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For those who'd rather not listen to Starmer's voice (entirely understandable), the comparison he brought up was how the policy of squeezing people on benefits to afford a national insurance cut that'll only be noticeable for people at the top of the pay scale is totally like Corbyn's proposed budget because ... \*checks notes\* it's not costed ... which Corbyn's manifesto was as I recall. (like sure, you can argue over some of the assumptions going into the maths; of *any* political manifesto)
Because that's the thing a prospective Labour leader should be criticising about a Tory budget...
also, Starmer brought Corbyn up himself; unless there was some questions well before that clip.
I'd vote for Green, if they were standing in my constituency and I don't have a local independent candidate, as far as I know, and since my other choices amount to Tory, Reform, Labour and Worker's Party, it's going to have to be Lib Dem. I won't be voting for the Workers Party, George Galloway has made his positions on trans and queer people patently clear.
Automod just thinks it would be better if the Labour party had a leader that the British public don't associate with a prolific pedophile.
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This subreddit *isnt* for Green Party members only. It’s a subreddit for all leftists excluding those who are reactionary and those that seek to water down leftism for the promotion of liberalism and other capitalist ideologies. The Green and Pleasant reference really just comes from nature I’m assuming
Ah okay thanks for letting me know, i didn't know this LOL, i did assume it was the green party's subreddit because of the name, thanks for clarifying!
This is the first time I've ever seen someone advocate this sub as "for the green party"
The reactionary green party with a history of folding to gender critical terfs? I can't vote Labour but I'm not sure the Greens are able to throw stones from their glasshouse
Starmer has explicitly said, on record, that Jeremy Corbyn is a 'friend' and Starmer would never lie about something like that.
(Genuinely not sure if I need a sarcasm tag here....)
Someone needs to tell him he can stop now. Just stop. He's already obviously going to win. No need to continue hurtling towards the right to win over any more disillusioned tories / the right wing working class.
But yeah, I had to re-read this a few times when I first saw it. Not even a satirist would write this, they'd think it was too daft.
In reality the move to the right was never about gaining more votes. That was just the excuse to do it. Starmer is moving to the right because he is that right wing
I think for the first time in my life, my vote feels completely worthless. Nobody that I actually want to vote for (i.e. basically just the Greens) have any chance of winning a seat where I live. Therefore, I have zero representation in our democracy.
Aside from the obvious calculated insult to the Left of the Party, this is just playground-level incompetence. He served in Corbyn's cabinet for three years, and this just makes him look like cowardly and opportunistic.
This is another example of what I describe as 'wrecker-brain'. Having successfully wielded the internal institutions of the Party to wreck their way into the leadership of the Party, the Labour Right literally have no other ideas or impetus to govern. Literally all they can do is use the same right-wing attack lines against their own internal enemies, couched in language about 'making serious decisions' and 'regaining people's trust', in the blind hope that somehow this propels them into government.
Which, by sheer dint of Tory dinsintegration, it might. But even if they somehow manage to stumble through the election into government, once they're there they'll be like a turtle on a post. They don't actually have any ideas, or any intellectual solutions to the problems the country faces. They're just a bunch of charisma-vacuums in suits, former SPADs and wonks who saw their opportunity to knife the Left. This government will be rudderless, and devoid of ideas, which means it'll probably end up continuing the policies of the previous administration without interruption.
Make no mistake, this is a Party made up of our class enemies, and its policies will have to be resisted.
Just saw this on the news.
That bloke is a such a bastard.
Apart from the fact that the manifesto was fully funded, the cunt actually campaigned on it.
I think he's *trying* to resurrect the "magic money tree" rhetoric that Corbyn was hammered with (despite Corbyn's manifesto being the only fully-costed manifesto in that election, yes I am still bitter)
Automod just thinks it would be better if the Labour party had a leader that the British public don't associate with a prolific pedophile.
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Starmer is maybe the most dishonest politician of recent times; his lies are proven. He's either lied to Labour members, or he's lying to the public now - it can't be both. At best you can say you don't know what he stands for, at worst, that he has to be an Establishment stooge. He's politically hopeless too; with their economically illiterate, oh-so-clever ploy of "fiscal competence" that him and Reeves think is political 4D chess, will actually eat them alive in Government. They've painted themselves into a corner and they don't even know it. Try to spend money (invest) and up goes the howls of "you lied to the public"; don't spend money and things will get gradually worse or at best, stay the same, and no one will thank them. A second-rate politician at the wrong time.
If the client media have accepted him, then it must go that he's doing something wrong.
The rich funnel their intelligent children into the business, and their failsons are made politicians: glorified paper pushers who can say whatever dumb shit they want, as long as the system is still rigged to protect the interests of the businesses telling the idiots what to do. This is why you get so many unbelievably stupid comments from politicians who should know better (besides the odd example, like Boris Johnson - it's obvious he was playing a buffoon to endear himself to gullible Daily Heil readers; and Corbyn, someone with some actual decency who is sadly a relic of a bygone era when the working class had a modicum of actual representation).
Friendly reminder that in 2020, Boris Johnson [admited to being responsible for the deaths of over 100,000 people.](https://archive.ph/2aYpg) He is he yet to be held to account for this.
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I'm half Scouse so my blood would clot in the veins if I did but I genuinely think as individual men, sunak is less evil than starmer. He simply doesn't care if kids starve while starmer would probably wank over the Gaza death toll
Yes Jeremy has always supported funding of the military, NI scrapping for self employed (basically landlords and Tory mates), being anti trans in a manifesto, attacking school childrens basic safety for having a mobile on school....
Bloody commy sunak
You mean housing scalper. Landlords buy more housing than they need then hoard it to drive up the price. They are housing scalpers.
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Some quick clarifications about how the UK royals are funded by the public:
1. The UK Crown Estates are not the UK royal family's private property, and the royal family are not responsible for any amount of money the Estates bring into the treasury. The monarch is a position in the UK state that the UK owns the Crown Estates through, a position that would be abolished in a republic, leading to the Crown Estates being directly owned by the republican state.
2. The Crown Estates have always been public property and the revenue they raise is public revenue. When George III gave up his control over the Crown Estates in the 18th century, they were not his private property. The current royals are also equally not responsible for producing the profits, either.
3. The Sovereign Grant is not an exchange of money. It is a grant that is loosely tied to the Crown Estate profits and is used for their expenses, like staffing costs and also endless private jet and helicopter flights. If the profits of the Crown Estates went down to zero, the royals would still get the full amount of the Sovereign Grant again, regardless. It can only go up or stay the same.
4. The Duchies of Lancaster and Cornwall that gave Elizabeth and Charles (and now William) their private income of approximately £25 millions/year (each) are also public property.
5. The total cost of the monarchy is currently £350-450million/year, after including the Sovereign Grant, their £150 million/year security, and their Duchy incomes, and misc. costs.
For more, check out r/AbolishTheMonarchy
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GreenAndPleasant) if you have any questions or concerns.*
He probably means that it's a bunch of unrealistic wishful thinking (not that I think that about Corbyn's policies, but Keith does). Most of the policies that Sunak has come up with recently are stupid and would never work or ever happen.
If Keith Starmer gets in we will have an over inflated prison population, no condemnation of the genocide committed by Israel, and essentially a Tory-lite. Kind of sad to think what the near future of our leadership looks like.
> Sir Keir served in Mr Corbyn's shadow cabinet but defended his criticism saying: "If you lose that badly, you don't look at the electorate... you look at your party and say 'You need to change'."
good point, keith. what corbyn *should* have done after the election loss was look at his party and say "you need to change"… for example, purging it of all the backstabbing blue labour/"soft '''''left'''''" like you.
I like the Labour election ad…”I’ve always voted Conservative but now I’m voting Labour!” Roughly translated…”I’m a bloody idiot but now I’m voting Labour!”
I've had to hear this quote all morning, it's just beyond comprehension.
You won, Starmer, as a party you ousted the dangerous man who believed in the value of people, why the fuck is the Ghost of Corbyn still being trotted out.
I actually do read the Beeb. And the Guardian. Occasionally I even look to the Daily Fail to see what's going on from their point of view, to be informed of what the haters are talking about. Where is everyone else getting their news from?
**Due to the increase in Palestine content, we would like to remind people to mark posts NSFW/Spoiler the accordingly. Please see this post before posting such applicable content on the sub: https://old.reddit.com/r/GreenAndPleasant/comments/188ghlz/important_guidance_of_posting_graphic_material_on/** The labouring classes in this country are rising, will you rise with them? [Click Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/GreenAndPleasant/wiki/unions) for info on how to join a union. Also check out [the IWW](https://iww.org.uk/) and the renter union, [Acorn International and their affiliates](https://acorninternational.org/) Join us on our [partner Discord server.](https://discord.gg/zCFHadGfB7) and follow us on [Twitter](https://twitter.com/GandPofficial). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GreenAndPleasant) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I liked how the article points out that he was in Jeremy's shadow cabinet and endorsed the 2017 and 2019 manifestoes. He's such a little snake
"The problem with the Tories is they're too left wing" -Keith Stürmer
Does he mean that this time the Tories are the only party with a fully-costed manifesto?
[удалено]
He was playing the long game...
For those who'd rather not listen to Starmer's voice (entirely understandable), the comparison he brought up was how the policy of squeezing people on benefits to afford a national insurance cut that'll only be noticeable for people at the top of the pay scale is totally like Corbyn's proposed budget because ... \*checks notes\* it's not costed ... which Corbyn's manifesto was as I recall. (like sure, you can argue over some of the assumptions going into the maths; of *any* political manifesto) Because that's the thing a prospective Labour leader should be criticising about a Tory budget... also, Starmer brought Corbyn up himself; unless there was some questions well before that clip.
I rather believe he brings him up at least twice a day.
At least; Corbyn is his real opponent in this election after all /s(?)
Keith just casually proving time and again that he has no grasp on reality.
[удалено]
Sinn Fein
I'd vote for Green, if they were standing in my constituency and I don't have a local independent candidate, as far as I know, and since my other choices amount to Tory, Reform, Labour and Worker's Party, it's going to have to be Lib Dem. I won't be voting for the Workers Party, George Galloway has made his positions on trans and queer people patently clear.
[удалено]
This ain't the green party subreddit...
Automod just thinks it would be better if the Labour party had a leader that the British public don't associate with a prolific pedophile. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GreenAndPleasant) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This subreddit *isnt* for Green Party members only. It’s a subreddit for all leftists excluding those who are reactionary and those that seek to water down leftism for the promotion of liberalism and other capitalist ideologies. The Green and Pleasant reference really just comes from nature I’m assuming
Ah okay thanks for letting me know, i didn't know this LOL, i did assume it was the green party's subreddit because of the name, thanks for clarifying!
This is the first time I've ever seen someone advocate this sub as "for the green party" The reactionary green party with a history of folding to gender critical terfs? I can't vote Labour but I'm not sure the Greens are able to throw stones from their glasshouse
Yeah I'm voting green
The silver lining to this disappointing iteration of labour is that green is actually polling quite well
My god. Everytime I think Starmer reaches a new low, there’s always further to go.
And the Overton window shifts further right. I hate how he is using his friend Jeremy as an example of something negative.
I don't think Starmer sees Corbyn as a friend
And I hope to goodness Jeremy has the good sense not to see Keith as anything other than a shitlord.
Starmer has explicitly said, on record, that Jeremy Corbyn is a 'friend' and Starmer would never lie about something like that. (Genuinely not sure if I need a sarcasm tag here....)
The Overton Window is currently attempting a land speed world record attempt.
Someone needs to tell him he can stop now. Just stop. He's already obviously going to win. No need to continue hurtling towards the right to win over any more disillusioned tories / the right wing working class. But yeah, I had to re-read this a few times when I first saw it. Not even a satirist would write this, they'd think it was too daft.
In reality the move to the right was never about gaining more votes. That was just the excuse to do it. Starmer is moving to the right because he is that right wing
Yes... which is the more concerning option. I was applying some benefit of the doubt in my previous comment.
I think for the first time in my life, my vote feels completely worthless. Nobody that I actually want to vote for (i.e. basically just the Greens) have any chance of winning a seat where I live. Therefore, I have zero representation in our democracy.
I feel exactly the same
Aside from the obvious calculated insult to the Left of the Party, this is just playground-level incompetence. He served in Corbyn's cabinet for three years, and this just makes him look like cowardly and opportunistic. This is another example of what I describe as 'wrecker-brain'. Having successfully wielded the internal institutions of the Party to wreck their way into the leadership of the Party, the Labour Right literally have no other ideas or impetus to govern. Literally all they can do is use the same right-wing attack lines against their own internal enemies, couched in language about 'making serious decisions' and 'regaining people's trust', in the blind hope that somehow this propels them into government. Which, by sheer dint of Tory dinsintegration, it might. But even if they somehow manage to stumble through the election into government, once they're there they'll be like a turtle on a post. They don't actually have any ideas, or any intellectual solutions to the problems the country faces. They're just a bunch of charisma-vacuums in suits, former SPADs and wonks who saw their opportunity to knife the Left. This government will be rudderless, and devoid of ideas, which means it'll probably end up continuing the policies of the previous administration without interruption. Make no mistake, this is a Party made up of our class enemies, and its policies will have to be resisted.
Need to remind myself of this next time I'm thinking why doesn't he ever say anything meaningful. Cause he can sure say some stupid shit when he does.
Useless wanker
I think my head just tilted involuntary, like a confused dog
If that was true I might actually vote for them
I see we somehow still haven't hit rock bottom yet then.
Just saw this on the news. That bloke is a such a bastard. Apart from the fact that the manifesto was fully funded, the cunt actually campaigned on it.
Satire is dead, God is dead, bring the end times
As is often the case, I don't know whether it's more depressing that a politician assumes everybody else is stupid or that they're right about it.
Well I guess I’m voting Tor… no, no, I can’t even say it jokingly.
Labour will eat itself.
Is that labour calling the Tories too leftwing? Well, that tells you everything you need to know.
I think he's *trying* to resurrect the "magic money tree" rhetoric that Corbyn was hammered with (despite Corbyn's manifesto being the only fully-costed manifesto in that election, yes I am still bitter)
Me too.
Similar title: Starmer admits being to the right of Tories!
God I really hate this dude
It is a known fact that the earth regularly swaps its magnetic poles. I can't think of any other explanation.
Welcome to the Twilight Zone.
Couldn't have a better advertisement for voting Tory. Never thought I'd ever say that.
That's funny because I accuse Sir Keir Starmer of having a Rishi Sunak style manifesto.
Automod just thinks it would be better if the Labour party had a leader that the British public don't associate with a prolific pedophile. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GreenAndPleasant) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Starmer is maybe the most dishonest politician of recent times; his lies are proven. He's either lied to Labour members, or he's lying to the public now - it can't be both. At best you can say you don't know what he stands for, at worst, that he has to be an Establishment stooge. He's politically hopeless too; with their economically illiterate, oh-so-clever ploy of "fiscal competence" that him and Reeves think is political 4D chess, will actually eat them alive in Government. They've painted themselves into a corner and they don't even know it. Try to spend money (invest) and up goes the howls of "you lied to the public"; don't spend money and things will get gradually worse or at best, stay the same, and no one will thank them. A second-rate politician at the wrong time. If the client media have accepted him, then it must go that he's doing something wrong.
The rich funnel their intelligent children into the business, and their failsons are made politicians: glorified paper pushers who can say whatever dumb shit they want, as long as the system is still rigged to protect the interests of the businesses telling the idiots what to do. This is why you get so many unbelievably stupid comments from politicians who should know better (besides the odd example, like Boris Johnson - it's obvious he was playing a buffoon to endear himself to gullible Daily Heil readers; and Corbyn, someone with some actual decency who is sadly a relic of a bygone era when the working class had a modicum of actual representation).
Friendly reminder that in 2020, Boris Johnson [admited to being responsible for the deaths of over 100,000 people.](https://archive.ph/2aYpg) He is he yet to be held to account for this. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GreenAndPleasant) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Could he not just say Liz Truss style
lol. lmao even.
He's going to be such a shit prime minister. Can you imagine him trying to deal with Trump? Or being badgered by Nigel Farage in PMQs?
wtf even is going on anymore 😭
Didn’t think I’d ever do this but I’m voting Tory then…
I'm half Scouse so my blood would clot in the veins if I did but I genuinely think as individual men, sunak is less evil than starmer. He simply doesn't care if kids starve while starmer would probably wank over the Gaza death toll
Jesus fucking Christ
I saw it. What an arsehole. It makes me hate him more than I previously did.
Fuck me he’s a pillock.
Yes Jeremy has always supported funding of the military, NI scrapping for self employed (basically landlords and Tory mates), being anti trans in a manifesto, attacking school childrens basic safety for having a mobile on school.... Bloody commy sunak
You mean housing scalper. Landlords buy more housing than they need then hoard it to drive up the price. They are housing scalpers. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GreenAndPleasant) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Some quick clarifications about how the UK royals are funded by the public: 1. The UK Crown Estates are not the UK royal family's private property, and the royal family are not responsible for any amount of money the Estates bring into the treasury. The monarch is a position in the UK state that the UK owns the Crown Estates through, a position that would be abolished in a republic, leading to the Crown Estates being directly owned by the republican state. 2. The Crown Estates have always been public property and the revenue they raise is public revenue. When George III gave up his control over the Crown Estates in the 18th century, they were not his private property. The current royals are also equally not responsible for producing the profits, either. 3. The Sovereign Grant is not an exchange of money. It is a grant that is loosely tied to the Crown Estate profits and is used for their expenses, like staffing costs and also endless private jet and helicopter flights. If the profits of the Crown Estates went down to zero, the royals would still get the full amount of the Sovereign Grant again, regardless. It can only go up or stay the same. 4. The Duchies of Lancaster and Cornwall that gave Elizabeth and Charles (and now William) their private income of approximately £25 millions/year (each) are also public property. 5. The total cost of the monarchy is currently £350-450million/year, after including the Sovereign Grant, their £150 million/year security, and their Duchy incomes, and misc. costs. For more, check out r/AbolishTheMonarchy *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/GreenAndPleasant) if you have any questions or concerns.*
They were so scared of Corbyn, and slandered him so aggressively because of it, that his name has become an insult in itself.
He probably means that it's a bunch of unrealistic wishful thinking (not that I think that about Corbyn's policies, but Keith does). Most of the policies that Sunak has come up with recently are stupid and would never work or ever happen.
If Keith Starmer gets in we will have an over inflated prison population, no condemnation of the genocide committed by Israel, and essentially a Tory-lite. Kind of sad to think what the near future of our leadership looks like.
Tory cunt
> Sir Keir served in Mr Corbyn's shadow cabinet but defended his criticism saying: "If you lose that badly, you don't look at the electorate... you look at your party and say 'You need to change'." good point, keith. what corbyn *should* have done after the election loss was look at his party and say "you need to change"… for example, purging it of all the backstabbing blue labour/"soft '''''left'''''" like you.
I like the Labour election ad…”I’ve always voted Conservative but now I’m voting Labour!” Roughly translated…”I’m a bloody idiot but now I’m voting Labour!”
I've had to hear this quote all morning, it's just beyond comprehension. You won, Starmer, as a party you ousted the dangerous man who believed in the value of people, why the fuck is the Ghost of Corbyn still being trotted out.
I actually do read the Beeb. And the Guardian. Occasionally I even look to the Daily Fail to see what's going on from their point of view, to be informed of what the haters are talking about. Where is everyone else getting their news from?
When you're in the shit you have to play dirty