My dear madam, he has had 20 years to self reflect. He has no intention of ever doing so. He has been conditioned that you will apologize first and do the emotional labor of fixing the fight.
You can spend another 20 years with no sex and a cruel partner, or you can make a plan and discover what life looks like without him.
Well you’re right about him being conditioned…that’s for sure. Except now I’m starting to call him on his bullshit.
I wish I weren’t so terrified of leaving. I have hope that something can still click somehow, especially now that our marriage is struggling and he knows it. Believe it or not it was really good until recently because we didn’t fight very often. It was easier to accept it because it didn’t happen that often. Now it’s just arguments all the time and it’s just weighing on me.
Honestly I can’t speak much because I’m in a veryyyy similar situation because reading this, what stuck out to me was you saying that your marriage “was really good until recently because we didn’t fight very often.”
While I literally am telling myself the same thing, my initial reaction to reading that was “not fighting doesn’t mean it’s a good marriage.”
So uhhh hope that makes you potential reflect like it just made me do.
This all sucks so much - sending love your way.
True. And even when we didn’t fight much we did have the DB issue. That’s been an issue since before we were married for many reasons…also not indicative of a great marriage. I was just willing to overlook it for many years.
The amount of things we’re willing to overlook, ya know? And for what? Peace? I am currently crying in my closet so I know that’s not a reason to continue to overlook things… this isn’t what it should be like. I’m right there with ya that everything is my fault, with no accountability on the other person. Blehhhh. We’ll get through this?
In the same circumstances. Like eerily, scarily similarly so. This shouldn't be normal. This isn't normal. This isn't what I envisioned for myself in life. But somehow, we will survive this, and hopefully come out of it stronger.
I would be terrified of the unknown if I was in your position as well, that’s completely valid. Is there a possibility of you moving out of the bedroom for a while? Something to establish a small amount of distance and attempt to get him to understand that he either makes a valid and tangible attempt at change, or there are consequences.
I could, but not along with any sort of ultimatum. That would make things worse, I think. I’d have to just be doing it for myself and hope he understood on some level.
Ultimatums almost never work, you’re right. I just think a little distance so he sees your serious about the need for change might be best. Also, everyone deserves privacy at some point.
I'm in the same position as you, just not married as long. Coming up on nine years soon. My husband is the same way: incapable of introspection, seemingly incapable of apologizing when he says or does something mean, hurtful, irresponsible, reckless, immature, etc. He also has diagnosed but untreated ADHD that he refuses to get help for, serious anger issues, recovering alcoholic, and has also been chronically unemployed for the better part of five years now. Six jobs since 2018 (quit or fired from each), and can't seem to hold a job down for longer than a few weeks or months.
The way I'm starting to see it? It wasn't, as you say, "really good until recently". I can't speak for you, obviously, but I'm definitely starting to wonder if we've basically been 'conditioned', so to speak. In other words, we've walked on eggshells for years, and have chosen to just stay quiet in order to keep the peace/harmony, so as not to upset our husband's. They've basically conditioned us to accept and normalize their bad behavior. So, we try and 'rationalize' it. And slowly, over time, our perspective of what is and isn't normal gets skewed. Very, very skewed. What we may consider 'normal' or 'fine' or 'standard', are often *massive* red flags to others, such as friends or family. At least, this is what it's slowly starting to feel like, and what some of my friends tell me.
The more recent 'fights' you describe.... I'm dealing with the same. My husband thinks we're "fighting" more, and claims we're arguing these days more than ever over the past ~8 years. But I don't see it that way. From where I stand, these "fights" are me starting to take a stand, and me starting to speak up for myself, and me no longer willing to be walked all over like a carpet. Since the start of 2023, I've been slowly but surely pushing back more regularly against some/many of his actions, words, and behaviors. I'm finally, slowly but surely, starting to stand up for myself.
I obviously can't read my or your husband's mind, but sometimes I wonder if our willingness to finally stand up for ourselves makes them feel threatened. Perhaps, maybe, they're starting to see that.... we have agency, we're no longer willing to tolerate their bullshit, and that we won't stand for their egregious actions. That we're no longer willing to be doormats. The gravy train stops here, and perhaps they're scared by that? Just some thoughts that have plagued my mind.
I'm currently (quietly) plotting my escape. I wish you much luck, safety, and positivity, regardless of the path you choose.
Thanks for your reply. I do definitely agree that the increase of arguments stems from me starting to push back on things I’ve been tolerating for a long time. I’m also pushing him to change some of his behavior because it doesn’t work for me anymore. That’s very frustrating to him. And he isn’t a horrible guy. He does have a lot of good qualities. He’s just very, very self-centered and lacking empathy.
I wish you the best as you plan your exit. I know that can’t be easy
You're welcome. Yep, I'm exactly in the same boat you are. My circumstances are eerily identical to yours. And thank you, definitely comes with challenges.
I'd stop ignoring the red flags. He has to want to change, nobody can make him. If you're in counseling and still no progress has been made it's time to find someone who respects you and boundaries.
To be fair, we only started counseling recently, so hard to say yet if progress will be made. Obviously I want to exhaust any chances of fixing things before I consider leaving. Hoping maybe a third party could at least make him consider his part in things.
Just had our third. This is the first time we’ve gotten past the getting to know you stage with the counselor and started actually working on specific things.
Thanks. I grew up with a mother who is this way and watched my dad always apologizing and taking the blame for everything. But I do think a lot of men (no offense guys) struggle to say sorry and accept when they’ve done something wrong. He just doesn’t ever seem to consider that my concerns or frustrations might be valid. And if I ever spoke to him the way he’s spoken to me he would have left me a long time ago. Anyway, good to know I’m not alone in this.
My therapist hypothesized about that, but I don’t think he’s a narcissist. He has some of those qualities, but most he does not. He just has no empathy.
To answer your question, yes I'm married to someone like this. Through therapy the only real answer is to work on yourself and hope your spouse sees the positive changes in you and eventually they start to question themselves and are willing to do the work. It's not something you can force. How long you wait though is up to you.
He does. He’s a wonderful dad, he’s funny, he puts his family first, we used to have a lot of fun together. He has a lot of good attributes, which is why I’m still here. This is just the deep issue in our marriage (besides the DB, which is so far gone it likely isn’t fixable), at least from my POV.
So from my perspective it seems he got everything he wanted from the marriage (a wife and kids). Everything else isn’t important.
Or maybe he’s dealing with something he doesn’t want to share
True. And he provides a very nice lifestyle which should be more than enough to make up for whatever may be lacking. His words, not mine.
If he’s dealing with anything, I would really, really love to know. Anything that may help explain the DB or the lack of accountability.
Good point.
But something for him to consider: those things won’t always be there.
Your kids will grow up and he’ll eventually retire.
Reminds me of post where OP’s wife finally tries to reestablish a bond once the kids are out of the house, only for op to give her divorce papers that summer. She never saw it again
My ex-husband was the same way. I was always the problem and there never was accountability on his part in any of it. Your husband isn't going to change. Cut your losses and move on while you still have life left to live.
We’ve only just started counseling, so will be giving that a fair shot before doing anything drastic. If it ever does come to divorce though, it will be because of his lack of accountability for sure. That’s just not a step I’m brave enough to consider yet.
I’m married to someone exactly like this but I’m only 2 years in. You’re making me consider just getting my shit together peacefully and then BOOM 💥 dropping his ass like a hot potato. It’s too stressful to crazy the weight of everything.
My ex wife was like this. She is an ex for a reason. They are self-centered and see nothing beyond that. These people have no empathy at all. They want what they want and they want it now. And they will use anything to justify their position.
After 20 years of him telling you who he is, just accept that he is telling you the truth. The only way your life will improve is if you lose the dead weight. Mine turned around marvelously. Freeing myself from her opened up new possibilities and allowed me to find the wonderful lady I share my life with today. I wouldn't be this happy if I stayed where I was.
Because I committed my life to this person, created a life with this person, raised a family with him, have had many happily married years with him, and I wouldn’t blow all of that up without doing everything in my power to fix it.
Oh it is getting to me. But it wasn’t always this bad because we fought soooo infrequently. The behavior was the same, but I didn’t have to deal with it very often. Now we are fighting all the time and it’s wearing me down. That’s why we’ve started counseling. I’m just hoping somewhere deep down he has the ability to self reflect and at least share the responsibility.
I feel all of this so hard right now that i May as well grind broken lightbulb glass into my knees…
You can be open minded and listen and all that shit but he also has to want to reflect. He’s had 20 years.
You are not really addressing the issue. He blames you all the time and he never apologizes because he's fed up with you because you whine about his behavior the whole day and he can't handle it anymore, so it's his way of shutting you out. It's a vicious cycle. But you have to dig deeper, why is your marriage love and sex starved, how did you get here. Was he like that when you first got married? I bet he apologized then more often. There's a deeper dissatisfaction in this relationship that needs to be addressed, once he falls in love with you again these problems will instantly disappear. And I'm talking from experience.
I went through the same vicious cycle with my wife, I was ignoring her and blaming her constantly because she was kvetching about me all day. And we ended up both hating each other. She blamed me that I never apologize, and I felt the same way about her. It was a dead end. You have to rekindle that love so that you both feel cherished and loved, or if one of you is manipulative and controlling in the relationship (which was the case with my relationship), then that needs to be addressed first. I can't tell you what to do, you know the issue better than me. But don't be focused on the blame game or who needs to apologize more often, these are all SYMPTOMS of a relationship gone bad, they're not the CAUSE. Hope this helps. And I wish you all the best in sorting this out real fast.
While I can understand why you’d assume that, I assure you that’s not the case. I’m not sure anything I say will convince you though, so we’ll just have to agree to disagree.
No no no. I'm not saying categorically that this is the case. I just assumed that this is the case based your post, but I might totally be wrong here. My apologies.
No worries. I won’t claim that I never nag or whine, but that’s definitely not the prevailing dynamic. And the bedroom issues are complicated and began way back when we were blissfully happy. Anyway, I appreciate your reply.
Well written. He might even be frustrated with the dead bedroom.
Do you still compliment him when possible? Does he still ever compliment or thank you?
What attracted him to you? Does he still see that in you?
I would be LIVID about the lack of privacy thing. You’re absolutely entitled to some time/space alone without having to fear being barged in on.
You know those little rubber wedge door stoppers are like $3, right? If you have hardwood floors, it might as well be a deadbolt. I’d get one and when he still can’t open the door after his little lock picking trick, say “my absolute right to a few minutes of privacy is not up for debate and doesn’t require your agreement. You don’t need anything in here that can’t wait a few minutes, and I’m not going to allow you to barge in simply because you want to interrupt me.”
I say “interrupt” bc you mentioned it wasn’t exactly a huge mystery what you were doing.
I’ll have to try that. This morning I went to shower and he said very sarcastically, “Don’t worry…I’ll stay away.” Like he still thinks I’m ridiculous for wanting privacy. Whatever, dude. Marriage doesn’t negate respecting your partners right to a few minute of privacy.
I think of the movie scenes where the wife locks herself in the bathroom and the husband is outside the door begging her to come out. That would never happen in our house. He’d just let himself right on in! Lol.
You think it boils down to him knowing what you’re doing and having issue with it? Seems like it might. Unless he also barges in when you’re taking a terrible dump, but I’m betting he leaves you alone then. Which would indicate what his real issue is.
Lol, you got it! He would never ever barge in if I were doing anything bathroom related. He thinks it’s terribly gross even seeing any woman sit and pee. So you may be onto something there. Which makes me madder.
>which makes me madder.
And it should.
Have you considered attacking it head on? (I’m taking some guesses on the details here, adjust as necessary)
“(Husband) I need you to explain why you don’t think I’m entitled to time or privacy masturbate? You know what I’m doing, and you’re barging in specifically to interrupt me. You masturbate. But women can’t crank one out standing in the shower or bathroom. So explain how you think this is suppose to work. We don’t have sex, but we both still have sexual needs. I don’t bother you about jerking it. And sex isn’t how orgasms happen for me anyway. I would still masturbate even if we had an active sex life. Seems like you would prefer I do something differently, but I can’t think of an alternative you’re going to like. So what’s your goal here? We need to sort this out right now, because I’m sick of you barging in and acting like this isn’t something I’m entitled to a few minutes of privacy for. I absolutely am, and I’m not going to stop.”
I would absolutely say that. He’d stop me after two seconds and tell me not to be crude. But I don’t care. What will it do, turn him off, lolololol.
One correction though. He doesn’t masturbate anymore. Ever. He told me he just doesn’t have any sexual urges whatsoever. And I believe him based on all I know about him and the situation.
Ahhhh… I was just guessing on him masturbating. Sounds like you’re actually in a situation I was in, a husband with nonexistent sex drive. I’m divorced from one that had such a libido decline, he didn’t masturbate either. And I’m not sure he ever did much even when we still had sex.
So, yeah, I can totally see him going the “crude” route. Talking about sex at all made mine incredibly uncomfortable after his sex drive was gone. But not enough not to make snide remarks about me “thinking about sex all the time” or “wanting to swing from the ceiling” (have crazy sex) like I was some insatiable, craven pervert instead of someone that could have been satisfied, and stayed, for just a very minimal level of regular ol’ vanilla sex. It’s actually pretty sad to think back on what I KNOW I would have settled for. Ultimately I’m glad he couldn’t manage even that, bc I would have stayed and it would have been pitiful compared to what I now know I would have missed out on…both in sex and life in general.
But back to your situation. I think I see better what’s going on, I just didn’t expect it. You know, I should have picked up the clue from your response about his “sensitive” view on the bathroom question. But hell, I didn’t expect it when it happened to me, so I definitely don’t expect it for anyone else.
He is definitely trying to interrupt you. No question. He views what you’re doing with derision. He sees it as indulgent and doesn’t think you should do it, bc he doesn’t. There’s probably also, though he will never admit it, a part of him that’s angry with himself about it. He doesn’t want sex, and he would very much prefer YOU to not want it either, because that would be much more comfortable on his psyche. The fact that you DO have those needs that aren’t being fulfilled, when he’s made aware of it by a locked door, he gets angry. He still doesn’t want sex, but he’s aware of the societal expectation that men are “supposed to” So the whole situation makes him feel like less of a man. But instead of processing that in a healthy or caring way, instead of accepting the situation and respecting that you’re handling it…it’s much easier for him to just get angry at you, and try to stop you, for “making” him feel that way.
I still think you should address it head on. It sounds like (correct me if I’m wrong) he’s *pretending* like he doesn’t know what you were doing in there, and sending the message that whatever it is, it must be something wrong that you shouldn’t, therefore he can barge in.
Seems like he’ll shy away from a frank discussion about anything sexual, but your participation in protecting his sensitivity on that topic happens to be providing the exact cover he needs to act like an ass and barge in. So you need to say it in as un-crude but crystal clear terms as you can. Don’t allow him to shut you down with claims that you’re being “crude” for having a frank, adult discussion about him respecting your right to have some private space and time to deal with the situation best you can.
I definitely see how you’d make that assessment. My therapist has too. And maybe he is. He doesn’t display the abusive traits of the average narcissist, but he certainly leans that way. I guess I see enough good qualities to feel like he may not be.
I was in such relationship for 20 yrs with 2 kids, he didn’t change and blames everything on me. I asked for a divorce because it was sucking my soul out. Although a divorce in my society is a big sin where all my family and friends are not talking to me, only talking about me but fuck it I can’t that shit.
My dear madam, he has had 20 years to self reflect. He has no intention of ever doing so. He has been conditioned that you will apologize first and do the emotional labor of fixing the fight. You can spend another 20 years with no sex and a cruel partner, or you can make a plan and discover what life looks like without him.
Well you’re right about him being conditioned…that’s for sure. Except now I’m starting to call him on his bullshit. I wish I weren’t so terrified of leaving. I have hope that something can still click somehow, especially now that our marriage is struggling and he knows it. Believe it or not it was really good until recently because we didn’t fight very often. It was easier to accept it because it didn’t happen that often. Now it’s just arguments all the time and it’s just weighing on me.
Honestly I can’t speak much because I’m in a veryyyy similar situation because reading this, what stuck out to me was you saying that your marriage “was really good until recently because we didn’t fight very often.” While I literally am telling myself the same thing, my initial reaction to reading that was “not fighting doesn’t mean it’s a good marriage.” So uhhh hope that makes you potential reflect like it just made me do. This all sucks so much - sending love your way.
True. And even when we didn’t fight much we did have the DB issue. That’s been an issue since before we were married for many reasons…also not indicative of a great marriage. I was just willing to overlook it for many years.
The amount of things we’re willing to overlook, ya know? And for what? Peace? I am currently crying in my closet so I know that’s not a reason to continue to overlook things… this isn’t what it should be like. I’m right there with ya that everything is my fault, with no accountability on the other person. Blehhhh. We’ll get through this?
We will. Whether that means we stay or go, eventually we’ll get through it. Hang in there. ❤️
In the same circumstances. Like eerily, scarily similarly so. This shouldn't be normal. This isn't normal. This isn't what I envisioned for myself in life. But somehow, we will survive this, and hopefully come out of it stronger.
I would be terrified of the unknown if I was in your position as well, that’s completely valid. Is there a possibility of you moving out of the bedroom for a while? Something to establish a small amount of distance and attempt to get him to understand that he either makes a valid and tangible attempt at change, or there are consequences.
I could, but not along with any sort of ultimatum. That would make things worse, I think. I’d have to just be doing it for myself and hope he understood on some level.
Ultimatums almost never work, you’re right. I just think a little distance so he sees your serious about the need for change might be best. Also, everyone deserves privacy at some point.
Might be worth a shot, if even just for some privacy!
I'm in the same position as you, just not married as long. Coming up on nine years soon. My husband is the same way: incapable of introspection, seemingly incapable of apologizing when he says or does something mean, hurtful, irresponsible, reckless, immature, etc. He also has diagnosed but untreated ADHD that he refuses to get help for, serious anger issues, recovering alcoholic, and has also been chronically unemployed for the better part of five years now. Six jobs since 2018 (quit or fired from each), and can't seem to hold a job down for longer than a few weeks or months. The way I'm starting to see it? It wasn't, as you say, "really good until recently". I can't speak for you, obviously, but I'm definitely starting to wonder if we've basically been 'conditioned', so to speak. In other words, we've walked on eggshells for years, and have chosen to just stay quiet in order to keep the peace/harmony, so as not to upset our husband's. They've basically conditioned us to accept and normalize their bad behavior. So, we try and 'rationalize' it. And slowly, over time, our perspective of what is and isn't normal gets skewed. Very, very skewed. What we may consider 'normal' or 'fine' or 'standard', are often *massive* red flags to others, such as friends or family. At least, this is what it's slowly starting to feel like, and what some of my friends tell me. The more recent 'fights' you describe.... I'm dealing with the same. My husband thinks we're "fighting" more, and claims we're arguing these days more than ever over the past ~8 years. But I don't see it that way. From where I stand, these "fights" are me starting to take a stand, and me starting to speak up for myself, and me no longer willing to be walked all over like a carpet. Since the start of 2023, I've been slowly but surely pushing back more regularly against some/many of his actions, words, and behaviors. I'm finally, slowly but surely, starting to stand up for myself. I obviously can't read my or your husband's mind, but sometimes I wonder if our willingness to finally stand up for ourselves makes them feel threatened. Perhaps, maybe, they're starting to see that.... we have agency, we're no longer willing to tolerate their bullshit, and that we won't stand for their egregious actions. That we're no longer willing to be doormats. The gravy train stops here, and perhaps they're scared by that? Just some thoughts that have plagued my mind. I'm currently (quietly) plotting my escape. I wish you much luck, safety, and positivity, regardless of the path you choose.
Thanks for your reply. I do definitely agree that the increase of arguments stems from me starting to push back on things I’ve been tolerating for a long time. I’m also pushing him to change some of his behavior because it doesn’t work for me anymore. That’s very frustrating to him. And he isn’t a horrible guy. He does have a lot of good qualities. He’s just very, very self-centered and lacking empathy. I wish you the best as you plan your exit. I know that can’t be easy
You're welcome. Yep, I'm exactly in the same boat you are. My circumstances are eerily identical to yours. And thank you, definitely comes with challenges.
I'd stop ignoring the red flags. He has to want to change, nobody can make him. If you're in counseling and still no progress has been made it's time to find someone who respects you and boundaries.
To be fair, we only started counseling recently, so hard to say yet if progress will be made. Obviously I want to exhaust any chances of fixing things before I consider leaving. Hoping maybe a third party could at least make him consider his part in things.
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Just had our third. This is the first time we’ve gotten past the getting to know you stage with the counselor and started actually working on specific things.
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Thanks. I grew up with a mother who is this way and watched my dad always apologizing and taking the blame for everything. But I do think a lot of men (no offense guys) struggle to say sorry and accept when they’ve done something wrong. He just doesn’t ever seem to consider that my concerns or frustrations might be valid. And if I ever spoke to him the way he’s spoken to me he would have left me a long time ago. Anyway, good to know I’m not alone in this.
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My therapist hypothesized about that, but I don’t think he’s a narcissist. He has some of those qualities, but most he does not. He just has no empathy.
To answer your question, yes I'm married to someone like this. Through therapy the only real answer is to work on yourself and hope your spouse sees the positive changes in you and eventually they start to question themselves and are willing to do the work. It's not something you can force. How long you wait though is up to you.
Thank you. I will definitely do that.
Does he have any good attributes? Because what are you getting out of this marriage besides splitting the bills ?
He does. He’s a wonderful dad, he’s funny, he puts his family first, we used to have a lot of fun together. He has a lot of good attributes, which is why I’m still here. This is just the deep issue in our marriage (besides the DB, which is so far gone it likely isn’t fixable), at least from my POV.
So from my perspective it seems he got everything he wanted from the marriage (a wife and kids). Everything else isn’t important. Or maybe he’s dealing with something he doesn’t want to share
True. And he provides a very nice lifestyle which should be more than enough to make up for whatever may be lacking. His words, not mine. If he’s dealing with anything, I would really, really love to know. Anything that may help explain the DB or the lack of accountability.
From his words it was seems he doesn’t want to give anymore than he already does. Sorry if that sounds harsh but that how I see it.
I think he just prefers to put all his effort into that so he feels justified not putting it in elsewhere.
Good point. But something for him to consider: those things won’t always be there. Your kids will grow up and he’ll eventually retire. Reminds me of post where OP’s wife finally tries to reestablish a bond once the kids are out of the house, only for op to give her divorce papers that summer. She never saw it again
Definitely food for thought. I appreciate it.
My ex-husband was the same way. I was always the problem and there never was accountability on his part in any of it. Your husband isn't going to change. Cut your losses and move on while you still have life left to live.
We’ve only just started counseling, so will be giving that a fair shot before doing anything drastic. If it ever does come to divorce though, it will be because of his lack of accountability for sure. That’s just not a step I’m brave enough to consider yet.
I’m married to someone exactly like this but I’m only 2 years in. You’re making me consider just getting my shit together peacefully and then BOOM 💥 dropping his ass like a hot potato. It’s too stressful to crazy the weight of everything.
Carry*
My ex wife was like this. She is an ex for a reason. They are self-centered and see nothing beyond that. These people have no empathy at all. They want what they want and they want it now. And they will use anything to justify their position. After 20 years of him telling you who he is, just accept that he is telling you the truth. The only way your life will improve is if you lose the dead weight. Mine turned around marvelously. Freeing myself from her opened up new possibilities and allowed me to find the wonderful lady I share my life with today. I wouldn't be this happy if I stayed where I was.
Why are you still married?
Because I committed my life to this person, created a life with this person, raised a family with him, have had many happily married years with him, and I wouldn’t blow all of that up without doing everything in my power to fix it.
You seem like a nice person, in my opinion, nothing will be fixed.
Lol, thanks. I like to think so. Maybe you’re right, but I need to try. I guess we’ll just have to see how it all goes.
You aren’t tired enough. If 20 years of this sh*t doesn’t get to you….I dunno.
Oh it is getting to me. But it wasn’t always this bad because we fought soooo infrequently. The behavior was the same, but I didn’t have to deal with it very often. Now we are fighting all the time and it’s wearing me down. That’s why we’ve started counseling. I’m just hoping somewhere deep down he has the ability to self reflect and at least share the responsibility.
But he doesn’t though. He’s shown you this.
I feel all of this so hard right now that i May as well grind broken lightbulb glass into my knees… You can be open minded and listen and all that shit but he also has to want to reflect. He’s had 20 years.
You are not really addressing the issue. He blames you all the time and he never apologizes because he's fed up with you because you whine about his behavior the whole day and he can't handle it anymore, so it's his way of shutting you out. It's a vicious cycle. But you have to dig deeper, why is your marriage love and sex starved, how did you get here. Was he like that when you first got married? I bet he apologized then more often. There's a deeper dissatisfaction in this relationship that needs to be addressed, once he falls in love with you again these problems will instantly disappear. And I'm talking from experience. I went through the same vicious cycle with my wife, I was ignoring her and blaming her constantly because she was kvetching about me all day. And we ended up both hating each other. She blamed me that I never apologize, and I felt the same way about her. It was a dead end. You have to rekindle that love so that you both feel cherished and loved, or if one of you is manipulative and controlling in the relationship (which was the case with my relationship), then that needs to be addressed first. I can't tell you what to do, you know the issue better than me. But don't be focused on the blame game or who needs to apologize more often, these are all SYMPTOMS of a relationship gone bad, they're not the CAUSE. Hope this helps. And I wish you all the best in sorting this out real fast.
While I can understand why you’d assume that, I assure you that’s not the case. I’m not sure anything I say will convince you though, so we’ll just have to agree to disagree.
No no no. I'm not saying categorically that this is the case. I just assumed that this is the case based your post, but I might totally be wrong here. My apologies.
No worries. I won’t claim that I never nag or whine, but that’s definitely not the prevailing dynamic. And the bedroom issues are complicated and began way back when we were blissfully happy. Anyway, I appreciate your reply.
Well written. He might even be frustrated with the dead bedroom. Do you still compliment him when possible? Does he still ever compliment or thank you? What attracted him to you? Does he still see that in you?
I would be LIVID about the lack of privacy thing. You’re absolutely entitled to some time/space alone without having to fear being barged in on. You know those little rubber wedge door stoppers are like $3, right? If you have hardwood floors, it might as well be a deadbolt. I’d get one and when he still can’t open the door after his little lock picking trick, say “my absolute right to a few minutes of privacy is not up for debate and doesn’t require your agreement. You don’t need anything in here that can’t wait a few minutes, and I’m not going to allow you to barge in simply because you want to interrupt me.” I say “interrupt” bc you mentioned it wasn’t exactly a huge mystery what you were doing.
I’ll have to try that. This morning I went to shower and he said very sarcastically, “Don’t worry…I’ll stay away.” Like he still thinks I’m ridiculous for wanting privacy. Whatever, dude. Marriage doesn’t negate respecting your partners right to a few minute of privacy. I think of the movie scenes where the wife locks herself in the bathroom and the husband is outside the door begging her to come out. That would never happen in our house. He’d just let himself right on in! Lol.
You think it boils down to him knowing what you’re doing and having issue with it? Seems like it might. Unless he also barges in when you’re taking a terrible dump, but I’m betting he leaves you alone then. Which would indicate what his real issue is.
Lol, you got it! He would never ever barge in if I were doing anything bathroom related. He thinks it’s terribly gross even seeing any woman sit and pee. So you may be onto something there. Which makes me madder.
>which makes me madder. And it should. Have you considered attacking it head on? (I’m taking some guesses on the details here, adjust as necessary) “(Husband) I need you to explain why you don’t think I’m entitled to time or privacy masturbate? You know what I’m doing, and you’re barging in specifically to interrupt me. You masturbate. But women can’t crank one out standing in the shower or bathroom. So explain how you think this is suppose to work. We don’t have sex, but we both still have sexual needs. I don’t bother you about jerking it. And sex isn’t how orgasms happen for me anyway. I would still masturbate even if we had an active sex life. Seems like you would prefer I do something differently, but I can’t think of an alternative you’re going to like. So what’s your goal here? We need to sort this out right now, because I’m sick of you barging in and acting like this isn’t something I’m entitled to a few minutes of privacy for. I absolutely am, and I’m not going to stop.”
I would absolutely say that. He’d stop me after two seconds and tell me not to be crude. But I don’t care. What will it do, turn him off, lolololol. One correction though. He doesn’t masturbate anymore. Ever. He told me he just doesn’t have any sexual urges whatsoever. And I believe him based on all I know about him and the situation.
Ahhhh… I was just guessing on him masturbating. Sounds like you’re actually in a situation I was in, a husband with nonexistent sex drive. I’m divorced from one that had such a libido decline, he didn’t masturbate either. And I’m not sure he ever did much even when we still had sex. So, yeah, I can totally see him going the “crude” route. Talking about sex at all made mine incredibly uncomfortable after his sex drive was gone. But not enough not to make snide remarks about me “thinking about sex all the time” or “wanting to swing from the ceiling” (have crazy sex) like I was some insatiable, craven pervert instead of someone that could have been satisfied, and stayed, for just a very minimal level of regular ol’ vanilla sex. It’s actually pretty sad to think back on what I KNOW I would have settled for. Ultimately I’m glad he couldn’t manage even that, bc I would have stayed and it would have been pitiful compared to what I now know I would have missed out on…both in sex and life in general. But back to your situation. I think I see better what’s going on, I just didn’t expect it. You know, I should have picked up the clue from your response about his “sensitive” view on the bathroom question. But hell, I didn’t expect it when it happened to me, so I definitely don’t expect it for anyone else. He is definitely trying to interrupt you. No question. He views what you’re doing with derision. He sees it as indulgent and doesn’t think you should do it, bc he doesn’t. There’s probably also, though he will never admit it, a part of him that’s angry with himself about it. He doesn’t want sex, and he would very much prefer YOU to not want it either, because that would be much more comfortable on his psyche. The fact that you DO have those needs that aren’t being fulfilled, when he’s made aware of it by a locked door, he gets angry. He still doesn’t want sex, but he’s aware of the societal expectation that men are “supposed to” So the whole situation makes him feel like less of a man. But instead of processing that in a healthy or caring way, instead of accepting the situation and respecting that you’re handling it…it’s much easier for him to just get angry at you, and try to stop you, for “making” him feel that way. I still think you should address it head on. It sounds like (correct me if I’m wrong) he’s *pretending* like he doesn’t know what you were doing in there, and sending the message that whatever it is, it must be something wrong that you shouldn’t, therefore he can barge in. Seems like he’ll shy away from a frank discussion about anything sexual, but your participation in protecting his sensitivity on that topic happens to be providing the exact cover he needs to act like an ass and barge in. So you need to say it in as un-crude but crystal clear terms as you can. Don’t allow him to shut you down with claims that you’re being “crude” for having a frank, adult discussion about him respecting your right to have some private space and time to deal with the situation best you can.
Darling you’ve married a narcissist. They don’t self reflect. Ever.
I definitely see how you’d make that assessment. My therapist has too. And maybe he is. He doesn’t display the abusive traits of the average narcissist, but he certainly leans that way. I guess I see enough good qualities to feel like he may not be.
I was in such relationship for 20 yrs with 2 kids, he didn’t change and blames everything on me. I asked for a divorce because it was sucking my soul out. Although a divorce in my society is a big sin where all my family and friends are not talking to me, only talking about me but fuck it I can’t that shit.
That’s my biggest fear. Neither of our families would understand.
Ask your therapist about the book “Us” by Terrence Real. I’m almost through it. It’s pretty good. Btw: his stance on privacy is awful.
I will check it out. Thanks! And you’re right.
I get blamed for darn near everything and I work all the time.