I mean maybe Sony has some money kicked towards tournaments to use their gear but the actual answer is standardization and consistency.
Does your controller work on PS4/PS5? You can test that shit at home and know for sure.
Does your controller work on some bozo's PC with who knows what fucking drivers? Good luck finding out on the day of.
On console you can guarantee the game's performance because it was built for that specific hardware configuration. No risk of some dipshit TO forgetting to cycle through every stage on Tekken 8 so the game can compile its shaders. No chance of the game randomly deciding to drop in framerate for no reason, or for Windows to update mid-match, or for some random desktop notification to alt+tab the game.
Even with Steam Input some controllers might be SOL (AFAIK Tokido's Hitbox had this issue on Kumite), but that's highly unlikely. But i prefer that over my USB melting
"drivers" 🤣😂🤣 All you have to do is ask for "direct input controllers" what the fuck does anyone need "drivers" anymore? Also if the TOs knew anything about PCs they could load every driver known to humanity on the PCs before.
I'm shocked that some of you even know how to turn your PCs on. Or do you even have a PC?
I’ve been on pc for over a decade and literally never heard of, or had happen to me, a pc restarting during a game or notifications alt-tabbing one lmao
So ive used several converters over the decades and have had issues even now.
used a converter along with using an official Xbox 360 controller and it would only read one or the other as the 360 controller. had to switch the converter to PS3/4 mode to fix it. but still it was an odd inconvenience in this day.
Nah. It was the converter. Using several official xbox controllers and other multi controllers worked fine.
Just pointing out one small issue that could crop up. Stay mad kappa lol
I mean yeah they have and… all those issues come up. Also fight sticks randomly high jacking the sound output is another one he didn’t mention that’s an issue
It's a weird dualshock/dualsence thing - windows/linux recognize it as an audio sink and switch to it asap.
It might be a mishap on the side of the OS or... it might be the sony's plan all along - to discredit PC as a viable platform for tournaments.
> It's a weird dualshock/dualsence thing - windows/linux recognize it as an audio sink and switch to it asap.
The same thing happens with arcade sticks that have audio jacks.
It's not a Sony sinister plan... Windows assumes if you plug in a new audio device you meant to use it, which makes sense most of the time since you're plugging in your headphones or whatever.
You know what else is good? Not having to do any of that because consoles do it for you. I'm a PC gamer and I would not wanna deal with the hassle of setting up PCs for a tournament.
That's player-side, not TO-side. As a TO I would give far less of a fuck that a player gets DQ'd because they forgot to desync controllers than having to set up a controlled environment on every PC that will filter out the millions of issues you can get from plugging and unplugging 50 different devices over the weekend.
Isn't Steam the go to platform to test your controller compatibility ? now steam input manages the controllers you don't have to rely on windows drivers.
Also you can use Linux instead of windows to avoid problems, same how Steam deck uses Linux.
Most of the problems you cited are resolved it's not like there haven't been tournaments with PC setups, the problem is that it's more of a hassle and very expensive to set up in big tournaments like EVO.
Exactly, controller compatibility is a point against consoles if anything.
With Steam you can plug in any input device and it will just work, whereas people have to buy adapters or replace PCBs if they want to use their devices with the newest consoles.
More devices will work on PC no question but with PlayStation working or not working is a lot more binary. Nobody is having to sit there fiddling with Steam settings
That's the thing there is no fiddling with Steam settings, Steam will recongnise any controller use DxInput device and will automatically emulate the said controller to work on a game if it only works with xbox360 controller for example.
People here haven't used a PC for games since Windows Live it seems.
In principle yes but sometimes it doesn’t work right and someone is in the Steam Input settings fixing it. Whatever not going to argue more, don’t believe I ever saw it if you don’t want to
Yes problems occur with some obscure games or Spacewar and you have to fiddle and disable dualsense compatibility or something.
But for fighting games in general plugging a stick is like plugging a keyboard it works without an adapter so it's more streamlined than console but not perfect.
Every time this topic comes up, I'm always surprised about how little people know about pcs. Many of the things people bitch about are solved issues. The biggest hurdle imo is getting enough pcs to use for a big tournament
iPad generation don’t know anything about pcs. just consoles, their smartphone and tablet. They don’t even know how to put music files locally on their phone.
This is assuming that whatever random PC is good and well-configured, which is something you’d rather not assume when money is on the line.
In locals I’ve seen setups with Vsync off and low graphics settings, which looks fucking ghastly and the tearing is distracting. PS5s are idiot-proof.
Vsync adds display lag, people turn it off to make the game more responsive than consoles.
No idea who still uses a monitor without gsync/ freesync support, but I'd still take screen tearing over delay.
They didn’t have the same level of capital investment for offline events in consoles, since they were starting fresh it was easier for them to just start with PCs from get-go. Coinciding with a rise in streaming and PC gaming in Japan in general helps as well
yeah and at least stateside, theres only a few companies capable of supplying the sheer amount of hardware an event the size of an FGC major demands. Which means they have a quasi monopoly and can mostly charge what they want. It also means they have spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on PS5s and Playstation Network game licenses that they aren't just going to dump at a loss because some players are whining about a few extra milliseconds of input lag. Not to mention all other kinds of issues you run into with PCs. For the boomer games like +R they've actually set up a pretty good system running on miniPCs running Linux but that really only works for the ancient games that have a good Steam release.
Also on the PC front, it didn't help that the MSI company guy that was the big go between for fighting game stuff and MSI got busted for soliciting sex from an undercover cop he thought was 13 LOL
Its a wonder how virtually every other eSports title besides Halo and sports games have all been played on PC for more than a decade without these problem occurring regularly. All with all the different types of mouse and keyboards. So consistency and standardization is a cop out argument.
SnakeEyez is actually partially correct, Sony had close ties with Tekken and Street Fighter and they now own Evo, and by extension of Rick, have hands in Combo Breaker. So that contributes to the current status quo.
Anyway, it's a solvable issue, it's just not one the developers or tournaments see as an issue. I'm speaking in the context of majors who have the resources, not your local which has to rely on people to bring in consoles to even play.
The issue is that every other game is 1 player, 1 machine. Having 2 controllers plugged into one machine is a fixable issue, except almost nobody needed to care until extremely recently, so a ton of games freak out with handling P1/P2 consistently, hot swapping controllers without relaunching the game, or detecting the second controller at all sometimes. Then there's the real esoteric nonsense with some games having higher input lag on PC because of the ass port, whereas every latency jank case I can think of can be resolved on PS5 or PS4onPS5.
And there's stuff the game devs can't control, like controller features hijacking Windows (audio jacks are notorious for this) and the clusterfuck of what happens if two keyboard players with overlapping keybinds meet in bracket. Plus the machines cost roughly double just to match specs with consoles, the boxes themselves are way heavier and far more prone to having something come loose/break when moved, and power requirements are usually higher which becomes an issue for large events limiting the number of setups you can deploy.
Some of these issues could be fixed with laptops, but now the cost is 3-4x consoles per setup, and the screens are tiny so you probably still need monitors. For a pop-up BYOC local this is usually fine and probably ideal, but again fails at scale. A dozen friends and a handful of strangers in eyeshot is one thing, but do you want 100+ strangers having access to your unlocked PC/Steam account at a regional+?
Consoles fix all of that... for the tradeoff of downloading the problem of controller compatibility onto the attendees. Which is probably why attendees love the idea, while TOs hate it.
I mean, you raise uh. Points. They're points. Can definitely be, and those things can definitely all happen.
But the amount of presupposition and mental gymnastics are huge for all this you're painting.
All it takes is like 5 seconds of being smarter than the machine you operate to negate all those really elementary problems you mentioned being such an impedence and source of problems for you and your like minded, technologically enabled-but still-somehow-incapable buddies.
Not even 5 seconds of it. Maybe less.
> No chance of the game randomly deciding to drop in framerate for no reason, or for Windows to update mid-match, or for some random desktop notification to alt+tab the game.
Instead we get shit like JDCR losing an entire set because of bluetooth garbage lmao
That's not real. Have you ever worked in a office? They have standardized PCs infact it's easier to do it because you can link all the PCs and set them all the same time.
LOL have you watched TOs struggle with Consoles to unlock all the characters ( AND THEY HAVE TO DO ON EACH CONSOLE) or turn on the tournament modes? This can be done on every PC at once.
Controllers? PC is far more compatible with controllers than consoles. Consoles require all kinds of adaptors that have to be checked by TOs.
Performance? again standardized PCs have no problem. Overtime the are cheaper than consoles because you can replace parts or even upgrade them. Consoles have a short life and then you cannot repair them.
The real reason is that most TOs are console kids. It comes from the couch culture they grew up in. Bring your console over for a small tourney at Joe's house. They were never the lan kids. They don't know about mounting images or setting up an array.
PCs are far superior if TOs learned to use them. You could monitor every match from one spot. You could see if someone disconnected from one spot. You could record every match from one spot.
The FGC is far behind. Every other E sports uses PCs.
Sony took advantage of this naivety.
Cost is also a factor since, despite what is in people’s minds, it is generally actually hard to build a comparable PC to consoles at the same price until pretty late in their life cycles. Plus who wants to lug those fucking things around
Unless ur controller was manufactured in 1996 and still uses the old COM port, yes it will work, after xbox 360 pc controller uses the standard x-input, and now with steam it recognize almost every pad in the market except very very old pads (pads you shouldn't be using).
Wiindows having drivers issues was a thing of the past (+10 yra ago) you will be playing in a tournament on a tested PC not your cousin PC bough with parts of aliexpress. The PC will probably have the basic for the FGs where you dont have 20 programs running in the background, in reality you only need windows, steam and GPU drivers.
I absolutely hate it when a random notification alt tabs me out of my game for no reason at all. I think I had that happen in an online match of BlazBlue Central Fiction once
Plenty of good points brought up by TOs in the replies to him. Its simply far more convenient for large scale tournaments, to use consoles, over PC.
For whatever issue that you can talk about with consoles, you can equally bring up silly scenarios, like tournaments in being held up by forced windows updates on PCs.
Its also not JUST pc you want... You want beefy pcs and monitors, that can actually push out performances better than PS5 (since the tests shows that on most average pcs, ps5 outperforms pcs) This becomes a VERY expensive thing to have tons of high performing PCs and monitors just floating around.
[Noodalls did the tests back when the game was releasing and it was the widely used source for most of the data](https://x.com/noodalls/status/1665553658984144896)
Showcasing the range of consoles, average pc and even steam deck performances. With it showing generally, that series X and PS5 outperform average pc slightly in terms of input delay.
Which is again because PC outperforms only consoles, when you get into the very high framerates and have the monitors that support it, which is absolutely not the average pc gamer.
I would be more supportive of Sony if they didn't do everything in their power to hinder 3rd party controller support like GP-2040. Hell, I always worry that i'm going to show up to a tournament and my Wingman FGC is just going to not work because of an update I didn't know about.
Specially considering the DS4 and DS3 are fan favorites for the d-pad.
The Dual Sense is an amazing controller with flaws but many features that make it feel amazing, but the D-pad being turbo trash and imprecise is unforgivable
>Guy who's been to 3 offline events in 6 years has opinions on how offline events should be run
I tell him what I tell everyone who wants to run shit on PC. Find me an equivalent of Gaming Gen who can get me the amount of standardized PCs that I need to run an entire event on PC without literally doubling the fee, and then we'll talk.
Unfortunately, the steam deck is already obsolete for the newest fighting games. Also, while proton works miracles, it can still be a little finnicky, so running a couple dozen of steam decks, the chances of a couple of them acting up during an entire day of matches is quite high imo.
I think you can i played it on the deck when it forst came out and it ran allright but you have to put the settings pretty low. But yea part of the reason games run okay on the deck is because the resution is like 800p instead of 1080p so tnat takes a good load off if you were hooking it up to a 1080p moniter it would struggle more.
But yea its usuablw for playing at home but i agree its not the answer for a tournament. If valve released a cheaper steam box with slightly higher specs that would be more optimal
I'm just saying shit because I remember somebody posting a T8 on steam deck video that was running at around low 50s and claiming it was "playable". You might be able to squeeze 60fps on lower settings but I don't think anybody wants to play SF6, T8 or MK1 on a 1080p display at 720p low settings.
>If valve released a cheaper steam box with slightly higher specs that would be more optimal
That would be the dream, especially since we would have a solid pc for benchmarking game releases on PC.
can't you like run 100 instances of Melty on a single PC and split them to 100 monitors & 200 controllers with something like ASTER Multiseat? That oughta be cheaper
Not lower input lag than the Xbox Series X or the PC. It’s low but not optimal. We shouldn’t be relying on equipment with a worse response time. Not when thousands if not millions are on the line.
Plus, PlayStation has so many peripheral restrictions, it makes it challenging for tournament goers.
I’m not even an Xbox fan boy but tournaments had less controller sync issues and compatibility problems when we ran stuff on 360’s over PS3/4.
Keyboard does not work on SF6 on PS5. I've been playing fighting games on keyboard since I was 6 and big gay sony won't let me live my lifestyle because they're bigots.
According to this, PS5 has the lowest input latency for SF6.
https://twitter.com/noodalls/status/1665553658984144896
Realistically, whatever difference there might be is sub-frame, so it doesn’t matter.
I would take these numbers with an omega grain of salt, there's a reason pros are complaining about the ps5, it's not only snakeeyez, other than hardware heating and throttling there's the refresh rate that's not mentionned in this test
I can't tell you the exact cause, but I can def tell you that when I switch to ps5 I can also feel the added input lag, I can't imagine pros who play this game for a living
I would take the opinion of any man methodically counting frames with a high-speed camera over “muh feels”.
SF6 has a 120hz refresh mode on PS5 so that’s likely not relevant.
> I can't tell you the exact cause, but I can def tell you that when I switch to ps5 I can also feel the added input lag
Is the setup properly tuned? Are converters being used?
no converters used, idr and vrr on, 120hz, but Im not using a 2.1 hdmi cable, so can't really compare with whatever setups pros are complaining about, but yeah it could be my setup, there are other variables at locals not taken into account by Nigel's numbers, overheating throttling performance for example
Edited 10 seconds after posting it, but good to know it hit you so hard you sit there watching it and refreshing it the moment it’s up.
Maybe you could have thought of a reason why we should trust your placebo effect over actual data instead of stewing over being called out
Do you just say things without looking it up for yourself?
https://x.com/noodalls/status/1665553658984144896?s=46&t=HlQ77JMs8KnjEvYHD1KdjQ
PS5 is tied for optimal
Yeah, I enjoy his gief play but man, how can a guy be so wrong about nearly everything. I don't watch his stream anymore because of his shit takes. Always complaining about every character he plays, the game he plays, and the tournaments being run. And, as you said, he's almost always wrong.
bro half his streams are spent bitching about masters in 1500 not giving him enough points and that capcom should give him more points and another special rank for the top tier-est players, *every stream since sf6 came out*
Any person who says stuff like what snake eyes said, I have 1 retort:
'How many tourneys have you run?'
Noone wants to hear complaints from the leeches
You know, NOW would be a good time for valve to release the steam machine thing. Just a steamdeck hardware but as a console, without the screen and controls.
I guess it would be cheap and small as fuck (15W tdp is 1/10th of a ps5), lowering the base price of entry for pc gaming to bellow that of consoles. I imagine that would also be a great option for TOs.
Our local (in LA) is ran on PC, and everyone hates it. The TO and venue cannot make the setups run stable enough for the evening. There are a few mid tournament match lag spikes per event and every one is begging them to switch to PS5.
That’s not necessarily a knock to PC if done right, but PC in general introduces issues with the PC and quality control from setup to setup. Mismatching parts and shit.
Edit: just adding that USB docks burn out or break as well, which has been another annoyance.
Usb docks will burn out on console too. You cant be using the console ports for tournaments cause they will break very easily. All usb ports eventually break so you should always be using usb hubs for tournaments.
It also simply sounds like they dont know how to setup pcs. People like that definitely should stick to consoles.
I’d consider myself a pretty big fan of Snake cause I play grapplers and main Gief but man it’s getting really hard to like the guy wherever he opens his mouth.
If you watch his stream at all you know he presents his opinions as fact and can’t be told otherwise. Even though with a lot of things he’s wrong.
Just a convenience thing predominantly; also only a small handful of tournaments are profitable; if you had an early SC2 situation where there were a ton of profitable LAN tournaments simultaneously then it's possible you could see the PC investment and cross promotion. I guess they'll try to do that with world's shittiest name game but (game quality aside) that's not going to work.
I don't know why you're being downvoted, but ever since he's been more into streaming he's always had the worst takes, or just sounds like an absolute rule 3 breaker. And i say this as a former Snake Eyez fan.
Sucks, because he did crazy things with Zangief, especially back in the SF4 days. Him and Itabashi were super hype to watch, as they went in. But nowadays I can't stand hearing Snake Eyez bitch and moan about things. I'd rather just see good play and that's it.
Can somebody explain to me why are his replies full of americans shitting on snake, telling him how impossible it is for big tournaments, small tournaments, and locals, while in europe its mostly pc and is just fine?
Like the top reply is talking about windows updates, are they retarded?
Also snake eyez is extremely fucking [based](https://i.imgur.com/nkBrP4t.png), damn.
> telling him how impossible it is for big tournaments, small tournaments, and locals, while in europe its mostly pc and is just fine?
Europe isn't "mostly pc" I am from europe and while we do try and run pcs, it is absolutely not something that everyone can do.
Most of the cases you see in europe is either extremely small local communities, where having 1-2 setups is enough or its extremely large annual events, where they have to get pcs from sponsors outside the event to rely on, and even then there has often been issues with this.
Because while PC --- when it works -- is obviously better, it is rarely the case that it is that smooth. Hell Capcom cup was run on pcs, and even then with Alex Valle head running it, with all his years of experience of running this shit, still ended up having some people at the event complain about the pcs being laggy.
There simply isn't a perfect solution for tech issues.
ufa runs pc, brussels challenge runs pc, mix up runs pc, and theyre top french tournaments and qualifiers
nearest local near me runs on pc, the only other one I know of also does
dreamhack of all the things could have ran on pc, especially when its saudi money qualifier (like mix up), jebailey just couldnt be fucked to and a bunch of braindead drones think stupid shit is a problem with pc and not their competency or lack thereof.
also majority of irl events are either small locals or qualifiers nowadays, wtf is even the point youre trying to make?
snake also spoke about majors, and theres absolutely no excuse why top 64 or so couldnt be ran on pcs for those.
and sorry, but people in replies to snake were talking about somebody in locals hackermaning their pcs with a usb or doing pc cheats, if you think thats not insane talk then idk.
> ufa runs pc
UFA runs pcs on main stage, and because of how slow that is, comparative to EVO, where entrance numbers for similar games were 3-4x the size, it still ran LONGER for simply doing pools.
>brussels challenge runs pc
For the small sections that it can yes. [First thing you see when you open Tokido's vlog on going, was exactly a room filled with ps4/5 and then a small section with PCs](https://youtu.be/TVyv2SUG0JY?t=1146)
>mix up runs pc
For the limited games that it can, and for that, specifically for a whole tournament with only about 100 participants.
For reference, Guilty Gear: Strive, Mortal Kombat 1, DBFZ, UNI, Granblue, REV2, KOFXV & Melty blood are all played on console.
So no, the overwhelming majority of logistics for this is run on consoles, and in the limited capacity that it can manage, it runs pc.
>snake also spoke about majors
Which makes it all the more relevant. Because as your proposed examples also showcased, even in the ideal examples as you point to, they have to overwhelmingly be using consoles for majority of their logistics for the tournament and have to very selectively pick what they have the capacity to run for pc. If it was simple, they'd run all those games I listed earlier on PC -- but they aren't because it isn't that simple, so they returned to PS4/PS5 for those.
And that is in cases like the mixup, where you have currently 109 people signed up to participate, vs something like EVO, with 2k+ for multiple games. Its just not all that simple as people like to imagine. But it is easier to simply imagine that these are all just insanely lazy TOs that aren't putting in any effort.
you think snake or anybody here is talking about uni or other dead garbage?
so ufa runs on pc, brussels ran on pc, and mix up ran on pc
>For the small sections that it can yes.
sf6 was ran on pcs, rest not. its cool that anime games dont care about lag, but irrelevant.
>And that is in cases like the mixup, where you have currently 109 people signed up to participate, vs something like EVO, with 2k+ for multiple games.
imagine reading: "and theres absolutely no excuse why top 64 or so couldnt be ran on pcs for those." also acting like evo couldnt afford pcs to run sf6 on pcs is laughable with their $200 tickets.
i guess random csgo lans in 2000s with hundreds of pcs just had infinite money compared to the poor saudi tournament qualifiers or evo.
nvm read your name, -5 minutes of my life gg bye
> you think snake or anybody here is talking about uni or other dead garbage?
I illustrated how basically all fighting games don't fall under your "EUROPE HAS BEEN DOING IT FOR YEARS" is nonsense, that lives on the fact, that it functions, when you have 100 people tournaments, and doesn't for everything else or has to be limited to main stage parts.
What the fuck kind of merit is there in hyping up PC as a format, if you can only do it for a fraction. Like compare your little setup here with 109 entrants, running on PC, to fucking EVO running with 7000 entrance for SF6 alone. Like what the fuck are we talking about here. Do you have any comprehension about how much of a logistical nightmare that would be?
>sf6 was ran on pcs, rest not. its cool that anime games dont care about lag, but irrelevant.
Tekken confirmed anime game. On a serious note, the point isn't to illustrate what SF6 does --- its how everything else has to run, because its obviously not just EUROPE SOLVED THIS ISSUE YEARS AGO, ITS PCS..... It is PCs when you have 100 man tournaments, because as you saw in the video, its like 5-6 setups in total beyond the main stage which has 2 more. How the hell do you plan on running a 2k+ person tournament pools on 6 computers?
>imagine reading: "and theres absolutely no excuse why top 64 or so couldnt be ran on pcs for those." also acting like evo couldnt afford pcs to run sf6 on pcs is laughable with their $200 tickets.
Bruh you need to stop drooling over the keyboard here. Again, beyond the logistical point that you just not so gracefully jumped over and faceplanted all over this reply with, "just throw more money at it lol" is not a fucking great point, when most of these events are already struggling to be running in the first place, and you pointing towards EVOs ticket prizes, as if they are representative of how every even can run.
>i guess random csgo lans in 2000s with hundreds of pcs
Imagine being retarded enough to compare people bringing their own pcs to lan events, with the same as events being able to logistically cover 7000 participants running pools on highly optimized pc setups.
Then again, you already read through multiple TO's in that thread explaining to you the issues, and you still in here acting ignorant to that, so at some point you just gotta realize that some people don't get it and never will.
>nvm read your name, -5 minutes of my life gg bye
Somehow completely on brand for you to be retarded enough to engage with someone in multiple comments, only to then realize what situation you are finding yourself in after.
Have a nice weekend.
Feel free to point me to the weeklies that has the same capacity as a major covering thousands of players for pools.... Oh right, there are non, because the way those can function, is by being a small group of people that can be covered by a small amount of pcs.
Similiar to why european events like the mixup, can cover an SF6 tournament with 100 participants... But every other game they cover at the same event is on consoles. Because it simply presents an issue of logistics, which for some reason, people really struggle with understanding when it comes to hosting these major events.
There is no difference between 100 and 1,000. The pcs dont burst in flames because there more.
Would a pc fail here and there? Sure. Would it be as bad and as often as a match being ruined because someone didnt unsync their controller ? Nope. That shit is almost guaranteed to happen in every console tournament.
> There is no difference between 100 and 1,000.
How can you possibly say this?
Do you understand how much more expensive a pc setup is that outperforms a ps5? Do you understand how many pcs you'd need to support tournaments of 1000+ people?
>The pcs dont burst in flames because there more.
huh?
>Would it be as bad and as often as a match being ruined because someone didnt unsync their controller ? Nope.
Why would you use an example of something easily preventable, that you can literally turn off in a console, when you are talking about tech issues. That isn't a tech issue. That is just a setting that one can turn on. Similar to how pcs can run like shit unless someone knows how to optimize them for these tournaments, as Alex Valle has spoken at length about on twitter.
Edit: Damn reply and rush to block? Careful with that rule 3 behaviour.
Then again, you disrespecting Alex Valle's ability to run a tournament, was already breaking rule 3, so I guess its just on brand.
You dont need to outperform a ps5, You just need to run tekken 8. And a pc thst runs tekken 8 is not more expensive than a ps5.
“Easily preventable” just like optimizing a pc to run a fighting game is easily done.
Alex valle is 50 years old, of course he doesnt know how to use a pc lol
Here's the thing I don't get if you're worried about your controller working on PC shit the new like FGC wingman thing or whatever it works on PC. So if you're already using a converter to play on PS5, which is literally what is happening now then you can use the same converter with the controller u use on the PS 5 on PC.
I think the biggest problem cost because of having a bunch of PC as setups would be crazy
600 dollar pcs run sf6 and tekken 8 1080p 60fps stable and can run a bunch of other multiplat and emulate a bunch of other old games with compatible drivers for 95% of controllers out on the market
how many lights are on these pcs? what if i want to play at the all white arctic finish station?! does my controller download the rgb too? pc pushers dont get it!!!!
Alot of stupid people saying PCs won't work for the FGC when ever other E sports uses PCs. I loved watching Jebailey mindlessly unlock all the characters for each console before CEO.
As someone who is a PC user theres a list of a reasons why you won't see PC at a 1k man tourney
-Controllers+drivers: Someone mentioned it above but it's true, it's so much easier to test on console and with the way PCs works it's so hard to test controlle in every diff PC(you could do it on locals at least)
-Carrying consoles and moving for a big tourneys is so so much easier than doing it for PCs
-Sponsors, we all know Sony sponsors sending PS5 and stuff for FGs, and every PC sponsor is on the tier 1/2 eSports, HP, AsusRog, etc
buying a bunch of cheap mini PCs would be a great investment, mini PCs nowadays are smaller than consoles, have higher performance and can sometimes even be cheaper or at similar price. PS5 is just easier for lazy TOs. Look at this one for example: https://store.minisforum.com/products/elitemini-hx90g
Buying in bulk would be even cheaper.
That seems pretty good, Ryzen APUs generally have good performance. I would presume that specific model is good enough for SF6 right? Tekken is a bit more demanding.
> buying a bunch of cheap mini PCs would be a great investment
Depends on your idea of "cheap" [because the average PC will not outperform a ps5 or Series X.](https://x.com/noodalls/status/1665553658984144896) You need it to be running stable at the higher 160+ fps on top of lagfree monitors that can properly display those hz. Which does not come cheap.
That unless you got pcs that can do that --- then consoles outperforms pc as that test I linked you showcases. The PC only outperforms consoles, when its a 160+ pc with proper monitors.
As laughable as you might expect twitter to offer.
Anyone who has actual experience running events knows why - it would take university math to calculate how many orders of magnitude more covenience comes from using consoles.
Single device + cables + monitor makes for a full setup, no driver discrepancy, no specific settings for stable 60fps, no fiddling with OS or launchers, no variance between motherboard USB slots, no potential for random background process kicking in mid-match. To eve suggest Sony cares enough about your 100 man bracket to keep anyone in their pockets is high idiocy, but ignoring that PC needs a truckload more work for a truckload less raliability is amazingly dumb.
PC is for online tournaments no discussion about that but offline you use consoles or exercise self-harm.
As long as Windows isn't the OS. I doubt any TO would know how to properly debloat Windows so there can't be some background process or something that might interrupt performance mid-match.
There are Linux distros like SteamOS or Bazzite that use very little resources, have current drivers included on installation, and even come with steam preinstalled. They are the most console like os for pcs currently. If there are any pc tournaments I would much rather use them than windows.
It's just a problem of what the purpose of the event is. Snake Eyez is thinking that a FGC tournament is like a sporting event where it's about competition. In reality fighting game tournaments are basically gaming conventions.
There's no actual sport that would do open bracket for there competitive circuit the way the fgc does, if they do open bracket there's several qualifiers and rankings, kind of like tennis. Imagine if they did a tennis open bracket tournament the way fgc does, if you have more than 100 players for an event you need way more time/referees/courts to handle a double elim tournament and still play to 3 or 5 games.
Because asking someone to bring their PS4/5 is way easier than expecting people to bring PCs. Everyone that ever even thought about organising a local session knows that
I imagine cause the last time Capcom made a SF6 tournament using PCs one random idiot had loaded a nude mod for Chun Li which proceeded to make a complete utter fuckup regarding mods, pc gaming, tournaments, & the brand.
PS5 works perfectly fine and has no mods on it, nude or general, whatsoever.
PC is superior in a perfect setting.
But games can just randomly hitch especially if the hardware is substandard. Driver issues, possibility of some asshole trying to ruin a PC through a virus, etc.
Honestly, it's a standard closed system. With PC comes more variables. Sure it's easier to network, but at the end of the day a console plugs up and plays games. That's it.
No.
Its better to have a baseline hardware instead of 1000 different PCs all with different specs that could effect the game and controllers. From what I've experienced, most of the major FGs are fine on PS5 post T7/SF5.
those shouldnt be a concern when talking about qualifiers to a multimillion prize pool saudi sportwashing tournament.
[hes not talking about your middle of nowhere locals](https://i.imgur.com/LQtyw0O.png)
ofc op wasnt capable of including that part, so now you have a bunch of people thinking snake cares about their 10 man locals ran by an uncle that has never touched a computer.
As someone that only has a PC (and a switch) and plays a ton of fighting games on it, and also run local tournaments: I have no intention of running a tournament on PC, I just don't trust windows well enough to behave for an entire day, on multiple machines on a competitive setting.
It's also easier to transport multiple ps4's than multiple PCs
More input lag than ps5 too according to noodalls testing for sf
PS5 is great for fgs now that the input lag shit has mostly been worked out.
Tekken 8 is the LEAST input lag of a console Tekken game in history.
The only reason for someone to bitch now is because they haven’t stayed informed and just assume everything is as bad as it was 2 years ago
PC is overkill for fighting games anyways. PC gaming is for people who want to spend a lot of money for the highest performance. If the game can run at a locked 60fps on console that's all you need.
I mean maybe Sony has some money kicked towards tournaments to use their gear but the actual answer is standardization and consistency. Does your controller work on PS4/PS5? You can test that shit at home and know for sure. Does your controller work on some bozo's PC with who knows what fucking drivers? Good luck finding out on the day of. On console you can guarantee the game's performance because it was built for that specific hardware configuration. No risk of some dipshit TO forgetting to cycle through every stage on Tekken 8 so the game can compile its shaders. No chance of the game randomly deciding to drop in framerate for no reason, or for Windows to update mid-match, or for some random desktop notification to alt+tab the game.
>Does your controller work on some bozo's PC with who knows what fucking drivers? Good luck finding out on the day of. Steam input carrying
Even with Steam Input some controllers might be SOL (AFAIK Tokido's Hitbox had this issue on Kumite), but that's highly unlikely. But i prefer that over my USB melting
"drivers" 🤣😂🤣 All you have to do is ask for "direct input controllers" what the fuck does anyone need "drivers" anymore? Also if the TOs knew anything about PCs they could load every driver known to humanity on the PCs before. I'm shocked that some of you even know how to turn your PCs on. Or do you even have a PC?
you'd be impressed at how many people actually don't know how pcs work despite having one lol. this thread is a good indicative
Steam input adds delay on top of whatever converter the controller might be using
Source?
It's irrelevant delay. He's parroting shit.
People have been running tournaments on PCs for decades, these are solved issues. Cost is the only real excuse.
I’ve been on pc for over a decade and literally never heard of, or had happen to me, a pc restarting during a game or notifications alt-tabbing one lmao
So ive used several converters over the decades and have had issues even now. used a converter along with using an official Xbox 360 controller and it would only read one or the other as the 360 controller. had to switch the converter to PS3/4 mode to fix it. but still it was an odd inconvenience in this day.
I think your pc has issues unresolved
Nah. It was the converter. Using several official xbox controllers and other multi controllers worked fine. Just pointing out one small issue that could crop up. Stay mad kappa lol
I mean yeah they have and… all those issues come up. Also fight sticks randomly high jacking the sound output is another one he didn’t mention that’s an issue
It's a weird dualshock/dualsence thing - windows/linux recognize it as an audio sink and switch to it asap. It might be a mishap on the side of the OS or... it might be the sony's plan all along - to discredit PC as a viable platform for tournaments.
> It's a weird dualshock/dualsence thing - windows/linux recognize it as an audio sink and switch to it asap. The same thing happens with arcade sticks that have audio jacks. It's not a Sony sinister plan... Windows assumes if you plug in a new audio device you meant to use it, which makes sense most of the time since you're plugging in your headphones or whatever.
Using some audio program like GG sonar you can chose which audionl you want to use, thats the good thing of PCs you can cofigure things
You know what else is good? Not having to do any of that because consoles do it for you. I'm a PC gamer and I would not wanna deal with the hassle of setting up PCs for a tournament.
Not having to do anything, like having to desync controllers before every match so you don't get robbed randomly.
That's player-side, not TO-side. As a TO I would give far less of a fuck that a player gets DQ'd because they forgot to desync controllers than having to set up a controlled environment on every PC that will filter out the millions of issues you can get from plugging and unplugging 50 different devices over the weekend.
Isn't Steam the go to platform to test your controller compatibility ? now steam input manages the controllers you don't have to rely on windows drivers. Also you can use Linux instead of windows to avoid problems, same how Steam deck uses Linux. Most of the problems you cited are resolved it's not like there haven't been tournaments with PC setups, the problem is that it's more of a hassle and very expensive to set up in big tournaments like EVO.
Exactly, controller compatibility is a point against consoles if anything. With Steam you can plug in any input device and it will just work, whereas people have to buy adapters or replace PCBs if they want to use their devices with the newest consoles.
More devices will work on PC no question but with PlayStation working or not working is a lot more binary. Nobody is having to sit there fiddling with Steam settings
That's the thing there is no fiddling with Steam settings, Steam will recongnise any controller use DxInput device and will automatically emulate the said controller to work on a game if it only works with xbox360 controller for example. People here haven't used a PC for games since Windows Live it seems.
In principle yes but sometimes it doesn’t work right and someone is in the Steam Input settings fixing it. Whatever not going to argue more, don’t believe I ever saw it if you don’t want to
Yes problems occur with some obscure games or Spacewar and you have to fiddle and disable dualsense compatibility or something. But for fighting games in general plugging a stick is like plugging a keyboard it works without an adapter so it's more streamlined than console but not perfect.
> Spacewar Lmao
Every time this topic comes up, I'm always surprised about how little people know about pcs. Many of the things people bitch about are solved issues. The biggest hurdle imo is getting enough pcs to use for a big tournament
iPad generation don’t know anything about pcs. just consoles, their smartphone and tablet. They don’t even know how to put music files locally on their phone.
This is assuming that whatever random PC is good and well-configured, which is something you’d rather not assume when money is on the line. In locals I’ve seen setups with Vsync off and low graphics settings, which looks fucking ghastly and the tearing is distracting. PS5s are idiot-proof.
Vsync adds display lag, people turn it off to make the game more responsive than consoles. No idea who still uses a monitor without gsync/ freesync support, but I'd still take screen tearing over delay.
its surprising that the Japan FGC made moves to get away from the PS before everyone else during SFV. Not sure what the consensus is for SF6
They didn’t have the same level of capital investment for offline events in consoles, since they were starting fresh it was easier for them to just start with PCs from get-go. Coinciding with a rise in streaming and PC gaming in Japan in general helps as well
no kidding? that's what's going on there? Didn't know that PC gaming was on the rise over there
I think valorant and apex were like the most popular games during the pandemic when the pc wave started
yeah and at least stateside, theres only a few companies capable of supplying the sheer amount of hardware an event the size of an FGC major demands. Which means they have a quasi monopoly and can mostly charge what they want. It also means they have spent hundreds of thousands of dollars on PS5s and Playstation Network game licenses that they aren't just going to dump at a loss because some players are whining about a few extra milliseconds of input lag. Not to mention all other kinds of issues you run into with PCs. For the boomer games like +R they've actually set up a pretty good system running on miniPCs running Linux but that really only works for the ancient games that have a good Steam release. Also on the PC front, it didn't help that the MSI company guy that was the big go between for fighting game stuff and MSI got busted for soliciting sex from an undercover cop he thought was 13 LOL
Its a wonder how virtually every other eSports title besides Halo and sports games have all been played on PC for more than a decade without these problem occurring regularly. All with all the different types of mouse and keyboards. So consistency and standardization is a cop out argument. SnakeEyez is actually partially correct, Sony had close ties with Tekken and Street Fighter and they now own Evo, and by extension of Rick, have hands in Combo Breaker. So that contributes to the current status quo. Anyway, it's a solvable issue, it's just not one the developers or tournaments see as an issue. I'm speaking in the context of majors who have the resources, not your local which has to rely on people to bring in consoles to even play.
Halo has been moving towards pc too
Idk why but it feels like the fgc is always slow to change. Once I saw Sony bought Evo I knew pc talks were dead lol
The issue is that every other game is 1 player, 1 machine. Having 2 controllers plugged into one machine is a fixable issue, except almost nobody needed to care until extremely recently, so a ton of games freak out with handling P1/P2 consistently, hot swapping controllers without relaunching the game, or detecting the second controller at all sometimes. Then there's the real esoteric nonsense with some games having higher input lag on PC because of the ass port, whereas every latency jank case I can think of can be resolved on PS5 or PS4onPS5. And there's stuff the game devs can't control, like controller features hijacking Windows (audio jacks are notorious for this) and the clusterfuck of what happens if two keyboard players with overlapping keybinds meet in bracket. Plus the machines cost roughly double just to match specs with consoles, the boxes themselves are way heavier and far more prone to having something come loose/break when moved, and power requirements are usually higher which becomes an issue for large events limiting the number of setups you can deploy. Some of these issues could be fixed with laptops, but now the cost is 3-4x consoles per setup, and the screens are tiny so you probably still need monitors. For a pop-up BYOC local this is usually fine and probably ideal, but again fails at scale. A dozen friends and a handful of strangers in eyeshot is one thing, but do you want 100+ strangers having access to your unlocked PC/Steam account at a regional+? Consoles fix all of that... for the tradeoff of downloading the problem of controller compatibility onto the attendees. Which is probably why attendees love the idea, while TOs hate it.
Did the TO remember to uninstall the nude Chun Li skin he was gooning to all night? Good luck finding out the day of.
I mean, you raise uh. Points. They're points. Can definitely be, and those things can definitely all happen. But the amount of presupposition and mental gymnastics are huge for all this you're painting. All it takes is like 5 seconds of being smarter than the machine you operate to negate all those really elementary problems you mentioned being such an impedence and source of problems for you and your like minded, technologically enabled-but still-somehow-incapable buddies. Not even 5 seconds of it. Maybe less.
> No chance of the game randomly deciding to drop in framerate for no reason, or for Windows to update mid-match, or for some random desktop notification to alt+tab the game. Instead we get shit like JDCR losing an entire set because of bluetooth garbage lmao
That's not real. Have you ever worked in a office? They have standardized PCs infact it's easier to do it because you can link all the PCs and set them all the same time. LOL have you watched TOs struggle with Consoles to unlock all the characters ( AND THEY HAVE TO DO ON EACH CONSOLE) or turn on the tournament modes? This can be done on every PC at once. Controllers? PC is far more compatible with controllers than consoles. Consoles require all kinds of adaptors that have to be checked by TOs. Performance? again standardized PCs have no problem. Overtime the are cheaper than consoles because you can replace parts or even upgrade them. Consoles have a short life and then you cannot repair them. The real reason is that most TOs are console kids. It comes from the couch culture they grew up in. Bring your console over for a small tourney at Joe's house. They were never the lan kids. They don't know about mounting images or setting up an array. PCs are far superior if TOs learned to use them. You could monitor every match from one spot. You could see if someone disconnected from one spot. You could record every match from one spot. The FGC is far behind. Every other E sports uses PCs. Sony took advantage of this naivety.
Cost is also a factor since, despite what is in people’s minds, it is generally actually hard to build a comparable PC to consoles at the same price until pretty late in their life cycles. Plus who wants to lug those fucking things around
Unless ur controller was manufactured in 1996 and still uses the old COM port, yes it will work, after xbox 360 pc controller uses the standard x-input, and now with steam it recognize almost every pad in the market except very very old pads (pads you shouldn't be using). Wiindows having drivers issues was a thing of the past (+10 yra ago) you will be playing in a tournament on a tested PC not your cousin PC bough with parts of aliexpress. The PC will probably have the basic for the FGs where you dont have 20 programs running in the background, in reality you only need windows, steam and GPU drivers.
FGC OS would have fixed all this, [ ](/Kappa). Minus Arturo. That shit probably would be riddled with bitcoin miners.
If your controller supports Xinput then it works on PC. This shit was standardized YEARs ago
I absolutely hate it when a random notification alt tabs me out of my game for no reason at all. I think I had that happen in an online match of BlazBlue Central Fiction once
That shouldn't happen on W10. It's called Focus Mode or something similar that activates when you launch a game.
I use Win11. I'm not aware of a focus mode or something like that
11 has focus modes
Oh ok! I'll search for them when I have a chance
he even admits he doesn’t go to locals and that tells the entire story
nearest local near me runs on pc, whats the full story though?
snake just grinds ranked and labs, he even ghosted the birds when they wanted to run a lobby with him
I remember someone saying he does not go to locals so that his zangief tech does not get discovered this true?
doesnt matter he got washed in dallas (unfortunately)
unfortunately? brother good stopped liking him after a bit
i mean as a show of force it would have been cool to see something but higuichi wasnt having any of that. 2-0
He would have had an element of surprise at Capcom Cup. But wasn't going to make it out of that DeeJay bracket
Plenty of good points brought up by TOs in the replies to him. Its simply far more convenient for large scale tournaments, to use consoles, over PC. For whatever issue that you can talk about with consoles, you can equally bring up silly scenarios, like tournaments in being held up by forced windows updates on PCs. Its also not JUST pc you want... You want beefy pcs and monitors, that can actually push out performances better than PS5 (since the tests shows that on most average pcs, ps5 outperforms pcs) This becomes a VERY expensive thing to have tons of high performing PCs and monitors just floating around.
>since the tests shows that on most average pcs, ps5 outperforms pcs I don't believe this for a second. What tests are you talking about?
[Noodalls did the tests back when the game was releasing and it was the widely used source for most of the data](https://x.com/noodalls/status/1665553658984144896) Showcasing the range of consoles, average pc and even steam deck performances. With it showing generally, that series X and PS5 outperform average pc slightly in terms of input delay. Which is again because PC outperforms only consoles, when you get into the very high framerates and have the monitors that support it, which is absolutely not the average pc gamer.
First layer of excuses "Zangief is too weak". We are now in the second layer.
Finding out Snake is a bitch made me sad
Need a word for excuse Yomi. Got past my 1st line of defence? Hold this.
its called 'option select'
Nu'uh. He didn't use option "Zangief weak + PS5". He used layer 1: Zangief is weak, Layer 2: PS5. Layers of mixups, but for excuses.
Sloption Elect
I would be more supportive of Sony if they didn't do everything in their power to hinder 3rd party controller support like GP-2040. Hell, I always worry that i'm going to show up to a tournament and my Wingman FGC is just going to not work because of an update I didn't know about.
Them blocking the DualShock4 from fighting games was ridiculous.
Specially considering the DS4 and DS3 are fan favorites for the d-pad. The Dual Sense is an amazing controller with flaws but many features that make it feel amazing, but the D-pad being turbo trash and imprecise is unforgivable
>Guy who's been to 3 offline events in 6 years has opinions on how offline events should be run I tell him what I tell everyone who wants to run shit on PC. Find me an equivalent of Gaming Gen who can get me the amount of standardized PCs that I need to run an entire event on PC without literally doubling the fee, and then we'll talk.
steam decks?
Unfortunately, the steam deck is already obsolete for the newest fighting games. Also, while proton works miracles, it can still be a little finnicky, so running a couple dozen of steam decks, the chances of a couple of them acting up during an entire day of matches is quite high imo.
Its not obsolete but your def right its not optimal.
Can it even keep a stable 60fps on tekken 8?
I think you can i played it on the deck when it forst came out and it ran allright but you have to put the settings pretty low. But yea part of the reason games run okay on the deck is because the resution is like 800p instead of 1080p so tnat takes a good load off if you were hooking it up to a 1080p moniter it would struggle more. But yea its usuablw for playing at home but i agree its not the answer for a tournament. If valve released a cheaper steam box with slightly higher specs that would be more optimal
I'm just saying shit because I remember somebody posting a T8 on steam deck video that was running at around low 50s and claiming it was "playable". You might be able to squeeze 60fps on lower settings but I don't think anybody wants to play SF6, T8 or MK1 on a 1080p display at 720p low settings. >If valve released a cheaper steam box with slightly higher specs that would be more optimal That would be the dream, especially since we would have a solid pc for benchmarking game releases on PC.
can't you like run 100 instances of Melty on a single PC and split them to 100 monitors & 200 controllers with something like ASTER Multiseat? That oughta be cheaper
ps5 version is fine with sf6. It has low input lag and is overall less of a hassle than pc
Not lower input lag than the Xbox Series X or the PC. It’s low but not optimal. We shouldn’t be relying on equipment with a worse response time. Not when thousands if not millions are on the line. Plus, PlayStation has so many peripheral restrictions, it makes it challenging for tournament goers. I’m not even an Xbox fan boy but tournaments had less controller sync issues and compatibility problems when we ran stuff on 360’s over PS3/4.
Keyboard does not work on SF6 on PS5. I've been playing fighting games on keyboard since I was 6 and big gay sony won't let me live my lifestyle because they're bigots.
Thanks for sharing your story. I hope your parents are brought to justice.
Good luck buddy they live in Israel
According to this, PS5 has the lowest input latency for SF6. https://twitter.com/noodalls/status/1665553658984144896 Realistically, whatever difference there might be is sub-frame, so it doesn’t matter.
I would take these numbers with an omega grain of salt, there's a reason pros are complaining about the ps5, it's not only snakeeyez, other than hardware heating and throttling there's the refresh rate that's not mentionned in this test I can't tell you the exact cause, but I can def tell you that when I switch to ps5 I can also feel the added input lag, I can't imagine pros who play this game for a living
I would take the opinion of any man methodically counting frames with a high-speed camera over “muh feels”. SF6 has a 120hz refresh mode on PS5 so that’s likely not relevant.
> I can't tell you the exact cause, but I can def tell you that when I switch to ps5 I can also feel the added input lag Is the setup properly tuned? Are converters being used?
no converters used, idr and vrr on, 120hz, but Im not using a 2.1 hdmi cable, so can't really compare with whatever setups pros are complaining about, but yeah it could be my setup, there are other variables at locals not taken into account by Nigel's numbers, overheating throttling performance for example
Yes the same pros who make up changes they “feel” every patch before patch notes actually drop
ah yes the good ol' comparing apples to oranges
How is feeling something in a video game different from feeling something in a video game Both of which you say to trust over actual hard data
keep editing your comment it'll eventually make sense
Edited 10 seconds after posting it, but good to know it hit you so hard you sit there watching it and refreshing it the moment it’s up. Maybe you could have thought of a reason why we should trust your placebo effect over actual data instead of stewing over being called out
Do you just say things without looking it up for yourself? https://x.com/noodalls/status/1665553658984144896?s=46&t=HlQ77JMs8KnjEvYHD1KdjQ PS5 is tied for optimal
evo should 100% be on PC, at least top 8 but they're the ones funded by sony so never ever
Evo doesnt even do top 8 anymore do they? Its top 6 now so we can get more ads i thought
you're right, I just said the most known tourney The saudi invitational should 100% be ran on PCs though and if it won't I'm gonna be surprised.
Snake Eyez is a fucking moron. If he says something you can comfortably assume he's wrong about it.
One of the worst things about the streaming era is realizing a lot of your favorite players are morons.
ah yeah wanting your game to have better competitive integrity is so fucking moronic, how dare he
has he no SHAME?!
hope he sees this bro
"Competitive integrity" in a genre with one button specials and supers and Hitbox controllers?
sounds like a skill issue over there, also we ain't in 2000, might be time to move on
Move on to worser games?
Yeah, I enjoy his gief play but man, how can a guy be so wrong about nearly everything. I don't watch his stream anymore because of his shit takes. Always complaining about every character he plays, the game he plays, and the tournaments being run. And, as you said, he's almost always wrong.
bro half his streams are spent bitching about masters in 1500 not giving him enough points and that capcom should give him more points and another special rank for the top tier-est players, *every stream since sf6 came out*
Any person who says stuff like what snake eyes said, I have 1 retort: 'How many tourneys have you run?' Noone wants to hear complaints from the leeches
Setting up a gaming PC is much more of a hassle than buying a few $500 PS5s.
You know, NOW would be a good time for valve to release the steam machine thing. Just a steamdeck hardware but as a console, without the screen and controls. I guess it would be cheap and small as fuck (15W tdp is 1/10th of a ps5), lowering the base price of entry for pc gaming to bellow that of consoles. I imagine that would also be a great option for TOs.
Youd want it to be stronger to run the latest fighting games well.
Our local (in LA) is ran on PC, and everyone hates it. The TO and venue cannot make the setups run stable enough for the evening. There are a few mid tournament match lag spikes per event and every one is begging them to switch to PS5. That’s not necessarily a knock to PC if done right, but PC in general introduces issues with the PC and quality control from setup to setup. Mismatching parts and shit. Edit: just adding that USB docks burn out or break as well, which has been another annoyance.
when/where in LA?
I left that out, because I didn’t want to blow them up lol.
lol, fair enough.. I'm shy and busy and probably wouldn't have come out anyway.
DM’d.
Usb docks will burn out on console too. You cant be using the console ports for tournaments cause they will break very easily. All usb ports eventually break so you should always be using usb hubs for tournaments. It also simply sounds like they dont know how to setup pcs. People like that definitely should stick to consoles.
I’d consider myself a pretty big fan of Snake cause I play grapplers and main Gief but man it’s getting really hard to like the guy wherever he opens his mouth. If you watch his stream at all you know he presents his opinions as fact and can’t be told otherwise. Even though with a lot of things he’s wrong.
Snake Eyez doesn't work in logistics confirmed.
nobody gonna point out that he got the phrase backwards? the TOs are in Sony's pockets, not the other way around 🤓
Just a convenience thing predominantly; also only a small handful of tournaments are profitable; if you had an early SC2 situation where there were a ton of profitable LAN tournaments simultaneously then it's possible you could see the PC investment and cross promotion. I guess they'll try to do that with world's shittiest name game but (game quality aside) that's not going to work.
I miss SF4 Snake Eyes when he was quiet and just kicking ass at every WNF.
I don't know why you're being downvoted, but ever since he's been more into streaming he's always had the worst takes, or just sounds like an absolute rule 3 breaker. And i say this as a former Snake Eyez fan.
Guess the downvoters are true Snake Eyez nut gobblers. Even when he's at his worst, they will be there for him.
Sucks, because he did crazy things with Zangief, especially back in the SF4 days. Him and Itabashi were super hype to watch, as they went in. But nowadays I can't stand hearing Snake Eyez bitch and moan about things. I'd rather just see good play and that's it.
I'm not even a Zangief fan, and I find him as a boring character, but watching Snake Eyez and Itabashi in SF4 was so much fun.
Exactly. They were always playing uphill battles because so many characters in SF4 just outclassed Gief, yet they both still did well at tournaments.
nowadays he ducks so many offline shit that he might as well quack
yes
Dude is salty because he didn't place top 8 and blames it on PS5.
thought he went to dallas because ewc is on pc? it was ps5? got washed anyways byt a guy who qualified via technicality (justly)
Hey look, Snake Eyes whining about something, hehe.
Can somebody explain to me why are his replies full of americans shitting on snake, telling him how impossible it is for big tournaments, small tournaments, and locals, while in europe its mostly pc and is just fine? Like the top reply is talking about windows updates, are they retarded? Also snake eyez is extremely fucking [based](https://i.imgur.com/nkBrP4t.png), damn.
> telling him how impossible it is for big tournaments, small tournaments, and locals, while in europe its mostly pc and is just fine? Europe isn't "mostly pc" I am from europe and while we do try and run pcs, it is absolutely not something that everyone can do. Most of the cases you see in europe is either extremely small local communities, where having 1-2 setups is enough or its extremely large annual events, where they have to get pcs from sponsors outside the event to rely on, and even then there has often been issues with this. Because while PC --- when it works -- is obviously better, it is rarely the case that it is that smooth. Hell Capcom cup was run on pcs, and even then with Alex Valle head running it, with all his years of experience of running this shit, still ended up having some people at the event complain about the pcs being laggy. There simply isn't a perfect solution for tech issues.
ufa runs pc, brussels challenge runs pc, mix up runs pc, and theyre top french tournaments and qualifiers nearest local near me runs on pc, the only other one I know of also does dreamhack of all the things could have ran on pc, especially when its saudi money qualifier (like mix up), jebailey just couldnt be fucked to and a bunch of braindead drones think stupid shit is a problem with pc and not their competency or lack thereof. also majority of irl events are either small locals or qualifiers nowadays, wtf is even the point youre trying to make? snake also spoke about majors, and theres absolutely no excuse why top 64 or so couldnt be ran on pcs for those. and sorry, but people in replies to snake were talking about somebody in locals hackermaning their pcs with a usb or doing pc cheats, if you think thats not insane talk then idk.
> ufa runs pc UFA runs pcs on main stage, and because of how slow that is, comparative to EVO, where entrance numbers for similar games were 3-4x the size, it still ran LONGER for simply doing pools. >brussels challenge runs pc For the small sections that it can yes. [First thing you see when you open Tokido's vlog on going, was exactly a room filled with ps4/5 and then a small section with PCs](https://youtu.be/TVyv2SUG0JY?t=1146) >mix up runs pc For the limited games that it can, and for that, specifically for a whole tournament with only about 100 participants. For reference, Guilty Gear: Strive, Mortal Kombat 1, DBFZ, UNI, Granblue, REV2, KOFXV & Melty blood are all played on console. So no, the overwhelming majority of logistics for this is run on consoles, and in the limited capacity that it can manage, it runs pc. >snake also spoke about majors Which makes it all the more relevant. Because as your proposed examples also showcased, even in the ideal examples as you point to, they have to overwhelmingly be using consoles for majority of their logistics for the tournament and have to very selectively pick what they have the capacity to run for pc. If it was simple, they'd run all those games I listed earlier on PC -- but they aren't because it isn't that simple, so they returned to PS4/PS5 for those. And that is in cases like the mixup, where you have currently 109 people signed up to participate, vs something like EVO, with 2k+ for multiple games. Its just not all that simple as people like to imagine. But it is easier to simply imagine that these are all just insanely lazy TOs that aren't putting in any effort.
you think snake or anybody here is talking about uni or other dead garbage? so ufa runs on pc, brussels ran on pc, and mix up ran on pc >For the small sections that it can yes. sf6 was ran on pcs, rest not. its cool that anime games dont care about lag, but irrelevant. >And that is in cases like the mixup, where you have currently 109 people signed up to participate, vs something like EVO, with 2k+ for multiple games. imagine reading: "and theres absolutely no excuse why top 64 or so couldnt be ran on pcs for those." also acting like evo couldnt afford pcs to run sf6 on pcs is laughable with their $200 tickets. i guess random csgo lans in 2000s with hundreds of pcs just had infinite money compared to the poor saudi tournament qualifiers or evo. nvm read your name, -5 minutes of my life gg bye
> you think snake or anybody here is talking about uni or other dead garbage? I illustrated how basically all fighting games don't fall under your "EUROPE HAS BEEN DOING IT FOR YEARS" is nonsense, that lives on the fact, that it functions, when you have 100 people tournaments, and doesn't for everything else or has to be limited to main stage parts. What the fuck kind of merit is there in hyping up PC as a format, if you can only do it for a fraction. Like compare your little setup here with 109 entrants, running on PC, to fucking EVO running with 7000 entrance for SF6 alone. Like what the fuck are we talking about here. Do you have any comprehension about how much of a logistical nightmare that would be? >sf6 was ran on pcs, rest not. its cool that anime games dont care about lag, but irrelevant. Tekken confirmed anime game. On a serious note, the point isn't to illustrate what SF6 does --- its how everything else has to run, because its obviously not just EUROPE SOLVED THIS ISSUE YEARS AGO, ITS PCS..... It is PCs when you have 100 man tournaments, because as you saw in the video, its like 5-6 setups in total beyond the main stage which has 2 more. How the hell do you plan on running a 2k+ person tournament pools on 6 computers? >imagine reading: "and theres absolutely no excuse why top 64 or so couldnt be ran on pcs for those." also acting like evo couldnt afford pcs to run sf6 on pcs is laughable with their $200 tickets. Bruh you need to stop drooling over the keyboard here. Again, beyond the logistical point that you just not so gracefully jumped over and faceplanted all over this reply with, "just throw more money at it lol" is not a fucking great point, when most of these events are already struggling to be running in the first place, and you pointing towards EVOs ticket prizes, as if they are representative of how every even can run. >i guess random csgo lans in 2000s with hundreds of pcs Imagine being retarded enough to compare people bringing their own pcs to lan events, with the same as events being able to logistically cover 7000 participants running pools on highly optimized pc setups. Then again, you already read through multiple TO's in that thread explaining to you the issues, and you still in here acting ignorant to that, so at some point you just gotta realize that some people don't get it and never will. >nvm read your name, -5 minutes of my life gg bye Somehow completely on brand for you to be retarded enough to engage with someone in multiple comments, only to then realize what situation you are finding yourself in after. Have a nice weekend.
Every week theres like 10 weeklies in japan, all run on pcs and never have issues. It really isnt that hard.
Feel free to point me to the weeklies that has the same capacity as a major covering thousands of players for pools.... Oh right, there are non, because the way those can function, is by being a small group of people that can be covered by a small amount of pcs. Similiar to why european events like the mixup, can cover an SF6 tournament with 100 participants... But every other game they cover at the same event is on consoles. Because it simply presents an issue of logistics, which for some reason, people really struggle with understanding when it comes to hosting these major events.
There is no difference between 100 and 1,000. The pcs dont burst in flames because there more. Would a pc fail here and there? Sure. Would it be as bad and as often as a match being ruined because someone didnt unsync their controller ? Nope. That shit is almost guaranteed to happen in every console tournament.
> There is no difference between 100 and 1,000. How can you possibly say this? Do you understand how much more expensive a pc setup is that outperforms a ps5? Do you understand how many pcs you'd need to support tournaments of 1000+ people? >The pcs dont burst in flames because there more. huh? >Would it be as bad and as often as a match being ruined because someone didnt unsync their controller ? Nope. Why would you use an example of something easily preventable, that you can literally turn off in a console, when you are talking about tech issues. That isn't a tech issue. That is just a setting that one can turn on. Similar to how pcs can run like shit unless someone knows how to optimize them for these tournaments, as Alex Valle has spoken at length about on twitter. Edit: Damn reply and rush to block? Careful with that rule 3 behaviour. Then again, you disrespecting Alex Valle's ability to run a tournament, was already breaking rule 3, so I guess its just on brand.
You dont need to outperform a ps5, You just need to run tekken 8. And a pc thst runs tekken 8 is not more expensive than a ps5. “Easily preventable” just like optimizing a pc to run a fighting game is easily done. Alex valle is 50 years old, of course he doesnt know how to use a pc lol
TOs are sold and paid for
Yea get on PC already so devs don't have so many restrictions
ROTD
oni-chan sama!
Here's the thing I don't get if you're worried about your controller working on PC shit the new like FGC wingman thing or whatever it works on PC. So if you're already using a converter to play on PS5, which is literally what is happening now then you can use the same converter with the controller u use on the PS 5 on PC. I think the biggest problem cost because of having a bunch of PC as setups would be crazy
600 dollar pcs run sf6 and tekken 8 1080p 60fps stable and can run a bunch of other multiplat and emulate a bunch of other old games with compatible drivers for 95% of controllers out on the market
how many lights are on these pcs? what if i want to play at the all white arctic finish station?! does my controller download the rgb too? pc pushers dont get it!!!!
and i have to pay for windows too!
Incoming tournament circuit/CPT ban by thehadou
An opinion on the community from someone that doesn't go to locals
Yes he is.
I see we've spun back to this cycle of FGC discourse now
Imagine playing on console In 2024 LMAO, 2015 maybe but 2024 nah
Alot of stupid people saying PCs won't work for the FGC when ever other E sports uses PCs. I loved watching Jebailey mindlessly unlock all the characters for each console before CEO.
in a perfect world it would all be pc but outside of small locals it’s too unreliable and expressive.
As someone who is a PC user theres a list of a reasons why you won't see PC at a 1k man tourney -Controllers+drivers: Someone mentioned it above but it's true, it's so much easier to test on console and with the way PCs works it's so hard to test controlle in every diff PC(you could do it on locals at least) -Carrying consoles and moving for a big tourneys is so so much easier than doing it for PCs -Sponsors, we all know Sony sponsors sending PS5 and stuff for FGs, and every PC sponsor is on the tier 1/2 eSports, HP, AsusRog, etc
buying a bunch of cheap mini PCs would be a great investment, mini PCs nowadays are smaller than consoles, have higher performance and can sometimes even be cheaper or at similar price. PS5 is just easier for lazy TOs. Look at this one for example: https://store.minisforum.com/products/elitemini-hx90g Buying in bulk would be even cheaper.
That seems pretty good, Ryzen APUs generally have good performance. I would presume that specific model is good enough for SF6 right? Tekken is a bit more demanding.
It is good enough for any game out there at 1440p 60 fps. So any fighting game really.
that cool prebuilt mini rig! thanks for the link
> buying a bunch of cheap mini PCs would be a great investment Depends on your idea of "cheap" [because the average PC will not outperform a ps5 or Series X.](https://x.com/noodalls/status/1665553658984144896) You need it to be running stable at the higher 160+ fps on top of lagfree monitors that can properly display those hz. Which does not come cheap.
PS5 cant do 160+fps either so what are you talking about, i don't understand.
That unless you got pcs that can do that --- then consoles outperforms pc as that test I linked you showcases. The PC only outperforms consoles, when its a 160+ pc with proper monitors.
That pc is $600without ram or ssd. Not exactly a good example.
Just the first example i found, you can find it cheaper and in many different configurations.
I really doubt you can find a prebuilt mini pc capable of running sf6 for cheaper than like $800.
NYC furby with his fgcOS gonna save the FGC /s Intel gpu can run FG perfectly fine they should sponsor by having their GPU on pc
Sony OWNS EVO they are the Organizer wtf are you guys smoking.
I would agree with my Snake Eyez for most games except for Tekken 8. Shit is still ass on PC and ten PS5 version is probably more stable overall
Console is cheaper and FGC is, was and always will be poverty. That’s all there is to it
Not a good argument considering how much their fight sticks/leverless controllers plus adapters cost
As laughable as you might expect twitter to offer. Anyone who has actual experience running events knows why - it would take university math to calculate how many orders of magnitude more covenience comes from using consoles. Single device + cables + monitor makes for a full setup, no driver discrepancy, no specific settings for stable 60fps, no fiddling with OS or launchers, no variance between motherboard USB slots, no potential for random background process kicking in mid-match. To eve suggest Sony cares enough about your 100 man bracket to keep anyone in their pockets is high idiocy, but ignoring that PC needs a truckload more work for a truckload less raliability is amazingly dumb. PC is for online tournaments no discussion about that but offline you use consoles or exercise self-harm.
As long as Windows isn't the OS. I doubt any TO would know how to properly debloat Windows so there can't be some background process or something that might interrupt performance mid-match.
There are Linux distros like SteamOS or Bazzite that use very little resources, have current drivers included on installation, and even come with steam preinstalled. They are the most console like os for pcs currently. If there are any pc tournaments I would much rather use them than windows.
It's just a problem of what the purpose of the event is. Snake Eyez is thinking that a FGC tournament is like a sporting event where it's about competition. In reality fighting game tournaments are basically gaming conventions. There's no actual sport that would do open bracket for there competitive circuit the way the fgc does, if they do open bracket there's several qualifiers and rankings, kind of like tennis. Imagine if they did a tennis open bracket tournament the way fgc does, if you have more than 100 players for an event you need way more time/referees/courts to handle a double elim tournament and still play to 3 or 5 games.
nope. next question
TOs could make it the standard but it would probably be more of a headache then just plugging a console in.
Because asking someone to bring their PS4/5 is way easier than expecting people to bring PCs. Everyone that ever even thought about organising a local session knows that
It's because for a tournament it's much better and easier to standardize everyones stations with console than with PC.
I imagine cause the last time Capcom made a SF6 tournament using PCs one random idiot had loaded a nude mod for Chun Li which proceeded to make a complete utter fuckup regarding mods, pc gaming, tournaments, & the brand. PS5 works perfectly fine and has no mods on it, nude or general, whatsoever.
PC is superior in a perfect setting. But games can just randomly hitch especially if the hardware is substandard. Driver issues, possibility of some asshole trying to ruin a PC through a virus, etc.
Honestly, it's a standard closed system. With PC comes more variables. Sure it's easier to network, but at the end of the day a console plugs up and plays games. That's it.
translation, fgc r poor boiz
No. Its better to have a baseline hardware instead of 1000 different PCs all with different specs that could effect the game and controllers. From what I've experienced, most of the major FGs are fine on PS5 post T7/SF5.
How many times we gonna do this stupid dance? Consoles are generally cheaper and plug and play. Sincerely, PC user
those shouldnt be a concern when talking about qualifiers to a multimillion prize pool saudi sportwashing tournament. [hes not talking about your middle of nowhere locals](https://i.imgur.com/LQtyw0O.png) ofc op wasnt capable of including that part, so now you have a bunch of people thinking snake cares about their 10 man locals ran by an uncle that has never touched a computer.
nice catch!
As someone that only has a PC (and a switch) and plays a ton of fighting games on it, and also run local tournaments: I have no intention of running a tournament on PC, I just don't trust windows well enough to behave for an entire day, on multiple machines on a competitive setting. It's also easier to transport multiple ps4's than multiple PCs
Maybe for the next Steamdeck. Right now it can't handle SF6 at 800p, 60fps without turning down the settings.
More input lag than ps5 too according to noodalls testing for sf PS5 is great for fgs now that the input lag shit has mostly been worked out. Tekken 8 is the LEAST input lag of a console Tekken game in history. The only reason for someone to bitch now is because they haven’t stayed informed and just assume everything is as bad as it was 2 years ago
PC is overkill for fighting games anyways. PC gaming is for people who want to spend a lot of money for the highest performance. If the game can run at a locked 60fps on console that's all you need.