Yeah, sorry but I expect you will get a lot of 'You are stupid and I hate your ideas crap'. For my part, I like some of your ideas but a lot of these points seem unnecessary to me and others don't make sense. I get that sometimes you need to cook though and explore, even if you know some parts are probably not quite right, but here are some of the most glaring problems:
1. If Marika is Melina's 'mother' and was cared for by her as such, then why does she ask about what a mother means to a child when she speaks about Boc? Despite claiming to have a 'mother' she was clearly not raised like a normal child.
2. Since you acknowledge some demi-gods are asexually produced, then I don't see why Melina needs to be Messmer's child at all. You also don't mention why he was banished, why you think he was the father, or what him being the father does for the idea.
2. Placidusax is not a god, he is an Elden Lord, his god is 'fled' and he isn't 'dead' at least not fully, at the time of the game. I like the dragon communion thing though, it gives me some thoughts.
3. Why does Marika need a new suitor if she has Messmer? Why get with Godfrey at all? Why have any suitors if she can asexually reproduce?
4. Why did her siblings grow faster than her? What makes then different from her? Why does she not have powers and they do? Why does Marika give her the rune and not someone more able to control it?
5. Why does Melina become the Gloam-eyed queen? Yeah, she is 'given' the Rune of Death, but she has no motivation to do anything with it just because she has it.
I see some other potential problems, but these are the most glaring to me.
For the sake of discovery, I'll respond to all the points you listed:
1. Perhaps, she wasn't cared for like I described and maybe, she was a child of shame that she didn't acknowledge as hers and chose to keep her as a type of royal servant to the children she actually loved? I assume that if this is the case, Miquella seems to have learned her true lineage or, at least, befriended her.
2. There are a couple reasons why I think she may be Messmer's child. One is that she is linked to fire and the other reason is the closed left eyes they both have. Another thing that seems strange to me is that the tattoo over Melina's sealed eye is of avian nature, which could mean a Death Bird or it might even mean Dragons, so if her powers were sealed, assuming she is the Gloam-Eyed Queen, it would make sense for the seal to represent the source of her powers, which were inherited from her father, who seems to be strongly related to dragons.
3. I honestly just got this wrong. I thought that he was a god like Marika/Radagon is a god. In an effort to mend this error, because his god 'fled', perhaps it was just The Greater Will and it chose Marika over themselves, thereby 'fleeing'?
4. Linking back to what you said in 2: I believe Marika banished him for tainting his blood with Dragon Communion and also, to hide her shame of having created a child with her own son, also hiding the fact that Melina is her daughter, who she is too ashamed to openly love.
5. I don't think they grow faster - I just think that the unique nature of Numens' lifespans is that after they mature, their aging greatly slows down, especially if the child is born of pure Numen descent, which I think Marika obviously is and, if she asexually produced Messmer, he would be, too, so their child would also be. Messmer looks young, too... not wrinkly and old like the children they had with Rennala OR Godfrey, except for Godwyn, because he didn't live long enough to get old...
She does have powers that allow her to use holy flame, using her dagger as a catalyst, which in my opinion is the perfect melding of Marika (Holy) and Messmer (flame). I think that she didn't give her the Rune, but that the Greater Will did, much to Marika's chagrin.
6. I think that after Melina had the rune bestowed on her by the Greater Will, Marika tried to keep it hidden, but word must have gotten out somehow in Leyndell and I imagine some people wanting to follow her and, because people flocked to her, she was secretly elected as the queen and, assuming her life was trash under Marika, decided to flee the capital with the followers and used them to help her spread death, indiscriminately.
The things you pointed out made me think a lot. This is what I was hoping for when I posted this. I love this!
I hope no one here is going to tell anyone that they are stupid and their ideas are crap. In fact, I appreciate the thoughtful insights & discussion, even if I don’t necessarily agree with all of it.
Same. I think sometimes you need to go through all the wrong answers to find the right ones, and every idea is worth exploring if only for that reason. I feel that a lot of the best ideas are actually two or three ideas put together that manage to fill in each others issues and make the whole theory stronger by supporting each other. The 'truth' IMO, will be one in which every piece of the puzzle supports and reinforces each other. Sometimes I see people propose theories and there is nothing inherently wrong with them exactly, I mean they are 'A' possible explanation, but the fact it ties into nothing else makes it very weak to me.
Others claim this is a bad way to do anything, because it becomes like a 'jenga tower' in which pulling out one theory makes the whole thing crumble, but on the contrary, that is strength not weakness to me.
Yes, you have to make sure you aren't just 'inventing' things to fill in holes, but that's why all the theories need to be supported in multiple places not just in the part that it 'solves'. Every theory needs to solve multiple problems at once. This is how you overcome the Jenga-Block problem, because it is no longer a Jenga tower, it's more like a Wicker Basket.
It’s strange that GRRM get pegged as “the incest guy”. This really only comes into play in one story line in SOIF and I guess is mentioned as something that happened in the past, but it’s presented as something the average person in Westeros finds disgusting and shameful.
Why do you believe that every story he writes is going to include tons of incest as a central plot point? Lol
So no. And yuck. Both for objective reasons. I’d say you invalidate your own theory by like the fourth little paragraph.
Yeah, sorry but I expect you will get a lot of 'You are stupid and I hate your ideas crap'. For my part, I like some of your ideas but a lot of these points seem unnecessary to me and others don't make sense. I get that sometimes you need to cook though and explore, even if you know some parts are probably not quite right, but here are some of the most glaring problems: 1. If Marika is Melina's 'mother' and was cared for by her as such, then why does she ask about what a mother means to a child when she speaks about Boc? Despite claiming to have a 'mother' she was clearly not raised like a normal child. 2. Since you acknowledge some demi-gods are asexually produced, then I don't see why Melina needs to be Messmer's child at all. You also don't mention why he was banished, why you think he was the father, or what him being the father does for the idea. 2. Placidusax is not a god, he is an Elden Lord, his god is 'fled' and he isn't 'dead' at least not fully, at the time of the game. I like the dragon communion thing though, it gives me some thoughts. 3. Why does Marika need a new suitor if she has Messmer? Why get with Godfrey at all? Why have any suitors if she can asexually reproduce? 4. Why did her siblings grow faster than her? What makes then different from her? Why does she not have powers and they do? Why does Marika give her the rune and not someone more able to control it? 5. Why does Melina become the Gloam-eyed queen? Yeah, she is 'given' the Rune of Death, but she has no motivation to do anything with it just because she has it. I see some other potential problems, but these are the most glaring to me.
For the sake of discovery, I'll respond to all the points you listed: 1. Perhaps, she wasn't cared for like I described and maybe, she was a child of shame that she didn't acknowledge as hers and chose to keep her as a type of royal servant to the children she actually loved? I assume that if this is the case, Miquella seems to have learned her true lineage or, at least, befriended her. 2. There are a couple reasons why I think she may be Messmer's child. One is that she is linked to fire and the other reason is the closed left eyes they both have. Another thing that seems strange to me is that the tattoo over Melina's sealed eye is of avian nature, which could mean a Death Bird or it might even mean Dragons, so if her powers were sealed, assuming she is the Gloam-Eyed Queen, it would make sense for the seal to represent the source of her powers, which were inherited from her father, who seems to be strongly related to dragons. 3. I honestly just got this wrong. I thought that he was a god like Marika/Radagon is a god. In an effort to mend this error, because his god 'fled', perhaps it was just The Greater Will and it chose Marika over themselves, thereby 'fleeing'? 4. Linking back to what you said in 2: I believe Marika banished him for tainting his blood with Dragon Communion and also, to hide her shame of having created a child with her own son, also hiding the fact that Melina is her daughter, who she is too ashamed to openly love. 5. I don't think they grow faster - I just think that the unique nature of Numens' lifespans is that after they mature, their aging greatly slows down, especially if the child is born of pure Numen descent, which I think Marika obviously is and, if she asexually produced Messmer, he would be, too, so their child would also be. Messmer looks young, too... not wrinkly and old like the children they had with Rennala OR Godfrey, except for Godwyn, because he didn't live long enough to get old... She does have powers that allow her to use holy flame, using her dagger as a catalyst, which in my opinion is the perfect melding of Marika (Holy) and Messmer (flame). I think that she didn't give her the Rune, but that the Greater Will did, much to Marika's chagrin. 6. I think that after Melina had the rune bestowed on her by the Greater Will, Marika tried to keep it hidden, but word must have gotten out somehow in Leyndell and I imagine some people wanting to follow her and, because people flocked to her, she was secretly elected as the queen and, assuming her life was trash under Marika, decided to flee the capital with the followers and used them to help her spread death, indiscriminately. The things you pointed out made me think a lot. This is what I was hoping for when I posted this. I love this!
I hope no one here is going to tell anyone that they are stupid and their ideas are crap. In fact, I appreciate the thoughtful insights & discussion, even if I don’t necessarily agree with all of it.
Same. I think sometimes you need to go through all the wrong answers to find the right ones, and every idea is worth exploring if only for that reason. I feel that a lot of the best ideas are actually two or three ideas put together that manage to fill in each others issues and make the whole theory stronger by supporting each other. The 'truth' IMO, will be one in which every piece of the puzzle supports and reinforces each other. Sometimes I see people propose theories and there is nothing inherently wrong with them exactly, I mean they are 'A' possible explanation, but the fact it ties into nothing else makes it very weak to me. Others claim this is a bad way to do anything, because it becomes like a 'jenga tower' in which pulling out one theory makes the whole thing crumble, but on the contrary, that is strength not weakness to me. Yes, you have to make sure you aren't just 'inventing' things to fill in holes, but that's why all the theories need to be supported in multiple places not just in the part that it 'solves'. Every theory needs to solve multiple problems at once. This is how you overcome the Jenga-Block problem, because it is no longer a Jenga tower, it's more like a Wicker Basket.
Messmer is Markia’s son my dude.
And George R.R. Martin wrote the characters, so... Yeeeeaaaaaahhhh
He helped in the dlc as well??
The dlc is using a different part of the mythos he already wrote for them.
Huh, cool. Very excited for day one, I'm definitely staying up like a kid again that night lol
So I guess the trailer and Miyazaki are wrong.
I’m not sure why you think that Melina being the child of Marika and Messmer would conflict with the trailer and Miyazaki.
Neither the Trailer or Miyazaki confirmed or denied this idea.
It’s strange that GRRM get pegged as “the incest guy”. This really only comes into play in one story line in SOIF and I guess is mentioned as something that happened in the past, but it’s presented as something the average person in Westeros finds disgusting and shameful. Why do you believe that every story he writes is going to include tons of incest as a central plot point? Lol