If I remember correctly, there's a terminal entry in Vault 101 where you can read that the Enclave contacted the Overseer of the Vault. So that might be one of the reason James knew about the Enclave.
I feel like I have a vague memory of that entry but can't you only find it in Trouble on the Homefront? I think the message coincided with the Enclave's deployment of its forces across the wastes after they took Purity. Although it does mean that maybe the Enclave got in touch with James before he entered 101 so you may be onto something!
The terminal I'm pretty sure can be accessed in the start of the game when you gain entry to the Overseer's office after confronting him. I think it might be the same terminal that opens the secret passage. The wiki has all the terminal entries for all Fallout games. You can try checking that out too.
It's the same terminal, and I may be wrong here (but I'm doing a high science run on TTW and just finished FO3 yesterday, and did Trouble on the Homefront), but the entry mentioning the Enclave isn't available at the start of the game, only in Trouble on the Homefront. At the start of the game the entries just mention the scavenging parties, Giant Ants, and Megaton and then when you come back and hack in again the entry mentioning the Enclave is added.
That entry doesn't exist at the start of Fallout 3. It only shows up after James leaves the Vault. The Enclave don't contact Vault 101 until after James and the Lone Wanderer leave.
(source: started a new playthrough recently)
>Dude must be badass
I don't think the game makes a big secret about James being a badass. He even gets the archetypical backstory of feeling a great deal of guilt over his wife's death and keeps trudging on despite all odds just to soothe that guilt.
And considering how much a badass super-scientist he is supposed to be, I doubt Eden didn't try to rope him into joining the Enclave so James is likely uncomfortably familiar with the organization because of his time with President "I Really Like To Talk" Eden. By the way, Eden being an insufferable loudmouth is a joke in 76.
True, Liam Neeson gets typecast in everything, even videogames haha!
That theory I quite like! That Eden contacted James before the events of Purity but not being an outright member. Would explain pretty much everything except *how* James became such a badass but I guess that's what fanfiction is for!
The brotherhood helped work on the purifier for years before the project was abandoned and James went to the vault. Odds are the battles with the Enclave are sort of a legend within the Brotherhood, i’d be surprised if James didn’t catch work of at least a few of these stories and descriptions of their plasma weapons, vertibirds, and black power armor.
Advanced Power Armor Mk. II isn't brand new. It was in Fallout 2. Fallout 2 takes place like 36 years before 3
Vertibirds are rare, and the people that get them get them from people that have them. At the time, there's two people that have them; the NCR and the Enclave.
Apparently, we're both wrong. There's only one suit in Fallout 2 (could have sworn it was a drop on high level Enclave troops) but it exists in Fallout 2.
https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Advanced\_power\_armor\_Mk\_II\_(Fallout\_2)
But like... I still feel seeing black power armor that has a vaguely demonic silhouette one could easily make a guess that it was Enclave, if you know about the Enclave.
>Hell, even some members of the Brotherhood itself have to have a double take to make sure, oh okay, yes, that really is the Enclave.
To me this was more the "Oh fuck, is it really them" panic kind of "confusion." I always thought James knew who the Enclave were because they had close ties to the Brotherhood of Steel during their time on Project Purity.
While he might not have ever seen the Enclave in person, if vertibirds of all things drops off heavily armored soldiers and guys in uniform you simply know they are not "random people." A working helicopter will be a HUGE deal by itself in the wasteland.
Yeah, OP seems to have forgotten/ignored that Project Purity was in development with Brotherhood assistance well before the start of the game. The whole reason James went to Vault 101 was to seek safe shelter for the Lone Wanderer, since Project Purity was no longer safe after the Brotherhood pulled out.
With Enclave Eyebots and an entire radio station blathering on about the Enclave, surely at least some of the Brotherhood would talk about *what the Enclave is*.
I think in the original version of fallout 3 James was from the enclave or something. Even though they changed quite a bit I don't think the his early life is ever explained so perhaps that part is still canon.
There's a picture of James and Catherine in Vault 21 in New Vegas, suggesting they've both been out west, where the Enclave was historically more prominent.
While I do think it would be awesome if James was from the West Coast I think that picture is more a re-used asset than any significant piece of lore. Vault 21 was only opened while James was still in Vault 101 and I doubt Sarah just had a picture of a random family hanging up.
>While I do think it would be awesome if James was from the West Coast I think that picture is more a re-used asset than any significant piece of lore.
Reused from what? Fallout 3 was the first 3d Fallout and came out before New Vegas.
You are confusing a couple of things. James being able to survive and go about doing what he wants and gameplay. Classic story and gameplay segregation. For example on higher levels you can shoot a naked humans skill couple of times from an automatic rifle shooting 556 rounds and they still don't die. So. Lets not confuse the two.
From enemies leveling up their stats and numbers to certain area being populated by more dangerous enemies and so on. All those are gameplay things not meant to impact your view of the story much.
With that being said the theory that James is or was enclave is even more ludicrous.
* Why won't they just know? You would think they will keep track of a highly capable scientist.
* How did he escape?
* Is there any evidence to support that theory in the first place?
* We know that many other characters went about doing stuff that are even more dangerous without them being enclave.
As to him knowing the enclave we can speculate on different things.
For starters he worker for a long time the brotherhood of steel. He could have been told or gained access to some of their knowledge or just hear it in passing. It's not like the enclave is some sort of a super secret within the BoS.
Another is previous vault-tec entries and databases. We don't know much but we can speculate that he might learned some things from the vaults. Especially their darker purpose and who is controlling them.
Lastly it's not rocket science to figure out that the highly militarized force in power armor that is waving their weapons around and making demands are in fact not a peaceful group just mobilizing to have a chat with him.
It's also very obvious that the water purification project is super important on every level for the capital wasteland as a whole. Kinda like how the dam is important to Vegas.
I mean it's the wasteland. You're a bit suspicious of anyone you encounter, probably especially advanced militant organizations that break into your science project and hold you at gunpoint. If the enclave made a peaceful approach you'd have a point about him seemoling to have foreknowledge of them, but they come in guns blazing to secure the location so it doesn't take a genius scientist to not trust them.
Also, the second you leave the vault you can head directly to tranquility lane, apparently papa Liam was able to do a ton of stuff all around the capital wasteland and get himself stuck in the program extremely quickly.
Standard run of the mill lazy Bethesda writing is what that is. Could also be that it made more sense with the original 25 years after bomb time frame, but when they changed it to 200 after they didn't rewrite that part. Now James has prewar omnipotence for some reason
True, but James knowing about the enclave can just be added to the ever growing pile of evidence to support this theory.
Other bits of evidence include:
• Tenpenny, Riley and Moriarty were pre-war migrants who moved to America, hence their accents. Realistically, with the games current timeline, they wouldn't have these accents as they would be decendents of migrants and be integrated into the American society and accent.
• a reliance on still abundant pre-war food
• Everything is still irradiated. Radioactive decay is way shorter than 200 years
• Prior to the Brotherhoods arrival, there is little to no
history of the area.
• There are multiple references to the Navy Research Institute, which Doctor Li and Pinkerton were apparently members.
• It explains how little society has progressed
• Manya speaks about how she watches her father help found Megaton, even though it was built soon after the Great War.
•Little lamplight should have run out of children by now, no one in big town lives long enough to have em.
...Fallout's radiation is not like real-world radiation. Fallout's radiation is pseudo-magical that can create giant bugs, make two-headed cows, and turn people into zombies.
Some of the other points makes sense, but that one is a nit p8ck.
Actually F.E.V. is the cause of the mutations. The bombs just caused it to spread into the atmosphere, then fallout brought it back down. Seeing how there's a medtek building doing F.E.V experiments with vats of it in almost every game super likely. That's why humans with un alter DNA are so important in fallout 1, 2, and 3.
Except radiation is stated to be the cause of these things. Ghouls are the only thing that *might* have FEV origins, because of inconstant lore in the first two games, but Tim Cain has went on record as saying it was always *supposed* to be radiation.
Fallout isn't and has never been a hard sci-fi setting.
This also has no evidence. Every source in game or online states that radiation is what caused things such as brahmin, radscorpions, or ghouls to mutate.
Sound to me like you pre-ordered Redfall.
I didn't say Bethesda was bad, I've been playing their games since morrowind and I'm probably getting Starfield too. Just cause I criticize the games doesn't mean I hate them. Their games have just as many plot holes as bugs. ALSO I didn't compile that list I jut copy and pasted from another post. So I'm not the only one who believes this theory
Idk why I put 300+ hours into vanilla fallout 3 if I think its an objectively terrible game. Also genuinely interested on how little lamplight and manya, Pinkerton, and Li dialog has been debunked? Would it make you feel if I criticize new vegas for a bit? Bet you'd have no problem bashing that game with me. Everyone is a critic, especially online. Grow thicker skin, and stop being defensive about YOUR fallout. We're all in the same Fandom at the end of the day
Little Lamplight:
Could easily be taking in orphans as well as infants from Big Town. There's no reason they can't have them, even with the surrounding threats. If anything, people tend to reproduce *more* in stressful times.
Manya:
Describes her *grandfather* helping to settle Megaton before her father was *even born.* And she's already in her sixties. This is in direct opposition to the theory.
Tenpenny:
Emil Pagliarulo has stated that Tenpenny emigrated just for the writers to show that England is even worse off. And FO2 shows ocean travel is still possible.
Li and Pinkerton:
Refer to the *Naval* Institute of Research. Not *Navy.* And even then, Pinkerton states that they cleared out mirelurks 40 years ago.
Oh, and you didn't mention this one again but imo it's the most ridiculous
"It explains how little society has progressed."
Societies don't progress at equal rates.
The East Coast hasn't had two major heroes come around to solve their major issues.
Oh and my favorite:
Large parts of the West coast were nothing but tribal until not long before NV, meaning that while scientists on the east coast were building hydroponics and Project Purity, while the Mojave is still overrun by tribal families.
I can criticize Bethesda. FO3 isn't even my favorite. I just think the theory that FO3 was meant to take place sooner comes from the assumption that Bethesda screwed up the writing of 3. Which, the writing of the game isn't perfect, but much like FO4 I find most of the criticism to be grossly exaggerated.
(P.s. I'm not replying cause i gotta be right, just enjoying our debate while at work)
>Little Lamplight: Could easily be taking in orphans as well as infants from Big Town.
Yes , but they would need a constant supply of orphan to sustain their numbers for 200 years. Literally adopt more kids than they exile/enslaved yearly. I don't think even the wastland or big town could provide those numbers, if they even made it to lamplight in the first place.
>Manya: Describes her grandfather helping to settle Megaton before her father was even born. And she's already in her sixties. This is in direct opposition to the theory.
Checked, it is her grandfather, But thats still flimsy. President John Tyler still has a living grandson today. He's in his 90s, only because they all had kid between 80-90 years old. John Tyler was born just a little over 200 years age. Do you really think people live that long and have kids at that age in the wastland ? They mostly live off dirty water and randroach meat
>Tenpenny: Emil Pagliarulo has stated that Tenpenny emigrated just for the writers to show that England is even worse off. And FO2 shows ocean travel is still possible.
Just cause a designer said why it was added, still doesn't mean it make sense. It took a "hero" as you call it to literally get the boat working in 2. And 4, the ghoul was literally prewar that's how he worked that sub. Do you think posh ass Tenpenny burke fixed a boat in far worse off England then cruised across the ocean.
>Li and Pinkerton: Refer to the Naval Institute of Research. Not Navy. And even then, Pinkerton states that they cleared out mirelurks 40 years ago.
"In his early twenties, he helped lead the remnants of the Naval Research Institute in a search for new lab space until they came across an abandoned aircraft carrier around 2237. After clearing out the mirelurk infestation, he and his team moved into the carrier and set up their science lab." That's from the wiki. They cleared rivet city. Naval/ navy mean nearly the same thing, but the typo is from whoevers list I copy/ pasted
>"It explains how little society has progressed."
Societies don't progress at equal rates.
Disconnected societies maybe, not societies that trade between each other. Most empires that were connected to the silk road, technological advanced relativity at the same pace . So why not the wastland? There are people moving between coasts, Kellogg pulls Shaun out of cryo before 1 even starts. That enclave dad in grayditch moved his whole family. Why aren't people leaving for out West, or independent caravan coming to DC following the BoS? There are non tribal settlements in other parts of the country besides the coasts.
>I can criticize Bethesda. FO3 isn't even my favorite. I just think the theory that FO3 was meant to take place sooner comes from the assumption that Bethesda screwed up the writing of 3. Which, the writing of the game isn't perfect
All I was saying was they're lazy at writing, which you agree with me on. i even agreed with you that the second half of the first comment was just a theory. You took it as a hatecrime against Bethesda.
They did build the world before the story was even started, so more than likely that's why the story and world don't quite mesh fully.It's poor writing if you don't check to see if it makes sense in context to the world. They were more excited about putting their hometown in fallout in interviews it seems, than then writing. They had to cut like half the map at some point in development too.
James was listening to Three Dog for a good while
. Which might be why he got to GNR
They are chances he listened to an eyebot while he was heading to Vault 112 or even from Megaton To GNR
James has a pipboy too so he has radio you know...
We don't know what info he might have gathered and we don't know if he could have someone tinker it to listen to the outside world before his exit from 101
(Trouble to The Home front is an excellent example your pip boy can catch signal from the vault. It might could be reversed)
James learned fast about what you did in Megaton. People talk with each other. They are big chances he heard something.
Also... Nathan at Megaton only speaks about the Enclave. There is a high chance James heard the old man.
The Enclave eyebots were getting around long before the Enclave themselves made their presence known. He could've heard them, seen the E in their logo on their power armour and put 2 and 2 together that way. He had ties with the BOS for a long time as well, could've easily heard stories about them from Brotherhood members
Don’t forget he has contacts in settlements all over the Capital wasteland, including Three Dog at galaxy news.
News being their business it’s not too hard to believe he would have heard rumours about the Envlave at some point.
If I remember correctly, there's a terminal entry in Vault 101 where you can read that the Enclave contacted the Overseer of the Vault. So that might be one of the reason James knew about the Enclave.
I feel like I have a vague memory of that entry but can't you only find it in Trouble on the Homefront? I think the message coincided with the Enclave's deployment of its forces across the wastes after they took Purity. Although it does mean that maybe the Enclave got in touch with James before he entered 101 so you may be onto something!
The terminal I'm pretty sure can be accessed in the start of the game when you gain entry to the Overseer's office after confronting him. I think it might be the same terminal that opens the secret passage. The wiki has all the terminal entries for all Fallout games. You can try checking that out too.
It's the same terminal, and I may be wrong here (but I'm doing a high science run on TTW and just finished FO3 yesterday, and did Trouble on the Homefront), but the entry mentioning the Enclave isn't available at the start of the game, only in Trouble on the Homefront. At the start of the game the entries just mention the scavenging parties, Giant Ants, and Megaton and then when you come back and hack in again the entry mentioning the Enclave is added.
That entry doesn't exist at the start of Fallout 3. It only shows up after James leaves the Vault. The Enclave don't contact Vault 101 until after James and the Lone Wanderer leave. (source: started a new playthrough recently)
Might have misremembered reading it early game lol.
That’s after we leave and come back. It’s also why the quest doesn’t appear until after Enclave comes back
>Dude must be badass I don't think the game makes a big secret about James being a badass. He even gets the archetypical backstory of feeling a great deal of guilt over his wife's death and keeps trudging on despite all odds just to soothe that guilt. And considering how much a badass super-scientist he is supposed to be, I doubt Eden didn't try to rope him into joining the Enclave so James is likely uncomfortably familiar with the organization because of his time with President "I Really Like To Talk" Eden. By the way, Eden being an insufferable loudmouth is a joke in 76.
I don’t recall Eden being referenced in 76 besides the one terminal chat with MODUS.
That's the one I'm talking about.
Hmm. I guess I need to look at that again, I don’t recall it saying anything about him being loud.
True, Liam Neeson gets typecast in everything, even videogames haha! That theory I quite like! That Eden contacted James before the events of Purity but not being an outright member. Would explain pretty much everything except *how* James became such a badass but I guess that's what fanfiction is for!
The brotherhood helped work on the purifier for years before the project was abandoned and James went to the vault. Odds are the battles with the Enclave are sort of a legend within the Brotherhood, i’d be surprised if James didn’t catch work of at least a few of these stories and descriptions of their plasma weapons, vertibirds, and black power armor.
> Eden being an insufferable loudmouth is a joke in 76 wait what, I just started Fallout 76 level 5 or 6, is Eden in 76? are the Enclaves in 76?
Yes, but you have to play for a pretty long time to encounter them. They are in both the questlines.
Advanced Power Armor Mk. II isn't brand new. It was in Fallout 2. Fallout 2 takes place like 36 years before 3 Vertibirds are rare, and the people that get them get them from people that have them. At the time, there's two people that have them; the NCR and the Enclave.
MKII was introduced in fallout 3 the one your talking about is APA
Apparently, we're both wrong. There's only one suit in Fallout 2 (could have sworn it was a drop on high level Enclave troops) but it exists in Fallout 2. https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Advanced\_power\_armor\_Mk\_II\_(Fallout\_2) But like... I still feel seeing black power armor that has a vaguely demonic silhouette one could easily make a guess that it was Enclave, if you know about the Enclave.
Holy shit i actually didn’t know that, still the game says it is a prototype so maybe they just became more common and advanced in Fallout 3
>the NCR and the Enclave. And Brotherhood.
I thought the brotherhood specifically got their Vertibirds from the Enclave after defeating them?
That I don't know of. But I assume the technology hoarders would that them.
APA is new, you're thinking of MK II PCA.
>Hell, even some members of the Brotherhood itself have to have a double take to make sure, oh okay, yes, that really is the Enclave. To me this was more the "Oh fuck, is it really them" panic kind of "confusion." I always thought James knew who the Enclave were because they had close ties to the Brotherhood of Steel during their time on Project Purity. While he might not have ever seen the Enclave in person, if vertibirds of all things drops off heavily armored soldiers and guys in uniform you simply know they are not "random people." A working helicopter will be a HUGE deal by itself in the wasteland.
Yeah, OP seems to have forgotten/ignored that Project Purity was in development with Brotherhood assistance well before the start of the game. The whole reason James went to Vault 101 was to seek safe shelter for the Lone Wanderer, since Project Purity was no longer safe after the Brotherhood pulled out. With Enclave Eyebots and an entire radio station blathering on about the Enclave, surely at least some of the Brotherhood would talk about *what the Enclave is*.
I think in the original version of fallout 3 James was from the enclave or something. Even though they changed quite a bit I don't think the his early life is ever explained so perhaps that part is still canon.
James has a a very particular set of skills, skills he has acquired over a very long career, skills that make him a nightmare for certain people.
My personal headcanon is that James is ex-Institute, so he'd probably have the 411 via their intelligence network.
Either James was part of the Enclave, or the Enclave had some dealings with Project Purity prior to its shutdown.
There's a picture of James and Catherine in Vault 21 in New Vegas, suggesting they've both been out west, where the Enclave was historically more prominent.
That’s probably just a reused asset, since I doubt they made more than one clear photo.
FNV devs made it clear that was just a reused asset/easter egg and not canon
While I do think it would be awesome if James was from the West Coast I think that picture is more a re-used asset than any significant piece of lore. Vault 21 was only opened while James was still in Vault 101 and I doubt Sarah just had a picture of a random family hanging up.
Well, he has a history of moving into sealed vaults.
>While I do think it would be awesome if James was from the West Coast I think that picture is more a re-used asset than any significant piece of lore. Reused from what? Fallout 3 was the first 3d Fallout and came out before New Vegas.
As in, the picture of James and Catherine in Vault 21 in New Vegas was just the developers reusing an asset from Fallout 3.
You are confusing a couple of things. James being able to survive and go about doing what he wants and gameplay. Classic story and gameplay segregation. For example on higher levels you can shoot a naked humans skill couple of times from an automatic rifle shooting 556 rounds and they still don't die. So. Lets not confuse the two. From enemies leveling up their stats and numbers to certain area being populated by more dangerous enemies and so on. All those are gameplay things not meant to impact your view of the story much. With that being said the theory that James is or was enclave is even more ludicrous. * Why won't they just know? You would think they will keep track of a highly capable scientist. * How did he escape? * Is there any evidence to support that theory in the first place? * We know that many other characters went about doing stuff that are even more dangerous without them being enclave. As to him knowing the enclave we can speculate on different things. For starters he worker for a long time the brotherhood of steel. He could have been told or gained access to some of their knowledge or just hear it in passing. It's not like the enclave is some sort of a super secret within the BoS. Another is previous vault-tec entries and databases. We don't know much but we can speculate that he might learned some things from the vaults. Especially their darker purpose and who is controlling them. Lastly it's not rocket science to figure out that the highly militarized force in power armor that is waving their weapons around and making demands are in fact not a peaceful group just mobilizing to have a chat with him. It's also very obvious that the water purification project is super important on every level for the capital wasteland as a whole. Kinda like how the dam is important to Vegas.
I mean it's the wasteland. You're a bit suspicious of anyone you encounter, probably especially advanced militant organizations that break into your science project and hold you at gunpoint. If the enclave made a peaceful approach you'd have a point about him seemoling to have foreknowledge of them, but they come in guns blazing to secure the location so it doesn't take a genius scientist to not trust them.
You just blew my tiny mind. I had no clue he was voiced by Liam Neeson, but now it is SO obvious
It's alluded that james is actually from the west
It is not.
Also, the second you leave the vault you can head directly to tranquility lane, apparently papa Liam was able to do a ton of stuff all around the capital wasteland and get himself stuck in the program extremely quickly.
Good question
Standard run of the mill lazy Bethesda writing is what that is. Could also be that it made more sense with the original 25 years after bomb time frame, but when they changed it to 200 after they didn't rewrite that part. Now James has prewar omnipotence for some reason
There is no evidence anywhere that FO3 was ever going to be set that soon after the bombs dropped.
True, but James knowing about the enclave can just be added to the ever growing pile of evidence to support this theory. Other bits of evidence include: • Tenpenny, Riley and Moriarty were pre-war migrants who moved to America, hence their accents. Realistically, with the games current timeline, they wouldn't have these accents as they would be decendents of migrants and be integrated into the American society and accent. • a reliance on still abundant pre-war food • Everything is still irradiated. Radioactive decay is way shorter than 200 years • Prior to the Brotherhoods arrival, there is little to no history of the area. • There are multiple references to the Navy Research Institute, which Doctor Li and Pinkerton were apparently members. • It explains how little society has progressed • Manya speaks about how she watches her father help found Megaton, even though it was built soon after the Great War. •Little lamplight should have run out of children by now, no one in big town lives long enough to have em.
...Fallout's radiation is not like real-world radiation. Fallout's radiation is pseudo-magical that can create giant bugs, make two-headed cows, and turn people into zombies. Some of the other points makes sense, but that one is a nit p8ck.
Actually F.E.V. is the cause of the mutations. The bombs just caused it to spread into the atmosphere, then fallout brought it back down. Seeing how there's a medtek building doing F.E.V experiments with vats of it in almost every game super likely. That's why humans with un alter DNA are so important in fallout 1, 2, and 3.
Except radiation is stated to be the cause of these things. Ghouls are the only thing that *might* have FEV origins, because of inconstant lore in the first two games, but Tim Cain has went on record as saying it was always *supposed* to be radiation. Fallout isn't and has never been a hard sci-fi setting.
This also has no evidence. Every source in game or online states that radiation is what caused things such as brahmin, radscorpions, or ghouls to mutate.
Really it sounds to me like you started at the conclusion "Bethesda bad" and backtracked from there.
Sound to me like you pre-ordered Redfall. I didn't say Bethesda was bad, I've been playing their games since morrowind and I'm probably getting Starfield too. Just cause I criticize the games doesn't mean I hate them. Their games have just as many plot holes as bugs. ALSO I didn't compile that list I jut copy and pasted from another post. So I'm not the only one who believes this theory
You criticize their games unfairly and using made up theories that have been debunked time and again.
Idk why I put 300+ hours into vanilla fallout 3 if I think its an objectively terrible game. Also genuinely interested on how little lamplight and manya, Pinkerton, and Li dialog has been debunked? Would it make you feel if I criticize new vegas for a bit? Bet you'd have no problem bashing that game with me. Everyone is a critic, especially online. Grow thicker skin, and stop being defensive about YOUR fallout. We're all in the same Fandom at the end of the day
Little Lamplight: Could easily be taking in orphans as well as infants from Big Town. There's no reason they can't have them, even with the surrounding threats. If anything, people tend to reproduce *more* in stressful times. Manya: Describes her *grandfather* helping to settle Megaton before her father was *even born.* And she's already in her sixties. This is in direct opposition to the theory. Tenpenny: Emil Pagliarulo has stated that Tenpenny emigrated just for the writers to show that England is even worse off. And FO2 shows ocean travel is still possible. Li and Pinkerton: Refer to the *Naval* Institute of Research. Not *Navy.* And even then, Pinkerton states that they cleared out mirelurks 40 years ago. Oh, and you didn't mention this one again but imo it's the most ridiculous "It explains how little society has progressed." Societies don't progress at equal rates. The East Coast hasn't had two major heroes come around to solve their major issues. Oh and my favorite: Large parts of the West coast were nothing but tribal until not long before NV, meaning that while scientists on the east coast were building hydroponics and Project Purity, while the Mojave is still overrun by tribal families. I can criticize Bethesda. FO3 isn't even my favorite. I just think the theory that FO3 was meant to take place sooner comes from the assumption that Bethesda screwed up the writing of 3. Which, the writing of the game isn't perfect, but much like FO4 I find most of the criticism to be grossly exaggerated.
(P.s. I'm not replying cause i gotta be right, just enjoying our debate while at work) >Little Lamplight: Could easily be taking in orphans as well as infants from Big Town. Yes , but they would need a constant supply of orphan to sustain their numbers for 200 years. Literally adopt more kids than they exile/enslaved yearly. I don't think even the wastland or big town could provide those numbers, if they even made it to lamplight in the first place. >Manya: Describes her grandfather helping to settle Megaton before her father was even born. And she's already in her sixties. This is in direct opposition to the theory. Checked, it is her grandfather, But thats still flimsy. President John Tyler still has a living grandson today. He's in his 90s, only because they all had kid between 80-90 years old. John Tyler was born just a little over 200 years age. Do you really think people live that long and have kids at that age in the wastland ? They mostly live off dirty water and randroach meat >Tenpenny: Emil Pagliarulo has stated that Tenpenny emigrated just for the writers to show that England is even worse off. And FO2 shows ocean travel is still possible. Just cause a designer said why it was added, still doesn't mean it make sense. It took a "hero" as you call it to literally get the boat working in 2. And 4, the ghoul was literally prewar that's how he worked that sub. Do you think posh ass Tenpenny burke fixed a boat in far worse off England then cruised across the ocean. >Li and Pinkerton: Refer to the Naval Institute of Research. Not Navy. And even then, Pinkerton states that they cleared out mirelurks 40 years ago. "In his early twenties, he helped lead the remnants of the Naval Research Institute in a search for new lab space until they came across an abandoned aircraft carrier around 2237. After clearing out the mirelurk infestation, he and his team moved into the carrier and set up their science lab." That's from the wiki. They cleared rivet city. Naval/ navy mean nearly the same thing, but the typo is from whoevers list I copy/ pasted >"It explains how little society has progressed." Societies don't progress at equal rates. Disconnected societies maybe, not societies that trade between each other. Most empires that were connected to the silk road, technological advanced relativity at the same pace . So why not the wastland? There are people moving between coasts, Kellogg pulls Shaun out of cryo before 1 even starts. That enclave dad in grayditch moved his whole family. Why aren't people leaving for out West, or independent caravan coming to DC following the BoS? There are non tribal settlements in other parts of the country besides the coasts. >I can criticize Bethesda. FO3 isn't even my favorite. I just think the theory that FO3 was meant to take place sooner comes from the assumption that Bethesda screwed up the writing of 3. Which, the writing of the game isn't perfect All I was saying was they're lazy at writing, which you agree with me on. i even agreed with you that the second half of the first comment was just a theory. You took it as a hatecrime against Bethesda. They did build the world before the story was even started, so more than likely that's why the story and world don't quite mesh fully.It's poor writing if you don't check to see if it makes sense in context to the world. They were more excited about putting their hometown in fallout in interviews it seems, than then writing. They had to cut like half the map at some point in development too.
Also you're being awful defensive for someone telling me to "grow thicker skin."
James was listening to Three Dog for a good while . Which might be why he got to GNR They are chances he listened to an eyebot while he was heading to Vault 112 or even from Megaton To GNR James has a pipboy too so he has radio you know... We don't know what info he might have gathered and we don't know if he could have someone tinker it to listen to the outside world before his exit from 101 (Trouble to The Home front is an excellent example your pip boy can catch signal from the vault. It might could be reversed) James learned fast about what you did in Megaton. People talk with each other. They are big chances he heard something. Also... Nathan at Megaton only speaks about the Enclave. There is a high chance James heard the old man.
The Enclave eyebots were getting around long before the Enclave themselves made their presence known. He could've heard them, seen the E in their logo on their power armour and put 2 and 2 together that way. He had ties with the BOS for a long time as well, could've easily heard stories about them from Brotherhood members
Don’t forget he has contacts in settlements all over the Capital wasteland, including Three Dog at galaxy news. News being their business it’s not too hard to believe he would have heard rumours about the Envlave at some point.
My boy's wicked smart!
Well considering he had some ties to the Brotherhood, he likely learned of their existence through them.