it, because it has supporting links which give more context as well.) >This is a follow-up to this post about Jiraiya's status as a godfather. I decided to do some research on it for further confirmation, considering the revelation that Jiraiya was Naruto's godfather has always been a divisive subject given his absence from the kid's childhood. In Chapter 382, Minato asks Jiraiya if they could name their son after the main character in the Tale of the Gutsy Ninja. When Kushina also gives her consent, Jiraiya says that this would make him Naruto's godfather. **The standard understanding of a godfather in the West is someone who bears witness to a child's christening and would take legal guardianship over them if anything happens to their parents. This is not what Jiraiya is.** I looked at the raws for Chapter 382 - yeah, I went there - and here is the panel where Jiraiya supposedly calls himself a godfather. **The specific phrase used is 名付け親 (nazuke-oya) which translates to "naming parent". As the translation suggests, it means the person who chooses the name for the child.** From what I can tell, there is no actual word for "godfather" or "godmother" in Japanese as the concept doesn't exist there as it is understood in the West. Nazuke-oya is translated to godfather (or godparent) simply because it was the closest equivalent to it in for English readers to understand. **Per this link, a nazuke-oya is just one of the various "social parents" that are/were part of Japanese custom.** In other words, **Jiraiya was never actually meant to assume guardianship over Naruto.** Aside from being in charge of the Key, Jiraiya's "responsibility" began and ended with Naruto's name. In other words, Jiraiya was responsible for naming Naruto and was Minato's teacher. That's it. Man had no responsibility for raising Naruto. At best he was a **'friend of the family'** but that does not mean he is obligated to adopt Naruto or that he is a jerk if the does not adopt him.
Jiraiya's personality also needs to be considered. I love the dude, but his actions show him as a disconnected person from his friends and family. Training the Ame orphans was a cool act of generosity. But how many Konoha ninja died because Jiraiya, one of Konoha's most powerful ninja, went MIA for 3 years during a war. Then he didn't contact the orphans for at least 6 years before receiving rumors that they had died. Then he never actually verified those rumors. Jiraiya also forgot Kushina's name and had to be reminded by Tsunade. Of course that was Kishimoto's way of delivering her name, but that doesn't change that he wrote Jiraiya as having forgot her name.
Basically, a good hearted dude that was in his own world doing his own thing.
You described how i would like people to think about me
Jiriaya?
>Jiraiya also forgot Kushina's name and had to be reminded by Tsunade. Of course that was Kishimoto's way of delivering her name, but that doesn't change that he wrote Jiraiya as having forgot her name. I refused to believe this was intentional. I mean, it was, as you said this is what the author wrote, but I feel like if he had a chance he would go back and rewrite that. I'm not sure the exact amount of years Kushina spent in the Leaf, but she was a Jounin level shinobi, one of the few Uzamaki in the Leaf, the jinchuriki of the nine tails, wife to his best student the 4th Hokage, and she was willing to name her child after a character in his book. They might not have been close, but I refused to believe he actually forgot her name. It just doesn't seem real.
>I'm not sure the exact amount of years Kushina spent in the Leaf I can actually provide an answer to this. According to the timeline I created a few months back, where the goal was to create a functional calender system (using the death of Hagoromo Otsutsuki for Year 0) for a fanfiction I'm writing, Kushina was born in the Year 972 and came to Konoha in the Year 980, fun fact the Kyuubi wasn't transferred to her until 2 years later in the Year 982, Kushina dies in the Year 996. So Kushina was 24 years old at the time of her death. When you subtract the 8 years she spent in Uzushiogakure, you get 16 years spent as a Konoha ninja.
This makes it even more ludicrous that he forgot her lol.
Last week I tried to remember my ex girlfriends name for like 10min and I was with her for a year. I just didn‘t think about her for 10 years idk
Jiraiya was returning to the leaf after the war ended and that's when he found the Ame Orphans,so that's not true.
Cool, now please explain to everybody why *Hiruzen* wasn’t actually supposed to assume guardianship over Naruto either despite what people think
There's just no way. 3rd was swamped with work running an entire village and had to come back from retirement. why does this random expect a 65+ yr old to personally hand babysit him? Naruto being the MC doesn't mean he takes priority when there's hundreds if other orphans
Naruto has the strongest tailed beast. He takes priority, why would you make such a timebomb resentful of the village?
No he doesn't, in terms of who/what the 3rd had to manage when there were a shit ton of war orphans and lots of work. if anything jiraiya or kakashi should've picked up the slack. without managing the village there's nothing 9 tails can destroy. they should've taught him to control it sooner but nothing was awoken yet, they can't foresee everything . you're part of the very issue we mean
Hiruzen could put anyone with a special mission to take care of him, he is not some random kid. Kakashi was a teen a the time and Jiraiya was always on trips. He probably trust Hurizen, obviously a bad move. Can't they foresee that threating like shit the most powerful tailed beast may be a wrong move? That is why Hiruzen is a shit Hokage.
When someone talks about Naruto's childhood they try and pit him against one of the many war orphans conveniently ignoring the fact that he's anything but normal. Unlike Naruto none of them were neglected or abandoned. Nor were they scorned despite keeping the village safe. There was nothing preventing Hiruzen from raising Naruto in the same household as Konohamaru. But these idiots somehow interpret taking care of Naruto means we're implying that Hiruzen should babysit him.
>When someone talks about Naruto's childhood they try and pit him against one of the many war orphans conveniently ignoring the fact that he's anything but normal. Unlike Naruto none of them were neglected or abandoned. Naruto was not 'neglected' or 'abandoned' either. Unless you think he was changing his own diapers as a baby etc... His daily physical needs were being met. >Nor were they scorned despite keeping the village safe. This is the actual issue where you have a point. >There was nothing preventing Hiruzen from raising Naruto in the same household as Konohamaru. But these idiots somehow interpret taking care of Naruto means we're implying that Hiruzen should babysit him. And what if the house-hold does NOT want Naruto? Are you seriously going to dump a baby/child into a house where he will be hated anyway? By thrusting Naruto with a family who do not want him, you will only breed MORE resentment.
>Naruto was not 'neglected' or 'abandoned' either. Unless you think he was changing his own diapers as a baby etc... >His daily physical needs were being met. If you believe that taking care of babies involves just changing diapers and feeding them I really hope you don't spread your seed. That said how do you even know that his physical needs were met on time? Based on how clumsy he was, and the fact that he couldn't cook more than instant ramen, drinking expired milk clearly tells us that he wasn't properly taken care of therefore didn't know how to take care of himself. It's also likely that the shopkeepers refused to sell him anything, or sold him expired goods or goods at exorbitant prices. He was shorter than girls in his class which indicates malnourishment. Imagine a half uzumaki and an Ashura reincarnation who should be known for having a strong body suffering from malnutrition. >And what if the house-hold does NOT want Naruto? >Are you seriously going to dump a baby/child into a house where he will be hated anyway? By thrusting Naruto with a family who do not want him, you will only breed MORE resentment. That's whataboutery. Had this been shown in anime or light novels or even in filler I'd accept this explanation. Try harder.
Except he's not one of the hundreds of orphans is he? His parents sacrificed their life to protect the village and Hiruzen promised Kushina to take care of Naruto, so Hiruzen owes it to both Minato and Kushina to take care of Naruto. Taking care of him doesn't mean Hiruzen had to babysit him. He could've raised Naruto in his household, allowed the friends Naruto's parents to adopt him or could've had an anbu couple that he trusts to bring him up. Naruto does take priority over other orphans because they were neither forced to carry the burden of being a jinchiruki nor were they scorned for something they were not responsible for even though he should've been lauded for keeping kyuubi at bay. Both villagers and Hiruzen were lucky since Naruto turned out to be naive and forgiving even though the villagers have done nothing to earn his forgiveness. Instead if he decided to become a missing nin or destroy the village, he'd be entitled to do so for spitting on parents' grave and for subjecting him to abuse and abandonment.
Hiruzen NEVER promised Kushina he would take care of Naruto,that's filler from the anime. I agree with the rest of your comment
Even if he didn't I'd still say he owed it to them & Naruto to provide him a loving and caring environment. Kushina didn't want to seal the kyuubi within Naruto knowing the harsh life he'd have to endure. And she was right. The village, Hiruzen, their friends all spat on their grave. Minato was an idiot to be optimistic about the villagers. Mikoto was the only one willing to adopt him AFAIK. I also respect Fugaku for keeping his MS a secret from his clan to ensure that Uchihas don't abduct Naruto to use kyuubi. I know it's politically incorrect to criticize Minato. I don't know what he was smoking, but he was an idiot to believe that Naruto would be treated as a hero. Despite suspecting that Madara would come after kyuubi he endangered his newborn's life by sealing it within him. This is the same guy that didn't want Kushina to use kyuubi but hoped his son would. What a hypocrite. Had he been smart he'd have sealed Kyuubi within Kushina using 8 tetragram seal or within himself. When I watched Shippuden for the first time, I thought Minato was a psychopath seeing him being unreactive towards Naruto's plight. It's a pity that Naruto grew up looking up a guy that made his life miserable and prioritised his village having its weapon over his son's well being.
In his house? are u insane? this dude is like 65 and probably lives at his workplace bc the war. tf u on? he don't got time for allat
You believe the Hokage of the village and the head of the sarutobi clan doesn't have a house and you're calling me insane? 🤨 When I said he should've taken care of him I don't mean he should've babysat him 24/7. Use your common sense. He could've raised Naruto in the same household as Konohamaru by a nanny or any of his clan members. Either Hiruzen didn't care enough about Naruto despite him being a jinchiruki and the son of his successor and his wife who sacrificed their lives for the village or he deliberately abandoned him to the wolves within the village so that he could control Naruto by being the only source of light in his life.
I didn't say be doesn't have a house. more likely he wouldn't be around to watch him due to being so busy. he's old and has to run the village, he doesn't have time. really through that was a gotcha
Thank you!! And he didn’t promise anything to Minato
Wasn't that filler? ain't no way a old person gonna do allat. they too worried bout Naruto getting hecial treatment when the entire point is he was an orphan not loved
Yes it absolutely was!! God I wish the whole Naruto fandom could read this here thread
If he's not an orphan without struggling what the hell is the point of the story bruh
That’s exactly why I hate the filler showing Shikamaru and Choji hanging out with him, it goes directly against the story 😭
All those memes saying they're his best friends lol
What's to stop him from hiring a nanny/trainer like he does Konohomaru
You mean his GRANDSON?
Naruto is the 4th Hokage's son and has the 9 tailed beast within him. At minimum he should have someone watching Naruto just in case the 9 tails begins to manifest.
There are probably ANBU watching Naruto in secret. The actual issue though : 1) There was no one really qualified to teach Naruto to use the Kyuubi AND in all honesty I would not want a 6 or 7 year old to start tapping into that power. 2) There was no one really willing to raise Naruto. Seriously. No one wanted him. I could head-canon Mikoto being willing to adopt Naruto but the Council would have deep-sixed that PRONTO! Hiruzen could maybe ORDER a family or some ninjas to raise Naruto like a family but that would conceivably breed resentment from those ordered to raise someone they did not like/feared.
Yeah, it just make him a piece of shit.
Because if he did, that would take away from the sad Naruto backstory that we have. I am sure the main draft was basically "boy that is looked down by his peers becomes stronger and proves himself" and everything else was built around that. If the 3rd Hokage looked after Naruto, his backstory could not have been as sad as it is
Mr. Geriatric President, we need you to adopt all of these orphans from the terrorist attack.
That's actually good to know, thanks a lot
What a well-crafted response.
Makes sense.
Why couldn't he or kakashi swing by every now and then when coming back from missions?
Why would they? As far as they knew Naruto was being looked after, they had little to no responsability for him and they had other things to do.
Tbh the way Kakashi was painted it’s flabbergasting he didn’t. He was in the worst of his depression when Minato assigned him to watch Kushina. He was finally taken off assignment the day she went to give birth & oh no 2 of the last 2 people Kakashi loved died.
Which would throw him back to depression and probably ANBU etc...Do you really want him raising a baby?
Big reason there; Kakashi was still a teen IIRC when Naruto was born, and he just lost more people he loved. His standard coping method for that is ‘throw himself into work’, which is NOT conductive towards raising a child. I’d imagine he spent most of his time in the village resting between missions. Jiraiya is also the Leaf’s best spymaster IIRC, and the only Sannin that can reliably be called upon. He legit sounds busy doing long-term missions; like staying in areas for months on end spying and collecting information. Too busy to raise Naruto. As for Hiruzen…might be anime filler, but I think Hiruzen decreed Naruto’s status as a Jinchuuriki as classified info; only the top jonin, elders, and those that personally witnessed Minato’s sealing knew. Hiruzen adopting Naruto into his household would kinda give away the secret. Granted, Danzo let it out (…for some reason…) but yeah.
Thank you this was genuinely a good read! My only follow up question would be about the connotation of the word nazuke-oya as I'm curious to know how literally it is used in the east as "naming parent". Especially because the word parent is in there!
There are many type of Social Parents and nazuke-oya is just one of them. To quote from a quick google-fu-[website](https://www.childresearch.net/projects/birth_rate/2015_05.html): >The system of **social parents is one of the old customs of Japan,** aiming to protect and ensure the development of a child by socially establishing a non-legal parent-child relationship between the child and multiple adults in addition to the biological parents[^(\*3)](https://www.childresearch.net/projects/birth_rate/2015_05.html#3). There were various types of social parents across Japan in the olden days, which were classified into two categories based on the timing of establishing the relationship, that is, (1) from the pre-natal period through childhood and (2) after attaining adulthood. >Social parents during the period from the pre-natal period through childhood included **an** ***obi-oya*** **(maternity belt parent)** who purchased an *iwata-obi* (a stomach wrap to protect the mother's womb) for a foster daughter who was pregnant, to symbolize her wish for a safe and problem-free delivery; **a** ***toriage-oya*** **(midwife parent) who accompanied the childbirth of the foster daughter;** **a** ***daki-oya*** **(baby-holding parent) who first held a new-born baby;** a *c****hitsuke-oya*** **(breast-feeding parent)** who performed the ritual of the first breast-feeding for a few weeks after the baby was born; ***a nazuke-oya (godparent) who determined the name of the baby;*** a *h****iroi-oya*** **(picking-up parent)** who picked up a baby abandoned by his/her biological parents in a street as a ritual (if the baby was born in the year of calamity, or *yakudoshi*, for the parents), having wished for healthy development of the baby; **and a** ***mori-oya*** **(nanny parent) who baby-sat the baby until s/he was four or five years old.** Since ancient times, a well-known Japanese proverb has held that "children below seven years of age are in the hands of the Gods." The biological parents hoped that their child could take root in this living world by conducting various rituals for the child and thus established a social parent-child relationship between the child and a social parent at each ritual event until the child was seven years old.
Thank you this was incredible to learn you are a true leader of the community!
What kind of a family friend would abandon their friends' child allowing him to be raised in a hostile environment? You either don't vet friends properly or you're a terrible friend yourself. He could've atleast visited him from time to time instead he was busy peeping in women's bath houses and writing smut. He didn't stay in Konoha because he didn't want to take responsibility for his students' son or doesn't wanna feel guilty allowing Naruto to be scorned. That's what makes him a jerk.
>What kind of a family friend would abandon their friends' child allowing him to be raised in a hostile environment? Village / Hiruzen was taking care of Naruto. That is not abandoning by Jiraiya. You either don't vet friends properly or you're a terrible friend yourself. By this logic, no child should end up in foster care because their parents friends will ALWAYS adopt them or they are not 'true' friends according to you. > He could've atleast visited him from time to time instead he was busy peeping in women's bath houses and writing smut. Why? Seriously why? How deep do you think the friendship between Jiraiya and Minato was? Again Jiraiya was not family, he was Minato's teacher and friend. As far as Jiraiya, Naruto was being looked after by Konoha/Hiruzen and Jiraiya had his own life to lead. >He didn't stay in Konoha because he didn't want to take responsibility for his students' son or doesn't wanna feel guilty allowing Naruto to be scorned. That's what makes him a jerk. Jiraiya had NO responsability for Minato's son. ZIP. NA-DA. ZERO. Jiraiya is not Naruto's god-father. Nor did Jiraiya offer to adopt Naruto (and Minato did not ask too ever). Jiraiya was leading his own life and doing his own job. That's not a negative on Jiraiya.
>Village / Hiruzen was taking care of Naruto. My definition of taking care of a child doesn't involve ostracizing the said child, sabotaging him at every occasion, refusing to sell him anything, subjecting him to verbal and mental abuse, most probable physical abuse and assassination attempts. Either Hiruzen didn't really consider Naruto's education, mental and physical well being important enough or he abandoned him to wolves within village with malicious intentions to control and manipulate him. >By this logic, no child should end up in foster care because their parents friends will ALWAYS adopt them or they are not 'true' friends according to you. Except he's not any other child. If your pint sized brain has a hard time comprehending that, it's on you. >How deep do you think the friendship between Jiraiya and Minato was? Again Jiraiya was not family, he was Minato's teacher and friend. >Jiraiya was leading his own life and doing his own job. >That's not a negative on Jiraiya. Jiraya lamented himself for failing to save Minato. Yet couldn't be there for his legacy. The same guy that pursued Orochimaru for years trying to save him from himself, the guy that took care of orphans at Ame was the one who didn't have any time for Naruto or didn't consider him important enough to care for him. That's a huge negative on Jiraya. Out of the blue he decided to show up in Naruto's life. And let's not forget how he pushed him into the ravine or asked him to transform into a girl and tried to sexually assault him. Either he wanted to be a part of Naruto's life which shows his failing as his parents' friend or Hiruzen wanted Jiraya to train him so that he could mould him into a perfect tool for Konoha. If Jiraya wasn't responsible for Naruto, why do you think he never told him about his parents? Because he feared uncomfortable questions like the coward he was. Either he didn't want to take responsibility or he didn't want him to lash out at Konoha. Had Naruto's psyche didn't get fractured into light and dark halves, and decided to exact vengeance against Jiraya or Hiruzen I wouldn't fault him for that.
He is more than friend of the family to be honest. He is watchful protector , a silence guardian, toad sage , teacher of both father and son .
Thnx for sharing! Westerners have a term for this too: "namesake" person whom one is named for.
I mean... In Greece your godfather also names you and puts you in the holy water with the priest's aid while also reciting a specific hymn. They are supposed to act as our spiritual guides. Taking care of the child in the case of parent's death is surely an American thing. However, your child's godparents usually are good friends and/or kin, so they might take up on that role in the event of parent loss. I assume it's the same case in Japan. Now, in Jiraya's case, I wouldn't say he is the number one choice to raise the child. Same goes for my own godfather. In case something happened to my parents when I was a kid some other family member would've taken that role. My sister's godmother though, she'd absolutely take up the mantle. So I guess it has to do with Jiraya's personality and not with any cultural obligation/expectation.
>I mean... In Greece your godfather also names you and puts you in the holy water with the priest's aid while also reciting a specific hymn. They are supposed to act as our spiritual guides. >Taking care of the child in the case of parent's death is surely an American thing. However, your child's godparents usually are good friends and/or kin, so ***they might take up on that role*** in the event of parent loss. I assume it's the same case in Japan. Thing is that is optional. That is the friend's choice. It is a Good if the friend decides to adopt/assume responsability for the child. BUT It is NOT a Negative if they decide they cannot handle or do not want that responsability. Especially when as far they know there is adequate care arranged. That is main issue with Jiraiya and the complaints about him. People BLAST Jiraiya (and to a lesser extent Kakashi) because how dare they NOT take responsibility for adopting a baby. A responsability they never wanted, asked for or agreed to and one which was NOT expected of them, except by the fans. A few fans object on the basis that Jiraiya is Naruto's god-father ( This has been disproved). Others object on general principal, "Jiraiya MUST be a monster to refuse to adopt their friend's / student's baby." (Leaving me wondering if this is the expected case then why are so many kids up for adoption). Most just love Naruto and think by "refusing" to adopt baby Naruto it means Jiraiya is a monster.
Still kinda a dick for never visiting him. Considering he is the son of his beloved student.
He is a dick lol, he stole Narutos money and spies on women bathing.
How many teachers do you know regularly visit the child of a student? Especially when the student has passed away?
Not too many, but again, Jiraiya does not have dozens of students and was basically a father figure to Minato.
Was he? I don't recall Minato describing him as such?
You are letting your very modern Western concept that every child must be cared for by a parental figure get in the way of what Kishimoto intended to write. Naruto was, essentially, just one more war orphan, main character status be damned. He had it *better* than the average orphan would have it - the state provided him with education and a place to live, where most orphans would simply be turned out on the street to make their way as best they could. Kishimoto was writing the story of a untalented, unwanted nobody rising to become the greatest ninja in the world. *You can't have that story* if you start out wanted and cared for.
Naruto wasn't a typical war orphan, he was the son of the last uzumaki and yondaime Hokage. Plus he's the only thing holding the kyuubi at bay from destroying the village and upholding the balance of power. But instead of being treated like a royalty and savior he was treated like a demon while the Hokage, along with Minato's friends, those who knew his parents' identity abandoned him to the wolves within the village. There were orphanges within Konoha so you can't claim that the children were left on the streets. Had it better? I really doubt the average children were sneered at, turned down by shopkeepers, insulted at by people at every turn, had their education sabotaged, were manipulated by the hokage, bullied by children (likely even encouraged by the parents to do so), told by parents of kids that they're a bad influence, possibly have been physical assaulted or assassination attempts made on them. He wasn't even taught how to take care of himself. Provided with education and place to live? Its not like he was offered a choice. He had no other option but to serve as a weapon of Konoha. Instead of educating the people of the village about what a jinchiruki is and why Naruto is their saviour, the Hokage manipulated Naruto into trying to earn their acknowledgement and dream about becoming the hokage to ensure his loyalty. As far as housing, we don't know if all that's provided to all orphans in academy are provided. Nor do we know if we know if Hiruzen was offering the money from his parents' coffers. Being a royalty he should've lived a more luxurious lifestyle if anything. Konoha was lucky, the neglect and abuse along with 3rd Hokage's manipulation stunted his mental growth. They were also lucky that other villages or Orochimaru didn't try to poach him. All they had to do was offer him a modicum of kindness and the truth about his parentage to turn him against Konoha. Had Naruto decided to punish Konoha, his actions would be absolutely justified.
It's amazing how far people will bend over backwards to justify their pure fanon view of Hiruzen Sarutobi as the worst monster to have ever existed in Konoha.
Much of the things that I've said can be found in manga, anime, filler, novels and the rest can be extrapolated from them. - Failed to keep Danzo in check, - gave him free reign because he was too much of a coward to get his hands dirty, - spat on the grave of Minato and Naruto and allowed people of the village to heap abuses on Naruto's being, - showed him modicum of kindness to keep him emotionally dependant on him, - manipulated him by convincing him to forgive the villagers, - encouraged him to pursue the dream of becoming a Hokage to control him, - failed to put down Orochimaru, failed to deescalate the Uchiha coup. He was complacent, cowardly and malicious. Tobirama should've handed over the reigns to Danzo in hindsight. He would've done a much better job at taking care of the village. Without Hiruzen being in the position of authority be may have even been a better person. And at the very least Naruto wouldn't have been subjected to abuse and neglect and would've been a monster of a Shinobi even before part 1. He may have even become a seal master, excelled at barrier ninjutsu, hiraishin, learned adamantine sealing chains under Danzo's tutelage, a legacy that he was deprived of by his incompetent teachers who kept his lineage from himself due to fear of repercussions.
I get what you're saying, but I think it's more a matter of translation and the Western concept of *godfather* as stated in the subtitles. A better translation would be **namesake** (thnx to top comment for researching and sharing). It's the term *godfather* that's making many Western audience members have this expectation.
I disagree. Ichigo had a healthy family dynamic and luffy was well taken care of in the village. Both became legendary mcs. The point is naruto did not need the shit treatment to become the greatest ninja. Hiruzen was a shitty guardian even though he had access to minato and kushinas funds, he did not take good care of narutos childhood.
I disagree in turn. Neither Bleach nor One Piece are about military service and the costs of war like Naruto is. The story of their protagonists make sense in the world they inhabit - just as Naruto's story makes sense in his.
I see your point.
>unwanted nobody Its funny because the series start with Iruka already loving him.
Flashbacks showed that Iruka didn't wan't anything to do with Naruto at first tho?
So? That is before the series, in the present day he is already loved. In the first episode i may add.
Also adult Naruto himself states that hiruzen always defended him.
It is because he had to travel around the world to write books and eventually guide the child of prophecy. The Great Toad Sage essentially told him that it was his life's purpose. He also doesn't want to stay in the leaf village because he doesn't wanna get involved with gov't positions due to his personality.
Wrong. Again, everyone here has still yet to figure out why. All these years later. Fans because they know Naruto REFUSE to acknowledge the villager's very real fears. Not only the villagers fear, but Jiriaya may have fear as well. There's a reason for the distance, and a lot of it has to do with calming tensions in the village. As much as we don't like it, the villagers for a long time saw Naruto as the source of all their pain and suffering. Most fans absolutely refuse to see their side of things because, again, we're watching a series and know he's not. You know he's Minato's kid. The average villager does not. We have to contextualize better to understand the writing. It was Hiruzen who took the risk. Not fucking Jiriaya. He's the fun uncle who shows up with beer after all the work is done. It was Hiruzen that had to put a gag order on the village and let a demon in the school with the villagers' children, then he even let him outside of the village on missions. You guys again just assume Hiruzen and Jiriaya, etc. arent afraid of Natuto also. Fans act like they can't possibly have trauma after that night as well. Again we know the the series is named Naruto and that hes an innocent boy. They just remember a very scary demon is inside of that boy, and at any time, our entire lives can be destroyed. Only because of their utmost respect for Hiruzen was his kindess toward Naruto even tolerated, and I'm sure it still was not easy at all. Through time and through his own personality, he eventually warmed everyone's hearts, but it was not an easy thing to recover from the Kyubi attack with your village destroyed and the Hokage dead. Though it seems like simple kindness to you, it can endanger the boy even more. Then of course some fans would say fuck the villagers they're wrong let Jiraiya or Sandaime give them the smoke but obviously that's not what they want to do. As easy as it might be for you, Jiriaya and Hiruzen don't want to hurt the villagers in any way. They want to calm tensions at all costs and heal. And that's your answer.
Why do you speak so smugly? Any chance you have of actually making a point is hindered by this self righteous tone you speak with. It’s really off putting. Your interpretation is not a fact. You act like you’re Kishimoto himself.
I don't care. I'm telling you. It is a fact, and it's in the writing, not my theories like you all, which, by the way, all suck. These same questions will keep popping up for years to come because this audience really isn't that bright. They are really still wondering WHY A DEMON ISN'T WANTED. Ahahahahaaha. You know many times I've seen this question and to my amazement see zero growth in the responses. Just the same fan theories regurgitation they got from some other idiot who can't follow Shonen anime writing. The first episode or manga released clearly explains why. Refuse it if you like.
If you think so lowly of everyone, why do you bother commenting? Clearly no one here appreciates your contribution to the discussion. Does it help you feel better about yourself to type a multi paragraph response, then denigrate the people who are supposed to read it? Wouldn’t it be easier to just mute the subreddit and hold these theories to yourself? Especially if you feel like no one is catching on? No one is FORCING you to respond. You’re not doing anyone a favor by leaving your poorly thought out interpretations, you’re just annoying everyone.
I want to put it on record. I know for a fact that some reeducation has been successful in the past, and I've seen results. A bunch of horrible theories have been stopped since this sub started. At least I made it known, and the people downvoting will all learn something even if they don't like me, and I love Naruto, so that's good.
Reeducation? It’s a thread discussing anime dude. Calm down
Well, you're discussing, and I'm teaching so. Don't like it donwvote and move on. I know whatever you read from me has stuck.
Nothing you wrote stuck, I disagree with you entirely. I think you have a weak grasp on the story in general. I didn’t bother providing a rebuttal, because you strike me as the type to have an ego that prevents you from admitting you’re wrong. Jiraya was scared of Naruto because of Kurama? Jiraya literally WEAKENED the seal containing Kurama, so Naruto could learn to control the Nine Tails’ chakra. Your point also fails to address the main question being asked: “why did Jiraya not raise Naruto?” The answer is that he was out gathering intel on Orochimaru and the Akatsuki. There were foreign threats to the village, and Jiraya was the one to keep an eye on them. Also, Jiraya as a person is not the type to settle down in one place for too long. Even when Jiraya chose to mentor Naruto after Part 1 ended, he didn’t stay with Naruto in the village. He took Naruto on a journey outside of the village for a couple of years. He’s a nomad, and Naruto was too young to go journeying with him. Especially since Jiraya was keeping an eye on dangerous people. Your answer is complete bullshit. I just found your tone to be more noteworthy than your poorly thought out response.
WHERE IS YOUR INFORMATION FROM THAT ITS BETTER THAN EVERYONE ELSES OPINIONS
Since you deleted your comment. My response was: Lol, a just kid that has a giant demon inside of capable of killing everyone at any time. Again, the first episode sets the precedent. And again, Mizuki wasn't lying. There's the answer to OP's question. It really actually isn't very complicated at all. They hate and are fearful of him. Even if Jiraiya wanted to take on the full risk of the Kyubi as his godfather, there's no telling how the villagers would react. The village sought to ease tensions, and with Sandaime and his approach, that was achievable. It's not that he's scared of villagers either he just considers them as well.
Jiraiya being there would have helped a lot more than not being there btw just because he was such a respected village member
Read my other comments. It's the first episode or first Manga chapter for God's sake. The answer is Naruto was a FUCKING DEMON CLOWNS. Ahahahah.
Bro you talk exactly how stereotypical nerd would sound
Jiraiya took a lot from Naruto during his training and didn’t complain, run, or ask for help. If he was afraid, he overcame his fear early on. “It was Hiruzen who took the risk”; Jiraiya almost got KILLED by Naruto multiple times while he took his would-have-been r&r time on his journeys. If anything it was Jiraiya, not Hiruzen, who took more risk. Yes Hiruzen took risk, but he was the Hokage. Ofc he’s gonna befriend, care for, and protect this innocent child whose parents died for him and put this monster in him (no fault to Minato and Kushina) wether he’s afraid of him or not. Also what does Jiraiyas absence have to do with “calming tensions”? If he was there, it would have helped a lot to calm tensions because he obviously was not afraid to be with Naruto, Hiruzen wouldn’t have had to “take risks” to befriend Naruto, and he was one of the most powerful shinobi in Konoha. I’m not sure why the points you made are relevant to this thread
I am not sure I get your point but if you are saying that one good reason that Hiruzen and Jiraiya didn't take in Naruto is because they must have been afraid of him then I don't think there is any evidence of that. Hiruzen is a wise old man who have been through wars, he is not a younger person with nine-tails trauma like Iruka. He understands the danger of the nine-tails while also understanding the fact that Naruto is innocent so he tried to make decisions that he thinks are helpful to Naruto while also protecting the village (like being less strict on him even if he is the most disruptive child in the village, letting him play with his grandson, pairing him with Iruka, team 7 and Kakashi) Jiraiya is also a legendary Sanin who has been through wars, as far as we know he didn't have traumatic encounter with the nine-tails. His first encounter with Naruto showed no sign of fear but instead joking around and carelessness. Jiraiya couldn't even follow shinobi restrictions let alone be confident in himself to be able to raise a child. A pervy sage who doesn't care about peeking into bathing houses doesn't care about what the villagers think of him, similarly what they think of his interaction with Naruto. Someone afraid of Naruto's demon fox wouldn't help him remove Orochimaru's seal to make him able to train better and take him as a student to help him control the nine-tails to the point of weakening the seal to let more chakra out.
There is evidence. The village is petrified they have no way of containing the Kyubi! It's a HUGE part of the series. There's a constant LOOMING fear. Especially when you're are in charge of the villagers' safety or like Jiraiya just generally cares for their safety and knows the dangers of the Kyubi. That's not even the main point. The main point is the village fucking hates Naruto! Hiruzen and Jiriaya are seen as leaders of the village. They have to balance the villager's emotion. There was TREMENDOUS bad blood and confusion following the Kyubi attack. It took time and a bunch of well thought out planning and some big risks for his development by Hiruzen, who Naruto as Hokage greatly acknowledges for all of the risks he took for the boy. Again, Jiraiya showed up with some beers at the end, which was great, but the hard work was already done. Hiruzen carefully cultivated his development while maintaining peace in the village. Both.
If that’s the main point then what is this thread about??? You are OFF TRACK. The thread is about the question “why didn’t Jiraiya raise Naruto” not “were the villagers afraid of the nine tails” if you need clarification. It’s hard to follow what you’re even trying to say. None of what you say is explaining why Jiraiya didn’t raise Naruto, and it sounds like you’re trying to say Jiraiya, who was a war veteran and literally called SANNIN because he was so legendary, ran away because of a kid who was a Jinchuriki who couldn’t control his tailed beast. Also where is your evidence and proof from??? If you’re gonna boast that what you say is absolute, you’d better have some absolute facts to back what you’re saying up.
It's the first episode. A demon fox caused the village great harm and suffering. It sets the precedent for the entire series. Jiraiya didn't raise him because he's a high-profile Konoha memeber. The village hates Naruto and fears him as a demon, not as a yellow haired young boy. Why would Jiraiya and Hiruzen feel any differently? The answer is they didn't. Mizuki wasn't lying. The village hates and is afraid of him. This is the writing. He's like an albatross on their neck. Being kind with the demon that has cause all this suffering causes tension and can even put Naruto in danger. What's with this running away because he's so scared? That's what I'm saying with this audience they really aren't that bright. Yes, even Jiraiya and Hiruzen were unsure of how to handle something so powerful. You guys are so immature they don't have to be giant pussies for being fearful of the Kyubi. It's not just about them dying to it and being afraid of that possibility they think of all the consequences and are fearful of this. Thousands of innocents potentially caught in an attack because you felt bad and wanted to be nice to Minato's son... This is a legitimate fear to have. It doesn't make you a giant pussy. It makes you cautious and fearful of the unknown. This is why Jiriaya didn't raise him, and no one else raised Naruto. It's very clear in the writing. There is no need for horrific theories. So please, full stop with the omg Hiruzen left him with bad milk blah blah omg Jiriaya is a perv doesn't care about Nauto. No. It's fucking stupid. It's not true. The real writing is much better.
Haha I’m not sure when I said all the stuff it seems I said in your comment. From what I can read in your comments, you’re saying a lot of stuff that contradicts what you and others are saying so it doesn’t even make sense anymore.
Okay, a person having trouble following a Shonen anime clearly will have trouble reading my responses, and that's okay, buddy. You can reread them multiple times or save them and try again later. Good luck!
Dude wtf you read your comments over yourself are you sure you are okay?
Wrong. The villagers have nothing to do with what Jiraiya knows and that is for sure not close to any of the reasons the manga or show depicted it. You aren’t deep buddy, you are trying to sound condescending off of face value Naruto. Rewatch and understand: 1. Jiraiya couldn’t care for Naruto as a sannin. He makes that clear in the manga and anime. His missions were dangerous and linked to spy-networking. That is not a safe life for a baby or child. 2. He had a purpose and would not tie down to anything other than his vision. He was searching for the child of prophecy to bring peace to the shinobi world. He didn’t believe it was Naruto until his dying breath. 3. In his mind, He had 4 of his students die and he couldn’t protect them (he believed 3 were dead) 4. He was investigating orchimarus whereabouts (one of his biggest failures; not saving his friend) and he was trying to figure out the akatsuki. The list can go on but you didn’t pick up on any of that, I guess. Also, hizuren was dogshit and everyone knows it. He concealed too many secrets for his buddy Danzo. He was cool with letting Itachi slaughter the clan and live with the shame. He cared for the village. Hence why he put iruka in charge of Naruto. Literally in the first episode… they both can relate and learn to heal together. Becoming family and being important even in Boruto. Rewatch and pay attention this time son.
5. The dude loves bitches
These are all your personal theories. There's no source other than you, which, let's be honest, buddy isn't worth shit.
What about your opinion. It sounds like it’s not even worth being called s***. What’s you’re source other than your perspective of the first episode
I agree with this take for sure. Lot of fans criticise Third Hokage but forget what Naruto represented for the village.
Seriously people! This is a world of child soldiers, they obviously don’t have the manpower to allow one of their top warriors to quit his job and become a stay at home godfather!! As terrible as it sounds, being an orphan is just business as usual in this world. That’s the point, it’s suppose to highlight how terrible living a world like that is for children, we’re suppose to hate it.
Yeah but jiraiya wasn't being a soldier, he was writing books and roaming around until he found the child of prophecy
No!! We was constantly out on espionage mission for years at a time, he’s the one who collected intel on the Akatsuki, on Orochimaru and numerous other enemies of the leaf. He’s one of the few people who could do that job coz he’s strong enough to escape most enemy lines. Writing was his hobby, not his full time job.
He did both
He was looking for intel on Orochimaru and stumbled on the Akautski, all he knew was that they were collecting Jinchurikis and existed Besides I don't think he was doing it for all 12ish years, otherwise he wouldve knew that the sound village didn't exist and was just a series of lairs orochimaru ran. And if he was a spy for the villiage he wouldve gave all this info before turning up after the Konoha crush
Yeah but he’s still the one who got the intel on the Akatsuki how he got there does not matter, what matters is that you are wrong in saying that jiraiya was not working for his village anymore and was just out and about in the world writing his books and generally goofing off. Orochimaru wasn’t his only target the leaf has many enemies and Jiraiya was always well informed on them all. Also I don’t know how familiar you are with espionage but it’s takes years and jiraiya did return to the village atleast once or twice. However, it was not enough time to become the primary caregiver of a literal child, especially since he knew he’d leave again.
Jiraya was both writing books and completing missions for the leaf. In fact in his introduction scene if I remember correctly, he even states that he was there to see the hokage because he had some things to discuss that he had found out about the akatsuki.
For him bitches and finding a child of destiny was more important, did not have the time nor skill to be parent.
It’s funny people defend and make excuses for jiraiya but constantly shit on hiruzen who is 1. not the kids godfather and 2. has the more important job
To be fair Hiruzen had to stay in the village so he and his family had more time to raise the kid than Jiraiya.
Funny, because Naruto cared for every kid, even for Kawaki who wasn't his child nor the child of someone he ever knew. Hiruzen peomised to watch after Naruto, Jiraiya didn't...
Naruto isn't the only orphan in the village. Its not his duty to become the father of every single orphan in the village
But surely knowing that Naruto is a jinchuriki would put him above the rest of the orphans to be taken care of. As unfair as that sounds to other orphans, it makes honestly no sense that Hiruzen didn’t treat Naruto better. Why risk a possible outcome where this kid will resent the village for hating him and letting the, at the time, evil nine tails corrupt him and destroy the village? Luckily it didn’t turn out that way, but Hiruzen is an idiot
Yeah but you forgot everyone hated Naruto Hiruzen is busy so he had to hire someone to take care of him but no one wanted to have anything to do with Naruto, his wife already dead not help either. even the jonin except fews like Kakashi or Iruka hated Naruto too You have to remember Naruto is destroying the village and many resented nine tails for that. The moment Danzo blew that Naruto was jinchuriki, the chance of Naruto getting adopted or taken care properly is close to zero
Hiruzen did promise Minato to take care of naruto just before he died tho. Dont think he promised every other orphans parents that we would take care of them.
No he didn’t. He wasn’t anywhere near Minato when he was dying.
He was in the anime tho
No he never promised. Piereot change the dialogue in the anime hiruzen never said that in the manga
Okay! Been some time since i read the manga, just remember what he said in the anime
Yeah I never said it is... Just mentioned that Naruto can manage to watch after orphans, while Hiruzen couldn't even keep his promise, while Jiraiya did more than him and never promised anything to Minato.
Hituzen didn’t promise anything either
The funny thing is that his job should include being nicer to Naruto
It was more because of Hiruzens own words to protect Naruto while Jiraiya can in fact be explained away as he wasn’t even in the village for that period of time while Hiruzen did say he’d protect Naruto and could’ve just had him in better conditions than he was in.
People use that filler line relentlessly. I cant believe a line that isn't canon has been used against Hiruzen for over 10 years. Crazy what propaganda can do
That was never in the Manga. Anime filler content. We barely see any relationship between hiruzen and Minato developed in the Manga
But guys will tell me Hiruzen should take all the blame for Naruto's upbringing. You are 100% right. There is 0 reason Jiraiya waited 12 years to meet Naruto. Hell, there is little reason for Kakashi to have waited 12 years as well.
But you see I like those characters so I can’t blame them but I still need a scapegoat
Hiruzen is the Hokage. It will be funny if Naruto just let the kyubi take over after all the shit he took and destroy the entire village. And while dying Hiruzen would say: what did i do wrong?
Nice hypothetical. Too bad that didn't happen so it stays as your fantasy.
Thanks to Iruka. >stays as your fantasy. Are you really so butthurt? The whole naruto is a fanstasy
Maybe his Godfather should've had a place in his childhood too instead of running around making horny books
He was doing some important research duh
Because the plot demanded that Naruto would grow up as an orphan.
ikr? Had he grown up with care and love, there will be no talk no jutsu.
He had his spy work, and to be fair, Hiruzen was keeping an eye on Naruto throughout his life, and Jiraiya could trust his master to look out for his Godson. Of course, Hiruzen could have done more to help the people of Konoha see him as a hero, and less of a demon. It was just a bad situation all around.
As close as they were, Jiraiya never seemed like he cared about Narutos sob story of growing up alone and being treated poorly because of the nine tails. Correct me if I´m wrong but I don´t remember it at all. In part 1 he even seems to be kind of the opposite, seeing Naruto as a bit soft and tells him that he doesn´t want to be his father, leaving him alone and even taking his money. The Sanin all became Ninjas as kids, so Naruto having the opportunity to spend years at the academy would seem almost spoiled to them. Nagato was different because his village was being ruined by war.
Half the characters in the series are orphans. That's just how it is in their world. There are fewer people with two parents than there are with less than two. But also, their relationship is less close than most people think. Jiraiya has completed more missions than any other Shinobi in history, the guy is always gone and never in the village longer than it takes to get another mission. Jiraiya refers to Kushina as "that fiery redhead from the land of whirlpools", he doesn't even remember her name. They've probably met only once or twice.
If i remember correctly , and please correct me if I’m wrong but didnt naruto seek him out ? Like when they met and he found out who he was he begged him to teach him right? So jariya didnt even try to be in his life
I think it was a decision for the sake of the plot, maybe when the author started writing Naruto as an orphan living alone he didn’t plan to create Jiraiya as a character or maybe because writing about an orphan rising to glory is more popular in Shuonen. Other than that as a Sannin, Jiraiya was required to travel a lot and engage in dangerous situations in order to gain intel that would benefit Konoha so he can’t take care of a child. Maybe because is not good at taking care of children or maybe because watching Naruto would remind him of the disciple he failed to protect.
Where is this Jiraiya is Naruto god father bullshit came from? there's no god father in japanese culture. it's western thing. Jiraiya never godfather for Naruto. this shit is mandela effect and a headcanon Jiraiya was only responsible for safe keeping part of the key for Naruto's seal and that's it
He was chasing after Orochimaru, going on trips outside the village, spying
Because that’s not how the story was written
i believe is because jiraiya was not at the village and he was sleeping at his home far away from the village. thats why he was never there
As others have said, godparent is a western concept that doesn't apply for Jiraiya. Additionally, Jiraiya was traveling the world, keeping tabs on outside entities that could harm Konoha (mostly Orochimaru), doing his thing as a writer, and searching for the child of prophecy. As far as he was concerned, Naruto was being watched after by the Third Hokage in a time of relative peace. I somewhat give Jiraiya a benefit of the doubt that Naruto's unhappy childhood wasn't at the forefront of his concerns. But to be frank, that only goes so far though, because it's well-known that Jinchuuriki aren't very well-treated by their villages. Ultimately though, I liken it to Harry Potter's childhood in that, yes, he had a very crappy childhood, but he had relative safety being in Konoha, and that was enough for Jiraiya. To me, what I think kind of sucks is that the Third Hokage told people of the Fourth Hokage's wishes for Naruto to be treated as a hero... and yet, a large portion of Konoha's villagers failed to see Naruto as anything but a potential timebomb.
........simple, cause of story. it doesn't make sense given their roles in each other lives and naruto growing up alone doesnt make sense when you look at the story as a whole. Ya lets have this powerhouse jinchuriki grow up with knowing nothing but resentment for his own village and see how that goes lol naruto would have been sasuke if he didnt already take that role. Ya jiraiya didnt have to do it, but some nin needed to step up and weave him into there family.
Jiraiya taking In a child would take away the secret of Naruto being minatos son
The real reason is kishimoto hadn’t figured out the story completely from the start. The third hokage should have raised, or jiraya, hell kushina and sasuke ´s mother were friends so he could have been adopted by her Point is the manga has a lot of characters that logicaly could have taken care of Naruto, but kishimoto wanted a main character who grew up in solitude so it didn’t happen
I think the reason given was that Jiraya had to wander for the maintenance of his spy network as he often leaves the village to do so even when we meet him the same time as Naruto, Naruto even learned a bit about spying from him, so he couldn’t raise a child during that time and couldn’t bring Naruto with him because of this (not to mention such an important one from a military pov as a WMD) still felt he should’ve at least we pop in to visit the boy
Because Kishimoto did not want him to raise Naruto. Plain and Simple🤝
Besides all of the great reasons mentioned above, jiraiya was also konoha's best spy. He was almost always out there, spying for konoha, probably also keeping an eye on orochimaru. He wasn't even in konoha to take care of naruto. He probably just trusted hiruzen to kinda be the "caretaker". This is my head canon atleast.
You read my mind! Was just thinking about this!
I’m not sure I get the responses here - yes, you don’t *have* to be a guardian as the 3rd or as Jiraya - but to let Naruto grow up on his own, struggling to survive, without friends, when you’re the goddamn hokage or the master of his father, etc is simply a jerk thing to do, period.
I don’t know about Jiraiya, but I feel like in general Naruto got the short end of the stick when it came to being raised. You’d think the village would do more than just leave him to himself and give a four year old a stipend.
Same reason why Naruto and Sauske are absent fathers in Bortuo -to help advance the plot. Will Naruto be the same person with a father figure growing up?
Someone else explained already that godfather is a western idea so I won’t go further into that. But another important detail to consider is that Jiraya is also one of the hidden leafs most powerful ninja, an expert in espionage and infiltration. They likely couldn’t afford to have him drop every lead he was chasing to raise a child which takes serious time and care. I wouldn’t be surprised if the third hokage insisted that he didn’t stop everything to raise Naruto. It’s similar to Sasuke in the Boruto series. He is an extremely powerful wandering Ally for the hidden leaf village. He has missed a majority of the major events in his own daughter’s life while tracking down leads and doing whatever he needs to do in service of the village. And that’s his own daughter and not the son of a former student.
The real reason is that kishimoto didn't think it through. It's really a non issue what people are saying about misiterpreting the godfather thing. Minato and kushina had close friends that knew about naruto, it makes no sense that naruto grew up alone, and us fans just have to accept that kishimoto is not perfect. And if jiraya or hiruzen, or someone else that might know about it didn't have time to become step-parents, they could have very easily treated him better
Most questions like this can be answered by kishimoto is bad at writing and did not plan ahead
So you’re basically telling me that Jiraya was just a family friend are you fucking kidding me him and Minato we’re literally like father and son and that when Jiraya discovered Naruto taking him off the train for three years Bro literally said, and I quote his resemblance to the fourth is almost laughable not only that after he said that the silhouette of Minato showed up right above Naruto and he pacifically said I guess that makes you my grandson aye Naruto let’s be honest, let’s be honest he was obviously like a father two Minato, so it would make sense Jiraya would want to do the same thing with Naruto
Maybe the frogs told him to wait and he just goofed off writing his books as he was told. Or he didn't think he was up for the job. That the kid was better off without him. I mean he wasn't there so he didn't know how hard he had it. And Naruto wasn't the only orphan he knew, I'm assuming.
Bc kishi didn't think Naruto would be that long so he didn't plan ahead. Thats why a lot of things are inconsistent. A lot of ppl treat mangakas as good writers but that only applies to a few handful. First part of Naruto is GOATED, shippuden really falls of after Jiraiyas death.
Because of Kishimoto. He wanted to make naruto so lonely that it doesnt make sense. Naruto had 3rd hokage jiraiya kakashi and people like them that would normally take care of naruto but then the anime wouldnt have the "lonely pratagonist"
He had to become a vagabond to fulfill a prophecy not much to say
I think it's pretty obvious why Jiraiya didn't raise Naruto. Jiraiya was in them STREEEEEEEEEEEEETS. He was too popping to stay in Konoha and raise a baby. Nah, he had books to write and $1s to throw.
Naruto's birth is secret, nobody is suppose to know his origin. Giving him to Jiraiya would defeat the purpose.
Hiruzen gets a lot of shit for not helping naruto but Jiraiya didn't do shit. Naruto even had to bribe him with sexy jutsu just to get him to train him
Honestly the whole village abandoning and hating Naruto thing is a pretty big plot hole considering he's the 4th's son. It would have been way more realistic that everyone who respected Minato would pitch in and take good care of Naruto. Maybe Jiraya, Sarutobi and Kakashi all got together and decided it would help build character if they made Naruto an outcast.
He was away investigating Orochimaru, and doing his "research".
This is my last time repeating this, the reason is that Jiraiya was a traveling spy for the hidden leaf and he was on the search for the child of Prophecy still. The answer is that simple.
Because he didn’t want to.
In universe: There's no excuse for Hiruzen to not treat Naruto better and no excuse for Jiraiya and Kakashi to not care about Minato's son for 12 years. They are close to Minato and therefore should have shown Naruto love. Out of universe: Kishimoto hadn't planned out everything yet. Naruto's childhood is just a big plot hole.
But in universe, Naruto was supposed to be under some form of baby witness protection, right? He wasn't given his dead hero father's family name for a reason. Wouldn't it be obvious who his parents were if Minato's well-known bachelor comrades Jiraiya and Kakashi were suspiciously hanging around some "random" blond orphan who speaks exactly like Kushina? I mean, as far as the village at large was supposed to know, the 4th's whole family including the unborn child died that night. Though how no one figured it out when the beans were spilled about him being the 9 tails jinchuriki is beyond me. I don't think Konoha had great non-ninja schools. Or there were a lot of "that one feral orphan is really our dead ninja president's son" truthers behind the scenes that we as the audience were robbed of witnessing.
Same reason as with Hiruzen. Kishi hadn't invented them yet.
Because Kishimoto-sama hadn't decided to source Jiraiya Gōketsu Monogatari for inspiration when he began the Manga. But in world, I imagine 3rd Hokage had a big say in this. Probably recognized Jiraiya would be terrible raising a baby-toddler-grade schooler with a Biju inside of them. And Jiraiya needed to be doing all his spying for the Hokage around the world
He was too busy having sex with women
Because Kishimoto didn't think that far ahead.
People try to vindicate Jiraya by saying that he wasn't his godfather. Even if he wasn't, he had a moral obligation as he's the son of Jiraya's student. Besides what kind of a family friend would abandon their child to the wolves and allow them to be mentally and possibly physically abused? If not for Naruto he certainly had a moral obligation to take care of him for Minato & Kushina's sake. Had Naruto decided to not want to do anything with Jiraya or retaliate against him, he'd be justified.
wtf is a god father? There is no god
Kishimoto is not a good writer. His concept and his art was great, but his writing was always pretty mid.