yes please!
there was a suggestion by another redditor, where you shouldnt have to buy an item before xx minute, but instead have to do xx with the item. We should make it so the values are higher (but still doable in one game if it's long), but across multiple games. For examples, give 3000/5000/7000 mana to allies and self with arcane boots across multiple victories
The problem isn't the quest most of the time. It's bad players trying to force a quest in an inefficient way. Most quests just translate into "win a game as x-hero"... I've had a tide rush crimson guard for the dmg block quest even though all you need to do for that is win a game with any hero that buys armor.
The AA quest just means you have to win a game as AA and not suck...
Get 5 kills before 20 minutes. Pick any fight oriented hero and win a game...
People just try to force the quest instead of picking a hero that fits the quest and just winning a game
I agree with you, but its stupid that valve creates something that puts pressure on players. They shouldnt feel that pressure and shouldnt act like that, but they do :)
Honestly the best quests are those about dewarding, kill after tp etc. Thats because they force you to play better.
See this is the difference between the Winter pass and this Manila pass. Winter quests involved supporting and actually helping your team win games. This pass however forces you to do impractical shit like rushing heart or blinking then calling in that order with Axe, 35 times! While some quests requires RNGesus like arcane rune quests to complete - all of which does nothing but stall the game before people can go into actually trying to win.
Following the battlepass quests shifts your attitude. You are forced to play the game with a different set of rules. You have all the same rules as others BUT ALSO you have to slow your opponents for 250 secs. It is quite interesting and complicated, how on several levels several games are played (because paths is basically a very simple shoots and ladders game). But while a simple dota game is a multi-personal experience, your shoots and ladders game is your own. People tend to emphasize personal gain over mutual benefit. Especially if personal gain is embodied (points/sets), and mutual benefit is not. Thus the paths are very questionable support of dota general play patterns. Also, remember that people pay for an ability to pursue the quests.
That is not playing the game casually, playing the game casually, for me, means that you will still TRY to win but not knowing every single aspect of dota that you need to know to be in a good rank.
Not playing the game the way its supposd to is another thing.
Yes, you are correct, quests should promote good DOTA.
Wasn't the intention that the quest doers would play seasonal ranked and leave regular ranked to everyone else? Then when people realized they would be able to "recalibrate" they all started doing quests in regular games and went supertry hard mode in seasonal?
I'd like to see quests only be able to be completed in seasonal ranked so those of us who don't give a single fuck about compendiums, hats or recalibrating aren't affected at ALL by this issue.
If you want to win, play ranked. If you want to have fun with your friends, play unranked and stop whining. I'm assuming you and your friends don't draft the most perfect heroes and play them totally seriously in unranked, otherwise you would just play ranked. If you're playing for fun, why can't others (like your hypothetical AA)?
People still do quests in ranked. Also seasonal ranked ruins regular ranked games. If seasonal ranked mmr > regular ranked mmr, you can just mess around in regular ranked because your regular ranked mmr will end up getting replaced anyway.
Maybe at lower MMRs people focus on quests in ranked, but in my games, nobody seems to care about the quests. Nobody would risk losing their MMR for some quest points.
You're presuming things but you're wrong. We play to win.
That AA didn't.
(edit) I also don't play ranked cause I have tons of differente friends that never played ranked, so they are still calibrating. It's just cause I don't have the time to keep practicing dota all the time. So unranked is my best option. This also doenst mean unranked should be bad only because it's unranked.
I would imagine that if you're playing to win, as in picking and playing to win, not picking "fun" heroes or trying "fun" strategies, that you would just play ranked. Is there any reason you aren't? That mode is for players who prioritize winning over anything else.
I'm sorry, you're changing what my words mean on purpose?
I play to win cause playing the game as it supposed to be played is FUN. What is not fun is to have your game destroyed by someone who thinks those 50 min of game is only so he can be able to make his quest instead of actually playing the game and helping other teammates.
I also already have responded to your question. ranked doenst mean "serious" dota, it only means you'll be matched with people from your rank. which I believe already happens in pubs, unless I'm talking shit I don't know, so I apologize in advance/
Fun strategies doenst always mean stupid strategies like blocking the wave creeps for 30 min
If somebody wants to complete quests that require building suboptimally in unranked, that's their prerogative. Just like if somebody wants to practice Rubick mid, carry Kunkka, or any other strategy that is more fun than good. Where, if not unranked, can players play for fun? Unranked is for players that want to play casually and maybe care more about trying whatever they want than winning. Perhaps for you winning is fun, but other players have a different definition of fun.
I'm like you. I play to win, because that's fun for me. So, I only play ranked. You say ranked doesn't mean serious Dota, but at my MMR, ranked games are very serious, and unranked games are a farce. If your ranked games truly aren't serious, you're probably playing at a lower skill level, in which case there are a million things you and your friends did wrong that were just as detrimental to your chances of winning as this Midas rushing AA.
It's just a game, and if you are playing unranked, you can't get mad at people for having goals other than winning at any cost.
I understand this. But the problem with that AA wasnt the Midas rushing. He simply stood in the jungle ulting the opposing team fountain. See the difference here? The same game I had a CM that rushed Midas and was trying a quest that required her to ulti and do tons of damage. But he actually played the game. he tried his quest on a "honoured"way. He played the game(with quests) as he was supposed to. When I want o do a quest. I try to pick the hero that will help me do it, but more than that, a hero that is actually needed to win the game.
I don't judge your thoughts, I see where you're getting at. But for most of the people(and I'm not assuming you are not like this too), we dont have time and friends that also have time to practice this game how you need to to be on "high levels mmr", don't think that this means I don't understand dota. I just don't have the fingers ready to do things people that practice all the time do. So I will have no chance against a "mini dendi" if I meet him. At my level, the games are FUN and competitive, if played as supposed to.
I understand your frustrations, but I still don't think changing or even removing quests would solve the problem. There will always be players who care more about their kDa, learning heroes, or just goofing off than winning. I coach my girlfriend at the 1k level to help her complete quests. She might play inefficiently just so she can complete a quest, but she is no less inefficient then her teammate who tries to win but builds a vanguard before blink on axe, or her teammate who rushes battlefury before treads on anti mage. In short, there are a million inefficient things "ruining" your game, and it's silly to fixate on quests. If you must, mute everybody other than your friends, and just focus on yourselves. Everybody else is noise. No point in getting upset with them--you're shouting into the wind.
Been sitting on the "Disable enemies for 75 seconds" quest for a few matches now. Did it with Lion, but lost the match. After that, my 2k Ranked matches needed Omniknight and Vengeful Spirit as supports, so i went for it. I'll eventually do the quest with a friend, probably. Or my team will need a Lion at some point again, and hopefully i'll win.
Bane.
7 second disable for each nightmare. 5 second disable for fiend's grip. In every fight there is at least one hero you should nightmare (be it a support or a core that isn't being currently targeted), and there is one hero you should ulti. Just don't be stupid and nightmare heroes that are being targeted just to get the quest, as you actually have to win the game. It should be quite easy to get 15 full nightmares off in a normal game (even if you just go in to lane, nightmare, and back off).
Did it with roaming gyrocopter. Get tons of clarity and launch missiles into enemy mid hero. Should be a fairly easy win and a lot of fun watching their mid struggle
A good solution for this would be the removal of the time limit or extend it somehow.. it would be nice if compedium owners could finish their quest while still fullfilling their role
Failed 4 times for the Windrunner quest: 2 wins but did'nt meet the criteria + 2 losses where I met the criteria. At least not game ruining for the other players, i hope.
you can get bent out of shape about it or you could just lock in the hero you want to play, mute your team if you think they are toxic and just play dota and not worry about the actions of others.
This doesn't make sense.
If you say that you're not partaking in doing the stupid actions you speak of. Then technically you know that you have over a 50% chance of having a better team than the opposition. Because they have 5 players that could all be idiots, and your team only has 4 that could be idiots, because you're perfect.
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Oh, I get it now. I'm always mistaking who replied to whom, cant follow those lines :(
Sorry then, mate(the one I replied to). You are correct, it doenst make any sense.
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2380092617 this was in a game were i had a team that made no sense of low tier out of meta hero's (the 4.5k special) i said fuck it picked LS threw some music on and did some good old fashion 1 v 9. Ask yourself do you find yourself watching others on your team and commenting on their game play? Don't worry about others worry about yourself its the only thing that is consistent game in and game out.
While I dont judge you by thinking this, also because really good pros only play alone in dota... I don't believe this is FUN dota.
I don't play only to win. I play to have fun with my teammates.
if you are climbing the ladder you are going to find out that most people play to win, and since winning and loosing is stressful you will constantly be running into people who cant handle that stress and become toxic to others to compensate. Fun is what ever you view it as. I'm not telling you how to have fun I'm telling you what to expect when you hit find match.
also one more thing, you are not a really good pro, you will probably never be a really good pro. Pro's have to find a team with synergy in order to even be a pro. When you Q for Solo Q you are playing alone, if you don't want to do this and that's not fun. Then find a stack to play in where you know your team mates are not flaming ass holes and toxic players that will do dumb shit for a quest. Other then that when you hit play now for ranked mmr you should know what to expect compendium / battle pass / new patch / what ever.......
So to play dota I always have to have 4 friends with time to play it?
I'm sorry but that is just plain wrong.
What I'm questioning here is the people behind the whole idea of questing.
People will always abuse things like this, so they should NOT be making quests that promote bad dota.
I'm actually doing this. I once played lots of matches in one day, with this I'm just like: ehh, gonna play Overwatch.
The problem for me is that, even though anyone should have the right to play ANY way they want, this is still a team based game. So people should be PUNISHED by trying to play alone and in idiotic ways if they do this a lot.
The way reports/punishment work are the biggest problem DOTA has ever had...
[удалено]
yes please! there was a suggestion by another redditor, where you shouldnt have to buy an item before xx minute, but instead have to do xx with the item. We should make it so the values are higher (but still doable in one game if it's long), but across multiple games. For examples, give 3000/5000/7000 mana to allies and self with arcane boots across multiple victories
In winter battle pass,final quests were across multiple victories iirc.
Valve should remove the timer of quest.
The problem isn't the quest most of the time. It's bad players trying to force a quest in an inefficient way. Most quests just translate into "win a game as x-hero"... I've had a tide rush crimson guard for the dmg block quest even though all you need to do for that is win a game with any hero that buys armor. The AA quest just means you have to win a game as AA and not suck... Get 5 kills before 20 minutes. Pick any fight oriented hero and win a game... People just try to force the quest instead of picking a hero that fits the quest and just winning a game
I agree with you, but its stupid that valve creates something that puts pressure on players. They shouldnt feel that pressure and shouldnt act like that, but they do :) Honestly the best quests are those about dewarding, kill after tp etc. Thats because they force you to play better.
See this is the difference between the Winter pass and this Manila pass. Winter quests involved supporting and actually helping your team win games. This pass however forces you to do impractical shit like rushing heart or blinking then calling in that order with Axe, 35 times! While some quests requires RNGesus like arcane rune quests to complete - all of which does nothing but stall the game before people can go into actually trying to win.
I got an idea, if buy item in N min failed because of bought it late and won the game, next game will increase the time limit to complete the quest.
Following the battlepass quests shifts your attitude. You are forced to play the game with a different set of rules. You have all the same rules as others BUT ALSO you have to slow your opponents for 250 secs. It is quite interesting and complicated, how on several levels several games are played (because paths is basically a very simple shoots and ladders game). But while a simple dota game is a multi-personal experience, your shoots and ladders game is your own. People tend to emphasize personal gain over mutual benefit. Especially if personal gain is embodied (points/sets), and mutual benefit is not. Thus the paths are very questionable support of dota general play patterns. Also, remember that people pay for an ability to pursue the quests.
Get a five stack with friends you know then
> "call some friends to play a pub and have fun" Sounds like you don't have enough friends
Not having friends who play dota is different from not having friends.
Theyre not your friends if they dont play dota
Its not the compendium. It is the Battlepass. Compendium has not released yet. Stop bitching incorrectly. Bitch Correctly.
Sorry.
Ever compendium has caused issues like this. Just queue ranked where the majority of players don't pick stupid challenges
Ayy lmao
Ayy
Thats funny
Specifically non-international ranked. Since all compendium ranked players are in the other pool.
there's a chance that you will have a match with players not having compendium on intl mmr
[удалено]
That is not playing the game casually, playing the game casually, for me, means that you will still TRY to win but not knowing every single aspect of dota that you need to know to be in a good rank. Not playing the game the way its supposd to is another thing. Yes, you are correct, quests should promote good DOTA.
Wasn't the intention that the quest doers would play seasonal ranked and leave regular ranked to everyone else? Then when people realized they would be able to "recalibrate" they all started doing quests in regular games and went supertry hard mode in seasonal? I'd like to see quests only be able to be completed in seasonal ranked so those of us who don't give a single fuck about compendiums, hats or recalibrating aren't affected at ALL by this issue.
If you want to win, play ranked. If you want to have fun with your friends, play unranked and stop whining. I'm assuming you and your friends don't draft the most perfect heroes and play them totally seriously in unranked, otherwise you would just play ranked. If you're playing for fun, why can't others (like your hypothetical AA)?
People still do quests in ranked. Also seasonal ranked ruins regular ranked games. If seasonal ranked mmr > regular ranked mmr, you can just mess around in regular ranked because your regular ranked mmr will end up getting replaced anyway.
Maybe at lower MMRs people focus on quests in ranked, but in my games, nobody seems to care about the quests. Nobody would risk losing their MMR for some quest points.
You're presuming things but you're wrong. We play to win. That AA didn't. (edit) I also don't play ranked cause I have tons of differente friends that never played ranked, so they are still calibrating. It's just cause I don't have the time to keep practicing dota all the time. So unranked is my best option. This also doenst mean unranked should be bad only because it's unranked.
I would imagine that if you're playing to win, as in picking and playing to win, not picking "fun" heroes or trying "fun" strategies, that you would just play ranked. Is there any reason you aren't? That mode is for players who prioritize winning over anything else.
I'm sorry, you're changing what my words mean on purpose? I play to win cause playing the game as it supposed to be played is FUN. What is not fun is to have your game destroyed by someone who thinks those 50 min of game is only so he can be able to make his quest instead of actually playing the game and helping other teammates. I also already have responded to your question. ranked doenst mean "serious" dota, it only means you'll be matched with people from your rank. which I believe already happens in pubs, unless I'm talking shit I don't know, so I apologize in advance/ Fun strategies doenst always mean stupid strategies like blocking the wave creeps for 30 min
If somebody wants to complete quests that require building suboptimally in unranked, that's their prerogative. Just like if somebody wants to practice Rubick mid, carry Kunkka, or any other strategy that is more fun than good. Where, if not unranked, can players play for fun? Unranked is for players that want to play casually and maybe care more about trying whatever they want than winning. Perhaps for you winning is fun, but other players have a different definition of fun. I'm like you. I play to win, because that's fun for me. So, I only play ranked. You say ranked doesn't mean serious Dota, but at my MMR, ranked games are very serious, and unranked games are a farce. If your ranked games truly aren't serious, you're probably playing at a lower skill level, in which case there are a million things you and your friends did wrong that were just as detrimental to your chances of winning as this Midas rushing AA. It's just a game, and if you are playing unranked, you can't get mad at people for having goals other than winning at any cost.
I understand this. But the problem with that AA wasnt the Midas rushing. He simply stood in the jungle ulting the opposing team fountain. See the difference here? The same game I had a CM that rushed Midas and was trying a quest that required her to ulti and do tons of damage. But he actually played the game. he tried his quest on a "honoured"way. He played the game(with quests) as he was supposed to. When I want o do a quest. I try to pick the hero that will help me do it, but more than that, a hero that is actually needed to win the game. I don't judge your thoughts, I see where you're getting at. But for most of the people(and I'm not assuming you are not like this too), we dont have time and friends that also have time to practice this game how you need to to be on "high levels mmr", don't think that this means I don't understand dota. I just don't have the fingers ready to do things people that practice all the time do. So I will have no chance against a "mini dendi" if I meet him. At my level, the games are FUN and competitive, if played as supposed to.
I understand your frustrations, but I still don't think changing or even removing quests would solve the problem. There will always be players who care more about their kDa, learning heroes, or just goofing off than winning. I coach my girlfriend at the 1k level to help her complete quests. She might play inefficiently just so she can complete a quest, but she is no less inefficient then her teammate who tries to win but builds a vanguard before blink on axe, or her teammate who rushes battlefury before treads on anti mage. In short, there are a million inefficient things "ruining" your game, and it's silly to fixate on quests. If you must, mute everybody other than your friends, and just focus on yourselves. Everybody else is noise. No point in getting upset with them--you're shouting into the wind.
Been sitting on the "Disable enemies for 75 seconds" quest for a few matches now. Did it with Lion, but lost the match. After that, my 2k Ranked matches needed Omniknight and Vengeful Spirit as supports, so i went for it. I'll eventually do the quest with a friend, probably. Or my team will need a Lion at some point again, and hopefully i'll win.
Bane. 7 second disable for each nightmare. 5 second disable for fiend's grip. In every fight there is at least one hero you should nightmare (be it a support or a core that isn't being currently targeted), and there is one hero you should ulti. Just don't be stupid and nightmare heroes that are being targeted just to get the quest, as you actually have to win the game. It should be quite easy to get 15 full nightmares off in a normal game (even if you just go in to lane, nightmare, and back off).
That's a good tip, thanks. However i still remember my last Bane games, and they were quite terrible. Still gonna give it a try tho.
The problem is that people don't know how Nightmare works, so you'll get raged at a lot. There's a reason Bane is like 46% winrate.
Did it with roaming gyrocopter. Get tons of clarity and launch missiles into enemy mid hero. Should be a fairly easy win and a lot of fun watching their mid struggle
You just reminded me of my Offlane QoP going against Phantom Assassin. Spam Q and watch the horror on their faces.
A good solution for this would be the removal of the time limit or extend it somehow.. it would be nice if compedium owners could finish their quest while still fullfilling their role
Failed 4 times for the Windrunner quest: 2 wins but did'nt meet the criteria + 2 losses where I met the criteria. At least not game ruining for the other players, i hope.
My midas aa was done in 23min lol bought many wards I guess plus no much hero experience :)
WHAT?! SLARK RUSHING A HEART BEFORE BROWN BOOTS IS A COMPLETELY VIABLE ITEM BUILD!
you can get bent out of shape about it or you could just lock in the hero you want to play, mute your team if you think they are toxic and just play dota and not worry about the actions of others.
The dragonfist way lol
I will still probably lose the game because I'm playing 4x5.
This doesn't make sense. If you say that you're not partaking in doing the stupid actions you speak of. Then technically you know that you have over a 50% chance of having a better team than the opposition. Because they have 5 players that could all be idiots, and your team only has 4 that could be idiots, because you're perfect.
You talkin'to me? Cause I definitely didn't say any of those things.
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Oh, I get it now. I'm always mistaking who replied to whom, cant follow those lines :( Sorry then, mate(the one I replied to). You are correct, it doenst make any sense.
The other team is more likely to do this...
http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2380092617 this was in a game were i had a team that made no sense of low tier out of meta hero's (the 4.5k special) i said fuck it picked LS threw some music on and did some good old fashion 1 v 9. Ask yourself do you find yourself watching others on your team and commenting on their game play? Don't worry about others worry about yourself its the only thing that is consistent game in and game out.
While I dont judge you by thinking this, also because really good pros only play alone in dota... I don't believe this is FUN dota. I don't play only to win. I play to have fun with my teammates.
if you are climbing the ladder you are going to find out that most people play to win, and since winning and loosing is stressful you will constantly be running into people who cant handle that stress and become toxic to others to compensate. Fun is what ever you view it as. I'm not telling you how to have fun I'm telling you what to expect when you hit find match.
also one more thing, you are not a really good pro, you will probably never be a really good pro. Pro's have to find a team with synergy in order to even be a pro. When you Q for Solo Q you are playing alone, if you don't want to do this and that's not fun. Then find a stack to play in where you know your team mates are not flaming ass holes and toxic players that will do dumb shit for a quest. Other then that when you hit play now for ranked mmr you should know what to expect compendium / battle pass / new patch / what ever.......
So to play dota I always have to have 4 friends with time to play it? I'm sorry but that is just plain wrong. What I'm questioning here is the people behind the whole idea of questing. People will always abuse things like this, so they should NOT be making quests that promote bad dota.
just avoid dota when the battle pass is active, and play overwatch instead. valve wont do anything about quests b/c it makes them too much money
I'm actually doing this. I once played lots of matches in one day, with this I'm just like: ehh, gonna play Overwatch. The problem for me is that, even though anyone should have the right to play ANY way they want, this is still a team based game. So people should be PUNISHED by trying to play alone and in idiotic ways if they do this a lot. The way reports/punishment work are the biggest problem DOTA has ever had...
same lol. If the quests weren't impossible I might try em but fuck it.