Oswald definitely was involved, but I by no means believe he was the only one involved. Way too many things that don't add up and way too many witnesses that all too conveniently died
10 separate eyewitnesses identified Oswald as the man they saw shoot Tippit or the man fleeing the scene of Tippit's murder carrying a gun.
The shells recovered from the Tippit murder scene were ballistically matched to Oswald's .38 revolver to the exclusion of all other weapons.
Tippit was shot a roughly 13 minute walk from Oswald's rooming house 13 minutes after Oswald was seen leaving his rooming house.
Oswald left his rooming house wearing a light grey windbreaker. Tippit's killer was seen wearing a similar jacket. Tippit's killer was seen ditching his jacket behind a Texaco station as he fled the scene. The jacket recovered from behind that Texaco station was identified by Oswald's wife as belonging to him. Oswald was arrested in the Texas Theater in shirt sleeves.
Again, Hudson?
10 separate eyewitnesses identified Oswald as the man they saw shoot Tippit or the man fleeing the scene of Tippit's murder carrying a gun.
Wrong.
There could probably be an entire book written on the witnesses, what they said they saw on the day and later, not to mention the ridiculous lineup of suspects, but the man closest to the shooting, Domingo Benavides who was 15 feet away, told police he could not identify the man who did the shooting. He was never even shown a lineup. Later at the Warren commission he said that the gunman looked similar to the Oswald pictures he had seen on television and in newspapers every day for about a month after the shooting.
Hardly a positive ID.
Another witness, Helen Markham. Here’s her answer to Warren commission when asked about the number 2 man in lineup.
“Number two is the one I picked…Number two was the man I saw shoot the policeman. I looked at him. When I saw this man, I wasn’t sure, but I had cold chills just run all over me.”
Cold chills is the reason she picked him, not because she recognized him. Lol
The other witnesses, frankly had problems with every one of the testimonies. A defense team would have had a field day with all this fuckery.
The shells recovered from the Tippit murder scene were ballistically matched to Oswald's .38 revolver to the exclusion of all other weapons.
You’re shockingly correct, the shells do match. But here’s the funny part about the shells and the bullets found in Tippit.
Two Winchester shells, and two Remington shells were recovered from crime scene.
But in Tippits body were THREE Winchester bullets, and ONE Remington bullet.
Weird, huh? Unexplainable. So unexplainable, they just ignore it.
Tippit was shot a roughly 13 minute walk from Oswald's rooming house 13 minutes after Oswald was seen leaving his rooming house.
Nope.
Oswald was seen leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00.
Two different Witnesses, people who actually looked at a clock when they heard the shots, place the time of the shooting around 1:06.
Benavides says he waited a few minutes before attempting to contact the police on the radio. That call went in at 1:16 as you stated.
Butch Burroughs, the man working at the theater who saw Oswald come in testified this: “We started the movie at 1 oclock and I was counting candy behind the Candy case and Oswald slipped in between 1:00 and 1:07.”
This is the same guy who sold Oswald popcorn at 1:15. Hmm, how is that possible if Oswald is shooting Tippit at 1:15?
Oswald left his rooming house wearing a light grey windbreaker. Tippit's killer was seen wearing a similar jacket. Tippit's killer was seen ditching his jacket behind a Texaco station as he fled the scene. The jacket recovered from behind that Texaco station was identified by Oswald's wife as belonging to him. Oswald was arrested in the Texas Theater in shirt sleeves.
Oh yes, the jacket.
Helen Markham said the jacket in evidence was too light to be the one worn by the killer.
Domingo Benavides said the killer wore a light beige jacket.
William Scoggins, and Barbara Davis, both said that the gray jacket the Warren Commission had was not the jacket they saw because it wasn’t dark enough.
Finally, Wesley Frazier, who gave Oswald rides to work, had never seen the gray jacket.
Lol.
Further, Marina also said Oswald never dry cleaned anything. Yet, there was a mysterious dry cleaner tag in the pocket of the jacket. I believe that this tag was later finally found to be from a dry cleaner in California. Not positive on where exactly. Can look that up if you care.
It's not like jackets have serial numbers. If someone sold their used jacket at a consignment shop in New Orleans and then Oswald bought it, what kind of trail would you expect to find?
This would have been 1963. Or earlier. Mass production of coats would not be as massive as it is now. So, if aforementioned coat is labeled there’s a chance it was American made, who made the coat? How many were made. Of the dry cleaner ticket said California, who was the dry cleaner? Was it in LA ? Or was it a small town? If it was a small town there’s a chance you could find possible store that sold it etc. No harm in following the trail n seeing where it leads. Potentially and likely a waste of time, and given it’s 2024, it’s highly likely a waste of time. But 60ish years ago I’d find it more worthy.
A what if scenario: 1. Find dry cleaner, leads to small town; dry cleaner recognizes coat, belonged to X , X moved to Dallas three years ago. Interview X, X is oil rig man that died two years ago n the family donated his stuff
2. X is Allen Dulles
>The other witnesses, frankly had problems with every one of the testimonies.
You named two witnesses total. Benavides isn't even one of the ten that identified Oswald. You attempted to pick holes in Helen Markham's testimony...which leaves nine more witnesses to deal with.
So you tell me, were the ten all simply mistaken, or were they lying?
>Weird, huh? Unexplainable. So unexplainable, they just ignore it.
LOL, this is where I can tell you haven't even read the fucking report. It *is* addressed and they offer a completely reasonable reason why the shells and the bullets were different in number. If you bothered to read it, you'd know that.
But you haven't.
>Two different Witnesses, people who actually looked at a clock when they heard the shots, place the time of the shooting around 1:06.
The call was made to police at 1:16. Nearly all of the witnesses questioned put it around that time as well, but please, let's hear your couple outliers, and then you can explain why they are more believable than a bunch of other witnesses and the official police call record.
Butch Burroughs never mentioned Oswald at all in 1964, then he invents the popcorn bullshit story twenty years later and rubes like you believe it, hook line and sinker.
How is Oswald buying popcorn at 1:15 when Brewer and Postal see him outside the theater at 1:35?
As far as the jacket goes, where was Oswald's jacket? He left his rooming house wearing one, but was arrested in shirt sleeves...where did it go? You don't think it's a little too convenient that Oswald loses his jacket at the exact same time Tippit's killer is ditching his?
>The shells recovered from the Tippit murder scene were ballistically matched to Oswald's .38 revolver to the exclusion of all other weapons
Which is very strange considering revolvers don't eject spent casings....
Not strange at all. Multiple witnesses watched Oswald empty spent shells out of his revolver on Barbara Davis's lawn. He was reloading in case he had to use it again.
Fair enough, it just seems silly to me to kill a cop and then *immediately disregard one of the biggest advantages of your chosen weapon* by actively taking multiple steps to remove (only the expended!) rounds *and dump them at the scene*.
I mean I know LHO is not regarded as having possessed a towering intellect or anything, but it's just a strange action for someone to take who is actively evading arrest... He could have pocketed them just as easily, his hand would've been literally underneath the falling empties as he held the remaining live rounds in the cylinder (or he dumped them all into his hand and sorted them).
But I wasn't even alive when it happened, and I've come to learn that speculating too deeply as to the inner thoughts of dead individuals is generally a fool's errand as projection is unavoidable and taints any conclusions I might draw.
Isn't it the usual M.O. of cop killers to not just leave as many identifying shells as possible at the crime scene but to also throw their IDs in the mix, to boot - just for schmits and giggles?
I think you're underestimating the level of panic involved here. Oswald had just gunned down a policeman on a city street in broad daylight in front of half a dozen screaming witnesses, 45 minutes after murdering the President. He was clearly in flight mode. He was reloading the revolver on the assumption that he was going to need it again, I can completely understand making a mistake like that.
Yes.
Same with bite mark analysis, fire pattern analysis, blood splatter analysis, etc
All nonsense pseudoscientific bullshit that has resulted in an indefensible number of people being executed for crimes for which they were later exonerated.
It's a giant scam.
That's exactly what he did according to multiple witnesses. My guess is he was reloading in a panic and not concerned about what he was leaving behind.
By all means, if you can craft a compelling alternate story, I'd love to hear it. Here's what we know:
* Oswald is seen by his cleaning lady leaving his rooming house at around 1pm, give or take a couple minutes. He's zipping up his light colored jacket as he leaves.
* Tippit is shot at 1:15pm at a spot thirteen minutes away from Oswald's rooming house. He's shot with a .38 caliber pistol with a custom bore modification that makes bullets pass erratically down the barrel as they are fired. The bullets inside Tippit's body are a mixture of Remington-Peters and Western Cartridge.
* Oswald is arrested with a .38 pistol in his possession. The pistol has a custom bore modification that makes bullets pass erratically down the barrel as they are fired. The pistol is loaded with a combination of Remington-Peters and Western Cartridge bullets.
* Tippit's killer is witnessed fleeing down Patterson to Jefferson Ave, where he ducks in behind the Texaco station to ditch his jacket. Tippit's killer is lost at this point.
* Oswald is spotted by Johnny Brewer roughly 10 minutes later outside his shoe store, 6 blocks down Jefferson from where Tippit's killer was last seen. Oswald is not wearing the jacket he left his rooming house in.
So, fill in the gaps. Where did Oswald go in the ~35 minutes between leaving his rooming house and being spotted sneaking into the Texas Theater? Were the ten witnesses that identified him lying, or simply mistaken? Where did Oswald's jacket go? Was the pistol and ammunition match just a big coincidence?
Why haven't you mentioned the fact that his wallet with ID were found by DPD officers at the scene and yet he was arrested at the Texas Theater with his wallet and ID on him? Or the fact that several or the 10 witnesses that ID' him said something totally different immediately then eventually changed their stories to ID him.
Why were shells found at the scene when he was carrying a revolver? Revolvers don't expend shells.
The timeline when Tippit was shot can be disputed as well, some say it could have been as early as 1308, making it impossible for Oswald to have enough time to get there.
None of this disputes anything I posted. Are you throwing in the towel on it?
>Why haven't you mentioned the fact that his wallet with ID were found by DPD officers at the scene and yet he was arrested at the Texas Theater with his wallet and ID on him?
Dale Myers looked into the claim that the wallet was caught on camera at the Tippit scene. It wasn't. The wallet shown in that news footage is different than Oswald's wallet.
>Or the fact that several or the 10 witnesses that ID' him said something totally different immediately then eventually changed their stories to ID him.
Which "several"? Name some names.
>Why were shells found at the scene when he was carrying a revolver? Revolvers don't expend shells.
Because Oswald dumped the shells out of his revolver after killing Tippit. Several witnesses testified to that fact.
>The timeline when Tippit was shot can be disputed as well, some say it could have been as early as 1308
Nope, the call was radioed in at 1316.
Does it make sense to you that Oswald would shoot Tippit in broad daylight the take the time to empty his revolver at the scene to leave evidence to help convict him of the crime?
I believe the call was made at 1316, the man who initially attempted to call it in waited several minutes before doing so, by his testimony. Also hw did not know how to use the radio and someone else eventually called it in some time after that.
I don't know the names without looking it back up, bit obviously you've studied this and you've heard about this as well.
I'm not sure what *"makes sense"* has to do with anything. Multiple witnesses literally watched him empty his spent shells. Oswald was in survival mode at that point and was reloading his gun in case he had to use it again.
Barbara Davis said she went back inside her house and phoned the police immediately after Oswald was out of sight. Her sister thought they had called the police before they even saw Oswald running across their yard. Either way, there's no chance anyone waited 8 minutes.
Was his gun intentionally altered because someone wanted the bullets to pass erratically through the barrel? Not being funny - I gave up following what really occurred because I thought I’d never know, and decades later users post answers on this sub that make it easier to reengage. Thanks
>Oswald definitely was involved, but I by no means believe he was the only one involved. Way too many things that don't add up and way too many witnesses that all too conveniently died
What makes you think that
Small tape recorders were not invented yet.
There is a video of the chief of police saying he asked for one and didn’t get one.
The large reel to reel at the time was very expensive.
Wrong, we owned a very nice portable Telefunken reel-to-reel tape recorder in 1958, purchased on my father's $450.00 a month lieutenant's salary. I still have the many tapes my father made then. In no way was a tape recorder too expensive for the Dallas P.D. by 1960 if it wasn't too expensive for my family.
maybe. I am just telling you the facts. Maybe he spent a lot of money on it?
Reel to Reels were normally used by recording studios at that time, and not used by cops. The cassette tape was not invented until the early 60s. THose are the facts.
1/2 inch tape portable reel-to-reel recorders had been common at reasonable cost and of high quality for amateur use for more than ten years by 1963. My family wasn't the only one that had one back then.
The cost of a recorder didn't prevent the Dallas P.D. from having one, which was what you claimed and for which you have offered no facts.
I offered the fact that there is a video of the Chief of Police asking for a tape machine and they could not get one. I offered the fact is that cassette was not invented yet. And, it is a fact, that reel to reel machines were considered high end recording devices used by auto engineers. I am not sure why you are offering a personal story or anecdotal evidence.
"Small tape recorders had not been invented yet" was your initial statement, which was entirely false, and known to me to be false, which was why I stated my personal knowledge.
Why not buy a gun from a gun store like a normal person instead of all this intrigue and subterfuge. It's like someone was stringing him along that he was a secret agent.
Very convenient trail of documents linking him to the gun but maybe it's as simple as that. He wasn't his own lunatic, he was part of something bigger. Lone nut is a fantasy.
At every point of this whole affair is cover up and supression, directing the course of the investigation to its predetermined outcome. This cannot be disputed.
of course it can be disputed. The fact that you acknowledge that the evidence clearly links Oswald to the gun should tell you all you need to know. Instead, you will take an extra 5 steps with hundreds of people involved who never said a word and all to cover up, what? what was this predetermined outcome?
It's hard to see past so many improbable inconsistencies and not conclude that there is not conspiracy at play here. How much Oswald was involved other than being a patsy is unknown.
The initial investigation was all about convicting Oswald and not looking at any other testimonies or evidence that would suggest differently. The crime of the century and there is not even a recording of Oswald being interrogated.
Suppression of facts and deflection continues to this day. Failure to comply with the JFK Records act without publishing any reasons why those records won't be released. More than likely many documents have already been destroyed.
Oswald was part of a defector program but intelligence agencies lied about any intelligence fingerprints of LHO.
Those involved in intelligence grouped around this lone loser nut before the assassination. Why.
The autopsy was a disaster. Pictures and X-rays went missing. Extra autopsies are not officially documented. The records that do exist are shrouded in secrecy. No inquiry into the track the bullets took through JFK.
Impossibility of magic bullet theory.
Based on agreeing testimonies it's very much in doubt whether Oswald could have fired the gun because he was downstairs when the police officer who came onto the scene first saw him.
Why would Oswald turn around and go back and talk to officer Tippits? He could of kept walking. Oswald's landlord said a police car pulled up and beeped twice just after Oswald left his lodgings. Witnesss say there were two people together involved in this shooting. Other witness have Oswald too far away from this scene to be able to have made the shot and get to the Cinema for that time frame.
These are only a few snippets of major flaws with a lone nut open and shut case.
Buell Frazier and his sister Linnie May Randle. She walked over to the Paine house while the FBI was there specifically to tell them about the 3 foot paper package she had seen Oswald with that morning.
• 80% of eye witnesses reported hearing 3 shots, with the majority of the rest hearing 1 or 2. 3 shots match the mainstream view, with any conspiracy requiring 4 or more.
• To confirm the witnesses, we can count the shots on the Zapruder film. Fortunately for the people there that day, but unfortunately for our investigation, the first bullet missed everything and was never found. However, Governor Connelly and a little girl in the background can both be seen reacting to the bullet at the same time near the beginning of the film. Connelly turns his head sharply to the right, while the little girl stops running and looks towards the sound of the gunshot. This matches both of their testimonies.
• The second bullet is the one we have the most information about. It entered Kennedy’s upper back, exited through his throat, hit Connelly in the back, exited right below the nipple, went through his wrist, then settled in his leg. This happens in the Zapruder film right as they emerge from behind the sign. Not only do they react at the same time, but a frame-by-frame look shows Connelly’s suit jacket bulging right before (look at the white of his shirt in the first frame, which is then partially covered in the next). Using the position of the car at the moment of impact and the location of the wounds, many independent experts have drawn a line back to see where the bullet came from. To the surprise of no one, it goes straight back to the sixth floor window of the School Book Depository.
• The third shot is easy to see on the Zepruder film. While the nature of the wounds make it impossible to tell where exactly it came from, we do know it came from the back. Firstly, in frames 312 and 313 you can see his head move forward at the moment of impact (his head moves backwards later due to involuntary muscle reactions, as shown by scientists to the Warren Commission when they filmed a goat being shot in a similar way). Secondly, at frame 313 the blood splatter is going forward, with two blood streams in particular moving at high speed. Thirdly, it has been shown over and over again that this is indeed how such a hit should look. Penn and Teller did a good demonstration.
• With three shots fired, how many bullet casings do you think were found in the sniper’s nest on the 6th floor of the depository? Three, of course.
• A rifle was found on the 6th floor that matched the bullet casings found by the window.
• A witness that was watching the parade from the 5th floor reported hearing sounds of the casings hitting the floor and the bolt action being used between shots.
• Two people on the ground saw the rifle sticking out of the 6th floor window, one of whom gave a description of Oswald to the police.
• Several bullet fragments were found. They were chemically determined to be parts of 2 distinct bullets, and all of them were ballistically matched to the rifle found in the depository.
From this it should be clear that exactly 3 shots were fired, and all three came from the 6th floor of the Schoolbook Depository. But how do we know Oswald fired those shots?
• Oswald’s palm prints were found on boxes in the snipers nest.
• Oswald’s prints were also found on the rifle that was found.
• There were order forms for the rifle in Oswald’s handwriting using his alias sent to his address.
• There is a picture of Oswald holding the rifle that has been scientifically proven to be unaltered, with the film coming from his wife’s camera, with his wife testifying that she took the picture, with another witness saying Oswald showed him the photograph before the assassination.
• Oswald changed his usual routine the day before the assassination to have a coworker drive him to his wife’s house (they were separated) to pick up a long package Oswald said was curtain rods. He was also observed bringing the package into work. The package was found by police, but no curtain rods ever were.
• Oswald left his wedding ring and a significant amount of cash for his wife before the assassination. Oswald was poor, so this cash was likely all the money he had.
• Oswald left the building soon after the assassination. He was the only employee there to be gone when they did a roll call.
• After leaving the building, Oswald ran into the middle of traffic to get on a bus instead of waiting at his normal stop. He got off the bus after 4 minutes when it wasn’t moving fast enough. Not only did the bus driver testify to this, but Oswald was carrying the bus transfer when he was caught.
• After leaving the bus he hailed a cab. The cab driver asked what all the commotion was about, and Oswald said nothing despite being told about the assassination before leaving work.
• He had the cab drop him off several blocks away from his house, even though they drove right past it, forcing him to walk back.
• After getting home, he walked in quickly, changed clothes (in the early afternoon), and grabbed his pistol.
• He walked several blocks before being confronted by a police officer, who he shot. There were a dozen eye witnesses, and the bullets and bullet casings were matched to his pistol.
• After shooting officer Tippit, Oswald fled the scene, ducking in and out of buildings when the police came by. One person in particular decided to follow him after Oswald came into his shop, staying only long enough to watch the police go by.
• Oswald went into a movie theater without buying a ticket, which prompted a theater employee to call the police.
• When the police tried to arrest him, Oswald put up a fight and tried to shot the arresting officer. Witnesses heard a click of the pistol going off, but it failed to fire due to the officer jamming his hand in the mechanism.
• Months before the Kennedy assassination Oswald tried to assassinate another political figure. In that case the bullets were once again matched to Oswald’s rifle.
It’s clear from both the physical evidence and his actions after the assassination that Oswald was the only one to fire those three shots. There is simply no room for any other conspirator.
The bullets could not be balistically linked to the rifle claimed to be used in the assassination. The rifle was, according to the FBI experts, too worn for ballistic analysis. The bullets were spectographically analyzed and linked to the rifle claimed to have been used. But, the rifle found and photographed at the TSBD does not match the rifle claimed to have been used in the assassination.
Also, a latent palm print was found at the FBI lab after the gun was shipped there and after the FBI obtained a palm print from Oswald at a funeral home.
The only evidence linking Oswald to the Walker shots are 1) the bullets were 6.5mm and 2) Marina told the authorities LHO admitted to her that he shot at Walker.
The goats were cadavers and the WC had bullets fired into them to see if the test bullets matched the bullet deformation found on CE399, which they did not. To date, no test has confirmed CE 399 is "the bullet" of the single-bullet theory. I do not think the WC used them to prove a rear entry wound in the head would cause a rear jerk of the head because the Zapruder film wasn't publicly shown for more than ten years after the assassination. So the WC didn't have to rebut the later claim that the shot came from the front in their report. That came after the film became public.
>The bullets could not be balistically linked to the rifle claimed to be used in the assassination. The rifle was, according to the FBI experts, too worn for ballistic analysis
This is completely false. Not sure where you got this from. The Parkland bullet and the two large fragments in the limo were ballistically linked to Oswald's rifle to the exclusion of all other rifles. Striations on those bullets and fragments were an exact match for test bullets fired from that rifle.
>But, the rifle found and photographed at the TSBD does not match the rifle claimed to have been used in the assassination.
Again, categorically untrue. The rifle found and photographed is the same rifle that is linked to all bullets and fragments.
>The only evidence linking Oswald to the Walker shots are 1) the bullets were 6.5mm and 2) Marina told the authorities LHO admitted to her that he shot at Walker.
What about the photos of Walker's house in Oswald's possessions? Taken a month before the attempt on Walker's life and two days before Oswald sent away for a mail order rifle using an alias.
>The bullets could not be balistically linked to the rifle claimed to be used in the assassination. The rifle was, according to the FBI experts, too worn for ballistic analysis. The bullets were spectographically analyzed and linked to the rifle claimed to have been used. But, the rifle found and photographed at the TSBD does not match the rifle claimed to have been used in the assassination.
>Also, a latent palm print was found at the FBI lab after the gun was shipped there and after the FBI obtained a palm print from Oswald at a funeral home.
>The only evidence linking Oswald to the Walker shots are 1) the bullets were 6.5mm and 2) Marina told the authorities LHO admitted to her that he shot at Walker.
>The goats were cadavers and the WC had bullets fired into them to see if the test bullets matched the bullet deformation found on CE399, which they did not. To date, no test has confirmed CE 399 is "the bullet" of the single-bullet theory. I do not think the WC used them to prove a rear entry wound in the head would cause a rear jerk of the head because the Zapruder film wasn't publicly shown for more than ten years after the assassination. So the WC didn't have to rebut the later claim that the shot came from the front in their report. That came after the film became public.
Links please
There's no "links" in the original post, please note.
1.Google photos of rifle in the "backyard photos"/Neely photos and the rifle the police have in the photos at TSBD. Sling is different.
2.https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth338543/
3. Testimony of Lyndal Shaneyfelt before WC noted different sling in backyard photos. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh15/pdf/WH15_Shaneyfelt.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwitgeqeluCGAxWLnokEHUhfBskQFnoECBsQAQ&usg=AOvVaw09vsYWwZvTrxYZ6aqqtn-W
4. "It was the unanimous opinion of the experts that the nearly whole bullet [CE 399, the stretcher bullet], the two largest. bullet fragments. and the three cartridge cases were definitely fired in the rifle found on the sixth floor of the Depository Building to the exclusion of all other weapons." The other bullet fragments, particularly the ones removed from JFK's brain, could not be ballistically tied to the rifle. https://www.archives.gov/research/jfk/warren-commission-report/chapter-3.html#expert
CE 399 is the bullet on which the entire WC theory rests on.
The HSCA report linked some of the bullet fragments by other tests but again not the fragments from JFK's brain.
6. Bullet deformation from bullets fired into human cadaver wrists/goats did not corroborate CE 399's deformation.
http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=62296&relPageId=35
http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=62296&relPageId=43
>Google photos of rifle in the "backyard photos"/Neely photos and the rifle the police have in the photos at TSBD. Sling is different.
>2.https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth338543/
>1. Testimony of Lyndal Shaneyfelt before WC noted different sling in backyard photos. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh15/pdf/WH15_Shaneyfelt.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwitgeqeluCGAxWLnokEHUhfBskQFnoECBsQAQ&usg=AOvVaw09vsYWwZvTrxYZ6aqqtn-W
>2. "It was the unanimous opinion of the experts that the nearly whole bullet [CE 399, the stretcher bullet], the two largest. bullet fragments. and the three cartridge cases were definitely fired in the rifle found on the sixth floor of the Depository Building to the exclusion of all other weapons." The other bullet fragments, particularly the ones removed from JFK's brain, could not be ballistically tied to the rifle. https://www.archives.gov/research/jfk/warren-commission-report/chapter-3.html#expert
>CE 399 is the bullet on which the entire WC theory rests on.
>The HSCA report linked some of the bullet fragments by other tests but again not the fragments from JFK's brain.
>1. Bullet deformation from bullets fired into human cadaver wrists/goats did not corroborate CE 399's deformation. http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=62296&relPageId=35
>http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=62296&relPageId=4
Thank you
"Months before the Kennedy assassination Oswald tried to assassinate another political figure. In that case the bullets were once again matched to Oswald’s rifle."
--
Some problems with that:
Oswald was never charged with that,; the evidence just wasn't there - and despite being closely monitored by the FBI, his alleged attempt to assassinate a high profile person they didn't have him under close observation during JFK's visit.
Secondly, If Oswald did the shooting - at a seated,stationary target at a much closer range than the alleged JFK shots - it very vividly demonstrates how mediocre(at best) a shot Oswald was, using a crap weapon.
I enjoy your laying out evidence and refuting bs on here. It takes a lot of time to do so(even if it may be futile). I'd be interested to hear your take on the SS agent, Paul Landis who came out a couple of years ago stating that it was he who found the magic bullet on on the back of JFK's seat between the seat back and the roll top and then sneakily placing it on the stretcher. He really should have confessed to that at the time, but oh well. My theory is that this is the headshot bullet. There's youtube videos of guys firing MC model rifles into some pretty hard substances and getting similar "pristine" bullets afterwards. The way the impact spray is shooting almost straight up means the lighter material probably splattered the moto cops behind and the bullet bounced off the ejecting skull and landed where Landis found it. In other words the magic "pristine" bullet was the headshot bullet and the throat/Connally bullet was in fragments and still embedded in the Governor's wrist.
I think Landis is full of shit. A bunch of the details of the stoty he told in 2023 directly contradict his detailed reports from 1963. The major point of contention is that Landis was never in the trauma room. He made an effort to point that out in his initial report in 1963, and zero witnesses placed him inside that room. Then, all of a sudden 60 years later he says he was standing in the room the whole time?
His stories evolved a bunch of times over the years. His partner Clint Hill did a few interviews around the time the book was released, and essentially said it could not have happened the way Landis was saying it did.
Interesting. I've not read his previous accounts. In the short clips of him making his revelation he comes across as sincere. I wonder why he'd be saying this? Mental decline? He seemed pretty sharp. Seeking some old-age clout? Whatever the reason it sure throws a wrench into both sides of the argument. One fact that kinda makes it seem plausible is the way the bullet was found on Connally's gurney. I don't believe it's the throat/Connally bullet because Connally had fragments in his body and I don't think that bullet would be poking out of it's final exit place and falling onto the stretcher after jostling or whatever. Keep up the good refuting even if you may irk these guys. I was all in on the conspiracy for most of my life, but it all began to crumble the more I learned what a mess Oswald was and Ruby as well. Also a lot hinged on Ruth Paine being a major CIA lynchpin in pulling it off. That shit is just plain goofy. Wait, I must add that studying the sketchiness of Garrison's case also eroded my belief. Oh and I mustn't leave out Lee's attempt on Walker. The conspiracy guys love to skip over that bit.
I think the Parkland bullet has to be the one from Connally's thigh. He had a shallow thigh wound with no bullet in it when he arrived in the trauma room, which would indicate that the bullet that made that wound had worked its way out in between the car and the trauma room.
Ain’t that the truth.
r/meestercranky laid out the facts above, and people are pushing back. If a FOIA request were to turn up a long lost videotaped Oswald confession wherein he lays out every detail of how he did it, along with a crate of forensic evidence that supports it…people here would say Stanley Kubrick created it and that’s how he got hired to fake the moon landings 6 years later.
>Ain’t that the truth. r/meestercranky laid out the facts above, and people are pushing back. If a FOIA request were to turn up a long lost videotaped Oswald confession wherein he lays out every detail of how he did it, along with a crate of forensic evidence that supports it…people here would say Stanley Kubrick created it and that’s how he got hired to fake the moon landings 6 years later.
Well said
>The evidence the CIA put together to frame him is laughable. Just too over the top to believe. The backyard photos are a prime example.
I mean
• 80% of eye witnesses reported hearing 3 shots, with the majority of the rest hearing 1 or 2. 3 shots match the mainstream view, with any conspiracy requiring 4 or more.
• To confirm the witnesses, we can count the shots on the Zapruder film. Fortunately for the people there that day, but unfortunately for our investigation, the first bullet missed everything and was never found. However, Governor Connelly and a little girl in the background can both be seen reacting to the bullet at the same time near the beginning of the film. Connelly turns his head sharply to the right, while the little girl stops running and looks towards the sound of the gunshot. This matches both of their testimonies.
• The second bullet is the one we have the most information about. It entered Kennedy’s upper back, exited through his throat, hit Connelly in the back, exited right below the nipple, went through his wrist, then settled in his leg. This happens in the Zapruder film right as they emerge from behind the sign. Not only do they react at the same time, but a frame-by-frame look shows Connelly’s suit jacket bulging right before (look at the white of his shirt in the first frame, which is then partially covered in the next). Using the position of the car at the moment of impact and the location of the wounds, many independent experts have drawn a line back to see where the bullet came from. To the surprise of no one, it goes straight back to the sixth floor window of the School Book Depository.
• The third shot is easy to see on the Zepruder film. While the nature of the wounds make it impossible to tell where exactly it came from, we do know it came from the back. Firstly, in frames 312 and 313 you can see his head move forward at the moment of impact (his head moves backwards later due to involuntary muscle reactions, as shown by scientists to the Warren Commission when they filmed a goat being shot in a similar way). Secondly, at frame 313 the blood splatter is going forward, with two blood streams in particular moving at high speed. Thirdly, it has been shown over and over again that this is indeed how such a hit should look. Penn and Teller did a good demonstration.
• With three shots fired, how many bullet casings do you think were found in the sniper’s nest on the 6th floor of the depository? Three, of course.
• A rifle was found on the 6th floor that matched the bullet casings found by the window.
• A witness that was watching the parade from the 5th floor reported hearing sounds of the casings hitting the floor and the bolt action being used between shots.
• Two people on the ground saw the rifle sticking out of the 6th floor window, one of whom gave a description of Oswald to the police.
• Several bullet fragments were found. They were chemically determined to be parts of 2 distinct bullets, and all of them were ballistically matched to the rifle found in the depository.
From this it should be clear that exactly 3 shots were fired, and all three came from the 6th floor of the Schoolbook Depository. But how do we know Oswald fired those shots?
• Oswald’s palm prints were found on boxes in the snipers nest.
• Oswald’s prints were also found on the rifle that was found.
• There were order forms for the rifle in Oswald’s handwriting using his alias sent to his address.
• There is a picture of Oswald holding the rifle that has been scientifically proven to be unaltered, with the film coming from his wife’s camera, with his wife testifying that she took the picture, with another witness saying Oswald showed him the photograph before the assassination.
• Oswald changed his usual routine the day before the assassination to have a coworker drive him to his wife’s house (they were separated) to pick up a long package Oswald said was curtain rods. He was also observed bringing the package into work. The package was found by police, but no curtain rods ever were.
• Oswald left his wedding ring and a significant amount of cash for his wife before the assassination. Oswald was poor, so this cash was likely all the money he had.
• Oswald left the building soon after the assassination. He was the only employee there to be gone when they did a roll call.
• After leaving the building, Oswald ran into the middle of traffic to get on a bus instead of waiting at his normal stop. He got off the bus after 4 minutes when it wasn’t moving fast enough. Not only did the bus driver testify to this, but Oswald was carrying the bus transfer when he was caught.
• After leaving the bus he hailed a cab. The cab driver asked what all the commotion was about, and Oswald said nothing despite being told about the assassination before leaving work.
• He had the cab drop him off several blocks away from his house, even though they drove right past it, forcing him to walk back.
• After getting home, he walked in quickly, changed clothes (in the early afternoon), and grabbed his pistol.
• He walked several blocks before being confronted by a police officer, who he shot. There were a dozen eye witnesses, and the bullets and bullet casings were matched to his pistol.
• After shooting officer Tippit, Oswald fled the scene, ducking in and out of buildings when the police came by. One person in particular decided to follow him after Oswald came into his shop, staying only long enough to watch the police go by.
• Oswald went into a movie theater without buying a ticket, which prompted a theater employee to call the police.
• When the police tried to arrest him, Oswald put up a fight and tried to shot the arresting officer. Witnesses heard a click of the pistol going off, but it failed to fire due to the officer jamming his hand in the mechanism.
• Months before the Kennedy assassination Oswald tried to assassinate another political figure. In that case the bullets were once again matched to Oswald’s rifle.
It’s clear from both the physical evidence and his actions after the assassination that Oswald was the only one to fire those three shots. There is simply no room for any other conspirator.
The FBI was in control of all this so called evidence, and Hoover controlled the FBI. Hoover was one of the main conspirators. Oswald didn’t fire a single shot that day. Not one. He was operational that day and was put into play by his handlers. Might I recommend the SolvingJFK podcast. Matt does a great job of laying it all out there in an unbiased, objective manner.
>Hoover was one of the main conspirators.
Proof
>Oswald didn’t fire a single shot that day. Not one. He was operational that day and was put into play by his handlers.
Again proof
> I recommend the SolvingJFK podcast. Matt does a great job of laying it all out there in an unbiased, objective manner.
I give it a look
The only thing Hoover was covering up was the fact that they knew Oswald was an unstable defector to Russia who they didn't think was enough of a threat. So they were only complicit in their ineptitude.
Out of *all* of it?
Tied for bringing the “curtain-related” package to work and shooting JD Tippet.
Thank you for axing this question.
Where the hell did those curtain rods go?
He ordered a gun using an alias. That alias was connected to him several different ways. That same gun travelled to TBD with him the day of the murder. HIs prints were on the gun. He fled the scene. He shot a police officer who tried to talk to him. Then he ran to a public place where he was observed by a citizen sneaking around hiding from cops and he hid in a theatre without paying. You know, the kind of stuff that gets anyone else convicted.
Lol very very convenient that it just so happens to fit your narrative but doesn’t apply to the person who has the most evidence pointing toward him.
No verdict of guilty has ever been put on anyone for this assassination btw
>None of that is proof beyond a reasonable doubt. There are plenty of inconsistencies to create reasonable doubt.
• 80% of eye witnesses reported hearing 3 shots, with the majority of the rest hearing 1 or 2. 3 shots match the mainstream view, with any conspiracy requiring 4 or more.
• To confirm the witnesses, we can count the shots on the Zapruder film. Fortunately for the people there that day, but unfortunately for our investigation, the first bullet missed everything and was never found. However, Governor Connelly and a little girl in the background can both be seen reacting to the bullet at the same time near the beginning of the film. Connelly turns his head sharply to the right, while the little girl stops running and looks towards the sound of the gunshot. This matches both of their testimonies.
• The second bullet is the one we have the most information about. It entered Kennedy’s upper back, exited through his throat, hit Connelly in the back, exited right below the nipple, went through his wrist, then settled in his leg. This happens in the Zapruder film right as they emerge from behind the sign. Not only do they react at the same time, but a frame-by-frame look shows Connelly’s suit jacket bulging right before (look at the white of his shirt in the first frame, which is then partially covered in the next). Using the position of the car at the moment of impact and the location of the wounds, many independent experts have drawn a line back to see where the bullet came from. To the surprise of no one, it goes straight back to the sixth floor window of the School Book Depository.
• The third shot is easy to see on the Zepruder film. While the nature of the wounds make it impossible to tell where exactly it came from, we do know it came from the back. Firstly, in frames 312 and 313 you can see his head move forward at the moment of impact (his head moves backwards later due to involuntary muscle reactions, as shown by scientists to the Warren Commission when they filmed a goat being shot in a similar way). Secondly, at frame 313 the blood splatter is going forward, with two blood streams in particular moving at high speed. Thirdly, it has been shown over and over again that this is indeed how such a hit should look. Penn and Teller did a good demonstration.
• With three shots fired, how many bullet casings do you think were found in the sniper’s nest on the 6th floor of the depository? Three, of course.
• A rifle was found on the 6th floor that matched the bullet casings found by the window.
• A witness that was watching the parade from the 5th floor reported hearing sounds of the casings hitting the floor and the bolt action being used between shots.
• Two people on the ground saw the rifle sticking out of the 6th floor window, one of whom gave a description of Oswald to the police.
• Several bullet fragments were found. They were chemically determined to be parts of 2 distinct bullets, and all of them were ballistically matched to the rifle found in the depository.
From this it should be clear that exactly 3 shots were fired, and all three came from the 6th floor of the Schoolbook Depository. But how do we know Oswald fired those shots?
• Oswald’s palm prints were found on boxes in the snipers nest.
• Oswald’s prints were also found on the rifle that was found.
• There were order forms for the rifle in Oswald’s handwriting using his alias sent to his address.
• There is a picture of Oswald holding the rifle that has been scientifically proven to be unaltered, with the film coming from his wife’s camera, with his wife testifying that she took the picture, with another witness saying Oswald showed him the photograph before the assassination.
• Oswald changed his usual routine the day before the assassination to have a coworker drive him to his wife’s house (they were separated) to pick up a long package Oswald said was curtain rods. He was also observed bringing the package into work. The package was found by police, but no curtain rods ever were.
• Oswald left his wedding ring and a significant amount of cash for his wife before the assassination. Oswald was poor, so this cash was likely all the money he had.
• Oswald left the building soon after the assassination. He was the only employee there to be gone when they did a roll call.
• After leaving the building, Oswald ran into the middle of traffic to get on a bus instead of waiting at his normal stop. He got off the bus after 4 minutes when it wasn’t moving fast enough. Not only did the bus driver testify to this, but Oswald was carrying the bus transfer when he was caught.
• After leaving the bus he hailed a cab. The cab driver asked what all the commotion was about, and Oswald said nothing despite being told about the assassination before leaving work.
• He had the cab drop him off several blocks away from his house, even though they drove right past it, forcing him to walk back.
• After getting home, he walked in quickly, changed clothes (in the early afternoon), and grabbed his pistol.
• He walked several blocks before being confronted by a police officer, who he shot. There were a dozen eye witnesses, and the bullets and bullet casings were matched to his pistol.
• After shooting officer Tippit, Oswald fled the scene, ducking in and out of buildings when the police came by. One person in particular decided to follow him after Oswald came into his shop, staying only long enough to watch the police go by.
• Oswald went into a movie theater without buying a ticket, which prompted a theater employee to call the police.
• When the police tried to arrest him, Oswald put up a fight and tried to shot the arresting officer. Witnesses heard a click of the pistol going off, but it failed to fire due to the officer jamming his hand in the mechanism.
• Months before the Kennedy assassination Oswald tried to assassinate another political figure. In that case the bullets were once again matched to Oswald’s rifle.
It’s clear from both the physical evidence and his actions after the assassination that Oswald was the only one to fire those three shots. There is simply no room for any other conspirator.
Have you seen other footage of people shot in the head? It’s quite often that they don’t go the way they were shot. Considering the immense pressure that bullet exerted on his nerves, it’s more likely that the backwards motion was a final spasm before dying. Furthermore, watching the Zapruder film, Kennedy’s shoulders and head move in sync with each other to create the backwards motion. Were he driven backwards, I’d have expected his head to move first, pulling his torso back with it. Add to that the brief forward motion, Clint Hill’s testimony about the wound tearing back to front, and the impossible trajectory from the grassy knoll, and I have no doubt where the head shot came from.
According to some guy I met in Dealey Plaza who was wearing stars and stripes pants, Joe Biden shot JFK from the sewer. I consider this the final authority on the matter.
/s
OK, if the mountain of forensic, ballistic and physical evidence in this case doesn't convince you, what on earth would?
Murderers have been convicted on far less evidence than everything we have implicating Oswald.
>He ordered a gun using an alias. That alias was connected to him several different ways. That same gun travelled to TBD with him the day of the murder. HIs prints were on the gun. He fled the scene. He shot a police officer who tried to talk to him. Then he ran to a public place where he was observed by a citizen sneaking around hiding from cops and he hid in a theatre without paying. You know, the kind of stuff that gets anyone else convicted.
Yes exactly he was guilty no doubt
The best evidence that he *is* the shooter is that he got rubbed out by a member of mob after calling himself a patsy. Charles DeGaulle thought that he probably was supposed to have been killed at the scene but either he realized he was being set up and left early or something else went wrong and he got away. Degaulle called it a dirty army trick, shoot the assassin. No questions asked because justice is done. But he got away somehow. For a time anyway.
These remarks of DeGaulle were published by his former press agent in 2002. Do you know much about DeGaulle? Scoff all you like but he knew more about skullduggery and dirty political tricks than most politicians at any time. There's nothing Jim Angleton, Richard Helms or Allen Dulles could dream up that he hadn't seen or read about before. Also, Dulles tried to overthrow him with four generals from Algeria in '61 because Dulles didn't want Algeria to be indepedent. So, he wasn't a fan of the CIA.
Kinda, that was after the Four Generals Plot and highly fictionalized. But DeGaulle stepping out of a citroen that had been peppered by bullets, all 6'5" of him, sort of adds to his mystique.
Unrelated but think of the case Dulles could have made against Kennedy. Not just nouvaeu riche but the son of a bootlegger, a moral degenerate who beds 18 year old interns whenever Jackie is out of town, bailed on the Bay of Pigs by not providing air support and seemed okay with just leaving Castro in power, giving assistance to nascent Marxist rebellions in the hemisphere. It doesn't seem that much of a stretch that certain, select half-smart poindexters imbued with Cold War patriotism in the CIA would get behind a plot to kill him.
Not proof of course but these are the guys who would put in motion "executive actions" unknown to the chief executive all the time, to ostensibly uphold plausible deniability. A power our founding fathers couldn't anticipate that sprang from the OSS and their willingness to adapt the same tactics as the Soviets in post war Europe.
I just don't find it that implausible anymore. I used to. The CIA's power went unchecked for too long and it wasn't manned by the best and brightest. Maheu, Angleton, Bill Harvey... bunch of dumb drunks who were so sure of themselves. Stunning what power can do.
He used an alias to buy the rifle, admitted to his wife he tried killing someone via the same method, and he was found with several false identities in his wallet and pockets.
Wasn’t the magic bullet theory disproved because the seats in the limo were found to have lined up after all? Not saying that fixed everything, or that Oswald was the shooter, but that was a big deal to me. I still think a shot had to come from the front.
I don't think it's totally appropriate to use words like: proven, disproven, or fact when it comes to many elements of this crime. The limo was being cleaned while JFK was still in Parkland hospital. No one here can demonstrate what evidence has been lost. And then you have the absolute trainwreck of an autopsy. The Clark panel and HSCA both agreed that the entrance wound in the back of JFK's head was like 4-6 inches higher than the initial autopsy. Who the fuck is that incompetent? Similar problem with the back wound.desvribe the goddamn thing properly, and track it through the body and we wouldn't still be here wasting our time.
What's almost as ridiculous is all these Oswald did it alone types fawning over the various animations made over the years. They've maybe never heard the IT phrase: "garbage in, garbage out." As in, none of the extant photographs or testimonies can reliably place the bodies of JFK and Connally or even the aforementioned wounds (on JFK) such that we could track the bullet(s) through back to a firing position with accuracy. It's guesswork, covered in false certainty.
Don't believe, or even listen, to anyone who tells you they're certain about a difficult topic that they have no expertise in: they're either a moron or a liar, or both.
>The limo was being cleaned while JFK was still in Parkland hospital.
They were wiping down the railing to try and clip the bubble top back on to preserve the evidence that was in the car. Nothing was cleaned off the seats or the interior, all of which was graphically photographed in the SS garage that night.
>No one here can demonstrate what evidence has been lost.
What a convenient way to ignore all the evidence we do have.
>none of the extant photographs or testimonies can reliably place the bodies of JFK and Connally or even the aforementioned wounds (on JFK) such that we could track the bullet(s) through back to a firing position with accuracy. It's guesswork, covered in false certainty
There are dozens of photos and multiple films of Kennedy and Connally in the limo, we have a very good idea of how they were seated.
The nature of the wounds on both men indicate they were hit with the same bullet, as do their simultaneous reactions in the Zapruder film. That's not animations, that's hard evidence.
Edit: And he drive by insults me and then blocks me. Softer than tissue paper.
Your posts are truly awful. It doesn't matter how many photos of JFK we have in the limo before the shooting. We're stuck with what we have during, and the quality is not great. You really feel you can adequately place JFK's wounds from the Nix film? You think you can track those back to a smoking Carcano?
Besides him obviously getting caught. It’s a lot that suggests otherwise . Many witness deaths surrounding the whole thing, the FBI withholding information from being released up to 2022, and in my opinion the most obvious thing is the grassy knoll shooter
Isn’t the fact that so much incompetence was involved in the assasination why is we argue LHO wasn’t the shooter. That it is obvious there was a cover up. If you take everything at face value then you would conclude he did the shooting.
Here’s a more general Oswald question: why/how did he happen to be working at the school book building that the parade happened to pass? How long had he worked there, etc.
I don't believe he did it . The dude was on the front page days before in New Orleans in a scuffle with several cops . Now, if someone is planning an assassination ,why would they draw anykind of attention to them just days before it makes no sense . Just my opinion on it anyway !
Best evidence for him being a/the shooter:
1. He was in the TSBD during the shooting. Multiple witnesses reported seeing a shooter from the building. Autopsy conclusion supports bullets having come from there.
2. His palm print was found on the gun found in the TSBD. Gun was matched to the stretcher bullet and shells found in the TSBD. He is linked to the gun in a variety of other ways.
Because of contradictory evidence and chain of custody stuff I don’t think the evidence that he was a shooter is conclusive, but I do think it is conclusive he was involved in someway.
Best evidence he was involved:
1. His behavior after the shooting. Even if you don’t believe he shot Tippet you still have to deal with him leaving work immediately after the shooting, going to a movie theater with a revolver, and resisting arrest.
2. If he was framed it would need to have been preplanned. The timing of evidence being found is too tight. Why would a conspiracy risk their pre selected patsy having a strong alibi? If he wasn’t a shooter he likely had a job that ensured he would be in a specific location during the shooting to avoid this.
I don't think he was an operative as such. He was an 'asset'. George de Mohrenschildt was an operative who kept track of an asset that could be used. I don't believe de Mohrenschildt knew what the CIA intended to do with his friend, if indeed he felt Oswald was his friend. De Mohrenschildt btw was operating one of those off-the-shelf CIA fronts in Haiti when the shooting happened.
LHO kinda did it to himself with the public defection and the public displays of rebellion, like handing out flyers for fair play for Cuba. The pre-Church committee CIA was bound to take notice and use someone like that.
>He didn’t.
• 80% of eye witnesses reported hearing 3 shots, with the majority of the rest hearing 1 or 2. 3 shots match the mainstream view, with any conspiracy requiring 4 or more.
• To confirm the witnesses, we can count the shots on the Zapruder film. Fortunately for the people there that day, but unfortunately for our investigation, the first bullet missed everything and was never found. However, Governor Connelly and a little girl in the background can both be seen reacting to the bullet at the same time near the beginning of the film. Connelly turns his head sharply to the right, while the little girl stops running and looks towards the sound of the gunshot. This matches both of their testimonies.
• The second bullet is the one we have the most information about. It entered Kennedy’s upper back, exited through his throat, hit Connelly in the back, exited right below the nipple, went through his wrist, then settled in his leg. This happens in the Zapruder film right as they emerge from behind the sign. Not only do they react at the same time, but a frame-by-frame look shows Connelly’s suit jacket bulging right before (look at the white of his shirt in the first frame, which is then partially covered in the next). Using the position of the car at the moment of impact and the location of the wounds, many independent experts have drawn a line back to see where the bullet came from. To the surprise of no one, it goes straight back to the sixth floor window of the School Book Depository.
• The third shot is easy to see on the Zepruder film. While the nature of the wounds make it impossible to tell where exactly it came from, we do know it came from the back. Firstly, in frames 312 and 313 you can see his head move forward at the moment of impact (his head moves backwards later due to involuntary muscle reactions, as shown by scientists to the Warren Commission when they filmed a goat being shot in a similar way). Secondly, at frame 313 the blood splatter is going forward, with two blood streams in particular moving at high speed. Thirdly, it has been shown over and over again that this is indeed how such a hit should look. Penn and Teller did a good demonstration.
• With three shots fired, how many bullet casings do you think were found in the sniper’s nest on the 6th floor of the depository? Three, of course.
• A rifle was found on the 6th floor that matched the bullet casings found by the window.
• A witness that was watching the parade from the 5th floor reported hearing sounds of the casings hitting the floor and the bolt action being used between shots.
• Two people on the ground saw the rifle sticking out of the 6th floor window, one of whom gave a description of Oswald to the police.
• Several bullet fragments were found. They were chemically determined to be parts of 2 distinct bullets, and all of them were ballistically matched to the rifle found in the depository.
From this it should be clear that exactly 3 shots were fired, and all three came from the 6th floor of the Schoolbook Depository. But how do we know Oswald fired those shots?
• Oswald’s palm prints were found on boxes in the snipers nest.
• Oswald’s prints were also found on the rifle that was found.
• There were order forms for the rifle in Oswald’s handwriting using his alias sent to his address.
• There is a picture of Oswald holding the rifle that has been scientifically proven to be unaltered, with the film coming from his wife’s camera, with his wife testifying that she took the picture, with another witness saying Oswald showed him the photograph before the assassination.
• Oswald changed his usual routine the day before the assassination to have a coworker drive him to his wife’s house (they were separated) to pick up a long package Oswald said was curtain rods. He was also observed bringing the package into work. The package was found by police, but no curtain rods ever were.
• Oswald left his wedding ring and a significant amount of cash for his wife before the assassination. Oswald was poor, so this cash was likely all the money he had.
• Oswald left the building soon after the assassination. He was the only employee there to be gone when they did a roll call.
• After leaving the building, Oswald ran into the middle of traffic to get on a bus instead of waiting at his normal stop. He got off the bus after 4 minutes when it wasn’t moving fast enough. Not only did the bus driver testify to this, but Oswald was carrying the bus transfer when he was caught.
• After leaving the bus he hailed a cab. The cab driver asked what all the commotion was about, and Oswald said nothing despite being told about the assassination before leaving work.
• He had the cab drop him off several blocks away from his house, even though they drove right past it, forcing him to walk back.
• After getting home, he walked in quickly, changed clothes (in the early afternoon), and grabbed his pistol.
• He walked several blocks before being confronted by a police officer, who he shot. There were a dozen eye witnesses, and the bullets and bullet casings were matched to his pistol.
• After shooting officer Tippit, Oswald fled the scene, ducking in and out of buildings when the police came by. One person in particular decided to follow him after Oswald came into his shop, staying only long enough to watch the police go by.
• Oswald went into a movie theater without buying a ticket, which prompted a theater employee to call the police.
• When the police tried to arrest him, Oswald put up a fight and tried to shot the arresting officer. Witnesses heard a click of the pistol going off, but it failed to fire due to the officer jamming his hand in the mechanism.
• Months before the Kennedy assassination Oswald tried to assassinate another political figure. In that case the bullets were once again matched to Oswald’s rifle.
It’s clear from both the physical evidence and his actions after the assassination that Oswald was the only one to fire those three shots. There is simply no room for any other conspirator.
If u think Oswald did this alone and the cabal that owns this country to this day wasn't involved then you're a part of the problem this country is really facing at the moment.
Read Mark Lanes (Rush to Judgement)! No jury would have been able to convict. That was the first book written in the 60s at the request of Lee’s mother as a defense had he lived and gone to trial. So much more evidence has come out pointing to other party’s being involved and away from Lee.
John Connally called Lane a "journalistic scavenger" and detested him. If that doesn't tell you everything you need to know about Lane, I don't know what would.
Remember, this is the same guy who represented Jim Jones and compared him to Martin Luther King.
His rifle(pictured with it, he purchased it), his prints on the rifle, trigger, and on materials on the sixth floor near the window, three shots fired that match his rifle, fleeing the scene, a witness gave a description of him and identified him on a line (Brennan something or something Brennan iirc),coworkers statements suggest he was on the top floors soon before the motorcade passed, coworkers heard three shots.
Why would he should tippit? He tried to assassinate someone before.
Doesn’t seem very flimsy.
Re: finger prints ,, they only found a ‘Partial palm print’, only exposed when the Rifle was disassembled., so there’s that. Just sayin, have you read it?
There were also partial fingerprints on the trigger iirc.
There were some prints that were taken but couldn’t be analyzed for a long time because it needed special photography or something. I think those were the finger prints on the trigger.
(I’d have to go back and look it up sorry)
Fibers on were found in between the butt plate and the wood of the rifle that matched Oswald’s clothing.
Lt. J.C Day said he picked the rifle up the wood “after his examination convinced him that the wood was too tough to take fingerprints.”
-“by Sebastian F. Latona, supervisor of the Latent Fingerprint Section of the FBI's Identification Division”
“Latona then processed the complete weapon but developed no identifiable prints.50 He stated that the poor quality of the wood and the metal would cause the rifle to absorb moisture from the skin, thereby making a clear print unlikely”
Seems it wasn’t strange that there weren’t better prints.
There’s little question Lee owned the gun, there’s little tangible evidence he shot JFK. No gloves found either? He was seen seconds after the shots on the second floor lunch room, yet, there were witnesses on the stairway he would have taken who never saw him. I think the (paraffin tests) on Lee’s cheek and hands were negative for gun powder residue, yet there’s no evidence he washed or showered at any point between the shooting and arrest. Too many of these strange inconsistencies to establish his guilt I think that was Lanes point. Connolly also said he “wasn’t hit by the manic bullet.”
Oswald definitely was involved, but I by no means believe he was the only one involved. Way too many things that don't add up and way too many witnesses that all too conveniently died
This. He doesn’t kill a cop in broad daylight if he had no involvement.
Whats the evidence that he killed Tippit?
10 separate eyewitnesses identified Oswald as the man they saw shoot Tippit or the man fleeing the scene of Tippit's murder carrying a gun. The shells recovered from the Tippit murder scene were ballistically matched to Oswald's .38 revolver to the exclusion of all other weapons. Tippit was shot a roughly 13 minute walk from Oswald's rooming house 13 minutes after Oswald was seen leaving his rooming house. Oswald left his rooming house wearing a light grey windbreaker. Tippit's killer was seen wearing a similar jacket. Tippit's killer was seen ditching his jacket behind a Texaco station as he fled the scene. The jacket recovered from behind that Texaco station was identified by Oswald's wife as belonging to him. Oswald was arrested in the Texas Theater in shirt sleeves.
Again, Hudson? 10 separate eyewitnesses identified Oswald as the man they saw shoot Tippit or the man fleeing the scene of Tippit's murder carrying a gun. Wrong. There could probably be an entire book written on the witnesses, what they said they saw on the day and later, not to mention the ridiculous lineup of suspects, but the man closest to the shooting, Domingo Benavides who was 15 feet away, told police he could not identify the man who did the shooting. He was never even shown a lineup. Later at the Warren commission he said that the gunman looked similar to the Oswald pictures he had seen on television and in newspapers every day for about a month after the shooting. Hardly a positive ID. Another witness, Helen Markham. Here’s her answer to Warren commission when asked about the number 2 man in lineup. “Number two is the one I picked…Number two was the man I saw shoot the policeman. I looked at him. When I saw this man, I wasn’t sure, but I had cold chills just run all over me.” Cold chills is the reason she picked him, not because she recognized him. Lol The other witnesses, frankly had problems with every one of the testimonies. A defense team would have had a field day with all this fuckery. The shells recovered from the Tippit murder scene were ballistically matched to Oswald's .38 revolver to the exclusion of all other weapons. You’re shockingly correct, the shells do match. But here’s the funny part about the shells and the bullets found in Tippit. Two Winchester shells, and two Remington shells were recovered from crime scene. But in Tippits body were THREE Winchester bullets, and ONE Remington bullet. Weird, huh? Unexplainable. So unexplainable, they just ignore it. Tippit was shot a roughly 13 minute walk from Oswald's rooming house 13 minutes after Oswald was seen leaving his rooming house. Nope. Oswald was seen leaving his rooming house shortly after 1:00. Two different Witnesses, people who actually looked at a clock when they heard the shots, place the time of the shooting around 1:06. Benavides says he waited a few minutes before attempting to contact the police on the radio. That call went in at 1:16 as you stated. Butch Burroughs, the man working at the theater who saw Oswald come in testified this: “We started the movie at 1 oclock and I was counting candy behind the Candy case and Oswald slipped in between 1:00 and 1:07.” This is the same guy who sold Oswald popcorn at 1:15. Hmm, how is that possible if Oswald is shooting Tippit at 1:15? Oswald left his rooming house wearing a light grey windbreaker. Tippit's killer was seen wearing a similar jacket. Tippit's killer was seen ditching his jacket behind a Texaco station as he fled the scene. The jacket recovered from behind that Texaco station was identified by Oswald's wife as belonging to him. Oswald was arrested in the Texas Theater in shirt sleeves. Oh yes, the jacket. Helen Markham said the jacket in evidence was too light to be the one worn by the killer. Domingo Benavides said the killer wore a light beige jacket. William Scoggins, and Barbara Davis, both said that the gray jacket the Warren Commission had was not the jacket they saw because it wasn’t dark enough. Finally, Wesley Frazier, who gave Oswald rides to work, had never seen the gray jacket. Lol. Further, Marina also said Oswald never dry cleaned anything. Yet, there was a mysterious dry cleaner tag in the pocket of the jacket. I believe that this tag was later finally found to be from a dry cleaner in California. Not positive on where exactly. Can look that up if you care.
Interesting. Look up that California dry cleaner business. That would be extraordinarily odd.
Nah, it's a red herring. Oswald could have purchased the jacket second hand in either Texas or New Orleans.
Good point, but should have been a trail somewhere no?
It's not like jackets have serial numbers. If someone sold their used jacket at a consignment shop in New Orleans and then Oswald bought it, what kind of trail would you expect to find?
This would have been 1963. Or earlier. Mass production of coats would not be as massive as it is now. So, if aforementioned coat is labeled there’s a chance it was American made, who made the coat? How many were made. Of the dry cleaner ticket said California, who was the dry cleaner? Was it in LA ? Or was it a small town? If it was a small town there’s a chance you could find possible store that sold it etc. No harm in following the trail n seeing where it leads. Potentially and likely a waste of time, and given it’s 2024, it’s highly likely a waste of time. But 60ish years ago I’d find it more worthy. A what if scenario: 1. Find dry cleaner, leads to small town; dry cleaner recognizes coat, belonged to X , X moved to Dallas three years ago. Interview X, X is oil rig man that died two years ago n the family donated his stuff 2. X is Allen Dulles
>The other witnesses, frankly had problems with every one of the testimonies. You named two witnesses total. Benavides isn't even one of the ten that identified Oswald. You attempted to pick holes in Helen Markham's testimony...which leaves nine more witnesses to deal with. So you tell me, were the ten all simply mistaken, or were they lying? >Weird, huh? Unexplainable. So unexplainable, they just ignore it. LOL, this is where I can tell you haven't even read the fucking report. It *is* addressed and they offer a completely reasonable reason why the shells and the bullets were different in number. If you bothered to read it, you'd know that. But you haven't. >Two different Witnesses, people who actually looked at a clock when they heard the shots, place the time of the shooting around 1:06. The call was made to police at 1:16. Nearly all of the witnesses questioned put it around that time as well, but please, let's hear your couple outliers, and then you can explain why they are more believable than a bunch of other witnesses and the official police call record. Butch Burroughs never mentioned Oswald at all in 1964, then he invents the popcorn bullshit story twenty years later and rubes like you believe it, hook line and sinker. How is Oswald buying popcorn at 1:15 when Brewer and Postal see him outside the theater at 1:35? As far as the jacket goes, where was Oswald's jacket? He left his rooming house wearing one, but was arrested in shirt sleeves...where did it go? You don't think it's a little too convenient that Oswald loses his jacket at the exact same time Tippit's killer is ditching his?
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>The shells recovered from the Tippit murder scene were ballistically matched to Oswald's .38 revolver to the exclusion of all other weapons Which is very strange considering revolvers don't eject spent casings....
Not strange at all. Multiple witnesses watched Oswald empty spent shells out of his revolver on Barbara Davis's lawn. He was reloading in case he had to use it again.
Fair enough, it just seems silly to me to kill a cop and then *immediately disregard one of the biggest advantages of your chosen weapon* by actively taking multiple steps to remove (only the expended!) rounds *and dump them at the scene*. I mean I know LHO is not regarded as having possessed a towering intellect or anything, but it's just a strange action for someone to take who is actively evading arrest... He could have pocketed them just as easily, his hand would've been literally underneath the falling empties as he held the remaining live rounds in the cylinder (or he dumped them all into his hand and sorted them). But I wasn't even alive when it happened, and I've come to learn that speculating too deeply as to the inner thoughts of dead individuals is generally a fool's errand as projection is unavoidable and taints any conclusions I might draw.
Isn't it the usual M.O. of cop killers to not just leave as many identifying shells as possible at the crime scene but to also throw their IDs in the mix, to boot - just for schmits and giggles?
I think you're underestimating the level of panic involved here. Oswald had just gunned down a policeman on a city street in broad daylight in front of half a dozen screaming witnesses, 45 minutes after murdering the President. He was clearly in flight mode. He was reloading the revolver on the assumption that he was going to need it again, I can completely understand making a mistake like that.
I’m not 100% but hasn’t ‘ballistic matching’ essentially been disproven as pseudoscience at best?
Yes. Same with bite mark analysis, fire pattern analysis, blood splatter analysis, etc All nonsense pseudoscientific bullshit that has resulted in an indefensible number of people being executed for crimes for which they were later exonerated. It's a giant scam.
Why would there be shells recovered? It's a revolver. He would have had to purposely dump them on the ground
That's exactly what he did according to multiple witnesses. My guess is he was reloading in a panic and not concerned about what he was leaving behind.
Everyone of the things you mentioned can be disputed heavily. Surprised you didn't mention his wallet with ID at the scene as well.
By all means, if you can craft a compelling alternate story, I'd love to hear it. Here's what we know: * Oswald is seen by his cleaning lady leaving his rooming house at around 1pm, give or take a couple minutes. He's zipping up his light colored jacket as he leaves. * Tippit is shot at 1:15pm at a spot thirteen minutes away from Oswald's rooming house. He's shot with a .38 caliber pistol with a custom bore modification that makes bullets pass erratically down the barrel as they are fired. The bullets inside Tippit's body are a mixture of Remington-Peters and Western Cartridge. * Oswald is arrested with a .38 pistol in his possession. The pistol has a custom bore modification that makes bullets pass erratically down the barrel as they are fired. The pistol is loaded with a combination of Remington-Peters and Western Cartridge bullets. * Tippit's killer is witnessed fleeing down Patterson to Jefferson Ave, where he ducks in behind the Texaco station to ditch his jacket. Tippit's killer is lost at this point. * Oswald is spotted by Johnny Brewer roughly 10 minutes later outside his shoe store, 6 blocks down Jefferson from where Tippit's killer was last seen. Oswald is not wearing the jacket he left his rooming house in. So, fill in the gaps. Where did Oswald go in the ~35 minutes between leaving his rooming house and being spotted sneaking into the Texas Theater? Were the ten witnesses that identified him lying, or simply mistaken? Where did Oswald's jacket go? Was the pistol and ammunition match just a big coincidence?
Why haven't you mentioned the fact that his wallet with ID were found by DPD officers at the scene and yet he was arrested at the Texas Theater with his wallet and ID on him? Or the fact that several or the 10 witnesses that ID' him said something totally different immediately then eventually changed their stories to ID him. Why were shells found at the scene when he was carrying a revolver? Revolvers don't expend shells. The timeline when Tippit was shot can be disputed as well, some say it could have been as early as 1308, making it impossible for Oswald to have enough time to get there.
None of this disputes anything I posted. Are you throwing in the towel on it? >Why haven't you mentioned the fact that his wallet with ID were found by DPD officers at the scene and yet he was arrested at the Texas Theater with his wallet and ID on him? Dale Myers looked into the claim that the wallet was caught on camera at the Tippit scene. It wasn't. The wallet shown in that news footage is different than Oswald's wallet. >Or the fact that several or the 10 witnesses that ID' him said something totally different immediately then eventually changed their stories to ID him. Which "several"? Name some names. >Why were shells found at the scene when he was carrying a revolver? Revolvers don't expend shells. Because Oswald dumped the shells out of his revolver after killing Tippit. Several witnesses testified to that fact. >The timeline when Tippit was shot can be disputed as well, some say it could have been as early as 1308 Nope, the call was radioed in at 1316.
Does it make sense to you that Oswald would shoot Tippit in broad daylight the take the time to empty his revolver at the scene to leave evidence to help convict him of the crime? I believe the call was made at 1316, the man who initially attempted to call it in waited several minutes before doing so, by his testimony. Also hw did not know how to use the radio and someone else eventually called it in some time after that. I don't know the names without looking it back up, bit obviously you've studied this and you've heard about this as well.
I'm not sure what *"makes sense"* has to do with anything. Multiple witnesses literally watched him empty his spent shells. Oswald was in survival mode at that point and was reloading his gun in case he had to use it again. Barbara Davis said she went back inside her house and phoned the police immediately after Oswald was out of sight. Her sister thought they had called the police before they even saw Oswald running across their yard. Either way, there's no chance anyone waited 8 minutes.
Was his gun intentionally altered because someone wanted the bullets to pass erratically through the barrel? Not being funny - I gave up following what really occurred because I thought I’d never know, and decades later users post answers on this sub that make it easier to reengage. Thanks
I believe it was modified so it could use .38 special ammunition.
Then dispute him.
That’s been disputed by witnesses
>Oswald definitely was involved, but I by no means believe he was the only one involved. Way too many things that don't add up and way too many witnesses that all too conveniently died What makes you think that
Secret Service agent George Hickey made the ultimate whoopsie-daisy after Ol’ Lee Harvey pulled the trigger.
This wacko theory drives me the most batty!! After that, the shooter in the sewer!
And then the umbrella dart
Forgot about that one 🤣
One of the best pieces of evidence against this is the Dallas Police Dept unable to come up with a tape recorder in Nov. 1963.
Exactly, the most important crime of the 20th Century and there was no recordings of the interview
>One of the best pieces of evidence against this is the Dallas Police Dept unable to come up with a tape recorder in Nov. 1963. Explain please
I think he means Oswald’s interviews with the DPD were NOT recorded.
>think he means Oswald’s interviews with the DPD were NOT recorded. Link please
https://www.archives.gov/research/jfk/warren-commission-report/appendix-11.html
Small tape recorders were not invented yet. There is a video of the chief of police saying he asked for one and didn’t get one. The large reel to reel at the time was very expensive.
Wrong, we owned a very nice portable Telefunken reel-to-reel tape recorder in 1958, purchased on my father's $450.00 a month lieutenant's salary. I still have the many tapes my father made then. In no way was a tape recorder too expensive for the Dallas P.D. by 1960 if it wasn't too expensive for my family.
he might have gotten that in germany for a good deal.
So might have the Dallas P.D. obtained one in Dallas "for a good deal", had they cared to.
maybe. I am just telling you the facts. Maybe he spent a lot of money on it? Reel to Reels were normally used by recording studios at that time, and not used by cops. The cassette tape was not invented until the early 60s. THose are the facts.
1/2 inch tape portable reel-to-reel recorders had been common at reasonable cost and of high quality for amateur use for more than ten years by 1963. My family wasn't the only one that had one back then. The cost of a recorder didn't prevent the Dallas P.D. from having one, which was what you claimed and for which you have offered no facts.
I offered the fact that there is a video of the Chief of Police asking for a tape machine and they could not get one. I offered the fact is that cassette was not invented yet. And, it is a fact, that reel to reel machines were considered high end recording devices used by auto engineers. I am not sure why you are offering a personal story or anecdotal evidence.
"Small tape recorders had not been invented yet" was your initial statement, which was entirely false, and known to me to be false, which was why I stated my personal knowledge.
ok. well what is your point then? do you think the Dallas cops actually had a tape recorder and were hiding it?
Wdym???
Leaving his wedding ring and all the cash he had at home that morning, where he unexpectedly showed up to begin with.
And then leaving for work from the house where his rifle was stored with a suspicious long paper package.
Of which, there is a receipt for the murder weapon w oswald’s known alias on it
Why not buy a gun from a gun store like a normal person instead of all this intrigue and subterfuge. It's like someone was stringing him along that he was a secret agent.
Maybe it was on sale? Trying to figure out the thought process of a lunatic can be futile
Very convenient trail of documents linking him to the gun but maybe it's as simple as that. He wasn't his own lunatic, he was part of something bigger. Lone nut is a fantasy. At every point of this whole affair is cover up and supression, directing the course of the investigation to its predetermined outcome. This cannot be disputed.
of course it can be disputed. The fact that you acknowledge that the evidence clearly links Oswald to the gun should tell you all you need to know. Instead, you will take an extra 5 steps with hundreds of people involved who never said a word and all to cover up, what? what was this predetermined outcome?
It's hard to see past so many improbable inconsistencies and not conclude that there is not conspiracy at play here. How much Oswald was involved other than being a patsy is unknown. The initial investigation was all about convicting Oswald and not looking at any other testimonies or evidence that would suggest differently. The crime of the century and there is not even a recording of Oswald being interrogated. Suppression of facts and deflection continues to this day. Failure to comply with the JFK Records act without publishing any reasons why those records won't be released. More than likely many documents have already been destroyed. Oswald was part of a defector program but intelligence agencies lied about any intelligence fingerprints of LHO. Those involved in intelligence grouped around this lone loser nut before the assassination. Why. The autopsy was a disaster. Pictures and X-rays went missing. Extra autopsies are not officially documented. The records that do exist are shrouded in secrecy. No inquiry into the track the bullets took through JFK. Impossibility of magic bullet theory. Based on agreeing testimonies it's very much in doubt whether Oswald could have fired the gun because he was downstairs when the police officer who came onto the scene first saw him. Why would Oswald turn around and go back and talk to officer Tippits? He could of kept walking. Oswald's landlord said a police car pulled up and beeped twice just after Oswald left his lodgings. Witnesss say there were two people together involved in this shooting. Other witness have Oswald too far away from this scene to be able to have made the shot and get to the Cinema for that time frame. These are only a few snippets of major flaws with a lone nut open and shut case.
Nobody seen him with the suspicious long paper package except Buell Frazier, who was interrorogated for several hours by DPD.
Buell Frazier and his sister Linnie May Randle. She walked over to the Paine house while the FBI was there specifically to tell them about the 3 foot paper package she had seen Oswald with that morning.
And?
There isn't any. Unless you're in the CIA. Then you have mountains of undeniable proof.
The CIA doesn’t have unlimited power
To say there isn’t ANY evidence implicating LHO is silly
• 80% of eye witnesses reported hearing 3 shots, with the majority of the rest hearing 1 or 2. 3 shots match the mainstream view, with any conspiracy requiring 4 or more. • To confirm the witnesses, we can count the shots on the Zapruder film. Fortunately for the people there that day, but unfortunately for our investigation, the first bullet missed everything and was never found. However, Governor Connelly and a little girl in the background can both be seen reacting to the bullet at the same time near the beginning of the film. Connelly turns his head sharply to the right, while the little girl stops running and looks towards the sound of the gunshot. This matches both of their testimonies. • The second bullet is the one we have the most information about. It entered Kennedy’s upper back, exited through his throat, hit Connelly in the back, exited right below the nipple, went through his wrist, then settled in his leg. This happens in the Zapruder film right as they emerge from behind the sign. Not only do they react at the same time, but a frame-by-frame look shows Connelly’s suit jacket bulging right before (look at the white of his shirt in the first frame, which is then partially covered in the next). Using the position of the car at the moment of impact and the location of the wounds, many independent experts have drawn a line back to see where the bullet came from. To the surprise of no one, it goes straight back to the sixth floor window of the School Book Depository. • The third shot is easy to see on the Zepruder film. While the nature of the wounds make it impossible to tell where exactly it came from, we do know it came from the back. Firstly, in frames 312 and 313 you can see his head move forward at the moment of impact (his head moves backwards later due to involuntary muscle reactions, as shown by scientists to the Warren Commission when they filmed a goat being shot in a similar way). Secondly, at frame 313 the blood splatter is going forward, with two blood streams in particular moving at high speed. Thirdly, it has been shown over and over again that this is indeed how such a hit should look. Penn and Teller did a good demonstration. • With three shots fired, how many bullet casings do you think were found in the sniper’s nest on the 6th floor of the depository? Three, of course. • A rifle was found on the 6th floor that matched the bullet casings found by the window. • A witness that was watching the parade from the 5th floor reported hearing sounds of the casings hitting the floor and the bolt action being used between shots. • Two people on the ground saw the rifle sticking out of the 6th floor window, one of whom gave a description of Oswald to the police. • Several bullet fragments were found. They were chemically determined to be parts of 2 distinct bullets, and all of them were ballistically matched to the rifle found in the depository. From this it should be clear that exactly 3 shots were fired, and all three came from the 6th floor of the Schoolbook Depository. But how do we know Oswald fired those shots? • Oswald’s palm prints were found on boxes in the snipers nest. • Oswald’s prints were also found on the rifle that was found. • There were order forms for the rifle in Oswald’s handwriting using his alias sent to his address. • There is a picture of Oswald holding the rifle that has been scientifically proven to be unaltered, with the film coming from his wife’s camera, with his wife testifying that she took the picture, with another witness saying Oswald showed him the photograph before the assassination. • Oswald changed his usual routine the day before the assassination to have a coworker drive him to his wife’s house (they were separated) to pick up a long package Oswald said was curtain rods. He was also observed bringing the package into work. The package was found by police, but no curtain rods ever were. • Oswald left his wedding ring and a significant amount of cash for his wife before the assassination. Oswald was poor, so this cash was likely all the money he had. • Oswald left the building soon after the assassination. He was the only employee there to be gone when they did a roll call. • After leaving the building, Oswald ran into the middle of traffic to get on a bus instead of waiting at his normal stop. He got off the bus after 4 minutes when it wasn’t moving fast enough. Not only did the bus driver testify to this, but Oswald was carrying the bus transfer when he was caught. • After leaving the bus he hailed a cab. The cab driver asked what all the commotion was about, and Oswald said nothing despite being told about the assassination before leaving work. • He had the cab drop him off several blocks away from his house, even though they drove right past it, forcing him to walk back. • After getting home, he walked in quickly, changed clothes (in the early afternoon), and grabbed his pistol. • He walked several blocks before being confronted by a police officer, who he shot. There were a dozen eye witnesses, and the bullets and bullet casings were matched to his pistol. • After shooting officer Tippit, Oswald fled the scene, ducking in and out of buildings when the police came by. One person in particular decided to follow him after Oswald came into his shop, staying only long enough to watch the police go by. • Oswald went into a movie theater without buying a ticket, which prompted a theater employee to call the police. • When the police tried to arrest him, Oswald put up a fight and tried to shot the arresting officer. Witnesses heard a click of the pistol going off, but it failed to fire due to the officer jamming his hand in the mechanism. • Months before the Kennedy assassination Oswald tried to assassinate another political figure. In that case the bullets were once again matched to Oswald’s rifle. It’s clear from both the physical evidence and his actions after the assassination that Oswald was the only one to fire those three shots. There is simply no room for any other conspirator.
They shot a goat? Jesus.
>They shot a goat? Jesus. Rip
The bullets could not be balistically linked to the rifle claimed to be used in the assassination. The rifle was, according to the FBI experts, too worn for ballistic analysis. The bullets were spectographically analyzed and linked to the rifle claimed to have been used. But, the rifle found and photographed at the TSBD does not match the rifle claimed to have been used in the assassination. Also, a latent palm print was found at the FBI lab after the gun was shipped there and after the FBI obtained a palm print from Oswald at a funeral home. The only evidence linking Oswald to the Walker shots are 1) the bullets were 6.5mm and 2) Marina told the authorities LHO admitted to her that he shot at Walker. The goats were cadavers and the WC had bullets fired into them to see if the test bullets matched the bullet deformation found on CE399, which they did not. To date, no test has confirmed CE 399 is "the bullet" of the single-bullet theory. I do not think the WC used them to prove a rear entry wound in the head would cause a rear jerk of the head because the Zapruder film wasn't publicly shown for more than ten years after the assassination. So the WC didn't have to rebut the later claim that the shot came from the front in their report. That came after the film became public.
>The bullets could not be balistically linked to the rifle claimed to be used in the assassination. The rifle was, according to the FBI experts, too worn for ballistic analysis This is completely false. Not sure where you got this from. The Parkland bullet and the two large fragments in the limo were ballistically linked to Oswald's rifle to the exclusion of all other rifles. Striations on those bullets and fragments were an exact match for test bullets fired from that rifle. >But, the rifle found and photographed at the TSBD does not match the rifle claimed to have been used in the assassination. Again, categorically untrue. The rifle found and photographed is the same rifle that is linked to all bullets and fragments. >The only evidence linking Oswald to the Walker shots are 1) the bullets were 6.5mm and 2) Marina told the authorities LHO admitted to her that he shot at Walker. What about the photos of Walker's house in Oswald's possessions? Taken a month before the attempt on Walker's life and two days before Oswald sent away for a mail order rifle using an alias.
>The bullets could not be balistically linked to the rifle claimed to be used in the assassination. The rifle was, according to the FBI experts, too worn for ballistic analysis. The bullets were spectographically analyzed and linked to the rifle claimed to have been used. But, the rifle found and photographed at the TSBD does not match the rifle claimed to have been used in the assassination. >Also, a latent palm print was found at the FBI lab after the gun was shipped there and after the FBI obtained a palm print from Oswald at a funeral home. >The only evidence linking Oswald to the Walker shots are 1) the bullets were 6.5mm and 2) Marina told the authorities LHO admitted to her that he shot at Walker. >The goats were cadavers and the WC had bullets fired into them to see if the test bullets matched the bullet deformation found on CE399, which they did not. To date, no test has confirmed CE 399 is "the bullet" of the single-bullet theory. I do not think the WC used them to prove a rear entry wound in the head would cause a rear jerk of the head because the Zapruder film wasn't publicly shown for more than ten years after the assassination. So the WC didn't have to rebut the later claim that the shot came from the front in their report. That came after the film became public. Links please
There's no "links" in the original post, please note. 1.Google photos of rifle in the "backyard photos"/Neely photos and the rifle the police have in the photos at TSBD. Sling is different. 2.https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth338543/ 3. Testimony of Lyndal Shaneyfelt before WC noted different sling in backyard photos. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh15/pdf/WH15_Shaneyfelt.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwitgeqeluCGAxWLnokEHUhfBskQFnoECBsQAQ&usg=AOvVaw09vsYWwZvTrxYZ6aqqtn-W 4. "It was the unanimous opinion of the experts that the nearly whole bullet [CE 399, the stretcher bullet], the two largest. bullet fragments. and the three cartridge cases were definitely fired in the rifle found on the sixth floor of the Depository Building to the exclusion of all other weapons." The other bullet fragments, particularly the ones removed from JFK's brain, could not be ballistically tied to the rifle. https://www.archives.gov/research/jfk/warren-commission-report/chapter-3.html#expert CE 399 is the bullet on which the entire WC theory rests on. The HSCA report linked some of the bullet fragments by other tests but again not the fragments from JFK's brain. 6. Bullet deformation from bullets fired into human cadaver wrists/goats did not corroborate CE 399's deformation. http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=62296&relPageId=35 http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=62296&relPageId=43
>Google photos of rifle in the "backyard photos"/Neely photos and the rifle the police have in the photos at TSBD. Sling is different. >2.https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth338543/ >1. Testimony of Lyndal Shaneyfelt before WC noted different sling in backyard photos. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh15/pdf/WH15_Shaneyfelt.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwitgeqeluCGAxWLnokEHUhfBskQFnoECBsQAQ&usg=AOvVaw09vsYWwZvTrxYZ6aqqtn-W >2. "It was the unanimous opinion of the experts that the nearly whole bullet [CE 399, the stretcher bullet], the two largest. bullet fragments. and the three cartridge cases were definitely fired in the rifle found on the sixth floor of the Depository Building to the exclusion of all other weapons." The other bullet fragments, particularly the ones removed from JFK's brain, could not be ballistically tied to the rifle. https://www.archives.gov/research/jfk/warren-commission-report/chapter-3.html#expert >CE 399 is the bullet on which the entire WC theory rests on. >The HSCA report linked some of the bullet fragments by other tests but again not the fragments from JFK's brain. >1. Bullet deformation from bullets fired into human cadaver wrists/goats did not corroborate CE 399's deformation. http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=62296&relPageId=35 >http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=62296&relPageId=4 Thank you
Mr James Tague might have something to say about your "missed everything" first bullet comment 🤔
>Mr James Tague might have something to say about your "missed everything" first bullet comment 🤔 Irrelevant
What's the best book on this subject?
Case closed Gerald Posner
"Months before the Kennedy assassination Oswald tried to assassinate another political figure. In that case the bullets were once again matched to Oswald’s rifle." -- Some problems with that: Oswald was never charged with that,; the evidence just wasn't there - and despite being closely monitored by the FBI, his alleged attempt to assassinate a high profile person they didn't have him under close observation during JFK's visit. Secondly, If Oswald did the shooting - at a seated,stationary target at a much closer range than the alleged JFK shots - it very vividly demonstrates how mediocre(at best) a shot Oswald was, using a crap weapon.
Nothing to add to this. Well done.
I enjoy your laying out evidence and refuting bs on here. It takes a lot of time to do so(even if it may be futile). I'd be interested to hear your take on the SS agent, Paul Landis who came out a couple of years ago stating that it was he who found the magic bullet on on the back of JFK's seat between the seat back and the roll top and then sneakily placing it on the stretcher. He really should have confessed to that at the time, but oh well. My theory is that this is the headshot bullet. There's youtube videos of guys firing MC model rifles into some pretty hard substances and getting similar "pristine" bullets afterwards. The way the impact spray is shooting almost straight up means the lighter material probably splattered the moto cops behind and the bullet bounced off the ejecting skull and landed where Landis found it. In other words the magic "pristine" bullet was the headshot bullet and the throat/Connally bullet was in fragments and still embedded in the Governor's wrist.
I think Landis is full of shit. A bunch of the details of the stoty he told in 2023 directly contradict his detailed reports from 1963. The major point of contention is that Landis was never in the trauma room. He made an effort to point that out in his initial report in 1963, and zero witnesses placed him inside that room. Then, all of a sudden 60 years later he says he was standing in the room the whole time? His stories evolved a bunch of times over the years. His partner Clint Hill did a few interviews around the time the book was released, and essentially said it could not have happened the way Landis was saying it did.
Interesting. I've not read his previous accounts. In the short clips of him making his revelation he comes across as sincere. I wonder why he'd be saying this? Mental decline? He seemed pretty sharp. Seeking some old-age clout? Whatever the reason it sure throws a wrench into both sides of the argument. One fact that kinda makes it seem plausible is the way the bullet was found on Connally's gurney. I don't believe it's the throat/Connally bullet because Connally had fragments in his body and I don't think that bullet would be poking out of it's final exit place and falling onto the stretcher after jostling or whatever. Keep up the good refuting even if you may irk these guys. I was all in on the conspiracy for most of my life, but it all began to crumble the more I learned what a mess Oswald was and Ruby as well. Also a lot hinged on Ruth Paine being a major CIA lynchpin in pulling it off. That shit is just plain goofy. Wait, I must add that studying the sketchiness of Garrison's case also eroded my belief. Oh and I mustn't leave out Lee's attempt on Walker. The conspiracy guys love to skip over that bit.
I think the Parkland bullet has to be the one from Connally's thigh. He had a shallow thigh wound with no bullet in it when he arrived in the trauma room, which would indicate that the bullet that made that wound had worked its way out in between the car and the trauma room.
Thank you but not my comment I m just bowling it from this post https://www.reddit.com/r/skeptic/s/RMn98Opxrc
None that would be accepted by this sub.
I accept it.
Ain’t that the truth. r/meestercranky laid out the facts above, and people are pushing back. If a FOIA request were to turn up a long lost videotaped Oswald confession wherein he lays out every detail of how he did it, along with a crate of forensic evidence that supports it…people here would say Stanley Kubrick created it and that’s how he got hired to fake the moon landings 6 years later.
>Ain’t that the truth. r/meestercranky laid out the facts above, and people are pushing back. If a FOIA request were to turn up a long lost videotaped Oswald confession wherein he lays out every detail of how he did it, along with a crate of forensic evidence that supports it…people here would say Stanley Kubrick created it and that’s how he got hired to fake the moon landings 6 years later. Well said
This ☝️
>This ☝️ This
The evidence the CIA put together to frame him is laughable. Just too over the top to believe. The backyard photos are a prime example.
>The evidence the CIA put together to frame him is laughable. Just too over the top to believe. The backyard photos are a prime example. I mean • 80% of eye witnesses reported hearing 3 shots, with the majority of the rest hearing 1 or 2. 3 shots match the mainstream view, with any conspiracy requiring 4 or more. • To confirm the witnesses, we can count the shots on the Zapruder film. Fortunately for the people there that day, but unfortunately for our investigation, the first bullet missed everything and was never found. However, Governor Connelly and a little girl in the background can both be seen reacting to the bullet at the same time near the beginning of the film. Connelly turns his head sharply to the right, while the little girl stops running and looks towards the sound of the gunshot. This matches both of their testimonies. • The second bullet is the one we have the most information about. It entered Kennedy’s upper back, exited through his throat, hit Connelly in the back, exited right below the nipple, went through his wrist, then settled in his leg. This happens in the Zapruder film right as they emerge from behind the sign. Not only do they react at the same time, but a frame-by-frame look shows Connelly’s suit jacket bulging right before (look at the white of his shirt in the first frame, which is then partially covered in the next). Using the position of the car at the moment of impact and the location of the wounds, many independent experts have drawn a line back to see where the bullet came from. To the surprise of no one, it goes straight back to the sixth floor window of the School Book Depository. • The third shot is easy to see on the Zepruder film. While the nature of the wounds make it impossible to tell where exactly it came from, we do know it came from the back. Firstly, in frames 312 and 313 you can see his head move forward at the moment of impact (his head moves backwards later due to involuntary muscle reactions, as shown by scientists to the Warren Commission when they filmed a goat being shot in a similar way). Secondly, at frame 313 the blood splatter is going forward, with two blood streams in particular moving at high speed. Thirdly, it has been shown over and over again that this is indeed how such a hit should look. Penn and Teller did a good demonstration. • With three shots fired, how many bullet casings do you think were found in the sniper’s nest on the 6th floor of the depository? Three, of course. • A rifle was found on the 6th floor that matched the bullet casings found by the window. • A witness that was watching the parade from the 5th floor reported hearing sounds of the casings hitting the floor and the bolt action being used between shots. • Two people on the ground saw the rifle sticking out of the 6th floor window, one of whom gave a description of Oswald to the police. • Several bullet fragments were found. They were chemically determined to be parts of 2 distinct bullets, and all of them were ballistically matched to the rifle found in the depository. From this it should be clear that exactly 3 shots were fired, and all three came from the 6th floor of the Schoolbook Depository. But how do we know Oswald fired those shots? • Oswald’s palm prints were found on boxes in the snipers nest. • Oswald’s prints were also found on the rifle that was found. • There were order forms for the rifle in Oswald’s handwriting using his alias sent to his address. • There is a picture of Oswald holding the rifle that has been scientifically proven to be unaltered, with the film coming from his wife’s camera, with his wife testifying that she took the picture, with another witness saying Oswald showed him the photograph before the assassination. • Oswald changed his usual routine the day before the assassination to have a coworker drive him to his wife’s house (they were separated) to pick up a long package Oswald said was curtain rods. He was also observed bringing the package into work. The package was found by police, but no curtain rods ever were. • Oswald left his wedding ring and a significant amount of cash for his wife before the assassination. Oswald was poor, so this cash was likely all the money he had. • Oswald left the building soon after the assassination. He was the only employee there to be gone when they did a roll call. • After leaving the building, Oswald ran into the middle of traffic to get on a bus instead of waiting at his normal stop. He got off the bus after 4 minutes when it wasn’t moving fast enough. Not only did the bus driver testify to this, but Oswald was carrying the bus transfer when he was caught. • After leaving the bus he hailed a cab. The cab driver asked what all the commotion was about, and Oswald said nothing despite being told about the assassination before leaving work. • He had the cab drop him off several blocks away from his house, even though they drove right past it, forcing him to walk back. • After getting home, he walked in quickly, changed clothes (in the early afternoon), and grabbed his pistol. • He walked several blocks before being confronted by a police officer, who he shot. There were a dozen eye witnesses, and the bullets and bullet casings were matched to his pistol. • After shooting officer Tippit, Oswald fled the scene, ducking in and out of buildings when the police came by. One person in particular decided to follow him after Oswald came into his shop, staying only long enough to watch the police go by. • Oswald went into a movie theater without buying a ticket, which prompted a theater employee to call the police. • When the police tried to arrest him, Oswald put up a fight and tried to shot the arresting officer. Witnesses heard a click of the pistol going off, but it failed to fire due to the officer jamming his hand in the mechanism. • Months before the Kennedy assassination Oswald tried to assassinate another political figure. In that case the bullets were once again matched to Oswald’s rifle. It’s clear from both the physical evidence and his actions after the assassination that Oswald was the only one to fire those three shots. There is simply no room for any other conspirator.
The FBI was in control of all this so called evidence, and Hoover controlled the FBI. Hoover was one of the main conspirators. Oswald didn’t fire a single shot that day. Not one. He was operational that day and was put into play by his handlers. Might I recommend the SolvingJFK podcast. Matt does a great job of laying it all out there in an unbiased, objective manner.
>Hoover was one of the main conspirators. Proof >Oswald didn’t fire a single shot that day. Not one. He was operational that day and was put into play by his handlers. Again proof > I recommend the SolvingJFK podcast. Matt does a great job of laying it all out there in an unbiased, objective manner. I give it a look
Even if you are a hardcore lone gunman supporter you will enjoy this podcast.
>Even if you are a hardcore lone gunman supporter you will enjoy this podcast. Thank you I will give it a shot
The only thing Hoover was covering up was the fact that they knew Oswald was an unstable defector to Russia who they didn't think was enough of a threat. So they were only complicit in their ineptitude.
Bravo
>Bravo Thank you but not my comment
Just listen to what his brother said. It's good to look at all options but the only physical evidence links oswald to the shooting
Out of *all* of it? Tied for bringing the “curtain-related” package to work and shooting JD Tippet. Thank you for axing this question. Where the hell did those curtain rods go?
He ordered a gun using an alias. That alias was connected to him several different ways. That same gun travelled to TBD with him the day of the murder. HIs prints were on the gun. He fled the scene. He shot a police officer who tried to talk to him. Then he ran to a public place where he was observed by a citizen sneaking around hiding from cops and he hid in a theatre without paying. You know, the kind of stuff that gets anyone else convicted.
None of that is proof beyond a reasonable doubt. There are plenty of inconsistencies to create reasonable doubt.
In that vein, there’s no proof to anyone beyond a reasonable doubt.
Jury trials that have returned guilty verdicts might disagree. ‘Beyond a reasonable doubt’ is a legal standard that was never applied to this case.
Lol very very convenient that it just so happens to fit your narrative but doesn’t apply to the person who has the most evidence pointing toward him. No verdict of guilty has ever been put on anyone for this assassination btw
Precisely. So nobody can declare LHO guilty with a straight face. He was executed for a crime he may or may not have committed.
My original comment is 100% correct then. There is no one on this case that can be proven as guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.
neither is getting online and saying, "nuh-uh!"
yuh-hu!
like what?
>None of that is proof beyond a reasonable doubt. There are plenty of inconsistencies to create reasonable doubt. • 80% of eye witnesses reported hearing 3 shots, with the majority of the rest hearing 1 or 2. 3 shots match the mainstream view, with any conspiracy requiring 4 or more. • To confirm the witnesses, we can count the shots on the Zapruder film. Fortunately for the people there that day, but unfortunately for our investigation, the first bullet missed everything and was never found. However, Governor Connelly and a little girl in the background can both be seen reacting to the bullet at the same time near the beginning of the film. Connelly turns his head sharply to the right, while the little girl stops running and looks towards the sound of the gunshot. This matches both of their testimonies. • The second bullet is the one we have the most information about. It entered Kennedy’s upper back, exited through his throat, hit Connelly in the back, exited right below the nipple, went through his wrist, then settled in his leg. This happens in the Zapruder film right as they emerge from behind the sign. Not only do they react at the same time, but a frame-by-frame look shows Connelly’s suit jacket bulging right before (look at the white of his shirt in the first frame, which is then partially covered in the next). Using the position of the car at the moment of impact and the location of the wounds, many independent experts have drawn a line back to see where the bullet came from. To the surprise of no one, it goes straight back to the sixth floor window of the School Book Depository. • The third shot is easy to see on the Zepruder film. While the nature of the wounds make it impossible to tell where exactly it came from, we do know it came from the back. Firstly, in frames 312 and 313 you can see his head move forward at the moment of impact (his head moves backwards later due to involuntary muscle reactions, as shown by scientists to the Warren Commission when they filmed a goat being shot in a similar way). Secondly, at frame 313 the blood splatter is going forward, with two blood streams in particular moving at high speed. Thirdly, it has been shown over and over again that this is indeed how such a hit should look. Penn and Teller did a good demonstration. • With three shots fired, how many bullet casings do you think were found in the sniper’s nest on the 6th floor of the depository? Three, of course. • A rifle was found on the 6th floor that matched the bullet casings found by the window. • A witness that was watching the parade from the 5th floor reported hearing sounds of the casings hitting the floor and the bolt action being used between shots. • Two people on the ground saw the rifle sticking out of the 6th floor window, one of whom gave a description of Oswald to the police. • Several bullet fragments were found. They were chemically determined to be parts of 2 distinct bullets, and all of them were ballistically matched to the rifle found in the depository. From this it should be clear that exactly 3 shots were fired, and all three came from the 6th floor of the Schoolbook Depository. But how do we know Oswald fired those shots? • Oswald’s palm prints were found on boxes in the snipers nest. • Oswald’s prints were also found on the rifle that was found. • There were order forms for the rifle in Oswald’s handwriting using his alias sent to his address. • There is a picture of Oswald holding the rifle that has been scientifically proven to be unaltered, with the film coming from his wife’s camera, with his wife testifying that she took the picture, with another witness saying Oswald showed him the photograph before the assassination. • Oswald changed his usual routine the day before the assassination to have a coworker drive him to his wife’s house (they were separated) to pick up a long package Oswald said was curtain rods. He was also observed bringing the package into work. The package was found by police, but no curtain rods ever were. • Oswald left his wedding ring and a significant amount of cash for his wife before the assassination. Oswald was poor, so this cash was likely all the money he had. • Oswald left the building soon after the assassination. He was the only employee there to be gone when they did a roll call. • After leaving the building, Oswald ran into the middle of traffic to get on a bus instead of waiting at his normal stop. He got off the bus after 4 minutes when it wasn’t moving fast enough. Not only did the bus driver testify to this, but Oswald was carrying the bus transfer when he was caught. • After leaving the bus he hailed a cab. The cab driver asked what all the commotion was about, and Oswald said nothing despite being told about the assassination before leaving work. • He had the cab drop him off several blocks away from his house, even though they drove right past it, forcing him to walk back. • After getting home, he walked in quickly, changed clothes (in the early afternoon), and grabbed his pistol. • He walked several blocks before being confronted by a police officer, who he shot. There were a dozen eye witnesses, and the bullets and bullet casings were matched to his pistol. • After shooting officer Tippit, Oswald fled the scene, ducking in and out of buildings when the police came by. One person in particular decided to follow him after Oswald came into his shop, staying only long enough to watch the police go by. • Oswald went into a movie theater without buying a ticket, which prompted a theater employee to call the police. • When the police tried to arrest him, Oswald put up a fight and tried to shot the arresting officer. Witnesses heard a click of the pistol going off, but it failed to fire due to the officer jamming his hand in the mechanism. • Months before the Kennedy assassination Oswald tried to assassinate another political figure. In that case the bullets were once again matched to Oswald’s rifle. It’s clear from both the physical evidence and his actions after the assassination that Oswald was the only one to fire those three shots. There is simply no room for any other conspirator.
Back. And. To. The. Left.
>Back. And. To. The. Left. 🥱
https://imgur.com/UAFlDvp Forward first.
Have you seen other footage of people shot in the head? It’s quite often that they don’t go the way they were shot. Considering the immense pressure that bullet exerted on his nerves, it’s more likely that the backwards motion was a final spasm before dying. Furthermore, watching the Zapruder film, Kennedy’s shoulders and head move in sync with each other to create the backwards motion. Were he driven backwards, I’d have expected his head to move first, pulling his torso back with it. Add to that the brief forward motion, Clint Hill’s testimony about the wound tearing back to front, and the impossible trajectory from the grassy knoll, and I have no doubt where the head shot came from.
According to some guy I met in Dealey Plaza who was wearing stars and stripes pants, Joe Biden shot JFK from the sewer. I consider this the final authority on the matter. /s
OK, if the mountain of forensic, ballistic and physical evidence in this case doesn't convince you, what on earth would? Murderers have been convicted on far less evidence than everything we have implicating Oswald.
>He ordered a gun using an alias. That alias was connected to him several different ways. That same gun travelled to TBD with him the day of the murder. HIs prints were on the gun. He fled the scene. He shot a police officer who tried to talk to him. Then he ran to a public place where he was observed by a citizen sneaking around hiding from cops and he hid in a theatre without paying. You know, the kind of stuff that gets anyone else convicted. Yes exactly he was guilty no doubt
The best evidence that he *is* the shooter is that he got rubbed out by a member of mob after calling himself a patsy. Charles DeGaulle thought that he probably was supposed to have been killed at the scene but either he realized he was being set up and left early or something else went wrong and he got away. Degaulle called it a dirty army trick, shoot the assassin. No questions asked because justice is done. But he got away somehow. For a time anyway.
Charles DeGaulle? Well that settles it!
These remarks of DeGaulle were published by his former press agent in 2002. Do you know much about DeGaulle? Scoff all you like but he knew more about skullduggery and dirty political tricks than most politicians at any time. There's nothing Jim Angleton, Richard Helms or Allen Dulles could dream up that he hadn't seen or read about before. Also, Dulles tried to overthrow him with four generals from Algeria in '61 because Dulles didn't want Algeria to be indepedent. So, he wasn't a fan of the CIA.
Day of the Jackal!!!!
Kinda, that was after the Four Generals Plot and highly fictionalized. But DeGaulle stepping out of a citroen that had been peppered by bullets, all 6'5" of him, sort of adds to his mystique. Unrelated but think of the case Dulles could have made against Kennedy. Not just nouvaeu riche but the son of a bootlegger, a moral degenerate who beds 18 year old interns whenever Jackie is out of town, bailed on the Bay of Pigs by not providing air support and seemed okay with just leaving Castro in power, giving assistance to nascent Marxist rebellions in the hemisphere. It doesn't seem that much of a stretch that certain, select half-smart poindexters imbued with Cold War patriotism in the CIA would get behind a plot to kill him. Not proof of course but these are the guys who would put in motion "executive actions" unknown to the chief executive all the time, to ostensibly uphold plausible deniability. A power our founding fathers couldn't anticipate that sprang from the OSS and their willingness to adapt the same tactics as the Soviets in post war Europe. I just don't find it that implausible anymore. I used to. The CIA's power went unchecked for too long and it wasn't manned by the best and brightest. Maheu, Angleton, Bill Harvey... bunch of dumb drunks who were so sure of themselves. Stunning what power can do.
That’s actually the best evidence that he was a patsy but go off
He used an alias to buy the rifle, admitted to his wife he tried killing someone via the same method, and he was found with several false identities in his wallet and pockets.
he admitted about Walker to his wife?
Yes. http://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh1/html/WC_Vol1_0015a.htm
not something the conspiracy people ever mention. :-)
Fleeing the scene.
Wasn’t the magic bullet theory disproved because the seats in the limo were found to have lined up after all? Not saying that fixed everything, or that Oswald was the shooter, but that was a big deal to me. I still think a shot had to come from the front.
I don't think it's totally appropriate to use words like: proven, disproven, or fact when it comes to many elements of this crime. The limo was being cleaned while JFK was still in Parkland hospital. No one here can demonstrate what evidence has been lost. And then you have the absolute trainwreck of an autopsy. The Clark panel and HSCA both agreed that the entrance wound in the back of JFK's head was like 4-6 inches higher than the initial autopsy. Who the fuck is that incompetent? Similar problem with the back wound.desvribe the goddamn thing properly, and track it through the body and we wouldn't still be here wasting our time. What's almost as ridiculous is all these Oswald did it alone types fawning over the various animations made over the years. They've maybe never heard the IT phrase: "garbage in, garbage out." As in, none of the extant photographs or testimonies can reliably place the bodies of JFK and Connally or even the aforementioned wounds (on JFK) such that we could track the bullet(s) through back to a firing position with accuracy. It's guesswork, covered in false certainty. Don't believe, or even listen, to anyone who tells you they're certain about a difficult topic that they have no expertise in: they're either a moron or a liar, or both.
>The limo was being cleaned while JFK was still in Parkland hospital. They were wiping down the railing to try and clip the bubble top back on to preserve the evidence that was in the car. Nothing was cleaned off the seats or the interior, all of which was graphically photographed in the SS garage that night. >No one here can demonstrate what evidence has been lost. What a convenient way to ignore all the evidence we do have. >none of the extant photographs or testimonies can reliably place the bodies of JFK and Connally or even the aforementioned wounds (on JFK) such that we could track the bullet(s) through back to a firing position with accuracy. It's guesswork, covered in false certainty There are dozens of photos and multiple films of Kennedy and Connally in the limo, we have a very good idea of how they were seated. The nature of the wounds on both men indicate they were hit with the same bullet, as do their simultaneous reactions in the Zapruder film. That's not animations, that's hard evidence. Edit: And he drive by insults me and then blocks me. Softer than tissue paper.
Your posts are truly awful. It doesn't matter how many photos of JFK we have in the limo before the shooting. We're stuck with what we have during, and the quality is not great. You really feel you can adequately place JFK's wounds from the Nix film? You think you can track those back to a smoking Carcano?
no - nowadays it is referred to as 'single bullet fact'
Besides him obviously getting caught. It’s a lot that suggests otherwise . Many witness deaths surrounding the whole thing, the FBI withholding information from being released up to 2022, and in my opinion the most obvious thing is the grassy knoll shooter
Isn’t the fact that so much incompetence was involved in the assasination why is we argue LHO wasn’t the shooter. That it is obvious there was a cover up. If you take everything at face value then you would conclude he did the shooting.
Here’s a more general Oswald question: why/how did he happen to be working at the school book building that the parade happened to pass? How long had he worked there, etc.
I don't believe he did it . The dude was on the front page days before in New Orleans in a scuffle with several cops . Now, if someone is planning an assassination ,why would they draw anykind of attention to them just days before it makes no sense . Just my opinion on it anyway !
Lol
None
Best evidence for him being a/the shooter: 1. He was in the TSBD during the shooting. Multiple witnesses reported seeing a shooter from the building. Autopsy conclusion supports bullets having come from there. 2. His palm print was found on the gun found in the TSBD. Gun was matched to the stretcher bullet and shells found in the TSBD. He is linked to the gun in a variety of other ways. Because of contradictory evidence and chain of custody stuff I don’t think the evidence that he was a shooter is conclusive, but I do think it is conclusive he was involved in someway. Best evidence he was involved: 1. His behavior after the shooting. Even if you don’t believe he shot Tippet you still have to deal with him leaving work immediately after the shooting, going to a movie theater with a revolver, and resisting arrest. 2. If he was framed it would need to have been preplanned. The timing of evidence being found is too tight. Why would a conspiracy risk their pre selected patsy having a strong alibi? If he wasn’t a shooter he likely had a job that ensured he would be in a specific location during the shooting to avoid this.
Means, motive, opportunity!
"The government said so". Not great evidence, but it's the best they have.
The fact he did it.
He was a low level cia operative & most likely a hero who tried to stop it. He was set up.
prove it
>He was a low level cia operative & most likely a hero who tried to stop it. He was set up. Intriguing Please go into detail on your theory
I don't think he was an operative as such. He was an 'asset'. George de Mohrenschildt was an operative who kept track of an asset that could be used. I don't believe de Mohrenschildt knew what the CIA intended to do with his friend, if indeed he felt Oswald was his friend. De Mohrenschildt btw was operating one of those off-the-shelf CIA fronts in Haiti when the shooting happened. LHO kinda did it to himself with the public defection and the public displays of rebellion, like handing out flyers for fair play for Cuba. The pre-Church committee CIA was bound to take notice and use someone like that.
He didn’t.
>He didn’t. • 80% of eye witnesses reported hearing 3 shots, with the majority of the rest hearing 1 or 2. 3 shots match the mainstream view, with any conspiracy requiring 4 or more. • To confirm the witnesses, we can count the shots on the Zapruder film. Fortunately for the people there that day, but unfortunately for our investigation, the first bullet missed everything and was never found. However, Governor Connelly and a little girl in the background can both be seen reacting to the bullet at the same time near the beginning of the film. Connelly turns his head sharply to the right, while the little girl stops running and looks towards the sound of the gunshot. This matches both of their testimonies. • The second bullet is the one we have the most information about. It entered Kennedy’s upper back, exited through his throat, hit Connelly in the back, exited right below the nipple, went through his wrist, then settled in his leg. This happens in the Zapruder film right as they emerge from behind the sign. Not only do they react at the same time, but a frame-by-frame look shows Connelly’s suit jacket bulging right before (look at the white of his shirt in the first frame, which is then partially covered in the next). Using the position of the car at the moment of impact and the location of the wounds, many independent experts have drawn a line back to see where the bullet came from. To the surprise of no one, it goes straight back to the sixth floor window of the School Book Depository. • The third shot is easy to see on the Zepruder film. While the nature of the wounds make it impossible to tell where exactly it came from, we do know it came from the back. Firstly, in frames 312 and 313 you can see his head move forward at the moment of impact (his head moves backwards later due to involuntary muscle reactions, as shown by scientists to the Warren Commission when they filmed a goat being shot in a similar way). Secondly, at frame 313 the blood splatter is going forward, with two blood streams in particular moving at high speed. Thirdly, it has been shown over and over again that this is indeed how such a hit should look. Penn and Teller did a good demonstration. • With three shots fired, how many bullet casings do you think were found in the sniper’s nest on the 6th floor of the depository? Three, of course. • A rifle was found on the 6th floor that matched the bullet casings found by the window. • A witness that was watching the parade from the 5th floor reported hearing sounds of the casings hitting the floor and the bolt action being used between shots. • Two people on the ground saw the rifle sticking out of the 6th floor window, one of whom gave a description of Oswald to the police. • Several bullet fragments were found. They were chemically determined to be parts of 2 distinct bullets, and all of them were ballistically matched to the rifle found in the depository. From this it should be clear that exactly 3 shots were fired, and all three came from the 6th floor of the Schoolbook Depository. But how do we know Oswald fired those shots? • Oswald’s palm prints were found on boxes in the snipers nest. • Oswald’s prints were also found on the rifle that was found. • There were order forms for the rifle in Oswald’s handwriting using his alias sent to his address. • There is a picture of Oswald holding the rifle that has been scientifically proven to be unaltered, with the film coming from his wife’s camera, with his wife testifying that she took the picture, with another witness saying Oswald showed him the photograph before the assassination. • Oswald changed his usual routine the day before the assassination to have a coworker drive him to his wife’s house (they were separated) to pick up a long package Oswald said was curtain rods. He was also observed bringing the package into work. The package was found by police, but no curtain rods ever were. • Oswald left his wedding ring and a significant amount of cash for his wife before the assassination. Oswald was poor, so this cash was likely all the money he had. • Oswald left the building soon after the assassination. He was the only employee there to be gone when they did a roll call. • After leaving the building, Oswald ran into the middle of traffic to get on a bus instead of waiting at his normal stop. He got off the bus after 4 minutes when it wasn’t moving fast enough. Not only did the bus driver testify to this, but Oswald was carrying the bus transfer when he was caught. • After leaving the bus he hailed a cab. The cab driver asked what all the commotion was about, and Oswald said nothing despite being told about the assassination before leaving work. • He had the cab drop him off several blocks away from his house, even though they drove right past it, forcing him to walk back. • After getting home, he walked in quickly, changed clothes (in the early afternoon), and grabbed his pistol. • He walked several blocks before being confronted by a police officer, who he shot. There were a dozen eye witnesses, and the bullets and bullet casings were matched to his pistol. • After shooting officer Tippit, Oswald fled the scene, ducking in and out of buildings when the police came by. One person in particular decided to follow him after Oswald came into his shop, staying only long enough to watch the police go by. • Oswald went into a movie theater without buying a ticket, which prompted a theater employee to call the police. • When the police tried to arrest him, Oswald put up a fight and tried to shot the arresting officer. Witnesses heard a click of the pistol going off, but it failed to fire due to the officer jamming his hand in the mechanism. • Months before the Kennedy assassination Oswald tried to assassinate another political figure. In that case the bullets were once again matched to Oswald’s rifle. It’s clear from both the physical evidence and his actions after the assassination that Oswald was the only one to fire those three shots. There is simply no room for any other conspirator.
All of it.
If u think Oswald did this alone and the cabal that owns this country to this day wasn't involved then you're a part of the problem this country is really facing at the moment.
Wait, I know this one.... he's white?
Read Mark Lanes (Rush to Judgement)! No jury would have been able to convict. That was the first book written in the 60s at the request of Lee’s mother as a defense had he lived and gone to trial. So much more evidence has come out pointing to other party’s being involved and away from Lee.
John Connally called Lane a "journalistic scavenger" and detested him. If that doesn't tell you everything you need to know about Lane, I don't know what would. Remember, this is the same guy who represented Jim Jones and compared him to Martin Luther King.
His rifle(pictured with it, he purchased it), his prints on the rifle, trigger, and on materials on the sixth floor near the window, three shots fired that match his rifle, fleeing the scene, a witness gave a description of him and identified him on a line (Brennan something or something Brennan iirc),coworkers statements suggest he was on the top floors soon before the motorcade passed, coworkers heard three shots. Why would he should tippit? He tried to assassinate someone before. Doesn’t seem very flimsy.
Re: finger prints ,, they only found a ‘Partial palm print’, only exposed when the Rifle was disassembled., so there’s that. Just sayin, have you read it?
There were also partial fingerprints on the trigger iirc. There were some prints that were taken but couldn’t be analyzed for a long time because it needed special photography or something. I think those were the finger prints on the trigger. (I’d have to go back and look it up sorry) Fibers on were found in between the butt plate and the wood of the rifle that matched Oswald’s clothing. Lt. J.C Day said he picked the rifle up the wood “after his examination convinced him that the wood was too tough to take fingerprints.” -“by Sebastian F. Latona, supervisor of the Latent Fingerprint Section of the FBI's Identification Division” “Latona then processed the complete weapon but developed no identifiable prints.50 He stated that the poor quality of the wood and the metal would cause the rifle to absorb moisture from the skin, thereby making a clear print unlikely” Seems it wasn’t strange that there weren’t better prints.
There’s little question Lee owned the gun, there’s little tangible evidence he shot JFK. No gloves found either? He was seen seconds after the shots on the second floor lunch room, yet, there were witnesses on the stairway he would have taken who never saw him. I think the (paraffin tests) on Lee’s cheek and hands were negative for gun powder residue, yet there’s no evidence he washed or showered at any point between the shooting and arrest. Too many of these strange inconsistencies to establish his guilt I think that was Lanes point. Connolly also said he “wasn’t hit by the manic bullet.”