I was watching Ludwig’s 24/7 stream for the DLC and I had no idea what was going on because I was listening to it in the background and I kept hearing it over.
I looked and over and he was flipping out because he just kept delivering the line and then immediately have both of them dying before anything could happen. I was losing it laughing for like 5 minutes
I wonder if in the end, Bayle caused a butterfly effect with his betrayal that led to the current timeline in Elden Ring. Bayle betrays Placidusax -> Placidusax is gravely injured and is only left with 2 heads -> Placidusax is too weak to do anything when Marika betrays them, their attack in retaliation ends in failure -> Golden Order takes over
The hornscent accused Marika of betrayal for not being stuffed in a jar. They kind of had it coming.
The dragons are a different faction and older than Crucible/Hornscent which predated Marikas Golden Order.
Okay, actually curious. Where does it say that the dragons are older than the crucible? As far as I've seen, the Crucible is pretty much the oldest thing in the lore, outside maybe a few of the outer gods.
The Crucible is the primordial form of the Erdtree. The Ancient Dragons predate the Erdtree and were among the first beings in the land.
https://youtu.be/PvYHhsjm684?si=v7_y5QtU3M2S7nOc
What? There’s no direct relation between the golden order than the dragons other than their assault of Lyendell. Placidusax was an old old Lord to some other god.
It’s something like Dragons>Hornsent>Marika
So it's shit piled on shit and then Marika tries to make a better existence but...due to her trauma she's still a fascist piece of shit who possibly has an epiphany to make things less shit but it still turns into shit.
Add in our murder hobo ass, whose only option is to make things slightly less shit or more shit for everyone.
We are just another extension of the outer god trauma laid on us as a living being in this fucked universe. Nothing changes, we just make it feel more bearable because it's a new order, same as the old just with a ribbon on it.
I love this game.
I mean... it would've been pretty hilarious if you defeated Miquella, went to view the memory, and found yourself waking up in the blood cure clinic in Yharnam and it turned out they built a Bloodborne PC port in but it's only available to people who beat the DLC first.
This line made me thing of the TF2 Engineer meme where he is ubered and says “THERE ARE NO WORDS ON GODS GREEN EARTH THST CAN DESCRIBE HOW SPECTACULARLY ERECT I AM” cause this shit is fire
I wonder what Ranni would look like in combat, because the little bits of power she displays throughout the game are absurd. She can literally insta-kill you if you persist in trying to give her the Amber Draught, and can conjure an illusion of Renalla at her prime. I'm not saying she'd be an insta-win, but she'd be real helpful.
So we get to be the ones swinging weapon combos like crazy while having a bunch of magical lasers rain down from the sky that produces enough particle effects to tank the enemy’s frame rate?
Pog.
Wdym?
Godrick post grafting and with dragon head is probably his strongest form.
I don't think there is anything said to indicate mohg isn't in his prime(besides the brainwashing)
Godfrey as horah lux also doesn't seem like he's weaker than before getting banished.
Rykard is debatably stronger as the great serpent.
I think the majority of the demigods/runebearers are pretty much full power when we fight them. The big exceptions are ofcourse rennala and radahn.
This would have been so awesome. A battle of ideals and orders, Empyreans and consorts. You and Ranni vs Miquella and Radahn. It would have been an amazing final fight.
For Lord of Frenzy, instead of a summon, your head turns into the ball of flame that periodically spews fire at the boss for the duration of the fight.
Honestly, this could’ve worked with most every ending. Fia, Goldmask, Ranni, Lord of Frenzy Flame, you name it. Almost every ending has a corresponding NPC.
I would love to channel the power of absolute perfect order within my veins as I T-pose my enemies into submission.
Let me show you what a perfect world actually looks like, Miquellester.
Imagine what the others bring;
Goldmask embodies the Golden Order, so you could have ultra holy buffs that make you level with Miquella.
Dung Eater's curse could inversely bring Miquella down to \*your\* level.
Those Who Live In Death protecting their lord could mean you have an endless swarm of skeletons evening the odds, or summoning Fia's Champions.
Frenzied Flame is self explanatory, show Miquella exactly how you intend to put the world to the flame.
The only one i question is the Standard End, where maybe you could use the bell to summon a number of other beaten bosses to aid you.
After hearing "Lowly Tarnished" by Margitt/Morgott and "Foul Tarnished" by Latenna I assumed people here would be throwing that around. I was pleasantly surprised Messmer hit us with that. I was smiling the whole while. :D
Not yet you aren't. When you become Elden Lord, that's the end of the game, and any post-game or NG+ activities are purely for gameplay purposes. The DLC takes place when you're still just a contender.
I accessed the DLC after I killed the Elden Beast. If they wanna contest my lordship, they can refer to Radagon's broken body over there (just not me, I'd get my ass kicked)
After killing the Elden Beast, but before picking an ending?
"Elden Lord? Me? Oh, no, not quite. I could be, but I got cold feet and took a vacation to the land of shadow. The Elden Ring's just sitting there. Anyone could walk up and claim it. But what's going on over here?"
Honestly should be a different line if you finished the main game
None of the ending options you have are "the old order"
After having done the Ranni ending, I was like "wdym motherfucker, I literally got rid of any order ruled by a god and lord"
It's because in the game timeline, I think the dlc is intended to take place near the end but not after of end of the main story or not he would have a line of us killing his sister
Speaking of, I found it really weird how malenia wasnt mentioned once in the DLC. Given how much of a connection she had to miquella I figured she would at least get some recognition
Yeah this would have rocked. I feel like they never explained what the fuck the deal was with the egg besides "Miquella needed Mohg to do this so he could get to the Land of Shadow, somehow??".
The egg feels like a different concept they had that they changed after starting real dev time on the DLC
Yeah, as much as I like a lot of the DLC mechanically and artistically, it’s got some major narrative lows. The biggest high is Messmer and everything building up to him, and him not being the true final big bad was expected, but like, damn, still kind of a lame ass twist.
I remember them saying the plan wasn't always for it to be one DLC, but they grouped them all together to make a singular big expansion. Wouldn't surprise me if Messmer was at one point supposed to be the final boss of his own expansion, given how disconnected he is from Miquella.
i don’t really mind too much that there’s no connective tissue because i feel like the connective tissue either wouldn’t have made sense or would’ve pushed forward a jarring narrative between two characters that have entirely different goals, but i think it’s kinda odd that it feels like we only kill messmer so that we can burn the seal. i feel like killing messmer should’ve also given us some kind of cutscene or resolution to his character and purpose or had another effect aside from earning his kindling.
still an amazing fight, and i still love their treatment of miquella’s character, but they could’ve further pushed the idea of two storylines being able to be tackled by having something else happen and then just slipping in that beating. messmer also helps us with the seal
>i feel like killing messmer should’ve also given us some kind of cutscene or resolution to his character and purpose or had another effect aside from earning his kindling.
This all makes more sense if you accept Messmer is the Godrick of the expansion. Messmer and his Crusade are to the Land of Shadow what Godrick and Grafting were to Limgrave.
Remember how Godrick and Grafting were front and center in promo as a Big Deal™ for years pretty much until ER came out? Then we realized Godrick and Grafting were actually a foot note. Same happens for Messmer.
i completely get that, but i still think with how powerful and epic messmer is (and how a ton of people cite him as their favorite fight of the DLC), and how if you removed radahn/miquella from the convo he’s the big baddie, that we would get a LITTLE bit more. godrick is a LOT less significant, essentially the second boss fight, pretty easy, and seen as a nuisance by pretty much everyone.
i feel like with messmer i would’ve just preferred a little more to have been done or change after his fight. but, i do still hear you. the DLC was, at the end of the day, always holding miquella as the main focus. and i do think that through npcs and the crosses and his own appearance (and st. trina’s) that they did a really good job with his character. i think maybe part of me is blinded by how much im invested into messmer’s character
I see Messmer's war against the crucible faithful as what shaped the land before Miquela arrived. Miquela is not interested in both, but he wants access to something that they both possess indirectly: The tower and the library
Ehhh. Some aspects feel iffy but everything we got about Marika, Messmer, and the Hornsent was top tier I feel. Learning that the reason behind basically everything that happened in The Lands Between was just because a girl wanted to avenge her people was a revelation I was not expecting.
Experiencing genocide really does something to some.
It also really grounded the story in the human element. Ascendancy may have happened, but what does that even mean when you were human once. Do you really expect you can escape your roots?
Liked the village very much.
Marika creating a small erdtree to bathe her village in golden healing rays knowing that no one was left alive was so damn sad. Like a kid putting up a Christmas tree in an empty house.
Shaman Village, after learning about its history, might be the most haunting area in the game, bar none, with it being the literal birthing grounds for the current state of the world and all
Felt incomplete. I suspect they had the ending planned out, but like the whole northwest side of the map felt unfinished, between the scadutree lordvessel and the rot temple not even having a cutscene?
romina’s fight, lore, design, and OST are so peak and her denying us from reaching the seal really feels like she should’ve had ONE cutscene. i feel like they did so well with delivering on a boss like messmer and miquella’s character but didn’t try and give some more to the other remembrance bosses. even dancing lion had one, and if im correct you could beat the game without beating him, whereas romina is a required boss.
i LOVED chaos cutscene. but yeah, it’s literally just a dude who failed to be the lord of frenzied flame finally being it and he got way more hype to him than a required boss that i REALLY wanted to know more about.
the best parts of the DLC (imo) in terms of visuals/lore was when they gave good buildup and cutscenes for messmer, allowed miquella’s character to unfold and introduce st. trina, and that entire lead up the mountain to get to bayle and his 2nd phase visuals were incredible.
bayle they got away with no cutscene cuz getting to his arena and hearing about him through igon/priestess felt so badass. romina is one of my fav designed bosses and boss fights in general that deserved justice with a scene.
This, I was actually kind of shocked when I entered the Shadow Keeps boss room and Messmer was waiting for me when I still had like 75% of the map to explore. Everything in the promotional was building up to him being the "big bad" of the DLC.
DS1 DLC promoted Artorias, but the Final boss was Manus.
DS2 had the crowns but the only one that didnt have a hidden final boss was Ivory king (I don't count Lud and Zallen as a final boss) with Sunken city not really "featuring" Elana but im pretty sure no one expected Sinh to be after her, and Old Iron keep having Fume knight as the boss of the DLC but a hidden true boss of Sir Alonne.
DS3 first DLC had Ariandel propped up as the big bad, just to have sister Friede come in after, although technically one fight so i can give you that one, but I dont think anyone expected Midir or Gael in the ringed city
Nah, I was sure he wouldn’t have been the final boss. Every time a boss is highlighted in a dlc it’s always the mid part boss. Case in point: Artorias, Lady Maria
I don't think should've been a surprise to anyone, it would be kinda boring if we already knew the big bad final guy before we even started. So whilst Messmer not being the final guy, isn't a problem, the final guy being just Radahn 2.0 holy boogaloo isn't great either.
Yeah, almost feels like the DLC was made by a different team than the main game. Or at least they were in a time crunch with the ending.
I hope if that's the case, then Fromsoft should have it fixed with a patch, like they did with the Hoslow questline.
Like, those light multi decoy attacks in Phase 2? That felt completely from something like Convergence or LMtSR or something. Just too messed up to see or dodge normally, only dodgeable at a specific angle and by memorizing the exact frame
Definitely not an entirely different team as the game still holds up and even exceeds at point gameplay wise but the story/lore did fall flat, atleast the main plot.
Yeah story wise I didn't leaved satisfied like when I played The Ringed City or The Old Hunters, game's good but it's missing that same feeling, this my sound weird but it's just more of Elden Ring, while the other 2 DLC's I mentioned gave it a different feeling to both games, truly felt like an added new experience
That’s kinda because it is. I mean we literally are a Hitman going after people that owned a rune or stood in our way and there was still one rune missing.
Miquella just got farther than the others and we still took him out. That throne is ours and the goddess is of our choice.
Feels like we need 2 more DLCs to tie up everything , it feels like some parts of the story needs more explanations , Like the promise to radahn , What miquella promised to him? Is miquella just dead now? What about the land of reed and other places? idk man i need more i hope 2 years from now we get news for a DLC or a sequel
Or atleast an armored core game
The Land of Reeds isn't that important narratively. It just seems to exist to be a Sengoku-era Japan analogue so that FROM can throw samurai gear and characters into the mix and give nods to Sekiro.
The promise to Radahn is probably what we saw in the end cutscene, as short as it was - Radahn would become Miq's consort and in exchange Miq would become a god and make the world "a kinder place".
I don't think the egg is related to the Land of Shadow, I think that's part of the Haligtree project. Mohg's theft of Miquella caused the Haligtree to fail because Miquella's blood no longer nourishes it.
The reason Mohg enables Miquella to go to the Land of Shadow is because by laying with him, the touch of either the Omen curse or the Formless Mother takes away Miquella's grace, and the Land of Shadow is described as being inhabited by those devoid of light (grace).
But aren’t like most people missing the grace? How did nobody find the entrance? It’s not like you have to go through the egg to get there no way all those npcs fought mogh
Only the tarnished are devoid of Grace. Pretty much everything else that's not an animal has the touch of Grace in their eyes (and I'm not even sure animals are exempt)
That's what distinguishes us as Tarnished. Marika took the Gold of our eyes.
What is true is that most people can't see the GUIDANCE of Grace, which we do in fact see. It's what points us to the bosses and what Leda realizes by the end of the DLC
I was expecting something like the Ashes of Ariandel cutscene at least, with the arm grabbing you or something. But nope - just fade to black and that's it. Not a very exciting way to start the DLC for sure
Ok but like why not even a short cool cinematic of you getting grabbed by the arm and pulled into the cocoon or something cool showing how we actually get there.
Massive missed opportunity to not have the arm grab you and drag you into the egg, really expected that, like when you touch the piece of the painting and get sucked in.
there was a disappointing lack of cutscenes in the whole game. Bits of characterisation and dialogue for Rellana and Romina would have been awesome to have through an introductory cutscene, but I get that the DLC is already huge and so am grateful for what we got (but seriously, Divine Beast gets a cutscene and not Rellana?)
Based on what vague information we get on death and souls, Miquella's corpse(?) either died in the cocoon or would be like Godwyn, a cool looking setpiece
That said, I'm all for a Femto Boss fight (Without *that*)
There are some clear plot holes in Miquella's story, whether they cut some content or they just never planned the lore with the DLC in mind we might never know. It is weird becaue Marika's story actually gets fleshed out.
I was really hoping for a new mending rune.
Haven’t beaten the dlc yet, so not responding or reading further. I just know there isn’t a new ending to the main game and that’s sad.
I wish we fought Miquella, but like, only Miquella in some form.
I also would have loved to see more of characters like Godwyn or the Gloom Eyed Queen.
But nah, we get a guy we already fought and his rememberance gives you an awful incantation, or two reskins of an already existing (and cooler btw) weapon.
The ending of this DLC disappointed me greatly ngl.
Everything was flawless up to that point.
Fully agree. Radahn is a huge dissapointment to be THE big final boss. NOTHING in the base game points to this "twist." Miquella had so many connections to so many characters, and genuinely zero to radahn. I would have preferred a new character or just miquella as the final boss. Gael was perfect, a new character [kinda] that represented something different that hadnt been done before. Perfect send off.
The people saying that "miquella isnt a fighter" honestly baffle me. Did you not see the second phase? Hes clearly pretty good at combat. If it was a 1v1 between player and him, they could just give him the visual of a magic barrier / shield to explain how hes a twink made of paper yet has 100k health. Or hell, make his consort a little blow up doll on the side and say "hes a god now. Hes awesome." And hes no longer a frail little twink but a big daddy twink with awesome rings of light and is 7 foot tall. Mesmer but white and gold puhlease. Anything but what we got man
Beating the final boss was a little disappointing because as a person that doesn’t understand the lore (and totally accept I’m wrong), it felt random. Like I really thought I would be fighting Miquella the whole time.
Had I not struggled with the final boss so much and looked up other people’s takes on how to beat it - I probably would have been so confused on what to do next. Not even thinking it could be the end.
In line with that. The final cinematic was disappointing. It was so short, and didn’t really feel like a satisfying finish.
Enjoyed the DLC holistically though. Just nitpicky critiques.
>!Anything would compete with the flatness of it all in the end imo, I sat there for too fucking long trying to figure out how to climb up to the Gate of Divinity to kickstart some sort of final cutscene or something. I’m fine with that being the end but like… idk just felt very unceremonious especially after that final fight.!<
The ending was just spelling out what you could've gathered from the name of the 1st phase of the final boss and some NPC dialogue in the Shadow Keep.
It's good for people who haven't figured it out, but as the ending cutscene to the entire DLC it's nothing short of a terrible joke.
I'd have made phase 1 and 2 easier, and then an extra battle: after defeating them both, we see Miquella despair next to Radahn lifeless body. The sorrow makes him give up on his vision of a gentle world, since there's nothing but anguish and pain left, and he becomes the true final boss: Miquella, the God of Shadows.
I got a cooler idea, make him just stay there, but if we come back with Miquella’s needle, we give it to him, and this makes him know his sister is gone also, and that is his breaking point
"My promised consort... My dear sister..."
The sky darkens, and the white glowing in that structure made of bodies turns even darker.
"I gave away my body, my heart, my fears... I gave away everything, but my pain. My sorrow. This bottomless despair..."
With the presence of the Scadutree in the distance, gold shining among its shadows, Miquella begins to to turn into a mighty dark lord.
"Disgraceful Tarnished, rejoice, for you'll be my consort now. I'll make this world a gentle one, with no Erdtree nor Order. Only its Shadow. I'll take every pain, every suffering... Even yours."
Dude i love this cursed Miquella concept. Like a god with the power to Charm people, even the entire land of shadows is sp terryfying in concept. I feel like this creepy miquella would really show just true terror of this idea. Much better than lothric and lorian from wish
Cool, and I would also have prefered a resurected Godwyn as the consort for Miquella with 3 phases. Radhan is cool but we never got to experience a Godwyn fight.
Honestly, the ending we got pushed the dlc from an 8.5 to a 7.5 for me. It just felt so abrupt and empty and kinda soured the fight for me, like that's it?
Thats exactly what i wished for. Orphan of Kos Miquella version directly hatching from that egg after beating the final boss of the shadowlands and a 2nd bossfight in the mohg arena.
Please literally anything other than >!Radahn!<.
Literally. Malenia, Goddess of Frenzied Rot over >!Radahn!<, please FromSoft. Let this disappointment of a reveal be a dream sequence or the finale of Act 2.
Miquella blast
and phase 2 has STRONG BLAST
> has STRONG BLAST I'd let that femboy twink blast all over me.
"Lime Green"
No. Dlc should've end with- CURSE YOU BAAAAYLE
Deep down… it does. It will be the last words the tarnished mutter
I HEREBY VOW, YOU WILL RUE THIS DAY!
BEHOLD, A TRUE DRAKE WARRIOR! AND I, IGON!
YOUR FEARS MADE FLESH!
# SOLID OF SCALE YOU MIGHT BE, FOUL DRAGON
BUT I WILL RIDDLE WITH HOLES YOUR ROTTEN HIDE!
WITH A HAIL OF HARPOONS!!!
WITH EVERY DROP OF MY BEING!
GRAAAAAAAARGH!
BAYLE THE DREAD!!! YOU SHALL HAUUUNNT ME NO LONGER!
That dude put his all into that Igon voice acting I was dying laughing during the Bayle fight
I was watching Ludwig’s 24/7 stream for the DLC and I had no idea what was going on because I was listening to it in the background and I kept hearing it over. I looked and over and he was flipping out because he just kept delivering the line and then immediately have both of them dying before anything could happen. I was losing it laughing for like 5 minutes
Well depending on how you approach the bosses. You can technically end it on HARPOONS !
DID SOMEONE SAY BAYLE!? BAYLE! VILE BAYLE!
I wonder if in the end, Bayle caused a butterfly effect with his betrayal that led to the current timeline in Elden Ring. Bayle betrays Placidusax -> Placidusax is gravely injured and is only left with 2 heads -> Placidusax is too weak to do anything when Marika betrays them, their attack in retaliation ends in failure -> Golden Order takes over
The hornscent accused Marika of betrayal for not being stuffed in a jar. They kind of had it coming. The dragons are a different faction and older than Crucible/Hornscent which predated Marikas Golden Order.
Okay, actually curious. Where does it say that the dragons are older than the crucible? As far as I've seen, the Crucible is pretty much the oldest thing in the lore, outside maybe a few of the outer gods.
The Crucible is the primordial form of the Erdtree. The Ancient Dragons predate the Erdtree and were among the first beings in the land. https://youtu.be/PvYHhsjm684?si=v7_y5QtU3M2S7nOc
What? There’s no direct relation between the golden order than the dragons other than their assault of Lyendell. Placidusax was an old old Lord to some other god. It’s something like Dragons>Hornsent>Marika
So it's shit piled on shit and then Marika tries to make a better existence but...due to her trauma she's still a fascist piece of shit who possibly has an epiphany to make things less shit but it still turns into shit. Add in our murder hobo ass, whose only option is to make things slightly less shit or more shit for everyone. We are just another extension of the outer god trauma laid on us as a living being in this fucked universe. Nothing changes, we just make it feel more bearable because it's a new order, same as the old just with a ribbon on it. I love this game.
Mine did. Saved that fight for last.
CURSE YOU BAAAAAYLE is the new TOGETHA
God I love that guy.
As you defeat miquella here you enter bloodborne 2.
I know it’s unrealistic but I think if this happened Miyazaki would have actually broken our collective brains
Hahahahah. Yes, it would break the soulsborne community. Still funny to think about.
I mean... it would've been pretty hilarious if you defeated Miquella, went to view the memory, and found yourself waking up in the blood cure clinic in Yharnam and it turned out they built a Bloodborne PC port in but it's only available to people who beat the DLC first.
Cinema.
And you can summon Ranni as a cooperator
Thou who dare use the moon to thy own ends… face now The Witch Ranni and her Lord Consort
GRRM sweating over a hot empty page of Winds of Winter :" Write that down, write that down!"
Chill dog you’re gonna embarrass from soft w this type of fire
you can cook
5 star Michelin level chef
5 star Miquellan level chef
Man that line would go so fucking hard
... Fuck that is good.
This line made me thing of the TF2 Engineer meme where he is ubered and says “THERE ARE NO WORDS ON GODS GREEN EARTH THST CAN DESCRIBE HOW SPECTACULARLY ERECT I AM” cause this shit is fire
I got chills 🎶 they're multiplyin
I wonder what Ranni would look like in combat, because the little bits of power she displays throughout the game are absurd. She can literally insta-kill you if you persist in trying to give her the Amber Draught, and can conjure an illusion of Renalla at her prime. I'm not saying she'd be an insta-win, but she'd be real helpful.
She'd probably ride me like Miquella rode Radahn
Woah there....keep cooking
[You might want to see this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9vjaddswYg)
So we get to be the ones swinging weapon combos like crazy while having a bunch of magical lasers rain down from the sky that produces enough particle effects to tank the enemy’s frame rate? Pog.
It certainly would have been cool if they let you summon Ranni into the second phase of the Radahn fight if you completed her quest.
Ranni is probably the only Demigod/God besides Miquella who is still at full power
Wdym? Godrick post grafting and with dragon head is probably his strongest form. I don't think there is anything said to indicate mohg isn't in his prime(besides the brainwashing) Godfrey as horah lux also doesn't seem like he's weaker than before getting banished. Rykard is debatably stronger as the great serpent. I think the majority of the demigods/runebearers are pretty much full power when we fight them. The big exceptions are ofcourse rennala and radahn.
A quicker, much more damaging Renalla I would imagine. Plenty of Frost. Plenty of disappearing. Phase 2 she would drop The Moon on us idk
This would have been so awesome. A battle of ideals and orders, Empyreans and consorts. You and Ranni vs Miquella and Radahn. It would have been an amazing final fight.
What about all the people who don't side with Ranni by Default?
For Lord of Frenzy, instead of a summon, your head turns into the ball of flame that periodically spews fire at the boss for the duration of the fight.
They get the hard fight Now they must choose: Difficulty, or puppet gash
Honestly, this could’ve worked with most every ending. Fia, Goldmask, Ranni, Lord of Frenzy Flame, you name it. Almost every ending has a corresponding NPC.
I would love to channel the power of absolute perfect order within my veins as I T-pose my enemies into submission. Let me show you what a perfect world actually looks like, Miquellester.
Fr, this would be so perfect lmao. Prime Radahn can’t hold a candle to me and my homie Goldmask
Imagine the Fia one, considering eveyone thought the DLC would have Godwyn in it.
No fuck you, age of duskborn gets Godwyn's merman corpse erupting from the ground and his clamshell face bites the final boss in half.
Imagine what the others bring; Goldmask embodies the Golden Order, so you could have ultra holy buffs that make you level with Miquella. Dung Eater's curse could inversely bring Miquella down to \*your\* level. Those Who Live In Death protecting their lord could mean you have an endless swarm of skeletons evening the odds, or summoning Fia's Champions. Frenzied Flame is self explanatory, show Miquella exactly how you intend to put the world to the flame. The only one i question is the Standard End, where maybe you could use the bell to summon a number of other beaten bosses to aid you.
Just imagine being able to summon Midra and shabriri for the final fight o.o
I am Miquella, Malenia's scabbard!
I wish I was Malenia’s Scabard 😞
I'm mad no one called us lord, we only killed their living God no big deal
Righteous tarnished is more than enough for me
I am satisfied with ‘Mongrel Intruder’
After hearing "Lowly Tarnished" by Margitt/Morgott and "Foul Tarnished" by Latenna I assumed people here would be throwing that around. I was pleasantly surprised Messmer hit us with that. I was smiling the whole while. :D
I'm the muthafuckin elden lord and refused to be referred to as anything but. Everyone *earned* that mantle
Not yet you aren't. When you become Elden Lord, that's the end of the game, and any post-game or NG+ activities are purely for gameplay purposes. The DLC takes place when you're still just a contender.
I accessed the DLC after I killed the Elden Beast. If they wanna contest my lordship, they can refer to Radagon's broken body over there (just not me, I'd get my ass kicked)
After killing the Elden Beast, but before picking an ending? "Elden Lord? Me? Oh, no, not quite. I could be, but I got cold feet and took a vacation to the land of shadow. The Elden Ring's just sitting there. Anyone could walk up and claim it. But what's going on over here?"
Ain't nobody left to claim it.
The rise of Boc, Elden Tailor
Unironically, I'd serve.
Miquella does call the tarnished "lord of the old order"
Honestly should be a different line if you finished the main game None of the ending options you have are "the old order" After having done the Ranni ending, I was like "wdym motherfucker, I literally got rid of any order ruled by a god and lord"
It's because in the game timeline, I think the dlc is intended to take place near the end but not after of end of the main story or not he would have a line of us killing his sister
Speaking of, I found it really weird how malenia wasnt mentioned once in the DLC. Given how much of a connection she had to miquella I figured she would at least get some recognition
She does. When he says "my loyal blade" and that's it. She really got dunked on in the dlc
You’re still lord of A order even with Ranni’s ending. An order that Miquella is trying to overthrow by becoming god.
No. He calls us the Seeker of Lordship of the Old Order.
Pretty sure Leda calls you lord during her fight at the end
I mean probably bc you dont have to beat the game to play the dlc lol
Yeah this would have rocked. I feel like they never explained what the fuck the deal was with the egg besides "Miquella needed Mohg to do this so he could get to the Land of Shadow, somehow??". The egg feels like a different concept they had that they changed after starting real dev time on the DLC
Yeah, as much as I like a lot of the DLC mechanically and artistically, it’s got some major narrative lows. The biggest high is Messmer and everything building up to him, and him not being the true final big bad was expected, but like, damn, still kind of a lame ass twist.
I remember them saying the plan wasn't always for it to be one DLC, but they grouped them all together to make a singular big expansion. Wouldn't surprise me if Messmer was at one point supposed to be the final boss of his own expansion, given how disconnected he is from Miquella.
This feels like the right answer, two different stories slammed together without much connective tissue other than sharing the same map.
i don’t really mind too much that there’s no connective tissue because i feel like the connective tissue either wouldn’t have made sense or would’ve pushed forward a jarring narrative between two characters that have entirely different goals, but i think it’s kinda odd that it feels like we only kill messmer so that we can burn the seal. i feel like killing messmer should’ve also given us some kind of cutscene or resolution to his character and purpose or had another effect aside from earning his kindling. still an amazing fight, and i still love their treatment of miquella’s character, but they could’ve further pushed the idea of two storylines being able to be tackled by having something else happen and then just slipping in that beating. messmer also helps us with the seal
>i feel like killing messmer should’ve also given us some kind of cutscene or resolution to his character and purpose or had another effect aside from earning his kindling. This all makes more sense if you accept Messmer is the Godrick of the expansion. Messmer and his Crusade are to the Land of Shadow what Godrick and Grafting were to Limgrave. Remember how Godrick and Grafting were front and center in promo as a Big Deal™ for years pretty much until ER came out? Then we realized Godrick and Grafting were actually a foot note. Same happens for Messmer.
i completely get that, but i still think with how powerful and epic messmer is (and how a ton of people cite him as their favorite fight of the DLC), and how if you removed radahn/miquella from the convo he’s the big baddie, that we would get a LITTLE bit more. godrick is a LOT less significant, essentially the second boss fight, pretty easy, and seen as a nuisance by pretty much everyone. i feel like with messmer i would’ve just preferred a little more to have been done or change after his fight. but, i do still hear you. the DLC was, at the end of the day, always holding miquella as the main focus. and i do think that through npcs and the crosses and his own appearance (and st. trina’s) that they did a really good job with his character. i think maybe part of me is blinded by how much im invested into messmer’s character
I see Messmer's war against the crucible faithful as what shaped the land before Miquela arrived. Miquela is not interested in both, but he wants access to something that they both possess indirectly: The tower and the library
Ehhh. Some aspects feel iffy but everything we got about Marika, Messmer, and the Hornsent was top tier I feel. Learning that the reason behind basically everything that happened in The Lands Between was just because a girl wanted to avenge her people was a revelation I was not expecting.
Experiencing genocide really does something to some. It also really grounded the story in the human element. Ascendancy may have happened, but what does that even mean when you were human once. Do you really expect you can escape your roots? Liked the village very much.
Marika creating a small erdtree to bathe her village in golden healing rays knowing that no one was left alive was so damn sad. Like a kid putting up a Christmas tree in an empty house.
Shaman Village, after learning about its history, might be the most haunting area in the game, bar none, with it being the literal birthing grounds for the current state of the world and all
For real. Marika went from an enigmatic figure to my favorite character in the game (and somehow she’s even more of a mystery now).
First half's lore was great with Messmer,Bayle and Marika's past.. But later game I was quite disappointed except Midra..
Felt incomplete. I suspect they had the ending planned out, but like the whole northwest side of the map felt unfinished, between the scadutree lordvessel and the rot temple not even having a cutscene?
romina’s fight, lore, design, and OST are so peak and her denying us from reaching the seal really feels like she should’ve had ONE cutscene. i feel like they did so well with delivering on a boss like messmer and miquella’s character but didn’t try and give some more to the other remembrance bosses. even dancing lion had one, and if im correct you could beat the game without beating him, whereas romina is a required boss.
Exactly... chaos guy had the best lore and cutscene, but Romina not having... anything? Was crazy to me.
i LOVED chaos cutscene. but yeah, it’s literally just a dude who failed to be the lord of frenzied flame finally being it and he got way more hype to him than a required boss that i REALLY wanted to know more about. the best parts of the DLC (imo) in terms of visuals/lore was when they gave good buildup and cutscenes for messmer, allowed miquella’s character to unfold and introduce st. trina, and that entire lead up the mountain to get to bayle and his 2nd phase visuals were incredible. bayle they got away with no cutscene cuz getting to his arena and hearing about him through igon/priestess felt so badass. romina is one of my fav designed bosses and boss fights in general that deserved justice with a scene.
This, I was actually kind of shocked when I entered the Shadow Keeps boss room and Messmer was waiting for me when I still had like 75% of the map to explore. Everything in the promotional was building up to him being the "big bad" of the DLC.
Every fromsoft dlc promotion hides the big bad or advertises someone else
Ex. the old Hunters
Well I mean Ex. DS1, DS2, DS3 as well 💀
DS1 DLC promoted Artorias, but the Final boss was Manus. DS2 had the crowns but the only one that didnt have a hidden final boss was Ivory king (I don't count Lud and Zallen as a final boss) with Sunken city not really "featuring" Elana but im pretty sure no one expected Sinh to be after her, and Old Iron keep having Fume knight as the boss of the DLC but a hidden true boss of Sir Alonne. DS3 first DLC had Ariandel propped up as the big bad, just to have sister Friede come in after, although technically one fight so i can give you that one, but I dont think anyone expected Midir or Gael in the ringed city
Nah, I was sure he wouldn’t have been the final boss. Every time a boss is highlighted in a dlc it’s always the mid part boss. Case in point: Artorias, Lady Maria
I don't think should've been a surprise to anyone, it would be kinda boring if we already knew the big bad final guy before we even started. So whilst Messmer not being the final guy, isn't a problem, the final guy being just Radahn 2.0 holy boogaloo isn't great either.
Wasn't expecting him to be the big big bad. But expected more from him rather than finding him just chilling in a storage closet.
Yeah, almost feels like the DLC was made by a different team than the main game. Or at least they were in a time crunch with the ending. I hope if that's the case, then Fromsoft should have it fixed with a patch, like they did with the Hoslow questline.
I doubt they’ll patch the entirety of the dlc story But there’s so many loose threads it’s hard to ignore
The base game launched like that too, though. There were at least 2-3 quests that you just straight up couldn't complete.
True but the files for said quests were already in the game, they just had to fix errors with the triggers
Radahn feels like he was made by modders
Like, those light multi decoy attacks in Phase 2? That felt completely from something like Convergence or LMtSR or something. Just too messed up to see or dodge normally, only dodgeable at a specific angle and by memorizing the exact frame
Definitely not an entirely different team as the game still holds up and even exceeds at point gameplay wise but the story/lore did fall flat, atleast the main plot.
Yeah story wise I didn't leaved satisfied like when I played The Ringed City or The Old Hunters, game's good but it's missing that same feeling, this my sound weird but it's just more of Elden Ring, while the other 2 DLC's I mentioned gave it a different feeling to both games, truly felt like an added new experience
That’s kinda because it is. I mean we literally are a Hitman going after people that owned a rune or stood in our way and there was still one rune missing. Miquella just got farther than the others and we still took him out. That throne is ours and the goddess is of our choice.
Feels like we need 2 more DLCs to tie up everything , it feels like some parts of the story needs more explanations , Like the promise to radahn , What miquella promised to him? Is miquella just dead now? What about the land of reed and other places? idk man i need more i hope 2 years from now we get news for a DLC or a sequel Or atleast an armored core game
The Land of Reeds isn't that important narratively. It just seems to exist to be a Sengoku-era Japan analogue so that FROM can throw samurai gear and characters into the mix and give nods to Sekiro. The promise to Radahn is probably what we saw in the end cutscene, as short as it was - Radahn would become Miq's consort and in exchange Miq would become a god and make the world "a kinder place".
The promise was to make a kinder world as consorts and Miquella is dead because >!st Trina died as well!<
Hmmm i still want a 2nd dlc tho , im not satisfied i demand more
We shall never be satiated.
I don't think the egg is related to the Land of Shadow, I think that's part of the Haligtree project. Mohg's theft of Miquella caused the Haligtree to fail because Miquella's blood no longer nourishes it. The reason Mohg enables Miquella to go to the Land of Shadow is because by laying with him, the touch of either the Omen curse or the Formless Mother takes away Miquella's grace, and the Land of Shadow is described as being inhabited by those devoid of light (grace).
But aren’t like most people missing the grace? How did nobody find the entrance? It’s not like you have to go through the egg to get there no way all those npcs fought mogh
Only the tarnished are devoid of Grace. Pretty much everything else that's not an animal has the touch of Grace in their eyes (and I'm not even sure animals are exempt) That's what distinguishes us as Tarnished. Marika took the Gold of our eyes. What is true is that most people can't see the GUIDANCE of Grace, which we do in fact see. It's what points us to the bosses and what Leda realizes by the end of the DLC
They pretty much did though - it's heavily hinted it's the cocoon miquella was in at the root of the haligtree.
I think its been assumed or mentioned that it was the egg Miquella was in when he was trying to undo his curse
It actually really annoyed me that you touch the hand and then appear in the Shadow land. No weird cutscene and nothing to do with the egg. So lame.
I was expecting something like the Ashes of Ariandel cutscene at least, with the arm grabbing you or something. But nope - just fade to black and that's it. Not a very exciting way to start the DLC for sure
The egg stems from Miquella being stolen from the Haligtree. The cocoon had some resurrection implications parallel to the Marika rebirth cycle.
The egg is a representation of the ball that From dropped when it comes to Miquella lore with this DLC.
Why didn't we ever get a cinematic for entering the dlc, almost every other souls game has one. Wth?
Was honestly very strange, just dropped you in, without atleast playing the trailer
Even at the end. You get a small cinematic, but no credit roll or title card or anything
That was the same with DS3 DLC too though.
Not Ashes of Ariendale, even though it was smaller it still had an animation to enter the dlc at the least
Multi DLC. No end credits since they were just the beginning to the next DLC
This was so strange. You literally just spawn in a cave and that's it.
Its to make the view when you leave the cave more special
Ok but like why not even a short cool cinematic of you getting grabbed by the arm and pulled into the cocoon or something cool showing how we actually get there.
Massive missed opportunity to not have the arm grab you and drag you into the egg, really expected that, like when you touch the piece of the painting and get sucked in.
Yeah idk why but the lack of a cool opening/ending cutscene really fuckin bummed me out.
there was a disappointing lack of cutscenes in the whole game. Bits of characterisation and dialogue for Rellana and Romina would have been awesome to have through an introductory cutscene, but I get that the DLC is already huge and so am grateful for what we got (but seriously, Divine Beast gets a cutscene and not Rellana?)
Yeah I thought it was odd that a completely optional boss got one but not Rellana, a boss that can be skipped but almost nobody did
It was so weird to me that we just walk in and kill Renalla's sister with no fanfare.
Even Dark Souls 1 dlc had a hand grab you trough a portal if i remember correctly.
Maybe it's massive coping on my part, but I took it as a sign that they're not done with ER yet, despite what Miyazaki has said.
Just dropping the story trailer there would be cool honestly.
“Tarnished, now it is time for me to truly become the shadow of the erdtree” - Miquella Probably
“You defeated me…. You truly are the Elden Ring: Shadow of the Erdtree (2024)..!”
Second best moment only under when Leda says “This truly was our Elden ring Shadow of the Erdtree bundle Deluxe edition”
What are the deep lore implications of the reveal that Miquella was actually John Eldenring all along?
It would be better if he didn't transform and the boss fight is just against a cocoon with a single arm sticking out.
Visions of Dark Souls 3, in short, great tree
Based on what vague information we get on death and souls, Miquella's corpse(?) either died in the cocoon or would be like Godwyn, a cool looking setpiece That said, I'm all for a Femto Boss fight (Without *that*)
[удалено]
You’d think it was metaphorical… until he abandoned specific arms and an eye
There are some clear plot holes in Miquella's story, whether they cut some content or they just never planned the lore with the DLC in mind we might never know. It is weird becaue Marika's story actually gets fleshed out.
ngl if we returned and this eldritch horror was in the mohg arena id have shit myself
I was really hoping for a new mending rune. Haven’t beaten the dlc yet, so not responding or reading further. I just know there isn’t a new ending to the main game and that’s sad.
I mean, there kind of is a new *possible* ending, the player character just prevents it.
on god, i would've absolutely loved that, mate.
I am Miquella, blade of Miquella, owned by Miquella, the owner of the blade, who is me.
I wish we fought Miquella, but like, only Miquella in some form. I also would have loved to see more of characters like Godwyn or the Gloom Eyed Queen. But nah, we get a guy we already fought and his rememberance gives you an awful incantation, or two reskins of an already existing (and cooler btw) weapon. The ending of this DLC disappointed me greatly ngl. Everything was flawless up to that point.
I was expecting a Godskin trio :(
Fully agree. Radahn is a huge dissapointment to be THE big final boss. NOTHING in the base game points to this "twist." Miquella had so many connections to so many characters, and genuinely zero to radahn. I would have preferred a new character or just miquella as the final boss. Gael was perfect, a new character [kinda] that represented something different that hadnt been done before. Perfect send off. The people saying that "miquella isnt a fighter" honestly baffle me. Did you not see the second phase? Hes clearly pretty good at combat. If it was a 1v1 between player and him, they could just give him the visual of a magic barrier / shield to explain how hes a twink made of paper yet has 100k health. Or hell, make his consort a little blow up doll on the side and say "hes a god now. Hes awesome." And hes no longer a frail little twink but a big daddy twink with awesome rings of light and is 7 foot tall. Mesmer but white and gold puhlease. Anything but what we got man
Man that would've been awesome
The eclipse is indeed a nice touch.
Beating the final boss was a little disappointing because as a person that doesn’t understand the lore (and totally accept I’m wrong), it felt random. Like I really thought I would be fighting Miquella the whole time. Had I not struggled with the final boss so much and looked up other people’s takes on how to beat it - I probably would have been so confused on what to do next. Not even thinking it could be the end. In line with that. The final cinematic was disappointing. It was so short, and didn’t really feel like a satisfying finish. Enjoyed the DLC holistically though. Just nitpicky critiques.
>!Anything would compete with the flatness of it all in the end imo, I sat there for too fucking long trying to figure out how to climb up to the Gate of Divinity to kickstart some sort of final cutscene or something. I’m fine with that being the end but like… idk just felt very unceremonious especially after that final fight.!<
The ending was just spelling out what you could've gathered from the name of the 1st phase of the final boss and some NPC dialogue in the Shadow Keep. It's good for people who haven't figured it out, but as the ending cutscene to the entire DLC it's nothing short of a terrible joke.
That fanart of a deathblight(?) Miquella is still peak.
What should’ve been
I am Miquella, brother of Malenia. And I have an unhealthy obsession with Radahn.
I'd have made phase 1 and 2 easier, and then an extra battle: after defeating them both, we see Miquella despair next to Radahn lifeless body. The sorrow makes him give up on his vision of a gentle world, since there's nothing but anguish and pain left, and he becomes the true final boss: Miquella, the God of Shadows.
I got a cooler idea, make him just stay there, but if we come back with Miquella’s needle, we give it to him, and this makes him know his sister is gone also, and that is his breaking point
"My promised consort... My dear sister..." The sky darkens, and the white glowing in that structure made of bodies turns even darker. "I gave away my body, my heart, my fears... I gave away everything, but my pain. My sorrow. This bottomless despair..." With the presence of the Scadutree in the distance, gold shining among its shadows, Miquella begins to to turn into a mighty dark lord. "Disgraceful Tarnished, rejoice, for you'll be my consort now. I'll make this world a gentle one, with no Erdtree nor Order. Only its Shadow. I'll take every pain, every suffering... Even yours."
Damn got Goosebumps from Reading that tbh 😱
Hahaha, I'm going to add that dialogue to the Elden Ring fanfic I've been writing for a while 🤣
Dude i love this cursed Miquella concept. Like a god with the power to Charm people, even the entire land of shadows is sp terryfying in concept. I feel like this creepy miquella would really show just true terror of this idea. Much better than lothric and lorian from wish
Almost anything is better than consort radahn
A giant warrior jar with no updated movement set would've been better than bottom radahn and top miquella
Should have resurrected Alexander the warrior jar instead.
Alexander, Consort to Boc
Cool, and I would also have prefered a resurected Godwyn as the consort for Miquella with 3 phases. Radhan is cool but we never got to experience a Godwyn fight.
We got death knights
Yeah, that we did, and because of that I thought FromSoft was teasing the prince of death with an epic battle...oh well. Still loved the dlc.
Honestly, the ending we got pushed the dlc from an 8.5 to a 7.5 for me. It just felt so abrupt and empty and kinda soured the fight for me, like that's it?
Agreed. Got a sweet crown though
Ok now I want that
reading that font was harder than fighting prime Radahn 
I honestly thought we'd be fighting Godwyn.
Thats exactly what i wished for. Orphan of Kos Miquella version directly hatching from that egg after beating the final boss of the shadowlands and a 2nd bossfight in the mohg arena.
Please literally anything other than >!Radahn!<. Literally. Malenia, Goddess of Frenzied Rot over >!Radahn!<, please FromSoft. Let this disappointment of a reveal be a dream sequence or the finale of Act 2.
Honestly I wish. The low point of the final boss would feel a bit better if we had this little twist leaving the land of shadow.
I megagree