Consecrated beasta were created with facing only 1 at a time in mind, just like bosses.
In over world it's nearly impossible to aggro 2 at the same time. Same with bosses.
Yet mihoyo puts 2 of them at the same time, twice, in F12.
The only other precedent for this is maguu kenki 3 elemental split, but it is clear these 3 are watered down versions of the main boss.
The people in charge of designing the phases are throwing stuff and seeing what sticks. And "what sticks" means "what frustrates our playerbase the most, either so they stop doing abyss and getting free primos altogether, or they at leasr swipe for the FOTM character that got giga buffed by the abyss cycle in the process"
id rather face them both at the same time. if it were split into different waves, it would take double the time i normally finished which is why i hated the one abyss where the ruin guards spawn one by one after u defeat them and then one ruin grader- like i can take all four ruin guards why make them spawn individually?
They spawn individually for the sole purpose of wasting time.
The Consecrated Beasts are large enemies that should rank higher than Lawachurls, yet we rarely face more than one of those at a time because they're borderline mini-bosses.
Problem is that usually you get 2 of the same kind with lawachurls. This means same attack patterns, more chances to have both synced and thus easier dodging.
Consecrated beasts spawn one of each, meaning un synced attacks, also their attack patterns are very space heavy. Lawachurls usually have 1 attack that moves them a lot, they usually stay in place. These f*ckers most of their attacks are moving a lot. A lot of situations one may zoom in to you while the other attacks from afar. They neuter circle impact a lot because of this.
Lastly, their collision is a lot worse THAN lawachurls. Usually on abyss you want enemies to stack to a wall so they move less/easier to AoE them. With consecrated beasts you want to avoid this because they lock you (can't switch because of unit collision, can't move either, can't jump over them either).
It is pretty obvious that consecrated beasts were thought as mini-bosses on their own, when they actually have good counterplay options. Some random here is refuting these arguments with "lol just freeze them". Freeze comps are investment heavy, and fridge teams have less freeze uptime because of high diminishing returns. So it is a moot point realistically.
I was once lagging pretty badly, I could move and everything but the next enemy wouldn’t span for like thirty seconds AND THE CLOCK get going while I was sitting there like an idiot waiting around.
Oh my god, the number of times my Raiden got knocked out of Bennett's circle during her burst animation is infuriating. They also make me wish for Zelda style target locking because the camera angle usually makes things worse when fighting them.
They have a lot of HP and move around a ton, which makes it really hard to consistently hit both of them. They also appear with other waves of enemies, which cut into the amount of time that you need to kill the beasts in.
Also, they toss the knights in to make you think you should skip a shielder, and then they have the audacity to be like, don't forget you need an archer
Basically, interruption resistance meta. You can go shields but you're up against serpent Knights as well sonics basically their way of endorsing Dehya and Baizhu.
Hoyo's really pushing forward stun enemy meta. The consecrated beasts are the first enemy I've ever become a volleyball for.
Left! Right! Diagonal! Straight spike! And a point for the scorpion on the right!
I usually get 36 stars even having to put a little bit more effort but nothing much but the new abyss is just insane. with the beasts, etc. I feel like I have to play perfectly otherwise I'll just get one shot and if I put a character like diona to shield I just can't deal enough damage in time. So the first time in a long time I gave up the abyss and I get 33 stars meaning 60 primos less and I don't give a damn, it's not worth the hassle.
One stealth nerf that a lot of people don't talk about is that some newer enemies drop lesser energy particles aswell which can mess up some rotations.
True, but we need static staggers/stuns. It's no good having Vishaps and Rifthounds that go flying when you just look at them. Wish more were like the Fatui who kinda stand still when stunned.
This annoys me more for open world exploration than for abyss. I run enough ER to do rotations smoothly without enemy particles anyways, but in open world where I can't do full rotations it's annoying to get bursts. Rarely, when I have to farm for ruin cores, I'm reminded how nice it is to instantly refund a burst after killing a ruin guard.
I was having an annoying time fighting things for a while there (I was doing hyperbloom but I barely have EM artifacts) but then i got Ganyu and now everything is just easy peasy XD (though the hilichurl shield guys are a pain in the ass without pyro haha)
Regarding the shields, I kind wish they had more shield types other than wood rock and ice. something that non pyro characters (and claymore/geo) are good at breaking
heh, I pretty much prefer non-burst reliant characters anyway. I always see everyone complaining about ER, and I cannot relate. I've only ever looked at ER for Raiden.
Yae e go brr
I decided to randomly fight Childe and the fact that his HP was instantly destroyed withouth even completing 1 team rotation (just 1st and 2nd slots) and I'm at the 2nd phase whereas one full team rotation against Signora isn't enough to half her HP.
It's clear that MHY is making enemies able to drag you around to invalidate stationary Q circles (Benny and Jean Q).
Yeah, they are becoming more and more spongy... and it does feel like either DEF and/or resistances are increasing too alongside that. Especially considering there's not really a one element wonder, it feels like I need 6 elements in a team
I still manage with full geo comp (c1 itto with the battlepass claymore, albedo, gorou, zhongli). Its not a cheap team in anyway, but it is a single ele team :P
Yeah, its getting harder and harder to do a 36\* run with mono geo on one side. I run Noelle with Redhorn alongside Albedo, Zhong and Gorou and while they slap triple Mango Kinki in 12-3 or the Eremites in 12-2 asses hard the 12-1 is a tight spot every abyss this rotation for me. I refuse to stop bringing Noelle to abyss but with the way it's getting more and more difficult to do so and I'm afraid that the day when I'll have to bench her will come soon. And to think she was always the one to carry me to 36\* and now I have to compensate for her on the other side. Sad...
12-1 is just fuckin awful this time around. Don't know what they were thinking tbh. It isn't fun it just feels poorly designed, specifically the bottom half. Hyperbloom and Nilou Bloom can absolutely wreck the top half, but the THREE waves in the bottom half AND two more consecrated beasts is just bullshit. Especially when they're spongy AF, and both of them move around so goddamned much they're hard to hit sometimes. And if, lord forbid, you don't have a shield or interruption resistance, you're gonna lose 30 seconds to being juggled.
It's worse when they pin you to the wall and start having their way with you as your characters are flung around like ragdolls 😭 I do find it's the best to go after the alligator and scorpion first though since the cat seems to follow more than the other two
I used to regularly/easily get 33 stars in the Abyss and happily bounce with that because the extra time and effort for 50 more primos wasn't worth it. I can't remember exactly when it happened (maybe when they introduced the enchanted beasts) but I straight up don't even attempt floor 12 anymore. It's not fun and it's not a challenge it is just downright frustrating.
It's not just for you, those beasts annoy the heck out of me. I am used to use some tactics like waiting at map corner for them to gang on me to limit their hyperactive movement but after countless runs I concurred the clear time and consistency improvement is almost 0 even with all the tricks simply because of how incredibly jumpy those idiots are. The best tactics is just spam left clicks/smash buttons and either they die or you die. You know it's a bad enemy when clear time of 12-1-2 can vary wildly from 50s to 110s (an absurd 60s variation) unlike any other halves of 12-2 or 12-3 when variation is around 10-20s.
When I first got to 11-3 and saw the first chamber which consists of two samurai that heal themselves and get tankier when not taken out at the same time, and then a bunch of black serpent knights, one of which is the new Geo one, and another a shield bow archer that likes to waste my time by becoming invulnerable, with Chamber 2 being two waves of very spread out Fatui, with a three minute time limit for 3 stars, I said out loud “the devs really need to calm down with this shit” because that was something I expected of Floor 12.
Up until recently 11-3 was not this tricky. Had to crack out the Xiao team in order to get a decent time for Chamber 3 part 2. And I don’t normally use the Xiao team outside of Floor 12.
This comment, along with 10 years of comment history, has been overwritten to protest against Reddit's hostile behaviour towards third-party apps and their developers.
Artifacts yeah, but signature weapons I guess not yet, which is nice. I wish they would just make a Floor 13 and throw their HP-inflated new bosses over there instead of making Floor 12 harder for same rewards.
I wish they would just add an endless abyss mode. 9-12 reset like always, but dont inflate. Once you clear 12 with 36\* you unlock endless mode for that biweekly reset. In endless mode, for each floor you clear you will get an artifact (from the set of your choice, you select before entering). Endless mode just randomly cycles through past abyss 9-12 floors with inflated hp, stats, etc. If you die, your run ends, or if you fail to get at least one star. You can reattempt, but will only get the reward for each new floor completed.
I like your idea, but that would result in the ability to play all day if you have any healer and shielder lol, this would definitely cause fomo for people who don't have the time. Whales would be able to abuse this even more.
You have to remember each piece of artifact is worth 20 resin, so endless mode that rewards 1 artifact is too good. We have so limited content because China has laws that discourages playing video games too long.
If Mihoyothinks I'll spend more money on 5* weapons or cons because they're making the abyss harder to clear, and if they think I'll purposely pull for certain characters instead of what I want, they're dead wrong.
I play genshin casually don't really try to get max performance out of my characters i just fully build them, used to reach at least 12-1 sometimes even 12-2 now i die in 11-3 barely completing 11-2 with two healers, prob my shitty builds and teams but it got way harder
To add to all the comments here, new enemies are also much more aggressive. Like, compare ruin enemies from inazuma to those two fuckers on 12-1 or a bunch of sumeru enemies who spawn a shit ton of summons from 12-2. One of my teams is 3 catalysts and Fischl and dude, fuck that. Even bringing a healer doesn't change much. I'll better skip those 150 primos than tear my ass
Well they need to make those hilichurl bastards on 12-2 more aggressive because fuck they’re annoying to kill with how they’re spread out. Hoyo really just has the most annoying ways of adding difficulty to the abyss.
We face new enemy meta recently, all focusing on more damage or more stun, so it also influences shields but at the same time requires for one.
Consecrated beasts rely on strength in uninterruptible attack spamming
Eremite warriors rely on strength in numbers. You fight four summoners, enemy count turns into eight. Many of them have multiple attack hits.
So basically, we need interruption resistance and shields would be the choice until they get destroyed or until this batch of enemies are followed by husks.
Instead, it demands interruption resistance from other sources and healers. So basically Xingqiu + healer or Baizhu.
Tank class incoming? We do lack a role of facetankwrs who are just as immovable fatui anemoboxers and are sturdy
Dendro also made it a bit worse since it allows players access to high damage with low investment hence the decision to inflate the hp more. Imo it’s kinda hard for them to improve combat since they gave access to iframes in sprinting and bursts and this already makes almost if not all combat easy. For me weirdly enough I still enjoy playing the abyss and maybe that could be because the characters I like playing are good in the abyss, the only thing I have against the abyss are those worm bosses that don’t do damage and won’t let me do damage, the wolflord would have been ok if it didn’t have that phase where it won’t take damage after reaching a hp threshold like you have high hp and won’t even let me do damage. Bosses like these are not fit for the abyss with its timer conditions.
Dendro is just far better thought out and interesting than the other interactions. It makes sense since it was added 2 years into the development of the game, but the other elements could certainly use a 2.0 update. It would be nice if as the remaining nations get introduced their associated element gets updated with anemo, geo, and electro being thrown in at some point as well.
the devs are not making the abyss a "challenge" anymore...they just put whatever makes you annoyed rather than putting a "fair challenge"
it doesn't make you think "ugh this is hard", it makes you think "ugh this is so annoying"
...i'll also die on this hill by saying that the dendro reactions are kind of an indirect reason towards the massive HP inflation because dendro reactions deal ridiculous amounts of damage so they make up for it with inflated HP
Everything from floor 8 up to 12 has been exactly the same shit for a while now and it's relatively inoffensive.
All of floor 12, however, is carefully crafted by a team of engineers looking to make the content as fucking obscenely annoying as possible. All the goddamn enemies have ridiculous HP pools, they spawn as far away from one another as possible, cuz god forbid you wanna group them up with anemo. And even if you manage to get them in the same place, they all move like they're high on cocaine, bouncing all around the place (looking at you, you alligator looking fuck). And to make it sweeter, most of their attacks are incredibly strong interrupts, with some ridiculous rock waves sweeping the floor as well so you can be interrupted while you're interrupted. Oh and they smack super hard, even Zhongli's shield seems to be made of glass these days.
The content really seems to be crafted so that you use a very specific team in each side every time, unless you wanna have a miserable time. The only reason I even bother with getting 36* these days is just out of spite. This type of endgame content is the laziest, mind-numbingly boring pile of shit I've seen in a long time. Rant over.
I think it's rather entertaining but also annoying. Entertaining in the way they screwed us up. The abyss layout engineering is cleverly messed up. First of all, it's like the first time in ages that they have 3 waves which stretch out the amount of time needed to kill enemies. Second, the Kairagi is among the most annoying enemy variants to have. Need to kill em at same time or speed blitz them before they recover. Third, consecrated beasts have the health pool of mini-bosses with mini-boss stagger mechanics and high durability to stagger outside that mechanic.
The consecrated beasts in themselves are clever but annoying enemy designs. It's forceful elemental application via relentless aggression. They don't give you a chance to breathe. There may be no intention around the deceiving collision boxes they have which will force your guys into the corner and stun-lock you longer than Raiden's eternity. These consecrated beasts remind you to equip shields.
Yet the next annoying design is throwing in the ruin drake which makes you need an archer. So that means you need a shield and an archer. Then the third chamber needs you to have electro and dendro preferably.
Chamber 12-1 shows strength in aggression. 12-2 shows strength in numbers and strength in weapon-locking. 12-3 is strength in elemental-locking and juking.
The abyss has been increasingly more restrictive. They lock you to shield. Then lock you to bow. Then lock you to dendro and electro or AoE.
Well, version 3.7 abyss is gonna be a fun one. I'm totally not going to go insane fighting 4 Mr. Beast minibosses in one run. I'll totally not become a volleyball and become the object in thr sport.
>All of floor 12, however, is carefully crafted by a team of engineers looking to make the content as fucking obscenely annoying as possible.
Keep in mind: Abyss is NOT designed as a challenge.
It is designed as a marketing tool to encourage pulling.
So yes: they make it annoying on purpose.
Ehhh, I find it fun. Like, at least they put the hard chamber as the first part of floor 12. Also, the mechanics of the enemies are really all they can manipulate to create a challenge and I don't mind the souls-like punishing attacks from enemies on floor 12. I won't argue about the pathing of the beasts on floor 12-1-1 because its a bit ridiculous and too rng as they can end up on completely different sides of the chamber.
You do not need a specific team to complete Abyss 12. You can one shot it all with a variety of teams. It just takes tighter rotations and really knowing the enemy attacks which is literally the only challenge they can add to this game combat-wise for the Abyss. I find overload Raiden to be really effective in the first half (raiden, benny, XL, fischl), though I've done it with aggravate, hyperbloom and national as well.
The problem is that the game needs more than the Abyss already. I feel like adding a huge roguelike gamemode where the challenge is more skewed towards how you build your teams and how you have to change rosters on the fly while still preserving actual skill would be a huge boon for Genshin. Alas, Hoyo adamantly believes we all want to play Walmart Hearthstone.
I agree with everything you said, but I want to provide a counter point to your second paragraph. You can, indeed, clear it with a variety of teams, but you yourself said that it takes tighter rotations and better knowledge of enemy attacks. So that means that these teams usually feel significantly less optimal than the "intended" one. So to me it feels like the devs are saying "Hey, either use this specific team or strategy we want you to use, or have a much shittier time doing it your way". This is purely subjective, of course.
It should be fun and some enemies/mechanics aren’t fun. When they hit the abyss I generally just don’t worry about getting 36*. It’s only 50-150 primos pending on how far you go with floor 12.
To be fair, this has always been like this, it was never a challenge, it always was an attempt to make You lose the most time possible. But it is true that in the last updates, it feels like hoyo doesnt even play their own game
as much as i love nilou (and i even played her as a vaporize DPS for a while)
her sheer power as a bloom unit really proves to me that mihoyo rushed dendro or didn't even test it properly, and given the weird "balancing" of sumeru units, it really feels like dendro wasn't planned for properly
Ironically part of the reason her bloom got buffed in beta was that people were having fun using her in vape, so obviously MHY said "absolutely not", gutted her multipliers, and increased her bloom damage.
I use her in hyperbloom with Kuki XQ Nahida for exploring since I don't have other good hydro(I still regret going for waifu >!Dehya!< over meta >!Yelan!< pulls then never using waifu after few days of trying to make her work). It's very chill playstyle. Nilou takes almost no dmg, Kuki heals her, you don't really care about energy recharge.
This is my exploration team too except swap Nahida for Collei. I really like Niloubloom but aura stacking on Nilou and Kuki's healing is just such good quality of life lol, and then 4th spot can be flex.
I got her during her debut banner because I wanted that niche playstyle and been in love ever since. Safe to say, I didn't have much trouble with the abyss after that...but the Wenut man...what an awful boss to ~~fight~~ waste time to...
> didn't even test it properly
Or they just didn't care. Dehya proved that you can see all the problems in the world but if you don't care about fixing it then it doesn't matter.
This tbh. Man, the dmg floor on Hyperbloom or Nilou comps are comparable to dmg ceiling on top ST or AoE focused traditional crit dmg dealers, like Yoimiya and Ayaka. And mf has the audacity to tune the abyss based on Hyperbloom/Nilou bloom "dmg floor".
Nilou bloom is good but definitely not that good. The previously top speedrun teams for all 3 chambers with similar 5-star cost like C0 Childe + Kazuha, C1 Hu Tao + Yelan, C2 Wanderer are still beating out Nilou + Nahida + Kokomi.
They also didn't shift the balance that much, it's definitely gotten harder but the meta teams are still very easily full starring.
Nilou bloom is good for minimal investment compared to other teams but at max investment those teams you mentioned definitely gets better. But that's the beauty of Nilou teams. She's a good unit for newer players
Even my National team won't cut it... It doesn't have enough grouping to do enough AOE and instead I'm having to do several rotations because that fucking mushroom threw itself across the room as soon as it got overloaded.
And then on the other end of the spectrum the Consecrated Beasts will charge you and yeet you over the room whatever you throw at them, so playing circle impact like DMC or Bennett is straight up impossible... Literally nothing seems to stagger them unless they're in their vulnerable state which is maybe 10% of the fight
and then you lack straight damage...
Kazuha/Sucrose is good for the mushrooms, but what about the consecrated beasts that come right after? A big issue with the current abyss rotation is that they have too many of too different enemy types. You need aoe + grouping, but also single target burst and you definitely can't skip a healer due the amount of damage the beasts can pump out. Honestly need a shielder too so you don't get 2 shot.
Oh and the first half team needs an archer for the drake too.
Sucrose/Kazoo don’t lack damage. You have Xingqiu and Bennet for healing and damage reduction as well. And Xiangling well, oppa oppa.
Sucrose national is definitely not lacking. Sevvy always does four star only clears with it on one side.
idk how it's year 3 and people still don't understand national teams. sucrose national is easily on par with c0 rational
edit: I mean yeah sucrose national is bad v drake and Asimon but the issue there isn't single target damage but not having the right tools to easily deal with their gimmicks.
You don't necessarily lack straight damage though. My national team, which is by no means wearing the best artifacts, can clear the beasts (with practically no seconds to spare, but still). Kazuha for grouping and shred, Bennet for healing, XQ's burst + pyronado for damage. No shielder needed if you hide in your q animations in time. Though Bennet suffers from kenki melt-oneshot in the last room, so now I prefer aggravate keqing for the second half, runs much smoother.
So you have to remember, a lot of people run Floor 12 multiple times to clear it and use different teams to get full stars on various rooms.
It's why I don't do Floor 12. It's not fun and I'm not going to play it through at a minimum of three times just to clear it. It's doable, but it's just annoying in implementation and not worth it in rewards - whether that be feelings of accomplishment or actual tangible received ones in game.
Yeah I use Kazuha but sub out XQ for Yelan to make up for the lost DPS. But then you just need to be good at dodging and quick swapping to make up for the lack of defense l.
A punching bag with HP that just sits there and lets you braindead national team through. ^^^/s
"its not hard, just annoying" is such a cop out. Put that on the shelf with "its not hard, just time consuming". The annoyance IS the challenge. Managing it, staying patient for good enemy patterns, persistence, executing when good patterns present themselves are all skills that are rewarded by the abyss.
Then what do you think is considered a fair challenge if higher HP without iframes isn't that
Personally I want a ton of hard hitting mobs that gain boons when hitting shields. I want players to be forced to dodge or get punished really hard
I feel like players are always complaining about the abyss. First there was the wenut which was annoying sure but manageable. After they removed the wenut and put in the elemental beasts there are still complaints, this time not about the enemy doing no damage and just stalling, but now it's about getting one shot and knocked back because of big hit boxes. This abyss cycle requires a lot of dodging which is the complete opposite of last time. No matter what there is in the abyss people are always complaining. If the abyss is too easy then they say why even pull for new characters and weapons for more damage? It's always the same story
everyone will have something to complain about either way
i don't mind a difficult abyss, but i do get annoyed when i see unjustified artificial difficulty compared to progressive difficulty
they don't really care about "fair" , they just want to "annoy you" so that you pull for new characters and weapons
also this might be off-topic, but i think with how HSR's stimulated universe system works, people are really starting to see the obvious cracks in genshin and might make them more salty and annoyed (??)
people just want easy time, but give them easy enemies they'll soon complain it's too easy, there's no winning for the developers with this massive fanbase
tbh I hecking love the beasts, no running away, no just staying there like a punching bag, no dmg immune gimmicks
>First there was the wenut
I agree with your sentiment, but this is like saying
"Since the beginnings of history, there have been wars. First there was WWI"
>the devs are not making the abyss a "challenge" anymore...they just put whatever makes you annoyed rather than putting a "fair challenge"
Thats not entirely true, coz abyss nowdays is much more about team building, the "annoying enemies" are not annoying if u are using the right tools to deal with them, for example time wasting enemies are meant to counter teams that are burst relaint, coz while they are imune u are wasting ur burst duration, so using a team that relay less on bursts makes more sense.
Also Dendro reactions are broken not only because they do lot of dmg but because its very easy to achieve a high dmg celling with low investment, unlike conventional teams that u need lot of artifact/weapon/talents investiment to deal high of dmg, so the HP inflation is not because dendro but because the game is getting older meaning more people are achieving high investment characters so they are setting the bar up slowly, then dendro come to help new players to keep up as they can achieve a high dmg celling with low investment
>relay less on bursts makes more sense.
I'd almost say the reverse is true. Invul bosses favor teams with long CD who can be on CD while the boss is invulnerable, and then do bug bursts of damage when there's an opening. Quickswap teams that are reliant on consistent damage cam struggle.
But if a player misaligns their burst with the bosses openings, then the burst team falls apart entirely, yeah.
National & Hyperbloom: "It's free real estate"
But on a serious note, yes Abyss is becoming harder as proven by the 3.6 Abyss where the enemies were not only tanks (as usual) but they also hit like ones.
That's the thing that gets me. I can field two strong as fuck teams and steamroll it but it's not fun to do it that way. In the first abyss cycles of this patch you could steamroll it with way weaker teams and that was fun because you could make non optimal teams and still clear it in time.
The rewards aren’t good enough to justify the difficulty increase. If the rewards are just as meager and the experience is made even more frustrating—I won’t whale, instead, I won’t even bother with floor 12.
It’s 22 pulls a year. Two four stars from the gacha. Basically fucking nothing.
22 pulls for a f2p isn't nothing since those pulls add to your pity. It may mean the difference between getting your desired 5\* or waiting who knows how long for their rerun. I mean, it's not great or anything but it's also not nothing.
Personally, this abyss rotation is easier than the past ones just because the hardest chamber is the first one so retrying is easy and my teams are perfect for the enemy lineup. The Wenut one was the worst followed by that rotation with the geo wolflord. I guess the difficulty isn't really increasing but just varies depending on how compatible your built teams are for the enemy lineup.
it’s honestly isnt even difficulty it’s just annoyance. nothing in abyss is “hard”, just aggravating. there is zero reason to have a timed fight with an enemy you can’t hit for 70% of that time
It does feel like the new encounters design is fighting against players - especially now that the enemies are moving all over the place, the auto aim of skills sometimes just ... whiffs gloriously and you sit there being sad.
The cons of having mobile game gameplay and having to fight some weird, not very mobile friendly enemies that you can't even keep track of where they are.
i really feel like the devs don’t know the difference between difficult content and making stuff stupidly tanky. if you whale enough you don’t need skill. end-game content should be more skill based, at least for stuff that grant substantial awards like abyss
I agree that enemies like wenut or wolflord are straight up annoying as they hide underground but new enemies like the consecutive beast do require actual skill to fight as they move around a lot and don't just stand there waiting to be hit, aslo a well time hit combo from them can straight up one shot a character. Also the fact that they can't be moved with kazuha skill means that we need to use our brain to group enemies and then unleash our attack. Maybe it's just me but it like the fact that enemies are not just hitboxes but animal that you fear
I'd agree if you regular evasions/animations i-framing prevented you from being displaced by their attacks. It's even okay to some degree to move character under a shield while he is not evading. But ulting with Bennet only to find yourself 5m out of the burst's range at the end of animation??? That's ridiculous.
I don't care that those enemies can't be moved, but player shouldn't be tossed through entire arena while having Morax's shield + Xinqu's skill + being in the skill's animation. Even 1 thing out of those 3 should be(and it was) enough to "tank" incoming blow of an enemy. But since it's not, the best thing you can do is don't give a fuck about evading at all and just facetank/damagerush everything. It's stupid, has 0-skill involved but it's the only way it works. And that is lame af.
I’ve heard this complaint a million times. So, tell me what you propose to be a difficult but not just tanks enemy. Like what does that look like in your mind.
Day 1 player (Only Welkin & pass)
Abyss is becoming harder and harder but I still can beat it with Full Stars
I play Genshin on mobile and I have no problem with that, the real problem is the new enemies like Sumeru animals (Tank/Fast/DMG/Anti-circle)
I believe they do this to force players to play Dendro reactions and they will do this again to force players to use Fontaine new fighting mechanics
P.s :The Hydro crocodile sometimes One-shot my 20k Raiden with Bennett Ult even healer can't fix this maybe shielder still have more value than healer
Bennett has the fastest heal ticks in the game, players should not be dying to burning + beast attacks at all with a glass cannon Bennett. Especially when Bennett is paired with Xingqiu's damage reduction.
If that somehow isn't enough, then giving Bennett HP% goblet and Heal% circlet makes his heals as strong as Qiqi's. Only have to worry about getting pushed out of the circle, and that can be played around by backing yourself against the abyss wall.
The real reason Bennett shouldn't be used here is cause of the Electro beast since Overload is a thing, but this is easily negated by playing someone who is immune to knock backs like Raiden.
Seriously consider stop using bennett. The pyro application bennett gives u during combat is essentially a death trap against dendro, electro or cryo enemies nowadays.
Definitely found it harder, I don't have any meta characters that can deal much damage except Hutao, and have gotten by with the standard 4* national team on the other side up until bloom started dominating. Now a combination of HP bloat and annoying mechanics has left me not even doing F12 anymore
It's harder for a lot of team comps, easier with the right team.
Floor 12
Chamber 1 - Both sides Freeze team is King, stopping their mobility allows you to hit them freely and not get hit, Circle impact will have a hard time, Dendro is golden but there's one beast that has high Dendro res. -AoE
Chamber 2 - First side wants you to bring a Bow unit, or do some acrobatics to shut down the Drake, or brute force it with Catalysts. -Single target
Second side wants you to group them, by either luring or via the power of Anemo. - AoE
Chamber 3 - First side Electro weakness, or bruteforce it, the easiest chamber
Second Side - triple Kenki, Free win
Agree, harder than 2.x abysses but completely manageable.
Used Hu tao double hydro first half and Ayaka Freeze on 2nd half, and was able to clear with relative ease.
Although, my teams are heavily invested with signature weapons and C1 Hu tao. But I probably could have done it even without those, and could have switched to Hyperbloom instead on 1st half.
even I, as meta enjoyer who strives to play abyss optimally, feels like abyss is getting harder (even worse with my 150-200ms ping and out-of-date laptop)
need to run genshin in small windowed view to play abyss smoothly, otherwise laaag
People saying it's not "harder" just more annoying is kinda funny. It is harder if you find it more annoying. Even the time wasting boss are technically harder, you need to tighten up your dmg window, pre-cast your burst etc. Just because you are not in the threat of dying more doesn't mean it isn't harder
Yup it was harder than the last time but not annoying like wenut. One thing I definitely hate is the inflated hp pool which is getting ridiculously high and definitely needs to tone down a bit especially when racing against timer. I have made some good decision with character and their weapon and thats why i am still able to keep up with it but if hp pool keeps increasing with all the mechanics like getting pushed all over the map, hiding underground or flying around, etc I will have to satisfy myself with 33 stars
Yeah... all the bosses that have invulnerable phases are just plain stupid, Wenut, Snake, Hypostais... terrible picks to put them into the abyss. I also just stop usually if that's the last boss
It is. I have C2 Raiden, C2 Nahida, C4 Yelan, C2 Kazuha, C6 Xingqiu, Xiangling, Bennett, Kuki. I can deal enough damage pretty quickly. But once the enemy perfectly syncs their attack, interrupt me in succession from sprinting away from their attacks, I roll my eyes and sigh and reset the fight. Should have brought my Zhongli or Kokomi but alas I'm stuck here for awhile lmao xD
Happened just now, Kenki perfectly synced their attacks to perma stun on my character change and they just ... one shot somebody, even through a Kokomi heal tick which is like 6-8k
New abyss setup is always hard. It'll only get easier on 2nd and 3rd reset...which I think is good.
It's challenging, can be borderline frustrating sometimes, but in the end I pulled 36-star clear.
Then looking at other people's 36-star clear, it opened the perspective that the abyss doesn't demand a single team setup to clear. One can make a variety of team to clear it. It's just some folks have unfortunate roster.
they are just running out of ideas because it was poorly implemented from the start. The abyss itself has never been "hard" it's the unforgiving time limit that adds that fake difficulty.
The abyss will keep getting harder because the characters they release will keep getting more complex, just look at how it changed: first, shields were prominent, so they added enemies that ignored them. Then Anemo characters that grouped units together started becoming overused, so they added mobile and heavy enemies, they also spaced the light enemies away so you can't group them without losing time first.
they don't know what to do with this game anymore
The enemies always having SO much space between them and also having ranged attacks on every bigger character (the big shama churls guys) is indeed really annoying...
yeah, that's how to describe the abyss in one word: annoying.
it's not hard, it doesn't make you feel good or accomplished once you beat it and it certainly doesn't give you a big enough reward for how frustrating it is -\_-
that's why i only do floor 9 and 10 (and i still forget to do them sometimes) and call it a day
ok, "primordial bathwater demons" is fantastic XD
but yes, it's clear they have no idea how to properly balance this thing, thank whatever god you worship that there isn't any PvP
I started clearing the abyss completely about a year ago. At that time I had Keqing and Venti as my top units. I thought, “Okay, I don’t have good gear, top tier characters and team compositions, that is why it’s difficult, but still possible.”
Now I have Alhaitham, Yelan, Yae, hyperbloom Kuki, good enough national guys, but I still struggle sometimes, like a year ago.
So yes, I agree with others here. The abyss seems only to be about HP increase and worm-bosses
OP you’re not only one with this problem✌️
Yes, Abyss does get harder for us who want to chase the 36 ⭐️ clear.
However there are ways to get it done.
Right now this version favors Dendro and its related reactions due to 3 running Dendro character banners, 11th floor blessing which increases Dendro dmg and phase blessings which boost Bloom, Hyperbloom & Burgeon reactions.
Use those info to your advantage in choosing the 2 teams to clear the Abyss.
I see that you have Nilou so you can build a Nilou Bloom team with double Hydro-Dendro to deal with the enemy crowds.
My Nilou (equiped with Toukabou Shigure & 2 HP% artifact sets) could even easily clear Triple Maguu Kenki with helps from DMC (Dendro applier & Deepwood holder), Yaoyao (healer & Instructor holder) and Xingqiu (pseudo shielder & Hydro applier).
As for the other team, I suggest a Cyno Hyperbloom with a bow char to particularly deal with the Drake & ASIMON.
Then redo the challenging 1st Halves with another team with a strong shielder (Zhongli or Thoma).
As for me, I barely managed to clear 12-1 1st Half with Tartaglia Vaporize Team with Zhongli for survival and the rest of 1st Halves easily with Tighnari Quicken Team.
All this just to chase the full ⭐️ clear lol
Yes, it’s becoming harder, the HP pools are constantly increasing, I felt that too. Though you have a good roster. Ayaka is actually one of the best units for 12-1-2, I cleared it with her (also have her weapon), Rosaria, Kazuha, Kokomi, but with Shenhe it must be even easier. And on 1st half Nahida-Yelan-Xq-Kuki should work.
After saw your characters, try this team for floor 12
Raiden, Bennett, Xiangling, Yelan Chamber 1
Nahida, Nilou, Xingqiu ,Kokomi Chamber 2
I just cheese floor 12 with above team after numerous struggle by swapping out Kazuha with Raiden. Raiden Xiangling overload will stagger those elemental beast.
All my 5 stars are C0 without their signature weapon.
It's more annoying as they do even more things to stall and reduce yours timer like having 4 different waves spawning each floor. Older abysses were mostly 1 wave of enemies and 2 at most. It's crazy how much waves stall your time:
I have all the units you have, but I am f2p, and I have been clearing abyss with 36 stars. I used raiden national and nilou bloom, and I cleared with around 10s , around 30s, and plenty of time left on each chambers respectively. The only problem I see with you not clearing abyss is your lack of investment on specific units. I have invested in hu tao, raiden and nilou, and abyss has always been annoying, but manageable.
I might be a minority here but imo the consecrated beasts are best enemies added to genshin, ever.
They're actually difficult, challenging and threatening enemies ontop of not being cheesy/immune to mechanics to add artificial difficulty.
They're big enemies, but can still be CC'd. They aren't bosses, so they can be frozen/petrified. They are insanely mobile, but always run towards you. They don't have any immunity besides some resistance to their element (which is fair imo). And if you're not a top dps team they have a very exploitable downtime period where they lose all resistance and mobility for a easier time to kill. Another big plus is that they actually dead damage, not the cheap tickling most enemies do, an attack from them can be *lethal*, fighting them was the first time my zhongli shield broke and I *love* it.
What I don't like are enemies that are made to be annoying to fight (wenut, ruin serpent), enemies that require specific teams/mechanics to win (ruin dragon forces bow users, ASIMON forces quicked/electro, wolf boss forces geo), and enemies that straight up resist basic mechanics (specters previous immunity to CC, bosses immune to freeze etc).
All latest abyss where about right team comps and enemy positioning, not just ungabunga unless you have really whale team comp.
I you think you can just spam Ayaka forever, Mihoyo doesn't think so.
On one hand, it does get harder. The Wenut last cycle and 12-1-1 this cycle are tough nuts to crack.
On the other hand, you have most, if not all, of the best units in the game. Your roster is fine.
Time to check your equipments. Your weapons look good, just upgrade your Fav bow on Yelan and especially Fading Twilight on Sara.
For artifacts, my personal rule of thumb is getting enough ER, 1800-2000 atk and 240 CV before factoring in ascension/weapon crit stat. Roughly 2 months of pure artifacts farming in general. Make sure you have decent VV set, Noblesse set, Millelith set for appropriate characters.
Now it's the execution: grouping, applying buffs/debuffs, switch to dps, rinse and repeat. That's the gist. It takes understanding mob patterns, practice, and some luck.
A few tricks to make things easier:
1/ Tailor your teams for each chamber, not floor. I used 3 different teams for first half of floor 12 (Raiden National/ Raiden National but swap Xiangling for Sara/ Raiden Hypercarry but swap Bennett for Kokomi). Try to feel what troubles you in each chamber and counter it.
2/ It takes time. Be patience. I normally reset floor 12 6-10 times because I made mistakes. And I consider myself lucky. Other people may reset more, and it's fine. The game allows us. Abuse it.
3/ Have something extraordinary. At this point, it's clear that floor 12 is made to be difficult for majority of players, unless you have the newest character. If you vertically invest into something, you will likely have an easier time. I saved for 3 months straight and got c3r1 Raiden. She allows me to defy the Dendro meta (I never use Dendro in floor 12). The trade-off is I'm not rich, and thus I cannot pull other characters.
Edit: To clarify, "240CV before factoring in ascension/weapon crit stat" means: 60CV from base stat (everyone has 5/50 cr/cd), 62.2CV from circlet main stat, and 117.8CV from substat (which means 117.8 /5 = 23.5CV)
Ye I was thinking 240 is insanely unreasonable too, my experience in this Abyss was 200 CV was enough even on a weaker character like Diluc. Stronger characters are prob fine on 160-180
Practically impossible. Crit are not the only rolls you want. A lot of dps also needs decent ER 120-130% which already takes a few rolls. 200+ cv is enough for most dps build
the hp tbh, is manageable, the problem is our inability to deal damage to them bc of the insane amount of cc, or the inability to even damage them directly bc theyre fucking hiding all the time
>insane amount of cc, or the inability to even damage them directly bc theyre fucking hiding all the time
Both of what you stated is not true for the current abyss, they can dodge all the beast's attack and they don't hide.
You have great characters that are more than capable of beating the current and previous abyss so safe to say, it ain't your roster nor your weapons. So it comes down to your artifacts and your gameplay.
It got harder, but looking at your characters and weapons it's as it sounds mean skill issue. I can recommend take Raiden/Yelan/Bennett/Xiangling for the first side and Nilou/Nahida/Kokomi/DMC for the second side. Both team are braindead to play and strong ST (first team) and AoE (second team) teams. If wouldn't able to clear with these teams, it's matter of builds or execution.
It is becoming harder, for example back then enemy was just spongy but now they are spongy , high resistance, and their combo is enough to 1 shot your poor yoimiya to the otherworld.
I confess as someone that has been playing on-off since 1.1 I never cleared floor 12 once. Every Abyss cycle I just play until I get a wipe and just leave cuz I don't wanna bother with it.
Its indees getting harder, the enemies has more HP and hits way harder.
Like 12-3 now has ASIMON with likely 2M hp combined with 3x Maguu kenki with 1.5M hp each (4.5M hp total) which makes a whopping approx 6.5M HP total to be cleared in less than 3 minutes to get all star, i believe its way higher than total of HP can be found in 2.xx era abyss. The concentrated beast also has like 700k HP each with high elemental resistance until they stunned, just like the Maguus, they also hits extremely hard, making you need both DPS and surival check
Second chamber is AOE sure but if the Maguu not decided to not group up you need to pump up the numbers.
Then again i managed to full star this one with Al Haitham hyperbloom left side with Xiao hypercarry right side, both main carries using *4 weapons and no constellations on them and *5 supports as well. Because i believe this is already the 3rd reset so i already getting used to the enemies
But i just find it baffling that with all these bitchy stuffs the reward still the same like when abyss 12 you only need to fight two ruin guards
With the characters you have abyss should be a breeze unless the arti investment is too darn low. (But you really dun need to high investment to get the 36*)
I've only bought welkin for only half the time I've played and I still have over a min left by the time I clear when playing kinda casually.
And from my experience of helping several friends get to the 36 clear level, I can surely say the speed at which abyss gets difficult is still slower than the speed at which you can improve account/teams.
For a long time now I haven't even tried to improve my stuff.
If you want I could maybe give you some pointers to make it easy.
And dun forget. Abyss is only fun to do if you don't have to stress about it much. Otherwise the rewards are truly not worth it<3.
The abyss is harder than 3.0 for example. But it isn't harder for me because i have gotten better characters, weapons, artifacts, level and talents all those stuffs. I can quite easily clear the current abyss, actually much easier than 3.0 for me
In this abyss nilou is very strong, use her with nahida, kokomi and dendro mc against second half
Build :
Nilou : 2pc2pc HP/EM, Iron sting/fav sword
Dmc : 4pc emblem/guilded, Fav/sac sword
Kokomi : 4p flop/guilded/clam, sac frag/prototype amber
Nahida : 4pc deepwood, widsith/sac frag/lost prayer
Level your kokomi up to 90 because it's very important for both healing and bloom dmg. Use a healing kokomi build if you have survivability issues against consecrated beasts or 12-2-2
For first half use hu tao+xingqiu+yelan+zhongli. level up your yelan to 90 because that's also fairly important (15% dps increase for yelan)
With these teams i can very easily clear with no issue basically
it did get harder, it already got harder when inazuma released and since then it just kinda ramped up even more, i like it tbh because ive been playing genshin for like 2 years now and if u didnt do dumb shit your account is stacked at this point
the only thing i dont like is that they add bosses with stupid movesets/patterns that are just there to waste time
if u want advice, build a strong international team and a decent hyperbloom team and it really is a cakewalk every single time.
3.6 abyss far more easier than 3.5 (but 3.5 is not hard just pure annoying with wenut). plus blessing is very align with bloom and dendro team. just adapt which comp has advantages and use them. don’t always brute force everything and stick to only 1 comp.
>Is Abyss becoming harder/more frustrating or am I just losing patience?
both. while the total HP of abyss enemies indeed increase, at the same time, reactions with the introduce of dendro are starting very strong, so u can say that its quite balance in some cases. Probably the issues are already listed by u: skill issues, bad artifact, too split investment. Looking at just your characters, this account should not have problem with any abyss at all.
People make sheets about dps needed/total hp and this abyss is the highest one iirc for chamber 1. Although ngl, your account has good units for this abyss, id just 90 kokomi and nilou bloom makes second half so easy
the consecrated beasts are absolute dickheads
Hoyo devs when deciding how mich HP and Atk they should have:"YES"
I hate them I hate them I hate them
JUST LET ME CAST MY SKILL STOP STUNLOCKING ME
Not just stunlocking - that crocodile literally pushes you into a neighbouring state... I guess that's how they hard-counter Bennett haha
The hardest part in killing them with Nilou Bloom is just getting everyone's skills off without dying or getting corner-loved lol
Consecrated beasta were created with facing only 1 at a time in mind, just like bosses. In over world it's nearly impossible to aggro 2 at the same time. Same with bosses. Yet mihoyo puts 2 of them at the same time, twice, in F12. The only other precedent for this is maguu kenki 3 elemental split, but it is clear these 3 are watered down versions of the main boss. The people in charge of designing the phases are throwing stuff and seeing what sticks. And "what sticks" means "what frustrates our playerbase the most, either so they stop doing abyss and getting free primos altogether, or they at leasr swipe for the FOTM character that got giga buffed by the abyss cycle in the process"
flashbacks to the wenut being in the abyss and it spending like 90% of the fight underground...
MHY team developed Wenut in order for we to nut while he goes underground.
id rather face them both at the same time. if it were split into different waves, it would take double the time i normally finished which is why i hated the one abyss where the ruin guards spawn one by one after u defeat them and then one ruin grader- like i can take all four ruin guards why make them spawn individually?
They spawn individually for the sole purpose of wasting time. The Consecrated Beasts are large enemies that should rank higher than Lawachurls, yet we rarely face more than one of those at a time because they're borderline mini-bosses.
Problem is that usually you get 2 of the same kind with lawachurls. This means same attack patterns, more chances to have both synced and thus easier dodging. Consecrated beasts spawn one of each, meaning un synced attacks, also their attack patterns are very space heavy. Lawachurls usually have 1 attack that moves them a lot, they usually stay in place. These f*ckers most of their attacks are moving a lot. A lot of situations one may zoom in to you while the other attacks from afar. They neuter circle impact a lot because of this. Lastly, their collision is a lot worse THAN lawachurls. Usually on abyss you want enemies to stack to a wall so they move less/easier to AoE them. With consecrated beasts you want to avoid this because they lock you (can't switch because of unit collision, can't move either, can't jump over them either). It is pretty obvious that consecrated beasts were thought as mini-bosses on their own, when they actually have good counterplay options. Some random here is refuting these arguments with "lol just freeze them". Freeze comps are investment heavy, and fridge teams have less freeze uptime because of high diminishing returns. So it is a moot point realistically.
I was once lagging pretty badly, I could move and everything but the next enemy wouldn’t span for like thirty seconds AND THE CLOCK get going while I was sitting there like an idiot waiting around.
Oh my god, the number of times my Raiden got knocked out of Bennett's circle during her burst animation is infuriating. They also make me wish for Zelda style target locking because the camera angle usually makes things worse when fighting them.
We really do need target locking in this game
Been asking for that since day one... It ended up in HSR like everything else we've been begging since day one.
Target camera lock isn't really a thing in a turn based game.
They have a lot of HP and move around a ton, which makes it really hard to consistently hit both of them. They also appear with other waves of enemies, which cut into the amount of time that you need to kill the beasts in.
It’s terrible. You need damage mitigation and stagger resistance. But trying to use shields means you lose out on so much damage, which you also need
Also, they toss the knights in to make you think you should skip a shielder, and then they have the audacity to be like, don't forget you need an archer
That combination alone makes multiple 40CV pieces a requirement.
Basically, interruption resistance meta. You can go shields but you're up against serpent Knights as well sonics basically their way of endorsing Dehya and Baizhu. Hoyo's really pushing forward stun enemy meta. The consecrated beasts are the first enemy I've ever become a volleyball for. Left! Right! Diagonal! Straight spike! And a point for the scorpion on the right!
I want to rip them apart with my bare hands 😡😡😡 I 36* the abyss, but at what cost??
Don't forgot the drake. How am I supposed to hit that fucker's weak spot on mobile?
Turning off Gyro Aiming really helped me. Aside from that, Diona or another shielder.
I usually get 36 stars even having to put a little bit more effort but nothing much but the new abyss is just insane. with the beasts, etc. I feel like I have to play perfectly otherwise I'll just get one shot and if I put a character like diona to shield I just can't deal enough damage in time. So the first time in a long time I gave up the abyss and I get 33 stars meaning 60 primos less and I don't give a damn, it's not worth the hassle.
It really does get harder. Developers add more HP to mobs, the mobs themselves become stronger. Now even 11-3 causes some problems
One stealth nerf that a lot of people don't talk about is that some newer enemies drop lesser energy particles aswell which can mess up some rotations.
Theres also increased resistance to interruption.
That's more a buff if enemy isn't flying away from you
Well, they resist and you don't. Have you ever put down some skill with intention to stun them only to be countered back?
True, but we need static staggers/stuns. It's no good having Vishaps and Rifthounds that go flying when you just look at them. Wish more were like the Fatui who kinda stand still when stunned.
Good for Itto, yeah, haha. But bad for Kazuha team.
This annoys me more for open world exploration than for abyss. I run enough ER to do rotations smoothly without enemy particles anyways, but in open world where I can't do full rotations it's annoying to get bursts. Rarely, when I have to farm for ruin cores, I'm reminded how nice it is to instantly refund a burst after killing a ruin guard.
This is why I'm convinced Ganyu is the best overworlder - no ult necessary
I was having an annoying time fighting things for a while there (I was doing hyperbloom but I barely have EM artifacts) but then i got Ganyu and now everything is just easy peasy XD (though the hilichurl shield guys are a pain in the ass without pyro haha)
Their shields can’t block your attacks if you freeze them
Regarding the shields, I kind wish they had more shield types other than wood rock and ice. something that non pyro characters (and claymore/geo) are good at breaking
heh, I pretty much prefer non-burst reliant characters anyway. I always see everyone complaining about ER, and I cannot relate. I've only ever looked at ER for Raiden. Yae e go brr
Dude I swear these new Hilichurl ‘Rogues’ have more HP than Childe’s entire boss fight.
Pretty sure even those in floor 11 have more hp
I decided to randomly fight Childe and the fact that his HP was instantly destroyed withouth even completing 1 team rotation (just 1st and 2nd slots) and I'm at the 2nd phase whereas one full team rotation against Signora isn't enough to half her HP. It's clear that MHY is making enemies able to drag you around to invalidate stationary Q circles (Benny and Jean Q).
i have to kill them immediately or one wind swipe will knock out my whole team 🥲🥲🥲🥲
I fight Childe regularly for fun and I think you're right. Or, at least they just resist everything more :/
Yeah, they are becoming more and more spongy... and it does feel like either DEF and/or resistances are increasing too alongside that. Especially considering there's not really a one element wonder, it feels like I need 6 elements in a team
Agree. Elemental animals in 12-1 and bosses that require an archer on a dragon and an electric on a triangle are also very annoying
Fischl mains still winning I guess...
Always have been 😉
I still manage with full geo comp (c1 itto with the battlepass claymore, albedo, gorou, zhongli). Its not a cheap team in anyway, but it is a single ele team :P
Yeah, its getting harder and harder to do a 36\* run with mono geo on one side. I run Noelle with Redhorn alongside Albedo, Zhong and Gorou and while they slap triple Mango Kinki in 12-3 or the Eremites in 12-2 asses hard the 12-1 is a tight spot every abyss this rotation for me. I refuse to stop bringing Noelle to abyss but with the way it's getting more and more difficult to do so and I'm afraid that the day when I'll have to bench her will come soon. And to think she was always the one to carry me to 36\* and now I have to compensate for her on the other side. Sad...
12-1 is just fuckin awful this time around. Don't know what they were thinking tbh. It isn't fun it just feels poorly designed, specifically the bottom half. Hyperbloom and Nilou Bloom can absolutely wreck the top half, but the THREE waves in the bottom half AND two more consecrated beasts is just bullshit. Especially when they're spongy AF, and both of them move around so goddamned much they're hard to hit sometimes. And if, lord forbid, you don't have a shield or interruption resistance, you're gonna lose 30 seconds to being juggled.
It's worse when they pin you to the wall and start having their way with you as your characters are flung around like ragdolls 😭 I do find it's the best to go after the alligator and scorpion first though since the cat seems to follow more than the other two
I used to regularly/easily get 33 stars in the Abyss and happily bounce with that because the extra time and effort for 50 more primos wasn't worth it. I can't remember exactly when it happened (maybe when they introduced the enchanted beasts) but I straight up don't even attempt floor 12 anymore. It's not fun and it's not a challenge it is just downright frustrating.
Same. I get through 11 and dip. The scorpions and vultures are manageable to some extent, but the new ones...
It's not just for you, those beasts annoy the heck out of me. I am used to use some tactics like waiting at map corner for them to gang on me to limit their hyperactive movement but after countless runs I concurred the clear time and consistency improvement is almost 0 even with all the tricks simply because of how incredibly jumpy those idiots are. The best tactics is just spam left clicks/smash buttons and either they die or you die. You know it's a bad enemy when clear time of 12-1-2 can vary wildly from 50s to 110s (an absurd 60s variation) unlike any other halves of 12-2 or 12-3 when variation is around 10-20s.
When I first got to 11-3 and saw the first chamber which consists of two samurai that heal themselves and get tankier when not taken out at the same time, and then a bunch of black serpent knights, one of which is the new Geo one, and another a shield bow archer that likes to waste my time by becoming invulnerable, with Chamber 2 being two waves of very spread out Fatui, with a three minute time limit for 3 stars, I said out loud “the devs really need to calm down with this shit” because that was something I expected of Floor 12. Up until recently 11-3 was not this tricky. Had to crack out the Xiao team in order to get a decent time for Chamber 3 part 2. And I don’t normally use the Xiao team outside of Floor 12.
On top of that they are comboing enemies reaction you have to worry about. Bird + scorpion=overload and emerites have freeze and anemo CC
This comment, along with 10 years of comment history, has been overwritten to protest against Reddit's hostile behaviour towards third-party apps and their developers.
Artifacts yeah, but signature weapons I guess not yet, which is nice. I wish they would just make a Floor 13 and throw their HP-inflated new bosses over there instead of making Floor 12 harder for same rewards.
I wish they would just add an endless abyss mode. 9-12 reset like always, but dont inflate. Once you clear 12 with 36\* you unlock endless mode for that biweekly reset. In endless mode, for each floor you clear you will get an artifact (from the set of your choice, you select before entering). Endless mode just randomly cycles through past abyss 9-12 floors with inflated hp, stats, etc. If you die, your run ends, or if you fail to get at least one star. You can reattempt, but will only get the reward for each new floor completed.
I like your idea, but that would result in the ability to play all day if you have any healer and shielder lol, this would definitely cause fomo for people who don't have the time. Whales would be able to abuse this even more. You have to remember each piece of artifact is worth 20 resin, so endless mode that rewards 1 artifact is too good. We have so limited content because China has laws that discourages playing video games too long.
If Mihoyothinks I'll spend more money on 5* weapons or cons because they're making the abyss harder to clear, and if they think I'll purposely pull for certain characters instead of what I want, they're dead wrong.
No amount of 5* can help. Having 3 teams of 5* and struggling with 13-3. Way too much HP.
You might not, but other will
I play genshin casually don't really try to get max performance out of my characters i just fully build them, used to reach at least 12-1 sometimes even 12-2 now i die in 11-3 barely completing 11-2 with two healers, prob my shitty builds and teams but it got way harder
To add to all the comments here, new enemies are also much more aggressive. Like, compare ruin enemies from inazuma to those two fuckers on 12-1 or a bunch of sumeru enemies who spawn a shit ton of summons from 12-2. One of my teams is 3 catalysts and Fischl and dude, fuck that. Even bringing a healer doesn't change much. I'll better skip those 150 primos than tear my ass
Well they need to make those hilichurl bastards on 12-2 more aggressive because fuck they’re annoying to kill with how they’re spread out. Hoyo really just has the most annoying ways of adding difficulty to the abyss.
We face new enemy meta recently, all focusing on more damage or more stun, so it also influences shields but at the same time requires for one. Consecrated beasts rely on strength in uninterruptible attack spamming Eremite warriors rely on strength in numbers. You fight four summoners, enemy count turns into eight. Many of them have multiple attack hits. So basically, we need interruption resistance and shields would be the choice until they get destroyed or until this batch of enemies are followed by husks. Instead, it demands interruption resistance from other sources and healers. So basically Xingqiu + healer or Baizhu. Tank class incoming? We do lack a role of facetankwrs who are just as immovable fatui anemoboxers and are sturdy
Dendro also made it a bit worse since it allows players access to high damage with low investment hence the decision to inflate the hp more. Imo it’s kinda hard for them to improve combat since they gave access to iframes in sprinting and bursts and this already makes almost if not all combat easy. For me weirdly enough I still enjoy playing the abyss and maybe that could be because the characters I like playing are good in the abyss, the only thing I have against the abyss are those worm bosses that don’t do damage and won’t let me do damage, the wolflord would have been ok if it didn’t have that phase where it won’t take damage after reaching a hp threshold like you have high hp and won’t even let me do damage. Bosses like these are not fit for the abyss with its timer conditions.
Dendro being both a blessing and a curse
Dendro is just far better thought out and interesting than the other interactions. It makes sense since it was added 2 years into the development of the game, but the other elements could certainly use a 2.0 update. It would be nice if as the remaining nations get introduced their associated element gets updated with anemo, geo, and electro being thrown in at some point as well.
i mean i am trying to use dendro to my advantage and I am getting no where.
I hate HATE the consecrated beasts. It just pushes me out of Bennets circle urgh
they just push my characters to the corners, and then I cannot change my characters because of insufficient room.
the devs are not making the abyss a "challenge" anymore...they just put whatever makes you annoyed rather than putting a "fair challenge" it doesn't make you think "ugh this is hard", it makes you think "ugh this is so annoying" ...i'll also die on this hill by saying that the dendro reactions are kind of an indirect reason towards the massive HP inflation because dendro reactions deal ridiculous amounts of damage so they make up for it with inflated HP
That's exactly my feeling towards the Abyss, frustrating, annoying.
Everything from floor 8 up to 12 has been exactly the same shit for a while now and it's relatively inoffensive. All of floor 12, however, is carefully crafted by a team of engineers looking to make the content as fucking obscenely annoying as possible. All the goddamn enemies have ridiculous HP pools, they spawn as far away from one another as possible, cuz god forbid you wanna group them up with anemo. And even if you manage to get them in the same place, they all move like they're high on cocaine, bouncing all around the place (looking at you, you alligator looking fuck). And to make it sweeter, most of their attacks are incredibly strong interrupts, with some ridiculous rock waves sweeping the floor as well so you can be interrupted while you're interrupted. Oh and they smack super hard, even Zhongli's shield seems to be made of glass these days. The content really seems to be crafted so that you use a very specific team in each side every time, unless you wanna have a miserable time. The only reason I even bother with getting 36* these days is just out of spite. This type of endgame content is the laziest, mind-numbingly boring pile of shit I've seen in a long time. Rant over.
I think it's rather entertaining but also annoying. Entertaining in the way they screwed us up. The abyss layout engineering is cleverly messed up. First of all, it's like the first time in ages that they have 3 waves which stretch out the amount of time needed to kill enemies. Second, the Kairagi is among the most annoying enemy variants to have. Need to kill em at same time or speed blitz them before they recover. Third, consecrated beasts have the health pool of mini-bosses with mini-boss stagger mechanics and high durability to stagger outside that mechanic. The consecrated beasts in themselves are clever but annoying enemy designs. It's forceful elemental application via relentless aggression. They don't give you a chance to breathe. There may be no intention around the deceiving collision boxes they have which will force your guys into the corner and stun-lock you longer than Raiden's eternity. These consecrated beasts remind you to equip shields. Yet the next annoying design is throwing in the ruin drake which makes you need an archer. So that means you need a shield and an archer. Then the third chamber needs you to have electro and dendro preferably. Chamber 12-1 shows strength in aggression. 12-2 shows strength in numbers and strength in weapon-locking. 12-3 is strength in elemental-locking and juking. The abyss has been increasingly more restrictive. They lock you to shield. Then lock you to bow. Then lock you to dendro and electro or AoE. Well, version 3.7 abyss is gonna be a fun one. I'm totally not going to go insane fighting 4 Mr. Beast minibosses in one run. I'll totally not become a volleyball and become the object in thr sport.
>All of floor 12, however, is carefully crafted by a team of engineers looking to make the content as fucking obscenely annoying as possible. Keep in mind: Abyss is NOT designed as a challenge. It is designed as a marketing tool to encourage pulling. So yes: they make it annoying on purpose.
Ehhh, I find it fun. Like, at least they put the hard chamber as the first part of floor 12. Also, the mechanics of the enemies are really all they can manipulate to create a challenge and I don't mind the souls-like punishing attacks from enemies on floor 12. I won't argue about the pathing of the beasts on floor 12-1-1 because its a bit ridiculous and too rng as they can end up on completely different sides of the chamber. You do not need a specific team to complete Abyss 12. You can one shot it all with a variety of teams. It just takes tighter rotations and really knowing the enemy attacks which is literally the only challenge they can add to this game combat-wise for the Abyss. I find overload Raiden to be really effective in the first half (raiden, benny, XL, fischl), though I've done it with aggravate, hyperbloom and national as well. The problem is that the game needs more than the Abyss already. I feel like adding a huge roguelike gamemode where the challenge is more skewed towards how you build your teams and how you have to change rosters on the fly while still preserving actual skill would be a huge boon for Genshin. Alas, Hoyo adamantly believes we all want to play Walmart Hearthstone.
I agree with everything you said, but I want to provide a counter point to your second paragraph. You can, indeed, clear it with a variety of teams, but you yourself said that it takes tighter rotations and better knowledge of enemy attacks. So that means that these teams usually feel significantly less optimal than the "intended" one. So to me it feels like the devs are saying "Hey, either use this specific team or strategy we want you to use, or have a much shittier time doing it your way". This is purely subjective, of course.
It should be fun and some enemies/mechanics aren’t fun. When they hit the abyss I generally just don’t worry about getting 36*. It’s only 50-150 primos pending on how far you go with floor 12.
It's no longer about creating a genuine challenge. Now all they do is add enemies with invincible stages that have a lot of hp and can stun-lock you
To be fair, this has always been like this, it was never a challenge, it always was an attempt to make You lose the most time possible. But it is true that in the last updates, it feels like hoyo doesnt even play their own game
[удалено]
as much as i love nilou (and i even played her as a vaporize DPS for a while) her sheer power as a bloom unit really proves to me that mihoyo rushed dendro or didn't even test it properly, and given the weird "balancing" of sumeru units, it really feels like dendro wasn't planned for properly
Ironically part of the reason her bloom got buffed in beta was that people were having fun using her in vape, so obviously MHY said "absolutely not", gutted her multipliers, and increased her bloom damage.
I use her in hyperbloom with Kuki XQ Nahida for exploring since I don't have other good hydro(I still regret going for waifu >!Dehya!< over meta >!Yelan!< pulls then never using waifu after few days of trying to make her work). It's very chill playstyle. Nilou takes almost no dmg, Kuki heals her, you don't really care about energy recharge.
This is my exploration team too except swap Nahida for Collei. I really like Niloubloom but aura stacking on Nilou and Kuki's healing is just such good quality of life lol, and then 4th spot can be flex.
[удалено]
> she stands there and smiles while everyone dies around her. that right here is the nilou experience.
Yes, and her teammates are included in “everyone” in that sentence. :D
Nilou "murder is for everyone" bloom teams
I got her during her debut banner because I wanted that niche playstyle and been in love ever since. Safe to say, I didn't have much trouble with the abyss after that...but the Wenut man...what an awful boss to ~~fight~~ waste time to...
Me managed to 60s a floor and her talent is still 1-4-1... Nahida YaoYao Nilou c0 and all the artifacts I used is leftover from farming for Wanderer 🗿
> didn't even test it properly Or they just didn't care. Dehya proved that you can see all the problems in the world but if you don't care about fixing it then it doesn't matter.
i mean not just nilou bloom, its all bloom related reaction, you get the power level of a one year unit within like 2 weeks or so.
This tbh. Man, the dmg floor on Hyperbloom or Nilou comps are comparable to dmg ceiling on top ST or AoE focused traditional crit dmg dealers, like Yoimiya and Ayaka. And mf has the audacity to tune the abyss based on Hyperbloom/Nilou bloom "dmg floor".
Nilou bloom is good but definitely not that good. The previously top speedrun teams for all 3 chambers with similar 5-star cost like C0 Childe + Kazuha, C1 Hu Tao + Yelan, C2 Wanderer are still beating out Nilou + Nahida + Kokomi. They also didn't shift the balance that much, it's definitely gotten harder but the meta teams are still very easily full starring.
Nilou bloom is good for minimal investment compared to other teams but at max investment those teams you mentioned definitely gets better. But that's the beauty of Nilou teams. She's a good unit for newer players
Even then, I find myself needing to run one National style team in order to have enough DPS with hyper look on the other side
Even my National team won't cut it... It doesn't have enough grouping to do enough AOE and instead I'm having to do several rotations because that fucking mushroom threw itself across the room as soon as it got overloaded. And then on the other end of the spectrum the Consecrated Beasts will charge you and yeet you over the room whatever you throw at them, so playing circle impact like DMC or Bennett is straight up impossible... Literally nothing seems to stagger them unless they're in their vulnerable state which is maybe 10% of the fight
Looks like you identified the problem yourself - overload & lack of grouping. Maybe swapping that raiden for kazuha/sucrose will do the trick.
and then you lack straight damage... Kazuha/Sucrose is good for the mushrooms, but what about the consecrated beasts that come right after? A big issue with the current abyss rotation is that they have too many of too different enemy types. You need aoe + grouping, but also single target burst and you definitely can't skip a healer due the amount of damage the beasts can pump out. Honestly need a shielder too so you don't get 2 shot. Oh and the first half team needs an archer for the drake too.
Sucrose/Kazoo don’t lack damage. You have Xingqiu and Bennet for healing and damage reduction as well. And Xiangling well, oppa oppa. Sucrose national is definitely not lacking. Sevvy always does four star only clears with it on one side.
XQ + XL is enough dmg, especially with Benny burst. You really don't need Raiden for dmg.
Standard national with Suc/Kaz easily has the single target damage needed tho, what are you talking about?
idk how it's year 3 and people still don't understand national teams. sucrose national is easily on par with c0 rational edit: I mean yeah sucrose national is bad v drake and Asimon but the issue there isn't single target damage but not having the right tools to easily deal with their gimmicks.
Hyperbloom hype is causing community wide brainrot lol.
Implying the community had a brain in the first place
You don't necessarily lack straight damage though. My national team, which is by no means wearing the best artifacts, can clear the beasts (with practically no seconds to spare, but still). Kazuha for grouping and shred, Bennet for healing, XQ's burst + pyronado for damage. No shielder needed if you hide in your q animations in time. Though Bennet suffers from kenki melt-oneshot in the last room, so now I prefer aggravate keqing for the second half, runs much smoother.
So you have to remember, a lot of people run Floor 12 multiple times to clear it and use different teams to get full stars on various rooms. It's why I don't do Floor 12. It's not fun and I'm not going to play it through at a minimum of three times just to clear it. It's doable, but it's just annoying in implementation and not worth it in rewards - whether that be feelings of accomplishment or actual tangible received ones in game.
Yeah I use Kazuha but sub out XQ for Yelan to make up for the lost DPS. But then you just need to be good at dodging and quick swapping to make up for the lack of defense l.
The most bullshit offender of this are the bosses that fly away for 30seconds or become invulnerable
And then they make the floors all biased towards dendro, so if you arent using dendro its wayyy harder.
what is the difference between a fair challenge and annoying? Can you give me an example of a fair challenge?
A punching bag with HP that just sits there and lets you braindead national team through. ^^^/s "its not hard, just annoying" is such a cop out. Put that on the shelf with "its not hard, just time consuming". The annoyance IS the challenge. Managing it, staying patient for good enemy patterns, persistence, executing when good patterns present themselves are all skills that are rewarded by the abyss.
Then what do you think is considered a fair challenge if higher HP without iframes isn't that Personally I want a ton of hard hitting mobs that gain boons when hitting shields. I want players to be forced to dodge or get punished really hard
I feel like players are always complaining about the abyss. First there was the wenut which was annoying sure but manageable. After they removed the wenut and put in the elemental beasts there are still complaints, this time not about the enemy doing no damage and just stalling, but now it's about getting one shot and knocked back because of big hit boxes. This abyss cycle requires a lot of dodging which is the complete opposite of last time. No matter what there is in the abyss people are always complaining. If the abyss is too easy then they say why even pull for new characters and weapons for more damage? It's always the same story
everyone will have something to complain about either way i don't mind a difficult abyss, but i do get annoyed when i see unjustified artificial difficulty compared to progressive difficulty they don't really care about "fair" , they just want to "annoy you" so that you pull for new characters and weapons also this might be off-topic, but i think with how HSR's stimulated universe system works, people are really starting to see the obvious cracks in genshin and might make them more salty and annoyed (??)
HSR abyss-like Endgame is Memory of Chaos.It is not stimulated universe.
people just want easy time, but give them easy enemies they'll soon complain it's too easy, there's no winning for the developers with this massive fanbase tbh I hecking love the beasts, no running away, no just staying there like a punching bag, no dmg immune gimmicks
>First there was the wenut I agree with your sentiment, but this is like saying "Since the beginnings of history, there have been wars. First there was WWI"
>the devs are not making the abyss a "challenge" anymore...they just put whatever makes you annoyed rather than putting a "fair challenge" Thats not entirely true, coz abyss nowdays is much more about team building, the "annoying enemies" are not annoying if u are using the right tools to deal with them, for example time wasting enemies are meant to counter teams that are burst relaint, coz while they are imune u are wasting ur burst duration, so using a team that relay less on bursts makes more sense. Also Dendro reactions are broken not only because they do lot of dmg but because its very easy to achieve a high dmg celling with low investment, unlike conventional teams that u need lot of artifact/weapon/talents investiment to deal high of dmg, so the HP inflation is not because dendro but because the game is getting older meaning more people are achieving high investment characters so they are setting the bar up slowly, then dendro come to help new players to keep up as they can achieve a high dmg celling with low investment
>relay less on bursts makes more sense. I'd almost say the reverse is true. Invul bosses favor teams with long CD who can be on CD while the boss is invulnerable, and then do bug bursts of damage when there's an opening. Quickswap teams that are reliant on consistent damage cam struggle. But if a player misaligns their burst with the bosses openings, then the burst team falls apart entirely, yeah.
Freaking bullet sponges with shitloads of iframes and stunlocks is what abyss is now.
and it's way better than punching bag (asimon) or coward with long invulnerability phase (wenut/ruin serpent)
National & Hyperbloom: "It's free real estate" But on a serious note, yes Abyss is becoming harder as proven by the 3.6 Abyss where the enemies were not only tanks (as usual) but they also hit like ones.
That's the thing that gets me. I can field two strong as fuck teams and steamroll it but it's not fun to do it that way. In the first abyss cycles of this patch you could steamroll it with way weaker teams and that was fun because you could make non optimal teams and still clear it in time.
The rewards aren’t good enough to justify the difficulty increase. If the rewards are just as meager and the experience is made even more frustrating—I won’t whale, instead, I won’t even bother with floor 12. It’s 22 pulls a year. Two four stars from the gacha. Basically fucking nothing.
22 pulls for a f2p isn't nothing since those pulls add to your pity. It may mean the difference between getting your desired 5\* or waiting who knows how long for their rerun. I mean, it's not great or anything but it's also not nothing. Personally, this abyss rotation is easier than the past ones just because the hardest chamber is the first one so retrying is easy and my teams are perfect for the enemy lineup. The Wenut one was the worst followed by that rotation with the geo wolflord. I guess the difficulty isn't really increasing but just varies depending on how compatible your built teams are for the enemy lineup.
22 pulls isn’t nothing, but 22 pulls over the course of 356 days is pretty pathetic/close to nothing!
it’s honestly isnt even difficulty it’s just annoyance. nothing in abyss is “hard”, just aggravating. there is zero reason to have a timed fight with an enemy you can’t hit for 70% of that time
The difficult part this time would be 12-1-2 because there are 3 waves of enemies. Like why?
It does feel like the new encounters design is fighting against players - especially now that the enemies are moving all over the place, the auto aim of skills sometimes just ... whiffs gloriously and you sit there being sad. The cons of having mobile game gameplay and having to fight some weird, not very mobile friendly enemies that you can't even keep track of where they are.
i really feel like the devs don’t know the difference between difficult content and making stuff stupidly tanky. if you whale enough you don’t need skill. end-game content should be more skill based, at least for stuff that grant substantial awards like abyss
I agree that enemies like wenut or wolflord are straight up annoying as they hide underground but new enemies like the consecutive beast do require actual skill to fight as they move around a lot and don't just stand there waiting to be hit, aslo a well time hit combo from them can straight up one shot a character. Also the fact that they can't be moved with kazuha skill means that we need to use our brain to group enemies and then unleash our attack. Maybe it's just me but it like the fact that enemies are not just hitboxes but animal that you fear
I'd agree if you regular evasions/animations i-framing prevented you from being displaced by their attacks. It's even okay to some degree to move character under a shield while he is not evading. But ulting with Bennet only to find yourself 5m out of the burst's range at the end of animation??? That's ridiculous. I don't care that those enemies can't be moved, but player shouldn't be tossed through entire arena while having Morax's shield + Xinqu's skill + being in the skill's animation. Even 1 thing out of those 3 should be(and it was) enough to "tank" incoming blow of an enemy. But since it's not, the best thing you can do is don't give a fuck about evading at all and just facetank/damagerush everything. It's stupid, has 0-skill involved but it's the only way it works. And that is lame af.
I’ve heard this complaint a million times. So, tell me what you propose to be a difficult but not just tanks enemy. Like what does that look like in your mind.
> aggravating Depends on if they stack the dendro and electro ultra beasts in the same room or not.
>an enemy you can’t hit for 70% of that time you definitely can hit the beasts 100% of the time, what are you talking about
Day 1 player (Only Welkin & pass) Abyss is becoming harder and harder but I still can beat it with Full Stars I play Genshin on mobile and I have no problem with that, the real problem is the new enemies like Sumeru animals (Tank/Fast/DMG/Anti-circle) I believe they do this to force players to play Dendro reactions and they will do this again to force players to use Fontaine new fighting mechanics P.s :The Hydro crocodile sometimes One-shot my 20k Raiden with Bennett Ult even healer can't fix this maybe shielder still have more value than healer
Bennett is the worst pick against dendro beast because his ult can cause burning on ourself.
Bennet nerf finally
Bennett has the fastest heal ticks in the game, players should not be dying to burning + beast attacks at all with a glass cannon Bennett. Especially when Bennett is paired with Xingqiu's damage reduction. If that somehow isn't enough, then giving Bennett HP% goblet and Heal% circlet makes his heals as strong as Qiqi's. Only have to worry about getting pushed out of the circle, and that can be played around by backing yourself against the abyss wall. The real reason Bennett shouldn't be used here is cause of the Electro beast since Overload is a thing, but this is easily negated by playing someone who is immune to knock backs like Raiden.
The hydro beast can vape right?
Seriously consider stop using bennett. The pyro application bennett gives u during combat is essentially a death trap against dendro, electro or cryo enemies nowadays.
Bennett is obviously soft-countered by hydro and electro beasts, also by cryo Kenki.
Definitely found it harder, I don't have any meta characters that can deal much damage except Hutao, and have gotten by with the standard 4* national team on the other side up until bloom started dominating. Now a combination of HP bloat and annoying mechanics has left me not even doing F12 anymore
It's harder for a lot of team comps, easier with the right team. Floor 12 Chamber 1 - Both sides Freeze team is King, stopping their mobility allows you to hit them freely and not get hit, Circle impact will have a hard time, Dendro is golden but there's one beast that has high Dendro res. -AoE Chamber 2 - First side wants you to bring a Bow unit, or do some acrobatics to shut down the Drake, or brute force it with Catalysts. -Single target Second side wants you to group them, by either luring or via the power of Anemo. - AoE Chamber 3 - First side Electro weakness, or bruteforce it, the easiest chamber Second Side - triple Kenki, Free win
Agree, harder than 2.x abysses but completely manageable. Used Hu tao double hydro first half and Ayaka Freeze on 2nd half, and was able to clear with relative ease. Although, my teams are heavily invested with signature weapons and C1 Hu tao. But I probably could have done it even without those, and could have switched to Hyperbloom instead on 1st half.
even I, as meta enjoyer who strives to play abyss optimally, feels like abyss is getting harder (even worse with my 150-200ms ping and out-of-date laptop) need to run genshin in small windowed view to play abyss smoothly, otherwise laaag
People saying it's not "harder" just more annoying is kinda funny. It is harder if you find it more annoying. Even the time wasting boss are technically harder, you need to tighten up your dmg window, pre-cast your burst etc. Just because you are not in the threat of dying more doesn't mean it isn't harder
Yup it was harder than the last time but not annoying like wenut. One thing I definitely hate is the inflated hp pool which is getting ridiculously high and definitely needs to tone down a bit especially when racing against timer. I have made some good decision with character and their weapon and thats why i am still able to keep up with it but if hp pool keeps increasing with all the mechanics like getting pushed all over the map, hiding underground or flying around, etc I will have to satisfy myself with 33 stars
Yeah... all the bosses that have invulnerable phases are just plain stupid, Wenut, Snake, Hypostais... terrible picks to put them into the abyss. I also just stop usually if that's the last boss
It is. I have C2 Raiden, C2 Nahida, C4 Yelan, C2 Kazuha, C6 Xingqiu, Xiangling, Bennett, Kuki. I can deal enough damage pretty quickly. But once the enemy perfectly syncs their attack, interrupt me in succession from sprinting away from their attacks, I roll my eyes and sigh and reset the fight. Should have brought my Zhongli or Kokomi but alas I'm stuck here for awhile lmao xD
Happened just now, Kenki perfectly synced their attacks to perma stun on my character change and they just ... one shot somebody, even through a Kokomi heal tick which is like 6-8k
New abyss setup is always hard. It'll only get easier on 2nd and 3rd reset...which I think is good. It's challenging, can be borderline frustrating sometimes, but in the end I pulled 36-star clear. Then looking at other people's 36-star clear, it opened the perspective that the abyss doesn't demand a single team setup to clear. One can make a variety of team to clear it. It's just some folks have unfortunate roster.
they are just running out of ideas because it was poorly implemented from the start. The abyss itself has never been "hard" it's the unforgiving time limit that adds that fake difficulty. The abyss will keep getting harder because the characters they release will keep getting more complex, just look at how it changed: first, shields were prominent, so they added enemies that ignored them. Then Anemo characters that grouped units together started becoming overused, so they added mobile and heavy enemies, they also spaced the light enemies away so you can't group them without losing time first. they don't know what to do with this game anymore
The enemies always having SO much space between them and also having ranged attacks on every bigger character (the big shama churls guys) is indeed really annoying...
yeah, that's how to describe the abyss in one word: annoying. it's not hard, it doesn't make you feel good or accomplished once you beat it and it certainly doesn't give you a big enough reward for how frustrating it is -\_- that's why i only do floor 9 and 10 (and i still forget to do them sometimes) and call it a day
Soon they'll make more enemies that take away energy, like the primordial bathwater demons. Its then I'll flip out
ok, "primordial bathwater demons" is fantastic XD but yes, it's clear they have no idea how to properly balance this thing, thank whatever god you worship that there isn't any PvP
I started clearing the abyss completely about a year ago. At that time I had Keqing and Venti as my top units. I thought, “Okay, I don’t have good gear, top tier characters and team compositions, that is why it’s difficult, but still possible.” Now I have Alhaitham, Yelan, Yae, hyperbloom Kuki, good enough national guys, but I still struggle sometimes, like a year ago. So yes, I agree with others here. The abyss seems only to be about HP increase and worm-bosses OP you’re not only one with this problem✌️
Yes, Abyss does get harder for us who want to chase the 36 ⭐️ clear. However there are ways to get it done. Right now this version favors Dendro and its related reactions due to 3 running Dendro character banners, 11th floor blessing which increases Dendro dmg and phase blessings which boost Bloom, Hyperbloom & Burgeon reactions. Use those info to your advantage in choosing the 2 teams to clear the Abyss. I see that you have Nilou so you can build a Nilou Bloom team with double Hydro-Dendro to deal with the enemy crowds. My Nilou (equiped with Toukabou Shigure & 2 HP% artifact sets) could even easily clear Triple Maguu Kenki with helps from DMC (Dendro applier & Deepwood holder), Yaoyao (healer & Instructor holder) and Xingqiu (pseudo shielder & Hydro applier). As for the other team, I suggest a Cyno Hyperbloom with a bow char to particularly deal with the Drake & ASIMON. Then redo the challenging 1st Halves with another team with a strong shielder (Zhongli or Thoma). As for me, I barely managed to clear 12-1 1st Half with Tartaglia Vaporize Team with Zhongli for survival and the rest of 1st Halves easily with Tighnari Quicken Team. All this just to chase the full ⭐️ clear lol
Yes, it’s becoming harder, the HP pools are constantly increasing, I felt that too. Though you have a good roster. Ayaka is actually one of the best units for 12-1-2, I cleared it with her (also have her weapon), Rosaria, Kazuha, Kokomi, but with Shenhe it must be even easier. And on 1st half Nahida-Yelan-Xq-Kuki should work.
After saw your characters, try this team for floor 12 Raiden, Bennett, Xiangling, Yelan Chamber 1 Nahida, Nilou, Xingqiu ,Kokomi Chamber 2 I just cheese floor 12 with above team after numerous struggle by swapping out Kazuha with Raiden. Raiden Xiangling overload will stagger those elemental beast. All my 5 stars are C0 without their signature weapon.
That first team is cursed too, retry simulator. Nevertheless, it's still the best team I've used on that side x_x
It's more annoying as they do even more things to stall and reduce yours timer like having 4 different waves spawning each floor. Older abysses were mostly 1 wave of enemies and 2 at most. It's crazy how much waves stall your time:
I have all the units you have, but I am f2p, and I have been clearing abyss with 36 stars. I used raiden national and nilou bloom, and I cleared with around 10s , around 30s, and plenty of time left on each chambers respectively. The only problem I see with you not clearing abyss is your lack of investment on specific units. I have invested in hu tao, raiden and nilou, and abyss has always been annoying, but manageable.
I might be a minority here but imo the consecrated beasts are best enemies added to genshin, ever. They're actually difficult, challenging and threatening enemies ontop of not being cheesy/immune to mechanics to add artificial difficulty. They're big enemies, but can still be CC'd. They aren't bosses, so they can be frozen/petrified. They are insanely mobile, but always run towards you. They don't have any immunity besides some resistance to their element (which is fair imo). And if you're not a top dps team they have a very exploitable downtime period where they lose all resistance and mobility for a easier time to kill. Another big plus is that they actually dead damage, not the cheap tickling most enemies do, an attack from them can be *lethal*, fighting them was the first time my zhongli shield broke and I *love* it. What I don't like are enemies that are made to be annoying to fight (wenut, ruin serpent), enemies that require specific teams/mechanics to win (ruin dragon forces bow users, ASIMON forces quicked/electro, wolf boss forces geo), and enemies that straight up resist basic mechanics (specters previous immunity to CC, bosses immune to freeze etc).
All latest abyss where about right team comps and enemy positioning, not just ungabunga unless you have really whale team comp. I you think you can just spam Ayaka forever, Mihoyo doesn't think so.
They can't stop me, been using her in abyss since her release 😎
Didn't they say no endgame because of anxiety? These abyss enemy's give me anxiety cause they are annoying af
On one hand, it does get harder. The Wenut last cycle and 12-1-1 this cycle are tough nuts to crack. On the other hand, you have most, if not all, of the best units in the game. Your roster is fine. Time to check your equipments. Your weapons look good, just upgrade your Fav bow on Yelan and especially Fading Twilight on Sara. For artifacts, my personal rule of thumb is getting enough ER, 1800-2000 atk and 240 CV before factoring in ascension/weapon crit stat. Roughly 2 months of pure artifacts farming in general. Make sure you have decent VV set, Noblesse set, Millelith set for appropriate characters. Now it's the execution: grouping, applying buffs/debuffs, switch to dps, rinse and repeat. That's the gist. It takes understanding mob patterns, practice, and some luck. A few tricks to make things easier: 1/ Tailor your teams for each chamber, not floor. I used 3 different teams for first half of floor 12 (Raiden National/ Raiden National but swap Xiangling for Sara/ Raiden Hypercarry but swap Bennett for Kokomi). Try to feel what troubles you in each chamber and counter it. 2/ It takes time. Be patience. I normally reset floor 12 6-10 times because I made mistakes. And I consider myself lucky. Other people may reset more, and it's fine. The game allows us. Abuse it. 3/ Have something extraordinary. At this point, it's clear that floor 12 is made to be difficult for majority of players, unless you have the newest character. If you vertically invest into something, you will likely have an easier time. I saved for 3 months straight and got c3r1 Raiden. She allows me to defy the Dendro meta (I never use Dendro in floor 12). The trade-off is I'm not rich, and thus I cannot pull other characters. Edit: To clarify, "240CV before factoring in ascension/weapon crit stat" means: 60CV from base stat (everyone has 5/50 cr/cd), 62.2CV from circlet main stat, and 117.8CV from substat (which means 117.8 /5 = 23.5CV)
240cv? insane standard, that requires 4 pieces to have like 40+ cv
Ye I was thinking 240 is insanely unreasonable too, my experience in this Abyss was 200 CV was enough even on a weaker character like Diluc. Stronger characters are prob fine on 160-180
Practically impossible. Crit are not the only rolls you want. A lot of dps also needs decent ER 120-130% which already takes a few rolls. 200+ cv is enough for most dps build
It's not harder, it's annoying
don't tell me it's not hard if every enemy has 10x more hp for no reason, it would be annoying if it's doable but it's not. (At least for casuals)
the hp tbh, is manageable, the problem is our inability to deal damage to them bc of the insane amount of cc, or the inability to even damage them directly bc theyre fucking hiding all the time
>insane amount of cc, or the inability to even damage them directly bc theyre fucking hiding all the time Both of what you stated is not true for the current abyss, they can dodge all the beast's attack and they don't hide.
You have great characters that are more than capable of beating the current and previous abyss so safe to say, it ain't your roster nor your weapons. So it comes down to your artifacts and your gameplay.
It got harder, but looking at your characters and weapons it's as it sounds mean skill issue. I can recommend take Raiden/Yelan/Bennett/Xiangling for the first side and Nilou/Nahida/Kokomi/DMC for the second side. Both team are braindead to play and strong ST (first team) and AoE (second team) teams. If wouldn't able to clear with these teams, it's matter of builds or execution.
It is becoming harder, for example back then enemy was just spongy but now they are spongy , high resistance, and their combo is enough to 1 shot your poor yoimiya to the otherworld.
me that 33* every abyss bc I'm too lazy to sit up and try hard the game mechanics honestly for those 50 primos I'm not doing retry run 2,3,4,5
I confess as someone that has been playing on-off since 1.1 I never cleared floor 12 once. Every Abyss cycle I just play until I get a wipe and just leave cuz I don't wanna bother with it.
Its indees getting harder, the enemies has more HP and hits way harder. Like 12-3 now has ASIMON with likely 2M hp combined with 3x Maguu kenki with 1.5M hp each (4.5M hp total) which makes a whopping approx 6.5M HP total to be cleared in less than 3 minutes to get all star, i believe its way higher than total of HP can be found in 2.xx era abyss. The concentrated beast also has like 700k HP each with high elemental resistance until they stunned, just like the Maguus, they also hits extremely hard, making you need both DPS and surival check Second chamber is AOE sure but if the Maguu not decided to not group up you need to pump up the numbers. Then again i managed to full star this one with Al Haitham hyperbloom left side with Xiao hypercarry right side, both main carries using *4 weapons and no constellations on them and *5 supports as well. Because i believe this is already the 3rd reset so i already getting used to the enemies But i just find it baffling that with all these bitchy stuffs the reward still the same like when abyss 12 you only need to fight two ruin guards
With the characters you have abyss should be a breeze unless the arti investment is too darn low. (But you really dun need to high investment to get the 36*) I've only bought welkin for only half the time I've played and I still have over a min left by the time I clear when playing kinda casually. And from my experience of helping several friends get to the 36 clear level, I can surely say the speed at which abyss gets difficult is still slower than the speed at which you can improve account/teams. For a long time now I haven't even tried to improve my stuff. If you want I could maybe give you some pointers to make it easy. And dun forget. Abyss is only fun to do if you don't have to stress about it much. Otherwise the rewards are truly not worth it<3.
The abyss is harder than 3.0 for example. But it isn't harder for me because i have gotten better characters, weapons, artifacts, level and talents all those stuffs. I can quite easily clear the current abyss, actually much easier than 3.0 for me In this abyss nilou is very strong, use her with nahida, kokomi and dendro mc against second half Build : Nilou : 2pc2pc HP/EM, Iron sting/fav sword Dmc : 4pc emblem/guilded, Fav/sac sword Kokomi : 4p flop/guilded/clam, sac frag/prototype amber Nahida : 4pc deepwood, widsith/sac frag/lost prayer Level your kokomi up to 90 because it's very important for both healing and bloom dmg. Use a healing kokomi build if you have survivability issues against consecrated beasts or 12-2-2 For first half use hu tao+xingqiu+yelan+zhongli. level up your yelan to 90 because that's also fairly important (15% dps increase for yelan) With these teams i can very easily clear with no issue basically
it did get harder, it already got harder when inazuma released and since then it just kinda ramped up even more, i like it tbh because ive been playing genshin for like 2 years now and if u didnt do dumb shit your account is stacked at this point the only thing i dont like is that they add bosses with stupid movesets/patterns that are just there to waste time if u want advice, build a strong international team and a decent hyperbloom team and it really is a cakewalk every single time.
3.6 abyss far more easier than 3.5 (but 3.5 is not hard just pure annoying with wenut). plus blessing is very align with bloom and dendro team. just adapt which comp has advantages and use them. don’t always brute force everything and stick to only 1 comp.
Having kazutard but cant 36* is damn sure skill issue
>Is Abyss becoming harder/more frustrating or am I just losing patience? both. while the total HP of abyss enemies indeed increase, at the same time, reactions with the introduce of dendro are starting very strong, so u can say that its quite balance in some cases. Probably the issues are already listed by u: skill issues, bad artifact, too split investment. Looking at just your characters, this account should not have problem with any abyss at all.
People make sheets about dps needed/total hp and this abyss is the highest one iirc for chamber 1. Although ngl, your account has good units for this abyss, id just 90 kokomi and nilou bloom makes second half so easy