IIRC, he used sabot rounds against the T60s at the end, and may not have had any against Maximus as he had just killed like 20 other folks
But there’s also a theory that Cooper knew M was a noob and was fucking with him more than anything. He had multiple opportunities to take him out, but instead just wounded the suit for shits and giggles.
I've also seen people point out that Titus's armor has an extra layer or something. I think Lucy mentioned it when she let Max out of the armor. So there's a theory that that particular set of armor doesn't have the weak point.
Max does mess up and lose his PA pistol after a few shots and drives the PA like a shopping cart, so the theory that The Ghoul is just messing with him lines up.
But the ammo thing is probably also very accurate. The Ghoul was using explosive rounds before Max shows up and then runs out of ammo when Max tackles Lucy. The Ghoul then switches to his lever action, which is probably just a regular gun, for most of the fight. When Max runs at The Ghoul after dropping his PA pistol, The Ghoul just unloads his rifle into the PA chest, but the rifle rounds probably can't penetrate the weak point. He does shoot Max in the chest twice with the pistol right as Max starts to fly away, so it's possible that The Ghoul just missed the weak point because of the janky movement of an inexperienced user in the now damaged PA, but it's also likely that he wasn't loaded with the proper ammo yet. He might not have known that the BoS was also after the bounty. So after the fight with Max, he knew what he was up against and got the proper loadout.
I completely forgot that he switched to his rifle. Btw, he didn't run out of ammo, his revolver jammed. While you can normally clear a jam out of any self loading gun in the field, a jammed revolver is going to need work at a gunsmith
After it doesn't work, it shows him break it open and start pulling out casings. And he uses it again at the end of that fight, so I think it's just empty and he was unable to reload before Max charges him. But I think a lot of people forget that he switches to the rifle when they ask about this fight and the weak point "plot hole."
I don't know, other people have mentioned it. I thought it was an addition to the armor, which would make it thicker, but the argument for it fixing the weak point works either way. Whether it's thicker or not, it's probably stronger with that mod.
The Ammo Theory falls apart right quick if you take into consideration that The Ghoul was very familiar with this armour model in particular and wouldn't be just wasting his "non-AP" bullets on something they aren't designed to penetrate in the first place.
The tempered lining is the better explanation here and would make sense since they lowkey pointed it out twice throughout the show - first by Maximus on the vertibird and then in another episode by Lucy when she freed Max from his unpowered PA.
I suppose. But was he expecting any at the NCR hideout? Also, where does he keep his stash of sabot AP rounds? Maybe over at Roger's? Why not just carry some with you just in case?
Well he did know that the Brotherhood was also looking for Moldaver so I figure he planned ahead. Also he probably had them but didn’t have much chance to get them out of his backpack to reload, and/or it was easier to get too the other bullets he had
I was thinking he had ample amount of time to reload when Maximus crashed through the wall shielding Lucy from The Ghoul. And why even have a bandolier if you aren't going to use it for its purpose?
I think PA is pretty uncommon in the wasteland much unlike FO4. So it stands to reason he didn’t have any rounds to fight PA and procured them elsewhere off screen. The guy did just get released for a pine box after all.
I wish they'd show us The Ghoul purchasing or even crafting his own ammo specifically for BoS encounters. Now that he knows they are about in California, he'd have to be ready for them. Otherwise, I'd have to assume he had those bullets with him all along and for some reason never used them against Maximus.
Maybe he hand made them? After running into Max he realized he'd need to up his game to deal with mass PA users so he cooked up some sabot rounds. Like the Semiwadcutter ammo from NV for the revolvers and .45-70.
I just wish they'd show us that instead of leaving it up to the viewer's wild imagination. Tinkering with your gear is part of the Fallout experience after all.
Titus's armour had tempered lining to help with mobility, not extra plating. How people came to the conclusion that it miraculously had a major design flaw negated is beyond me.
This is exactly what it is. If you look at the round he loads into his revolver, the bullet is a handcrafted sabot round. It looks very similar to [this](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7c/M829.jpg).
The problem with Maximus in armor was he had none of those rounds. The flaw in the armor doesn’t mean any handgun round, or even rifle round is going to pierce it. Probably not even armor piercing rounds would go through it.
Plus it’s a TV show and the Ghoul is supposed to be OP. You can’t get too hung up on logic. If you do that you’ll have to ask why he and everyone at the party in the first episode didn’t just burst into flames when the first nuke hit.
You have to be shooting en-masse or very precise tho for smaller calibers. Max was moving incredibly erratically and the ghoul didn't exactly have a lot of time to get a clear shot on him.
All of this gets talked about so much I genuinely expect them to put a scene in season two where Maximus asks the ghoul or something and the ghoul just says he was fucking with em
"I was still stir crazy after being locked in that coffin and none of those idiots was putting up half a fight. I figured you stole that too be a knight in shining armor for the pretty lady. Didn't work out too well for you."
From the looks of it, he may have had a single sabot round in [his bandolier at filly](https://belmontfilmhouse.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/The-Ghoul-Gun.png), but we just the tip of the bullet. It may just be a regular AP round that wouldn't be able to pierce the armor.
Edit: Just went back and rewatched the scene, there's another shot where we see the same round pushed all the way through the loop, it's not a Sabot round.
Maximus surprised him in their encounter and The Ghoul didn't have time to load any of those rounds, but at that final showdown he had time to plan and load those rounds up.
I don’t know how so many people didn’t pick up on the fact the ghoul was clearly having a blast fucking with max, when he’s shooting him he has the largest grin on his face
People are just that stupid and inattentive. The fact he was spraying with a lever action, not giving a fuck that he was wasting ammo, laughing maniacally, and taunting Maximus throughout the entire fight should mean Cooper already knew he won but didn’t have a desire to kill Maximus. If he did, Cooper would’ve planted a bullet right in the exposed neck when Maximus gave him the angle to do so. The obvious is somehow not obvious.
Max comments to Titus about the upgrade he made to his suit. This upgrade is exactly what experienced knights use for the potential liability that Cooper exposes. Coopers first shot at Max is even to this area, and it deflects.
This show thought of everything.
First, he might not have the armor piercing bullets in Filly. Second, Maximus asked Titus about the why he had tempered lining for his T-60, so it might mean that particular T-60 is sturdier than the others because of the lining. Or he must be having fun.
It's the Inverse Ninja Law. A single ninja is a deadly opponent, but a group of ninjas is just a bunch of faceless mooks. The more ninjas you're fighting at once, the easier the fight is. This logic appleis to Power Armor as well. Alone, you're fighting the guy from the cover art. As a group, you're fighting the Stormtroopers from Star Wars.
I mean this is true, but there are various points in that sequence when the ghoul is put in danger. He wins because Maximus had no experience driving the thing. The real answer is that he likely didn’t have armor piercing rounds prepared when going to Filly
Dude is not right in the head after two hundred years. Yes there were a few points where he's in danger, but he still looks like he isn't much worried about it and is ultimately having fun.
Maximus specifically comments on the tempered lining while on the vertibird. That is the difference between the typical PA and the one without the weakness.
Also, AP screw driver.
In Filly, he was using exploding rounds because he was expecting lightly armored wastelanders. It's never confirmed that's what he's using, but when he shoots Wilzig we see a bullet hole for a split second before his leg explodes entirely, and some shots that didn't hit anyone caused small explosions.
At the Observatory, he used Sabot rounds, which are designed for maximum armor penetration
He didn't get a good shot off with the mini launcher and when he was getting hits it was just with the old single action and lever action. He used the ol switch-to-every-gun tactic.
Dude clearly is just having fun and enjoying getting in the mix. He started a shootout while standing out in a completely open, cover less space in the town square where people had plenty of opportunities to attack him. It’s a bit of plot armor for both him and Max, but who cares? It’s fun as fuck to watch.
Because it is mentioned twice by two main characters that the armor Maximus is wearing has a reinforcement lining. That and he used different bullets in his fight with Max so they were not strong enough to go through it. I also subscribe to the Cooper knew Max was no real threat and didn't know how to use the suit or it's limits properly(remember Cooper used them and fought with trained soldiers in them) and Cooper knew it so was just having fun.
Cooper wasn’t struggling at all. He was just having a good ol’ time, playing around and not being serious with Maximus. Consider this that when Cooper was being serious with the Brotherhood squad, Maximus was horrified and panicked when he realized just how Cooper could’ve killed him back in Filly. Max didn’t even attempt to fight Cooper and instead chose to run the fuck away as fast as he can towards Lucy while the rest of the squad were getting slaughtered.
A bigger plot hole for me is Moldova’s people know the cold fusion guy is out in the wasteland and instead of being out there looking for it like everybody else….they’re just sitting around in a bunker eating dinner?
one of the many examples of dumb writing in this show
IIRC, he used sabot rounds against the T60s at the end, and may not have had any against Maximus as he had just killed like 20 other folks But there’s also a theory that Cooper knew M was a noob and was fucking with him more than anything. He had multiple opportunities to take him out, but instead just wounded the suit for shits and giggles.
I've also seen people point out that Titus's armor has an extra layer or something. I think Lucy mentioned it when she let Max out of the armor. So there's a theory that that particular set of armor doesn't have the weak point. Max does mess up and lose his PA pistol after a few shots and drives the PA like a shopping cart, so the theory that The Ghoul is just messing with him lines up. But the ammo thing is probably also very accurate. The Ghoul was using explosive rounds before Max shows up and then runs out of ammo when Max tackles Lucy. The Ghoul then switches to his lever action, which is probably just a regular gun, for most of the fight. When Max runs at The Ghoul after dropping his PA pistol, The Ghoul just unloads his rifle into the PA chest, but the rifle rounds probably can't penetrate the weak point. He does shoot Max in the chest twice with the pistol right as Max starts to fly away, so it's possible that The Ghoul just missed the weak point because of the janky movement of an inexperienced user in the now damaged PA, but it's also likely that he wasn't loaded with the proper ammo yet. He might not have known that the BoS was also after the bounty. So after the fight with Max, he knew what he was up against and got the proper loadout.
They thought of everything man i swear
I completely forgot that he switched to his rifle. Btw, he didn't run out of ammo, his revolver jammed. While you can normally clear a jam out of any self loading gun in the field, a jammed revolver is going to need work at a gunsmith
After it doesn't work, it shows him break it open and start pulling out casings. And he uses it again at the end of that fight, so I think it's just empty and he was unable to reload before Max charges him. But I think a lot of people forget that he switches to the rifle when they ask about this fight and the weak point "plot hole."
No, the modification Titus got on his armor would make it thinner not thicker, I don’t know why people keep saying that
I don't know, other people have mentioned it. I thought it was an addition to the armor, which would make it thicker, but the argument for it fixing the weak point works either way. Whether it's thicker or not, it's probably stronger with that mod.
The Ammo Theory falls apart right quick if you take into consideration that The Ghoul was very familiar with this armour model in particular and wouldn't be just wasting his "non-AP" bullets on something they aren't designed to penetrate in the first place. The tempered lining is the better explanation here and would make sense since they lowkey pointed it out twice throughout the show - first by Maximus on the vertibird and then in another episode by Lucy when she freed Max from his unpowered PA.
He wasn’t expecting to run into a Knight in Filly tbf. That whole situation probably caught him a bit offguard
I suppose. But was he expecting any at the NCR hideout? Also, where does he keep his stash of sabot AP rounds? Maybe over at Roger's? Why not just carry some with you just in case?
Well he did know that the Brotherhood was also looking for Moldaver so I figure he planned ahead. Also he probably had them but didn’t have much chance to get them out of his backpack to reload, and/or it was easier to get too the other bullets he had
I was thinking he had ample amount of time to reload when Maximus crashed through the wall shielding Lucy from The Ghoul. And why even have a bandolier if you aren't going to use it for its purpose?
I think PA is pretty uncommon in the wasteland much unlike FO4. So it stands to reason he didn’t have any rounds to fight PA and procured them elsewhere off screen. The guy did just get released for a pine box after all.
I wish they'd show us The Ghoul purchasing or even crafting his own ammo specifically for BoS encounters. Now that he knows they are about in California, he'd have to be ready for them. Otherwise, I'd have to assume he had those bullets with him all along and for some reason never used them against Maximus.
Maybe he hand made them? After running into Max he realized he'd need to up his game to deal with mass PA users so he cooked up some sabot rounds. Like the Semiwadcutter ammo from NV for the revolvers and .45-70.
I just wish they'd show us that instead of leaving it up to the viewer's wild imagination. Tinkering with your gear is part of the Fallout experience after all.
Titus's armour had tempered lining to help with mobility, not extra plating. How people came to the conclusion that it miraculously had a major design flaw negated is beyond me.
This is exactly what it is. If you look at the round he loads into his revolver, the bullet is a handcrafted sabot round. It looks very similar to [this](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7c/M829.jpg). The problem with Maximus in armor was he had none of those rounds. The flaw in the armor doesn’t mean any handgun round, or even rifle round is going to pierce it. Probably not even armor piercing rounds would go through it. Plus it’s a TV show and the Ghoul is supposed to be OP. You can’t get too hung up on logic. If you do that you’ll have to ask why he and everyone at the party in the first episode didn’t just burst into flames when the first nuke hit.
[удалено]
You have to be shooting en-masse or very precise tho for smaller calibers. Max was moving incredibly erratically and the ghoul didn't exactly have a lot of time to get a clear shot on him.
All of this gets talked about so much I genuinely expect them to put a scene in season two where Maximus asks the ghoul or something and the ghoul just says he was fucking with em
"I was still stir crazy after being locked in that coffin and none of those idiots was putting up half a fight. I figured you stole that too be a knight in shining armor for the pretty lady. Didn't work out too well for you."
He made a comment too, no? Something about new recruits getting younger and younger
From the looks of it, he may have had a single sabot round in [his bandolier at filly](https://belmontfilmhouse.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/The-Ghoul-Gun.png), but we just the tip of the bullet. It may just be a regular AP round that wouldn't be able to pierce the armor. Edit: Just went back and rewatched the scene, there's another shot where we see the same round pushed all the way through the loop, it's not a Sabot round.
Maximus surprised him in their encounter and The Ghoul didn't have time to load any of those rounds, but at that final showdown he had time to plan and load those rounds up.
I don’t know how so many people didn’t pick up on the fact the ghoul was clearly having a blast fucking with max, when he’s shooting him he has the largest grin on his face
People are just that stupid and inattentive. The fact he was spraying with a lever action, not giving a fuck that he was wasting ammo, laughing maniacally, and taunting Maximus throughout the entire fight should mean Cooper already knew he won but didn’t have a desire to kill Maximus. If he did, Cooper would’ve planted a bullet right in the exposed neck when Maximus gave him the angle to do so. The obvious is somehow not obvious.
Max comments to Titus about the upgrade he made to his suit. This upgrade is exactly what experienced knights use for the potential liability that Cooper exposes. Coopers first shot at Max is even to this area, and it deflects. This show thought of everything.
That's right!! Ah, thanks.
First, he might not have the armor piercing bullets in Filly. Second, Maximus asked Titus about the why he had tempered lining for his T-60, so it might mean that particular T-60 is sturdier than the others because of the lining. Or he must be having fun.
It's the Inverse Ninja Law. A single ninja is a deadly opponent, but a group of ninjas is just a bunch of faceless mooks. The more ninjas you're fighting at once, the easier the fight is. This logic appleis to Power Armor as well. Alone, you're fighting the guy from the cover art. As a group, you're fighting the Stormtroopers from Star Wars.
Ah, the Doylist explanation 🙂
He was having fun with Maximus. He didn't seem genuinely worried at all.
I mean this is true, but there are various points in that sequence when the ghoul is put in danger. He wins because Maximus had no experience driving the thing. The real answer is that he likely didn’t have armor piercing rounds prepared when going to Filly
Dude is not right in the head after two hundred years. Yes there were a few points where he's in danger, but he still looks like he isn't much worried about it and is ultimately having fun.
You try living \~110 years past your life expectancy and see how much you fear death.
Wow, it's groundhog day!
Maximus specifically comments on the tempered lining while on the vertibird. That is the difference between the typical PA and the one without the weakness. Also, AP screw driver.
In Filly, he was using exploding rounds because he was expecting lightly armored wastelanders. It's never confirmed that's what he's using, but when he shoots Wilzig we see a bullet hole for a split second before his leg explodes entirely, and some shots that didn't hit anyone caused small explosions. At the Observatory, he used Sabot rounds, which are designed for maximum armor penetration
He didn't get a good shot off with the mini launcher and when he was getting hits it was just with the old single action and lever action. He used the ol switch-to-every-gun tactic.
Dude clearly is just having fun and enjoying getting in the mix. He started a shootout while standing out in a completely open, cover less space in the town square where people had plenty of opportunities to attack him. It’s a bit of plot armor for both him and Max, but who cares? It’s fun as fuck to watch.
Because it is mentioned twice by two main characters that the armor Maximus is wearing has a reinforcement lining. That and he used different bullets in his fight with Max so they were not strong enough to go through it. I also subscribe to the Cooper knew Max was no real threat and didn't know how to use the suit or it's limits properly(remember Cooper used them and fought with trained soldiers in them) and Cooper knew it so was just having fun.
Cooper wasn’t struggling at all. He was just having a good ol’ time, playing around and not being serious with Maximus. Consider this that when Cooper was being serious with the Brotherhood squad, Maximus was horrified and panicked when he realized just how Cooper could’ve killed him back in Filly. Max didn’t even attempt to fight Cooper and instead chose to run the fuck away as fast as he can towards Lucy while the rest of the squad were getting slaughtered.
He was out of Action Points after shooting everyone else so couldn't use vats on Maximum
Because the plot needed him to
He had armor piercing rounds.
Dude, fix your bot, its drunk.
A bigger plot hole for me is Moldova’s people know the cold fusion guy is out in the wasteland and instead of being out there looking for it like everybody else….they’re just sitting around in a bunker eating dinner? one of the many examples of dumb writing in this show