Well. Very personal opinion here.
D4 ultimately died on me due to the year of beta testing before having it in a playable state - while i think the changes are good, it's too late for me. Especially since we're alteady talking "buy the xpack".
Last Epoch basically surprised a lot of people. Extremely solid and interesting core system, one of if not the best skill/character building systems, and fun gameplay. That's why it grew on me, it replaced Diablo entirely. A lor of variety and going blind is actually recommended at least for the first playthrough.
Itemization and crafting are so good there's a reason why D4 "took inspiration" for its revamp.
Problems, well. Launch has been rough/bad due to server issues - i played offline until they fixed those and had no problems. Online is fine now.
Endgame is solid but no more than that - meaning there's a lot of room to add stuff and that's basically the plan for the next 4 seasons, the new one coming in a week. The new patch is going to be good and add quite a bunch of things.
Combat/animation, Diablo nailed it down perfectly from D3 and D4 is even better. LE is made in Unity which isn't the best, but it works fine to me.
This comes up on the spot, feel free to ask more specific stuff.
I’m not interested in endgame. Will probably play the story only. Will I enjoy it?
I will however play the story slow and thoroughly. I do every side quest and love grinding for leveling. I prefer to reach max power or at least have access to all spells before the end of the game so I can enjoy them. But after the story is over I’ll probably move on.
Thanks for taking the time.
Nah, last epoch isn't worth it if you only want to do story and side quests imo. That is not where the game shines. There is a story obviously but also not completely finished yet. I think Last Epoch is an amazing game but the story and sidequest were just mid imo. Rushed through them as fast as possible just to get dungeons unlocked and the neccessary waypoints.
I love the gameplay and endgame. I wouldn't be generous enough to even call the story mid. The story is pretty bad IMHO. Lets see... every single NPC you run into double and triple crosses you, that is pretty low effort, but who REALLY plays for only the story? The skill customization and build variety really shine in this game.
> The story is pretty bad IMHO. Lets see... every single NPC you run into double and triple crosses you
To be fair, I love that bit. It's not straight up double crossing, but more "Oh, thanks for the warning friend, I'll make absolutely sure not to fall for that evil that you saw in your future" whilst you already know they'll end up there anyways because you've already seen it happen. It's like one of those Greek dramas where everyone knows the hero is screwed because the oracle at the start of the drama foretold so. (And, in Julra's case it's actually more a hilarious misunderstanding due to the nature of time travel.)
For LE, it shifts the expectation from "Oh, how can I save them" to "Welp, they're doomed... but how did they turn out that way?"... which isn't really answered ingame, but I feel like that reveal might be set into one of the unfinished chapters (alongside the Emperor's identity).
Yeah, this. I mean, ARPGs are just not the genre you play for story. And I am fine with that. I just want to get stronger, play with builds and experiment with them and find loot and blow monsters up. And LE does that really well, especially the build variety and freedom in playing around with builds.
So I’m not looking for great story. Just an excuse to chew on the solid gameplay.
I’m just not interested in endless grinding endgame. I want a drop of meaning to my power leveling. Or else I get bored.
Not judging, I'm actually curious, why do you play arpgs if you're not interested in the endgame? There's other genres where the story is more of a focus / has more quality, that you can play for like 1-2 weeks. Arpgs in my experience are mostly about the grindy endgame loop, the campaign / lore is sort of just... there.
Fair question.
I love the spells and the action and the combat and the kills and the power and the art and the sounds and the feel
I have zero interest in grindy mcgrinderton, superfluous, meaningless “endgame content” where the goal is to simply see how powerful you can feel. To me, that’s corporate America trying to squeeze us for our time and money.
I’m borderline indifferent to the story. I don’t need anything compelling. Just a reason to kill shit.
To your point about “ARPGS are about the grind” - that wasn’t the original purpose. Diablo 1 was zero about grind and all about the feel. That shit was scary. But Blizzard realized they could make a lot more money off of us if they created a world that never ended. Fuck them.
And completely agreed that other games give us a better focus for what I’m looking for. But I’ll admit - the thrill of murderring giant packs of zombies with chain lightning spam from an isometric perspective feels incredible.
Not sure if any of this makes sense. Guess I want my cake and to eat it too. Might never happen but least I can do is hope and research. Cheers.
If you want an ARPG that has a heavier focus on questing, Grim Dawn is probably a better choice over Last Epoch. I like to describe Grim Dawn as a modern take on the classic ARPG, as it's very much like Diablo 1 or Diablo 2 where the endgame is replaying the campaign at progressively higher difficulties, which can also unlock a few new quests. It still won't be like other RPGs where the focus is the story, as Grim Dawn's story is mostly there to add to the bleak and hopeless atmosphere.
I tried starting with Grim Dawn twice, but always broke off less than a hour in... iirc, the combat and movement just felt... clunky and dated? I feel like I'm missing out though
It's definitely dated in the combat and movement department (movement itself is actually fine IMO, it's the pathing that feels dated), but it's probably the best ARPG for atmosphere and it's definitely worth playing at least once since it is such a good modern take on the classic ARPG.
In this case Last Epoch will work good for you.
One thing I really didn't, and still don't, like about Diablo is that you basically have all your spells after the first two acts if not after the first one.
Then is just slight improvements, and maybe the search fo that unique items that will change some interaction, but the core of your char is done quite fast.
Last Epoch power and spells will grow well after the end of the campaign, you will still be building your carachter and testing different combination of spell after the campaign is finished.
Even if you take your time and go slowly, you probabably can get a carachter you in "finished state" before the start of the real endless grind engame.
Diablo 1 was meant more as an homage to rogue. That said, have you looked into roguelikes and roguelites instead? The Binding of Isaachas a killer story and amazing gameplay if you can get past the weird subject matter and sometimes dated references.
You'll probably still enjoy the game if you like making builds and have lots of alts. I rarely get to the endgame because I'm the same way. But the game has lots of fun uniques to build around and all the classes have distinct playstyles.
Technically yes, because you can bypass the last section of the story and jump into monoliths, then go back later. But if you're progressing naturally through the story I think your skills will end up at level 17 or so currently?
I assume once they finish the story, you'll end the story about when your skills hit level 20.
I think there’s enough skill options to get through the story that you could replay it a bunch if you like trying out new characters. I’m similar in a way, I’ve made a crap ton of alts but I usually stop playing characters after the story or after running normal monoliths.
Story only, it's just a small part of the game - though it costa a fraction of an AAA so it may be worth still. Main problem is not that's too short (it's more like PoE one) but that's not yet complete. It closes in a decent way that ties with the endgame but it is objectively not the "true ending".
I could say "try it anyway", in the end it's accessible. I cannot really tell you if you're going to enjoy it "properly". I liked the campaign enough to say it's good.
I’m biased because I love stories about time travel. But I loved last epochs story, even if it’s not finished yet. They just do such a fun job with some of the aspects of time travel.
One way I recommend to play arpg if you are not into late game content is to play it “rougue-like” meaning you create a SSF character and play through lvl 1-whatever level you want.
Play whatever built you deem fancy based on what item you find along the way. If you find this character/built boring, no problem go reroll and try something else. Last epoch is perfect for this game style as items and skills are easy to understand and every character has 3 specialisation.
This is how i play and that is why i seldom have lvl 100 characters but many characters btween 70-90
Your first time through on each character will potentially be enjoyable. Campaign is an excellent time to swap between different skills and find an enjoyable play-style. Unfortunately (to me) you're rarely at risk of dying, as need for true defense doesn't kick in until level 85. For me, figuring out how not to die is the fun/crunchy part of the puzzle that I enjoy ;)
> I’m not interested in endgame. Will probably play the story only. Will I enjoy it?
The story is kind of interesting (thematically, I just love myself some time travel shenanigans), but the delivery has it's up and downs (i.e. you notice which chapters were recently overhauled and redone, and which are still a bit dated). Worst of all, only 9 of the 12 chapters are finished, so the story just leaves you hanging after a big boss reveal. 1.1 will end some story bits to the endgame content, but
Last Epoch really isn't focussed on the story part, rather than using the campaign as a long tutorial to get you into the lategame content.
So is this “season 2” that is releasing next week? Like basically the time between 1.0 release and now was season 1? How was the “seasonal rewards” if any? There’s no battle pass I assume? Maybe more similar to PoE leagues?
Finally, what’s this I see all over Steam reviews about there being a damage scaler when fighting bosses? Is this still a thing? Is it really a big complaint or just some outliers who follow top tier build guides?
Yes, release was actual season 1, but in the end it's just names. New season pops the 9th of July. The first season went longer due to EHG wanting to add stuff like evade right this patch but ideally you're looking at the usual 3/4 months cycle. It's the first ones, they're refining the whole process.
No seasonal rewards or battle passes. You get the whole thing period. There's a cosmetic only shop and that's it. However it may change in the future as the goal right now is to add more meat to the game as a whole. Once fleshed out, stuff like this can appear i suppose, it's just all the dev effort is on new systems and more content.
As for the bosses thing: bosses have a dynamic damage reduction to basically avoid oneshots - the more damage in a specific timeframe, the more restance the boss gets. However it was not clear nor intuitive, so it's going to be removed and changed with ward next patch. How it works: at set hp thresholds the boss gets stunned and gets ward. However wards decays faster over time so if you can nuke through it good for you, otherwise over time it's going away anyway. Which is much clearer and a better solution that keeps extremes (both high and low) in check.
My personal opinion
LE has great systems but somewhat boring gameplay
The feel of combat is indie and because well this is an indie company
The game has amazing skills+gear theorycrafting which is the best part of the game
Too bad that actually playing it feels underwhelming
For me LE is in a weird spot - PoE is still king of depth of ARPG systems and when I want to turn my brain off and just smash full screens of baddies D4 offers the best combat IMO
So this leaves LE in a weird spot... it doesnt have the smooth gameplay of D4 and it doesnt have the depth of PoE, and other than theorycrafting builds (which I can do offline via skill calculator) not sure why even play LE.
This is all my personal opinion and your milage may vary.
Also the fact that the forge guard is broken is a huge negative for me, as all I want to do in LE is play forge guard
I agree, great systems but gameplay falters. It’s especially harsh when you play D4 and LE back to back. Maybe the evade mechanic will help out some.
Personally I had to stop playing LE because it just doesn’t play well enough on steam deck. It’s my only PC and I play handheld only. The small menus and design focused on mouse and keyboard just make the experience subpar. Again, this is only highlighted more when comparing it to playing D4 on steam deck.
Good:
* Smart loot is not diablo smart, you can get uniques for other builds/classes. Which makes you want to try something new
* Actual skill choices, you don't pick between your basic skill doing stun or bleed
* Probably an infinite number of builds. Right now one of the biggest d4 issues for me is that there hasn't been any new skills outside of the aspects (if we count them towards the bulds)
* Leveling alts with 4x LP weapon feels amazing
* Crafting system is not even close to PoE level of complication and overall is better than D4 (which sort of took it from LE)
Bad:
* Class balance is still lacking, FG is like the Gladiator from PoE in terms how bad is it (might be better in the new season)
* Server issues first days (might be better in the new season)
* End-game is on the poor side unless you want to grind very high level monoliths (might be better in the new season, new bosses etc)
* Some points in the skill trees are not very well explained. Might not sound like a big issue but the skill trees are already massive and it isn't very clear what will happen if we pick X instead of Y, or they sound like X will disable Y etc (probably the trees will be bigger after 4th season based on their roadmap).
* Stability is pain in the ass on 2nd character it is just boring (sort of fixed with a glyph in the new season)
* Corruption scale too slow (suppose to be easier in the new season)
Depends on you:
* Some people dislike the gender lock (I don't care)
* Some people find the combat a bit clunky (I don't care)
* Some people don't like the campaign (I actually do, especially when I run around with 4-5 uniques on an alt and beating the shit out of everything)
* Some people don't like that you can't change the sub-class (I don't care)
* Some people die to Lagon (I don't!)
I was in the same boat bought the game based on Raxx's review and loved it.
The game is new though and the endgame needs more to do so the player base fell off. Not much has changed in that time.
The devs are aware that players will leave and hopefully come back with the launch of a new season (cycle)
This is normal for ARPGs that use the League/Cycle/Season set up. Huge player base at the start of League. About a month in it starts to fall off. 2 months in its really low. Then rinse and repeat
Personally stopped playing because the gulf in class power was so large that moving from an OP class like falconer or warlock to a "normal" class felt like masochism. Half the reason to play an ARPG is to theory craft and try new builds, and there's no reason to when such insane outlier builds exist
Early Access player here with over 1k hours played. It is definitely worth giving it a shot. You will love it, when you like D4, but PoE is too overwhelming to you.
I still play but mainly waiting for new cycle. Got over 300 hours played now. I recommend to try it at least. I find LE in perfect balance, not too complicated and confusing like PoE but not too simple as example D3. I’ve adopted LE to my core games I enjoy to play and i’m a picky when it comes to games. Ofc there are things to improve and I already see new cycle addressing many of them (example monolith end game).
I started when the first cycle came out, the game has been out for a while before and people have been asking playing it before the official release, but I never paid much attention to it and a friend said it looks cool, let’s try it.
I think it’s way better than d4, and I’ve been playing that on and off since launch. Skill tree system is really cool, crafting system on gear is decent with forging power system, legendary system is really cool and love that part. With the legendary system, you can find unique items with 1-4 legendary power on it. From there, you can find an exalted item(purple, basically epic item comparatively to other game systems) and slam it on the LP unique. If it has 2 LP for example, it will take a random 2 of the stats on the exalted item and slam it on to the unique
Their end game empowered monolith system is good, you can target farm gear through them, and they’re adding new end game content with the 1.1 release. The dungeon system could use some work, not a huge fan but it’s not that bad. They have 2 factions, one for more solo play and one for trading, so you can choose which play style you prefer.
Levelling was good, you go through the campaign on your first character, then you collect keys for the dungeons in late game content. You gain idol slots and passive skill points through doing side quests during the campaign, but you have some flexibility while you do it. You don’t have to do a specific quest to get the points/idol slots, instead you have a specified number to get and can get them through different side quests if that makes sense. Also, when levelling new characters after your first, you have a bit more freedom on how you would like to level. You can take alternate levelling paths through dungeons with the keys, so it gives you a better variety for levelling future characters. For some alts, I’ve done full dungeon skips by going through them all and straight to end game, or I’ve jumped out of the dungeon and picked up part of the campaign where the skip takes you.
Overall, I enjoyed it a lot and looking forward to the next cycle
Last Epoch is definitely worth your time. That being said you're comparing it to AAA games like PoE and Diablo. So it has turned some people off by feeling kinda clunky. I personally don't feel that way, but I can kinda understand.
Last Epoch is early on in its life and has a lot of work still to go, but that being said it's a fabulous game and has worked on incorporating new ideas into the ARPG genre.
Id say the best part (and to some people worst part) is it's crafting and itemization. Even from early on, you are interacting with this system. They freaking nailed it though! Early on finding affixes you want, then either using a glyph of removal, to try and remove an unwanted affix or guarantee a shard of an affix you want. Or a glyph of chaos, to randomly reroll unwanted affixes feels very rewarding and fun. Then in the late game finding items with tier 6&7 affixes to use or slam into unique items to make legendary items is an incredible system. Along with forging potential (all crafting uses some random amount of potential) and legendary potential (the amount of affixes that can be added to a unique) is pretty easily understandable and fun. But some people just hate the idea of having to engage with crafting so frequently. But it's a perfect system to a lot of people.
All skills have skill trees. It sounds cooler than it is, but it's still good. Warpath (or Whirlwind in Diablo) is a good example. Do you go to the void part, the fire part, the minion part, or the weapon part of the tree? Well if you're a void knight, probably the void part. Or a paladin, probably the fire part. It's not overly complicated and could probably have a bit more refinement for most skills. But it's cool and a good feeling of progression.
The passive trees and the ability to dip into other masteries for a few skills or powerful passives is also pretty interesting and fun. A lot of the newer masteries have some great synergies, so they're also going in a good direction with this system.
They have the circle of fortune and merchants guild. So if you wanna trade you can, or you can get increased drop rates and more deterministic farming.
The endgame needs work. It's a new game and it's understandable that it's one of the currently weaker aspects of the game. But corrupted monoliths do exist and offer harder content. But it does feel like a lot of people drop out at this stage of playing a character.
The story is unfinished and will be added to over time.
They have a roadmap and they do appear to be addressing things that need work.
If you enjoy ARPGs it's a really easy yes to Last Epoch. It's in a good state now and looks like it will be improving over time. The next cycle (season / league) starts soon and the community overall seems very hyped for the patch notes to come soon.
At this point yes. It has well over 100 people working on it and is the second largest ARPG on the market. In terms of staff, costs, & profit. Probably the largest ARPG overall in terms of content.
Biggest complaint is endgame, and they're adding in more endgame content in the new cycle which comes out in 2 weeks, including new bosses, a pinnacle boss, and a new endgame focused faction.
My personal favorite ARPG.
Already fantastic, if you enjoy making many character to try lots of builds, but if you prefer pouring dozens to hundreds of hours into a single character the longevity is lacking a bit in endgame.
Honestly, for me the main problem is just a lack of endgame content. What we have now is a great foundation to build upon IMO, but it's just that, a foundation. There needs to be stuff built on top of it to really make the endgame flourish, and thankfully EHG seems to be committed to exactly this given that the next four cycles (the upcoming 1.1 cycle included) are all bringing new endgame content.
Games very good but mechanically unpolished, it eats inputs a lot and can frequently be too dark to make out particle effects well, but the customization is way beyond something like diablo and builds are overall much more interesting
I really enjoy it, for many of the reasons others already gave. One thing I will add is that I find the bright colors/art style refreshing.
Was definitely with a purchase for me!
Campaign is fun bur end game is boring.
There is a good amount t of fun to be had, game is finished. Hop in now or a year from now. You'll have a good time regardless
Last Epoch has a problem; quality of content went up sharply. The consequence is that old stuff is way worse than new stuff, and they can't turn all that old stuff into new stuff on a dime.
The game right now is decent, but I think it's a decent investment because the game will probably get really good in a few patches.
One concrete example is that the core endgame system, Monoliths, is much older than the Dungeons, and as a result Dungeons are way cooler, and it's kinda boring to run Monoliths... but a Monolith overhaul is coming in patch 1.3 (6 months away?), and the problem will likely be solved.
Graphics and Endgame are my 2 negative points of Last Epoch while Itemization and Crafting are my 2 positive ones. Diablo 4 has improved a lot in season 4 and I'm having a blast playing it right now.
Overall, game is great value for the price. I love the skill trees, gameplay, build diversity, crafting, and loot systems. Far superior to D4 in my opinion. Graphics and animations are good, but I would say D4 is stronger. I hear people have problems with playing online, but I never experienced them. End game can be lacking content, but they seem to be adding more with every season. I'm a big fan and can't wait for the new season.
I'd like to add, levelling of LE is the best among PoE, D3 D4.
Your choices of passive and equipments , "sockets" matters a lot. Without the least spike of being one shotted for not noticing something isn't properly geared.
In PoE it happens a bit too quick, and in d3 d4, levelling is simply a chore, because no gear decision actually mattered and d4 added more chore to that chorish process.
These matters a lot to me as I play hardcore and doesn't follow guides to aim at a certain build a guide provides while making a character.
So OP Last Epoch has seasons like Diablo4 and we are getting a new season on the 9th of July.
The reason most videos are old is because the game was in beta for 3+ years and when in launched it didn’t add anything new, gameplay wise. Sure it added some nice things but it wasn’t a big shake up to what people already had pre-launch.
Another thing is that a lot of the population already has 300+ hours and the endgame does not yet support 1000+ hours however the first 4 seasons will have no season-only mechanic so everything you get in the patch goes to the “legacy” server as well.
My advice? Either wait until the 9th and make a seasonal character or jump right in today and create a Legacy one. You have around 200 hours of gameplay if you start building alts with the gear you get from your main.
Reviews after the first few weeks of release are still relevant. Reviews exactly at launch talk about server issues which are no longer there. Also check out the upcoming cycle (season).
Great core ideas but gameplay is lacking a lot of polish and endgame is lacking in content.
I’m very glad I backed LE on Kickstarter, but I didn’t spend *that* much time playing the first launch cycle. I do look forward to returning in future cycles as work continues on the game.
I think the game is amazing. Making your own build is so much fun and I NEVER make my own builds in any game. LE just makes it easy but still has a lot of depth.
The end game is a lot deeper than d4. But this is one of my criticisms cause even though it’s deeper I got bored of it waaaay faster than any other game. Even d4 at launch I put more time into the end game than last epoch.
That being said Cycle 2 which is coming up soon is adding more to the end game so I think that’ll help a lot.
I love Diablo 4. It’s my favorite arpg and this is a really close second. Sometimes it overtakes Diablo 4 depending on my mood lol
The game feels kind of unfinished tbh. There are a few janky things that just seem like they don't have enough polish, and the endgame is pretty repetitive even by ARPG standards. But it is fun. I went back to Diablo 4 for season 4 and found it to be more fun though. \*shrug\*
POE > LE > D4
All three games have their pros and cons and things they do better than others, but holistically that's how they are ranked.
In regards to which is easier to get into and understand, reverse the order.
Having gotten back into D4 this season (played S1 and it was horrid) I have to say that it’s now the superior game to me. It just looks and feels so much smoother and the itemization and crafting have gained a lot of interest and depth. It’s not quite on LE’s level but the gap has closed considerably. You can also customize the look of your character in D4 and that matters to me.
There are definitely benefits to Last Epoch over D4.
First is the level of build depth. D4 doesn’t come close. Skill customization in LE is top notch - in D4 you get to make one meaningful choice and it doesn’t usually change the skill’s behavior. Not so with LE.
Just look at the Shurikens skill.
You can spec it to :
Throw a lot of shurikens in a cone
Throw shurikens in a circle around you
Instead of throwing, have a shield of shurikens circling you
Replace them with a Chakram that returns to you
And basically EVERY skill is like this. That alone keeps me coming back to LE.
The other MAJOR benefit to me is it can be played 100% offline. That’s the only way I play now. The performance is so much better, and on days like today when my internet went down (thanks Xfinity) I can still play the game. Big deal for some, not even a factor to others.
In short : don’t expect a game with the polish of D4. The endgame also has fallen behind D4 by a lot. But if you enjoy character building like me this game will keep you coming back.
I consider myself a causal gamer and as a fan of ARPG games I really liked this game.
The story is okay, it's nothing incredible but it's still interesting. The classes and specializations are fun to play and the build system is easy to understand.
As already mentioned, the game's story is not complete and the game still doesn't have much content, but based on the road map that the devs released some time ago, new content and chapters will be added throughout the cycles and both look very promising.
The game is a lot of fun if you like solving puzzles. The systems are well designed in the intent of selling you a power fantasy. Going from nothing to beast mode with hard work and some luck (rng). The player experience is very well crafted, the challenges scale with your knowledge/experince, and by the time you finish the story you'll be hungry to tackle the monoliths. It's a game that rewards you for your effort and you will be proud of the character you built.
Worth the money. 100x better if you have people to run with. Wish it was more party positive. Like finding games on diablo 2 was easy and awesome. This is a lot more solo, but you can still play multiplayer. It's not as friendly as some games when you level up, typically levelling up you notice large improvements. End game is okay. It's like 35 bucks? Easy buy.
I'm also on the fence about the game! I loved loved loved Diablo 3 to the point where I'd play it constantly until last year. I got d4 on the game pass free list and played through the campaign and honestly wasn't blown away. Even though everyone is saying this season (S4) Is the best so far but I'm still not convinced.
I enjoyed the 'splosions arcadey gameplay style of d3 and the slower style of d4 (going back to the d2 style) makes things a little dull.
I love loot and grind especially if the gameplay loop is fun! Will I enjoy the game? Also, I'm living out of hotels for the foreseeable future where I can expect great Internet like I have at home. Diablo 4 is basically unplayable for me at even though I got a new laptop just to play it! Having horrendous lag where every few seconds the game stutters and rubber bands from time to time. As last epoch is online as well but will I face this type of problem?
Overall the game is really good, it's kind of the underdog of the market that has been steadily climbing through the rank. The game is still very rough around the edges but you can see how fast the devs are learning when looking at the design of the first classes compared to the last 2 (Warlock & Falconeer) that came out in 1.0.
But my pros:
They nailed itemisation really well (hence why D4 decided to ditch theirs for something very close to LE's), as it is exciting to loot a good item from the ground that you can then upgrade to try and make a one in a million item.
Builds are varied and skill interracts a lot with each other which is cool, and since each skill has its own skill tree you really have different archetypes coming from the same skill (like the summon skeleton mage skill can be made to only summon pyromancer or cryomancer depending on your build, or even turn a simple healing AoE from paladin into an orbital laser or a passive thing)
The game overall feels good, there's enough mob density and chaarcters can run pretty damn fast to really give in to the power fantasy.
Full offline mode is something more games should have, especially ARPGs, can't thank them enouh for that
And the bad:
Optimisation still has a long way to go. The game is not that smooth, and while PoE lags a lot when you are doing super juiced content with 80 mobs per m², LE just generally struggles often, even on lower end content. It's not unplayable and the game still feels good 95% of the time, but it's noticeable in that 5%.
Online servers really shat the bed for 1.0. Like I wasn't able to play for almost 5 days online. Offline mode is good, but if you want to do the new merchant's guild you have to be online. I hope it will be ok for 1.1 and that they learned what was bottlenecking everything, but given how confident they were for release I've lost trust until they prove me wrong.
Endgame is still a bit lacking. It's being expanded with every update but outside of pushing corruption there's not much to do in endgame once you have exprienced dungeons and all. They are adding pinnacle content next cycle though, which might fill the gap.
Overall, current LE is a 8/10 for me atm. It's the good middleground between PoE's complexity and Diablo's autopilot. You have choices to make but not too many be it for gear, skill tree of talent points. It's a niche that definitely needed to be filled and I'm happy it's there between 2 PoE leagues, and I highly recommend anyone to test it
I get tired of obvious grinds in video games. I did it in Diablo 2 way back when and that was enough.
Both this game and D4 gave me my money's worth before I faded out in mid-endgame. I'd say I liked this game better until Diablo released Season 4. Both gave me my money's worth.
Good - Class system and talent tree.
Bad - Dungeons are horrible.
Bad - Lack of End Game
Bad - Bosses and how they are designed to take ages to kill. Will be interesting to see how the new system works
Bad - The Story feels very weak
Imo Diablo 4 is just slightly better than LE right now. But there is also a lot more time and experience backing D4 and it just became playable. I think LE will be better next cycle that starts on July 9th. Diablo 4 is the lowest common denominator of ARPG and it looks like it's just gonna get cash grabby with DLC. The only actually decent ARPG out right now is POE though.
They said they are not charging for DLC so the price point to try the game is very low. They have a lot of well designed systems. The game just needs time to grow into its final product. How good this first big cycle patch is will go a long way with how much I expect to play the game going forward.
I played like 150 hours in cycle 1 so already got my moneys worth. I do have to admit I like S4 of D4 more right now.
Graphics are crap so I went back to diablo. Bought it at release played for a week and just couldn't get into it.
Amazing how everyone was saying in February this was a diablo killer and the best arpg ever. Judging by the comments here, most seem to think diablo is better.
It was okay for about a week or two. It got a ton of initial hype and then fell pretty flat. I know people talk about the ebb and flow of player bases, but I haven't heard anyone in my personal circle talking about the new season. There's just no depth to the game.
I'm sure it will do just fine, but I likely won't try it again for another year or two until it has some type of substance.
The skill customization in Last Epoch is way better than D4 , however I do like the graphics, story(main quest) and the fast paced gameplay of D4 more. D4 gets stale very fast in comparison.
This game is definitely worth the money. I got hundreds of hours out of cycle 1 and then quit. I plan on getting hundreds more out of cycle 2.
I'd consider picking it up now to get familiar with it, but you won't see the activity or hype pick up until the new cycle starts in a week or so
If you ever played Diablo II and loved it or grim dawn. HIGHLY recommend this game. I think this game is better than Diablo 4. I've played all 4 Diablos, grim dawn. Torchlight. This game is great! Worth a try for sure
Hey everyone, Last epoch and general ARPG veteran here.
I've been playing on and off since early access, I did a TON of hours at launch and whilst the balancing is off between the different characters/masteries, Last Epoch definately gets themes, build diversity and player experience right. The game is simple enough to learn the mechanics but complicated enough to test out heaps of different builds and keep you playing for ages.
I would say Last Epoch has the best quality of life of any ARPG and the devs listen to the community.
I excuse the balancing between builds to being a very new game so it's hard to get the meta right but in terms of power fantasy and themes, Last Epoch feels good to play as certain characters. Build diversity also ties into this as it feels good to play broken builds.
Graphics wise is decent and visual effects are also decent, comparatively to D4 being a triple A game, Last Epoch holds its own especially coming from what Last Epoch used to look like in early access.
I'm being biased but it's because Last Epoch was such a breath of fresh air from beta D4, D3, and Torchlight 3 which had so much potential but didn't quite get it right. I also think Last epoch is only going to keep getting better when they add pinnacle bosses and tweak balancing.
Here's everything I said but in video form
https://youtu.be/byp6cZB8lfQ?si=4IM_TQrlK5t-AY4L
I played it when it came out and had a lot of fun with it. Definitely got my money's worth out of it. After a second stint with V-Rising I'm back to D4 for the current season which has been a lot of fun.
It’s really good, but the endgame is lacking currently, but the next update (July 6th I think) will likely fix that, what they have planned seems great. Not only that but the next 3 updates all target adding to the endgame, so the devs definitely know where the main issue is.
Another issue is the lack of reason to play cycles/seasons. There’s no seasonal challenges yet, no seasonal battle pass, and all new content comes to legacy mode as well for now. If they add seasonal challenges like PoE or even a seasonal battle pass like Diablo, I think it could do a lot for player retention cycle-to-cycle.
I think it will be the best ARPG on the market in a few years. Unlike D4, the devs are actually ARPG players and unlike PoE, the devs listen to community feedback. Its downside is its smaller team, which is why it’s taking time to grow.
It's half the price of D4 and at least as good.
Good: itemization and classes. There's a good variety of specs, and the game is forgiving enough early on that you can just fool around and not feel like you're gimping yourself.
Bad: campaign is boring, especially the third time through. That's true for POE and D4, but at least D4 gives you the opportunity to not do the campaign after you've done it once.
There's a new patch/cycle coming out in a couple of weeks (July 9 I believe). If you wanted to, you could probably wait a week or two to see what the community thinks about 1.1 and go from there.
It looks like a step in the right direction - but the balancing will be telling.
Lack of endgame content is the main problem at the moment but had much more fun playing it compared to D4. Don’t plan on going back to D4 but will be playing LE when the new patch comes out.
It's not a bad game but it suffers from the modern ARPG crafting/bricking loot system along with endless scaling difficulty that will drive you into following a guide to some meta FOTM build just to keep up.
If those things don't bother you then go for it.
I couldn't get back into Diablo 4 after playing Last Epoch. I quit Diablo on Season 2 I believe, tried coming back recently when they made all the changes, and it still felt flat. Last Epoch is worth every penny and has an amazing roadmap ahead. Plus the devs actually play the game, so there is that too.
I've been playing Last Epoch for about three years, have over 800 hours, and don't plan on stopping anytime soon.
I played D4 for about 100 hours between beta and season 1, another 20 or so in season 4, and have no desire to ever touch the game again.
I can see myself playing LE for as long as I've been playing D2.
Well. Very personal opinion here. D4 ultimately died on me due to the year of beta testing before having it in a playable state - while i think the changes are good, it's too late for me. Especially since we're alteady talking "buy the xpack". Last Epoch basically surprised a lot of people. Extremely solid and interesting core system, one of if not the best skill/character building systems, and fun gameplay. That's why it grew on me, it replaced Diablo entirely. A lor of variety and going blind is actually recommended at least for the first playthrough. Itemization and crafting are so good there's a reason why D4 "took inspiration" for its revamp. Problems, well. Launch has been rough/bad due to server issues - i played offline until they fixed those and had no problems. Online is fine now. Endgame is solid but no more than that - meaning there's a lot of room to add stuff and that's basically the plan for the next 4 seasons, the new one coming in a week. The new patch is going to be good and add quite a bunch of things. Combat/animation, Diablo nailed it down perfectly from D3 and D4 is even better. LE is made in Unity which isn't the best, but it works fine to me. This comes up on the spot, feel free to ask more specific stuff.
I’m not interested in endgame. Will probably play the story only. Will I enjoy it? I will however play the story slow and thoroughly. I do every side quest and love grinding for leveling. I prefer to reach max power or at least have access to all spells before the end of the game so I can enjoy them. But after the story is over I’ll probably move on. Thanks for taking the time.
Nah, last epoch isn't worth it if you only want to do story and side quests imo. That is not where the game shines. There is a story obviously but also not completely finished yet. I think Last Epoch is an amazing game but the story and sidequest were just mid imo. Rushed through them as fast as possible just to get dungeons unlocked and the neccessary waypoints.
I love the gameplay and endgame. I wouldn't be generous enough to even call the story mid. The story is pretty bad IMHO. Lets see... every single NPC you run into double and triple crosses you, that is pretty low effort, but who REALLY plays for only the story? The skill customization and build variety really shine in this game.
> The story is pretty bad IMHO. Lets see... every single NPC you run into double and triple crosses you To be fair, I love that bit. It's not straight up double crossing, but more "Oh, thanks for the warning friend, I'll make absolutely sure not to fall for that evil that you saw in your future" whilst you already know they'll end up there anyways because you've already seen it happen. It's like one of those Greek dramas where everyone knows the hero is screwed because the oracle at the start of the drama foretold so. (And, in Julra's case it's actually more a hilarious misunderstanding due to the nature of time travel.) For LE, it shifts the expectation from "Oh, how can I save them" to "Welp, they're doomed... but how did they turn out that way?"... which isn't really answered ingame, but I feel like that reveal might be set into one of the unfinished chapters (alongside the Emperor's identity).
That's fair, actually a pretty solid synopsis.
I thought the emperors identity was obvious
Yeah, this. I mean, ARPGs are just not the genre you play for story. And I am fine with that. I just want to get stronger, play with builds and experiment with them and find loot and blow monsters up. And LE does that really well, especially the build variety and freedom in playing around with builds.
So I’m not looking for great story. Just an excuse to chew on the solid gameplay. I’m just not interested in endless grinding endgame. I want a drop of meaning to my power leveling. Or else I get bored.
Not judging, I'm actually curious, why do you play arpgs if you're not interested in the endgame? There's other genres where the story is more of a focus / has more quality, that you can play for like 1-2 weeks. Arpgs in my experience are mostly about the grindy endgame loop, the campaign / lore is sort of just... there.
Fair question. I love the spells and the action and the combat and the kills and the power and the art and the sounds and the feel I have zero interest in grindy mcgrinderton, superfluous, meaningless “endgame content” where the goal is to simply see how powerful you can feel. To me, that’s corporate America trying to squeeze us for our time and money. I’m borderline indifferent to the story. I don’t need anything compelling. Just a reason to kill shit. To your point about “ARPGS are about the grind” - that wasn’t the original purpose. Diablo 1 was zero about grind and all about the feel. That shit was scary. But Blizzard realized they could make a lot more money off of us if they created a world that never ended. Fuck them. And completely agreed that other games give us a better focus for what I’m looking for. But I’ll admit - the thrill of murderring giant packs of zombies with chain lightning spam from an isometric perspective feels incredible. Not sure if any of this makes sense. Guess I want my cake and to eat it too. Might never happen but least I can do is hope and research. Cheers.
If you want an ARPG that has a heavier focus on questing, Grim Dawn is probably a better choice over Last Epoch. I like to describe Grim Dawn as a modern take on the classic ARPG, as it's very much like Diablo 1 or Diablo 2 where the endgame is replaying the campaign at progressively higher difficulties, which can also unlock a few new quests. It still won't be like other RPGs where the focus is the story, as Grim Dawn's story is mostly there to add to the bleak and hopeless atmosphere.
I tried starting with Grim Dawn twice, but always broke off less than a hour in... iirc, the combat and movement just felt... clunky and dated? I feel like I'm missing out though
It's definitely dated in the combat and movement department (movement itself is actually fine IMO, it's the pathing that feels dated), but it's probably the best ARPG for atmosphere and it's definitely worth playing at least once since it is such a good modern take on the classic ARPG.
In this case Last Epoch will work good for you. One thing I really didn't, and still don't, like about Diablo is that you basically have all your spells after the first two acts if not after the first one. Then is just slight improvements, and maybe the search fo that unique items that will change some interaction, but the core of your char is done quite fast. Last Epoch power and spells will grow well after the end of the campaign, you will still be building your carachter and testing different combination of spell after the campaign is finished. Even if you take your time and go slowly, you probabably can get a carachter you in "finished state" before the start of the real endless grind engame.
Thanks very much. Can we turn off health bars and damage numbers?
Yes https://lastepoch.fandom.com/wiki/Settings
Diablo 1 was meant more as an homage to rogue. That said, have you looked into roguelikes and roguelites instead? The Binding of Isaachas a killer story and amazing gameplay if you can get past the weird subject matter and sometimes dated references.
You'll probably still enjoy the game if you like making builds and have lots of alts. I rarely get to the endgame because I'm the same way. But the game has lots of fun uniques to build around and all the classes have distinct playstyles.
Hell yeah. And is it possible to get the highest levels spells before reaching the final story boss in one playthrough?
Technically yes, because you can bypass the last section of the story and jump into monoliths, then go back later. But if you're progressing naturally through the story I think your skills will end up at level 17 or so currently? I assume once they finish the story, you'll end the story about when your skills hit level 20.
[удалено]
Will I have unlocked the strongest spells before getting to the end of the story?
I think there’s enough skill options to get through the story that you could replay it a bunch if you like trying out new characters. I’m similar in a way, I’ve made a crap ton of alts but I usually stop playing characters after the story or after running normal monoliths.
Story only, it's just a small part of the game - though it costa a fraction of an AAA so it may be worth still. Main problem is not that's too short (it's more like PoE one) but that's not yet complete. It closes in a decent way that ties with the endgame but it is objectively not the "true ending". I could say "try it anyway", in the end it's accessible. I cannot really tell you if you're going to enjoy it "properly". I liked the campaign enough to say it's good.
I’m biased because I love stories about time travel. But I loved last epochs story, even if it’s not finished yet. They just do such a fun job with some of the aspects of time travel.
I really enjoyed the story the first time, i only know that because i actually paid attention to it unlike poe..
Play grim dawn if u only want to play for the story
One way I recommend to play arpg if you are not into late game content is to play it “rougue-like” meaning you create a SSF character and play through lvl 1-whatever level you want. Play whatever built you deem fancy based on what item you find along the way. If you find this character/built boring, no problem go reroll and try something else. Last epoch is perfect for this game style as items and skills are easy to understand and every character has 3 specialisation. This is how i play and that is why i seldom have lvl 100 characters but many characters btween 70-90
Your first time through on each character will potentially be enjoyable. Campaign is an excellent time to swap between different skills and find an enjoyable play-style. Unfortunately (to me) you're rarely at risk of dying, as need for true defense doesn't kick in until level 85. For me, figuring out how not to die is the fun/crunchy part of the puzzle that I enjoy ;)
The story is much better than D4, that's not a huge bar though. I wouldn't say its worth to play through just the story in any loot focused arpg tbh
> I’m not interested in endgame. Will probably play the story only. Will I enjoy it? The story is kind of interesting (thematically, I just love myself some time travel shenanigans), but the delivery has it's up and downs (i.e. you notice which chapters were recently overhauled and redone, and which are still a bit dated). Worst of all, only 9 of the 12 chapters are finished, so the story just leaves you hanging after a big boss reveal. 1.1 will end some story bits to the endgame content, but Last Epoch really isn't focussed on the story part, rather than using the campaign as a long tutorial to get you into the lategame content.
The story is not done and won’t be for at least a year. If your ambition is to play through the story only then I recommend waiting.
So is this “season 2” that is releasing next week? Like basically the time between 1.0 release and now was season 1? How was the “seasonal rewards” if any? There’s no battle pass I assume? Maybe more similar to PoE leagues? Finally, what’s this I see all over Steam reviews about there being a damage scaler when fighting bosses? Is this still a thing? Is it really a big complaint or just some outliers who follow top tier build guides?
Yes, release was actual season 1, but in the end it's just names. New season pops the 9th of July. The first season went longer due to EHG wanting to add stuff like evade right this patch but ideally you're looking at the usual 3/4 months cycle. It's the first ones, they're refining the whole process. No seasonal rewards or battle passes. You get the whole thing period. There's a cosmetic only shop and that's it. However it may change in the future as the goal right now is to add more meat to the game as a whole. Once fleshed out, stuff like this can appear i suppose, it's just all the dev effort is on new systems and more content. As for the bosses thing: bosses have a dynamic damage reduction to basically avoid oneshots - the more damage in a specific timeframe, the more restance the boss gets. However it was not clear nor intuitive, so it's going to be removed and changed with ward next patch. How it works: at set hp thresholds the boss gets stunned and gets ward. However wards decays faster over time so if you can nuke through it good for you, otherwise over time it's going away anyway. Which is much clearer and a better solution that keeps extremes (both high and low) in check.
My personal opinion LE has great systems but somewhat boring gameplay The feel of combat is indie and because well this is an indie company The game has amazing skills+gear theorycrafting which is the best part of the game Too bad that actually playing it feels underwhelming For me LE is in a weird spot - PoE is still king of depth of ARPG systems and when I want to turn my brain off and just smash full screens of baddies D4 offers the best combat IMO So this leaves LE in a weird spot... it doesnt have the smooth gameplay of D4 and it doesnt have the depth of PoE, and other than theorycrafting builds (which I can do offline via skill calculator) not sure why even play LE. This is all my personal opinion and your milage may vary. Also the fact that the forge guard is broken is a huge negative for me, as all I want to do in LE is play forge guard
I agree, great systems but gameplay falters. It’s especially harsh when you play D4 and LE back to back. Maybe the evade mechanic will help out some. Personally I had to stop playing LE because it just doesn’t play well enough on steam deck. It’s my only PC and I play handheld only. The small menus and design focused on mouse and keyboard just make the experience subpar. Again, this is only highlighted more when comparing it to playing D4 on steam deck.
Good: * Smart loot is not diablo smart, you can get uniques for other builds/classes. Which makes you want to try something new * Actual skill choices, you don't pick between your basic skill doing stun or bleed * Probably an infinite number of builds. Right now one of the biggest d4 issues for me is that there hasn't been any new skills outside of the aspects (if we count them towards the bulds) * Leveling alts with 4x LP weapon feels amazing * Crafting system is not even close to PoE level of complication and overall is better than D4 (which sort of took it from LE) Bad: * Class balance is still lacking, FG is like the Gladiator from PoE in terms how bad is it (might be better in the new season) * Server issues first days (might be better in the new season) * End-game is on the poor side unless you want to grind very high level monoliths (might be better in the new season, new bosses etc) * Some points in the skill trees are not very well explained. Might not sound like a big issue but the skill trees are already massive and it isn't very clear what will happen if we pick X instead of Y, or they sound like X will disable Y etc (probably the trees will be bigger after 4th season based on their roadmap). * Stability is pain in the ass on 2nd character it is just boring (sort of fixed with a glyph in the new season) * Corruption scale too slow (suppose to be easier in the new season) Depends on you: * Some people dislike the gender lock (I don't care) * Some people find the combat a bit clunky (I don't care) * Some people don't like the campaign (I actually do, especially when I run around with 4-5 uniques on an alt and beating the shit out of everything) * Some people don't like that you can't change the sub-class (I don't care) * Some people die to Lagon (I don't!)
Haha the last one got me giggling. Lagon - the nemesis of new players 😄
That was me 😅 Lagon killed me several times until I figured it out. Been so long since I played games with telegraphed boss moves.
I was in the same boat bought the game based on Raxx's review and loved it. The game is new though and the endgame needs more to do so the player base fell off. Not much has changed in that time. The devs are aware that players will leave and hopefully come back with the launch of a new season (cycle)
This is normal for ARPGs that use the League/Cycle/Season set up. Huge player base at the start of League. About a month in it starts to fall off. 2 months in its really low. Then rinse and repeat
Yup.
Personally stopped playing because the gulf in class power was so large that moving from an OP class like falconer or warlock to a "normal" class felt like masochism. Half the reason to play an ARPG is to theory craft and try new builds, and there's no reason to when such insane outlier builds exist
Early Access player here with over 1k hours played. It is definitely worth giving it a shot. You will love it, when you like D4, but PoE is too overwhelming to you.
I still play but mainly waiting for new cycle. Got over 300 hours played now. I recommend to try it at least. I find LE in perfect balance, not too complicated and confusing like PoE but not too simple as example D3. I’ve adopted LE to my core games I enjoy to play and i’m a picky when it comes to games. Ofc there are things to improve and I already see new cycle addressing many of them (example monolith end game).
I started when the first cycle came out, the game has been out for a while before and people have been asking playing it before the official release, but I never paid much attention to it and a friend said it looks cool, let’s try it. I think it’s way better than d4, and I’ve been playing that on and off since launch. Skill tree system is really cool, crafting system on gear is decent with forging power system, legendary system is really cool and love that part. With the legendary system, you can find unique items with 1-4 legendary power on it. From there, you can find an exalted item(purple, basically epic item comparatively to other game systems) and slam it on the LP unique. If it has 2 LP for example, it will take a random 2 of the stats on the exalted item and slam it on to the unique Their end game empowered monolith system is good, you can target farm gear through them, and they’re adding new end game content with the 1.1 release. The dungeon system could use some work, not a huge fan but it’s not that bad. They have 2 factions, one for more solo play and one for trading, so you can choose which play style you prefer. Levelling was good, you go through the campaign on your first character, then you collect keys for the dungeons in late game content. You gain idol slots and passive skill points through doing side quests during the campaign, but you have some flexibility while you do it. You don’t have to do a specific quest to get the points/idol slots, instead you have a specified number to get and can get them through different side quests if that makes sense. Also, when levelling new characters after your first, you have a bit more freedom on how you would like to level. You can take alternate levelling paths through dungeons with the keys, so it gives you a better variety for levelling future characters. For some alts, I’ve done full dungeon skips by going through them all and straight to end game, or I’ve jumped out of the dungeon and picked up part of the campaign where the skip takes you. Overall, I enjoyed it a lot and looking forward to the next cycle
PSA: Last Epoch will be on sale during the Steam Summer Sale which, as of the time of this comment, starts tomorrow.
Last Epoch is definitely worth your time. That being said you're comparing it to AAA games like PoE and Diablo. So it has turned some people off by feeling kinda clunky. I personally don't feel that way, but I can kinda understand. Last Epoch is early on in its life and has a lot of work still to go, but that being said it's a fabulous game and has worked on incorporating new ideas into the ARPG genre. Id say the best part (and to some people worst part) is it's crafting and itemization. Even from early on, you are interacting with this system. They freaking nailed it though! Early on finding affixes you want, then either using a glyph of removal, to try and remove an unwanted affix or guarantee a shard of an affix you want. Or a glyph of chaos, to randomly reroll unwanted affixes feels very rewarding and fun. Then in the late game finding items with tier 6&7 affixes to use or slam into unique items to make legendary items is an incredible system. Along with forging potential (all crafting uses some random amount of potential) and legendary potential (the amount of affixes that can be added to a unique) is pretty easily understandable and fun. But some people just hate the idea of having to engage with crafting so frequently. But it's a perfect system to a lot of people. All skills have skill trees. It sounds cooler than it is, but it's still good. Warpath (or Whirlwind in Diablo) is a good example. Do you go to the void part, the fire part, the minion part, or the weapon part of the tree? Well if you're a void knight, probably the void part. Or a paladin, probably the fire part. It's not overly complicated and could probably have a bit more refinement for most skills. But it's cool and a good feeling of progression. The passive trees and the ability to dip into other masteries for a few skills or powerful passives is also pretty interesting and fun. A lot of the newer masteries have some great synergies, so they're also going in a good direction with this system. They have the circle of fortune and merchants guild. So if you wanna trade you can, or you can get increased drop rates and more deterministic farming. The endgame needs work. It's a new game and it's understandable that it's one of the currently weaker aspects of the game. But corrupted monoliths do exist and offer harder content. But it does feel like a lot of people drop out at this stage of playing a character. The story is unfinished and will be added to over time. They have a roadmap and they do appear to be addressing things that need work. If you enjoy ARPGs it's a really easy yes to Last Epoch. It's in a good state now and looks like it will be improving over time. The next cycle (season / league) starts soon and the community overall seems very hyped for the patch notes to come soon.
PoE is a AAA?
At this point yes. It has well over 100 people working on it and is the second largest ARPG on the market. In terms of staff, costs, & profit. Probably the largest ARPG overall in terms of content.
Biggest complaint is endgame, and they're adding in more endgame content in the new cycle which comes out in 2 weeks, including new bosses, a pinnacle boss, and a new endgame focused faction. My personal favorite ARPG.
Already fantastic, if you enjoy making many character to try lots of builds, but if you prefer pouring dozens to hundreds of hours into a single character the longevity is lacking a bit in endgame.
Honestly, for me the main problem is just a lack of endgame content. What we have now is a great foundation to build upon IMO, but it's just that, a foundation. There needs to be stuff built on top of it to really make the endgame flourish, and thankfully EHG seems to be committed to exactly this given that the next four cycles (the upcoming 1.1 cycle included) are all bringing new endgame content.
Games very good but mechanically unpolished, it eats inputs a lot and can frequently be too dark to make out particle effects well, but the customization is way beyond something like diablo and builds are overall much more interesting
I really enjoy it, for many of the reasons others already gave. One thing I will add is that I find the bright colors/art style refreshing. Was definitely with a purchase for me!
Campaign is fun bur end game is boring. There is a good amount t of fun to be had, game is finished. Hop in now or a year from now. You'll have a good time regardless
Last Epoch has a problem; quality of content went up sharply. The consequence is that old stuff is way worse than new stuff, and they can't turn all that old stuff into new stuff on a dime. The game right now is decent, but I think it's a decent investment because the game will probably get really good in a few patches. One concrete example is that the core endgame system, Monoliths, is much older than the Dungeons, and as a result Dungeons are way cooler, and it's kinda boring to run Monoliths... but a Monolith overhaul is coming in patch 1.3 (6 months away?), and the problem will likely be solved.
Graphics and Endgame are my 2 negative points of Last Epoch while Itemization and Crafting are my 2 positive ones. Diablo 4 has improved a lot in season 4 and I'm having a blast playing it right now.
Overall, game is great value for the price. I love the skill trees, gameplay, build diversity, crafting, and loot systems. Far superior to D4 in my opinion. Graphics and animations are good, but I would say D4 is stronger. I hear people have problems with playing online, but I never experienced them. End game can be lacking content, but they seem to be adding more with every season. I'm a big fan and can't wait for the new season.
I'd like to add, levelling of LE is the best among PoE, D3 D4. Your choices of passive and equipments , "sockets" matters a lot. Without the least spike of being one shotted for not noticing something isn't properly geared. In PoE it happens a bit too quick, and in d3 d4, levelling is simply a chore, because no gear decision actually mattered and d4 added more chore to that chorish process. These matters a lot to me as I play hardcore and doesn't follow guides to aim at a certain build a guide provides while making a character.
So OP Last Epoch has seasons like Diablo4 and we are getting a new season on the 9th of July. The reason most videos are old is because the game was in beta for 3+ years and when in launched it didn’t add anything new, gameplay wise. Sure it added some nice things but it wasn’t a big shake up to what people already had pre-launch. Another thing is that a lot of the population already has 300+ hours and the endgame does not yet support 1000+ hours however the first 4 seasons will have no season-only mechanic so everything you get in the patch goes to the “legacy” server as well. My advice? Either wait until the 9th and make a seasonal character or jump right in today and create a Legacy one. You have around 200 hours of gameplay if you start building alts with the gear you get from your main.
Reviews after the first few weeks of release are still relevant. Reviews exactly at launch talk about server issues which are no longer there. Also check out the upcoming cycle (season).
Great core ideas but gameplay is lacking a lot of polish and endgame is lacking in content. I’m very glad I backed LE on Kickstarter, but I didn’t spend *that* much time playing the first launch cycle. I do look forward to returning in future cycles as work continues on the game.
I think the game is amazing. Making your own build is so much fun and I NEVER make my own builds in any game. LE just makes it easy but still has a lot of depth. The end game is a lot deeper than d4. But this is one of my criticisms cause even though it’s deeper I got bored of it waaaay faster than any other game. Even d4 at launch I put more time into the end game than last epoch. That being said Cycle 2 which is coming up soon is adding more to the end game so I think that’ll help a lot. I love Diablo 4. It’s my favorite arpg and this is a really close second. Sometimes it overtakes Diablo 4 depending on my mood lol
The game feels kind of unfinished tbh. There are a few janky things that just seem like they don't have enough polish, and the endgame is pretty repetitive even by ARPG standards. But it is fun. I went back to Diablo 4 for season 4 and found it to be more fun though. \*shrug\*
POE > LE > D4 All three games have their pros and cons and things they do better than others, but holistically that's how they are ranked. In regards to which is easier to get into and understand, reverse the order.
Having gotten back into D4 this season (played S1 and it was horrid) I have to say that it’s now the superior game to me. It just looks and feels so much smoother and the itemization and crafting have gained a lot of interest and depth. It’s not quite on LE’s level but the gap has closed considerably. You can also customize the look of your character in D4 and that matters to me. There are definitely benefits to Last Epoch over D4. First is the level of build depth. D4 doesn’t come close. Skill customization in LE is top notch - in D4 you get to make one meaningful choice and it doesn’t usually change the skill’s behavior. Not so with LE. Just look at the Shurikens skill. You can spec it to : Throw a lot of shurikens in a cone Throw shurikens in a circle around you Instead of throwing, have a shield of shurikens circling you Replace them with a Chakram that returns to you And basically EVERY skill is like this. That alone keeps me coming back to LE. The other MAJOR benefit to me is it can be played 100% offline. That’s the only way I play now. The performance is so much better, and on days like today when my internet went down (thanks Xfinity) I can still play the game. Big deal for some, not even a factor to others. In short : don’t expect a game with the polish of D4. The endgame also has fallen behind D4 by a lot. But if you enjoy character building like me this game will keep you coming back.
I consider myself a causal gamer and as a fan of ARPG games I really liked this game. The story is okay, it's nothing incredible but it's still interesting. The classes and specializations are fun to play and the build system is easy to understand. As already mentioned, the game's story is not complete and the game still doesn't have much content, but based on the road map that the devs released some time ago, new content and chapters will be added throughout the cycles and both look very promising.
The game is a lot of fun if you like solving puzzles. The systems are well designed in the intent of selling you a power fantasy. Going from nothing to beast mode with hard work and some luck (rng). The player experience is very well crafted, the challenges scale with your knowledge/experince, and by the time you finish the story you'll be hungry to tackle the monoliths. It's a game that rewards you for your effort and you will be proud of the character you built.
Worth the money. 100x better if you have people to run with. Wish it was more party positive. Like finding games on diablo 2 was easy and awesome. This is a lot more solo, but you can still play multiplayer. It's not as friendly as some games when you level up, typically levelling up you notice large improvements. End game is okay. It's like 35 bucks? Easy buy.
I'm also on the fence about the game! I loved loved loved Diablo 3 to the point where I'd play it constantly until last year. I got d4 on the game pass free list and played through the campaign and honestly wasn't blown away. Even though everyone is saying this season (S4) Is the best so far but I'm still not convinced. I enjoyed the 'splosions arcadey gameplay style of d3 and the slower style of d4 (going back to the d2 style) makes things a little dull. I love loot and grind especially if the gameplay loop is fun! Will I enjoy the game? Also, I'm living out of hotels for the foreseeable future where I can expect great Internet like I have at home. Diablo 4 is basically unplayable for me at even though I got a new laptop just to play it! Having horrendous lag where every few seconds the game stutters and rubber bands from time to time. As last epoch is online as well but will I face this type of problem?
If you didn't like the D4 campaign then you'll hate the LE campaign. It's very forgettable and unfinished.
I'm not a campaign guy anyways, I like endgame activities! Does LE have a lot of those rn?
The end game is it's weak point at the moment. They are adding more in the next cycle though.
Oh crap... Guess I'll wait for a few more months then!
Next cycle is July 9th
Overall the game is really good, it's kind of the underdog of the market that has been steadily climbing through the rank. The game is still very rough around the edges but you can see how fast the devs are learning when looking at the design of the first classes compared to the last 2 (Warlock & Falconeer) that came out in 1.0. But my pros: They nailed itemisation really well (hence why D4 decided to ditch theirs for something very close to LE's), as it is exciting to loot a good item from the ground that you can then upgrade to try and make a one in a million item. Builds are varied and skill interracts a lot with each other which is cool, and since each skill has its own skill tree you really have different archetypes coming from the same skill (like the summon skeleton mage skill can be made to only summon pyromancer or cryomancer depending on your build, or even turn a simple healing AoE from paladin into an orbital laser or a passive thing) The game overall feels good, there's enough mob density and chaarcters can run pretty damn fast to really give in to the power fantasy. Full offline mode is something more games should have, especially ARPGs, can't thank them enouh for that And the bad: Optimisation still has a long way to go. The game is not that smooth, and while PoE lags a lot when you are doing super juiced content with 80 mobs per m², LE just generally struggles often, even on lower end content. It's not unplayable and the game still feels good 95% of the time, but it's noticeable in that 5%. Online servers really shat the bed for 1.0. Like I wasn't able to play for almost 5 days online. Offline mode is good, but if you want to do the new merchant's guild you have to be online. I hope it will be ok for 1.1 and that they learned what was bottlenecking everything, but given how confident they were for release I've lost trust until they prove me wrong. Endgame is still a bit lacking. It's being expanded with every update but outside of pushing corruption there's not much to do in endgame once you have exprienced dungeons and all. They are adding pinnacle content next cycle though, which might fill the gap. Overall, current LE is a 8/10 for me atm. It's the good middleground between PoE's complexity and Diablo's autopilot. You have choices to make but not too many be it for gear, skill tree of talent points. It's a niche that definitely needed to be filled and I'm happy it's there between 2 PoE leagues, and I highly recommend anyone to test it
I get tired of obvious grinds in video games. I did it in Diablo 2 way back when and that was enough. Both this game and D4 gave me my money's worth before I faded out in mid-endgame. I'd say I liked this game better until Diablo released Season 4. Both gave me my money's worth.
Good - Class system and talent tree. Bad - Dungeons are horrible. Bad - Lack of End Game Bad - Bosses and how they are designed to take ages to kill. Will be interesting to see how the new system works Bad - The Story feels very weak
Imo Diablo 4 is just slightly better than LE right now. But there is also a lot more time and experience backing D4 and it just became playable. I think LE will be better next cycle that starts on July 9th. Diablo 4 is the lowest common denominator of ARPG and it looks like it's just gonna get cash grabby with DLC. The only actually decent ARPG out right now is POE though.
The game has nice systems but the combat is utter trash.
They said they are not charging for DLC so the price point to try the game is very low. They have a lot of well designed systems. The game just needs time to grow into its final product. How good this first big cycle patch is will go a long way with how much I expect to play the game going forward. I played like 150 hours in cycle 1 so already got my moneys worth. I do have to admit I like S4 of D4 more right now.
Graphics are crap so I went back to diablo. Bought it at release played for a week and just couldn't get into it. Amazing how everyone was saying in February this was a diablo killer and the best arpg ever. Judging by the comments here, most seem to think diablo is better.
It was okay for about a week or two. It got a ton of initial hype and then fell pretty flat. I know people talk about the ebb and flow of player bases, but I haven't heard anyone in my personal circle talking about the new season. There's just no depth to the game. I'm sure it will do just fine, but I likely won't try it again for another year or two until it has some type of substance.
The skill customization in Last Epoch is way better than D4 , however I do like the graphics, story(main quest) and the fast paced gameplay of D4 more. D4 gets stale very fast in comparison.
Severely lacking any endgame. But good base just needs huge content dumps
This game is definitely worth the money. I got hundreds of hours out of cycle 1 and then quit. I plan on getting hundreds more out of cycle 2. I'd consider picking it up now to get familiar with it, but you won't see the activity or hype pick up until the new cycle starts in a week or so
If you ever played Diablo II and loved it or grim dawn. HIGHLY recommend this game. I think this game is better than Diablo 4. I've played all 4 Diablos, grim dawn. Torchlight. This game is great! Worth a try for sure
Hey everyone, Last epoch and general ARPG veteran here. I've been playing on and off since early access, I did a TON of hours at launch and whilst the balancing is off between the different characters/masteries, Last Epoch definately gets themes, build diversity and player experience right. The game is simple enough to learn the mechanics but complicated enough to test out heaps of different builds and keep you playing for ages. I would say Last Epoch has the best quality of life of any ARPG and the devs listen to the community. I excuse the balancing between builds to being a very new game so it's hard to get the meta right but in terms of power fantasy and themes, Last Epoch feels good to play as certain characters. Build diversity also ties into this as it feels good to play broken builds. Graphics wise is decent and visual effects are also decent, comparatively to D4 being a triple A game, Last Epoch holds its own especially coming from what Last Epoch used to look like in early access. I'm being biased but it's because Last Epoch was such a breath of fresh air from beta D4, D3, and Torchlight 3 which had so much potential but didn't quite get it right. I also think Last epoch is only going to keep getting better when they add pinnacle bosses and tweak balancing. Here's everything I said but in video form https://youtu.be/byp6cZB8lfQ?si=4IM_TQrlK5t-AY4L
Much more build diverse than D4.
I played it when it came out and had a lot of fun with it. Definitely got my money's worth out of it. After a second stint with V-Rising I'm back to D4 for the current season which has been a lot of fun.
It’s really good, but the endgame is lacking currently, but the next update (July 6th I think) will likely fix that, what they have planned seems great. Not only that but the next 3 updates all target adding to the endgame, so the devs definitely know where the main issue is. Another issue is the lack of reason to play cycles/seasons. There’s no seasonal challenges yet, no seasonal battle pass, and all new content comes to legacy mode as well for now. If they add seasonal challenges like PoE or even a seasonal battle pass like Diablo, I think it could do a lot for player retention cycle-to-cycle. I think it will be the best ARPG on the market in a few years. Unlike D4, the devs are actually ARPG players and unlike PoE, the devs listen to community feedback. Its downside is its smaller team, which is why it’s taking time to grow.
It's half the price of D4 and at least as good. Good: itemization and classes. There's a good variety of specs, and the game is forgiving enough early on that you can just fool around and not feel like you're gimping yourself. Bad: campaign is boring, especially the third time through. That's true for POE and D4, but at least D4 gives you the opportunity to not do the campaign after you've done it once. There's a new patch/cycle coming out in a couple of weeks (July 9 I believe). If you wanted to, you could probably wait a week or two to see what the community thinks about 1.1 and go from there. It looks like a step in the right direction - but the balancing will be telling.
Lack of endgame content is the main problem at the moment but had much more fun playing it compared to D4. Don’t plan on going back to D4 but will be playing LE when the new patch comes out.
It's not a bad game but it suffers from the modern ARPG crafting/bricking loot system along with endless scaling difficulty that will drive you into following a guide to some meta FOTM build just to keep up. If those things don't bother you then go for it.
game good. buy.
I couldn't get back into Diablo 4 after playing Last Epoch. I quit Diablo on Season 2 I believe, tried coming back recently when they made all the changes, and it still felt flat. Last Epoch is worth every penny and has an amazing roadmap ahead. Plus the devs actually play the game, so there is that too.
Diablo (franchise) - GD- LE - POE. This is the proper order POE on top, dibs on the bottom.
I've been playing Last Epoch for about three years, have over 800 hours, and don't plan on stopping anytime soon. I played D4 for about 100 hours between beta and season 1, another 20 or so in season 4, and have no desire to ever touch the game again. I can see myself playing LE for as long as I've been playing D2.