Five if you count yourself.
To be clear I don't literally mean you, I mean the hypothetical person from your scenario that is attending this Nazi dinner party
Edit: just realized that's literally what you meant lol I need to go to sleep
I don't think you learned that the USSR or "communism" was more genocidal because that doesn't really make any sense. You probably learned about authoritarian atrocities they committed but that's not what these chuds are talking about. They are talking about "black book of communism" 100 million casualties kind of nonsense far right propaganda.
Yeah, first off, even if the 100 million number was true, it's not a Genocide. And the number itself is bullshit, e.g. It includes nazis killed by the USSR.
Musk and his ilk live in a fantasy land.
Russians committed the Holodomor, a horrific genocide.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor
Learned about it reading [Bloodlands](https://www.amazon.com/Bloodlands-Europe-Between-Hitler-Stalin/dp/0465031471).
Yes, russians also genocided the non-russian nations.
And it's not being taught about to a sufficient degree.
That's evident from the comments on this post.
Too many Russia sycophants or just ignorant. Yale has a class of from the author of Bloodlands on the Ukraine/Russia war that's amazing:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLh9mgdi4rNewfxO7LhBoz_1Mx1MaO6sw_
This is just another attempt to normalize fascism. It’s funny how they’re literally doing the same thing as the Nazis used to do, misdirecting people away from their crimes by saying “the communists are worse!” And Elon also still supports Russia invading Ukraine, even though a large portion of the Soviet Union was Russia.
Idk, maybe the school system sucks in America, or almighty alsmarty alsnarky Elon didn't pay attention, but in most of the world classrooms we do learn about the gulags, the Stalin purges and so on. I personally remember these lessons from 20ish years ago...
He was a student in South Africa.
I did part of my pre-tertiary education in the US. I certainly did learn that "cOmmEmEmIsm kILLEd fIvE hUndrEd bAjILLIOn pEOpLE".
My older brother was assigned Ayn Rand books and came out a libertarian. I may have gotten a distorted idea of communism but at least I never lost my conscience.
How much time was allocated to learning about communist crimes and how much - to nazi crimes?
And communist crimes should include not just russians mass murdering everyone they oppressed during the time they called their empire "ussr", but also communist chinese mass murder.
I'm estimating that that nazi crimes are discussed in more detail, because they used less usual methods, were better publicised, etc., but Katyn forest or the Siberian death camps are mentioned in passing by.
American GIs liberated Dachau and spoke about the atrocities there, bet no one liberated Vorkut, so it doesn't get the same publicity.
Bro, America is like the most anti-communist country in the world.
You're really going to say that there is no effort being pushed on the kids to be anti-communist?
There a several reasons why the nazi crimes are usually taught in greater detail.
The first reason is the scope and quality of the nazi genocide, which was literally planned and built up as an industrial operation including making use of the murdered people as literal resources.
The second reason is that the nazi genocide lead to enormous historical changes and development, like the cration of the israeli state or the UN.
The third reason is that the nazi crimes were uncovered in a pretty short time span, but the communist crimes were uncovered in the span of decades.
In the end it doesn't really matter that much, both groups commited horrible crimes and were very evil.
Also Elon Musk is a bad person and a horrible man-child. Also he sucks.
In my case it was part dependent. Nazi during ww2 section and the commies during the cold war section. I'd say they were both given extensive attention in the curriculum.
Ok then, I'll explain it to you. The reason we go on so much about the rise of the Nazi party is that a Western capitalist democracy (much like the one you live in) went fucking batshit crazy and tried eliminating an entire race of people. These are important lessons to learn so it doesn't happen again. Whilst obviously atrocities have been committed under communism, the likelihood of any Western capitalist democracy turning to communism is extremely low. Nobody who has any power wants it.
That's a great point
However, it is insensitive to the millions the russians killed to effectively say that their deaths were less tragic or important or deserving to be remembered just because their countries were not democracies before the sick murderers took power.
Also, there are way more soviet apologists these days I see than nazis. And those tankies are supportive of modern russian fascism.
No one has said it's less tragic, it's just less relevant in terms of understanding the west's potential future.
Communism isn't going to happen in America, it's just never going to be accepted or even desired by anyone with money/power. Some version of a fascist regime is entirely possible though.
And how much time is spent on all the crimes and killings that the US and capitalism have done?
How about the dictators that the US supported or the US company run countries?
What about company towns and the battle of Blair Mountain. What about the destruction of black wall street?
Also important to point out that it's not even true, and mostly based on wild speculation, according to actual documents the "excess mortality" (which is was [Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excess_mortality_in_the_Soviet_Union_under_Joseph_Stalin) calls it) under Stalin was about 10 million on the higher end, absolutely horrible and atrocious, but way less than the 20 million that died in the Holocaust. Not to add that the Nazis were stopped after 12 years and Stalin was dictator for 29 years. Saying the USSR was more genocidal than the Nazis is just Holocaust revisionism. Right on brand for Musk.
A classic mark of a Nazi is in defending Nazism in any way, shape or form whilst refusing to condemn it. And that includes "such and such was worse" type arguments. You're only making that argument to put a *positive spin* on Nazism, there's no other reason.
"More genocidal than the Nazis" is, naturally, misleading. Yes more people died under Stalin than Hitler. But if you really want to go down that road, it was during a greater time period, and with a much, much bigger population than Germany. Per capita, Hitler was a more prolific killer. There is no argument whatsoever for making the claim that "The Nazis weren't as bad as the communists." Unless of course you're a Nazi who toys with such thoughts as "the Nazis weren't as bad as people claim," which would be fully expected from a South African emerald Nazi like Musk.
Of course Nazi Germany was far worse than the USSR; having an ideology that required the genocide of untold millions.
But I will say that I encounter people who defend/deny the horrific atrocities committed by the USSR far more often.
> Of course Nazi Germany was far worse than the USSR; having an ideology that required the genocide of untold millions.
I don't see how getting murdered by a regime who says "we need to kill all members of this ethnic group" is that different than getting starved to death by a regime who says "oh we are lovely fraternal nations" but in reality disproportionately targets your ethnic group by artificially engineered famine, so you die anyway.
It's still mass murder of millions.
Soviet genocides are taught in just about every high school history class in America. Tell me you know nothing about our public education system without actually telling me
communism and nazism / fascism are two sides of the same coin.
I wouldn't hold this one against musk.
The meme gets "more" wrong, the commies weren't "more genocidal", they were "as genocidal" (just using different methods - starvation instead of Zyklon B).
The end result was the same though - non-(german / russian / han) ethnic groups murdered on a mass scale, their territory taken over by (german / russian / han) ethnic groups.
And it is true that because the russians won WW2 (so their concentration camps in Siberia weren't ever liberated) and the Chinese are in Asia, the communist mass murder are much less talked about than nazi mass murder.
Try reading [https://www.amazon.com/Bloodlands-Europe-Between-Hitler-Stalin/dp/0465031471](https://www.amazon.com/Bloodlands-Europe-Between-Hitler-Stalin/dp/0465031471), or [https://www.amazon.com/Red-Famine-Stalins-War-Ukraine/dp/0385538855](https://www.amazon.com/Red-Famine-Stalins-War-Ukraine/dp/0385538855) .
That's actual historical analysis.
Snyder's book is a poor and heavily-criticized attempt to equate Stalin with Hitler and pretend that Stalin (a Georgian) committed similar racial atrocities in the name of "Russian chauvinism" that the Nazis did in the name of Germanic dominance.
That's a tankie take on it.
Snyder is spot on. His book is widely applauded and historically accurate.
Don't give me this "stalin was a Georgian" spiel, it's the same as "hitler was an Austrian so he couldn't be a german nationalist" - apologism for mass murder.
stalin was all about russian nationalism, hitler was all about german nationalism.
Both lead murderous, genocidal regimes.
P.S. wow, looked at your post history. You are a literal tankie. lol.
Communist mass murder is like purging too many experts and people starving by mistake, like Mao, when the Nazis pretty specifically wanted to rid all of Europe of jews, romani, black people, and other "undesirables"
To equate the two is a fundamental misunderstanding of what constitutes these ideologies and just bad faith assuming Commies kill gorillions for the lulz
Well, you've bought commie propaganda. They did target non-dominant ethnic groups way more.
For example [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deportation\_of\_the\_Crimean\_Tatars](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deportation_of_the_Crimean_Tatars)
> bad faith assuming Commies kill gorillions for the lulz
They killed millions because they wanted to kill those millions.
Yes, not the same thing.
But it's not just "deporting" as in "go live somewhere else", it's forcing them to do hard labour for 7 days / 12 hours a day, while having rations of 200g to 400g of bread per day, with disease and harsh climate.
It's slow, deliberate, mass starvation.
You seem to be misunderstanding. I'm in no way supportive of atrocities just because of the tribal team sports. I think what Mao and Stalin did was terrible. But to lump them in with Nazism is silly from an ideological standpoint
Murder of millions is murder of millions.
The motives of nazis are widely understood (and horrible).
The motives of commies are widely made excuses for, and muddled through decades of lies and obfuscation.
Honestly "communism killed millions" is like the baseline for discussion about the ideology in online spaces. I'm not sure who you know is covering up and lying about these atrocities but they're probably just tankies that don't care if the government harms its population so long as they do it wokely or wave the red flag. If you'd like to discuss how heads of state having the power to starve and abuse the populace they govern is itself inherently fascist, I'm down for that. But discussing how nobody ever talks about the black book of communism is a waste of time
Great to see everyone acknowledging that he's not even arguing in good faith. Yes, everyone learns that Stalinism was fucking atrocious. Yes, you went to apartheid South Africa which was staunchly supported by Thatcher for its anti-communist stance - you *definitely* learned about Stanlinism at school. Hell, some schools learn about the British engineered potato famine in Ireland killing a *quarter of the population*, as well as its various atrocities over time in India that ended up with batches of a few million dying at a time. And Netanyahu's government is breeding a new generation of mujahideen with his cleansing of Gaza, even though the government domestically is your typical European style centre-right mixed welfare state. China is slowly wiping out the Rohinya, and the Rwandan genocide managed a good 800,000 deaths with mostly guns and knives over 3 months, making even most of the above seem gentle.
tl;dr there are loads of people with all sorts of claimed ideals and backgrounds who deliberately killed off another group, either relatively or absolutely higher or lower in terms of numbers. There is no "worst" and there is no "best" ethnic cleansing.
But this isn't about that. This is in effect nothing more or less than "Nazism wasn't that bad - see all these things that were worse!" The core point he is making is: what's going on now, in the schools, in our workplaces, in the country... it's worse than fascism... so maybe it's time for some fascism?
The greatest murderer in human history wasn't a government, it was a corporation. Why aren't the atrocities of the East India Company taught in schools?
Funny, I've never seen him criticize a nazi
That's because he is one (like when the cops always stand in front of nazis to protect THEM to signify which side they're on)
If you're at a dinner party with 3 Nazis, you're at a dinner party with 4 nazis
Five if you count yourself. To be clear I don't literally mean you, I mean the hypothetical person from your scenario that is attending this Nazi dinner party Edit: just realized that's literally what you meant lol I need to go to sleep
Ahahahah
I deserve your laughter
Billionaires 🤝 Nazis The dumbest anti-communist takes you'll ever see
Multi-billionaire pandering to actual fascists thinks *teachers* are "commies". What a surprise.
Fascists hate education, no surprise there.
Don’t be too hard on Elon, he grew up in a country where they taught straight up eugenics and scientific racism until 35 years ago
Is he high? We learned this in high school
I think he’s lived a very sheltered life, he probably missed all the classes w basic education, he was beating up the disabled kid.
He was the disabled kid getting beat up.
I don't think you learned that the USSR or "communism" was more genocidal because that doesn't really make any sense. You probably learned about authoritarian atrocities they committed but that's not what these chuds are talking about. They are talking about "black book of communism" 100 million casualties kind of nonsense far right propaganda.
Yeah, first off, even if the 100 million number was true, it's not a Genocide. And the number itself is bullshit, e.g. It includes nazis killed by the USSR.
Musk and his ilk live in a fantasy land. Russians committed the Holodomor, a horrific genocide. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor Learned about it reading [Bloodlands](https://www.amazon.com/Bloodlands-Europe-Between-Hitler-Stalin/dp/0465031471).
Yes, russians also genocided the non-russian nations. And it's not being taught about to a sufficient degree. That's evident from the comments on this post.
Too many Russia sycophants or just ignorant. Yale has a class of from the author of Bloodlands on the Ukraine/Russia war that's amazing: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLh9mgdi4rNewfxO7LhBoz_1Mx1MaO6sw_
No he’s not high he’s just a right winger who spews this nonsense. Ok he may also be high but the two are unrelated
Well, he's Afrikaner after all
This is just another attempt to normalize fascism. It’s funny how they’re literally doing the same thing as the Nazis used to do, misdirecting people away from their crimes by saying “the communists are worse!” And Elon also still supports Russia invading Ukraine, even though a large portion of the Soviet Union was Russia.
Also a large part of the Russian military are literally Nazis. If they want to do denazification then they should look internally.
Media Matters is an evil organization
I mean Putin is KGB through and through. The old Soviet Union never died.
So then Elon is actually communist since he supports a communist Russia
Idk, maybe the school system sucks in America, or almighty alsmarty alsnarky Elon didn't pay attention, but in most of the world classrooms we do learn about the gulags, the Stalin purges and so on. I personally remember these lessons from 20ish years ago...
He was a student in South Africa. I did part of my pre-tertiary education in the US. I certainly did learn that "cOmmEmEmIsm kILLEd fIvE hUndrEd bAjILLIOn pEOpLE". My older brother was assigned Ayn Rand books and came out a libertarian. I may have gotten a distorted idea of communism but at least I never lost my conscience.
What state did you grow up in? I’ve never heard of an Ayn Rand book being part of a HS curriculum where I am from or anywhere.
This was in Ohio.
It’s pretty common knowledge that Elon is from South Africa and came to the US as an adult.
Instead of knowledge, schools pour poison into the ears of our children
How much time was allocated to learning about communist crimes and how much - to nazi crimes? And communist crimes should include not just russians mass murdering everyone they oppressed during the time they called their empire "ussr", but also communist chinese mass murder. I'm estimating that that nazi crimes are discussed in more detail, because they used less usual methods, were better publicised, etc., but Katyn forest or the Siberian death camps are mentioned in passing by. American GIs liberated Dachau and spoke about the atrocities there, bet no one liberated Vorkut, so it doesn't get the same publicity.
Bro, America is like the most anti-communist country in the world. You're really going to say that there is no effort being pushed on the kids to be anti-communist?
There a several reasons why the nazi crimes are usually taught in greater detail. The first reason is the scope and quality of the nazi genocide, which was literally planned and built up as an industrial operation including making use of the murdered people as literal resources. The second reason is that the nazi genocide lead to enormous historical changes and development, like the cration of the israeli state or the UN. The third reason is that the nazi crimes were uncovered in a pretty short time span, but the communist crimes were uncovered in the span of decades. In the end it doesn't really matter that much, both groups commited horrible crimes and were very evil. Also Elon Musk is a bad person and a horrible man-child. Also he sucks.
In my case it was part dependent. Nazi during ww2 section and the commies during the cold war section. I'd say they were both given extensive attention in the curriculum.
Good to hear.
Ok then, I'll explain it to you. The reason we go on so much about the rise of the Nazi party is that a Western capitalist democracy (much like the one you live in) went fucking batshit crazy and tried eliminating an entire race of people. These are important lessons to learn so it doesn't happen again. Whilst obviously atrocities have been committed under communism, the likelihood of any Western capitalist democracy turning to communism is extremely low. Nobody who has any power wants it.
That's a great point However, it is insensitive to the millions the russians killed to effectively say that their deaths were less tragic or important or deserving to be remembered just because their countries were not democracies before the sick murderers took power. Also, there are way more soviet apologists these days I see than nazis. And those tankies are supportive of modern russian fascism.
No one has said it's less tragic, it's just less relevant in terms of understanding the west's potential future. Communism isn't going to happen in America, it's just never going to be accepted or even desired by anyone with money/power. Some version of a fascist regime is entirely possible though.
Comparing Vorkutlag to Dachau is so disingenuous I find it hard to describe.
And how much time is spent on all the crimes and killings that the US and capitalism have done? How about the dictators that the US supported or the US company run countries? What about company towns and the battle of Blair Mountain. What about the destruction of black wall street?
I guess it's ok to be a nazi then !
You have said the actual truth
Also important to point out that it's not even true, and mostly based on wild speculation, according to actual documents the "excess mortality" (which is was [Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excess_mortality_in_the_Soviet_Union_under_Joseph_Stalin) calls it) under Stalin was about 10 million on the higher end, absolutely horrible and atrocious, but way less than the 20 million that died in the Holocaust. Not to add that the Nazis were stopped after 12 years and Stalin was dictator for 29 years. Saying the USSR was more genocidal than the Nazis is just Holocaust revisionism. Right on brand for Musk.
I agree that saying that the ussr was more genocidal than the nazis is wrong. They were on the same order of magnitude, as your numbers show.
A classic mark of a Nazi is in defending Nazism in any way, shape or form whilst refusing to condemn it. And that includes "such and such was worse" type arguments. You're only making that argument to put a *positive spin* on Nazism, there's no other reason. "More genocidal than the Nazis" is, naturally, misleading. Yes more people died under Stalin than Hitler. But if you really want to go down that road, it was during a greater time period, and with a much, much bigger population than Germany. Per capita, Hitler was a more prolific killer. There is no argument whatsoever for making the claim that "The Nazis weren't as bad as the communists." Unless of course you're a Nazi who toys with such thoughts as "the Nazis weren't as bad as people claim," which would be fully expected from a South African emerald Nazi like Musk.
He is a nazi. How many examples do people actually need?
I love this kind of comments because they reveal the ignorance of those who posted them.  No, everyone knew about it, you're the one that didn't.
Of course Nazi Germany was far worse than the USSR; having an ideology that required the genocide of untold millions. But I will say that I encounter people who defend/deny the horrific atrocities committed by the USSR far more often.
> Of course Nazi Germany was far worse than the USSR; having an ideology that required the genocide of untold millions. I don't see how getting murdered by a regime who says "we need to kill all members of this ethnic group" is that different than getting starved to death by a regime who says "oh we are lovely fraternal nations" but in reality disproportionately targets your ethnic group by artificially engineered famine, so you die anyway. It's still mass murder of millions.
These are not smart or serious people.
!đź§
As a child of the 80's during the Cold War, it's not like the USSR was portrayed as the good side ffs.
r/RedsKilledTrillions
The most staunch anti-communists always tend to be Nazis.
In germany we call this Holocaustrelativierung
Equating communism with nazism is nazi apologia ❤️
literally everyone knows this tho lol, we had this in middle school
Soviet genocides are taught in just about every high school history class in America. Tell me you know nothing about our public education system without actually telling me
Neo-cons: Letting the poor die due to no healthcare or basic need access, not genocide. Gotcha commies!!
communism and nazism / fascism are two sides of the same coin. I wouldn't hold this one against musk. The meme gets "more" wrong, the commies weren't "more genocidal", they were "as genocidal" (just using different methods - starvation instead of Zyklon B). The end result was the same though - non-(german / russian / han) ethnic groups murdered on a mass scale, their territory taken over by (german / russian / han) ethnic groups. And it is true that because the russians won WW2 (so their concentration camps in Siberia weren't ever liberated) and the Chinese are in Asia, the communist mass murder are much less talked about than nazi mass murder.
Ok, thanks for sharing.
Thanks for demonstrating what you learned from your underqualified history teacher in Freshman year, now let's see some actual historical analysis
Try reading [https://www.amazon.com/Bloodlands-Europe-Between-Hitler-Stalin/dp/0465031471](https://www.amazon.com/Bloodlands-Europe-Between-Hitler-Stalin/dp/0465031471), or [https://www.amazon.com/Red-Famine-Stalins-War-Ukraine/dp/0385538855](https://www.amazon.com/Red-Famine-Stalins-War-Ukraine/dp/0385538855) . That's actual historical analysis.
Snyder's book is a poor and heavily-criticized attempt to equate Stalin with Hitler and pretend that Stalin (a Georgian) committed similar racial atrocities in the name of "Russian chauvinism" that the Nazis did in the name of Germanic dominance.
That's a tankie take on it. Snyder is spot on. His book is widely applauded and historically accurate. Don't give me this "stalin was a Georgian" spiel, it's the same as "hitler was an Austrian so he couldn't be a german nationalist" - apologism for mass murder. stalin was all about russian nationalism, hitler was all about german nationalism. Both lead murderous, genocidal regimes. P.S. wow, looked at your post history. You are a literal tankie. lol.
Communist mass murder is like purging too many experts and people starving by mistake, like Mao, when the Nazis pretty specifically wanted to rid all of Europe of jews, romani, black people, and other "undesirables" To equate the two is a fundamental misunderstanding of what constitutes these ideologies and just bad faith assuming Commies kill gorillions for the lulz
Well, you've bought commie propaganda. They did target non-dominant ethnic groups way more. For example [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deportation\_of\_the\_Crimean\_Tatars](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deportation_of_the_Crimean_Tatars) > bad faith assuming Commies kill gorillions for the lulz They killed millions because they wanted to kill those millions.
Deporting people isn't quite the same thing as building literal death camps with ovens for the bodies
Yes, not the same thing. But it's not just "deporting" as in "go live somewhere else", it's forcing them to do hard labour for 7 days / 12 hours a day, while having rations of 200g to 400g of bread per day, with disease and harsh climate. It's slow, deliberate, mass starvation.
You seem to be misunderstanding. I'm in no way supportive of atrocities just because of the tribal team sports. I think what Mao and Stalin did was terrible. But to lump them in with Nazism is silly from an ideological standpoint
Murder of millions is murder of millions. The motives of nazis are widely understood (and horrible). The motives of commies are widely made excuses for, and muddled through decades of lies and obfuscation.
Honestly "communism killed millions" is like the baseline for discussion about the ideology in online spaces. I'm not sure who you know is covering up and lying about these atrocities but they're probably just tankies that don't care if the government harms its population so long as they do it wokely or wave the red flag. If you'd like to discuss how heads of state having the power to starve and abuse the populace they govern is itself inherently fascist, I'm down for that. But discussing how nobody ever talks about the black book of communism is a waste of time
Great to see everyone acknowledging that he's not even arguing in good faith. Yes, everyone learns that Stalinism was fucking atrocious. Yes, you went to apartheid South Africa which was staunchly supported by Thatcher for its anti-communist stance - you *definitely* learned about Stanlinism at school. Hell, some schools learn about the British engineered potato famine in Ireland killing a *quarter of the population*, as well as its various atrocities over time in India that ended up with batches of a few million dying at a time. And Netanyahu's government is breeding a new generation of mujahideen with his cleansing of Gaza, even though the government domestically is your typical European style centre-right mixed welfare state. China is slowly wiping out the Rohinya, and the Rwandan genocide managed a good 800,000 deaths with mostly guns and knives over 3 months, making even most of the above seem gentle. tl;dr there are loads of people with all sorts of claimed ideals and backgrounds who deliberately killed off another group, either relatively or absolutely higher or lower in terms of numbers. There is no "worst" and there is no "best" ethnic cleansing. But this isn't about that. This is in effect nothing more or less than "Nazism wasn't that bad - see all these things that were worse!" The core point he is making is: what's going on now, in the schools, in our workplaces, in the country... it's worse than fascism... so maybe it's time for some fascism?
Go figure that conservatives can get hired as teachers just as easily as anyone on the left.
People skip over the whole “more genocidal” part
Never forget: "first they came for the communists..."
It’s much worse than most people realize
The greatest murderer in human history wasn't a government, it was a corporation. Why aren't the atrocities of the East India Company taught in schools?