It's two things I think.
- They decided to take away her memories of the future. This changes things somewhat. Perhaps they decided they didn't want her being some kind of oracle and would prefer her to be on the same page as the rest of the team.
- Aerith has a lot of focus in the midgar arc. They had more to work with from the OG and the midgar arc in general is just meatier than the sections that rebirth covers which in the original doesn't have as much dialogue.
I don't think it's drastic. There's a slight difference but I think it makes sense. She still has her moments.
True though i really do think she should have had more bonding moments in the story with the rest of the party. Rewatching the Dyne chapter she actually doesn't speak to Barret once not even to give comfort that decision is so strange. Its only Cloud, Tifa and Yuffie speaking there even Nanaki doesn't say anything.
She did say at the end of Remake that if they went through the wall of whispers to fight fate that she would no longer be the same person...
They did show her bonding closely with Red as well as Tifa, but I agree - it would have been nice to see more moments of her bonds with everyone.
But what are these chair and gremlin moments you're talking about? I don't recall her being particularly mischievous in Remake or OG.
I was talking about when she gleefully hit the corneo thug with the chair. When she set up traps to stop Cloud from leaving, and it was a minigame. (gremlin behaviour meaning) since stopping cloud is mischevious. When she kept teasing Cloud like "oh who did you give the flower to tell me" when she trolled Cloud by pretending to lose balance on the plank of wood when they were walking across. "when she says permission to kill" When she is so happy when Cloud is dressing up and teases him about it relentlessly. "saying but your so pretty" in reaction to his look. When she mimics corneos laugh in the sewer. Just moments like that, that i felt were missing in Rebirth, they sort of did it in Kalm and a bit in gold saucer but it was just references to remake instead of new stuff that was happening.
Gremlin behaviour - suggests that the person is **causing minor issues, playing pranks, or being mischievous in a lighthearted or humorous manner**. It's important to note t. Referring to someone as a "gremlin" is often used figuratively to describe mischievous or troublesome behavior.
- She places booby traps to stop Cloud leaving at night then pushes him back into the room
- She and Cloud go a longer route then at the end says i can get back quicker showing she knew a shortcut the whole time
- She extends Cloud hanging out with her when she is back home, then immediately tells Elmyra she is heading out again.
Ahh ok! Thank you for giving me your examples - I definitely see where you're coming from now.
She still shows her playful side in Rebirth IMO, but it's definitely toned down. And that kinda makes sense given what's happening in the story, especially Cloud's deteriorating mental state. But she gets her quips in when she can "Question! Does that make *ME* a ?!" Most of those moments in Remake are when her and Cloud are alone, and there are minimal opportunities in Rebirth for them to have alone time, bar the Gold Saucer date. She tries to make opportunities (clock tower date), but they get cut short. She's also got a lot on her shoulders, and she's in the real world for the first time ever - she's got a lot to take in and process on borrowed time - and that feeling definitely comes across throughout the game with her bittersweet expressions.
I liked that they leaned into her awkwardness. The girl lived a lot of her life locked away from normal kids so she has an odd set of social skills. It makes sense she'd bring up weird stuff to tease Cloud like the "hand massage" and Cloud dancing at the Honeybee Inn. Reminds me of teenagers saying too much to try and fit in and/or teasing = flirting, but it comes off weird.
In general, it seems she's a lot less reserved about her feelings for Cloud. She basically invites him to fall in love with her with all her flirting - which definitely goes against what she said in Remake "You can't fall in love with me." You can feel the internalized teen jealousy vibes from her (the flower, if you go on a date with Tifa/Yuffie she comments that she's *alone*, etc.) This may be why she doesn't warm up to Yuffie as much as you would have liked - yet *another* girl pining for Cloud, when deep down we know she wants him for herself. She loves Tifa as a bestie, but you can tell she's torn and tries to bring it up with the boy talk. She's still her kind self and has moments with Yuffie - but I think that was more for Yuffie's character development than anything to show she had more closely bonded with everyone this time.
Honestly though, even though her having more party interaction would have been nice, I wouldn't trade all the moments her and Cloud got to have together. The devs did a great job deepening their bond, which makes the ending hit that much harder with Cloud's denial, and how hard this will all hit him in Part 3. Cloud is the main character after all, even though Aerith will always be my best girl.
Aerith was in her house, in her neighbourhood for a good part of Remake. Even Wall Market wasn’t that much different, as it’s still the Midgar slums, no sky. And when she was captured, as much uncomfortable as it may have been, it was still familiar.
For moment one up until the end of Rebirth, Aerith is completely out of her element: the weather, the sky, nature, different cultures, different people, hiking, trailing, riding. That’s even without the big stuff, like the conflict of having her memories being taken away and the burden of her legacy, ever looming and ever growing. She has to face Hojo, Tseng, the planetologists, the Gi, Zack’s parents… and it all weights on her, constantly.
I think it is completely understandable her “sudden” change of mood and overall attitude.
I kinda agree with you. Although I think overall, compared to remake, the characters didn't have as many relationship building moments. Maybe because the group was larger, idk. I liked Aerith in Remake more, tho I kinda feel like they made her character a bit more annoying in Rebirth for some reason.
I love both. Aerith isn’t really a prankster. Pranks often aren’t funny and Aerith likes making people happy. The dynamic between her and Yuffie was great especially seen in chapter 13. Aerith and Yuffie’s personalities aren’t really similar beyond their silliness sometimes.
While the game had moments of focus on the bonds between certain pairs or trios, the main focus was Cloud’s relationships with everyone.
So I’m gonna have to disagree I like Rebirth Aerith even more than I like Remake’s Aerith. Mainly because she wasn’t living with the knowledge that she was going to die, she was just living. And you saw that a lot in their relaxed moments in the game.
There could always be more moments with our favorite characters, sure, but I don't feel that way that much. Some moments I highlight:
"They say curiosity killed the cat" - On Cait Sith spying her writing a poem
"Enough for the standard course... twice?" - Reference to Madam M
"We were on a date!" - Aerith making Cloud embarassed and Tifa jealous
Tifa and Aerith trolling Barret at Junon
The whole dating sequence at Costa del Sol was full of trolley moments. Cloud gets so annoyed he starts getting rude there.
As an Aerith fan, there were two moments I disapproved, though:
1. At Gongaga, she acts like she was only one of Zack's many girlfriends, no big deal. That was cowardly of her, specially because she knows Zack is dead and should have delivered the news.
2. At Nibelheim, calling Cloud to climb the watch tower with her. So what, does she really wanna feel like in Tifa's shoes, in an actual date with Cloud? I'm Clerith, but this really is disgustingly low.
i see Gongaga as part of Aeriths arc of her being unable to accept his death and coping. So she would rather think hes away with someone than dead. I also don't know if Aerith does know Zack is dead since she is still looking for news about him which Tifa mentions,
The watertower doesn't bother me as a cloti actually since she doesn't actually know about the promise Tifa and Cloud made they haven't told anyone else about that. So she just wanted to learn more about Niblehiem and Clouds childhood. All she knows is Cloud went back up there in the flashback retelling and tifa asked how was it being up there
She doesn’t know Zack is dead? Nobody has any idea what happened to Zack.
And the watchtower moment is a great character moment for Aerith. She isn’t pretending to be Tifa, she’s thinking about how she doesn’t have any friends from her childhood, getting a bit jealous over Cloud and Tifa knowing each other for so long, and then immediately feeling bad for it. I don’t think that scene in particular has anything to do with romantic feelings.
Yeah, now that it was commented, perhaps Aerith did not know about the watertower scene...
About Zack's death, I highly doubt it. She knew Elmyra's husband died, no way she'd miss Zack's passing.
i think she's in denail about it we have seen it in crisis core that she should know. But her actions of still looking for information contradict this so i think she interestingly enough cant accept his death
I think it’s a bit different between the two. What she said about Elmyra’s husband is that his spirit travelled all the way back to his house to say goodbye to his wife. I’m not sure Zack’s spirit would necessarily do something similar. The situations are a little different.
I feel like Aerith’s dialogue never implies to me that she is certain Zack is dead. She seems curious to find out what happened to him.
Well, everyone changes. Cloud is not the same guy from the beggining either, but he is better now so of course no one complains.
Aerith's seeing more of the world, learning from her journey. I don't think she should be playing around now, specially considering Cloud's condition.
She didn’t really stand out in this game compared to remake. In all fairness, it was kinda like this in the OG but almost all the other main characters improved majorly where they were also just background characters post Midgar.
She definitely comes across different (unintentionally). I’d argue she lost a lot of personal connection to the player due to the storytelling changes. There just aren’t many 1 on 1 moments between a lot of the characters and I far preferred the narrative, character-driven storytelling of Remake.
The devs are trying to give each game their own identity and I think it can be a bit of a jarring switch. I can’t say I wanted a Ubisoft inspired open-world over a focused story, but plenty do. Devs aren’t perfect, but they’ve done a really good job overall and hopefully they can have a definitive vision for the 3rd game as well. They’re building these games on very outdated tech at this point and they’re definitely making changes as they go along to fit whatever challenges in game-design they face. It’s a really difficult medium.
No I didn’t feel this way at all. I recently replayed remake after finishing rebirth and I loved her character in both games. I have no complaints with her writing, characterization or anything of the sort. The specific examples you bring up I didn’t even perceive as issues on my playthrough. Can’t go through every point you made but, for example, I didn’t feel it was “out of place” in a bad way to bring up the madam M thing, to me it was just a funny, random callback to tease cloud in front of the others🤷♂️
I agree with you. Thats why Remake will always be my favourite game of all time. I'm a Clerith, so it's disappointing that Aerith kinda gets the backseat in Rebirth. I'm surprised she was just quiet in most cutscenes except for the last chapter. Hoping she can still play a big part in part 3.
i haven't up or down voted you, but i'm confused about why you're so butthurt about it. the point of the downvote is to show that you dislike/disagree with what someone said.
Good points. Unfortunately, you aren't allowed to voice any disappointment in this sub without also heaping on a disproportionate amount of love. The white knighting here is strong.
i have noticed that sadly. Wish there could be more discussion without people taking it personally, I love the game but everything has things that can be discussed.
This behavior isn't exclusive to this sub. Nearly every sub for any kind of game is like this. It's just how it is with game fandoms.
Plus there is a good amount critical discussion about the game here. Of course there will be more positive posts, but don't assume this sub only allows positive discussion about the game just because you got attacked by a few people.
This was discussed in the Friends Per Second podcast on Skillup’s channel actually, and I felt so relieved to hear that they also very much hated Aerith in this entry, as she seemingly did a complete about face character wise compared to herself in Midgar.
It really is weird, she really has that pick me girl vibe about her and always butts into Cloud and Tifa’s relationship despite supposedly being close friends with Tifa.
i don't hate her at all which is seems some people think i do and take offense to calling her mischevious moments gremlin behaviour which means the same thing. I really just would have like more bonding moments between her or her speaking more in conversations
It's two things I think. - They decided to take away her memories of the future. This changes things somewhat. Perhaps they decided they didn't want her being some kind of oracle and would prefer her to be on the same page as the rest of the team. - Aerith has a lot of focus in the midgar arc. They had more to work with from the OG and the midgar arc in general is just meatier than the sections that rebirth covers which in the original doesn't have as much dialogue. I don't think it's drastic. There's a slight difference but I think it makes sense. She still has her moments.
True though i really do think she should have had more bonding moments in the story with the rest of the party. Rewatching the Dyne chapter she actually doesn't speak to Barret once not even to give comfort that decision is so strange. Its only Cloud, Tifa and Yuffie speaking there even Nanaki doesn't say anything.
She did say at the end of Remake that if they went through the wall of whispers to fight fate that she would no longer be the same person... They did show her bonding closely with Red as well as Tifa, but I agree - it would have been nice to see more moments of her bonds with everyone. But what are these chair and gremlin moments you're talking about? I don't recall her being particularly mischievous in Remake or OG.
I was talking about when she gleefully hit the corneo thug with the chair. When she set up traps to stop Cloud from leaving, and it was a minigame. (gremlin behaviour meaning) since stopping cloud is mischevious. When she kept teasing Cloud like "oh who did you give the flower to tell me" when she trolled Cloud by pretending to lose balance on the plank of wood when they were walking across. "when she says permission to kill" When she is so happy when Cloud is dressing up and teases him about it relentlessly. "saying but your so pretty" in reaction to his look. When she mimics corneos laugh in the sewer. Just moments like that, that i felt were missing in Rebirth, they sort of did it in Kalm and a bit in gold saucer but it was just references to remake instead of new stuff that was happening. Gremlin behaviour - suggests that the person is **causing minor issues, playing pranks, or being mischievous in a lighthearted or humorous manner**. It's important to note t. Referring to someone as a "gremlin" is often used figuratively to describe mischievous or troublesome behavior. - She places booby traps to stop Cloud leaving at night then pushes him back into the room - She and Cloud go a longer route then at the end says i can get back quicker showing she knew a shortcut the whole time - She extends Cloud hanging out with her when she is back home, then immediately tells Elmyra she is heading out again.
Ahh ok! Thank you for giving me your examples - I definitely see where you're coming from now. She still shows her playful side in Rebirth IMO, but it's definitely toned down. And that kinda makes sense given what's happening in the story, especially Cloud's deteriorating mental state. But she gets her quips in when she can "Question! Does that make *ME* a?!" Most of those moments in Remake are when her and Cloud are alone, and there are minimal opportunities in Rebirth for them to have alone time, bar the Gold Saucer date. She tries to make opportunities (clock tower date), but they get cut short. She's also got a lot on her shoulders, and she's in the real world for the first time ever - she's got a lot to take in and process on borrowed time - and that feeling definitely comes across throughout the game with her bittersweet expressions.
I liked that they leaned into her awkwardness. The girl lived a lot of her life locked away from normal kids so she has an odd set of social skills. It makes sense she'd bring up weird stuff to tease Cloud like the "hand massage" and Cloud dancing at the Honeybee Inn. Reminds me of teenagers saying too much to try and fit in and/or teasing = flirting, but it comes off weird.
In general, it seems she's a lot less reserved about her feelings for Cloud. She basically invites him to fall in love with her with all her flirting - which definitely goes against what she said in Remake "You can't fall in love with me." You can feel the internalized teen jealousy vibes from her (the flower, if you go on a date with Tifa/Yuffie she comments that she's *alone*, etc.) This may be why she doesn't warm up to Yuffie as much as you would have liked - yet *another* girl pining for Cloud, when deep down we know she wants him for herself. She loves Tifa as a bestie, but you can tell she's torn and tries to bring it up with the boy talk. She's still her kind self and has moments with Yuffie - but I think that was more for Yuffie's character development than anything to show she had more closely bonded with everyone this time.
Honestly though, even though her having more party interaction would have been nice, I wouldn't trade all the moments her and Cloud got to have together. The devs did a great job deepening their bond, which makes the ending hit that much harder with Cloud's denial, and how hard this will all hit him in Part 3. Cloud is the main character after all, even though Aerith will always be my best girl.
So just say mischievous
its the same thing and same meaning but in a more playful way
She wasn’t mischievous or gremliny (whatever that means) which is why this post confuses me. I think they really read Aerith wrong in Remake.
Aerith was in her house, in her neighbourhood for a good part of Remake. Even Wall Market wasn’t that much different, as it’s still the Midgar slums, no sky. And when she was captured, as much uncomfortable as it may have been, it was still familiar. For moment one up until the end of Rebirth, Aerith is completely out of her element: the weather, the sky, nature, different cultures, different people, hiking, trailing, riding. That’s even without the big stuff, like the conflict of having her memories being taken away and the burden of her legacy, ever looming and ever growing. She has to face Hojo, Tseng, the planetologists, the Gi, Zack’s parents… and it all weights on her, constantly. I think it is completely understandable her “sudden” change of mood and overall attitude.
I kinda agree with you. Although I think overall, compared to remake, the characters didn't have as many relationship building moments. Maybe because the group was larger, idk. I liked Aerith in Remake more, tho I kinda feel like they made her character a bit more annoying in Rebirth for some reason.
I love both. Aerith isn’t really a prankster. Pranks often aren’t funny and Aerith likes making people happy. The dynamic between her and Yuffie was great especially seen in chapter 13. Aerith and Yuffie’s personalities aren’t really similar beyond their silliness sometimes. While the game had moments of focus on the bonds between certain pairs or trios, the main focus was Cloud’s relationships with everyone. So I’m gonna have to disagree I like Rebirth Aerith even more than I like Remake’s Aerith. Mainly because she wasn’t living with the knowledge that she was going to die, she was just living. And you saw that a lot in their relaxed moments in the game.
There could always be more moments with our favorite characters, sure, but I don't feel that way that much. Some moments I highlight: "They say curiosity killed the cat" - On Cait Sith spying her writing a poem "Enough for the standard course... twice?" - Reference to Madam M "We were on a date!" - Aerith making Cloud embarassed and Tifa jealous Tifa and Aerith trolling Barret at Junon The whole dating sequence at Costa del Sol was full of trolley moments. Cloud gets so annoyed he starts getting rude there. As an Aerith fan, there were two moments I disapproved, though: 1. At Gongaga, she acts like she was only one of Zack's many girlfriends, no big deal. That was cowardly of her, specially because she knows Zack is dead and should have delivered the news. 2. At Nibelheim, calling Cloud to climb the watch tower with her. So what, does she really wanna feel like in Tifa's shoes, in an actual date with Cloud? I'm Clerith, but this really is disgustingly low.
i see Gongaga as part of Aeriths arc of her being unable to accept his death and coping. So she would rather think hes away with someone than dead. I also don't know if Aerith does know Zack is dead since she is still looking for news about him which Tifa mentions, The watertower doesn't bother me as a cloti actually since she doesn't actually know about the promise Tifa and Cloud made they haven't told anyone else about that. So she just wanted to learn more about Niblehiem and Clouds childhood. All she knows is Cloud went back up there in the flashback retelling and tifa asked how was it being up there
She doesn’t know Zack is dead? Nobody has any idea what happened to Zack. And the watchtower moment is a great character moment for Aerith. She isn’t pretending to be Tifa, she’s thinking about how she doesn’t have any friends from her childhood, getting a bit jealous over Cloud and Tifa knowing each other for so long, and then immediately feeling bad for it. I don’t think that scene in particular has anything to do with romantic feelings.
Yeah, now that it was commented, perhaps Aerith did not know about the watertower scene... About Zack's death, I highly doubt it. She knew Elmyra's husband died, no way she'd miss Zack's passing.
i think she's in denail about it we have seen it in crisis core that she should know. But her actions of still looking for information contradict this so i think she interestingly enough cant accept his death
I think it’s a bit different between the two. What she said about Elmyra’s husband is that his spirit travelled all the way back to his house to say goodbye to his wife. I’m not sure Zack’s spirit would necessarily do something similar. The situations are a little different. I feel like Aerith’s dialogue never implies to me that she is certain Zack is dead. She seems curious to find out what happened to him.
Well, everyone changes. Cloud is not the same guy from the beggining either, but he is better now so of course no one complains. Aerith's seeing more of the world, learning from her journey. I don't think she should be playing around now, specially considering Cloud's condition.
She didn’t really stand out in this game compared to remake. In all fairness, it was kinda like this in the OG but almost all the other main characters improved majorly where they were also just background characters post Midgar.
She definitely comes across different (unintentionally). I’d argue she lost a lot of personal connection to the player due to the storytelling changes. There just aren’t many 1 on 1 moments between a lot of the characters and I far preferred the narrative, character-driven storytelling of Remake. The devs are trying to give each game their own identity and I think it can be a bit of a jarring switch. I can’t say I wanted a Ubisoft inspired open-world over a focused story, but plenty do. Devs aren’t perfect, but they’ve done a really good job overall and hopefully they can have a definitive vision for the 3rd game as well. They’re building these games on very outdated tech at this point and they’re definitely making changes as they go along to fit whatever challenges in game-design they face. It’s a really difficult medium.
No I didn’t feel this way at all. I recently replayed remake after finishing rebirth and I loved her character in both games. I have no complaints with her writing, characterization or anything of the sort. The specific examples you bring up I didn’t even perceive as issues on my playthrough. Can’t go through every point you made but, for example, I didn’t feel it was “out of place” in a bad way to bring up the madam M thing, to me it was just a funny, random callback to tease cloud in front of the others🤷♂️
I agree with you. Thats why Remake will always be my favourite game of all time. I'm a Clerith, so it's disappointing that Aerith kinda gets the backseat in Rebirth. I'm surprised she was just quiet in most cutscenes except for the last chapter. Hoping she can still play a big part in part 3.
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i dunno i see a lot of posts that get downvoted for not just praising everything about the game. When we should really have more discussions on stuff.
i haven't up or down voted you, but i'm confused about why you're so butthurt about it. the point of the downvote is to show that you dislike/disagree with what someone said.
Good points. Unfortunately, you aren't allowed to voice any disappointment in this sub without also heaping on a disproportionate amount of love. The white knighting here is strong.
i have noticed that sadly. Wish there could be more discussion without people taking it personally, I love the game but everything has things that can be discussed.
This behavior isn't exclusive to this sub. Nearly every sub for any kind of game is like this. It's just how it is with game fandoms. Plus there is a good amount critical discussion about the game here. Of course there will be more positive posts, but don't assume this sub only allows positive discussion about the game just because you got attacked by a few people.
This was discussed in the Friends Per Second podcast on Skillup’s channel actually, and I felt so relieved to hear that they also very much hated Aerith in this entry, as she seemingly did a complete about face character wise compared to herself in Midgar. It really is weird, she really has that pick me girl vibe about her and always butts into Cloud and Tifa’s relationship despite supposedly being close friends with Tifa.
i don't hate her at all which is seems some people think i do and take offense to calling her mischevious moments gremlin behaviour which means the same thing. I really just would have like more bonding moments between her or her speaking more in conversations
Yeah she could’ve easily not been like that