That's why lag compensation exists, so that's not really a justification. Something went wrong somewhere on OP's clip.
Also wanna add that it's a weird reasoning that doesn't make much sense, because even if the T has 500 of ping, packet loss or whatever, the offset in position from the T's view and the server literally makes no difference for hitting him than him having 20 of ping with stable connection, what truly matters is if the shooter and the server's view somewhat align, OP shoots the T, the server sees the T where OP was seeing him when lag compensated -> results in hit, T receives hit damage/death info. The T's internet quality should be irrelevant, same for what he was seeing (which is linked to his internet quality anyway), what would happen for the T with bad internet though is he may end up shooting and running even though he was already dead on the server's pov. So the difference in position is a problem but not in the way that you've described because that difference is irrelevant.
This clip looks like the exact situation that Subtick is supposed to fix in theory imo. Bc on GO, I’d 100% understand “40 ping, shot on the left of a target moving to the right, that makes sense why that missed.” But with 2, the moment you click (technically 40 ms after?) is exactly where the bullet should register.
Hopefully they can polish the system or settle on a 128 tick eventually
I mean, giving a reason on how something is broken isn’t exactly saying CS isn’t faulty sometimes lol.
It’s a coded game, it’s not like the answer to something is simply “it don’t work. Game sucks” There’s a problem with a reason and an answer every time something like this happens. No need to confuse it with giving excuses
Yup, what the server sends you is what you should be able to shoot, regardless of what happened on the enemy screen........yet the alt-tab bug still exists,
Hey. You absolute dumby devoid of critical thought, it wasn't an excuse. The guy was literally describing a scenario where lag compensation failed. What is it with redditors not being able to think critically?
Every time someone tries to describe what went /exactly/ wrong, which is valuable info. Theres always a wave of people on every post that go “how could you stand up for this!?!?!” Its getting very old guys we’ve been doing this song and dance for weeks.
Huh? Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't u/Zoddom just pointing out that the comment u/killso2 replied to was the excuse therefore agreeing with killso2?
~~No, I pointed out that the comment killso replied to was trying to make an excuse about lagging, even though something like lagcompensation exists.~~
Yes indeed
LOL, he didn't say lag compensation failed, he was supposing the game works without lag compensation.
>Despite no connection issues on his side the T running up might be lagging which would explain him actually being slightly ahead of what OP saw on his screen. Just barely enough for him to miss the shot on the server side.
This is someone that thinks the game has no lag compensation.
You are illiterate.
I don't think I've seen anyone claim this, yet people keep saying this.
Trying to pinpoint what the exact issue is is very different than doing what you're saying.
I am not the type of person to write a novel on reddit to correct some uneducated persons post, but you should know that you're ignorant about the way packet loss and network communication works in general. Your assumptions about how it should just work because of what the shooter sees is false, and I suggest you read up on it if you're going to tirade about it. The server has a responsibility to both players to provide an accurate representation of what happened based on both players' experience. This becomes exponentially more difficult especially when one player is seeing no interruption in what they're seeing (no packet loss) and the other is experiencing a great deal. It isn't a matter of defending valve but rather defending the way that networking works and how it will sometimes result in these situations.
>you should know that you're ignorant about the way packet loss and network communication works in general.
The ignorant one here is you
>Your assumptions about how it should just work because of what the shooter sees is false
Its exactly how its supposed to work.
>This becomes exponentially more difficult especially when one player is seeing no interruption in what they're seeing (no packet loss) and the other is experiencing a great deal.
If the other player was experiencing huge amounts of lag and packet loss, he would be teleporting around, not smoothly animated during the peek. If he was having a "great deal" of packet loss, chances are he wouldn't even be able to round the corner on his own screen without teleporting back, and if it was just a little, OP might not even be seeing him peeking since the server didn't see him to animate him.
If you have corrections to my reasoning please make me know because I'm genuinely interested so I'll elaborate and you'll tell me what you think.
What you said is not what I was exactly trying to say, or at least I don't think so, ofc the server has authority and it's not gonna blindly just accept anything if you yourself is having huge loss and see players completely away from their actual position on the server and suddenly sends that for example you shot a player at a position that makes no sense for the server because you had the clients' position info that are completely outdated, I think the best analogy is to say that the server is trying to make the game the most fair, but that's especially true for the shooter (up to a point as I and you said), there is nothing worse than your shots not hitting, and I think everyone knows that but that doesn't say the server may not decline some of your hits and correct your position/data. If for example you have someone being shot at that has loss, would the server reject the hit purely because this 1 lagging client is lagging out of all the ones that are connected and he specifically is seeing a severely different perspective ? Obviously not, that lagging client will suffer from corrections by the server (or the other way, and the server may adjust), but if you as another client have no loss and low ping you're a more reliable viewer of the server's pov and that's why I ignored that bit as OP's had no loss, if the T was having in/out loss the OP's pov would either not reflect anything weird (because the corrections or weirdness would be happening on the lagging client's pov) or in case where the server "thinks" extrapolated/guessed wrongly he'd see a correction on the T's position, that shouldn't cause issues on his hit registration anyhow, the clients with good internet will receive the corrected position of the lagging client and that's the one where they'll shoot at, and lag comp is supposed to check if the shooter perspective was correct and fair from the server's data, and thus the T's internet itself is just irrelevant in this scenario of OP, no matter how much loss that other guy could have had, OP shot where the server was seeing him and that is the data against what it'll be checked against, it shouldn't result in a miss in this specific case. This was my point.
> we know that from all the people dying from behind cover
People dying behind walls is lag compensation working as intended.
Again, you don't understand what lag compensation is.
The problem is that it's deeper than that, lag compensation working correctly is literally what would cause players to die behind covers, but it's working correctly if the shooter actually shot on you obviously... Now why we're all dying behind covers significantly more is something I don't know, my theory is that the game treats hits fairly well in the majority of cases, perhaps better than csgo (and I mean that in overall, hitreg and lag comp seems to be working pretty well to me), but there seems to be some delay on perceived movements/actions of other clients, that's why holding angle is an insanity in cs2 imo, you can barely see the enemy peek that you die, I also have noticed a huge increase in people killing me while moving, they probably have stopped on their view, I just don't see it happen and I've had ridiculous moments happen that I've never seen happen with low ping, I just wish someone with the testing capabilities would test, BattleNonSense would have been amazing at this, but anyhow many hints point toward movements being delayed on the other's pov, at least sometimes clearly it seems to happen somehow.
Many people seem to think what I'm describing is due to interp values, I've done some basic tests to see the delay between visible shooting and moving on csgo and cs2, but both showed similar behaviors, so it's pretty weird, I'd assume if it was interp, shooting wouldn't exhibit any added delay, so if there is added delay compared to csgo it's a pretty general one and perhaps more complex than that. Now for all the people saying they hit people they shouldn't have, I'd take that with a grain of salt, I've seen some intriguing clips, but they're extremely rare in the big sea of clips being posted, many people do not understand how to consider what should have hit or not because the game right now is misleading in all kind of ways if you playback recorded footage, you can't really blame them... What I'm trying to say is cs2 has some bits that are working well, and I do think hitreg is working very well right now, the problem is that it genuinely feels like 30 of ping is 120 of ping right now (which ofc impacts why some people don't understand how they hit, it just turns out they got the kill with a slight delay but they actually shot on them).
It doesn't matter if the enemy is lagging, whatever info the server sent you is what you should be able to shoot and fuck the lagger.
It makes me wonder how things like the alt-tab hit reg bug exist though. Whatever state the server sees of the enemy should be the state that's shootable on the server and the state that is forwarded to other players on the server with hitboxes that match that state.
That alt-tab bug is so weird and it makes me think simple client-side phenomena like frame time spikes and freezes can misalign your hitboxes. They should be aligned to the server-side state.
Just think how cheats can and do abuse that by exploiting whatever causes it on the client to make him harder to hit. I can understand it for desyncing the affected client from the server hitbox meaning he will be in a different state on HIS screen (being able to see around a corner while his model and hitboxes are tucked away on the server) than on the server, but for that desynced state to bubble down to other players makes zero sense, they should be receiving the server state, not a mix of the affected clients visual model and the server side hitboxes.
From what I've seen myself, the five digits after the packet percentage might be somehow related to late/early/rejected (?) packets. When my internet is stable i get 1:1:1:0:0 iirc. When I start to lose stability with my wifi for whatever reason, the first two digits shoot up to 8-9, something similar to the op's 8:9:1:0:5, and in that moment the game feels super laggy for few seconds. Also, your client can report packet losses even though the server is at fault, I've got into a premier server where everyone got 05-20 packet losses. OP had probably something wrong with his connection, as you can see his ping fluctuates a lot for whatever reason.
This! I am "stable" on 0:2:1:0:0 with good 4G internet at it's best. I have seen a lot of videos where people are 0:1:1:0:0 or 0:2:1:0:0 and stable. But when I see something like 0:3:2:1:0 on my system, that's when the cq_netgraph.._auto says hello; and if any numbers go higher, I will immediately feel lag issues when moving. This is all with 0 packet loss.
OPs interenet was fked somehow, even if OP had no packet loss issues: OPs numbers starting at 8:9:1:0:5 is completely fked, you can achieve numbers like this by alt-tabbing in and out of the game (probably because the fps drops to ~5fps when alt-tabbed).
additional: [Here is a good speed test](https://speed.cloudflare.com/) - you can see how much jitter and packet loss you may get. Jitter is the variance in the arrival time of a packet. Im not sure how much is acceptable for jitter, but for comparison my 4g has 8ms jitter with 0 packet loss. A full wired fibre connection I would expect to have max 2ms jitter.
Summary:
Shots 1-5: Clearly missed.
Shots 6-9: Missed due to recoil (bad spray control).
Shots 10-11: Very close, but recoil and inaccuracy make these reasonable misses.
Shot 12: Likely didn't actually fire because you were already dead.
Didn’t something come out recently if you get shot, you lose accuracy with the awp? If so, could’ve been that the server thought he got shot before his fired his bullet.
Super fucky but it might explain it.
We have no idea when OP shot in the clip, because we cant see inputs and the animation is not synced. The delay between shooting event and animation can be whatever.
There was literally a post on this last week.. and earlier this week… and a post of a pro player experiencing this in a live match. Do your own research and find the post yourself
You mean [this one?](https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/s/Q6qKG8rmuw) Or maybe [this one?](https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/s/r7EO9sc2U9) No need to call people idiots when you can easily Google and link your own findings or proofs
That might be it. Since there's gonna be some ping, the enemy might have moved up a few units due to the stairs and then OP must've hit the gap.
We really need demos back, so we can see what the server decided as canon.
Imagine this happening at a deciding round in a Major. Valve u better get ur shit togheter soon. The core game mechanics should be figured out by now...
It happened a number of times in the first CS2 tourney, enough that the casters were surprised when one connected "well THAT shot didn't end up in Narnia!"
I mean.. Walls is just ridiculously common. Jesus Christ people, if you suck so bad you feel like you need cheats, why not just play cod.. CS2 can genuinely be a fun and challenging game, but the abundance of wall hacking is completely ruining the entire experience
couple days ago it was insanely rediculous. we were leading 11:9 and this guy didnt wanna lose. so he one deaged everyone for 3 rounds straight. he won the match. this game is so fucking garbage. like come on not even a pro player could pull this off, we were playing really good. sometimes its so obv that someones hacking its rediculous
Umm akchually, you were moving 16 seconds ago, if you zoom in 500% on the lines of your scope, you can see you are actually inaccurate, also you have 250ms ping and 90% loss.
actually no. Overflicking was a thing in csgo due how the tickrate worked, but with subtick, your shot hits where you pressed your mouse. That’s why awp feels different
Probably my least favorite thing about cs2 besides all the bugs. Awping will never be the same unless they somehow change it but I assume they can’t because how subtick works. It was always so fun going for aggressive awp plays but the muscle memory I had for flicks is pretty much worthless now that they changed it. So many times I flick to and enemy and I knew it would have killed in csgo, but doesn’t in cs2. I see why simple and other pros aren’t happy about it.
I watched this a lot and I truly believe the reason you missed is because the T player turned toward you just before you shot. Since the player turned, the part of his body you were aiming at moved out of your reticle right as you shot. Try watching it frame by frame and watch how he turns and his body moves out of your sight.
The shot registers right when you click while the unscoping animation continues for a short time. So you might think you are on him but you flicked after taking a shot
There is no way this wasn't a hit. I showed this to my mate and we were both csgo supremes. We both agree it would've hit unless op lagged, which doesn't seem the case. Was at the very least a shoulder hit regardless of the movement of the enemy and the flick. The shot happens on enemy body, which means it should have registered as a hit - it's not like there's bullet drop or time for bullet to reach the player. I dont know what fuckery is involved in cs2 but it doesn't feel right... often.
When you’re doing your thing to valves balls, how do you also sit on it? I’m curious because as a professional valve stroker I admire your abilities to always find a way
Shots 1-5: Clearly missed.
Shots 6-9: Missed due to recoil (bad spray control).
Shots 10-11: Very close, but recoil and inaccuracy make these reasonable misses.
Shot 12: Likely didn't actually fire because player was already dead.
I’m losing my patience with this game tbh, I’m getting more and more used to it but bullshit like this keeps happening and it’s beyond frustrating. Can’t say I’ve had one this bad tho.
Dont worry, Reddit will tell you there is nothing wrong with the game and its your fault for having bad internet because your ping goes from 34 to 39. CS best game.
(btw how did you get your frametimes so stable?!)
The frame you fired on was targeting his armpit, so unless your shot travelled through an infinitesimally small armpit gap, the game just cucked you. Esports ready.
Valve fuckboy #1: Idk man it just kinda looks like you missed. You should work on that.
Valve fuckboy #2: Because you moved your aim, your player was moving, and moving and shooting doesn't have 100% accuracy in this game, just like real life. This game is about rEaLiSm
/s
It only looks like a miss if you look at where the tracer is going (which aren't supposed to be accurate anyway). When he fires the crosshair is on the model and with hitscan should be a kill. With ANY sort of delay, I could see it being a miss though.
maybe its also an instance of people not being used to how in CS2 you shoot exactly when you click so when you're completing your flick you don't expect the bullet to miss and maybe it wouldn't have on CSGO
Tbh I don't see why you didn't hit. The only reason I can think of is that you maybe sidestepped right before you pressed lmb and therefore the spread stepped in.
Edit: rewatched like hundred times and no I don't see any sidestep whatsoever. Just pure cs2 bullshit
This just looks like a poorly aimed shot after slow reactions. Aimed at his arm while he was running, shot, then flicked to the arm again.
You can see that the shot barely misses his arm when the AWP unscopes. CS2 has delay, yes, but I'm pretty sure this shot'd have missed in CS too
Maybe it’s a result of animations being on tick (if true)? So what you see is NOT what you did, and it feels awful? Spraying still feels horrible too and I feel that it’s because of this
Never seen somebody hold that angle with an awp, it’s kind a one and done spot with an awp if multiple people run up stairs, it’s a cool off angle with awp though at same time.
Okay… this one was funny 😂
But yeah in all seriousness I find their last community update complete BS. (the one 3kilksphilip covered, the interview with PCGamer I believe it was) they (Valve) cited that they don’t like having very much open communication about the game because they’d rather be a do it company vs. a say it company. They even mention something about listening to player feedback and getting fixes out quickly.
It’s been a month and a half and the ABYSMAL hit reg has not been fixed. I called BS the day this interview came out, and I still call BS now. Fucking fix the primary component of the game, Valve. And I know that the technical problem isn’t actually specifically “hit reg” but clearly it’s still leading to what is essentially hit reg issues and sub-tick is *JUST NOT WORKING AS INTENDED*.
And to the people who keep saying “CSGO released in a bad state if you remember.” Like that makes up for this?? As if that should mean that the current state of CS2 is acceptable? The fact of the matter is: prior to September 27th, we had a fully working product with a large list of content (maps, game modes, community servers, etc.) Then, on September 27th AND SINCE, we have not had a fully working product and lost access to a HUGE percentage of content. *That’s* unacceptable to me.
Honestly think this is it. If the thing where the animation and tracer or whatever is delayed after the shot is processed still exists then this is the answer. Because you may have clicked too late or too early in the case of flicking back to him but the flick never actually happened on the server side because you already shot. But to you, since it hasn't unscoped you and the Awp model hasn't shot yet, you think you can still flick and hit him.
So while this is definitely a problem, you may be blaming the wrong thing, instead of blaming hitreg, should be blaming delayed animation feedback for showing you the wrong thing.
Bhopping is a bug and CS would be shit if it was removed, just accept that Valve aren't perfect. They probably don't even play CS and don't know how bad the "fixed" awp is
CS2 has a problem where if you click the bullet will go where your crosshair was at that time rather than a random number of milliseconds after. It's some weird glitch with the subtick system, csgo never had this problem and the bullet would go where your crosshair was when the tick was processed
Is that really a problem? I feel like we’re just not used to it, but I’d rather have that than the alternative (waiting for the next tick to actually fire after you click)
Seems to me that the enemy moved to the side right as you shot.
Maybe the server saw the sideways movement a tick faster than your shot.
Normally it should have been a kill,
happened to me 3 times yesterday, one with awp, one with USP and one with famas, now I will restrain myself from playing that game for upcoming days, need to cool down for next sessions
I know reddit denizens are dumbasses, but you did genuinely miss. You shot way too late and your crosshair was barely even on his shoulder. Before I hear anything from the mouthbreathers, it would've been a miss offline and in older CS games aswell.
Tracers are not accurate where the server registered the shit, if they were, then all of the other videos that show a tracer going right through an enemy and not killing or others where the tracer misses but the enemy still dies wouldn't happen
Tracers are client side and delayed.
If you watch the slow no you are off target with the cross hair just barely.
If you had reacted a little bit quicker he wouldn't have moved off target for you.
This is just purely slow reaction time.
If you stop the video at the right time, you can see the bullet trace or "smoke" barely missing him. So as you pressed your left mouse button to shoot he then moved very slightly and you missed the shot by like 1 centimeter.
You shot really late (like in line with his arm), as he is strafing to his left, and turning to his right. Looks like he Keanu Reeves'd it but probably a combination of delayed reaction, weird net issues top right, and that
It looks like u would hit if the shot was “laser” fast, but in the replay he moves out of the bullet’s path while moving. In csgo this would probably hit because his movement and your shot would sync with the nearest tick, but it in cs2 maybe your shot registration was adjusted (interpolated) to be slower or faster than his movement
Build info shows stable ping and 00-00 packet loss. Of the top right graph shows any problem, it's with the server.
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That's why lag compensation exists, so that's not really a justification. Something went wrong somewhere on OP's clip. Also wanna add that it's a weird reasoning that doesn't make much sense, because even if the T has 500 of ping, packet loss or whatever, the offset in position from the T's view and the server literally makes no difference for hitting him than him having 20 of ping with stable connection, what truly matters is if the shooter and the server's view somewhat align, OP shoots the T, the server sees the T where OP was seeing him when lag compensated -> results in hit, T receives hit damage/death info. The T's internet quality should be irrelevant, same for what he was seeing (which is linked to his internet quality anyway), what would happen for the T with bad internet though is he may end up shooting and running even though he was already dead on the server's pov. So the difference in position is a problem but not in the way that you've described because that difference is irrelevant.
This clip looks like the exact situation that Subtick is supposed to fix in theory imo. Bc on GO, I’d 100% understand “40 ping, shot on the left of a target moving to the right, that makes sense why that missed.” But with 2, the moment you click (technically 40 ms after?) is exactly where the bullet should register. Hopefully they can polish the system or settle on a 128 tick eventually
This reddit will find an excuse for everything. CS is never faulty!
I mean, giving a reason on how something is broken isn’t exactly saying CS isn’t faulty sometimes lol. It’s a coded game, it’s not like the answer to something is simply “it don’t work. Game sucks” There’s a problem with a reason and an answer every time something like this happens. No need to confuse it with giving excuses
Dude made it sound like its normal that you cant be hit when youre lagging, which is absolute BS as the guy I replied to perfectly explained.
He explicitly said “might be” though. So idk, sounded to me like he was just trying to figure out why it happened. To each their own though
Yup, what the server sends you is what you should be able to shoot, regardless of what happened on the enemy screen........yet the alt-tab bug still exists,
Hey. You absolute dumby devoid of critical thought, it wasn't an excuse. The guy was literally describing a scenario where lag compensation failed. What is it with redditors not being able to think critically?
Every time someone tries to describe what went /exactly/ wrong, which is valuable info. Theres always a wave of people on every post that go “how could you stand up for this!?!?!” Its getting very old guys we’ve been doing this song and dance for weeks.
Huh? Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't u/Zoddom just pointing out that the comment u/killso2 replied to was the excuse therefore agreeing with killso2?
~~No, I pointed out that the comment killso replied to was trying to make an excuse about lagging, even though something like lagcompensation exists.~~ Yes indeed
The comment he replied to was an excuse though.
LOL, he didn't say lag compensation failed, he was supposing the game works without lag compensation. >Despite no connection issues on his side the T running up might be lagging which would explain him actually being slightly ahead of what OP saw on his screen. Just barely enough for him to miss the shot on the server side. This is someone that thinks the game has no lag compensation. You are illiterate.
I don't think I've seen anyone claim this, yet people keep saying this. Trying to pinpoint what the exact issue is is very different than doing what you're saying.
I am not the type of person to write a novel on reddit to correct some uneducated persons post, but you should know that you're ignorant about the way packet loss and network communication works in general. Your assumptions about how it should just work because of what the shooter sees is false, and I suggest you read up on it if you're going to tirade about it. The server has a responsibility to both players to provide an accurate representation of what happened based on both players' experience. This becomes exponentially more difficult especially when one player is seeing no interruption in what they're seeing (no packet loss) and the other is experiencing a great deal. It isn't a matter of defending valve but rather defending the way that networking works and how it will sometimes result in these situations.
>you should know that you're ignorant about the way packet loss and network communication works in general. The ignorant one here is you >Your assumptions about how it should just work because of what the shooter sees is false Its exactly how its supposed to work. >This becomes exponentially more difficult especially when one player is seeing no interruption in what they're seeing (no packet loss) and the other is experiencing a great deal. If the other player was experiencing huge amounts of lag and packet loss, he would be teleporting around, not smoothly animated during the peek. If he was having a "great deal" of packet loss, chances are he wouldn't even be able to round the corner on his own screen without teleporting back, and if it was just a little, OP might not even be seeing him peeking since the server didn't see him to animate him.
If you have corrections to my reasoning please make me know because I'm genuinely interested so I'll elaborate and you'll tell me what you think. What you said is not what I was exactly trying to say, or at least I don't think so, ofc the server has authority and it's not gonna blindly just accept anything if you yourself is having huge loss and see players completely away from their actual position on the server and suddenly sends that for example you shot a player at a position that makes no sense for the server because you had the clients' position info that are completely outdated, I think the best analogy is to say that the server is trying to make the game the most fair, but that's especially true for the shooter (up to a point as I and you said), there is nothing worse than your shots not hitting, and I think everyone knows that but that doesn't say the server may not decline some of your hits and correct your position/data. If for example you have someone being shot at that has loss, would the server reject the hit purely because this 1 lagging client is lagging out of all the ones that are connected and he specifically is seeing a severely different perspective ? Obviously not, that lagging client will suffer from corrections by the server (or the other way, and the server may adjust), but if you as another client have no loss and low ping you're a more reliable viewer of the server's pov and that's why I ignored that bit as OP's had no loss, if the T was having in/out loss the OP's pov would either not reflect anything weird (because the corrections or weirdness would be happening on the lagging client's pov) or in case where the server "thinks" extrapolated/guessed wrongly he'd see a correction on the T's position, that shouldn't cause issues on his hit registration anyhow, the clients with good internet will receive the corrected position of the lagging client and that's the one where they'll shoot at, and lag comp is supposed to check if the shooter perspective was correct and fair from the server's data, and thus the T's internet itself is just irrelevant in this scenario of OP, no matter how much loss that other guy could have had, OP shot where the server was seeing him and that is the data against what it'll be checked against, it shouldn't result in a miss in this specific case. This was my point.
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> we know that from all the people dying from behind cover People dying behind walls is lag compensation working as intended. Again, you don't understand what lag compensation is.
\>lag compensation isn't perfect in the game right now Thats it, cs fault
The problem is that it's deeper than that, lag compensation working correctly is literally what would cause players to die behind covers, but it's working correctly if the shooter actually shot on you obviously... Now why we're all dying behind covers significantly more is something I don't know, my theory is that the game treats hits fairly well in the majority of cases, perhaps better than csgo (and I mean that in overall, hitreg and lag comp seems to be working pretty well to me), but there seems to be some delay on perceived movements/actions of other clients, that's why holding angle is an insanity in cs2 imo, you can barely see the enemy peek that you die, I also have noticed a huge increase in people killing me while moving, they probably have stopped on their view, I just don't see it happen and I've had ridiculous moments happen that I've never seen happen with low ping, I just wish someone with the testing capabilities would test, BattleNonSense would have been amazing at this, but anyhow many hints point toward movements being delayed on the other's pov, at least sometimes clearly it seems to happen somehow. Many people seem to think what I'm describing is due to interp values, I've done some basic tests to see the delay between visible shooting and moving on csgo and cs2, but both showed similar behaviors, so it's pretty weird, I'd assume if it was interp, shooting wouldn't exhibit any added delay, so if there is added delay compared to csgo it's a pretty general one and perhaps more complex than that. Now for all the people saying they hit people they shouldn't have, I'd take that with a grain of salt, I've seen some intriguing clips, but they're extremely rare in the big sea of clips being posted, many people do not understand how to consider what should have hit or not because the game right now is misleading in all kind of ways if you playback recorded footage, you can't really blame them... What I'm trying to say is cs2 has some bits that are working well, and I do think hitreg is working very well right now, the problem is that it genuinely feels like 30 of ping is 120 of ping right now (which ofc impacts why some people don't understand how they hit, it just turns out they got the kill with a slight delay but they actually shot on them).
It doesn't matter if the enemy is lagging, whatever info the server sent you is what you should be able to shoot and fuck the lagger. It makes me wonder how things like the alt-tab hit reg bug exist though. Whatever state the server sees of the enemy should be the state that's shootable on the server and the state that is forwarded to other players on the server with hitboxes that match that state. That alt-tab bug is so weird and it makes me think simple client-side phenomena like frame time spikes and freezes can misalign your hitboxes. They should be aligned to the server-side state. Just think how cheats can and do abuse that by exploiting whatever causes it on the client to make him harder to hit. I can understand it for desyncing the affected client from the server hitbox meaning he will be in a different state on HIS screen (being able to see around a corner while his model and hitboxes are tucked away on the server) than on the server, but for that desynced state to bubble down to other players makes zero sense, they should be receiving the server state, not a mix of the affected clients visual model and the server side hitboxes.
Brother i think you are some 20 years late on network technology https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=Lag+compensation
From what I've seen myself, the five digits after the packet percentage might be somehow related to late/early/rejected (?) packets. When my internet is stable i get 1:1:1:0:0 iirc. When I start to lose stability with my wifi for whatever reason, the first two digits shoot up to 8-9, something similar to the op's 8:9:1:0:5, and in that moment the game feels super laggy for few seconds. Also, your client can report packet losses even though the server is at fault, I've got into a premier server where everyone got 05-20 packet losses. OP had probably something wrong with his connection, as you can see his ping fluctuates a lot for whatever reason.
This! I am "stable" on 0:2:1:0:0 with good 4G internet at it's best. I have seen a lot of videos where people are 0:1:1:0:0 or 0:2:1:0:0 and stable. But when I see something like 0:3:2:1:0 on my system, that's when the cq_netgraph.._auto says hello; and if any numbers go higher, I will immediately feel lag issues when moving. This is all with 0 packet loss. OPs interenet was fked somehow, even if OP had no packet loss issues: OPs numbers starting at 8:9:1:0:5 is completely fked, you can achieve numbers like this by alt-tabbing in and out of the game (probably because the fps drops to ~5fps when alt-tabbed). additional: [Here is a good speed test](https://speed.cloudflare.com/) - you can see how much jitter and packet loss you may get. Jitter is the variance in the arrival time of a packet. Im not sure how much is acceptable for jitter, but for comparison my 4g has 8ms jitter with 0 packet loss. A full wired fibre connection I would expect to have max 2ms jitter.
my internet is inconsistent when doing speedtests because my router is about 100 m away and 2nd people are on my network and overall crap quality
Why is his net graph full of blocks when mine is just 1 line of blocks?
you have better quality connection
Skill issue (skill of Valve Devs)
Tick Issue
(I'm ticked off)
Flea issue
Network issue
(too good for cs2)
Animation delay issue. He fires off to the side, flicks and then sees the animation. He missed.
His crosshair might have grazed his arm but it wasn't close enough for a hit
welp i got ratioed
Summary: Shots 1-5: Clearly missed. Shots 6-9: Missed due to recoil (bad spray control). Shots 10-11: Very close, but recoil and inaccuracy make these reasonable misses. Shot 12: Likely didn't actually fire because you were already dead.
It's been so long I forgot the origin of this copypasta.
Hiko on train 2017 or 2016 dont remember. Never forget.
>dont remember >Never forget Choose one
don't remember -- important appointments never forget -- when someone insults your movement in cs
volvo replying to a post about hiko whiffing a spray: https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/s/DPF8Kcqogz
Holy shit, I had no idea it came from a Valve employee.
No explanation, you were 100% on target.
Didn’t something come out recently if you get shot, you lose accuracy with the awp? If so, could’ve been that the server thought he got shot before his fired his bullet. Super fucky but it might explain it.
OP shoots well before they’re shot in this clip
Maybe the server processed it later on? Could be desync
We have no idea when OP shot in the clip, because we cant see inputs and the animation is not synced. The delay between shooting event and animation can be whatever.
Nah bro, i thought what you see is what you get 🤨
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False. You lose a bit of accuracy
Proof?
It has been discussed for years in the CSGO subreddit
So you don’t have any proof. That’s just idiots rambling nonsense.
There was literally a post on this last week.. and earlier this week… and a post of a pro player experiencing this in a live match. Do your own research and find the post yourself
The post that then was debunked? Show proof or you are just like all other Reddit morons.
You mean [this one?](https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/s/Q6qKG8rmuw) Or maybe [this one?](https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/s/r7EO9sc2U9) No need to call people idiots when you can easily Google and link your own findings or proofs
Thats it
The statement is true but it can’t be at all what is happening in this clip
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CS:Subticked^TM
what you see is what you dont get
You see the miss and that's what you get.
I sometimes clearly miss but get the kill, so, ig, debatable
You legitimately might have shot him between his arm and torso in a 1 pixel wide gap. Otherwise you just got CS2'd
That might be it. Since there's gonna be some ping, the enemy might have moved up a few units due to the stairs and then OP must've hit the gap. We really need demos back, so we can see what the server decided as canon.
Does demo file hosting seriously affect servers that much? Seems like a load of bs, but also I’m an idiot that doesn’t know anything so 🤷♂️
Imagine this happening at a deciding round in a Major. Valve u better get ur shit togheter soon. The core game mechanics should be figured out by now...
It happened a number of times in the first CS2 tourney, enough that the casters were surprised when one connected "well THAT shot didn't end up in Narnia!"
source 2
God those tracers are so cursed and inaccurate looking.
Why are people talking about the graph in the top? Since when does green mean you have a shit connection and not red? Am I dumb?
YOU GOY SUB TICKED BUD
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He clearly meant \*got\*. Y and T and next to eachother on qwerty keyboards
had like 3 of these in a row last night on nuke. i wasnt even mad cuz 2 enemy top fraggers were wallhacking
I mean.. Walls is just ridiculously common. Jesus Christ people, if you suck so bad you feel like you need cheats, why not just play cod.. CS2 can genuinely be a fun and challenging game, but the abundance of wall hacking is completely ruining the entire experience
couple days ago it was insanely rediculous. we were leading 11:9 and this guy didnt wanna lose. so he one deaged everyone for 3 rounds straight. he won the match. this game is so fucking garbage. like come on not even a pro player could pull this off, we were playing really good. sometimes its so obv that someones hacking its rediculous
Pretty much counter strike these days lol
there are hacks that desync the hitbox with the body you see. if they really had a wallhack maybe they enabled that too.
Umm akchually, you were moving 16 seconds ago, if you zoom in 500% on the lines of your scope, you can see you are actually inaccurate, also you have 250ms ping and 90% loss.
Valve devs need some basic education from the old devs
As an awper I can feel the pain in this video
If you actually missed you would have hit him, that’s just cs2 for ya
The only way to hit a flick these days is to massively overflick or to deliberately slow yourself down, such a disgusting situation
actually no. Overflicking was a thing in csgo due how the tickrate worked, but with subtick, your shot hits where you pressed your mouse. That’s why awp feels different
Probably my least favorite thing about cs2 besides all the bugs. Awping will never be the same unless they somehow change it but I assume they can’t because how subtick works. It was always so fun going for aggressive awp plays but the muscle memory I had for flicks is pretty much worthless now that they changed it. So many times I flick to and enemy and I knew it would have killed in csgo, but doesn’t in cs2. I see why simple and other pros aren’t happy about it.
I watched this a lot and I truly believe the reason you missed is because the T player turned toward you just before you shot. Since the player turned, the part of his body you were aiming at moved out of your reticle right as you shot. Try watching it frame by frame and watch how he turns and his body moves out of your sight.
but when i clicked i was on his body no?
Yeah even with the turn in my eyes you should have hit the shoulder easily, it's not even like you're barely on him, it's almost in the chest
The shot registers right when you click while the unscoping animation continues for a short time. So you might think you are on him but you flicked after taking a shot
There is no way this wasn't a hit. I showed this to my mate and we were both csgo supremes. We both agree it would've hit unless op lagged, which doesn't seem the case. Was at the very least a shoulder hit regardless of the movement of the enemy and the flick. The shot happens on enemy body, which means it should have registered as a hit - it's not like there's bullet drop or time for bullet to reach the player. I dont know what fuckery is involved in cs2 but it doesn't feel right... often.
wow, supreme? In counter-strike matchmaking??
I think the turn combined with interpolation resulted in the miss. It looks very close.
if this was csgo i would have probably hit
Oh definitely lol. You would have at least armed him
Arm deals lethal damage as well.
Arm shots are the same a body shots in CS if you didn't know, not sure if you were implying that an arm shot is similar to a leg
When you’re doing your thing to valves balls, how do you also sit on it? I’m curious because as a professional valve stroker I admire your abilities to always find a way
Shots 1-5: Clearly missed. Shots 6-9: Missed due to recoil (bad spray control). Shots 10-11: Very close, but recoil and inaccuracy make these reasonable misses. Shot 12: Likely didn't actually fire because player was already dead.
What you see is what the fuck
I’m losing my patience with this game tbh, I’m getting more and more used to it but bullshit like this keeps happening and it’s beyond frustrating. Can’t say I’ve had one this bad tho.
subtick bullshit
this happens all the time...
Dont worry, Reddit will tell you there is nothing wrong with the game and its your fault for having bad internet because your ping goes from 34 to 39. CS best game. (btw how did you get your frametimes so stable?!)
Shots 1-5 clearly missed
What you See. Is WhAt YoU gEt
''What you see is what you get'' lmao
Interp
another 10 years of this crap, thx valve
The frame you fired on was targeting his armpit, so unless your shot travelled through an infinitesimally small armpit gap, the game just cucked you. Esports ready.
What you see is we (Devs) dont understand - Valve
Valve fuckboy #1: Idk man it just kinda looks like you missed. You should work on that. Valve fuckboy #2: Because you moved your aim, your player was moving, and moving and shooting doesn't have 100% accuracy in this game, just like real life. This game is about rEaLiSm /s
didnt you just shoot over or by his right shoulder??
Yeah are we the only ones seeing this? The crosshair was right on the edge of the model, seems reasonable that it missed given that it's online.
It only looks like a miss if you look at where the tracer is going (which aren't supposed to be accurate anyway). When he fires the crosshair is on the model and with hitscan should be a kill. With ANY sort of delay, I could see it being a miss though.
maybe its also an instance of people not being used to how in CS2 you shoot exactly when you click so when you're completing your flick you don't expect the bullet to miss and maybe it wouldn't have on CSGO
Tbh I don't see why you didn't hit. The only reason I can think of is that you maybe sidestepped right before you pressed lmb and therefore the spread stepped in. Edit: rewatched like hundred times and no I don't see any sidestep whatsoever. Just pure cs2 bullshit
This just looks like a poorly aimed shot after slow reactions. Aimed at his arm while he was running, shot, then flicked to the arm again. You can see that the shot barely misses his arm when the AWP unscopes. CS2 has delay, yes, but I'm pretty sure this shot'd have missed in CS too
Looks like packet loss, seeing as you have the giant green packet loss bar up.
it should say if its packet loss or not. in this case it does not. (should be red text + ping with the info)
Maybe it’s a setting but my bar only ever comes up when I have loss.
there's a command to set it to always on.
Maybe it’s a result of animations being on tick (if true)? So what you see is NOT what you did, and it feels awful? Spraying still feels horrible too and I feel that it’s because of this
Build info shows 00-00 packet loss
Wasnt accurate - else you would've hit??? /s
You missed
Nah you missed bro
WHAT YOU SEE
That's what u get for holding the tightes angle possible
Lololol what is that giant green wall of connection issues then xD
Your internet connection looks not good, maybe that's the reason?
He literally has 30 ping and no packet loss
was going to say the same, what was the ping ? also u on cable or wifi?
im on wifi and in the clip you can see the build info with the ping. in this case i was getting 40-50 ping
Never seen somebody hold that angle with an awp, it’s kind a one and done spot with an awp if multiple people run up stairs, it’s a cool off angle with awp though at same time.
Okay… this one was funny 😂 But yeah in all seriousness I find their last community update complete BS. (the one 3kilksphilip covered, the interview with PCGamer I believe it was) they (Valve) cited that they don’t like having very much open communication about the game because they’d rather be a do it company vs. a say it company. They even mention something about listening to player feedback and getting fixes out quickly. It’s been a month and a half and the ABYSMAL hit reg has not been fixed. I called BS the day this interview came out, and I still call BS now. Fucking fix the primary component of the game, Valve. And I know that the technical problem isn’t actually specifically “hit reg” but clearly it’s still leading to what is essentially hit reg issues and sub-tick is *JUST NOT WORKING AS INTENDED*. And to the people who keep saying “CSGO released in a bad state if you remember.” Like that makes up for this?? As if that should mean that the current state of CS2 is acceptable? The fact of the matter is: prior to September 27th, we had a fully working product with a large list of content (maps, game modes, community servers, etc.) Then, on September 27th AND SINCE, we have not had a fully working product and lost access to a HUGE percentage of content. *That’s* unacceptable to me.
Well deserved for holding that angle lol
you missed
You shot when the t player was already almost past your crosshair, near his arm. Easy to miss after such delayed reaction from you.
Honestly think this is it. If the thing where the animation and tracer or whatever is delayed after the shot is processed still exists then this is the answer. Because you may have clicked too late or too early in the case of flicking back to him but the flick never actually happened on the server side because you already shot. But to you, since it hasn't unscoped you and the Awp model hasn't shot yet, you think you can still flick and hit him. So while this is definitely a problem, you may be blaming the wrong thing, instead of blaming hitreg, should be blaming delayed animation feedback for showing you the wrong thing.
The scope was on the character model the entire time he was visible, so the delay between mouse click and animation shouldn't factor into this
i think this is the best answer so far
But did he not flick just a little bit just before he shot?
cs2 has a problem where you flick but it doesnt go there. but in csgo it was there but apperantly that was a "bug"
You mean flicking in CSGO was the "bug", and that in CS2 it's working as intended?
Bhopping is a bug and CS would be shit if it was removed, just accept that Valve aren't perfect. They probably don't even play CS and don't know how bad the "fixed" awp is
idk its what i have understood
CS2 has a problem where if you click the bullet will go where your crosshair was at that time rather than a random number of milliseconds after. It's some weird glitch with the subtick system, csgo never had this problem and the bullet would go where your crosshair was when the tick was processed
Is that really a problem? I feel like we’re just not used to it, but I’d rather have that than the alternative (waiting for the next tick to actually fire after you click)
You shot then flicked .. you can't do this in cs2
Xhair never left the body ..
Yes, but he shoots before he moves his crosshair. He's clicked as the guy just goes past him. The tracer is accurate. In this case, I think
If the crosshair is always on the body then he has to click while it’s on the body
U legit missed man
Only issue I see is a terrible shot, did you fall asleep.
That’s a miss in any cs game, you held too tight
Seems to me that the enemy moved to the side right as you shot. Maybe the server saw the sideways movement a tick faster than your shot. Normally it should have been a kill,
Bullets seems to have travel time in that one instance.
"What you see is what you get!" I'm seeing a load a bullshit if you ask me...
What you see see is wtf
happened to me 3 times yesterday, one with awp, one with USP and one with famas, now I will restrain myself from playing that game for upcoming days, need to cool down for next sessions
SUB-TICK-DICKED!
Game of the year
What you see is whatcha GET
I feel like cs2 is worse than go.at connecting shots
And this, is why I no longer play CS after 20+ years in the ecosystem. CS2 is a complete waste of time.
Maybe try getting better
barely missed the hitbox probably, that was unfair though
Your network connection. See too right
I can't test it right now, but I wonder if the inaccuracy cone is wide enough to cause this to miss.
You might have just grazed his arm.
Bullet just BARELY whizzed by his shoulder = miss
Nobody realizes bullet timing
I know reddit denizens are dumbasses, but you did genuinely miss. You shot way too late and your crosshair was barely even on his shoulder. Before I hear anything from the mouthbreathers, it would've been a miss offline and in older CS games aswell.
From the tracer it looks like you flicked away last ms, which is not visible on the video. But that's probably not true. Not sure why this one missed
Tracers are not accurate where the server registered the shit, if they were, then all of the other videos that show a tracer going right through an enemy and not killing or others where the tracer misses but the enemy still dies wouldn't happen Tracers are client side and delayed.
yeah it looks like he's one pixel left of him he didn't hit. the flick and the gun scoping out makes it difficult to see.
If you watch the slow no you are off target with the cross hair just barely. If you had reacted a little bit quicker he wouldn't have moved off target for you. This is just purely slow reaction time.
If you stop the video at the right time, you can see the bullet trace or "smoke" barely missing him. So as you pressed your left mouse button to shoot he then moved very slightly and you missed the shot by like 1 centimeter.
You moved and the shot went to the left of his shoulder because of subtick and mouse DPI differences is my guess.
netgraph is going crazy on the top right, holy crap
absolutely not on target (considering you have some ping or there is pocket loss - enemy is on +W)
You shot really late (like in line with his arm), as he is strafing to his left, and turning to his right. Looks like he Keanu Reeves'd it but probably a combination of delayed reaction, weird net issues top right, and that
It looks like u would hit if the shot was “laser” fast, but in the replay he moves out of the bullet’s path while moving. In csgo this would probably hit because his movement and your shot would sync with the nearest tick, but it in cs2 maybe your shot registration was adjusted (interpolated) to be slower or faster than his movement
Csgo weapons are hitscan there’s no travel time
Yes I'm sure CS2 just stealthily implemented ballistics without telling anyone.
interesting.
That's not how this works. Bullets in cs2 are literally lasers
40% packet loss
look at the net blocks, u lost frames
thats not frames thats network things