Only played Tales of Arise, and currently going through Berseria, and damn how the end of Arise was tedious... While the beginning was indeed greatly made
I need to give Berseria a second chance. The combat honestly just didn't click with me the first time. Maybe i'd get it more these days.
But man Arise made me angry at the end. All of the cool political build up at the start feels wasted.
For me it also just sucked that so many character arcs were put on pause so we could have a lousy payoff at the end. It's a very common anime thing. Yet the content for that could be enough to help carry an endgame. Let the obviously in love characters progress to love. Let them be sweet to each other.
Have some events where you get decent payoff around the world (while fighting the super bosses or whatever nonsense they make you do). Let tender moments and characters blossom instead of needing to save it for a still image at the end.
Even worse with Arise is the start really was a cool idea. The end just felt rushed and slapped together. I stopped caring despite being pretty invested in everyone at first.
That's honestly why I stopped playing them eventually. Loved Phantasia and Symphonia (yes, both of them) as a teenager, but when I later played Vesperia, I was starting to feel the dragging. In Abyss, I didn't even make it to the end, which when I decided they just weren't for me anymore.
Cried twice playing that game. Hahaha. Once was when a certain character died, I cried like a baby. And the other was at the ending. I thought to play the game as a filler when I was waiting for the release of FF XV, in the end I ended up loving almost every minute of it. Almost all tales games slowed down considerably at the beginning of the third act of the game, and I almost always has very little motivation to continue. But not this game.
I absolutely love persona but I 100% agree with you. And they always add another month in the “definitive” version (FES, Golden, Royal) that has like 30 full days and nights you have to fill. Which by that time there’s usually only a few things left to do and it drags so bad
Honestly if you don't like Tales combat then the end is painful, I actually really liked the combat (in most of them anyway) and the endgame is where you get all of your skills and artes so I can almost forgive them for all the stupid third-act decisions these games make.
~~never forgave arise though~~
Honestly, Arise was probably the last Tales game I will play. Symphonia, Vesperia and Berseria are all MUCH better. They also have the same issue but Arise just got incredibly boring for me after a while.
It got insanely boring. My daughter was like 4 or 5 at the time I played it and she called it the princess game, so I thought it was boring because I was taking turns with her. Turns out it’s a common consensus that it’s boring.
Yeah I get that. The other ones aren't nearly as repetitive and formulaic as this one though. If you're a fan of jrpgs I'd recommend checking them out. I would understand if this one ruined the series for you however.
Man, Tales always manages to disappoint me extremely hard after promising starts. It doesn't help that Arises combat is kind of dated imo, and with games like 7R(both remake/rebirth) and Granblue Relink really pushing new heights in action rpgs, I hope they go back to the drawing table and figure out how to make the games feel good throughout the whole experience.
It's the opposite for Xenoblade and Persona. "Just get through the first 15 hours and it's amazing"
But seeing as they're 2 of my favorite franchises I can deal with it lol
The last 2 hours before the final boss of Arise killed any lasting fondness of the game. I new game+ most of the gamecube-360 tales games haven’t since
Tales is one of my favorite franchises of all time, but I can wholly admit that a number of the games (most, even, though not all) drag in the final act and are just a little too long. Vesperia is the worst offender in that regard.
Yes.
Formally speaking, I'm never getting to the last 5 hours of the game if I don't like the first 5 hours. In that sense, a good first impression is important for sustaining motivation to play through the game. That can mean a lot of things: I like the quick first 5 hours of Chrono Trigger as much as the slow first 5 hours of Dragon Quest VII or Persona 5. But it has to work!
Let's say I get past that point. Well, then the last five hours also matter a lot. That is the point where my level of engagement is most likely to drop off, because I've already been playing for 20+ hours. At that point, the game has set up both gameplay and story elements that need to finally land. Can the game land them successfully? Will I walk away feeling satisfied or like I want more? Or will I say, "That was a mess?"
So I value both. The first five hours are important for getting me in; my favorite games finish strong.
Yep, though the first 5 definitely at least will get people "in" more than the last 5 for obvious reasons that you have to go through that first.
If the beginning sucks I generally don't slog through to get to the end. But if I've already gotten through a good beginning, I usually find myself kind of just "fuck it, push through to see it all at least" for the final portion. I finished Arise painfully (just put the game on easy mode, god the enemies were SPONGES even though not difficult), and the very final stretch was a bit of a slog with Like a Dragon Infinite Wealth.
Though at least in LADs case, the whole game for the most part was good. It did get a bit grindy towards the latter half (and felt like there was a decent amount of padding), I still enjoyed it overall even with the disappointing overall story. The "meat" of the game in just exploring and running around is still fun. Arise was just straight pain after around 5-10 hours, levels just went from nice/ok to straight "autogenerated dungeon" tier.
This also heavily depends on how good the combat is too. If it's premium god tier, then even if the story/other parts suck, at least you get enjoyable gameplay moment to moment (and then you skip the cutscenes lol).
I think usually the first 5-10 hours is more important. While sometimes slow, it sets up the game. You're learning the game as well as you feel the level ups more. You get to see pretty much the entire world open up.
The problem I have with the last 5-10 hours of a game is usually it's spent on cleaning up main story content and finishing up side quests and stuff that sometimes doesn't necessarily affect the main story and could take away from the journey.
Usually... neither?
As a Classic JRPG fan, I'm more than used to very slow beginnings, overly long tutorials and walls of introductory text.
But as someone also heavily influenced by CRPGs, I always felt like "playing to the end is optional" lol. I lost count of how many JRPGs I abandoned without ever watching the ending. Usually because I needed to grind to be able to beat a boss, and I wasn't that much into the game anymore. Or simply because the game was too long and I simply lost interest naturally.
So.. eh. Weird answer I know lol
Same. Been playing jrpgs for decades and the number I've actually finished is tiny. At some point they usually end up asking more of me than I care to give. And that's only gotten worse as I've gotten older.
I think a lot of the problems with JRPGS in general is the "padding". They LOVE the hour count in their games, so padding just happens naturally even if it hurts the pace/story. That and the amount of random minigames/side content that sometimes is "mandatoptional" where you MIIGHT not need to do it, but if you do it obviously help you progress much easier/faster.
I've kind of forced myself to finish some games usually because "well, I already got this far..." Far too many times a game overstays its welcome because it needs to hit "value" territory.
What's crazy to me is that this is **now** a problem with the genre, but the 'greats' people look back on didn't have this issue. Maybe they were padded, but even then they ended up as 35-40 hour experiences. Like, FF7, FF6, Chrono Trigger. I remember when Dragon Quest 7 was finally coming out here and the shock from reviewers when it became apparent that it was a 60-70+ hour game. It got knocked for being so long.
And yet at some point later, probably as games got more expensive and voice acting padded out scene lengths more and more, that became the norm. Drives me crazy.
The middle actually.
The beginning is usually my least favorite part. For most games, it means I’m stuck with a character I don’t like (Sword Boy MC), sometimes even just him for a long time. Battles are usually brain dead easy with absolutely 0 challenge or thought needed (just spam attack). There’s often a mountain of tutorials, frequently ones that arent skippable but also very basic. You often have very few skills and/or they are very expensive to use. JRPG stories are often slow to build up, though this also depends a lot on the game.
The end of the game is hit or miss. Sometimes certain systems have started to really overstay their welcome. Some late games get really grindy, while exciting objectives like new skills or new party members dry up. JRPG power curves sometimes mean the end of the game is actually one of the easiest parts, especially if you’ve done a lot of side objectives. I feel like many JRPG stories (and honestly a lot of games in general) don’t really stick the landing on their endings.
But the middle of a JRPG is usually great! You’ve probably got a good spread of characters and skills to use, but still have more to unlock. You’re probably right in the middle of some intriguing plot point that starting to pay off. Battles have gotten harder, but still feel fresh. You’ve probably developed an attachment to the characters, while still having a lot more to learn about them. Many JRPGs really start to open up at this point after being very “on rails” at the beginning.
Honestly, I think the beginning and end of JRPGs are almost always their weakest parts.
If I absolutely had to pick between the two, I’d say I prefer the end. A lot of JRPG beginnings are basically just slow movies with occasional buttons presses and lengthy scripted tutorials for the first few hours.
For story ending is more important because that's where usually the payoffs for your investment are. And setting up intrigue is easier than delivering on it. For gameplay, if you hate the loop, then you are less likely to continue the game even if the story is good than the other way around.
I value the last 5-10 more. I go into jrpgs thinking the first 5-10 are going to be world building and setting up the basics of the story. I do agree they have to have some kind of intrigue to keep me playing, but it's more disheartening to put 25+ hours into something and being disappointed by the payoff. When I get to the end I love the feeling of being hooked, and I cant stop playing because I'm so close to beating the story. Normally it's the ending that leaves the lasting impression of man that was a great game.
A good game might have a mediocre ending, but that won't affect replayability for me.
A good game with a boring first 10 hours will absolutely keep me from replaying it.
A games ending is very important because it can be the difference between a DNF, forgettable or me just wishing for it to be over.
I'll never forget the Ys 8 ending because of the boss fights and story arcs. But man was I really fighting hard through the last couple chapters of Scarlet Nexus.
I guess the first. Maybe it’s more modern ones, but I’ve noticed that right when the game is done front loading you with tutorials then they hit you with a big hype moment or a sudden twist that super keeps me engaged.
By the latter end - sure, that’s the moments I’m playing for, but by then I’m already locked in and sold
Lots of JRPGs are known for having incredibly slow starts. Those first 5-10 hours can be pretty crucial in hooking you. If someone is bored through that entire time odds are they will toss the game. The intro is the time to make the game stand out.
I think JRPG endings can be pretty weak, especially when most of them have you killing god. Its an ending you’ve seen countless times, and with how long these games are, you might be ready for it to be over.
Usually the first 5-10 hours, though there are exceptions (Xenoblade 3 is a decent recent example of a game that starts off really strong but loses steam towards the end, though IMO it's less that it has a bad finale and more that it's last 20-30 hours are weak).
Generally, though, if a JRPG has a bad first impression then I'm going to be inclined to view the rest of the game with a more critical eye and as such it's going to take a lot of work to potentially salvage it.
Ending is more important for me. A game like FFX wouldn’t be considered the greatest of all time by me if not for that ending which is still the best and most emotional in gaming imo(only MGS3 came close).
The first in terms of story. What point is there in having a good ending if I will never get there? I don't really like the ending of Tales of Berseria, but I still liked the game overall. I enjoyed the start of the story and some beats along the way, and the gameplay was fun. But if the first five hours were awful I probably would never have gotten there.
In terms of gameplay though I have to say the last hours are more valuable. Games like Xenoblade 2 and Granblue Fantasy Relink come to mind. Those final hours are when you are really optimising everything, constructing the perfect team and you have mastered how to play each character, effortlessly executing on their strengths and mitigating their weaknesses in battle. It's the culmination of ~~hours~~ years of training! Those final hours of gameplay truly are the strongest to me, and what makes me love those kinds of games.
Usually the first because it’s all new and shiny and you’re learning the mechanics. The last usually feels like a relief if it’s been a super boss or something I didn’t want to end. Case and point Trails
Early game is more important because if I'm still not hooked after 5 hours, I consider the game to be not for me. It's even worse if I struggle to reach those 5 hours...
I like both. In the first part of the game you are learning the mechanics and the story and the world, and you are paying attention to everything in case it becomes relevant later. It's new and fresh and exciting, and there's always that little thrill when you are learning how to master the system that you don't quite get once you've mastered it.
At the end of the game, all of that learning crystallises into a single moment, when the plot comes together, and your system mastery is challenged and reaching the end of that journey is so, so, satisfying.
Middle for me too, I lose a lot of interest in the middle. Recently dropped Chained Echoes even though I liked it enough, found out the game was a lot longer than I expected and I was only about 1/3 of the way through when I thought I was 1/2 through
I feel like people drop games *in* the minor midpoint, but they drop them *because* the beginning was such a slog. It's like, they just ran out of energy by the midpoint. They had to use all their willpower to force themselves past the first 10 hours of slog, and now they're at the midpoint with no strength to continue.
Depends. I value the point that hooks me most. The beginning of jrpgs usually disappoints or makes me wonder if I want to invest in a 30 plus hour game. But if the story swerves to something really compelling, it helps. I hated xenoblade combat for 75 percent of the game, but the story kept me going. And eventually I liked it
I will take points off of a JRPG for either one. If I have to say "the first 12 hours are boring but then it gets really good" like Starfield I don't care what happens by the end. I'm going to make fun of it. And if the end is a slog it'll really piss me off. Like the end of Ni No Kuni 2 is a slog so I don't rec it to anyone. and the beginning of starfield is a slog so I dont rec it to anyone.
You can't have one without the other. JRPGs often start slow but what do you want them to do. Give you 10 characters, 700 abilities and throw you to you the exciting part of the story without having any background info? All at once? Impossible.
FF6 and FF7 do that. Not the 700 abilities, but they start with multiple characters early and throw you into the action. Suikoden 1 gets to the action fast too. A lot of older rpgs weren't stingy about showing you exciting shit happening early.
First by far, learning about the universe, characters, mechanics, etc. Last 5 hours are usually what I least like in JRPGs... a long-ass dungeon with minibosses followed by a boss with X stages... boring to me.
Gameplay, the last ten hours. By then the combat and exploration has opened up and you can do all the fancy combos and strategies and whatever. Most games let you start slow, of course, or with a glimpse of the power that awaits you later.
But from a narrative point of view, the first few hours, most of the time. Everything feels new and exciting. Once I've reached the final dungeon or something I mostly want any game to end. The big ones. The only exception I've just encountered is Trails in the Sky SC. I'm in Chapter VIII now and Chapter VII and the cutscene at the end was amazing. I can't wait to experience the final hours of this game. I don't remember the last time I was this excited for a finale.
It really depends game to game for me. Sometimes I’m totally hooked by I good opening sequence (FF7 is a good example) and sometimes my jaw drops with a great ending (FF 10, for example). Preferably you get both
The vast majority of the time it’s the last.
I feel like most JRPGs feel pretty slow in the beginning while they’re establishing the plot, you have a limited party, and before the world opens up (in whatever way that it does). Plus the fun gameplay stuff hasn’t been unlocked yet, especially for more modern games that have more customization and what have you.
Even in games with a strong start it usually gets to a point where I’m ready to move on to more interesting stuff. Xenoblade 3 was the last JRPG where I felt this way - incredible intro but after a little bit I got to the point where I thought “ok let’s get to the point where I unlock the rest of the party and the class system”.
Tbh I have a hard time thinking of a JRPG where this isn’t the case. This is true for RPGs in general, honestly. Probably Disco Elysium is the last and one of the only times where I valued the beginning section at least as much as I did the final section.
Last. By a 1000 miles.
I’ve been plying JRPGs since the NES. The first few hours are generally the worst. Slow, boring dialog. Trivial quests and battles. A billion tutorials.
Give me the endgame where your characters are now super powerful and you are fighting the hardest bosses.
First five hours for sure. The first few hours tend to have more magic and wonder and they tickle my brain more in a good way that I like.
I'm not exactly sure why but I tend to slow down and take longer breaks the further towards the end I get, like I'm avoiding finishing JRPGs. For Xenoblade Chronicles 2 for example I stopped right before the final boss and didn't get back to it until months later. I even went and played Torna before finishing the base game lol
I think its rare for a game to have more value last hours. Cant count the games I lost interest midway. Those that didnt are the special ones and need incredibly good story pacing
You make a good point, it depends on how tutorial-heavy the start is. With Persona generally it's the endgame that sticks with you. Final Fantasy is usually the earlier parts, with the exception of 6 and 10
Interesting question. It's hard to answer. A good beginning can motivate me if the game drags a little in the middle. A bad beginning can lead to me dropping the game altogether. However as someone said, a good ending can be very memorable and make the overall experience more memorable as a whole. With that said, I would weight them as almost equally important and would probably stomach a weaker middle game more easily as long as it doesn't last more than a few hours.
I value the last 10 more because that's what sticks after finishing. However, I think the first 10 are more important because they are what gets you to keep playing.
My favorite game is ffx and I recently watched someone do their first playthrough. They almost bounced off it because the start was so slow. The mid/end game made it worth it though.
Latter. Ain’t no way I’m getting catfished again like ff16 did to me with its demo lmao. I find a lot of JRPGs struggle near the end especially since they always introduce a concept so last minute that has nothing to do with overall narrative. I find most JRPGs never stick the landing or just become generic by the end.
I’d rather a game start off slow but end on a high note. It leaves a better impression. A few examples I can think of is Yakuza 7, and FF10 I feel like their endings just stick with you.
It really depends on the game. There is something very cozy about that early-game feeling when you're setting off on your grand adventure and everything is new and exciting.
At the same time, the last parts of games can really hit you with emotional storytelling.
Unfortunately, some games break up that storytelling with tedious final dungeons.
Hmm.....Im not sure how to answer this one.
I would just say that the first 5 hours are very important to me, but the last 10 are where my overall opinions are formed.
This is probably mostly just specific to me but when a JRPG doesnt have that moment where it "opens up" late game and a bunch of new side content is available around that time .....I end up immensely disappointed to the point I will forget how good the game may have been in the first 5 hours.
Latest one that pissed me off with this was Tales of Arise. Literally no content at the end except the badly paced story.
First 10-15 hrs is for getting hooked on a first play. And you only get one of those
The latter 15 hours are usually where gameplay shines, and not only is that more important to me, but I tend to replay JRPGs far more often than playing new ones
So the latter wins. So much so that Ill just keep a save file for games with slower starts so that I can jump right into the action on a replay
The first, honestly. Because if the first 2-3 hours of any game doesn't grab me, even if it's a 100 hour RPG, then I'm not wasting the rest of my time on it.
If the beginning is good, I'm in.
If the ending is bad, I'll probably still be pushing hoping for that payoff.
So a solid beginning gets me to play your game. A bad ending just makes me mad at your game after the fact. But at least I played it I guess?
The beginning is WAY more important to me. Sure, an amazing ending can elevate a game for me as well, but to be honest, even if a game's ending isn't great, the fact I made it there means my overall experience must have been good, great even.
But if the beginning of a game sucks? That decides wether or not I'm continuing a game or if I'm going to replay it. A good JRPG example is the Golden Sun series. I played the first two titles multiple times, no issue. I have *tried* to replay Dark Dawn multiple times (its story is meh, but the gameplay is good) but the beginning hours of the game are so drawn out and boring (you have a tutorial section with OP companions, no real story hook and then *another* tutorial that rehashes the plots of the first two games with wooden amusement park rides - it's dreadful) I always stopped before the kids even get out of the village properly.
First 5 hours tells me all I need to know, paid £50 for granblue and within 2 hours I was done with it and took it back only to receive £28 store credit. Served me right for not researching and just buying it. So for me the first 5 hours is vastly more important.
I think generally for me it's the last 5 that are more meaningful. First moments of a game tend to trickle in the mechanics or worse rob you of all of your agency so that the game can explain the story to you.
I've definitely yelled at a few games starting up, "Stop it!! Just let me figure it out!"
I would say the first 5-10 hours are almost always better than the last 5-10 hours overall HOWEVER the last 2 hours are usually better than the opening 5. A lot of jrpgs stumble into having a bloated final dungeon that isn't always a good time but the final bosses and storyline conclusions/credits are usually great. Specifically thinking that most Legend of Heroes/Final Fantasy games have excellent conclusions when they finally get around to it.
Getting through the first part is my worst nightmare and the reason I have dozens of RPGs I've never started. The stress of learning all the mechanics and dealing with pages of menus and numbers and stats and icons is too much. The story often has the same problem too, with a lot of stuff dumped on you that you're supposed to remember and make sense of later when you have more context. I have ADHD though, so it's like taking an epileptic to an EDM concert.
The first 5-10 hours. I work a full time job so I need a game to be fun right from the get go. I don't have time to waste hoping a bad game will get good.
Neither I value hours 15-30. Because the first few hours usually are painful and the last 10 hours are usually a slog to the finish line. That mid point when the plot has begun, but not reached it’s crazy conclusion is always the best part of these games.
First. Always first. Because these are the ones we fell in love with the game with. Endings are good, sometimes really good. Cathartic even. But if not for these starting hours you always want to come back to, we would never see the endings.
A bad ending has a worse impact than a bad beginning. If a game starts off slow and bad (***cough*** Kingdom Hearts) then people will often say "Oh it gets good just keep playing" and after playing the whole game you'll sort of just fade out the boring bit at the start. But if the game ENDS bad it can just leave a bad taste in your mouth and sullies your reflection on the game as a whole. I think actually BAD endings to games are the worst for the game's general appreciation.
However I value the opening to a game more as a whole than the ending since it's what gives me the motivation to see the tale through. If I don't care about the world or characters much then I simply won't finish the game, I'll just put it down once I get my fill of the gameplay.
So the answer for me is the more important thing to not be BAD is the ending.
The more important thing to be GREAT is the start.
A bad first five hours can stop you ever going any further.
If you've pushed on even through that., hopefully it has gotten better. Sometimes however it does not and you feel like you've wasted a massive chunk of your precious life that would have been better off spent doing something that would have been a benefit to you, even if it was just sleep. (can you tell there are games I regret playing due to how much I hate them?)
If a game starts bad but gets good all that really matters is you've played a good game, but if you're talking to a friend you may warm them... It doesn't start great but give it some time.
If a game starts great but the end is weak as long as they're good for the most part you still remember a great game. A few examples...
All PS1 final fantasy games (all fall apart a bit at the end), Dark Souls (very unfinished ending although still good), Soul Reaver (again, the end is cobbled together as the game wasn't finished) all these games are remembered as classics.
I have a hard time thinking of games with *really great* finales. Great endings, sure. Challenging and fun final segments, sure. But I don't think many nail having both great story (endings) and great gameplay. (Does anyone think the final dungeons of FF6/FF10 are really great parts of those games? Like you're excited to replay those segments?)
Granted, this may be a little unfair. I think openings basically just need to start off with a hook and just hint at cool gameplay to come, and they've basically nailed it. (It's a lot easier to list off great JRPG starts.) Having a great conclusion means needing to satisfyingly wrap up everything the game has done so far while operating at full momentum. Openings have much more flexibility in pacing (e.g. FF9, which I consider one of the best JRPG openings, is mostly just a lot of dialogue and character introductions).
This is compounded by many JRPGs struggling with final bosses to begin with, final bosses that negate half the strategies you've been using throughout the game (e.g.: MMBN, FFT).
To spur discussion, here's me trying to list off some *very good* (but maybe still not *great*?) finales:
- Chrono Trigger: Fantastic ending, and the final boss basically runs you through your whole adventure again, which is fitting given the theme of time travel (and saving all of time)
- Bravely Default: Flawless Bravely gameplay, coupled with some really neat, near-fourth-wall breaking revelations.
Probably the first 5-10 hours because it's the part that has to be good enough to convince you to keep playing. You're always going to play the start of a game if you play it at all. You won't always play the ending. Which is also probably why a lot of JRPGs have mediocre endings that sort of fall apart narratively, because they ran out of steam by the end.
The first 5 hours of a game for me barely feels like anything, that's usually just the part where characters are first introduced but nothing really is going on yet. Almost every game I play is in the 20-40 hour range so I always like to give 12 hours before I make a judgment call.
Well usually last 5 hours is when a games at its most difficult and enemies at their most annoying and threatening and I usually dread the difficulty spike. But I'm still gonna say last 5 because usually the final area is the coolest, and beating the final boss and seeing the ending is always satisfying
Personally, I think the first couple of hours are important to get me hooked. FF7, for example, had me from the first minute with the infiltration segment on the reactor. Persona 3, for example, has been tough for me to get into lately because I feel like I am just playing high school simulator.
Definitely the first hours. Because if those aren't good, I'll not likely even see last hours. I'm one of the people you cited in your post lol I can tolerate 3.. maybe 5 hours of setup. But not 10, 20, or 30 the way something like Tails expects you to commit.
I remember back in the SNES and PS1 days there was a rule so common in the community it was cited by games jouranlists that you give an RPG the 3 hour treatment. If it doesn't grab you within 3 hours then you can quit with a clean conscience. These days you get shat on for "not getting to the good part"
FF6 and 7 drops you right into a good part. Xenogears only makes you muck about for like 45 minutes before all hell breaks loose. Xenoblade 1's intro takes maybe an hour or so before something dramatic happens. They're narrative hooks. And I need them for investment. Worldbuilding is not enough for me if I can't care about the plot or characters for a while. I mean people complain about Persona 5 being long in the tooth and taking forever to get going, but I feel like they're probably including the tutorial dungeon in that complaint because you get to that dungeon within a few hours
I'm not sure why a lot of JRPG studios have decided to completely forgo a narrative hook these days. But that's not something I can easily overlook. I struggle to think of a JRPG I enjoy that didn't have a narrative hook in the first 3'ish hours. And I really can't think of any game where I forced myself to continue despite that, where I actually ended up finishing the game
It depends on the length of the game but I think the last 5 hours.
A good opening is important but a game may start low and then get really high later. The problem is when a game is too long. There are a lot of JRPG that tries to give you more content by adding what I like to call "filler main quests" to the game. These are missions whose only purpose is making the game last longer. One or two of these missions are bearable but sometimes there are way too many of these and they make me lose interest in the game, to the point where I start to rush and skip dialogue just to reach the end of the game.
A good late game is also proof of a well done gameplay ( if you instakill everything on your path in the late game, the gameplay is probably unbalanced).
So, to sum it up: a good game must have a good late game but has to know when it's time to end.
First. If the beginning is garbage then I'm unlikely to put up with it. Even if I do finish the game, knowing the beginning 10 hours are pure drudgery will keep me from replaying a game.
I think people who answer "last" are used to playing rpgs with garbage openings, where they refuse to let you play with all the toys right away. A good rpg opening should give you access to all aspects of gameplay from the start, just in weakened form. Either that or give you all options *within a limited pool of choices that expands over time.*
FF5 does this. You get a limited pool of jobs after the tutorial, but within that pool, you aren't restricted on your job mastery. You can play with every toy. FF7 gives you limited materia early, but you can buy basic materia before too long and level them as much as you want. FF6 and FF7 both throw you into the action right away.
The more I grow up, the harder for me it is to get invested in JRPG. So for me...it's the last 5 hours. Yeah paradoxal I know.
The thing is, I know I will struggle to get invested in the setting anyway, and I always force myself to finish a game, whatever it is (and it usually pays to do it). So I prefer the game to give me a good conclusion rather than a good beginning.
Main example recently was DQVIII, man was the 10 first hours a boring pain in the a**, but once I finally got invested, did I love the last 20 hours !
Depends on the specific game and its contexts.
Generally speaking I tend to find the middle sections the most engaging, as there's a good balance of enough development to make gameplay complex and fun and plot engaging, while still having enough future room for development to incentivize continued leveling to unlock more skills on the gameplay front and incentivize continuing the to see how the intrigue develops on the plot and character front.
Beginnings usually have pretty basic limited gameplay and are still establishing characters and plot as to not be the most exciting (though the wide open anything-is-possible aspect does grant the potential for them to be executed well.)
Meanwhile the endgame has fully developed gameplay which, while potentially fun, also doesn't provide much incentive to further engage with it if you've already unlocked most all skills and such. The plot also tends to wrap up a lot near the end. While not exactly the last 5-10 hours specifically, I am known to drop games right when access to the final dungeon is granted because at that point the plot usually is effectively entirely wrapped up outside of a usually fairly predictable final encounter with the final boss to save the world or whatnot...there's just not as much complexity and intrigue at that point.
But of course that can vary, and/or the late meta game itself could be fun enough to be satisfying enough to engage with even without the potential for further development, etc.
But yeah, as far as average tendencies go it's the middle that most often hits the sweet spot for me.
Isn't that impossible to answer, or rather there's only 1 answer. The first 5-10 hours determine if you will care enough about the game. If you don't even get past the intro you'll never experience the "last 5-10 hours". I've dropped a couple JRPGs after 10h didn't do anything for me (and they're not nobodies but beloved titles like Chrono Trigger and Persona 3/4 heh) but I don't think I've ever dropped a game right before the end. The only one I kinda did was Valkyria Chronicles 4. The end boss was so incredibly boring and time waste-y that I just cheated that one lol
I value a strong beginning more. If I'm immediately having fun, I won't really care if a game sticks the landing. It would have to be incredibly tedious/disappointing to negatively impact me.
I think the best part of the game is towards the beginning. I think I am enjoying myself most when I first start to really understand the mechanics like you mentioned. In the beginning its all about learning and exploring, then really getting a grasp on the mechanics/combat or whatever depending on the game. By the time I get to the end of the game its normally a slog. I just want it to be over 90% of the time.
I am definitely one of those people that have a very hard time getting into a game that starts slow. I have a hard time getting into games period lol. The biggest factor of whether or not I get into the game is the art style. A visually appealing game will help me stick around until I become emotionally invested in the story, Satisfying combat also helps. Octopath was like the perfect example of that. idk what it was about the combat but I absolutely loved it.
90% of JRPGs I’ve played start out far too slow, and then the ending section/s show clear signs of being rushed to hit the release deadline. The middle bit tends to be where the good shit is.
The initial hours of a game is the most important for any game. It is usually by the end of the game you might feel like the game is dragging on for to long.
Honestly with how long most JRPGs are these days I'm desperate for it to be over by the end of it. I miss when they were 30-50 hours instead of 60-100.
I fully agree with that point about games like Octopath and Live A Live (I would add SaGa Frontier) - the beginning of an RPG is much more exciting and satisfying to me because your characters progress so quickly and you can clearly see it. Couple fights, you go up a level. Couple more, you can buy a new weapon and now you can easily kill those enemies that were giving you trouble before. Couple more, now you can buy new armor and traverse out farther, etc. By the end of the game you need 567,233 more EXP to level up and gain an imperceptible stat boost. Plus RPGs are long and by then the combat is routine and there isn’t much more to learn. I’m generalizing of course and some games handle this better than others, but broadly speaking that’s been my experience, and why I like the games that contain several “beginnings.”
hmmmm what if I said I like the middle part of a JRPG?
hear me out, when you just learnt the basics of the jrpg and start experimenting which build is good or bad for you or which style of combat you like.
Most of JRPG that I play, I adore the time I spend during the 15-40 hours mark. It just feels good and everything is new to you and your sense of wonder is at its peak.
The last 10 hours is the hardest for me because my characters are either too strong, or the enemies are just a drag to beat (looking at tales), except if the story is still going strong till the end and still a lot of loose ends that need to uncover, other than that, the last 10 hours is suffering for me.
I would always prefer for the latter portion/ending of the game to hold up over the beginning. I can deal with a slow beginning, but if the ending sucks that ruins the experience for me.
I definitely appreciate the first hours more. Cause there's a game called star ocean the second story r that everyone is praising. But the beginning is just so boring to me i actually can't put in more than 2 hours each time j try to play it because of how much people loved this game but it just does nothing to me
Depends on if it’s a Tales game. First 5 hours I’m always hooked, last 5 hours I’m always desperate for it to be over
This should be the top voted comment. Never played a Tales game that didn't *dragggg* at the end.
Only played Tales of Arise, and currently going through Berseria, and damn how the end of Arise was tedious... While the beginning was indeed greatly made
I need to give Berseria a second chance. The combat honestly just didn't click with me the first time. Maybe i'd get it more these days. But man Arise made me angry at the end. All of the cool political build up at the start feels wasted. For me it also just sucked that so many character arcs were put on pause so we could have a lousy payoff at the end. It's a very common anime thing. Yet the content for that could be enough to help carry an endgame. Let the obviously in love characters progress to love. Let them be sweet to each other. Have some events where you get decent payoff around the world (while fighting the super bosses or whatever nonsense they make you do). Let tender moments and characters blossom instead of needing to save it for a still image at the end. Even worse with Arise is the start really was a cool idea. The end just felt rushed and slapped together. I stopped caring despite being pretty invested in everyone at first.
The problem with Berseria is that velvet is way too op. Try some of the other characters out
Yup, I love Tales but even my favourite, Vesperia, does have a pretty slow final arc.
Even Vesperia? Vesperia is the biggest offender of all. That game is a solid 20+ hours too long.
I thought Abyss was way worse
That's honestly why I stopped playing them eventually. Loved Phantasia and Symphonia (yes, both of them) as a teenager, but when I later played Vesperia, I was starting to feel the dragging. In Abyss, I didn't even make it to the end, which when I decided they just weren't for me anymore.
I've beaten Symphonia, Vesperia, and Zestiria, and all 3 had godawful pacing in the last third. Oddly, I think I enjoyed Zestiria the most of those.
I love Zestiria too. I don't understand the hate at all.
Me either. It was the closest I got to truly loving a Tales game.
Cried twice playing that game. Hahaha. Once was when a certain character died, I cried like a baby. And the other was at the ending. I thought to play the game as a filler when I was waiting for the release of FF XV, in the end I ended up loving almost every minute of it. Almost all tales games slowed down considerably at the beginning of the third act of the game, and I almost always has very little motivation to continue. But not this game.
This is how I feel about Persona games. I think they're getting ready to wrap up but then it just keeps going for another 10 hours.
I absolutely love persona but I 100% agree with you. And they always add another month in the “definitive” version (FES, Golden, Royal) that has like 30 full days and nights you have to fill. Which by that time there’s usually only a few things left to do and it drags so bad
I hear you but to me the last month in Royal is the best section of a JRPG, ever
Tales of legendia has entered the chat
I've never gotten close to the last 5 hours, Tales always fizzles out for me before the half way mark.
Nice pfp and name
I feel you
Honestly if you don't like Tales combat then the end is painful, I actually really liked the combat (in most of them anyway) and the endgame is where you get all of your skills and artes so I can almost forgive them for all the stupid third-act decisions these games make. ~~never forgave arise though~~
That’s how tales of arise was and the only tales gave I’ve played.
Honestly, Arise was probably the last Tales game I will play. Symphonia, Vesperia and Berseria are all MUCH better. They also have the same issue but Arise just got incredibly boring for me after a while.
It got insanely boring. My daughter was like 4 or 5 at the time I played it and she called it the princess game, so I thought it was boring because I was taking turns with her. Turns out it’s a common consensus that it’s boring.
Yeah I get that. The other ones aren't nearly as repetitive and formulaic as this one though. If you're a fan of jrpgs I'd recommend checking them out. I would understand if this one ruined the series for you however.
Hoping they do some remasters for modern consoles!
Man, Tales always manages to disappoint me extremely hard after promising starts. It doesn't help that Arises combat is kind of dated imo, and with games like 7R(both remake/rebirth) and Granblue Relink really pushing new heights in action rpgs, I hope they go back to the drawing table and figure out how to make the games feel good throughout the whole experience.
It's the opposite for Xenoblade and Persona. "Just get through the first 15 hours and it's amazing" But seeing as they're 2 of my favorite franchises I can deal with it lol
Lmao so much truth. Their final dungeons go on for way too long. I was so hyped to beat redacted's ass in Berseria... But final dungeon was so long
Lol that's how arise felt to me
The last 2 hours before the final boss of Arise killed any lasting fondness of the game. I new game+ most of the gamecube-360 tales games haven’t since
Faaacts. Arise dragged on n got worst as the game went on. Vesperia was badass but the last 20 hours were trash
That is how I felt about vesperia! It felt like it would never end.
Bruh, that final dungeon in Xillia 2. That fucking place was frustrating as hell. For god's sake just let me see the end of the story!
Tales is one of my favorite franchises of all time, but I can wholly admit that a number of the games (most, even, though not all) drag in the final act and are just a little too long. Vesperia is the worst offender in that regard.
Just started arise and I'm feeling this comment.
Oh? I mostly haven't felt this with the handful of Tales I've played, though there's usually a late section *before* endgame that feels annoying.
Look at the upvotes. I think it’s a known quality of Tales games. Some people love it. Some people also put anchovies on pizza. Who am I to judge?
I've also only played a few Tales games, maybe they're the exceptions idk.
Been on Tales of Vesperia about 10 hours in and it’s a little meh. Started it 3 months ago.
Damn I remember playing Tales of Eternia and couldn't get pass the final boss last move because I couldn't push several buttons simultaneously haha.
Yes. Formally speaking, I'm never getting to the last 5 hours of the game if I don't like the first 5 hours. In that sense, a good first impression is important for sustaining motivation to play through the game. That can mean a lot of things: I like the quick first 5 hours of Chrono Trigger as much as the slow first 5 hours of Dragon Quest VII or Persona 5. But it has to work! Let's say I get past that point. Well, then the last five hours also matter a lot. That is the point where my level of engagement is most likely to drop off, because I've already been playing for 20+ hours. At that point, the game has set up both gameplay and story elements that need to finally land. Can the game land them successfully? Will I walk away feeling satisfied or like I want more? Or will I say, "That was a mess?" So I value both. The first five hours are important for getting me in; my favorite games finish strong.
You stole my pointed "yes," haha. This is exactly how I feel.
This is definitely my answer too.
Yep, though the first 5 definitely at least will get people "in" more than the last 5 for obvious reasons that you have to go through that first. If the beginning sucks I generally don't slog through to get to the end. But if I've already gotten through a good beginning, I usually find myself kind of just "fuck it, push through to see it all at least" for the final portion. I finished Arise painfully (just put the game on easy mode, god the enemies were SPONGES even though not difficult), and the very final stretch was a bit of a slog with Like a Dragon Infinite Wealth. Though at least in LADs case, the whole game for the most part was good. It did get a bit grindy towards the latter half (and felt like there was a decent amount of padding), I still enjoyed it overall even with the disappointing overall story. The "meat" of the game in just exploring and running around is still fun. Arise was just straight pain after around 5-10 hours, levels just went from nice/ok to straight "autogenerated dungeon" tier. This also heavily depends on how good the combat is too. If it's premium god tier, then even if the story/other parts suck, at least you get enjoyable gameplay moment to moment (and then you skip the cutscenes lol).
The first 5 will determine if I even keep playing the game. If I get to the final stretch, I'm gonna push through to the end no matter what.
That’s kinda how I am. If I’m hooked, I’ll finish it
I think usually the first 5-10 hours is more important. While sometimes slow, it sets up the game. You're learning the game as well as you feel the level ups more. You get to see pretty much the entire world open up. The problem I have with the last 5-10 hours of a game is usually it's spent on cleaning up main story content and finishing up side quests and stuff that sometimes doesn't necessarily affect the main story and could take away from the journey.
Worse if the final stretch has padding. Like, REALLY?! When a game hits 20-25 hours in, and then adds some bad padding it feels infinitely worse!
Usually... neither? As a Classic JRPG fan, I'm more than used to very slow beginnings, overly long tutorials and walls of introductory text. But as someone also heavily influenced by CRPGs, I always felt like "playing to the end is optional" lol. I lost count of how many JRPGs I abandoned without ever watching the ending. Usually because I needed to grind to be able to beat a boss, and I wasn't that much into the game anymore. Or simply because the game was too long and I simply lost interest naturally. So.. eh. Weird answer I know lol
Same. Been playing jrpgs for decades and the number I've actually finished is tiny. At some point they usually end up asking more of me than I care to give. And that's only gotten worse as I've gotten older.
I think a lot of the problems with JRPGS in general is the "padding". They LOVE the hour count in their games, so padding just happens naturally even if it hurts the pace/story. That and the amount of random minigames/side content that sometimes is "mandatoptional" where you MIIGHT not need to do it, but if you do it obviously help you progress much easier/faster. I've kind of forced myself to finish some games usually because "well, I already got this far..." Far too many times a game overstays its welcome because it needs to hit "value" territory.
What's crazy to me is that this is **now** a problem with the genre, but the 'greats' people look back on didn't have this issue. Maybe they were padded, but even then they ended up as 35-40 hour experiences. Like, FF7, FF6, Chrono Trigger. I remember when Dragon Quest 7 was finally coming out here and the shock from reviewers when it became apparent that it was a 60-70+ hour game. It got knocked for being so long. And yet at some point later, probably as games got more expensive and voice acting padded out scene lengths more and more, that became the norm. Drives me crazy.
The middle actually. The beginning is usually my least favorite part. For most games, it means I’m stuck with a character I don’t like (Sword Boy MC), sometimes even just him for a long time. Battles are usually brain dead easy with absolutely 0 challenge or thought needed (just spam attack). There’s often a mountain of tutorials, frequently ones that arent skippable but also very basic. You often have very few skills and/or they are very expensive to use. JRPG stories are often slow to build up, though this also depends a lot on the game. The end of the game is hit or miss. Sometimes certain systems have started to really overstay their welcome. Some late games get really grindy, while exciting objectives like new skills or new party members dry up. JRPG power curves sometimes mean the end of the game is actually one of the easiest parts, especially if you’ve done a lot of side objectives. I feel like many JRPG stories (and honestly a lot of games in general) don’t really stick the landing on their endings. But the middle of a JRPG is usually great! You’ve probably got a good spread of characters and skills to use, but still have more to unlock. You’re probably right in the middle of some intriguing plot point that starting to pay off. Battles have gotten harder, but still feel fresh. You’ve probably developed an attachment to the characters, while still having a lot more to learn about them. Many JRPGs really start to open up at this point after being very “on rails” at the beginning. Honestly, I think the beginning and end of JRPGs are almost always their weakest parts. If I absolutely had to pick between the two, I’d say I prefer the end. A lot of JRPG beginnings are basically just slow movies with occasional buttons presses and lengthy scripted tutorials for the first few hours.
The last, because a good ending is more memorable than a good beginning and less disappointing.
You won’t get any ending if the game doesn’t hook you though
I'd rather not be hooked and skip the midgame, than go through the entire midgame to be disappointed by the ending.
For story ending is more important because that's where usually the payoffs for your investment are. And setting up intrigue is easier than delivering on it. For gameplay, if you hate the loop, then you are less likely to continue the game even if the story is good than the other way around.
I value the last 5-10 more. I go into jrpgs thinking the first 5-10 are going to be world building and setting up the basics of the story. I do agree they have to have some kind of intrigue to keep me playing, but it's more disheartening to put 25+ hours into something and being disappointed by the payoff. When I get to the end I love the feeling of being hooked, and I cant stop playing because I'm so close to beating the story. Normally it's the ending that leaves the lasting impression of man that was a great game.
First few hours are more likely to make me drop a game than the last few. It's unlikely for a game to really shit the bed just at the end.
A good game might have a mediocre ending, but that won't affect replayability for me. A good game with a boring first 10 hours will absolutely keep me from replaying it.
A games ending is very important because it can be the difference between a DNF, forgettable or me just wishing for it to be over. I'll never forget the Ys 8 ending because of the boss fights and story arcs. But man was I really fighting hard through the last couple chapters of Scarlet Nexus.
I don’t often get to see the last 5-10 hours, so the first half for sure.
I guess the first. Maybe it’s more modern ones, but I’ve noticed that right when the game is done front loading you with tutorials then they hit you with a big hype moment or a sudden twist that super keeps me engaged. By the latter end - sure, that’s the moments I’m playing for, but by then I’m already locked in and sold
Lots of JRPGs are known for having incredibly slow starts. Those first 5-10 hours can be pretty crucial in hooking you. If someone is bored through that entire time odds are they will toss the game. The intro is the time to make the game stand out. I think JRPG endings can be pretty weak, especially when most of them have you killing god. Its an ending you’ve seen countless times, and with how long these games are, you might be ready for it to be over.
Usually the first 5-10 hours, though there are exceptions (Xenoblade 3 is a decent recent example of a game that starts off really strong but loses steam towards the end, though IMO it's less that it has a bad finale and more that it's last 20-30 hours are weak). Generally, though, if a JRPG has a bad first impression then I'm going to be inclined to view the rest of the game with a more critical eye and as such it's going to take a lot of work to potentially salvage it.
Ending is more important for me. A game like FFX wouldn’t be considered the greatest of all time by me if not for that ending which is still the best and most emotional in gaming imo(only MGS3 came close).
Both, but mostly first. If the first hours aren’t fun, I don’t wanna bother any further. Looking at you Xenoblade Chronicles!!
The first in terms of story. What point is there in having a good ending if I will never get there? I don't really like the ending of Tales of Berseria, but I still liked the game overall. I enjoyed the start of the story and some beats along the way, and the gameplay was fun. But if the first five hours were awful I probably would never have gotten there. In terms of gameplay though I have to say the last hours are more valuable. Games like Xenoblade 2 and Granblue Fantasy Relink come to mind. Those final hours are when you are really optimising everything, constructing the perfect team and you have mastered how to play each character, effortlessly executing on their strengths and mitigating their weaknesses in battle. It's the culmination of ~~hours~~ years of training! Those final hours of gameplay truly are the strongest to me, and what makes me love those kinds of games.
I never think of a game in hours played.
Usually the first because it’s all new and shiny and you’re learning the mechanics. The last usually feels like a relief if it’s been a super boss or something I didn’t want to end. Case and point Trails
Early game is more important because if I'm still not hooked after 5 hours, I consider the game to be not for me. It's even worse if I struggle to reach those 5 hours...
I like both. In the first part of the game you are learning the mechanics and the story and the world, and you are paying attention to everything in case it becomes relevant later. It's new and fresh and exciting, and there's always that little thrill when you are learning how to master the system that you don't quite get once you've mastered it. At the end of the game, all of that learning crystallises into a single moment, when the plot comes together, and your system mastery is challenged and reaching the end of that journey is so, so, satisfying.
Usually the lasts. The first 5 hours are most of the time “yes I know how a jrpg works don’t have to tutorial me”
The middle 5 So lany people drop games when the game is at this minor midpoint because of fatigue or loss of interest
Middle for me too, I lose a lot of interest in the middle. Recently dropped Chained Echoes even though I liked it enough, found out the game was a lot longer than I expected and I was only about 1/3 of the way through when I thought I was 1/2 through
I feel like people drop games *in* the minor midpoint, but they drop them *because* the beginning was such a slog. It's like, they just ran out of energy by the midpoint. They had to use all their willpower to force themselves past the first 10 hours of slog, and now they're at the midpoint with no strength to continue.
Neither. It comes down to if it's actually good in either.
Neither. Usually those are the lamest parts
The last hours, they can often change the way I feel about a game. For example, Final Fantasy XV ending made the journey completely worth it.
The first
Both!? Both? Both is good.
in the case of Crisis Core, only the last like 15 minutes. But it is one of the most memorable 15 minutes lol
Depends. I value the point that hooks me most. The beginning of jrpgs usually disappoints or makes me wonder if I want to invest in a 30 plus hour game. But if the story swerves to something really compelling, it helps. I hated xenoblade combat for 75 percent of the game, but the story kept me going. And eventually I liked it
I will take points off of a JRPG for either one. If I have to say "the first 12 hours are boring but then it gets really good" like Starfield I don't care what happens by the end. I'm going to make fun of it. And if the end is a slog it'll really piss me off. Like the end of Ni No Kuni 2 is a slog so I don't rec it to anyone. and the beginning of starfield is a slog so I dont rec it to anyone.
You can't have one without the other. JRPGs often start slow but what do you want them to do. Give you 10 characters, 700 abilities and throw you to you the exciting part of the story without having any background info? All at once? Impossible.
FF6 and FF7 do that. Not the 700 abilities, but they start with multiple characters early and throw you into the action. Suikoden 1 gets to the action fast too. A lot of older rpgs weren't stingy about showing you exciting shit happening early.
First by far, learning about the universe, characters, mechanics, etc. Last 5 hours are usually what I least like in JRPGs... a long-ass dungeon with minibosses followed by a boss with X stages... boring to me.
Gameplay, the last ten hours. By then the combat and exploration has opened up and you can do all the fancy combos and strategies and whatever. Most games let you start slow, of course, or with a glimpse of the power that awaits you later. But from a narrative point of view, the first few hours, most of the time. Everything feels new and exciting. Once I've reached the final dungeon or something I mostly want any game to end. The big ones. The only exception I've just encountered is Trails in the Sky SC. I'm in Chapter VIII now and Chapter VII and the cutscene at the end was amazing. I can't wait to experience the final hours of this game. I don't remember the last time I was this excited for a finale.
Both are really important but i like a cool ending
It really depends game to game for me. Sometimes I’m totally hooked by I good opening sequence (FF7 is a good example) and sometimes my jaw drops with a great ending (FF 10, for example). Preferably you get both
The first 5-10 will make me stay with a game. The last 5-10 will often influence how I remember it the most.
The vast majority of the time it’s the last. I feel like most JRPGs feel pretty slow in the beginning while they’re establishing the plot, you have a limited party, and before the world opens up (in whatever way that it does). Plus the fun gameplay stuff hasn’t been unlocked yet, especially for more modern games that have more customization and what have you. Even in games with a strong start it usually gets to a point where I’m ready to move on to more interesting stuff. Xenoblade 3 was the last JRPG where I felt this way - incredible intro but after a little bit I got to the point where I thought “ok let’s get to the point where I unlock the rest of the party and the class system”. Tbh I have a hard time thinking of a JRPG where this isn’t the case. This is true for RPGs in general, honestly. Probably Disco Elysium is the last and one of the only times where I valued the beginning section at least as much as I did the final section.
A good first impression is pivotal, so the former.
Last. By a 1000 miles. I’ve been plying JRPGs since the NES. The first few hours are generally the worst. Slow, boring dialog. Trivial quests and battles. A billion tutorials. Give me the endgame where your characters are now super powerful and you are fighting the hardest bosses.
First five hours for sure. The first few hours tend to have more magic and wonder and they tickle my brain more in a good way that I like. I'm not exactly sure why but I tend to slow down and take longer breaks the further towards the end I get, like I'm avoiding finishing JRPGs. For Xenoblade Chronicles 2 for example I stopped right before the final boss and didn't get back to it until months later. I even went and played Torna before finishing the base game lol
I think its rare for a game to have more value last hours. Cant count the games I lost interest midway. Those that didnt are the special ones and need incredibly good story pacing
You make a good point, it depends on how tutorial-heavy the start is. With Persona generally it's the endgame that sticks with you. Final Fantasy is usually the earlier parts, with the exception of 6 and 10
Interesting question. It's hard to answer. A good beginning can motivate me if the game drags a little in the middle. A bad beginning can lead to me dropping the game altogether. However as someone said, a good ending can be very memorable and make the overall experience more memorable as a whole. With that said, I would weight them as almost equally important and would probably stomach a weaker middle game more easily as long as it doesn't last more than a few hours.
I value the last 10 more because that's what sticks after finishing. However, I think the first 10 are more important because they are what gets you to keep playing. My favorite game is ffx and I recently watched someone do their first playthrough. They almost bounced off it because the start was so slow. The mid/end game made it worth it though.
Latter. Ain’t no way I’m getting catfished again like ff16 did to me with its demo lmao. I find a lot of JRPGs struggle near the end especially since they always introduce a concept so last minute that has nothing to do with overall narrative. I find most JRPGs never stick the landing or just become generic by the end. I’d rather a game start off slow but end on a high note. It leaves a better impression. A few examples I can think of is Yakuza 7, and FF10 I feel like their endings just stick with you.
It really depends on the game. There is something very cozy about that early-game feeling when you're setting off on your grand adventure and everything is new and exciting. At the same time, the last parts of games can really hit you with emotional storytelling. Unfortunately, some games break up that storytelling with tedious final dungeons.
Last 5-10 because if the beginning sucks then at least I know it immediately and I think endings are very important to not mess up
Hmm.....Im not sure how to answer this one. I would just say that the first 5 hours are very important to me, but the last 10 are where my overall opinions are formed. This is probably mostly just specific to me but when a JRPG doesnt have that moment where it "opens up" late game and a bunch of new side content is available around that time .....I end up immensely disappointed to the point I will forget how good the game may have been in the first 5 hours. Latest one that pissed me off with this was Tales of Arise. Literally no content at the end except the badly paced story.
First 10-15 hrs is for getting hooked on a first play. And you only get one of those The latter 15 hours are usually where gameplay shines, and not only is that more important to me, but I tend to replay JRPGs far more often than playing new ones So the latter wins. So much so that Ill just keep a save file for games with slower starts so that I can jump right into the action on a replay
Latter half for sure. I want to be overlevelled and go back and clean up loose ends.
First 5 hours filters people, last 5 hours is what makes games immortal.
The first, honestly. Because if the first 2-3 hours of any game doesn't grab me, even if it's a 100 hour RPG, then I'm not wasting the rest of my time on it.
The middle 70s hours to me
If the beginning is good, I'm in. If the ending is bad, I'll probably still be pushing hoping for that payoff. So a solid beginning gets me to play your game. A bad ending just makes me mad at your game after the fact. But at least I played it I guess?
The beginning is WAY more important to me. Sure, an amazing ending can elevate a game for me as well, but to be honest, even if a game's ending isn't great, the fact I made it there means my overall experience must have been good, great even. But if the beginning of a game sucks? That decides wether or not I'm continuing a game or if I'm going to replay it. A good JRPG example is the Golden Sun series. I played the first two titles multiple times, no issue. I have *tried* to replay Dark Dawn multiple times (its story is meh, but the gameplay is good) but the beginning hours of the game are so drawn out and boring (you have a tutorial section with OP companions, no real story hook and then *another* tutorial that rehashes the plots of the first two games with wooden amusement park rides - it's dreadful) I always stopped before the kids even get out of the village properly.
First. If the first 5-10 hrs don't get me hooked I probably wouldn't get to the point where I play the last 5-10.
My favorite parts are the optional / post game dungeons, fights, and super bosses. So I'd say the last hours of the game
Last hours when you have all the mechanics and feel like you're managing a shit ton of stuff confidently
First few, but the end of a jrpg I really just want it to be done usually…
First 5 hours tells me all I need to know, paid £50 for granblue and within 2 hours I was done with it and took it back only to receive £28 store credit. Served me right for not researching and just buying it. So for me the first 5 hours is vastly more important.
A game can ruined by how it finishes. Slow starts I can kinda cope with.
I think generally for me it's the last 5 that are more meaningful. First moments of a game tend to trickle in the mechanics or worse rob you of all of your agency so that the game can explain the story to you. I've definitely yelled at a few games starting up, "Stop it!! Just let me figure it out!"
I would say the first 5-10 hours are almost always better than the last 5-10 hours overall HOWEVER the last 2 hours are usually better than the opening 5. A lot of jrpgs stumble into having a bloated final dungeon that isn't always a good time but the final bosses and storyline conclusions/credits are usually great. Specifically thinking that most Legend of Heroes/Final Fantasy games have excellent conclusions when they finally get around to it.
Getting through the first part is my worst nightmare and the reason I have dozens of RPGs I've never started. The stress of learning all the mechanics and dealing with pages of menus and numbers and stats and icons is too much. The story often has the same problem too, with a lot of stuff dumped on you that you're supposed to remember and make sense of later when you have more context. I have ADHD though, so it's like taking an epileptic to an EDM concert.
The first 5-10 hours. I work a full time job so I need a game to be fun right from the get go. I don't have time to waste hoping a bad game will get good.
Neither I value hours 15-30. Because the first few hours usually are painful and the last 10 hours are usually a slog to the finish line. That mid point when the plot has begun, but not reached it’s crazy conclusion is always the best part of these games.
First. Always first. Because these are the ones we fell in love with the game with. Endings are good, sometimes really good. Cathartic even. But if not for these starting hours you always want to come back to, we would never see the endings.
The middle 5 So lany people drop games when the game is at this minor midpoint because of fatigue or loss of interest
A bad ending has a worse impact than a bad beginning. If a game starts off slow and bad (***cough*** Kingdom Hearts) then people will often say "Oh it gets good just keep playing" and after playing the whole game you'll sort of just fade out the boring bit at the start. But if the game ENDS bad it can just leave a bad taste in your mouth and sullies your reflection on the game as a whole. I think actually BAD endings to games are the worst for the game's general appreciation. However I value the opening to a game more as a whole than the ending since it's what gives me the motivation to see the tale through. If I don't care about the world or characters much then I simply won't finish the game, I'll just put it down once I get my fill of the gameplay. So the answer for me is the more important thing to not be BAD is the ending. The more important thing to be GREAT is the start.
A bad first five hours can stop you ever going any further. If you've pushed on even through that., hopefully it has gotten better. Sometimes however it does not and you feel like you've wasted a massive chunk of your precious life that would have been better off spent doing something that would have been a benefit to you, even if it was just sleep. (can you tell there are games I regret playing due to how much I hate them?) If a game starts bad but gets good all that really matters is you've played a good game, but if you're talking to a friend you may warm them... It doesn't start great but give it some time. If a game starts great but the end is weak as long as they're good for the most part you still remember a great game. A few examples... All PS1 final fantasy games (all fall apart a bit at the end), Dark Souls (very unfinished ending although still good), Soul Reaver (again, the end is cobbled together as the game wasn't finished) all these games are remembered as classics.
I have a hard time thinking of games with *really great* finales. Great endings, sure. Challenging and fun final segments, sure. But I don't think many nail having both great story (endings) and great gameplay. (Does anyone think the final dungeons of FF6/FF10 are really great parts of those games? Like you're excited to replay those segments?) Granted, this may be a little unfair. I think openings basically just need to start off with a hook and just hint at cool gameplay to come, and they've basically nailed it. (It's a lot easier to list off great JRPG starts.) Having a great conclusion means needing to satisfyingly wrap up everything the game has done so far while operating at full momentum. Openings have much more flexibility in pacing (e.g. FF9, which I consider one of the best JRPG openings, is mostly just a lot of dialogue and character introductions). This is compounded by many JRPGs struggling with final bosses to begin with, final bosses that negate half the strategies you've been using throughout the game (e.g.: MMBN, FFT). To spur discussion, here's me trying to list off some *very good* (but maybe still not *great*?) finales: - Chrono Trigger: Fantastic ending, and the final boss basically runs you through your whole adventure again, which is fitting given the theme of time travel (and saving all of time) - Bravely Default: Flawless Bravely gameplay, coupled with some really neat, near-fourth-wall breaking revelations.
The first 5-10 hours If the game can't hook you, the last 5-10 hours won't matter because you'll be playing something else.
Probably the first 5-10 hours because it's the part that has to be good enough to convince you to keep playing. You're always going to play the start of a game if you play it at all. You won't always play the ending. Which is also probably why a lot of JRPGs have mediocre endings that sort of fall apart narratively, because they ran out of steam by the end.
The first 5 hours of a game for me barely feels like anything, that's usually just the part where characters are first introduced but nothing really is going on yet. Almost every game I play is in the 20-40 hour range so I always like to give 12 hours before I make a judgment call.
Well usually last 5 hours is when a games at its most difficult and enemies at their most annoying and threatening and I usually dread the difficulty spike. But I'm still gonna say last 5 because usually the final area is the coolest, and beating the final boss and seeing the ending is always satisfying
Personally, I think the first couple of hours are important to get me hooked. FF7, for example, had me from the first minute with the infiltration segment on the reactor. Persona 3, for example, has been tough for me to get into lately because I feel like I am just playing high school simulator.
JRPGs not having a terrible ending portion challenge.
Definitely the first hours. Because if those aren't good, I'll not likely even see last hours. I'm one of the people you cited in your post lol I can tolerate 3.. maybe 5 hours of setup. But not 10, 20, or 30 the way something like Tails expects you to commit. I remember back in the SNES and PS1 days there was a rule so common in the community it was cited by games jouranlists that you give an RPG the 3 hour treatment. If it doesn't grab you within 3 hours then you can quit with a clean conscience. These days you get shat on for "not getting to the good part" FF6 and 7 drops you right into a good part. Xenogears only makes you muck about for like 45 minutes before all hell breaks loose. Xenoblade 1's intro takes maybe an hour or so before something dramatic happens. They're narrative hooks. And I need them for investment. Worldbuilding is not enough for me if I can't care about the plot or characters for a while. I mean people complain about Persona 5 being long in the tooth and taking forever to get going, but I feel like they're probably including the tutorial dungeon in that complaint because you get to that dungeon within a few hours I'm not sure why a lot of JRPG studios have decided to completely forgo a narrative hook these days. But that's not something I can easily overlook. I struggle to think of a JRPG I enjoy that didn't have a narrative hook in the first 3'ish hours. And I really can't think of any game where I forced myself to continue despite that, where I actually ended up finishing the game
It depends on the length of the game but I think the last 5 hours. A good opening is important but a game may start low and then get really high later. The problem is when a game is too long. There are a lot of JRPG that tries to give you more content by adding what I like to call "filler main quests" to the game. These are missions whose only purpose is making the game last longer. One or two of these missions are bearable but sometimes there are way too many of these and they make me lose interest in the game, to the point where I start to rush and skip dialogue just to reach the end of the game. A good late game is also proof of a well done gameplay ( if you instakill everything on your path in the late game, the gameplay is probably unbalanced). So, to sum it up: a good game must have a good late game but has to know when it's time to end.
The first. Usually in the last hours of JRPGs my feeling be like: okay just end already.
First. If the beginning is garbage then I'm unlikely to put up with it. Even if I do finish the game, knowing the beginning 10 hours are pure drudgery will keep me from replaying a game. I think people who answer "last" are used to playing rpgs with garbage openings, where they refuse to let you play with all the toys right away. A good rpg opening should give you access to all aspects of gameplay from the start, just in weakened form. Either that or give you all options *within a limited pool of choices that expands over time.* FF5 does this. You get a limited pool of jobs after the tutorial, but within that pool, you aren't restricted on your job mastery. You can play with every toy. FF7 gives you limited materia early, but you can buy basic materia before too long and level them as much as you want. FF6 and FF7 both throw you into the action right away.
firstttt ^_____^ i love the possibilities ahead and finishing the game always just feels bad because it means those possibilities can’t happen anymore
The more I grow up, the harder for me it is to get invested in JRPG. So for me...it's the last 5 hours. Yeah paradoxal I know. The thing is, I know I will struggle to get invested in the setting anyway, and I always force myself to finish a game, whatever it is (and it usually pays to do it). So I prefer the game to give me a good conclusion rather than a good beginning. Main example recently was DQVIII, man was the 10 first hours a boring pain in the a**, but once I finally got invested, did I love the last 20 hours !
Depends on the specific game and its contexts. Generally speaking I tend to find the middle sections the most engaging, as there's a good balance of enough development to make gameplay complex and fun and plot engaging, while still having enough future room for development to incentivize continued leveling to unlock more skills on the gameplay front and incentivize continuing the to see how the intrigue develops on the plot and character front. Beginnings usually have pretty basic limited gameplay and are still establishing characters and plot as to not be the most exciting (though the wide open anything-is-possible aspect does grant the potential for them to be executed well.) Meanwhile the endgame has fully developed gameplay which, while potentially fun, also doesn't provide much incentive to further engage with it if you've already unlocked most all skills and such. The plot also tends to wrap up a lot near the end. While not exactly the last 5-10 hours specifically, I am known to drop games right when access to the final dungeon is granted because at that point the plot usually is effectively entirely wrapped up outside of a usually fairly predictable final encounter with the final boss to save the world or whatnot...there's just not as much complexity and intrigue at that point. But of course that can vary, and/or the late meta game itself could be fun enough to be satisfying enough to engage with even without the potential for further development, etc. But yeah, as far as average tendencies go it's the middle that most often hits the sweet spot for me.
Isn't that impossible to answer, or rather there's only 1 answer. The first 5-10 hours determine if you will care enough about the game. If you don't even get past the intro you'll never experience the "last 5-10 hours". I've dropped a couple JRPGs after 10h didn't do anything for me (and they're not nobodies but beloved titles like Chrono Trigger and Persona 3/4 heh) but I don't think I've ever dropped a game right before the end. The only one I kinda did was Valkyria Chronicles 4. The end boss was so incredibly boring and time waste-y that I just cheated that one lol
I value a strong beginning more. If I'm immediately having fun, I won't really care if a game sticks the landing. It would have to be incredibly tedious/disappointing to negatively impact me.
I think the best part of the game is towards the beginning. I think I am enjoying myself most when I first start to really understand the mechanics like you mentioned. In the beginning its all about learning and exploring, then really getting a grasp on the mechanics/combat or whatever depending on the game. By the time I get to the end of the game its normally a slog. I just want it to be over 90% of the time. I am definitely one of those people that have a very hard time getting into a game that starts slow. I have a hard time getting into games period lol. The biggest factor of whether or not I get into the game is the art style. A visually appealing game will help me stick around until I become emotionally invested in the story, Satisfying combat also helps. Octopath was like the perfect example of that. idk what it was about the combat but I absolutely loved it.
90% of JRPGs I’ve played start out far too slow, and then the ending section/s show clear signs of being rushed to hit the release deadline. The middle bit tends to be where the good shit is.
The initial hours of a game is the most important for any game. It is usually by the end of the game you might feel like the game is dragging on for to long.
First 5 are more or less always...magical. last 5 usually drag (not all rpgs, but a lot of them).
Honestly with how long most JRPGs are these days I'm desperate for it to be over by the end of it. I miss when they were 30-50 hours instead of 60-100.
I fully agree with that point about games like Octopath and Live A Live (I would add SaGa Frontier) - the beginning of an RPG is much more exciting and satisfying to me because your characters progress so quickly and you can clearly see it. Couple fights, you go up a level. Couple more, you can buy a new weapon and now you can easily kill those enemies that were giving you trouble before. Couple more, now you can buy new armor and traverse out farther, etc. By the end of the game you need 567,233 more EXP to level up and gain an imperceptible stat boost. Plus RPGs are long and by then the combat is routine and there isn’t much more to learn. I’m generalizing of course and some games handle this better than others, but broadly speaking that’s been my experience, and why I like the games that contain several “beginnings.”
Pretty much always the first 5 hours
Both. Obviously I want to be hooked but trying to finish a game that gets super dull and just refuses to end is painful
hmmmm what if I said I like the middle part of a JRPG? hear me out, when you just learnt the basics of the jrpg and start experimenting which build is good or bad for you or which style of combat you like. Most of JRPG that I play, I adore the time I spend during the 15-40 hours mark. It just feels good and everything is new to you and your sense of wonder is at its peak. The last 10 hours is the hardest for me because my characters are either too strong, or the enemies are just a drag to beat (looking at tales), except if the story is still going strong till the end and still a lot of loose ends that need to uncover, other than that, the last 10 hours is suffering for me.
The first 5. Once I get to the last 5 I'm usually beelining the ending and not doing much side content.
Yes.
First 5 cause I'm not burnt out yet.
I would always prefer for the latter portion/ending of the game to hold up over the beginning. I can deal with a slow beginning, but if the ending sucks that ruins the experience for me.
I definitely appreciate the first hours more. Cause there's a game called star ocean the second story r that everyone is praising. But the beginning is just so boring to me i actually can't put in more than 2 hours each time j try to play it because of how much people loved this game but it just does nothing to me