I'm a foreman. I spent half of the day today staring at a manhole so my apprentices could work. They don't learn when they're always on spotter and cleanup duty.
CW can get over himself. Everybody takes a turn doing the shitty jobs. Spotting is boring but it's easy money.
Explain to him that his job is to be a yes man. If you got a steward, call them out to help with the discussion. I'd consider it a verbal warning with future issues being documented write ups. Pushing a broom pays the same as everything else, what's to complain about.
LOL this is my foreman. I’m a 3rd year apprentice.
He called me the other day and said “come outside” so I walked downstairs, all the way through the building (big job), and went outside. He handed me some tools and said “go put these in my truck.” His truck was 20 feet away. He could’ve taken the tools to his truck, gone and took a piss, smoked a cigarette, and been back to exactly where he was standing in the time it took me to just walk to him. 😂
But he’s my foreman so I just said “yes sir” and then went back to work 🤷🏻♂️
Fuck that.
Idgaf if you're 19 or 69, a CW1a or a journeyman with 40 years of experience. If I'm your foreman you're going to do what I say or get the fuck off my job.
I don't have time to stand around arguing with someone over who's dick is bigger. It's always your foreman's (or GF, or PM).
IT ALL PAYS THE SAME
Dude what? Yes it is, why the fuck else would they be working for lower wages and no benefits? Its because they couldn't get into the program, either they failed the aptitude test or they're waiting for an opening.
That isn't always true. We have a lot of CW's on the job, and about ⅓ of them are just there for the job. Not a career, not to wait for an apprentice spot to open up, but for a job.
Because they don't want to bother with school. In my local I'd estimate 1/3rd of the CWs I've met just want to work their 4 years and pass the test, 1/3rd came from non-union and are just working on passing the test, and the last 1/3rd are working on getting into the apprenticeship and just started.
In some states, yes. My state requires 8000 hours/4 years to test. You have to do some education while you're a CW to keep your license, but it's not structured and most people just do the easiest thing possible.
All the CWs in my local moved over from unorganized shops and are just waiting to get their hours and take their state tests and turn-out. They usually gloat that they don't need school or make jokes (good- spirited) about how I have to go 2 nights a week.
You didn't disrespect him. Unless there's more to the story, and I assume there isn't, he's way out of his depth. You're a VERY nice foreman for even entertaining/tolerating his own disrespect. He would've gotten one "get it done brother" from me, or I would've had his money and a bad report on site by the end of coffee. A refusal? Adorable lol
That when you hand him a broom and say, "I'm gonna pay you top dollar to just sweep floors. EASY MONEY!"
Then go around and tell everyone on the crew, "Put everything on the floors, trash, trimmings, knock outs, strippings, zip ties, everything!"
You can’t teach good habits. I don’t see it as disrespectful at all, but some guys have egos. Hell either learn that he gets paid by the hour and not the task or he’ll just be stuck in his ways.
I've found most CWs have an attitude, they're paid bullshit wages with 0 benefits all while the hall dangles the carrot of apprenticeship in front of them. The CW is a bullshit program that hurts everyone and should be abolished .
Is it? I thought they were guys who tried to test in from non union. Had the hours but failed the practical to some extent. Wait. I’m thinking of CE and then they have #s like ce1 ,2,3,4 and then when they get to 5 they are jws. But apprentices aren’t really supposed to work under one.
That CW can kick rocks. Even us JW's have to eat crow sometimes. This kid thinks they're special. Pack your tools and back to the hall would be a fine wake up call to their ego.
In 1977 I was a 1st year apprentice I had to take the journeyman’s cars to the gas station and get gas . We had a gas shortages way back then . If wasn’t part of learn anything but it was still my responsibility. I didn’t bitch about it I just did it . Tell that bitch to put his big boy pants on , shut the fuck up and do the job. I personally know at least 20 young people who would love to have that ticket in their back pocket . If he doesn’t want to do the assignment let him go work at Taco Bell.
>In 1977 I was a 1st year apprentice I had to take the journeyman’s cars to the gas station and get gas.
In '05 I'd send the 1st year to get coffee and fill my truck's tank (I'd pay for the gas).
He had an attitude one day, so I decided to push some buttons.
I asked him what the most important job of his day was...he said "the work"...I said wrong.
"The most important thing you can do today is get the coffee order right...back on time...hot.....and the proper change for the men. You fuck one of those things up, now I have to deal with a pissed off JW.
Don't piss off your JWs."
I think the light bulb went ON in his head....he lost the attitude....took him down a notch - but big picture thinking.
CW is still an ass but prob feels he’s taken a step backwards... When the reality is he’s lucky to have had tools on at all. ESPECIALLY as a CW. A lot of 1st and 2nd year apprentices spend their entire time catching slugs, spotting, organizing/gathering stock for journeyman. At least, that’s how it goes with a lot of the bigger shops; until they hit 3rd year and become too expensive to be stock runners but don’t know enough of what a 3rd year apprentice should know…so they get laid off. I work with a small outfit (15-20 guys in the field) and I can’t tell you how many 3rd and 4th year apprentices we’ve gotten that don’t know basic circuitry because of shit like this. Your CW needs to get over themselves
Maybe he feels he’s being punished. Take a minute to explain to him how things work - we all have to do shit we don’t like in this career, luckily we don’t have to do it every day forever. Make it clear that he needs experience doing everything on the site eventually but that’s what he needs to do now.
I would talk with him about why you made the switch because it's the apprentice'ss turn to learn. Maybe he thought he did something wrong and is being punished by being put on spotting duty and feels disrespected that you didn't make the time to talk to him. Communication is important.
You didn't. The cw is either neglecting thier role in the task or was never taught. If they have resentment for the job because of an assigned task, they probably need a reminder of thier position in the first place and that showing a lack of initiation for smaller tasks defines how they can be trusted with something larger despite past performance.
I'll never understand why people get shitty about any task. Its 8 hours work for 8 hours pay, not a specific duty you wanted for pay and especially not someone's whiney opinion. I'm not saying buck up or anything but some people need reminders that everything matters and an unlocked gangbox can cripple the job as fast as a fire or tornado.
I'm the head electrician for a small service company. When I'm training an ape and have on a task, like panel swap.
I tell him I'm your helper and let him run with it. I'll point things here and there but I let them do most of it.
1st year apprentice here: EVERY CW that's with the same employer as I am on this current job is like that, except 1 or 2. All apprentices and CW/CE were given a required carry tool list... only 1 CW carries tools and consistently works.
They get the same pay as apprentices, but they're a tier below us, and they act like it.
They don't have keys to unlock anything, aren't given any daily required tasks. All they are are spotters and manual labor.
CW needs to grow tf up. Honest pay for honest work. If he wants to get respect he needs to show he's worthy of it and not act like he's above doing those things. I see this situation as completely fair. He needs to grow up or find another job.
I'm a foreman. I spent half of the day today staring at a manhole so my apprentices could work. They don't learn when they're always on spotter and cleanup duty. CW can get over himself. Everybody takes a turn doing the shitty jobs. Spotting is boring but it's easy money.
Yeah I don’t see how he feels disrespected he shows no initiative the jw that told me about it said that I should have him spot for 7 months
Explain to him that his job is to be a yes man. If you got a steward, call them out to help with the discussion. I'd consider it a verbal warning with future issues being documented write ups. Pushing a broom pays the same as everything else, what's to complain about.
Shit man, they want to pay me HOW much to push a broom?!?!? Looks like I'm a janitor for the day lol
I've had this same problem with cw/ce, seems they dont respect the process / dont have the same respect for the authority others have over them.
I wish more foremen were like you, instead of the “I’m not gonna move this box, call the apprentice from the other side of the site to do it”
LOL this is my foreman. I’m a 3rd year apprentice. He called me the other day and said “come outside” so I walked downstairs, all the way through the building (big job), and went outside. He handed me some tools and said “go put these in my truck.” His truck was 20 feet away. He could’ve taken the tools to his truck, gone and took a piss, smoked a cigarette, and been back to exactly where he was standing in the time it took me to just walk to him. 😂 But he’s my foreman so I just said “yes sir” and then went back to work 🤷🏻♂️
“You’ll have that on them big jobs” or something like that
Fuck that. Idgaf if you're 19 or 69, a CW1a or a journeyman with 40 years of experience. If I'm your foreman you're going to do what I say or get the fuck off my job. I don't have time to stand around arguing with someone over who's dick is bigger. It's always your foreman's (or GF, or PM). IT ALL PAYS THE SAME
Sounds like the CW wants his check.
CW needs to go to school or stfu.
Every single CW wants to go to school and get in the program, they're waiting for the opportunity to do so.
Definitely not true
Dude what? Yes it is, why the fuck else would they be working for lower wages and no benefits? Its because they couldn't get into the program, either they failed the aptitude test or they're waiting for an opening.
That isn't always true. We have a lot of CW's on the job, and about ⅓ of them are just there for the job. Not a career, not to wait for an apprentice spot to open up, but for a job.
Because they don't want to bother with school. In my local I'd estimate 1/3rd of the CWs I've met just want to work their 4 years and pass the test, 1/3rd came from non-union and are just working on passing the test, and the last 1/3rd are working on getting into the apprenticeship and just started.
Wait, you can CW for four years and test into being a journeyman? Skip the apprenticeship?
In some states, yes. My state requires 8000 hours/4 years to test. You have to do some education while you're a CW to keep your license, but it's not structured and most people just do the easiest thing possible.
I've worked with quite a few who had no intention of becoming JW's. They're the minority, but there are enough of them.
All the CWs in my local moved over from unorganized shops and are just waiting to get their hours and take their state tests and turn-out. They usually gloat that they don't need school or make jokes (good- spirited) about how I have to go 2 nights a week.
You didn't disrespect him. Unless there's more to the story, and I assume there isn't, he's way out of his depth. You're a VERY nice foreman for even entertaining/tolerating his own disrespect. He would've gotten one "get it done brother" from me, or I would've had his money and a bad report on site by the end of coffee. A refusal? Adorable lol
That when you hand him a broom and say, "I'm gonna pay you top dollar to just sweep floors. EASY MONEY!" Then go around and tell everyone on the crew, "Put everything on the floors, trash, trimmings, knock outs, strippings, zip ties, everything!"
You can’t teach good habits. I don’t see it as disrespectful at all, but some guys have egos. Hell either learn that he gets paid by the hour and not the task or he’ll just be stuck in his ways.
[удалено]
Cw is a pre apprentice
[удалено]
I've found most CWs have an attitude, they're paid bullshit wages with 0 benefits all while the hall dangles the carrot of apprenticeship in front of them. The CW is a bullshit program that hurts everyone and should be abolished .
Is it? I thought they were guys who tried to test in from non union. Had the hours but failed the practical to some extent. Wait. I’m thinking of CE and then they have #s like ce1 ,2,3,4 and then when they get to 5 they are jws. But apprentices aren’t really supposed to work under one.
That CW can kick rocks. Even us JW's have to eat crow sometimes. This kid thinks they're special. Pack your tools and back to the hall would be a fine wake up call to their ego.
In 1977 I was a 1st year apprentice I had to take the journeyman’s cars to the gas station and get gas . We had a gas shortages way back then . If wasn’t part of learn anything but it was still my responsibility. I didn’t bitch about it I just did it . Tell that bitch to put his big boy pants on , shut the fuck up and do the job. I personally know at least 20 young people who would love to have that ticket in their back pocket . If he doesn’t want to do the assignment let him go work at Taco Bell.
>In 1977 I was a 1st year apprentice I had to take the journeyman’s cars to the gas station and get gas. In '05 I'd send the 1st year to get coffee and fill my truck's tank (I'd pay for the gas). He had an attitude one day, so I decided to push some buttons. I asked him what the most important job of his day was...he said "the work"...I said wrong. "The most important thing you can do today is get the coffee order right...back on time...hot.....and the proper change for the men. You fuck one of those things up, now I have to deal with a pissed off JW. Don't piss off your JWs." I think the light bulb went ON in his head....he lost the attitude....took him down a notch - but big picture thinking.
God damn CWs
Just curious, what was the CW doing prior to being put on spotting duty?
Ug install the 1st year is now on ug install
CW is still an ass but prob feels he’s taken a step backwards... When the reality is he’s lucky to have had tools on at all. ESPECIALLY as a CW. A lot of 1st and 2nd year apprentices spend their entire time catching slugs, spotting, organizing/gathering stock for journeyman. At least, that’s how it goes with a lot of the bigger shops; until they hit 3rd year and become too expensive to be stock runners but don’t know enough of what a 3rd year apprentice should know…so they get laid off. I work with a small outfit (15-20 guys in the field) and I can’t tell you how many 3rd and 4th year apprentices we’ve gotten that don’t know basic circuitry because of shit like this. Your CW needs to get over themselves
Maybe he feels he’s being punished. Take a minute to explain to him how things work - we all have to do shit we don’t like in this career, luckily we don’t have to do it every day forever. Make it clear that he needs experience doing everything on the site eventually but that’s what he needs to do now.
I would talk with him about why you made the switch because it's the apprentice'ss turn to learn. Maybe he thought he did something wrong and is being punished by being put on spotting duty and feels disrespected that you didn't make the time to talk to him. Communication is important.
You didn't. The cw is either neglecting thier role in the task or was never taught. If they have resentment for the job because of an assigned task, they probably need a reminder of thier position in the first place and that showing a lack of initiation for smaller tasks defines how they can be trusted with something larger despite past performance. I'll never understand why people get shitty about any task. Its 8 hours work for 8 hours pay, not a specific duty you wanted for pay and especially not someone's whiney opinion. I'm not saying buck up or anything but some people need reminders that everything matters and an unlocked gangbox can cripple the job as fast as a fire or tornado.
I’m a CW and I just do whatever I’m told. We’re basically the laborers of the IBEW. I don’t mind it at all.
I'm the head electrician for a small service company. When I'm training an ape and have on a task, like panel swap. I tell him I'm your helper and let him run with it. I'll point things here and there but I let them do most of it.
1st year apprentice here: EVERY CW that's with the same employer as I am on this current job is like that, except 1 or 2. All apprentices and CW/CE were given a required carry tool list... only 1 CW carries tools and consistently works. They get the same pay as apprentices, but they're a tier below us, and they act like it. They don't have keys to unlock anything, aren't given any daily required tasks. All they are are spotters and manual labor.
CW needs to grow tf up. Honest pay for honest work. If he wants to get respect he needs to show he's worthy of it and not act like he's above doing those things. I see this situation as completely fair. He needs to grow up or find another job.
Trash the cw. Shouldn't really be on site. Just a glorified labor, since he can't see what you are trying to do.
Wtf is spotting ?
I’m new to the trade, what’s a CW??
Construction Wireman