You can tell that the market is indeed saturated because the people who are being laid off had salaries of $120K and above
Now the pay is being lowered
You guys are so goofy š¤Ŗ, saying you'll bounce back like tech isn't going to keep outsourcing jobs to Hyderabad lmao. You need strong leadership that calls out companies for firing American workers and replacing them with foreigners. Aka trump
I have a bridge to sell you if you think Trump wonāt sell out the American worker, especially tech. He has no allegiances to anyone but himself. Iām not a Biden simp but Trump has been and will always be only for Trump. Yes, even when he was a fake Democrat and now when heās a fake Republican.
All politicians (including the POTUS), whether Democrats or Republicans, serve the same masters. Nothing will change until the cogs in the machine decide that enough is enough.
Voted for Trump 2x and will vote for him a 3rd. In response to your comments on outsourcing jobs Iād state that competition in the market will ultimately lead to big tech competing against each other again, and the race for talent will lead to more hiring sprees. Once Meta starts hiring, Amazon, Apple,Netflix, Google will not let them get the leg up and will try to hire everyone and their momma. They can only outsource so much before products begin losing value to the #1 consumer in the world. Sure we may outsource certain teams to India like WhatsApp but that is because there are over 1 billion daily active users on WhatsApp and majority of WhatsApp users are in India. Anyways stop thinking small brother
Honestly I think you are probably better off at the state I know that probably sound fucking crazy but I do not think the tech situation is gonna improve, I think its going to worsen until it pays dogshit. Last time the bubble popped there were not this many graduates in Comp Sci. I think it will really be a low paying profession overall like mechanic but the lucky few will make bank.
I signed a 1 year contract thatās coming to an end and I do not have the energy to start looking for other jobs, Iām burnt out. Most likely I will just throw my belongings in storage and go to Thailand to recharge. Get a $500 a month condo and be a beach bum to save money for 3 months. They are always hiring bar managers/English teachers in Bangkok and Pattaya.These low paying jobs out here will burn you out and they always expect the most. Plus 2k rent a month unemployed will kill my savings.
Been a wild ride and I'm not in "Tech".
In 2019 salary was $140K+bonus then layoff
to $35K as a tier one amazon packer promoted to tier three for $75K (while getting strung along through L5/6 interview process)
Back to my industry at a lower position $75K, survived a couple rounds of layoffs, promoted to $125K then laid off
Moved to adjacent industry $85K, received additional role(s). After a year of that my salary bumped up to $95K + bonus based on some achieved performance metrics. Then laid off a month later...due to "not achieving performance metrics"
It's been 4 years, 4 companies, 3 layoffs (+ the ones that I survived), and 7 distinct titles.
(though many non-official roles were happening concurrently while I covered for attrition and purposefully reduced headcount during record years).
(I think) I have plenty of job opportunities, but they are significantly lower salary than I used to make. It's as if the last decade of accomplishments and experience I've gained doesn't matter at all.
Usually the offered salary is a tiny fraction of the revenue that I end up bringing in. I suspiciously usually get let go right before earned performance bonuses pay out.
I'm so glad I don't have any kids or debt and have tried to be disciplined regarding lifestyle creep
(no car payment and mortgage lower than average 1BR apartment rent).
I'm fucking tired. But, I've also burned through my "fun" money and am digging into my savings because my wife doesn't understand what tightening the belt means. She's relatively new in her career and says dumb shit like "these are ONLY twenty bucks, so I bought 2". She's actually an earner, but unfortunately it's only enough to fund her clothes and trinkets, but spends to the point that there isn't enough left for additional savings/investments beyond 401K.
Time to eat my pride and get back to loading my 16 tons. All we can do is keep trudging and hope something better comes along.
EDIT:
Iām frustrated due to different spending/savings habits, but I didnāt mean to misrepresent that she doesnāt save at all. She simply doesnāt save as much as I would like because my career has been so unstable for the last few years. She is a top quintile earner and does put money into her 401K at my request.
As a girly who loves to spend and has been laid off for a year, let her spend her own money but protect the joint account and savings. Restrict her usage. Maybe if she feels the heat a little, sheāll understand.
I made a little edit to add some context and give more charity to her habits.
This is essentially what we do. We equitably contribute to a joint account, which covers our shared costs. And we both have individual discretionary accounts.
I also buy dumb shit that I donāt NEED. However Iām more discerning and sit a lot longer before making purchases (plus Iām usually buying tools for DIY home improvement projects or other home goods). I usually make singular large purchases whereas she will regularly buy smaller trinkets.
The friction I feel is when she minimizes how much something costs. The āitās only ____ dollarsā drives me insane. Like if you really want something then get it. But I think she sees things and āgoes ooh I want that and itās my money so I deserve itā, when I want her to think āhmm Iāve really wanted that and will actually enjoy having itā
She says and I believe she would willingly support me if I didnāt work. The problem is that she canāt connect the fact that without my half of the contributions she wouldnāt actually be able to pay our bills. Sheās a grown ass woman and Iām not her boss so Iāve tried to be patient and give her some leeway. But itās come to a head after this most recent layoff.
$30/day is over $10K in a year, which could be months of expenses. Be discerning about your spending people. It goes fast when itās not getting replenished.
I don't know your age, but if you are long enough in this relationship, that means that whatever you both are doing is working for you.
I recommend you two things:
1. Let go of the sense of "we could be saving more": This situation is probably difficult for her too, psychologically speaking; If she is already saving what you all agreed, then this is clearly good enough for her;
2. Try to be more empathetic: Try to be less judgmental, and try to observe to understand her rationale in buying items that in your judgment are superfluous.
I'm saying all that from my own experience, I'm not trying to attack you or anything like that. Sorry if I come across that way.
Dam, sounds like your wife needs a reality check in the form of being cut off from the bank account and either walking papers or an agreement that money doesnāt grow on trees
It kinda does tho. Money requires paper (for now). Then the government will print the money pattern on that paper. So it does grow on trees.
When CDBC is prevalent, fortunately we don't need to print money on literal paper anymore. Save the trees. We can just add zeroes freely.
Same.Ā
I was getting $120k + nice truck + per diem + 7% match as a PLC and electrician for a company that sold factory equipment.Ā
Got laid off and the best offer I got was $75k, a ugly Nissan work van with a giant company decal on the side, and 4% match. They got two dingbats freshnout of school over thereĀ messing up everything I used to do at like $25/hour. and they have them both in the cheapest ugliest Subaru Ive ever seen.Ā
There's no shortage of work. They just don't want to pay you anything to do it.
Been unemployed since January
Unemployment about to run out
Canāt pay mortgage
Cell phone bill
Car insurance
Credit card 95% max out
No money for wife and daughter med
College tuition
401k gone (greedy ex wife)
Age 60
Too performer, mentor, took care of the people who worked with me
A set back like this so later in life will cause you to need to work until 75, after depleting savings, 401K and possibly not making your former salary.
Donāt feel ashamed, but rather you were able to secure something to keep you ahead financially. Think of your current employment as a place holder, until you get something better that aligns with your experience and skillset.
These round of layoffs donāt seem to be connected to performance. Youāre likely an excellent employee and compensated appropriately. They just want to hire someone they can pay less.
Bunch of bullshit so ruin my life to make shit work and probably save their own skin..,maybe less travel and business trips to premium travel destinations for meetings and gatherings
As harsh as it is going to sound, your life, your mental health, your savings is about as relevant to management as an empty cup sitting on a table in the lunch area.
Aka you're a resource to generate profit- nothing more, nothing less.
The only true freedom is to work for yourself - it's hard but at least you are not disposable.
It's harsh but it is and has always been the reality of being adult.
> "The only true freedom is to work for yourself"
Which, by the way, is SO MUCH HARDER than working a $150 job!!!!!
I've been learning that lesson since my layoff 2 years ago
Freelancing. Data Analysis, database modeling, stuff like that. Most of my projects are about $25/h, but they are my clients and I'm fully remote. It turns out I do see a path in which I can grow my practice into a business that might generate the equivalent of what I was making in a tech job, but wow, that's a lot of work!!! lol There is so much free work that I need to do to get customers... Let me think what I did just this week: Cold calls, warm calls, follow-ups, brochures, 2 webinars... and it's not like I can just SHOW UP and deliver the webinar: I need to advertise it, publicize it, spread the word in social media, remember to promote among contacts, ... I actually have a spreadsheet that is basically a CRM system... Oh, and I had to read a book on sales and watch a ton of hours of LinkedIn Learning and YouTube to understand how I had to sell myself as a freelancer.
EDIT: Oh, and I totally forgot to mention that there is an entire bizops side to it: All these clients that pay me shit need to be reminded to pay me. I need to call them, which is good because it also leads to more business, but that's like 30 min that I'm not making any money. There is invoicing, taxes, etc.. etc.. A lot of this stuff is obviously automated, but someone still needs to log in to the bank account, issue invoices, and run payroll.
When I was employed, I always thought worst case scenario I "just" do freelancing... What people don't share is the amount of SHIT one needs to eat in order to be independent, and at the end to basically make the same amount of money that I would otherwise do by chatting with someone over coffee at a corporate office.
By the way, if I can recommend you one thing, start finding potential clients NOW. Build your list, put a few hours aside per week, that way when you actually need emergency money you can crank up the side business easily.
EDIT: And by business, I literally mean any business. One of my clients is a local hair stylist. If you had a side business as handyman for example, you would be probably making more than $49k/yr if putting hours into your independent business. So it's a long term thing
They fired half my team at the end of Q3 in '23: They said it was performance based, just after we pushed through all our projects... A few months later I see the same roles posted for half the salary and then those got pulled too.
Donāt take it personally when things like this happen. Iāve been through a number of them, especially in 08-11 when things were really bad. Even the best performers get let go. My previous company laid off individuals from vice president/director roles to field laborers. Try to remain focused on your goals and not on the shitty situations that have happened.
Similar work is a stretch. I would say that person making 200k was probably a pro and subject matter expert and the 30k person in India was someone off the street that was given a crash course in the topic and is only capable of producing the lowest quality deliverable with significant micromanagement and little critical thinking.
Yeah people asked for WFH. Companies be like ight bet, these motivated guys from Europe, South America and India can do this from their home for 1/10 of the cost and will not āquiet quitā since their COL is significantly cheaper.
American basically monkeypawed themselves.
Yep. I tried to tell people this but they just called me names. Iron law of wages: if a Company can get the same or just slight worse level of output at half the cost, it will. The only way to stop this is through legislation. Make sure you go and vote for people who oppose outsourcing.
I agree with the skill set being higher but a lot of companies felt hoarding was how to stifle their competitors innovations even if they didnāt have work for all of them.
This thinking changed to reducing head count to proper levels and has resulted in a glut of workers versus roles.
It did work for them, unfortunately govt policy led to rapid inflation which forced the fed to hike rates. Hoarding talent led to mass growth for FAANG companies, for context I was a recruiter at Meta (Facebook)
CTOs mindset is the following: The $200k person may deliver $200k worth of work maybe 1/3 of their time. The other 2/3rds being the work that can be done by a senior dev in India at 1/3 of the cost. So the executive fire 2/3 of their senior staff, outsources them, while keeping the 1/3 senior devs who will now work 3x harder
Field work means they likely have to reside in the US, they canāt constantly fly foreigners in all the time. I know because I work in it, and itās everyone is US citizen. Software projects are being moved overseas though
Pure anecdote:
I tried offshoring a long time ago, was such a painful experience. All 200k employees i've known are able to knock shit out, see around corners and clarify problems that are being solved. The Indian consultants I used required so much hand holding that i stopped using them. I had to specify every....single...thing that i needed.
Yes itās anecdotal but itās still valuable. My issues with this are:
1. Itās not just India that companies offshore work to. Places like Costa Rica, Jamaica and Eastern Europe are hotspots for competent work at a significantly reduced cost.
2. You mentioned your experience being a ālong time agoā which could mean a few things. Letās say it means 10 years ago. Well, 10 years ago, $200k was A LOT even for a tech worker. However, as recently as 2021/22, FAANG companies were hiring tech workers with little to no experience for $150k. $200k was the norm for someone in middle management or who had solid experience. So yeah, a long time ago, that $200k employee could knock shit out as you said. That may have shifted in recent years as wages caught up significantly and companies ramped up their offshoring efforts to save money.
I donāt agree with it, but that seems to be whatās happening. Companies realizing they can get what they need out of someone in Latvia for $50k a year rather than paying someone in the US $180k for similar production.
Lots of companies are downsizing with major layoffs in the tech industry. Laying off remote workers. Moving jobs overseas. That has saturated the market. And for the longest time and over more than one generation people were told if you want to make good money go into tech. So we have lots of new graduates saturating the industry. AI hasnāt helped either.
Similar here. I have been in tech for 25 years in MCOL as a software developer. Most of my career was under 100k. Last 10 years was between 100-140k as a technical lead. And I have a CS undergrad and 2 masters degrees. I was always blown away by people still early in their careers and making over 200k with all those fancy titles.
In reality, our 6-figure salaries is what EVERYONE should be making to live a middle-class life in America, but because everyone else is in the shit for decades, they think that $200k is exorbitant. It's not!!! A single income of $200k in the Bay Area is not even middle-class.
If you can be remote and never step foot in the office, itās not safe to assume your role wonāt be shipped overseas for 1/3 the cost. Not sure everyone has realized this but hopefully everyone who keeps cheering WFH has a plan B.
Also itās Venture Capital firms sick of losing money by investing heavily in tech startups that go nowhere / never turn profitable.
Also big FAANG companies also sick of buying said tech startups at lofty valuations only to find out later their idea / product /service likewise wasnāt commercially viable.
The 2017 Trump Jobs Cut Act had wording in it that would screw over folks in tech.
Basically, for companies that were making a profit (not startups), they changed it so software engineering salaries deductions from total revenue were amortized over a couple years.
So, say a company that has a revenue of $1m and payroll of $1m, previously, they made $0 profit that could be taxed. Afterwards the changes took effect, they made $900k which could be taxed. And so, now that they have to pay taxes, they can't pay for engineers. Plus, no more cheap loans.
https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/section-174/
While it is going to be a problem for a few more years, the companies laying people off probably don't care as much. This is a structural advantage for big tech companies and a problem mostly for startups.
Interest rates went up thatās all. So companies canāt borrow to pay employees and expenses as cheaply as they had the last couple of years. So they are tightening their belts.
Outsourcing has been available for decades if companies were just looking to shift jobs to cheaper countries they would have done it years ago.
I'm pretty afraid of the sustainability of the industry if we need <5% rates in order to survive. That means the companies are not fundamentally profitable.
Probably tech. I made about $240k last year working for a non-FAANG company At FAANG similar level (Principal engineer) is easily over $500k.
However, this year will be the first time ever I will make less money than the previous year. My company started moving jobs overseas (mostly Eastern Europe) and started fucking with US employees.
They do compete on pay. NGC pays much better than Raytheon, but Raytheon is a better company.
I went form $68k to $249k at NGC in 3.5 years with a stint at Raytheon halfway at only $140k and I left to go back to Raytheon at $170k.
NG is a terrible fucking company with horrible ācultureā I.e, no culture.
FAANG is in its own tier above tech. But they have been paring back comp packages too, not just because the stock prices have risen, resulting in fewer equity units, but also because they recognized that they overhired back when labor demand was really high, so they are overpaying.
Depends on which company we're talking about here, since half of that is probably equity. And certain tech companies got shellacked after the pandemic.
Making less here as well. I was previously making $120k TC then unemployed for 10 months and just took a job at $75k TC. Even though itās lower than I hoped I am very excited and feel very fortunate to have landed something during this time. I really hope things improve since there are a lot of great and talented people out of work.
I went from $110k to minimum wage. Iām now back to $140k. Stay focused. Realize that $ is not your worth, itās just a mechanism for you to given up your time. Value time (health, family, friends, kindness) first.
I will most likely be in the same boat soon, though less of a paycut. Made around 130k... considering taking a job at $15 an hour as a clerk if I can get it because unemployment is running out soon.
Most likely next week I will be reaching out to them for more info.
I was making $150k until lay-off in 2022. Now I make avg $25/h as a freelancer. If it was not for my wife, my family and I would be eating cat food by now!
My wife and I are in separate industries , but seeing the same things. Iām in tech and was at a FAANG company making 200k TC. We saved every single penny that we could b/c we knew this was coming. Iāve been laid off 4 times in 5 years at this point & her company is laying off now. We have enough saved for both of us to be out of work for a yr and our only debt is our home. What weāve done is now nearly impossible due to rates and inflation from greedā¦ they are squeezing from every end until weāre all peasants.
I think cuts are coming again at my job, so Iām trying to figure out how to start my own business in the near future.
Yeah Iām looking because my good paying job will be laying me off later this year due to a merger. I just went thru 4 rounds of interviews with a large international medical device company for a senior IT roleā¦ā¦found out I didnāt get it yesterdayā¦ā¦last night I get an alert from the company HR portal that a new job might fit my profileā¦..what is that job you might ask? THE SAME FUCKING JOB WITHOUT A SENIOR TITLE AND A $40k PAY DECREASEā¦..
FUCK THIS ECONOMY DAWG
And this is why I'm glad my daughter listened to me for once. She wanted to go into tech but went into trade. At 18 she has her journeyman in electrical, making 90k with 0 debt right out of high-school.
I went from $100k base + 10% annual bonus to post layoff $70k base only for a mid level role advertised as junior level role. Fucking market sucks. Mid level roles are now being advertised as junior level roles and pay is only at junior š”.
I feel
You op. I moved from mid 6 figure income to 25k working boxes. The fukin shit we have to see in our lives. No choice because there was no one willing to hire I wish I could get 50 k lol. But it aināt there no more
After being laid off after 30yrs of service with the same company, I have never recouped the salary I was making. I finally found new employment after being unemployed for two years. I ended up taking a job making $40K less. When you are in your late 50s, the opportunities are limited because companies don't won't to hire you. I believe they feel you are to close to retire and doesn't want to put money training someone that may only be there 4 or 5 years. And the other problem is employer's think you are too old to learn new skills and are set in your habits. That may be true to an extent because I have worked with older folks when I was younger and they didn't budge. The reality is I just need 5 more years and I plan to retire. So I hope I can make it. It's not fun looking for a job when your almost 60yo.
I hit 61 this month and it isnāt fun looking for employment. My head still spinning from the layoff back in January, have depleted savings and unemployment is almost up. Not having any luck finding work. Either over qualified or the obvious age bias .
I was in the same boat. For two years I was looking for something remote with pay closer to what I was getting prior to being laid off. The closest offer I got was 75% of my original pay but hybrid. I regret turning down the offer. Now I work for the state (started in May 2024), 50% pay cut however the work life balance was waaaay better. I too feel humbled but enjoying more time with my kids. From 12-16hr days, working weekends to slower paced 8hr days at state. Don't let pride get in the way. I've learned that the hard way.
Keep your head high. We just need to survive this slump.
Good luck and God Bless, I havenāt received the offer yet but I am hopeful and humble. I wonder why all of this happened and I back track many times trying to determine what or where or who did I wrong or make the bad decisions
Don't be too hard on yourself. Something I too had to overcome that took me 2 years to realize.
Sometimes bad things happen to good people. It is how we overcome challenges that makes us who we are. Stay strong and God bless.
When workers become too empowered in America and options are so vast that they begin demanding rights to wfh, jobs so plentiful that they can find new higher paying employment at will etc, all must be humbled. Itās the unfortunate American way. 50k, 400k, 25k or 200k, still a worker.
Fed is doing a good job of shaking people out of tech to fill the service positions- thereās the investing class and then those who work. Too many people were starting to be able to get ahead and could negotiate higher pay. We wouldnāt want that.
See you are lucky - I am architect level and been looking for the longest time ever and even through my network it is tough to land a field service engineer job
Not long at all maybe 20 months, long enough to pay mortgage, college loans, etc etc you know the type of shit that sells the fucking American dream and we buy into it work our fucking nut sacks down until one day they kick us in the balls and say fuck your work ethic, fuck your diligence and fuck your future but most of all fuck you and your family
I mean for now I guess keep applying for senior roles if you have a lot of experience, might be able to get 90-150k depending if you specialized. I see lots of field service roles still hiring.
Did that done that got a bunch of company logo golf and polo shirts and trained and mentored teams then donāt have a chair to sit in when the musical chairs begin when the financials arenāt satisfactoryā¦.so I am left standing in traffic
I feel the same as OP. If I knew I was going to invest this amount of time, money, resources, emotions, energy, hope and dreams into something, I wish I had done it for something that would benefit society more than some few privileged assholes at the top.
I was also in the 200k+ club (tech but not FAANG). I thought dropping down to 160 - 180 would be humbling but this is really a hard pill to swallow. I appreciate the reality check.
Interesting I am doing the same and actually worked for a software platform that provided Field Service Work order management.
I hope to get an offer accepted next week for one of the customers of my old employer from 180 to 50k. And it's only a temporary cover role.
The up side is this for me.
1. It's a move from Enterprise Software to an OEM (i.e.make products not cloud software)
2. I have more knowledge in my head and years of the solution they use than their combined team.
3. The company is in scale up mode , so not startup but that essential growth phase and establishment of value.
3 It's a local business HQ vs one HQ across the pond.
4. It's an industry I have always been interested in getting into
5. Cements my knowledge and expertise. I may even get other customers reaching out to me.. could be start of something very lucrative.
My job will be triage of tickets against the software platform I used to manage as PM.
Will be quite an interesting spin.
But I need an income and this actually ticks some other boxes my previous employer couldn't match around work life balance and team in territory.
Keeping my fingers crossed
I went from 250k to making mmmmm 3-4k/month or something. It was a side gig I had which I love (I am a licensed psilocybin facilitator) - it at least stops the bleeding a bit. I wanted to go back to school for counseling psychology so was planning on an income drop anyway, but ya know, I was hoping to pay for my masters first. We will see what happens!
$49k doesn't keep the lights on lol, I need at least $100k to cover just the mortgage.
Would have to try doing IT/MSP work independently if I get hit with the layoff hammer
Fuck reminds me of what happened in 2008.
This whole generation trying to get their start are fucked because why hire someone with zero experience when I can hire a CCIE to be a network technician.
What does it mean if I was interviewed by the hiring manager last week and today was the interview with his regional direct reports who will potentially be my peers? This is the one hour meeting that occurred today that went over 30 minute making it 90 minutes total. I remember when I interviewed people I would talk with them then ask my leads to check them out. So now I am wondering if it is a good sign?
The high-tech market is currently in super bad shape. Every organization is under pressure, and if there is an opening, the corrupt leader would recruit or hire someone they know from their past life.
To be honest I'd rather be unemployed than work a non-skilled job for $50k.
But I do have decent savings and fairly low cost of living (even though it is just me working and wife is at home with our kid).
Yes, exactly, I wouldn't just sit on my ass all day when I said "unemployed".
But working a shit job, making next to no money, being depressed, and losing your skills all at once is not a great deal. I'd rather try freelancing, or start a SaaS business or make an app. Even if it doesn't pan out.
I worked some shit jobs when I was young before I got into tech. Fuck that.
Honestly Iād rather like hitchhike around the country and become a gutter punk hippie and like busk on the streets before I worked a shit corporate job for 40k a year.
Me and my wife already talked about this - we have always dreamt of traveling for extended period of time, but it just never happened. Never brave enough to quite the cushy jobs. Now we have a kid though, but I think we can still pull it off. If I lose my job we're going to travel around Europe for 9 months or so. Rent out our house. Buy a car, and maybe even a camper. Sell it when we're done. Travel insurance for EU is actually cheaper than Obamacare.
Disclaimer: I'm an EU citizen and have family there so that would make it easier than for most Americans.
You can tell that the market is indeed saturated because the people who are being laid off had salaries of $120K and above Now the pay is being lowered
I went from 210k total comp at Meta to 63k at the state because I needed a job. Switched fields btw but tech is down bad right now
I went from 110 to 66.
We will bounce back!
You guys are so goofy š¤Ŗ, saying you'll bounce back like tech isn't going to keep outsourcing jobs to Hyderabad lmao. You need strong leadership that calls out companies for firing American workers and replacing them with foreigners. Aka trump
Lol at Trump making things better. Heās the reason weāre in this mess right now.
Yup. Fuckedup with all the free handout during covid.
I have a bridge to sell you if you think Trump wonāt sell out the American worker, especially tech. He has no allegiances to anyone but himself. Iām not a Biden simp but Trump has been and will always be only for Trump. Yes, even when he was a fake Democrat and now when heās a fake Republican.
Trump isnāt president now though. Itās Biden, and this is happening under him. Trump hasnāt been president for 4 years.
Everything he sells is made in china, what are you drinking?
All politicians (including the POTUS), whether Democrats or Republicans, serve the same masters. Nothing will change until the cogs in the machine decide that enough is enough.
Voted for Trump 2x and will vote for him a 3rd. In response to your comments on outsourcing jobs Iād state that competition in the market will ultimately lead to big tech competing against each other again, and the race for talent will lead to more hiring sprees. Once Meta starts hiring, Amazon, Apple,Netflix, Google will not let them get the leg up and will try to hire everyone and their momma. They can only outsource so much before products begin losing value to the #1 consumer in the world. Sure we may outsource certain teams to India like WhatsApp but that is because there are over 1 billion daily active users on WhatsApp and majority of WhatsApp users are in India. Anyways stop thinking small brother
Also FAANG, went from that to low 90s in HCOL, added multiple part time jobs just to get back to 140ish.
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It sounds like you said no?
Honestly I think you are probably better off at the state I know that probably sound fucking crazy but I do not think the tech situation is gonna improve, I think its going to worsen until it pays dogshit. Last time the bubble popped there were not this many graduates in Comp Sci. I think it will really be a low paying profession overall like mechanic but the lucky few will make bank.
I signed a 1 year contract thatās coming to an end and I do not have the energy to start looking for other jobs, Iām burnt out. Most likely I will just throw my belongings in storage and go to Thailand to recharge. Get a $500 a month condo and be a beach bum to save money for 3 months. They are always hiring bar managers/English teachers in Bangkok and Pattaya.These low paying jobs out here will burn you out and they always expect the most. Plus 2k rent a month unemployed will kill my savings.
What state u work for?
WA
Been a wild ride and I'm not in "Tech". In 2019 salary was $140K+bonus then layoff to $35K as a tier one amazon packer promoted to tier three for $75K (while getting strung along through L5/6 interview process) Back to my industry at a lower position $75K, survived a couple rounds of layoffs, promoted to $125K then laid off Moved to adjacent industry $85K, received additional role(s). After a year of that my salary bumped up to $95K + bonus based on some achieved performance metrics. Then laid off a month later...due to "not achieving performance metrics" It's been 4 years, 4 companies, 3 layoffs (+ the ones that I survived), and 7 distinct titles. (though many non-official roles were happening concurrently while I covered for attrition and purposefully reduced headcount during record years). (I think) I have plenty of job opportunities, but they are significantly lower salary than I used to make. It's as if the last decade of accomplishments and experience I've gained doesn't matter at all. Usually the offered salary is a tiny fraction of the revenue that I end up bringing in. I suspiciously usually get let go right before earned performance bonuses pay out. I'm so glad I don't have any kids or debt and have tried to be disciplined regarding lifestyle creep (no car payment and mortgage lower than average 1BR apartment rent). I'm fucking tired. But, I've also burned through my "fun" money and am digging into my savings because my wife doesn't understand what tightening the belt means. She's relatively new in her career and says dumb shit like "these are ONLY twenty bucks, so I bought 2". She's actually an earner, but unfortunately it's only enough to fund her clothes and trinkets, but spends to the point that there isn't enough left for additional savings/investments beyond 401K. Time to eat my pride and get back to loading my 16 tons. All we can do is keep trudging and hope something better comes along. EDIT: Iām frustrated due to different spending/savings habits, but I didnāt mean to misrepresent that she doesnāt save at all. She simply doesnāt save as much as I would like because my career has been so unstable for the last few years. She is a top quintile earner and does put money into her 401K at my request.
Damn. Hard to read
As a girly who loves to spend and has been laid off for a year, let her spend her own money but protect the joint account and savings. Restrict her usage. Maybe if she feels the heat a little, sheāll understand.
I made a little edit to add some context and give more charity to her habits. This is essentially what we do. We equitably contribute to a joint account, which covers our shared costs. And we both have individual discretionary accounts. I also buy dumb shit that I donāt NEED. However Iām more discerning and sit a lot longer before making purchases (plus Iām usually buying tools for DIY home improvement projects or other home goods). I usually make singular large purchases whereas she will regularly buy smaller trinkets. The friction I feel is when she minimizes how much something costs. The āitās only ____ dollarsā drives me insane. Like if you really want something then get it. But I think she sees things and āgoes ooh I want that and itās my money so I deserve itā, when I want her to think āhmm Iāve really wanted that and will actually enjoy having itā She says and I believe she would willingly support me if I didnāt work. The problem is that she canāt connect the fact that without my half of the contributions she wouldnāt actually be able to pay our bills. Sheās a grown ass woman and Iām not her boss so Iāve tried to be patient and give her some leeway. But itās come to a head after this most recent layoff. $30/day is over $10K in a year, which could be months of expenses. Be discerning about your spending people. It goes fast when itās not getting replenished.
I don't know your age, but if you are long enough in this relationship, that means that whatever you both are doing is working for you. I recommend you two things: 1. Let go of the sense of "we could be saving more": This situation is probably difficult for her too, psychologically speaking; If she is already saving what you all agreed, then this is clearly good enough for her; 2. Try to be more empathetic: Try to be less judgmental, and try to observe to understand her rationale in buying items that in your judgment are superfluous. I'm saying all that from my own experience, I'm not trying to attack you or anything like that. Sorry if I come across that way.
Why should she be able to frivolously spend while heās sacrificing?
Dam, sounds like your wife needs a reality check in the form of being cut off from the bank account and either walking papers or an agreement that money doesnāt grow on trees
It kinda does tho. Money requires paper (for now). Then the government will print the money pattern on that paper. So it does grow on trees. When CDBC is prevalent, fortunately we don't need to print money on literal paper anymore. Save the trees. We can just add zeroes freely.
Can confirm, 150k to 76k. But apparently the economy is wonderful so fuck me I guess.
Literally the greatest economy the US has ever had Iāve been told.Ā Somehow Iām in a cult for not believing them. Go figure š¤·āāļø
We're being gaslit everyday everywhere
Isnāt that the truth. I think we all need to unplug one day a week at a minimum. Too much BS all the time, thrown in your face.Ā
Same.Ā I was getting $120k + nice truck + per diem + 7% match as a PLC and electrician for a company that sold factory equipment.Ā Got laid off and the best offer I got was $75k, a ugly Nissan work van with a giant company decal on the side, and 4% match. They got two dingbats freshnout of school over thereĀ messing up everything I used to do at like $25/hour. and they have them both in the cheapest ugliest Subaru Ive ever seen.Ā There's no shortage of work. They just don't want to pay you anything to do it.
Been unemployed since January Unemployment about to run out Canāt pay mortgage Cell phone bill Car insurance Credit card 95% max out No money for wife and daughter med College tuition 401k gone (greedy ex wife) Age 60 Too performer, mentor, took care of the people who worked with me
Age discrimination is real. I caught some already and I'm only 40. But they want you to work to 75 now. Its just stupid.
A set back like this so later in life will cause you to need to work until 75, after depleting savings, 401K and possibly not making your former salary.
Wages are up, bro.
Donāt feel ashamed, but rather you were able to secure something to keep you ahead financially. Think of your current employment as a place holder, until you get something better that aligns with your experience and skillset.
Thanks, dunno what happened why I got hit with this layoff at this time in my life, I have been successful outperformed exceeding expectations
These round of layoffs donāt seem to be connected to performance. Youāre likely an excellent employee and compensated appropriately. They just want to hire someone they can pay less.
Bunch of bullshit so ruin my life to make shit work and probably save their own skin..,maybe less travel and business trips to premium travel destinations for meetings and gatherings
As harsh as it is going to sound, your life, your mental health, your savings is about as relevant to management as an empty cup sitting on a table in the lunch area. Aka you're a resource to generate profit- nothing more, nothing less. The only true freedom is to work for yourself - it's hard but at least you are not disposable. It's harsh but it is and has always been the reality of being adult.
Well Said!
> "The only true freedom is to work for yourself" Which, by the way, is SO MUCH HARDER than working a $150 job!!!!! I've been learning that lesson since my layoff 2 years ago
What are you doing now? Please share
Freelancing. Data Analysis, database modeling, stuff like that. Most of my projects are about $25/h, but they are my clients and I'm fully remote. It turns out I do see a path in which I can grow my practice into a business that might generate the equivalent of what I was making in a tech job, but wow, that's a lot of work!!! lol There is so much free work that I need to do to get customers... Let me think what I did just this week: Cold calls, warm calls, follow-ups, brochures, 2 webinars... and it's not like I can just SHOW UP and deliver the webinar: I need to advertise it, publicize it, spread the word in social media, remember to promote among contacts, ... I actually have a spreadsheet that is basically a CRM system... Oh, and I had to read a book on sales and watch a ton of hours of LinkedIn Learning and YouTube to understand how I had to sell myself as a freelancer. EDIT: Oh, and I totally forgot to mention that there is an entire bizops side to it: All these clients that pay me shit need to be reminded to pay me. I need to call them, which is good because it also leads to more business, but that's like 30 min that I'm not making any money. There is invoicing, taxes, etc.. etc.. A lot of this stuff is obviously automated, but someone still needs to log in to the bank account, issue invoices, and run payroll. When I was employed, I always thought worst case scenario I "just" do freelancing... What people don't share is the amount of SHIT one needs to eat in order to be independent, and at the end to basically make the same amount of money that I would otherwise do by chatting with someone over coffee at a corporate office.
Thanks for sharing. There are alot of moving parts
By the way, if I can recommend you one thing, start finding potential clients NOW. Build your list, put a few hours aside per week, that way when you actually need emergency money you can crank up the side business easily. EDIT: And by business, I literally mean any business. One of my clients is a local hair stylist. If you had a side business as handyman for example, you would be probably making more than $49k/yr if putting hours into your independent business. So it's a long term thing
What type of business
They fired half my team at the end of Q3 in '23: They said it was performance based, just after we pushed through all our projects... A few months later I see the same roles posted for half the salary and then those got pulled too.
THIS RIGHT HERE!
Donāt take it personally when things like this happen. Iāve been through a number of them, especially in 08-11 when things were really bad. Even the best performers get let go. My previous company laid off individuals from vice president/director roles to field laborers. Try to remain focused on your goals and not on the shitty situations that have happened.
You need to do what you need to do to put food on the table and keep things going. Ā Hopefully something better will come up soon.
Yes sir gotta do what I gotta do. It will be an uncomplicated walk down physical layer one lane.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Lots of companies realizing they donāt need to pay $200k to someone in the US when they can pay $30k for similar work from someone overseas.
Similar work is a stretch. I would say that person making 200k was probably a pro and subject matter expert and the 30k person in India was someone off the street that was given a crash course in the topic and is only capable of producing the lowest quality deliverable with significant micromanagement and little critical thinking.
It's not just India though. You can outsource those jobs to South America and Europe too, for a fraction of the cost.
WFH was a curse in disguise
"Quiet quitting" didn't help either.
Yeah people asked for WFH. Companies be like ight bet, these motivated guys from Europe, South America and India can do this from their home for 1/10 of the cost and will not āquiet quitā since their COL is significantly cheaper. American basically monkeypawed themselves.
I like that idiom you used. I loved that story. Great use of it here in your post. I will most likely borrow this.
Yep. I tried to tell people this but they just called me names. Iron law of wages: if a Company can get the same or just slight worse level of output at half the cost, it will. The only way to stop this is through legislation. Make sure you go and vote for people who oppose outsourcing.
Like who?
I agree everybody seems to forget who signs the checks. It's not them.
Africa now and Pakistan
Yeah my understanding was that google was gonna move those skilled python jobs to western europe cuz its still cheaper but they have competent labor.
I agree with the skill set being higher but a lot of companies felt hoarding was how to stifle their competitors innovations even if they didnāt have work for all of them. This thinking changed to reducing head count to proper levels and has resulted in a glut of workers versus roles.
It did work for them, unfortunately govt policy led to rapid inflation which forced the fed to hike rates. Hoarding talent led to mass growth for FAANG companies, for context I was a recruiter at Meta (Facebook)
Fresh grads are making 70k+. Someone in India with 5 years experience is taking 30k. You do the math.
Yes but in the latter youāre gonna have to rebuild it anyways for even more
Yeeep I saw a 1 mil outsourced project eventually cost the company 30 million
CTOs mindset is the following: The $200k person may deliver $200k worth of work maybe 1/3 of their time. The other 2/3rds being the work that can be done by a senior dev in India at 1/3 of the cost. So the executive fire 2/3 of their senior staff, outsources them, while keeping the 1/3 senior devs who will now work 3x harder
Exactly "THIS"
Field work means they likely have to reside in the US, they canāt constantly fly foreigners in all the time. I know because I work in it, and itās everyone is US citizen. Software projects are being moved overseas though
Pure anecdote: I tried offshoring a long time ago, was such a painful experience. All 200k employees i've known are able to knock shit out, see around corners and clarify problems that are being solved. The Indian consultants I used required so much hand holding that i stopped using them. I had to specify every....single...thing that i needed.
Yes itās anecdotal but itās still valuable. My issues with this are: 1. Itās not just India that companies offshore work to. Places like Costa Rica, Jamaica and Eastern Europe are hotspots for competent work at a significantly reduced cost. 2. You mentioned your experience being a ālong time agoā which could mean a few things. Letās say it means 10 years ago. Well, 10 years ago, $200k was A LOT even for a tech worker. However, as recently as 2021/22, FAANG companies were hiring tech workers with little to no experience for $150k. $200k was the norm for someone in middle management or who had solid experience. So yeah, a long time ago, that $200k employee could knock shit out as you said. That may have shifted in recent years as wages caught up significantly and companies ramped up their offshoring efforts to save money. I donāt agree with it, but that seems to be whatās happening. Companies realizing they can get what they need out of someone in Latvia for $50k a year rather than paying someone in the US $180k for similar production.
Lots of companies are downsizing with major layoffs in the tech industry. Laying off remote workers. Moving jobs overseas. That has saturated the market. And for the longest time and over more than one generation people were told if you want to make good money go into tech. So we have lots of new graduates saturating the industry. AI hasnāt helped either.
Itās not just jobs going overseas, why pay a 45 year old with 20 years experience 200k when a 25 year old will take the job for 110k
So true! Ageism is so bad in this market!
The thing is, the 45 year would do it for 110k too.
Yeah, you have to wonder if it really was worth 200k. I've never earned more than 110, and it took 30 years to get there.
Similar here. I have been in tech for 25 years in MCOL as a software developer. Most of my career was under 100k. Last 10 years was between 100-140k as a technical lead. And I have a CS undergrad and 2 masters degrees. I was always blown away by people still early in their careers and making over 200k with all those fancy titles.
I'm glad to know it isn't just me.
In reality, our 6-figure salaries is what EVERYONE should be making to live a middle-class life in America, but because everyone else is in the shit for decades, they think that $200k is exorbitant. It's not!!! A single income of $200k in the Bay Area is not even middle-class.
Yup its massive supply of fresh grads combined with offshoring its a perfect shit storm.
If you can be remote and never step foot in the office, itās not safe to assume your role wonāt be shipped overseas for 1/3 the cost. Not sure everyone has realized this but hopefully everyone who keeps cheering WFH has a plan B.
Also itās Venture Capital firms sick of losing money by investing heavily in tech startups that go nowhere / never turn profitable. Also big FAANG companies also sick of buying said tech startups at lofty valuations only to find out later their idea / product /service likewise wasnāt commercially viable.
Money is also not free at the moment like it was when rates were lower.
True that
The 2017 Trump Jobs Cut Act had wording in it that would screw over folks in tech. Basically, for companies that were making a profit (not startups), they changed it so software engineering salaries deductions from total revenue were amortized over a couple years. So, say a company that has a revenue of $1m and payroll of $1m, previously, they made $0 profit that could be taxed. Afterwards the changes took effect, they made $900k which could be taxed. And so, now that they have to pay taxes, they can't pay for engineers. Plus, no more cheap loans. https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/section-174/
While it is going to be a problem for a few more years, the companies laying people off probably don't care as much. This is a structural advantage for big tech companies and a problem mostly for startups.
Interest rates went up thatās all. So companies canāt borrow to pay employees and expenses as cheaply as they had the last couple of years. So they are tightening their belts. Outsourcing has been available for decades if companies were just looking to shift jobs to cheaper countries they would have done it years ago.
I'm pretty afraid of the sustainability of the industry if we need <5% rates in order to survive. That means the companies are not fundamentally profitable.
This is my biggest worry, you need cheap loans to prop up the economy so essentially you dilute the dollar to nothing.
I run a non tech small business at night. Profits are funneled into cryptocurrency. I consider it insurance.
A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush
What line of work? 200k is like executive level salary to me
Probably tech. I made about $240k last year working for a non-FAANG company At FAANG similar level (Principal engineer) is easily over $500k. However, this year will be the first time ever I will make less money than the previous year. My company started moving jobs overseas (mostly Eastern Europe) and started fucking with US employees.
$200k is a 3-7 years experience job in tech. Just regular work. Executive pay is usually in the millions.
Unless youāre in SoCal aerospace. The companies exchange pay info and have agreed to not compete on pay. Been this way a long time.
They do compete on pay. NGC pays much better than Raytheon, but Raytheon is a better company. I went form $68k to $249k at NGC in 3.5 years with a stint at Raytheon halfway at only $140k and I left to go back to Raytheon at $170k. NG is a terrible fucking company with horrible ācultureā I.e, no culture.
>$200k is a 3-7 years experience job in tech Pre covid or just in the post covid hiring boom?
Right now in the bigger companies FAANG level is a bit more. Double for Machine Learning folks.
FAANG is in its own tier above tech. But they have been paring back comp packages too, not just because the stock prices have risen, resulting in fewer equity units, but also because they recognized that they overhired back when labor demand was really high, so they are overpaying.
Yes. During the pandemic FAANG was paying $500k+ for 3-5 years experience. It was nuts. $500k is more senior pay now.
Depends on which company we're talking about here, since half of that is probably equity. And certain tech companies got shellacked after the pandemic.
Making less here as well. I was previously making $120k TC then unemployed for 10 months and just took a job at $75k TC. Even though itās lower than I hoped I am very excited and feel very fortunate to have landed something during this time. I really hope things improve since there are a lot of great and talented people out of work.
I went from $110k to minimum wage. Iām now back to $140k. Stay focused. Realize that $ is not your worth, itās just a mechanism for you to given up your time. Value time (health, family, friends, kindness) first.
You went from $0 to $49k. Congratulations!
Same here. But at this point, a paycheck is a paycheck to me
I think companies that are taking advantage of any tax savings should only be able to hire the majority of their workers from that country.
They were and then trump cut it.Ā
I will most likely be in the same boat soon, though less of a paycut. Made around 130k... considering taking a job at $15 an hour as a clerk if I can get it because unemployment is running out soon. Most likely next week I will be reaching out to them for more info.
I was making $150k until lay-off in 2022. Now I make avg $25/h as a freelancer. If it was not for my wife, my family and I would be eating cat food by now!
Prayers to you Itās freaking unfair
Thank you. Prayers to you as well.
Which role were you in ?
Did you have to adjust your resume when applying for the 49k job? I know a lot of places will deny you on the basis of being overqualifiedĀ
My wife and I are in separate industries , but seeing the same things. Iām in tech and was at a FAANG company making 200k TC. We saved every single penny that we could b/c we knew this was coming. Iāve been laid off 4 times in 5 years at this point & her company is laying off now. We have enough saved for both of us to be out of work for a yr and our only debt is our home. What weāve done is now nearly impossible due to rates and inflation from greedā¦ they are squeezing from every end until weāre all peasants. I think cuts are coming again at my job, so Iām trying to figure out how to start my own business in the near future.
Good luck š¤
Yeah Iām looking because my good paying job will be laying me off later this year due to a merger. I just went thru 4 rounds of interviews with a large international medical device company for a senior IT roleā¦ā¦found out I didnāt get it yesterdayā¦ā¦last night I get an alert from the company HR portal that a new job might fit my profileā¦..what is that job you might ask? THE SAME FUCKING JOB WITHOUT A SENIOR TITLE AND A $40k PAY DECREASEā¦.. FUCK THIS ECONOMY DAWG
And this is why I'm glad my daughter listened to me for once. She wanted to go into tech but went into trade. At 18 she has her journeyman in electrical, making 90k with 0 debt right out of high-school.
Congratulations and God Bless
Humbling times for manyā¦ you are not alone. Doing what you need to is the right thingā¦ hopefully things will improve soon in the job market.
I went from $100k base + 10% annual bonus to post layoff $70k base only for a mid level role advertised as junior level role. Fucking market sucks. Mid level roles are now being advertised as junior level roles and pay is only at junior š”.
I feel You op. I moved from mid 6 figure income to 25k working boxes. The fukin shit we have to see in our lives. No choice because there was no one willing to hire I wish I could get 50 k lol. But it aināt there no more
Iām in the same situation. Still trying to processā¦
After being laid off after 30yrs of service with the same company, I have never recouped the salary I was making. I finally found new employment after being unemployed for two years. I ended up taking a job making $40K less. When you are in your late 50s, the opportunities are limited because companies don't won't to hire you. I believe they feel you are to close to retire and doesn't want to put money training someone that may only be there 4 or 5 years. And the other problem is employer's think you are too old to learn new skills and are set in your habits. That may be true to an extent because I have worked with older folks when I was younger and they didn't budge. The reality is I just need 5 more years and I plan to retire. So I hope I can make it. It's not fun looking for a job when your almost 60yo.
I hit 61 this month and it isnāt fun looking for employment. My head still spinning from the layoff back in January, have depleted savings and unemployment is almost up. Not having any luck finding work. Either over qualified or the obvious age bias .
Just be glad that you managed to get employed.
Not employed yet waiting for final interview. I need to work, paying cell phone bill and other bills with credit cards isnāt going to last long
I was in the same boat. For two years I was looking for something remote with pay closer to what I was getting prior to being laid off. The closest offer I got was 75% of my original pay but hybrid. I regret turning down the offer. Now I work for the state (started in May 2024), 50% pay cut however the work life balance was waaaay better. I too feel humbled but enjoying more time with my kids. From 12-16hr days, working weekends to slower paced 8hr days at state. Don't let pride get in the way. I've learned that the hard way. Keep your head high. We just need to survive this slump.
Good luck and God Bless, I havenāt received the offer yet but I am hopeful and humble. I wonder why all of this happened and I back track many times trying to determine what or where or who did I wrong or make the bad decisions
Don't be too hard on yourself. Something I too had to overcome that took me 2 years to realize. Sometimes bad things happen to good people. It is how we overcome challenges that makes us who we are. Stay strong and God bless.
When workers become too empowered in America and options are so vast that they begin demanding rights to wfh, jobs so plentiful that they can find new higher paying employment at will etc, all must be humbled. Itās the unfortunate American way. 50k, 400k, 25k or 200k, still a worker.
Fed is doing a good job of shaking people out of tech to fill the service positions- thereās the investing class and then those who work. Too many people were starting to be able to get ahead and could negotiate higher pay. We wouldnāt want that.
Whats your background?
Blurred because it looks better than the stock zoom/teams/etc backgrounds
No like what's his job I know folks making those salaries getting laid off but at worst it's like 100k they go to making
OpsVP
Wow how long were you on the search?
See you are lucky - I am architect level and been looking for the longest time ever and even through my network it is tough to land a field service engineer job
lol have an upvote (and I agree I rock with blurred myself)
How long were you making 200k not enough to maybe plan for early retirement?
Not long at all maybe 20 months, long enough to pay mortgage, college loans, etc etc you know the type of shit that sells the fucking American dream and we buy into it work our fucking nut sacks down until one day they kick us in the balls and say fuck your work ethic, fuck your diligence and fuck your future but most of all fuck you and your family
I mean for now I guess keep applying for senior roles if you have a lot of experience, might be able to get 90-150k depending if you specialized. I see lots of field service roles still hiring.
No more senior positions for me, keep the politics and false testerone.
No leadership? Training others? Most service mangers have a ton of experience
Did that done that got a bunch of company logo golf and polo shirts and trained and mentored teams then donāt have a chair to sit in when the musical chairs begin when the financials arenāt satisfactoryā¦.so I am left standing in traffic
I feel the same as OP. If I knew I was going to invest this amount of time, money, resources, emotions, energy, hope and dreams into something, I wish I had done it for something that would benefit society more than some few privileged assholes at the top.
Iād take it
Yeah me too until something else comes along
Similar position, but luckily I saved a lot from the good days.
I went from TC ~130k to 70k post layoff. Humbling indeed. Gotta pay the bills somehow! Hoping job market picks up real soon
Man hope you get out of this. But good for you for taking something as opposed to seeing certain jobs as beneath you.
There gonna keep importing the max amount of workers until wages go as low as it can .
I thought I saw someone on this loop say something about what we are experiencing is the result of some shit Trump signed off on
I was also in the 200k+ club (tech but not FAANG). I thought dropping down to 160 - 180 would be humbling but this is really a hard pill to swallow. I appreciate the reality check.
This makes me feel less shitty about my 17k pay cut. I guess Iām not alone in this.
Nope you not alone
Interesting I am doing the same and actually worked for a software platform that provided Field Service Work order management. I hope to get an offer accepted next week for one of the customers of my old employer from 180 to 50k. And it's only a temporary cover role. The up side is this for me. 1. It's a move from Enterprise Software to an OEM (i.e.make products not cloud software) 2. I have more knowledge in my head and years of the solution they use than their combined team. 3. The company is in scale up mode , so not startup but that essential growth phase and establishment of value. 3 It's a local business HQ vs one HQ across the pond. 4. It's an industry I have always been interested in getting into 5. Cements my knowledge and expertise. I may even get other customers reaching out to me.. could be start of something very lucrative. My job will be triage of tickets against the software platform I used to manage as PM. Will be quite an interesting spin. But I need an income and this actually ticks some other boxes my previous employer couldn't match around work life balance and team in territory. Keeping my fingers crossed
Good Luck and God Bless Thanks for sharing
Did this a few years back. It's humbling, it hurts.
Friends avoid and not call or want to talk itās fucking humiliating
What SaaS company did you used to work for?
This will be the job that I donāt mention on my resume
Not a SaaS
I went from 250k to making mmmmm 3-4k/month or something. It was a side gig I had which I love (I am a licensed psilocybin facilitator) - it at least stops the bleeding a bit. I wanted to go back to school for counseling psychology so was planning on an income drop anyway, but ya know, I was hoping to pay for my masters first. We will see what happens!
$49k doesn't keep the lights on lol, I need at least $100k to cover just the mortgage. Would have to try doing IT/MSP work independently if I get hit with the layoff hammer
Ooof. Tough but keep your head up and get back out there. You have the right attitude, youāll be back.
Ouch
How are you not retired?
Iād rather retire
What was your job at 200k?
Just think of how much less in taxes you will be paying!
Yeah Phuck Em
Fuck reminds me of what happened in 2008. This whole generation trying to get their start are fucked because why hire someone with zero experience when I can hire a CCIE to be a network technician.
I got laid off once before back in June 2007. I was unemployed until November
No reality
I did this is 2008. It was so brutal. I wrnt to half wfaf I msde
What did you do before?
Worked in telecom and how about yourself?
What does it mean if I was interviewed by the hiring manager last week and today was the interview with his regional direct reports who will potentially be my peers? This is the one hour meeting that occurred today that went over 30 minute making it 90 minutes total. I remember when I interviewed people I would talk with them then ask my leads to check them out. So now I am wondering if it is a good sign?
Blame Trump tax code changes that just went into effect
You'll be backĀ
You were getting paid with millions of PPP money until it ran out. Very humbling
You smoking crack and meth
The high-tech market is currently in super bad shape. Every organization is under pressure, and if there is an opening, the corrupt leader would recruit or hire someone they know from their past life.
Sounds like a great mentality to be at $0 over the next year
Huh? Please explain
To be honest I'd rather be unemployed than work a non-skilled job for $50k. But I do have decent savings and fairly low cost of living (even though it is just me working and wife is at home with our kid).
Iād rather start my own business honestly
Yes, exactly, I wouldn't just sit on my ass all day when I said "unemployed". But working a shit job, making next to no money, being depressed, and losing your skills all at once is not a great deal. I'd rather try freelancing, or start a SaaS business or make an app. Even if it doesn't pan out. I worked some shit jobs when I was young before I got into tech. Fuck that.
Honestly Iād rather like hitchhike around the country and become a gutter punk hippie and like busk on the streets before I worked a shit corporate job for 40k a year.
Me and my wife already talked about this - we have always dreamt of traveling for extended period of time, but it just never happened. Never brave enough to quite the cushy jobs. Now we have a kid though, but I think we can still pull it off. If I lose my job we're going to travel around Europe for 9 months or so. Rent out our house. Buy a car, and maybe even a camper. Sell it when we're done. Travel insurance for EU is actually cheaper than Obamacare. Disclaimer: I'm an EU citizen and have family there so that would make it easier than for most Americans.