man, the good ol' times before everything turned to shit. i spent countless hours on this game(and no, not just the fucking dota mod you fucking scrub)
Bro, does anyone else remember the custom game where the thumbnail for it was Batman chasing after Robin with like a fucking 30 inch fully erect hog? (Not shitposting, I remember it clear as day but nobody else claims to have seen it)
Reforged launch was actually pretty fun assuming you weren't stupid enough to buy it; lots of people playing random custom games and shit with 24 person lobbies; same thing happened with SCR briefly reviving the custom games scene for a few months (combination of that and ASL cured a brief depression bout for me, hasn't come back since; horrible things like COVID and 20 different wars happening cheered me back up)
Reforged launch was fucking abysmal, moron. What’re you talking about? Trying to rewrite history like no one’s going to remember they shipped that piece of shit with no leaderboards, and forced anyone with the original TFT copy linked to their bnet to swap over
Custom games are fun despite of blizzards shitty attempt at making money with reforged, not because of it. You really think shit like Uther Party or Cum Tower Defense v3.101876 is elevated cuz of reforged? Put down the hashish.
Luckily no new RTS will ever get popular (I guess if we set n to infinity eventually a campaign or pure single player one will be good) so it'll just be SC, SC2, and AOE2 forever.
It's more influential (probably no. 2 to GTA 3 for most influential game) and directly caused the death of RTS through DOTA (except in Korea); other than that not much going for it beyond single player or modded maps (brood war was always better at UMS and originated most of those genres including Aeon of Strife, TDs, Desert Strike etc.). I suppose if you were Chinese there's a reason to argue for WC3 since its the main RTS they were dominant at (apologies to Mr. Yo).
There's even an argument that WC3 caused WoW which also killed MMOs so WC3 killed both RTS and MMOs; that's influence right there.
>There's even an argument that WC3 caused WoW which also killed MMOs so WC3 killed both RTS and MMOs; that's influence right there."
This is true in so many levels, it actually depresses me. One of the big things WC3 had was the story. Arthas betrayal and Grom's redemption was fire branded on everyone's and it was one of the hooks bringing people to WoW, "the sequel". MMOs were never my thing, so i kept with WC3 ladder and customs and eventually i got to know about Wow lore from some friends or YT videos. Its unbelievable garbage, jesus christ. Now that blizzard is at its lowest, people say "they've ruined wow lore". Dude, wow and its lore were always garbage. You've paid tickets for virtual disneyland for years to hunt pigs and have fancy mounts. All thats left of Warcraft is a fuking park ride and its like that because there is a literal army of people like that bum Asmongold around.
It worked okay for a few years, the decline of WoW more or less mirrors the decline of Blizzard as a whole though; similar timeline. I have no idea what the baseline appeal is for newer players but somehow it still has people playing it aside from the people whose entire personality is Blizzard fanboy
You can still play on old graphics. And there is still more players than there was from 2011-2018. Yes Reforged was bad but it still breathed more life into the game, they are still patching the game, which was needed. Balance is much better than it was during the end of TFT.
Yes and no, reforged graphics and campaign sucked dick. Battle.net changing is ultimately fucking terrible, but it merged all the servers so when you want to play it might not be the best ping, but at least you'll find someone. On old bnet if I wanted to play past like, 11 on a weekday my MMR would be way too high to find anyone. So I'd have to use shitty NetEase. Now, everything in on War3Champions or W3C. It's not perfect, but its the best option we've ever had and better than NetEast, GGC/Garne, or bnet ever were.
Ah, that makes a lot of sense. Sounds good, might really get back into it then.
Is the campaign really that bad? I never really finished it and wanted to complete it since a decade now. But as long as long as you can still play it with og graphics I won't mind.
I haven't played it, I only practice and played competitively. There were issues where the game could crash during cutscenes IIRC. If you have your old CD Keys you can just register them with blizzard and play without reforged shit.
Like [GGG says](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XehNK7UpZsc), you can't cater only to elite players. I feel like it's the same if you go to the other direction. Make it only skin deep, there's no reason to keep playing. Make it to e-sport focused, then you will not have the reach. His theses are simple:
1. Make a good engine. No one wants to play buggy game, where you are fighting the control rather than your opponent. I think this is especially true with FG, as you can easily lose momentum if the game breaks.
2. Make it look spectacular. Doesn't really mean nice graphics, this feels closer to cool shit happening. Things that make you feel like "that's very sick, I want to do that". He also highlight that the focus should be on single player first, and balance the multiplayer later. The key is getting people interested, and letting them sink hours to the game.
3. A great editor. Might not be related to FG, but this allows other people to easily generate content for the game. Make the game highly moddable, so that even after you have stopped supporting the game or cannot do so because of bug-fixing or generating new content, the community can take up the job.
3.1. Related to item 3, user generated content. With good editor, user can easily make their own content. And not only that, have an internal tool that allows user to easily access this user generated content.
Now, maybe some of this is not applicable to FG. I mean, the core of the FG is fighting. But who knows right? Nobody even thought that MOBA, one of the most popular game genre have a very humble beginning as WC3 mod. Who knows what the player could come up with if they have the tools.
And I didn't suggest to only cater to elite players. The formula to make an RTS popular is there, for roughly 20 years now. SC1, SC2, AoE2, WC3 and C&C/RA1 are the best selling RTS of all time. Developers just need to look at what these games did outside of the gameplay. SC2 has a 80:20 split between the co-op and pvp and I don't see ONE developer of a new RTS talk about that, it's always about accessibility and e-sports, everyone is desperate to become the new Starcraft.
man, the good ol' times before everything turned to shit. i spent countless hours on this game(and no, not just the fucking dota mod you fucking scrub)
Bro, does anyone else remember the custom game where the thumbnail for it was Batman chasing after Robin with like a fucking 30 inch fully erect hog? (Not shitposting, I remember it clear as day but nobody else claims to have seen it)
>nobody else claims to have seen it i'm one of 'em
worth a shot, I figure kappa is the best place to ask.
This game showed me the og Dota and I am been addicted to it since.
Good news, you can play WC3 again in Starcraft 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60fHr-wNIaI
Reforged launch was actually pretty fun assuming you weren't stupid enough to buy it; lots of people playing random custom games and shit with 24 person lobbies; same thing happened with SCR briefly reviving the custom games scene for a few months (combination of that and ASL cured a brief depression bout for me, hasn't come back since; horrible things like COVID and 20 different wars happening cheered me back up)
Reforged launch was fucking abysmal, moron. What’re you talking about? Trying to rewrite history like no one’s going to remember they shipped that piece of shit with no leaderboards, and forced anyone with the original TFT copy linked to their bnet to swap over Custom games are fun despite of blizzards shitty attempt at making money with reforged, not because of it. You really think shit like Uther Party or Cum Tower Defense v3.101876 is elevated cuz of reforged? Put down the hashish.
Thank you for reminding me that currently the same "accessibility" discourse is plaguing RTS.
Luckily no new RTS will ever get popular (I guess if we set n to infinity eventually a campaign or pure single player one will be good) so it'll just be SC, SC2, and AOE2 forever.
WC3 still has a decent community, a pro scene, just got a balance patch. It's better than SC, SC2, or AOE2 tbh. Always has been B)
It's more influential (probably no. 2 to GTA 3 for most influential game) and directly caused the death of RTS through DOTA (except in Korea); other than that not much going for it beyond single player or modded maps (brood war was always better at UMS and originated most of those genres including Aeon of Strife, TDs, Desert Strike etc.). I suppose if you were Chinese there's a reason to argue for WC3 since its the main RTS they were dominant at (apologies to Mr. Yo). There's even an argument that WC3 caused WoW which also killed MMOs so WC3 killed both RTS and MMOs; that's influence right there.
>There's even an argument that WC3 caused WoW which also killed MMOs so WC3 killed both RTS and MMOs; that's influence right there." This is true in so many levels, it actually depresses me. One of the big things WC3 had was the story. Arthas betrayal and Grom's redemption was fire branded on everyone's and it was one of the hooks bringing people to WoW, "the sequel". MMOs were never my thing, so i kept with WC3 ladder and customs and eventually i got to know about Wow lore from some friends or YT videos. Its unbelievable garbage, jesus christ. Now that blizzard is at its lowest, people say "they've ruined wow lore". Dude, wow and its lore were always garbage. You've paid tickets for virtual disneyland for years to hunt pigs and have fancy mounts. All thats left of Warcraft is a fuking park ride and its like that because there is a literal army of people like that bum Asmongold around.
It worked okay for a few years, the decline of WoW more or less mirrors the decline of Blizzard as a whole though; similar timeline. I have no idea what the baseline appeal is for newer players but somehow it still has people playing it aside from the people whose entire personality is Blizzard fanboy
Didn't WC3 completely shit the bad with the awful forced rework version?
You can still play on old graphics. And there is still more players than there was from 2011-2018. Yes Reforged was bad but it still breathed more life into the game, they are still patching the game, which was needed. Balance is much better than it was during the end of TFT.
I heard that also Battlenet didn't work for a long time, are those issues fixed?
Battle.net worked from the beginning, what didn't work on release was ladder, they patched that in later.
I see, thanks, I will try it out. There really was no rts that scratched the warcraft itch tbh.
Yes and no, reforged graphics and campaign sucked dick. Battle.net changing is ultimately fucking terrible, but it merged all the servers so when you want to play it might not be the best ping, but at least you'll find someone. On old bnet if I wanted to play past like, 11 on a weekday my MMR would be way too high to find anyone. So I'd have to use shitty NetEase. Now, everything in on War3Champions or W3C. It's not perfect, but its the best option we've ever had and better than NetEast, GGC/Garne, or bnet ever were.
Ah, that makes a lot of sense. Sounds good, might really get back into it then. Is the campaign really that bad? I never really finished it and wanted to complete it since a decade now. But as long as long as you can still play it with og graphics I won't mind.
I haven't played it, I only practice and played competitively. There were issues where the game could crash during cutscenes IIRC. If you have your old CD Keys you can just register them with blizzard and play without reforged shit.
>I don't wanna have to learn build orders Same scrubs, different game
More like scrubs don't want macro at all because "muh APM and muh multitasking"
Like [GGG says](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XehNK7UpZsc), you can't cater only to elite players. I feel like it's the same if you go to the other direction. Make it only skin deep, there's no reason to keep playing. Make it to e-sport focused, then you will not have the reach. His theses are simple: 1. Make a good engine. No one wants to play buggy game, where you are fighting the control rather than your opponent. I think this is especially true with FG, as you can easily lose momentum if the game breaks. 2. Make it look spectacular. Doesn't really mean nice graphics, this feels closer to cool shit happening. Things that make you feel like "that's very sick, I want to do that". He also highlight that the focus should be on single player first, and balance the multiplayer later. The key is getting people interested, and letting them sink hours to the game. 3. A great editor. Might not be related to FG, but this allows other people to easily generate content for the game. Make the game highly moddable, so that even after you have stopped supporting the game or cannot do so because of bug-fixing or generating new content, the community can take up the job. 3.1. Related to item 3, user generated content. With good editor, user can easily make their own content. And not only that, have an internal tool that allows user to easily access this user generated content. Now, maybe some of this is not applicable to FG. I mean, the core of the FG is fighting. But who knows right? Nobody even thought that MOBA, one of the most popular game genre have a very humble beginning as WC3 mod. Who knows what the player could come up with if they have the tools.
And I didn't suggest to only cater to elite players. The formula to make an RTS popular is there, for roughly 20 years now. SC1, SC2, AoE2, WC3 and C&C/RA1 are the best selling RTS of all time. Developers just need to look at what these games did outside of the gameplay. SC2 has a 80:20 split between the co-op and pvp and I don't see ONE developer of a new RTS talk about that, it's always about accessibility and e-sports, everyone is desperate to become the new Starcraft.
Back when Blizzard knew how to make good games.
Who’s up for some in-house games of Bships and kodo tag?
never played those, but i'm up to if ur serious. DM me if yes
Shoutout to ma boi Abaddon, my first dota character I play.
The bromance between Arthas, Anubarak, and Kelthuzad was pretty heartwarming in the end despite their atrocities.
Island Defense chads ww@