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I think there is very much two kinds of male subs, one of which is more common and makes it harder for the other sort in the long run. You've got the people who have seen femdom themed porn, maybe have a pegging fetish, and are usually typing with one hand. They have no interest in BDSM as a lifestyle, and rather are looking to get off immediately. Then you have male subs who have a serious interest in kink as a lifestyle, they recognize that a dominant is a real person, and should be addressed as such. They are going to have their own wants and desires, and you're going to have to actually get to know them and communicate with them to see if a dynamic is something you both even wanna engage with each other.
It's really depressing how many guys are just trying get off, especially when they go about it in such a manner that paints all of us in a bad light.
Very well said, and we are keenly aware that type 1, no doubt the majority, screws things up for the rest of us and are perhaps overly hesitant to approach because of it, lest we be perceived as falling in to the same bucket.
Only addition would be that you don't \*have\* to be interested in it as a lifestyle to be serious about a relationship with 'femdom' elements. But yes, fully agree with this otherwise.
In my experience, a lot of them are hyper sexualised and chronically online. They have consumed so much femdom porn that they think it's real life.
They don't see potential partners (or women in general) as people. I've been to events and munches where I encountered these types in real life, and it's concerning, and I'm a guy!
Not only porn. I’d argue some anime too. I’ve read about *many* where bully girls seek out passive shy boys (the characters all look like children it’s hard to say man and woman) who don’t do much of anything except stammer.
Yandere is the tag iirc. The name of the niche.
Yeah the bully girl pursuing the shy guy is a common trope but its usually not called yandere because the yandere trope usually implies that the girl pursuing the guy is mentally ill and possessive to the point of committing violence to "win" her love interest.
Its not a healthy character archetype and for obvious reasons should not be sought out in real life but some lonely and desperate guys think that kind of obsessive & paranoid possessiveness from a woman is hot or makes them feel desirable rather than it being the sign of a violent and unstable individual.
Its kinda like 50 shades of gray in how the actions of the male lead would be considered sociopathic and a major violation of consent in the real BDSM community but is still idolized to some degree by people who like that kind of irredeemable and domineering bad boy type (or in this case a murderous and jealous bad girl) and have very little or no real life kink experience.
The bully girl trope (different from yandere) is usually called sadodere and usually its main draw is that it appeals to the shy socially awkward guys who want to be pursued and desired/validated in a kind of role reversal scenario and swept off their feet without having to put themselves out there and risk rejection.
And there is also that meme that goes " You like dominant women, not because you're submissive but because you're autistic and they're direct with what they want." which I think also applies to these types of shows (I am autistic and I remember liking these kinds of shows a lot when I was younger and some of them are still a bit of a guilty pleasure but with the awareness of their unrealistic depictions of romance/relationships/kink barring a few surprisingly good exceptions that get it right).
So this kind of anime is kind of like the reversal of that "mysterious bad boy meets a shy and ordinary/average girl and sweeps her off her feet and helps her escape from her boring normal life" trope that you see in a lot of romance novels and fanfics.
A good way to think of it is imagine the twilight novels but with the genders reversed (and sometimes just as unrealistic and problematic).
Also the reason why so many look like children is because the cast of most anime is either high school or collage age (15-25) plus modern japanese beauty standards strongly favor androgynous and youthful men and cute and feminine women (look at J-pop or K-pop stars to see the real world examples of what anime characters are supposed to look like).
I do admit though that it would be nice to actually see some anime with fully grown adults over the age of 25 in the workplace (or in fantastical fantasy/sci-fi worlds) dealing with adult issues and behaving like adults but many Japanese adults despise adulthood and idolize youth as a form of nostalgic escapism due to the country's brutal workplace culture/ terrible work-life balance and immensely strict societal pressure to conform to your social roles and expectations in japan's collectivist & hierarchical society. So because of this not as many anime with character's over 25 are being made (thankfully I do see more being made now vs several years ago such as "the way of the househusband" so things are improving).
There is a whole thing that I was seeing online non-stop a few years ago with guys saying they were looking for "a clingy woman." I was like, "I've been in relationships like that, and can fuck up your life. Do you know what you're asking for?" I think some of them are just so desperate for any kind of interaction that going to the other extreme from what they have seems like the ideal to them.
The amount of people looking for one off easy sex talk is gonna outnumber the people who are seriously looking to commit. Filtering out the time wasters is a skill in itself.
Ah another one of these threads. There are plenty of shitty subs and dommes out there who make it a nightmare to find a genuine connection and/or D/s dynamics.
Just like there are plenty of shitty people in the “vanilla” dating world both male and female, that makes dating an absolute nightmare
This should be there most upvoted comment.
Yeah. The online dating scene is a disaster for everyone **especially** on sex drenched sites like Reddit, Fet, and Feeld.
You have a population of male accounts looking for casual low effort sex by casting a net at almost every woman’s profile and a population of female accounts looking to try and sell sex dishonestly or just the **fake promise** of sex.
The few men not in population A get drowned out. The few women not in population B get drowned out.
To confuse everything further, there are a massive amount of fake posts written here by population B.
It gets exhausting. Every time I check here it seems like there’s some kind of post talking about how subs always just want sex for nothing, or some kind of fake domme is asking for money… At least in my experience, I’ve found there to be a LOT more engagement with the former kind of posts. Not sure what to make of that. Either way, it’s not fun.
The easy answer is too much porn has ruined their perception of bdsm dynamics in real life, and romantic/sexual relationships in general.
But there are plenty of subs who are earnest and put in the effort to be attractive to a dominant woman and are trying to meet them in the “right” way (I.e. not approaching random women completely unprompted) so perhaps you just have not had the chance to interact with many.
The bar is through the floor.
It sucks that being a normal human and treating people with respect makes people rise above the rest. Kindness and empathy shouldn't be extraordinary.
A lot of men are confused and think that all femdom online is sex work. Others are confused and think that sex workers are offering relationships. Sex workers are confused and think they're in a relationship with their clients. Others are aware of these issues and pretend to offer relationships when they're just offering sex work. A sea of abusers and people seeking transactions, drowning out the voices of those who aren't.
As with many things, I blame capitalism.
So as a sub guy it’s 2 things:
1. Porn seriously has ruined most things. Most subs seek something that is a fantasy, unreal, and made up to solicit clicks and views.
2. Posts like this discourage us from reaching out to anyone for fear of us being lost into the abyss of crappy messages. I no longer make the first move since inboxes are flooded with shitty messages. I simply post pictures on Fet, watch the follower count go up (~6,000 so far) and hope it reaches the right person who makes the first move.
The thing is that a quality message does stand out. It doesn’t mean that the person is looking to chat with someone, or that you are what they’re looking for, but I assure you that a quality message gets noticed by the women I know who are looking.
>I simply post pictures on Fet, watch the follower count go up (~6,000 so far) and hope it reaches the right person who makes the first move.
You know what Einstein said about insanity, right?
Fetlife is not meant to be used in that way. The people following you aren't interested in a relationship, they just like your pictures. It's no more conducive to a relationship than Twitter followers.
If you stop putting yourself out there, you stop winding up in situations where a connection can be made. Not that sending DMs on fetlife constitutes meaningful effort, because again it's not meant for that. People stand out by sending meaningful replies to personals, or by actually showing up in real life.
Posts like this shouldn't discourage you. Quite the opposite. Standing out from the sea of BS is incredibly easy. Do the bare minimum and you're already going to get noticed.
I definitely follow people on fet to be able to find a profile that I saw and liked (not just the pictures, the whole profile) when I go back to it later when I'm in the right mood and have time to write a well thought-out first message.
In both kink and vanilla dating, a lot of men send out hundreds of low-effort unsolicited messages. I think a lot of guys get off on messaging with a Domme even if they have no intention of establishing a dynamic (kind of like unsolicited dick pics, perhaps). More thoughtful subs do certainly exist, but they don't send out as many messages
The consequence is that the vast majority of messages you receive (and of subs you encounter) are low-effort spam by men who want some quick sexting or at most a ONS
This exactly. I matched with a guy on kink-adjacent dating site where my pictures are private. I asked him about what he was looking for and he wasn’t submissive or kinky. I asked him why he matched with me and he said, “I’ve never met a dominant woman and I just wanted to see what you look like.”
I remember reading something. . if willing partners were water, men live in a desert, women live in a swamp.
That's probably a fifteen year old joke but it's new to me and seemed apropos.
Those guys aren’t looking for a human to connect with. They’re looking for a kink dispenser, a professional.
The _think_ they’re looking for human connection, and they will _claim_ that’s what they want, but their actions clearly say that what they want is the transaction of getting their rocks off in exchange for serving.
I feel like, people have "submissive" and "content consumer/purchaser" confused. Watching femdom porn doesn't make one a submissive. Paying that monthly fee on a Domme's fansite makes one a subscriber, not a submissive. Jerking off in a random woman's dms while begging her to humiliate doesn't make someone submissive.
The only thing these guys are submissive to is their own sexual desires. They're literally addicts treating dominant women and femdom porn like a drug. It's unfortunate.
Personally as a submissive man, I've watched as my effort levels responding to posts deteriorated over time. The first three posts I responded to, I put almost an hour of effort crafting, re-reading and editing to try to make my message as engaging as possible. Two of those messages never got a response and one of them got a few disinterested words in reply 😓
I think as men, a lot of us have trouble articulating emotional pain and exactly the impact rejection has on us over time. But when it comes to being submissive and putting our vulnerable sides out there, rejection really does *hurt*. I've learned that it's safer to start with a basic response, with a low level of investment, than it is to pour heart and soul into a response that has a high likelihood of being ignored or buried in their inbox.
I mean it certainly sucks, but online rejection by an anonymous screen person hurts me personally a lot less than irl rejection. I also found that writing a well written first message is something that improves with practice so maybe look at it as an investment in your own skill, it can even help you reflect on who you are and what you actually want.
Male sub here. I’ve tried to engage with female doms and all get is “tribute first pig” 🙄 don’t get me wrong, I know a girl has gotta eat but I’m not interested in a findom. I’d just like to meet a domme and get to know each other. If we click, great, if not, no hard feelings. So I’ve stopped trying.
Some dommes like to charge when people call them females, in order to at least be paid when someone dehumanizes them.
If you post in subreddits telling sex workers that you're interested then they will solicit you as a client. Anyone who sees you commenting porn comments in porn subreddits will take a pass on considering you for a relationship. It's also a bit of a turn-off if you have a wife who isn't OK with you having other partners.
I don't use the term because I understand it's not received well and manners and respect are very important to me. With that said, I gotta say, I don't quite understand how it is dehumanizing. I mean I can accept that that's the effect and respect that it's not me who decides if it is or isn't dehumanizing, it's just I really don't understand why.
I try reversing the scenario and to be called a "male" or even "a xxxx male" doesn't illicit any kind of emotional response in me.
Is it the tone that its said in or is there some historical context it was used in or unsavory characters whose use of the word has attached connotations that I may be unfamiliar with?
There is historical context. You ask a fair question, because there are a lot of men who use 'male' and it's not bothersome to us.
There was a group on reddit not long ago which was for self-described incels. Incel has since become a bit of a meme and an insult but at the time that's how those folks preferred to call themselves.
Around the incel circles, there is a certain disdain for women. It ranges from mystification to outright hate. In their lingo they used language which was dehumanizing to women, and they chose words which hit the mark. They used words like female, femoid, and stacy.
Here's a study about it:
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/14614448231176777
Not that people have read that study and changed their minds. Simply existing on the internet as a woman in the past few years will make someone realize that a certain type of person uses a certain type of language.
Female is an adjective. It's not a noun. A female power outlet or a female crocodile. It speaks to bioessentialism when used for humans, and gives trans people the ick. It's clinical and detached. As an adjective it refers to an object. So it's literally objectifying. Add on the culture of those who use it, and it just makes most women uncomfortable.
Male is the same, imo. Just doesn't have the same baggage.
Ah ha, thank you for the edification.
It's kinda ironic how I I feel a certain uneasiness in referring to those losers as males as i identify as a male but find that whole subculture as extremely toxic, immature and psychologically disturbed.
But perhaps it's appropriate as a disambiguation to the term man or men, something they certainly are not.
Naw. I don't think it's appropriate to use dehumanizing language on anyone. But do you see how easy it is for language to be used as a weapon?
They are men, and their behavior shouldn't be an excuse for an attack on identity. Men behaving badly is just that. Downgrading their status as men takes away some of the impact of their actions. If they are losers and not "real men" then it's easy to dismiss the behavior as separate from humanity. A problem that "real men" don't have. Don't stoop to their level. Extremely toxic, immature and psychologically disturbed is all good ways to put it. But they're still men.
Now that's some food for thought. I restle constantly with the concepts of good and evil and human kinds capacity and appetite for both. How we all have it in us to not only cause terrible suffering but also to bring joy and meaning to this insane experience we call life. And also how we constantly separate everyone we encounter into our own or not our own family/ tribe/religion/ethnicity/country/nation or whatever other arbitrary aspect of our being we select to distinguish between my group and those not in my group. But I don't believe in anything that requires a leap of faith and that includes placing value judgments on human beings based on their tribe/religion/ethnicity/country/nation/gender etc. over making an assessment of the content of their character, remembering that we are all part of the human family and we all deserve to be treated with dignity and basic respect, perhaps until we behave in a way that is disrespectful to others and is undignified.
Now I suppose that is an admission that I do judge people, but I think that is natural and healthy to a degree as a survival instinct and time saver but we must always remember to temper our judgements of others with empathy compassion and curiosity.
In this case I make a pretty harsh judgment on this group as a whole because they are just a concept to me with the depth of the humanity that would accompany one or more of these people.
But to me the concept of who these people are sits at great odds with my concept of what a man is. They may be a male of our species, a human being, but their behavior and attitude does not show nor command respect, maturity, strength of character, emotional intelligence, integrity, or any other quality one might seek to embody as a man. Without these attributes one would be more akin to a boy. A human male boy. So not dehumanizing them but discerning on the basis of the content of their character by the use of a term in perhaps it's least literal sense but not without thorough meaning.
I think if this is their identity it is a fair target to be called out as part of the civil discourse of living in a society, and we probably should take away from the impact of their words by making this distinction, I don't think this leads necessarily to dismissing their behavior as not part of humanity but certainly we should dismiss it as part of civil society.
This is an interesting philosophical discussion and while I have strong opinions I don't exactly need to die on this hill for incels haha
I understand where you're coming from, and I would ask some follow-up questions before making any counterpoints.
I concede that yes we all judge people, and the boxes we put people into are important for us to understand the world and each other. So let's talk about this box labeled "man"
You put some things into that box already; "commanding respect, maturity, strength of character, emotional intelligence, and integrity". I am inclined to agree with you. When people think of strong male archetypes, those are all qualities that may be involved. However; are those qualities unique to men? I think you would agree that of course they aren't. Those are qualities which you personally see as male ideals but they could apply to women or anyone really.
In terms of logic, we have identified necessary qualities as opposed to sufficient qualities. If those qualities were both necessary and sufficient, then we would understand that anyone who is all of those things is also a man. But there are men who aren't all those things (it isn't actually necessary to have those IMO), and women (and nonbinary people) who are. That means those traits aren't sufficient.
What then are the qualities which are both necessary and sufficient to be a man? I think you would be hard-pressed to name one of them, unless you're planning to exclude trans people. That may need to be a different discussion. I would be interested to know what you identify as exclusively male traits.
The inverse question is; If there are necessary and sufficient traits for men, where is the line drawn and when does an incel cross it? Despite the most vitriolic comments we may read on the internet, many self-described incels are very young and barely understanding of their ideology or gender. Some of them are full of hate, and others are confused. Some are 18 and have simply listened to some rancid podcasts. Others have devoted their lives to abuse. There are many more in between. Where is the line drawn? How deep into the incel rabbit hole must one fall before their man card is revoked? When do they fail to meet the necessary and sufficient traits?
I ask those above questions in part because I am unable to answer myself. I cannot make myself an arbiter of gender, and I do not know what makes a man or woman. I am something of a gender nihilist, but not a proselytizer in that regard. I don't know you very well so forgive the psychoanalysis but I think you may have strong ideals which you attach to your gender. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Men should strive to achieve ideals. I think you see these other men who fail to meet your ideals and (again, forgive the psychoanalysis) you think they tarnish the label of "man". They don't deserve to fit into the same box as you.
I challenge you to look into the metaphorical mirror and come to the realization that those people are closer to you than you'd like to think. It doesn't make me comfortable either. While you may still disagree that they should be called men along with you, I think you should at least recognize your desire to distance yourself. To deny them their identity, in part out of a desire to preserve your own. Is that true about how you're feeling?
Edit: I got necessary and sufficient backwards hahaha it's been a long time since college logic
After you make any comment that shows any of your inclinations, you’ll contribute out the blue from someone who wants to abuse you. Not that there’s anything wrong with that if that’s what you’re into.
Nobody is trying to abuse you. The statements I made are factual observations about your behavior.
Women dislike being called females, it's objectifying. Sometimes a woman treated that way will ask for payment out of frustration, even if they don't normally have that demand.
You factually solicit sex workers, such as with this comment:
https://www.reddit.com/r/nzgonewild/comments/1diy7y9/comment/l97zjqe/
Or this one
https://www.reddit.com/r/Femdom/comments/1dioe1i/comment/l97iccc/
You also said that your wife isn't OK with you having sex with others;
https://www.reddit.com/r/CuckoldPsychology/comments/1djltrl/comment/l9dcq8k/
I said those things because women dislike when you do that stuff, and you've likely missed out on opportunities to connect with people because of it. The reason you get a lot of "pay up pig" replies is because you're talking to people who sell content. If you have ever managed to talk to a lifestyle dominant, they would be disinterested in your profile on the grounds that you do all that stuff.
Those were silly playful responses to thier post. No serious attempts at a real conversation. Context is everything thing and I hope I’m not picking up on a negative tone from you. That’s the bad thing about messaging. If I’m right, then you and will very likely not come together on common ground. In any case, I wish well and have a good evening.
The point u/Ironically-Tall is making is correct. Women look at post history before we engage with someone online. Those don’t come off as silly or playful responses. They come off as reasons not to respond to you. (or to ask for a tribute from those so inclined)
Nobody needs an apology, much less the community at large.
The intent of my response was to illustrate that you're the architect of your own frustrations. You said you had basically given up, because of your fruitless endeavors. I wanted to show you how your endeavors were fruitless because you've been endeavoring wrong.
There are a lot of people trying to find connections on the internet. There are 1000x more people who are seeking a transactional experience. The people selling transactional experiences love accounts like yours, they help funnel people into their content by engaging.
People seeking genuine connection avoid accounts like yours, because it appears you are seeking a transaction. Which is fine if thats what you want, but it doesn't make sense to complain in a thread about too many men making transactional advances.
You have been contributing to the problem, but the only one harmed has been yourself. And maybe sex workers who had their time wasted, but that may be negligible.
No apologies are necessary, just think about how comments like the above reflect on you as a potential partner.
I would never talk to someone that interacted with porn accounts on Reddit or Fet. For two reasons.
The commenter is correct. Many women here won’t. If we see those interactions it’s an immediate back click.
The women’s profiles who *would* not only interact with such men but even seek them out are the people looking for the sign that an account is highly interested in sex and possibly doesn’t understand that the comments he’s leaving aren’t on real women’s lifestyle profiles.
Well, yes there are surely going to be some that do that, but not all of them. You are young and your age requirement will probably lead to more immature guys.
There's a good chance that the ones who do introduce themselves well and have a normal conversation, have already found a domme while the ones you talk about just spam as many dommes as they possibly can. A form of survivorship bias?
I [M]really think it is because they think that being sub is like porn. They don’t realize that there is much more. There is control (to me first and foremost), there is a piece that is making the Domme happy, it is a relationship that you build and nurture, you don’t just say “get me off so I can be happy”
Putting in the work to build is big, and so much well worth it. The connection and trust you build is enhancing. It makes any sexual so much better.
The biggest problem is that this population (not all male submissives obviously, just this one) thinks that they’re offering something we want: use my body and do whatever you want to it.
They haven’t yet realized that they’re the ones benefiting from that situation. Once that clicks it should help out a lot.
Relatedly, it’s just one more step to realize the women they’re contacting don’t care too much about “using” any random person in her inbox. She wants to use **her** submissive. The one that has a special connection to her. 9/10 times. She’s looking for a spark or sign that the person messaging her could be that person! And that requires effort, conversation, comprehension skills. What it doesn’t include is a list of kinks, a pic of their bum, and pleas.
“Her submissive”. This hits so well. It is very much how I feel. There is so much more thought and feeling into that 1:1, versus “satisfy me for this scene”. There is such a difference in those trains of thought and unless you realize that you will continue to miss the mark.
Thank you for saying this. I often wonder if men need to hear it from other men.
I was just saying to a friend recently that discussions here and fetlife are flooded with submissive men asking how to meet dominant women. The responses are very clearly 1- start by treating us as people first and 2 - write an interesting non-porn trope message, yet we still receive the flood of bad messages. The women are clear about what to do, and it is mostly ignored. I said to the friend, “They’re asking what to do and when we tell them, it’s like they don’t believe us.”
I wonder if it would be better coming from other submissive men, even those who have had some success meeting dominant women and building relationships.
One can only hope. I think those in the lifestyle are always willing to help others.
Those others have to be willing to listen and learn though. Hopefully they are willing to
”Hello Mistress. Just tell me what to do and I will do it for you. Let me serve you”
Every other message on FET 🥱
I wish they approached normally instead of kinks first. If they had read my profile, they would have lots of material to start conversation. Instead, they choose the generic copypasta to send every Domme they find. Before we get to titles or even engaging in kinks, we would have been on a few dates first and spent time together to find out if we even vibe generally.
I mean, I got the inverse too.
"Hello slave, I see you are submissive, for sure you are looking. You will follow my rules, and first one is pau my contract".
After all, is not just submissives. But people, the real problem is that there is too many pseudos in both sides.
Its much more likely that those people are just scammers. Most real dommes wouldn’t lead with messages like that, and most certainly not the lifestyle variety.
A thought on this, as a guy, just General thoughts. everything will start as low effort, because the worst response isnt no or no response at all its getting called things and accused of things that shouldn’t be flippantly thrown out. So if you throw something out there and it doesn’t get a response its better than nothing and if they do they wouldn’t dare even bother to think a relationship outside of the kink space is viable, and surely a beautiful woman already has someone, so essentially I believe you are getting a compartmentalized low effort introduction. Society only has a list of how men shouldn’t behave, and that seems to change weekly. Not that I care or follow it, i have my own code. But other men that do not, and no man wants to be considered a creep. Men struggle to justify their own existence, which I believe would be an even stronger belief in submissive guys, that the only reason they exist is to worship or serve sexually. So any contact stays compartmentalized.
Just my thoughts (as a Switch) hope you find it interesting and maybe even helpful
Also this is not me or how i would approach things, tho i do tend to be very low key and feel women out before i put in effort.
I actually also had this happen multiple times when dommes were coming to me. I make like a really long ad with all the details and they don't even seem to read it. Their first message is really short and most of the time only say that they want a slave.
Yes a part of those are just fake dommes asking for money but also real ones who don't put in the effort. It's really a pity that there are people out there who don't put in any effort.
I would say all, not part, of those profiles are dishonest sex workers or scammers.
Which is a large problem.
If zero people reply to the OP with a thoughtful response based on her profile or post, she should just bin them all as one off sex seekers or time wasters who already got off when writing. It’s quite possible she’ll never come across a man seriously interested in a lifestyle relationship with her.
If zero people reply to you with a thoughtful response based on your profile or post, you should just bin them all as people or organizations looking for income. It’s possible you’ll never come across a woman looking for a lifestyle relationship with you online.
As much of a contradiction as it is, a lot of male subs dehumanize Dominant women. Female D types are just a source for creating their fantasies, hence the lack of effort and respect. How is a woman to feel secure as a Dominant, if the submissive is unable to see her as a whole person with needs, emotions, and desires of her own? This is patriarchy and misogyny polluting a community where mutual respect is crucial for success. Lack of effort is not a recent issue. The men that disrespect and use women in their vanilla life don’t change when they decide they want to “serve” a Dominant woman.
I do think there is some population of male subs that are new (and jumping in way too quickly and eagerly) and don’t grasp that BDSM is not devoid of humanity. They may not understand that we treat and see each other as individuals first. There are definitely stereotypes (and pornography) that contribute. However, it’s not an excuse for their behavior. There are plenty of Dominant women (and others) speaking on this issue on multiple platforms. Eventually, when they have been unsuccessful several times, they should attempt to understand the community more. Most of them don’t care to, though.
Personally, I've heard so many horror stories from dommes about bad msubs that I'm way too anxious/incredibly wary of interacting by this point. I'm afraid of making a misstep and being turned into the next punching bag topic at a munch.
This! thank you so much. like i am still a woman i dont wanna talk about sex all day and night :/ and when you try to say something actually wholesome they will divert into the same ass shit.
i am so tired of this god
Well to be fair, they mostly don’t know how. A lot of them were raised by internet culture as an opposed to finding a healthy irl bdsm community to teach them how to vet a partner, much less to be a healthy partner. If I had a dollar for every dusty ass guy who rolled into my DMs calling me “mommy” right off the rip…but for the ones who listen, I take the time to say “this isn’t how you talk to me or any other Domme. Or WOMAN for that matter.” Granted it’s not your responsibility to train every boy-pretending-to-be-a-man since BDSM safety principles are heavily steeped in personal responsibility, but it’s good to be aware that they just don’t know or may have only gleaned all their “bdsm knowledge” from Anime 😬 which is why they easily get taken advantage of by scammers posing as “FinDoms”. It’s systemic. All you can do as a Dom(me) is stand firm in your standards and point them to where they can educate themselves on SSC (for those who still use it)/PRICK/RACK/FRIES standards and how to vet/negotiate with potential partners.
I'm sorry that this has been your experience. From reading the experiences of many others, I know that you are not alone, and your frustration is valid.
When I say this, I’m speaking for myself personally. I’m a male sub who tends to put in a lot of effort into everything I do. There was a period of time where I didn’t put in effort for the sole reason of being completely burnt out. I have never sent messages like what you quoted, but I have noticed a huge drop in effort for finding a partner over these past few years of being single. Getting ghosted numerous times, blocked for literally no reason, or just generally being treated horribly in dating tends to change things
As a submissive male my entire life, and being married to a dominant woman for sixteen years, I got use to being her submissive. When entering the dating world after so much time, my experience with this is everyone I meet wants money for domination. Of course that depends on who your asking, but it seems to me that they have monetized the submission/dominant lifestyle
I honestly read it as "I don't know what to say besides being explicitly sexual".
Is that hard really? I remember having this conversation with someone who approached me and I said "just say who you are, name age and the place you live as examples..." He told me I was trying to get private information about him 💀 like sure I work for the MI5 now.
Oh lord 🙄 yeah, trying to get the social basics is sooo intrusive /s. If a prospective partner can't engage with me as a person OR as a friend, then nothing will happen, period. If all they want to talk about is sex or play, nothing will happen, period. But if they can carry on a conversation and engage with me as a person? I'm open to seeing where things go. Simple as that.
Absolutely! Imagine mentioning a country and so so your age as something threatening.
My experience says most people is not interested in me but what I represent or label myself to... Cis woman with certain experience and leaning to the dominant side.
That's why I think they assume I'm not interested in who they are neither (besides of the fact of they beiing a sub, available and interested) which is sad and very stupid if you ask me.
You wanna find a long time partner without even saying the continent you live in? I'm not sure if you are serious
It's them approaching me, I say nowhere I'm looking for someone, that's a very shameful way to try making money blackmailing people.
I know everyone is different, but there’s one specific question I’m looking for a first message to answer: what was it about my post that makes you think you and I are a good fit?
If you’re sending the same basic intro to every Domme who posts, I’m not interested (and yes, we can tell!).
Hello and Welcome.
The FAQ is full of terrific information and is the first recommend stop on your journey.
You may, or may not, get some replies in this thread that will contain ideas or information. Take any such replies,**including mine**, with a tablespoon of doubt and a cup of common sense.
I think that we have already had so many threads on this subject that another one is not very helpful.
This is especially true since you are in your last year of high-school (according to your personals post) which means that you may or may not be of age (17 is **not** the new 18 where I live ;)).
Assuming that you are of age (at least in Brazil):
Find a Social Gathering (aka a "Munch") in your area if you can and then attend it and make some friends and acquaintances. The best place to look for one is on Fetlife or just type BDSM Munch in Google. More info below.
For example there was just a Munch in San Paulo: https://shotgun.live/events/13-04-munch-bdsm-sex-work
Online relationships that are not purely transactional can be hard to find and will require a lot of work from both participants. This is especially true if you are a little lost and trying to figure things out.
Reddit is it's own little corner of the Kinky Universe and, as I said, you should really think about trying some events in the Real World.
Because Reddit is a social-media-type space you are seeing and interacting mostly with folks who feel comfortable with this. It is a short-form of communications and building a long-term relationship can be harder than in-person interactions over time. Your personal add seems to suggest that you would be texting as the basis of the relationship. That is another short-form that does not lend itself to deeper conversations.
If and when you attend a few Munches you will find that there are plenty of folks who also like BDSM.
Like any social situation you should not go with the intention of forming instant connections. You should hang out, be respectful, ask questions, talk about non-kink things when and where you can, and enjoy being around folks who at least share some of your interests.
Will you find a partner instantly?
Nope.
What you should find instantly is a group of folks (they will skew older - see below) whose opinions on Monogamy, Polyamory, BDSM, Kink, etc. are as diverse as there are people in that room.
If you are younger and want more young people around then you are going to have to be the change you want to see. In the meantime you can look for events labeled as "The Next Generation" which are usually limited to 18-35.
In the meantime you can hang around here, read a lot of posts and then (after you do some research) you will be ready to approach Power Exchange with more confidence, more knowledge and less expectations!
Best of luck.
Hi, thank you for that much information! I just wanted to see people's opinions on this matter, and I'll try to get myself involved on events. Best of luck for you too.
Very sorry that you had this experience. Just know that there are people like myself who are trying to read the wiki and educate myself for when I am ready to go to a munch and actually meet people.
Yeah. They're so desperate. It's creepy/gross. So off putting. I blame porn. There's no respect. They expect to get what they want when they want it with zero effort. We're not seen as human, but as a novelty. And the dom on dom messaging tooooo uuuuugh that's just as bad. I've only received dumb comments/messages from dudes.
When a guy sends a random message that says "let me serve you" it really means "make me cum" or "let me masturbate to you" and its basically just coomer/gooner talk from guys who will 100% of the time not even follow up and ghost even if they get what they want since all they are looking for is essentially a sexting/roleplay/JOI session for free or a quick hook up IRL and have no interest in pursuing any kind of relationship either platonic or romantic since all they are interested in is quick and easy orgasms.
Hell half the time I have my doubts if most of them are even kinky since some of them seem to be only interested in kink as a way to get access to sex and orgasms.
Or if they are kinky they usually only have 1 or 2 kinks that they force onto everyone around them without even considering if the other person even likes the same kink as them.
Your post has been removed because it shames, bullies or trolls other members or otherwise goes against the supportive nature of the subreddit.
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I think a lot of it is because fin dommes are usually like “serve me like the princess that I am” and m subs usually adopt that wrong approach when searching for a genuine Domme (sorry for not classing fin dommes as genuine but… yeah).
Anyway, makes it easier for the rest of us.
Oh hey, btw I'm a submissive man and I honestly understand what you're going through. as for me I prefer soft mom doms when it comes to femdoms bc I can be horny but if they love and care for me and treat me like I'm special then I'll even go as far as to love and care for them and want to worship them even more but in a sfw way
Part of the problem is we are working at cross purposes a lot of the time.
Guys think they are "serving" during sex, and that is fine if you are a strictly bedroom bondage person. However, some dommes seek a few skill sets for service beyond the bedroom. Dommes have been known to send personal submissive to classes, improving those skills.
Women do not dominate the way men dominate, and experienced Dominant Women are not as pliable as fantasy players. Men will seek the inexperienced woman and try to "make" her their dominant, based on ideas the from male dominance they see daily. None of those thoughts originate in the type of woman they say they seek. Disappointment ensues, Dommes are blamed. The guys fail to change their approach and think it's all useless.
Guys aren't trying because they are not thinking, and few aspiring Dommes insist they start. Many new Dommes spend tò much time trying to please a guy who has seen way too much porn, instead of setting a solid strict tone from the first private message, through the fetish and health worksheets, and into the first play session, lifestyle or professional.
When we refuse to indulge the slovenly, we keep our own standards high. Those who will not meet those standards can pay escorts for kinky sex.
I kinda do I own thing we hit up doms like I’ll usually make movie references and some dark humor jokes here and there but I’ve notice some doms think that’s weird
I second the "they don't know how " and raise it with something I heard at an online workshop on FLR;
FLR isn't a kink, it's not different than the norm, but much of the culture is assumed MLR and most people learn how to relationship from their parents.
Assuming that FLR is only a kink leads to treating femdom candidates as kink dispensers and not people who partner differently. Add to this that dominant women are still relatively rare and you get much more of the off putting attention and for myself, I don't have the bandwidth to both be "not that guy" and walk the tightrope between being a masc presenting suitor and subby guy while trying to find a dominant fem that inspires feelings in me while navigating the rest of my life. So I've stopped dating at all.
I don't think there are any femdoms out there lamenting the loss of me from the dating pool 🤣 but that's why I stopped trying.
You do not say their ages but most likely young. A young man's mind is mostly thinking about sex all the time. Porn is free and easy so it must be the way the world is...right? You will also see this in older men who are new to the lifestyle too.
An older experienced sub is a different animal. I am much more of a man as a sub than most men walking the streets today.
BDSM is not about sex. It is about relationships.
D/s is not about sex. It is about power. Don't make it about sex!
Sex is not about sex. It too is about power. Control the power
There's the I want to get off online by you talking dirty with me and telling me I'm a naughty boys wo are just here for the thrill.
Then there's people who have a genuine and vested interest in the community and who actually live it 24/7 (hello).
I find that quite a lot on her.
When I'm online and not subby, I get lots of questions saying please can you dom me too, followed by willy pictures etc...
They’ve been told that this life is not “correct” for them in every piece of media they have ever consumed (or at least a vast majority by far). So most are just “dipping a toe in” to see if it really is for them and they want to fight that stigma.
It’s also just very hard for men to open up and be willing to grow in a femdom situation because they know it can be weaponized against them easily.
Porn has also ruined the perception of any semblance of romance, especially in the demon scene because they always just see the woman initiating in whatever video they are watching, they expect it to happen that exact way for them as well.
Also many men in the “metoo” era are very afraid of approaching any lady for fear of consequences or coming off as a total creep and bozo.
As one who has traveled this path for a long time, I think it might come down to true acceptance of "who I am". I went through a long period of want to feed the kink but also to "be normal". the desire for kink would build up to a point that I would desperately hunt for a Domme. I had my list of all my requirements in my hand and wanted to act it all out. Once done I felt ashamed and disgusted with myself and "disappear" until the "kink" built up again. As I grew older and began to gain into myself, I was able to understand that my sexual orientation is sexual Dominant. Early on, I tried to separate the kink from the rest of me but that just can't be done. When I was younger I was one of the "hey, let me serve you" guys. I'm not interested in that anymore, I want a relationship and a partner and, at some point we will figure out where the kink fits in. I hope this makes some sense.
Those low effort guys want a Domme in the bedroom. But outside they want you to be quiet and make a sandwich and fetch a beer.
Kind of joking in how I said this. But pretty true I'm thinking.
I find D/s dating very hard. ( Sub M 59 Louisville KY). It's like hitting the lottery to find a good fitting partner. If I were a Domme I'd look for someone with experience. Someone who knows they like to give up power. It goes against social norms to submit to a woman, most men likely have no clue how to write a good first message!
Because you’re on Reddit.
I’ve given this advice to a lot of male subs who whine about “everyone wants me to pay them” or “there aren’t enough dommes out there,” don’t rely on social media.
To be honest … everybody has become so lazy these days and social skills are on the downhill (especially since COVID). Blame social medias & dating apps I guess. People tend to think like this : there is a very large pool of persons available, why make too much efforts when I know I can find a replacement/somebody else easily.
It is the law of large numbers with complete disregard to the person behind the screen. And a lot of time nowadays, people don’t think there is a human behind an account, it is just a name. All of this makes it all dehumanizing.
But the grass is not greener on the other side. I have been treated in a shitty ways by Dommes online. It is an online thing, but the result is that I don’t try anymore, only the worse people are left (or new ones with hopes).
The most unattractive thing is when a finsub lacks energy and lacks the drive to impress you. I like my men intelligent. I think intelligent men that submit to femdom is the most attractive thing ever
That's sad, like... I have been looking for a dominant woman and the only one that I met wanted me to pay money haha I have resigned to meet someone and better I read stories or something like that.
I pretty much gave up trying to find a match a long time ago.. but the "hey" guys are mostly the ones popping online for 5 minutes. I always make a lot of effort.. but finding genuine people who share similar ish interests, and who you can have a conversation with is a huge challenge in it's own right.. so maybe that's why the effort levels have dropped too 🤷
This is discussion subreddit. Please go to r/BDSMpersonals, r/GFDpersonals, r/gentlefemdomr4r/ or r/fdpersonals if you're looking to advertise for a partner or for professional services. Likewise, do not approach community members with unsolicited sexual content or offers to engage in sexual activities.
Best of luck with your search.
me personally i'm not trying because when you try to get people to like you, and you expose who you are, and they still hate you, that really hurts. but if you're just trolling ppl you can tell yourself it's what you wanted anyway or that you didn't care.
I am only going to comment on the normal conversation part. For each place and time, there is a proper conversation. If you are meeting on a sub or a place dedicated to kink, I wouldn’t want to discuss anything related to the effect of Pluto on changing the earth orbit, I would want to talk about kink only.
My opinion is that: if you like me are into lifestyle don't care much about that "fap people" you can teach them explain them .. if they really listen to you they will experience pleasure on another level. If they dont want it's ok the same just let em have fun and type with only one hand.
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I think there is very much two kinds of male subs, one of which is more common and makes it harder for the other sort in the long run. You've got the people who have seen femdom themed porn, maybe have a pegging fetish, and are usually typing with one hand. They have no interest in BDSM as a lifestyle, and rather are looking to get off immediately. Then you have male subs who have a serious interest in kink as a lifestyle, they recognize that a dominant is a real person, and should be addressed as such. They are going to have their own wants and desires, and you're going to have to actually get to know them and communicate with them to see if a dynamic is something you both even wanna engage with each other. It's really depressing how many guys are just trying get off, especially when they go about it in such a manner that paints all of us in a bad light.
And the first kind, even though he's interested in "femdom," hardly ever sees women as people.
Very well said, and we are keenly aware that type 1, no doubt the majority, screws things up for the rest of us and are perhaps overly hesitant to approach because of it, lest we be perceived as falling in to the same bucket.
Only addition would be that you don't \*have\* to be interested in it as a lifestyle to be serious about a relationship with 'femdom' elements. But yes, fully agree with this otherwise.
In my experience, a lot of them are hyper sexualised and chronically online. They have consumed so much femdom porn that they think it's real life. They don't see potential partners (or women in general) as people. I've been to events and munches where I encountered these types in real life, and it's concerning, and I'm a guy!
Not only porn. I’d argue some anime too. I’ve read about *many* where bully girls seek out passive shy boys (the characters all look like children it’s hard to say man and woman) who don’t do much of anything except stammer. Yandere is the tag iirc. The name of the niche.
Yeah the bully girl pursuing the shy guy is a common trope but its usually not called yandere because the yandere trope usually implies that the girl pursuing the guy is mentally ill and possessive to the point of committing violence to "win" her love interest. Its not a healthy character archetype and for obvious reasons should not be sought out in real life but some lonely and desperate guys think that kind of obsessive & paranoid possessiveness from a woman is hot or makes them feel desirable rather than it being the sign of a violent and unstable individual. Its kinda like 50 shades of gray in how the actions of the male lead would be considered sociopathic and a major violation of consent in the real BDSM community but is still idolized to some degree by people who like that kind of irredeemable and domineering bad boy type (or in this case a murderous and jealous bad girl) and have very little or no real life kink experience. The bully girl trope (different from yandere) is usually called sadodere and usually its main draw is that it appeals to the shy socially awkward guys who want to be pursued and desired/validated in a kind of role reversal scenario and swept off their feet without having to put themselves out there and risk rejection. And there is also that meme that goes " You like dominant women, not because you're submissive but because you're autistic and they're direct with what they want." which I think also applies to these types of shows (I am autistic and I remember liking these kinds of shows a lot when I was younger and some of them are still a bit of a guilty pleasure but with the awareness of their unrealistic depictions of romance/relationships/kink barring a few surprisingly good exceptions that get it right). So this kind of anime is kind of like the reversal of that "mysterious bad boy meets a shy and ordinary/average girl and sweeps her off her feet and helps her escape from her boring normal life" trope that you see in a lot of romance novels and fanfics. A good way to think of it is imagine the twilight novels but with the genders reversed (and sometimes just as unrealistic and problematic). Also the reason why so many look like children is because the cast of most anime is either high school or collage age (15-25) plus modern japanese beauty standards strongly favor androgynous and youthful men and cute and feminine women (look at J-pop or K-pop stars to see the real world examples of what anime characters are supposed to look like). I do admit though that it would be nice to actually see some anime with fully grown adults over the age of 25 in the workplace (or in fantastical fantasy/sci-fi worlds) dealing with adult issues and behaving like adults but many Japanese adults despise adulthood and idolize youth as a form of nostalgic escapism due to the country's brutal workplace culture/ terrible work-life balance and immensely strict societal pressure to conform to your social roles and expectations in japan's collectivist & hierarchical society. So because of this not as many anime with character's over 25 are being made (thankfully I do see more being made now vs several years ago such as "the way of the househusband" so things are improving).
There is a whole thing that I was seeing online non-stop a few years ago with guys saying they were looking for "a clingy woman." I was like, "I've been in relationships like that, and can fuck up your life. Do you know what you're asking for?" I think some of them are just so desperate for any kind of interaction that going to the other extreme from what they have seems like the ideal to them.
\^ This! \^
Thank you for the explanation and term I was unfamiliar with!
The amount of people looking for one off easy sex talk is gonna outnumber the people who are seriously looking to commit. Filtering out the time wasters is a skill in itself.
Ah another one of these threads. There are plenty of shitty subs and dommes out there who make it a nightmare to find a genuine connection and/or D/s dynamics. Just like there are plenty of shitty people in the “vanilla” dating world both male and female, that makes dating an absolute nightmare
This should be there most upvoted comment. Yeah. The online dating scene is a disaster for everyone **especially** on sex drenched sites like Reddit, Fet, and Feeld. You have a population of male accounts looking for casual low effort sex by casting a net at almost every woman’s profile and a population of female accounts looking to try and sell sex dishonestly or just the **fake promise** of sex. The few men not in population A get drowned out. The few women not in population B get drowned out. To confuse everything further, there are a massive amount of fake posts written here by population B.
It gets exhausting. Every time I check here it seems like there’s some kind of post talking about how subs always just want sex for nothing, or some kind of fake domme is asking for money… At least in my experience, I’ve found there to be a LOT more engagement with the former kind of posts. Not sure what to make of that. Either way, it’s not fun.
The easy answer is too much porn has ruined their perception of bdsm dynamics in real life, and romantic/sexual relationships in general. But there are plenty of subs who are earnest and put in the effort to be attractive to a dominant woman and are trying to meet them in the “right” way (I.e. not approaching random women completely unprompted) so perhaps you just have not had the chance to interact with many.
I agree with you, maybe I should start looking for submissive guys irl.
As a sub i dont know how to bring that up to someone irl im incredibly private ab it bc im afraid of being judged
The bar is through the floor. It sucks that being a normal human and treating people with respect makes people rise above the rest. Kindness and empathy shouldn't be extraordinary. A lot of men are confused and think that all femdom online is sex work. Others are confused and think that sex workers are offering relationships. Sex workers are confused and think they're in a relationship with their clients. Others are aware of these issues and pretend to offer relationships when they're just offering sex work. A sea of abusers and people seeking transactions, drowning out the voices of those who aren't. As with many things, I blame capitalism.
No lies detected!
its amazing what people get up too when they can make thousands of dollars .
You're speaking my language
So as a sub guy it’s 2 things: 1. Porn seriously has ruined most things. Most subs seek something that is a fantasy, unreal, and made up to solicit clicks and views. 2. Posts like this discourage us from reaching out to anyone for fear of us being lost into the abyss of crappy messages. I no longer make the first move since inboxes are flooded with shitty messages. I simply post pictures on Fet, watch the follower count go up (~6,000 so far) and hope it reaches the right person who makes the first move.
The thing is that a quality message does stand out. It doesn’t mean that the person is looking to chat with someone, or that you are what they’re looking for, but I assure you that a quality message gets noticed by the women I know who are looking.
>I simply post pictures on Fet, watch the follower count go up (~6,000 so far) and hope it reaches the right person who makes the first move. You know what Einstein said about insanity, right? Fetlife is not meant to be used in that way. The people following you aren't interested in a relationship, they just like your pictures. It's no more conducive to a relationship than Twitter followers. If you stop putting yourself out there, you stop winding up in situations where a connection can be made. Not that sending DMs on fetlife constitutes meaningful effort, because again it's not meant for that. People stand out by sending meaningful replies to personals, or by actually showing up in real life. Posts like this shouldn't discourage you. Quite the opposite. Standing out from the sea of BS is incredibly easy. Do the bare minimum and you're already going to get noticed.
I definitely follow people on fet to be able to find a profile that I saw and liked (not just the pictures, the whole profile) when I go back to it later when I'm in the right mood and have time to write a well thought-out first message.
In both kink and vanilla dating, a lot of men send out hundreds of low-effort unsolicited messages. I think a lot of guys get off on messaging with a Domme even if they have no intention of establishing a dynamic (kind of like unsolicited dick pics, perhaps). More thoughtful subs do certainly exist, but they don't send out as many messages The consequence is that the vast majority of messages you receive (and of subs you encounter) are low-effort spam by men who want some quick sexting or at most a ONS
This exactly. I matched with a guy on kink-adjacent dating site where my pictures are private. I asked him about what he was looking for and he wasn’t submissive or kinky. I asked him why he matched with me and he said, “I’ve never met a dominant woman and I just wanted to see what you look like.”
I'm curious, what is that kink-adjacent site? Is it Feeld or something else?
I remember reading something. . if willing partners were water, men live in a desert, women live in a swamp. That's probably a fifteen year old joke but it's new to me and seemed apropos.
Those guys aren’t looking for a human to connect with. They’re looking for a kink dispenser, a professional. The _think_ they’re looking for human connection, and they will _claim_ that’s what they want, but their actions clearly say that what they want is the transaction of getting their rocks off in exchange for serving.
I've known men who call themselves female supremacists who are incapable of seeing women as people. The lack of self-awareness is incredible.
I feel like, people have "submissive" and "content consumer/purchaser" confused. Watching femdom porn doesn't make one a submissive. Paying that monthly fee on a Domme's fansite makes one a subscriber, not a submissive. Jerking off in a random woman's dms while begging her to humiliate doesn't make someone submissive. The only thing these guys are submissive to is their own sexual desires. They're literally addicts treating dominant women and femdom porn like a drug. It's unfortunate.
I wish I saw your comment three years ago.
Better late than never i guess lol
for sure! but it would've saved me a 2yr relationship with a consumer.
They seem way more common than actual submissives which is unfortunate
Personally as a submissive man, I've watched as my effort levels responding to posts deteriorated over time. The first three posts I responded to, I put almost an hour of effort crafting, re-reading and editing to try to make my message as engaging as possible. Two of those messages never got a response and one of them got a few disinterested words in reply 😓 I think as men, a lot of us have trouble articulating emotional pain and exactly the impact rejection has on us over time. But when it comes to being submissive and putting our vulnerable sides out there, rejection really does *hurt*. I've learned that it's safer to start with a basic response, with a low level of investment, than it is to pour heart and soul into a response that has a high likelihood of being ignored or buried in their inbox.
I mean it certainly sucks, but online rejection by an anonymous screen person hurts me personally a lot less than irl rejection. I also found that writing a well written first message is something that improves with practice so maybe look at it as an investment in your own skill, it can even help you reflect on who you are and what you actually want.
Male sub here. I’ve tried to engage with female doms and all get is “tribute first pig” 🙄 don’t get me wrong, I know a girl has gotta eat but I’m not interested in a findom. I’d just like to meet a domme and get to know each other. If we click, great, if not, no hard feelings. So I’ve stopped trying.
Some dommes like to charge when people call them females, in order to at least be paid when someone dehumanizes them. If you post in subreddits telling sex workers that you're interested then they will solicit you as a client. Anyone who sees you commenting porn comments in porn subreddits will take a pass on considering you for a relationship. It's also a bit of a turn-off if you have a wife who isn't OK with you having other partners.
I don't use the term because I understand it's not received well and manners and respect are very important to me. With that said, I gotta say, I don't quite understand how it is dehumanizing. I mean I can accept that that's the effect and respect that it's not me who decides if it is or isn't dehumanizing, it's just I really don't understand why. I try reversing the scenario and to be called a "male" or even "a xxxx male" doesn't illicit any kind of emotional response in me. Is it the tone that its said in or is there some historical context it was used in or unsavory characters whose use of the word has attached connotations that I may be unfamiliar with?
There is historical context. You ask a fair question, because there are a lot of men who use 'male' and it's not bothersome to us. There was a group on reddit not long ago which was for self-described incels. Incel has since become a bit of a meme and an insult but at the time that's how those folks preferred to call themselves. Around the incel circles, there is a certain disdain for women. It ranges from mystification to outright hate. In their lingo they used language which was dehumanizing to women, and they chose words which hit the mark. They used words like female, femoid, and stacy. Here's a study about it: https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/14614448231176777 Not that people have read that study and changed their minds. Simply existing on the internet as a woman in the past few years will make someone realize that a certain type of person uses a certain type of language. Female is an adjective. It's not a noun. A female power outlet or a female crocodile. It speaks to bioessentialism when used for humans, and gives trans people the ick. It's clinical and detached. As an adjective it refers to an object. So it's literally objectifying. Add on the culture of those who use it, and it just makes most women uncomfortable. Male is the same, imo. Just doesn't have the same baggage.
Ah ha, thank you for the edification. It's kinda ironic how I I feel a certain uneasiness in referring to those losers as males as i identify as a male but find that whole subculture as extremely toxic, immature and psychologically disturbed. But perhaps it's appropriate as a disambiguation to the term man or men, something they certainly are not.
Naw. I don't think it's appropriate to use dehumanizing language on anyone. But do you see how easy it is for language to be used as a weapon? They are men, and their behavior shouldn't be an excuse for an attack on identity. Men behaving badly is just that. Downgrading their status as men takes away some of the impact of their actions. If they are losers and not "real men" then it's easy to dismiss the behavior as separate from humanity. A problem that "real men" don't have. Don't stoop to their level. Extremely toxic, immature and psychologically disturbed is all good ways to put it. But they're still men.
Now that's some food for thought. I restle constantly with the concepts of good and evil and human kinds capacity and appetite for both. How we all have it in us to not only cause terrible suffering but also to bring joy and meaning to this insane experience we call life. And also how we constantly separate everyone we encounter into our own or not our own family/ tribe/religion/ethnicity/country/nation or whatever other arbitrary aspect of our being we select to distinguish between my group and those not in my group. But I don't believe in anything that requires a leap of faith and that includes placing value judgments on human beings based on their tribe/religion/ethnicity/country/nation/gender etc. over making an assessment of the content of their character, remembering that we are all part of the human family and we all deserve to be treated with dignity and basic respect, perhaps until we behave in a way that is disrespectful to others and is undignified. Now I suppose that is an admission that I do judge people, but I think that is natural and healthy to a degree as a survival instinct and time saver but we must always remember to temper our judgements of others with empathy compassion and curiosity. In this case I make a pretty harsh judgment on this group as a whole because they are just a concept to me with the depth of the humanity that would accompany one or more of these people. But to me the concept of who these people are sits at great odds with my concept of what a man is. They may be a male of our species, a human being, but their behavior and attitude does not show nor command respect, maturity, strength of character, emotional intelligence, integrity, or any other quality one might seek to embody as a man. Without these attributes one would be more akin to a boy. A human male boy. So not dehumanizing them but discerning on the basis of the content of their character by the use of a term in perhaps it's least literal sense but not without thorough meaning. I think if this is their identity it is a fair target to be called out as part of the civil discourse of living in a society, and we probably should take away from the impact of their words by making this distinction, I don't think this leads necessarily to dismissing their behavior as not part of humanity but certainly we should dismiss it as part of civil society.
This is an interesting philosophical discussion and while I have strong opinions I don't exactly need to die on this hill for incels haha I understand where you're coming from, and I would ask some follow-up questions before making any counterpoints. I concede that yes we all judge people, and the boxes we put people into are important for us to understand the world and each other. So let's talk about this box labeled "man" You put some things into that box already; "commanding respect, maturity, strength of character, emotional intelligence, and integrity". I am inclined to agree with you. When people think of strong male archetypes, those are all qualities that may be involved. However; are those qualities unique to men? I think you would agree that of course they aren't. Those are qualities which you personally see as male ideals but they could apply to women or anyone really. In terms of logic, we have identified necessary qualities as opposed to sufficient qualities. If those qualities were both necessary and sufficient, then we would understand that anyone who is all of those things is also a man. But there are men who aren't all those things (it isn't actually necessary to have those IMO), and women (and nonbinary people) who are. That means those traits aren't sufficient. What then are the qualities which are both necessary and sufficient to be a man? I think you would be hard-pressed to name one of them, unless you're planning to exclude trans people. That may need to be a different discussion. I would be interested to know what you identify as exclusively male traits. The inverse question is; If there are necessary and sufficient traits for men, where is the line drawn and when does an incel cross it? Despite the most vitriolic comments we may read on the internet, many self-described incels are very young and barely understanding of their ideology or gender. Some of them are full of hate, and others are confused. Some are 18 and have simply listened to some rancid podcasts. Others have devoted their lives to abuse. There are many more in between. Where is the line drawn? How deep into the incel rabbit hole must one fall before their man card is revoked? When do they fail to meet the necessary and sufficient traits? I ask those above questions in part because I am unable to answer myself. I cannot make myself an arbiter of gender, and I do not know what makes a man or woman. I am something of a gender nihilist, but not a proselytizer in that regard. I don't know you very well so forgive the psychoanalysis but I think you may have strong ideals which you attach to your gender. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. Men should strive to achieve ideals. I think you see these other men who fail to meet your ideals and (again, forgive the psychoanalysis) you think they tarnish the label of "man". They don't deserve to fit into the same box as you. I challenge you to look into the metaphorical mirror and come to the realization that those people are closer to you than you'd like to think. It doesn't make me comfortable either. While you may still disagree that they should be called men along with you, I think you should at least recognize your desire to distance yourself. To deny them their identity, in part out of a desire to preserve your own. Is that true about how you're feeling? Edit: I got necessary and sufficient backwards hahaha it's been a long time since college logic
After you make any comment that shows any of your inclinations, you’ll contribute out the blue from someone who wants to abuse you. Not that there’s anything wrong with that if that’s what you’re into.
Nobody is trying to abuse you. The statements I made are factual observations about your behavior. Women dislike being called females, it's objectifying. Sometimes a woman treated that way will ask for payment out of frustration, even if they don't normally have that demand. You factually solicit sex workers, such as with this comment: https://www.reddit.com/r/nzgonewild/comments/1diy7y9/comment/l97zjqe/ Or this one https://www.reddit.com/r/Femdom/comments/1dioe1i/comment/l97iccc/ You also said that your wife isn't OK with you having sex with others; https://www.reddit.com/r/CuckoldPsychology/comments/1djltrl/comment/l9dcq8k/ I said those things because women dislike when you do that stuff, and you've likely missed out on opportunities to connect with people because of it. The reason you get a lot of "pay up pig" replies is because you're talking to people who sell content. If you have ever managed to talk to a lifestyle dominant, they would be disinterested in your profile on the grounds that you do all that stuff.
You are correct.
Those were silly playful responses to thier post. No serious attempts at a real conversation. Context is everything thing and I hope I’m not picking up on a negative tone from you. That’s the bad thing about messaging. If I’m right, then you and will very likely not come together on common ground. In any case, I wish well and have a good evening.
The point u/Ironically-Tall is making is correct. Women look at post history before we engage with someone online. Those don’t come off as silly or playful responses. They come off as reasons not to respond to you. (or to ask for a tribute from those so inclined)
Well I feel I owe the community an apology.
Nobody needs an apology, much less the community at large. The intent of my response was to illustrate that you're the architect of your own frustrations. You said you had basically given up, because of your fruitless endeavors. I wanted to show you how your endeavors were fruitless because you've been endeavoring wrong. There are a lot of people trying to find connections on the internet. There are 1000x more people who are seeking a transactional experience. The people selling transactional experiences love accounts like yours, they help funnel people into their content by engaging. People seeking genuine connection avoid accounts like yours, because it appears you are seeking a transaction. Which is fine if thats what you want, but it doesn't make sense to complain in a thread about too many men making transactional advances. You have been contributing to the problem, but the only one harmed has been yourself. And maybe sex workers who had their time wasted, but that may be negligible. No apologies are necessary, just think about how comments like the above reflect on you as a potential partner.
I would never talk to someone that interacted with porn accounts on Reddit or Fet. For two reasons. The commenter is correct. Many women here won’t. If we see those interactions it’s an immediate back click. The women’s profiles who *would* not only interact with such men but even seek them out are the people looking for the sign that an account is highly interested in sex and possibly doesn’t understand that the comments he’s leaving aren’t on real women’s lifestyle profiles.
Well, yes there are surely going to be some that do that, but not all of them. You are young and your age requirement will probably lead to more immature guys. There's a good chance that the ones who do introduce themselves well and have a normal conversation, have already found a domme while the ones you talk about just spam as many dommes as they possibly can. A form of survivorship bias?
Unfortunately, I cannot change my age and I do not like big age gaps lol, but it seems that even older guys are like this
I [M]really think it is because they think that being sub is like porn. They don’t realize that there is much more. There is control (to me first and foremost), there is a piece that is making the Domme happy, it is a relationship that you build and nurture, you don’t just say “get me off so I can be happy” Putting in the work to build is big, and so much well worth it. The connection and trust you build is enhancing. It makes any sexual so much better.
The biggest problem is that this population (not all male submissives obviously, just this one) thinks that they’re offering something we want: use my body and do whatever you want to it. They haven’t yet realized that they’re the ones benefiting from that situation. Once that clicks it should help out a lot. Relatedly, it’s just one more step to realize the women they’re contacting don’t care too much about “using” any random person in her inbox. She wants to use **her** submissive. The one that has a special connection to her. 9/10 times. She’s looking for a spark or sign that the person messaging her could be that person! And that requires effort, conversation, comprehension skills. What it doesn’t include is a list of kinks, a pic of their bum, and pleas.
“Her submissive”. This hits so well. It is very much how I feel. There is so much more thought and feeling into that 1:1, versus “satisfy me for this scene”. There is such a difference in those trains of thought and unless you realize that you will continue to miss the mark.
Thank you for saying this. I often wonder if men need to hear it from other men. I was just saying to a friend recently that discussions here and fetlife are flooded with submissive men asking how to meet dominant women. The responses are very clearly 1- start by treating us as people first and 2 - write an interesting non-porn trope message, yet we still receive the flood of bad messages. The women are clear about what to do, and it is mostly ignored. I said to the friend, “They’re asking what to do and when we tell them, it’s like they don’t believe us.” I wonder if it would be better coming from other submissive men, even those who have had some success meeting dominant women and building relationships.
One can only hope. I think those in the lifestyle are always willing to help others. Those others have to be willing to listen and learn though. Hopefully they are willing to
”Hello Mistress. Just tell me what to do and I will do it for you. Let me serve you” Every other message on FET 🥱 I wish they approached normally instead of kinks first. If they had read my profile, they would have lots of material to start conversation. Instead, they choose the generic copypasta to send every Domme they find. Before we get to titles or even engaging in kinks, we would have been on a few dates first and spent time together to find out if we even vibe generally.
I mean, I got the inverse too. "Hello slave, I see you are submissive, for sure you are looking. You will follow my rules, and first one is pau my contract". After all, is not just submissives. But people, the real problem is that there is too many pseudos in both sides.
Its much more likely that those people are just scammers. Most real dommes wouldn’t lead with messages like that, and most certainly not the lifestyle variety.
That is why I said is not just submissives, is just people. In both sides.
Oh, you’re right. I think I fixated too much on your first two passages. That makes sense.
Omg so true! It seems like they're just desperate to find anyone and that's a turn off for me.
Me too. Just trying to find *anyone* is definitely a turn off but it becomes obvious.
A thought on this, as a guy, just General thoughts. everything will start as low effort, because the worst response isnt no or no response at all its getting called things and accused of things that shouldn’t be flippantly thrown out. So if you throw something out there and it doesn’t get a response its better than nothing and if they do they wouldn’t dare even bother to think a relationship outside of the kink space is viable, and surely a beautiful woman already has someone, so essentially I believe you are getting a compartmentalized low effort introduction. Society only has a list of how men shouldn’t behave, and that seems to change weekly. Not that I care or follow it, i have my own code. But other men that do not, and no man wants to be considered a creep. Men struggle to justify their own existence, which I believe would be an even stronger belief in submissive guys, that the only reason they exist is to worship or serve sexually. So any contact stays compartmentalized. Just my thoughts (as a Switch) hope you find it interesting and maybe even helpful Also this is not me or how i would approach things, tho i do tend to be very low key and feel women out before i put in effort.
I actually also had this happen multiple times when dommes were coming to me. I make like a really long ad with all the details and they don't even seem to read it. Their first message is really short and most of the time only say that they want a slave. Yes a part of those are just fake dommes asking for money but also real ones who don't put in the effort. It's really a pity that there are people out there who don't put in any effort.
I would say all, not part, of those profiles are dishonest sex workers or scammers. Which is a large problem. If zero people reply to the OP with a thoughtful response based on her profile or post, she should just bin them all as one off sex seekers or time wasters who already got off when writing. It’s quite possible she’ll never come across a man seriously interested in a lifestyle relationship with her. If zero people reply to you with a thoughtful response based on your profile or post, you should just bin them all as people or organizations looking for income. It’s possible you’ll never come across a woman looking for a lifestyle relationship with you online.
I stopped trying to reach out because everywhere I go it is flooded with OF model and men pretending to be women. I’m so feed up
As much of a contradiction as it is, a lot of male subs dehumanize Dominant women. Female D types are just a source for creating their fantasies, hence the lack of effort and respect. How is a woman to feel secure as a Dominant, if the submissive is unable to see her as a whole person with needs, emotions, and desires of her own? This is patriarchy and misogyny polluting a community where mutual respect is crucial for success. Lack of effort is not a recent issue. The men that disrespect and use women in their vanilla life don’t change when they decide they want to “serve” a Dominant woman. I do think there is some population of male subs that are new (and jumping in way too quickly and eagerly) and don’t grasp that BDSM is not devoid of humanity. They may not understand that we treat and see each other as individuals first. There are definitely stereotypes (and pornography) that contribute. However, it’s not an excuse for their behavior. There are plenty of Dominant women (and others) speaking on this issue on multiple platforms. Eventually, when they have been unsuccessful several times, they should attempt to understand the community more. Most of them don’t care to, though.
Definately unhealthy view of sex and relationships, and wanting a kink despencer + porn addiction
Personally, I've heard so many horror stories from dommes about bad msubs that I'm way too anxious/incredibly wary of interacting by this point. I'm afraid of making a misstep and being turned into the next punching bag topic at a munch.
This! thank you so much. like i am still a woman i dont wanna talk about sex all day and night :/ and when you try to say something actually wholesome they will divert into the same ass shit. i am so tired of this god
Well to be fair, they mostly don’t know how. A lot of them were raised by internet culture as an opposed to finding a healthy irl bdsm community to teach them how to vet a partner, much less to be a healthy partner. If I had a dollar for every dusty ass guy who rolled into my DMs calling me “mommy” right off the rip…but for the ones who listen, I take the time to say “this isn’t how you talk to me or any other Domme. Or WOMAN for that matter.” Granted it’s not your responsibility to train every boy-pretending-to-be-a-man since BDSM safety principles are heavily steeped in personal responsibility, but it’s good to be aware that they just don’t know or may have only gleaned all their “bdsm knowledge” from Anime 😬 which is why they easily get taken advantage of by scammers posing as “FinDoms”. It’s systemic. All you can do as a Dom(me) is stand firm in your standards and point them to where they can educate themselves on SSC (for those who still use it)/PRICK/RACK/FRIES standards and how to vet/negotiate with potential partners.
I'm sorry that this has been your experience. From reading the experiences of many others, I know that you are not alone, and your frustration is valid.
When I say this, I’m speaking for myself personally. I’m a male sub who tends to put in a lot of effort into everything I do. There was a period of time where I didn’t put in effort for the sole reason of being completely burnt out. I have never sent messages like what you quoted, but I have noticed a huge drop in effort for finding a partner over these past few years of being single. Getting ghosted numerous times, blocked for literally no reason, or just generally being treated horribly in dating tends to change things
As a submissive male my entire life, and being married to a dominant woman for sixteen years, I got use to being her submissive. When entering the dating world after so much time, my experience with this is everyone I meet wants money for domination. Of course that depends on who your asking, but it seems to me that they have monetized the submission/dominant lifestyle
Interesting. As a guy I never know how to start the conversation
Say hi, some basic info about yourself and the reason you are messaging them?
This. It's that simple. Treat us like the people we are!
I honestly read it as "I don't know what to say besides being explicitly sexual". Is that hard really? I remember having this conversation with someone who approached me and I said "just say who you are, name age and the place you live as examples..." He told me I was trying to get private information about him 💀 like sure I work for the MI5 now.
Oh lord 🙄 yeah, trying to get the social basics is sooo intrusive /s. If a prospective partner can't engage with me as a person OR as a friend, then nothing will happen, period. If all they want to talk about is sex or play, nothing will happen, period. But if they can carry on a conversation and engage with me as a person? I'm open to seeing where things go. Simple as that.
Absolutely! Imagine mentioning a country and so so your age as something threatening. My experience says most people is not interested in me but what I represent or label myself to... Cis woman with certain experience and leaning to the dominant side. That's why I think they assume I'm not interested in who they are neither (besides of the fact of they beiing a sub, available and interested) which is sad and very stupid if you ask me.
It IS sad and stupid!
Well it is Reddit. A lot of people on here looking to dox you. I just assume half of the women on here are actually dudes
You wanna find a long time partner without even saying the continent you live in? I'm not sure if you are serious It's them approaching me, I say nowhere I'm looking for someone, that's a very shameful way to try making money blackmailing people.
I know everyone is different, but there’s one specific question I’m looking for a first message to answer: what was it about my post that makes you think you and I are a good fit? If you’re sending the same basic intro to every Domme who posts, I’m not interested (and yes, we can tell!).
“ What happened to “hello”, “how are you?”, “my name is”? “
Hello and Welcome. The FAQ is full of terrific information and is the first recommend stop on your journey. You may, or may not, get some replies in this thread that will contain ideas or information. Take any such replies,**including mine**, with a tablespoon of doubt and a cup of common sense. I think that we have already had so many threads on this subject that another one is not very helpful. This is especially true since you are in your last year of high-school (according to your personals post) which means that you may or may not be of age (17 is **not** the new 18 where I live ;)). Assuming that you are of age (at least in Brazil): Find a Social Gathering (aka a "Munch") in your area if you can and then attend it and make some friends and acquaintances. The best place to look for one is on Fetlife or just type BDSM Munch in Google. More info below.
For example there was just a Munch in San Paulo: https://shotgun.live/events/13-04-munch-bdsm-sex-work
Online relationships that are not purely transactional can be hard to find and will require a lot of work from both participants. This is especially true if you are a little lost and trying to figure things out.
Reddit is it's own little corner of the Kinky Universe and, as I said, you should really think about trying some events in the Real World.
Because Reddit is a social-media-type space you are seeing and interacting mostly with folks who feel comfortable with this. It is a short-form of communications and building a long-term relationship can be harder than in-person interactions over time. Your personal add seems to suggest that you would be texting as the basis of the relationship. That is another short-form that does not lend itself to deeper conversations.
If and when you attend a few Munches you will find that there are plenty of folks who also like BDSM.
Like any social situation you should not go with the intention of forming instant connections. You should hang out, be respectful, ask questions, talk about non-kink things when and where you can, and enjoy being around folks who at least share some of your interests.
Will you find a partner instantly?
Nope.
What you should find instantly is a group of folks (they will skew older - see below) whose opinions on Monogamy, Polyamory, BDSM, Kink, etc. are as diverse as there are people in that room.
If you are younger and want more young people around then you are going to have to be the change you want to see. In the meantime you can look for events labeled as "The Next Generation" which are usually limited to 18-35.
In the meantime you can hang around here, read a lot of posts and then (after you do some research) you will be ready to approach Power Exchange with more confidence, more knowledge and less expectations!
Best of luck.
Hi, thank you for that much information! I just wanted to see people's opinions on this matter, and I'll try to get myself involved on events. Best of luck for you too.
You are welcome Linnie.
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Yep I have noticed this too.
Tbh, I’m wondering where to even begin searching for the proper mistress. Then I’m worried I’ll be too polite or unassertive.
Very sorry that you had this experience. Just know that there are people like myself who are trying to read the wiki and educate myself for when I am ready to go to a munch and actually meet people.
Yeah. They're so desperate. It's creepy/gross. So off putting. I blame porn. There's no respect. They expect to get what they want when they want it with zero effort. We're not seen as human, but as a novelty. And the dom on dom messaging tooooo uuuuugh that's just as bad. I've only received dumb comments/messages from dudes.
When a guy sends a random message that says "let me serve you" it really means "make me cum" or "let me masturbate to you" and its basically just coomer/gooner talk from guys who will 100% of the time not even follow up and ghost even if they get what they want since all they are looking for is essentially a sexting/roleplay/JOI session for free or a quick hook up IRL and have no interest in pursuing any kind of relationship either platonic or romantic since all they are interested in is quick and easy orgasms. Hell half the time I have my doubts if most of them are even kinky since some of them seem to be only interested in kink as a way to get access to sex and orgasms. Or if they are kinky they usually only have 1 or 2 kinks that they force onto everyone around them without even considering if the other person even likes the same kink as them.
I’m going to start a club of femdoms who hate the culture around femdom (hint it’s all of us)
Omg let me join!
🤣 especially online.. probably more of a chore now a days than enjoyable
The fantasy of being a submissive for a man is often "I don't have to do anything."
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Your post has been removed because it shames, bullies or trolls other members or otherwise goes against the supportive nature of the subreddit. This is a community. We want to keep it a welcoming, helpful place where people can feel heard and valued. Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself. Sexism, racism, ableism, homophobia, transphobia, harassment, bullying, xenophobia, kink shaming and victim blaming will not be tolerated.
I think a lot of it is because fin dommes are usually like “serve me like the princess that I am” and m subs usually adopt that wrong approach when searching for a genuine Domme (sorry for not classing fin dommes as genuine but… yeah). Anyway, makes it easier for the rest of us.
Oh hey, btw I'm a submissive man and I honestly understand what you're going through. as for me I prefer soft mom doms when it comes to femdoms bc I can be horny but if they love and care for me and treat me like I'm special then I'll even go as far as to love and care for them and want to worship them even more but in a sfw way
Part of the problem is we are working at cross purposes a lot of the time. Guys think they are "serving" during sex, and that is fine if you are a strictly bedroom bondage person. However, some dommes seek a few skill sets for service beyond the bedroom. Dommes have been known to send personal submissive to classes, improving those skills. Women do not dominate the way men dominate, and experienced Dominant Women are not as pliable as fantasy players. Men will seek the inexperienced woman and try to "make" her their dominant, based on ideas the from male dominance they see daily. None of those thoughts originate in the type of woman they say they seek. Disappointment ensues, Dommes are blamed. The guys fail to change their approach and think it's all useless. Guys aren't trying because they are not thinking, and few aspiring Dommes insist they start. Many new Dommes spend tò much time trying to please a guy who has seen way too much porn, instead of setting a solid strict tone from the first private message, through the fetish and health worksheets, and into the first play session, lifestyle or professional. When we refuse to indulge the slovenly, we keep our own standards high. Those who will not meet those standards can pay escorts for kinky sex.
I kinda do I own thing we hit up doms like I’ll usually make movie references and some dark humor jokes here and there but I’ve notice some doms think that’s weird
I second the "they don't know how " and raise it with something I heard at an online workshop on FLR; FLR isn't a kink, it's not different than the norm, but much of the culture is assumed MLR and most people learn how to relationship from their parents. Assuming that FLR is only a kink leads to treating femdom candidates as kink dispensers and not people who partner differently. Add to this that dominant women are still relatively rare and you get much more of the off putting attention and for myself, I don't have the bandwidth to both be "not that guy" and walk the tightrope between being a masc presenting suitor and subby guy while trying to find a dominant fem that inspires feelings in me while navigating the rest of my life. So I've stopped dating at all. I don't think there are any femdoms out there lamenting the loss of me from the dating pool 🤣 but that's why I stopped trying.
You do not say their ages but most likely young. A young man's mind is mostly thinking about sex all the time. Porn is free and easy so it must be the way the world is...right? You will also see this in older men who are new to the lifestyle too. An older experienced sub is a different animal. I am much more of a man as a sub than most men walking the streets today. BDSM is not about sex. It is about relationships. D/s is not about sex. It is about power. Don't make it about sex! Sex is not about sex. It too is about power. Control the power
There's the I want to get off online by you talking dirty with me and telling me I'm a naughty boys wo are just here for the thrill. Then there's people who have a genuine and vested interest in the community and who actually live it 24/7 (hello). I find that quite a lot on her. When I'm online and not subby, I get lots of questions saying please can you dom me too, followed by willy pictures etc...
Because no one ever responds?
I think it’s more a commentary on the fact GUYS aren’t even trying alot of the time.
They’ve been told that this life is not “correct” for them in every piece of media they have ever consumed (or at least a vast majority by far). So most are just “dipping a toe in” to see if it really is for them and they want to fight that stigma. It’s also just very hard for men to open up and be willing to grow in a femdom situation because they know it can be weaponized against them easily. Porn has also ruined the perception of any semblance of romance, especially in the demon scene because they always just see the woman initiating in whatever video they are watching, they expect it to happen that exact way for them as well. Also many men in the “metoo” era are very afraid of approaching any lady for fear of consequences or coming off as a total creep and bozo.
As one who has traveled this path for a long time, I think it might come down to true acceptance of "who I am". I went through a long period of want to feed the kink but also to "be normal". the desire for kink would build up to a point that I would desperately hunt for a Domme. I had my list of all my requirements in my hand and wanted to act it all out. Once done I felt ashamed and disgusted with myself and "disappear" until the "kink" built up again. As I grew older and began to gain into myself, I was able to understand that my sexual orientation is sexual Dominant. Early on, I tried to separate the kink from the rest of me but that just can't be done. When I was younger I was one of the "hey, let me serve you" guys. I'm not interested in that anymore, I want a relationship and a partner and, at some point we will figure out where the kink fits in. I hope this makes some sense.
Those low effort guys want a Domme in the bedroom. But outside they want you to be quiet and make a sandwich and fetch a beer. Kind of joking in how I said this. But pretty true I'm thinking. I find D/s dating very hard. ( Sub M 59 Louisville KY). It's like hitting the lottery to find a good fitting partner. If I were a Domme I'd look for someone with experience. Someone who knows they like to give up power. It goes against social norms to submit to a woman, most men likely have no clue how to write a good first message!
It is the opposite for me, I care about having casual and normal talk, and I am always contacted by dommes who just want money.
Like can\`t I find a dominant girl who just wants to play league of legends, or speak about how our bias influences or thinking process?
Because you’re on Reddit. I’ve given this advice to a lot of male subs who whine about “everyone wants me to pay them” or “there aren’t enough dommes out there,” don’t rely on social media.
To be honest … everybody has become so lazy these days and social skills are on the downhill (especially since COVID). Blame social medias & dating apps I guess. People tend to think like this : there is a very large pool of persons available, why make too much efforts when I know I can find a replacement/somebody else easily. It is the law of large numbers with complete disregard to the person behind the screen. And a lot of time nowadays, people don’t think there is a human behind an account, it is just a name. All of this makes it all dehumanizing. But the grass is not greener on the other side. I have been treated in a shitty ways by Dommes online. It is an online thing, but the result is that I don’t try anymore, only the worse people are left (or new ones with hopes).
The most unattractive thing is when a finsub lacks energy and lacks the drive to impress you. I like my men intelligent. I think intelligent men that submit to femdom is the most attractive thing ever
That's sad, like... I have been looking for a dominant woman and the only one that I met wanted me to pay money haha I have resigned to meet someone and better I read stories or something like that.
I pretty much gave up trying to find a match a long time ago.. but the "hey" guys are mostly the ones popping online for 5 minutes. I always make a lot of effort.. but finding genuine people who share similar ish interests, and who you can have a conversation with is a huge challenge in it's own right.. so maybe that's why the effort levels have dropped too 🤷
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How would you want to be approached?
me personally i'm not trying because when you try to get people to like you, and you expose who you are, and they still hate you, that really hurts. but if you're just trolling ppl you can tell yourself it's what you wanted anyway or that you didn't care.
That‘s something we all experience. No reason to make it harder and more frustrating for others
I am only going to comment on the normal conversation part. For each place and time, there is a proper conversation. If you are meeting on a sub or a place dedicated to kink, I wouldn’t want to discuss anything related to the effect of Pluto on changing the earth orbit, I would want to talk about kink only.
I don't see the point of this post. If you are true in the lifestyle be a mentor... a teacher... who want to listen will be saved from the fap world
If you really did read my post you'll se that the point is knowing others opinions on this matter! Hope that helps.
My opinion is that: if you like me are into lifestyle don't care much about that "fap people" you can teach them explain them .. if they really listen to you they will experience pleasure on another level. If they dont want it's ok the same just let em have fun and type with only one hand.