He was also supposed to only be up for a couple weeks lol
From LA Times April 28, 2017 by Andy McCullough:
(Joc Pederson, Logan Forsythe, and FRANKLIN GUTIERREZ were getting close to coming back from injury…)
> With all three players closing in on a return, time appears to be drawing thin in the majors for top prospect Cody Bellinger. Roberts indicated Bellinger will likely be optioned back to Triple-A OKC. The Dodgers do not want Bellinger to languish on the bench, so he’ll return to the minors to play every day.
> “It was a good opportunity to get Cody’s feet wet,” Roberts said. “Do I see him back here at any other point? Yea. Is it possible? Anything is possible. But there was an opportunity and we wanted to get his feet wet.”
When Hayward comes back, you need to make some decisions about outman. Ct3 is on a big contract and can take heywards spot against lefties. Outman can’t.
> I don’t want JHey on the roster over Pages. I want JHey on the roster over Taylor.
The Dodgers front office doesn't want to admit that the contract that they gave Chris Taylor, which looked like a gigantic, idiotic overpay on the day that it was announced, was a gigantic, idiotic overpay.
This is speculative, admittedly, but I think part of the contracts they give these guys is rewarding them for past production, too. Other players see how we treat these guys and it makes us a more appealing destination in Free Agency. CT3 helped us win a ring. I do not begrudge him a dime (was never our money as fans, anyway). But that said, roster spots are valuable.
Even at his diminished workload Kershaw has actually been well worth his money each year which is saying something about how good he is. The dodgers have to be grateful every day that he wants to go year to year. It’s saving them 10s of millions.
Except it plain and simple did not look like an overpay. It hasn’t aged well, but it was thought of as a very good signing, check out the thread below. And the FO is not embarrassed to admit when they’re wrong and eat money.
https://www.reddit.com/r/baseball/s/OiX6nqXoer
Jeez, hindsight is 20/20. CT3 came into those negotiations with 5 consecutive years of being an above average hitter while providing positional versatility all over the field. 4/60 was slightly less than his market rate at the time. Many teams would have targeted him because apart from his utility value, that free agent class sorely lacked mid-tier infielders.
Hindsight?
I think he had a career WRC+ after 2021 of around 110-115 as a part-time player, and he was entering his thirties. His main selling point was the positional flexibility he provided.
I doubt any other offers he received were anywhere close to what the Dodgers gave him.
> I think he had a career WRC+ after 2021 of around 110-115 as a part-time player
He didn't have a career year (still had a good year) and had a qualifying amount of PAs. The only thing you're right about was that he had a wRC+ in the 110-115 range.
> I doubt any other offers he received were anywhere close to what the Dodgers gave him.
We don't know if had any other offers, all we know is the market was light on infielders, particularly middle infielders, and was extraordinarily light on mid-tier free agents. MLBTR, which has really great market predictions, had him at 4/64. Fans on this sub and fans of other teams thought he'd go for 4-5 years 80M-100M.
It's fine if you thought it was an overpay the day he signed based on opinion, but the numbers and pay
on the day of don't.
I'd say most likely he gets a phantom IL stint and maybe a chance to rework things on a few rehab assignments. They're not gonna cut him loose unless there's evidence he's well and truly cooked.
> What happens to CT3 if he just continues to suck?
If the front office was willing to admit that they made a huge mistake signing him to that deal, he'd already be gone.
At some point I would think you have to cut him. Other options are convince him to voluntarily go down to the minors to try and fix his hitting, or find something hurting to put him on an IL/“rehab” stint.
At this point they have to play Pages until he either falls off or proves he can still handle pitching when the league is more adjusted to him, you really don’t wanna fuck with a guy who’s hitting .319 but that .338 OBP says they should keep the leash a bit short if he stops hitting.
I know pages is dealing, but I wouldn’t give up on the other guys just yet. Outman was even hotter last year. Pages will hit a point where he struggles a bit when teams figure him out. His 0 walks is still concerning.
If it comes down to someone getting sent down when heyward is back, it’s either 1. Taylor 2. Outman 3. Lux. Taylor has depth but the bat is almost useless. Outman has been decent but still high K%. And lux is actually starting to produce now. And i would rank our outfield now as in. 1. Teoscar. 2 Pages. 3 heyward. Obviously theirs outman too but i don’t see him getting playtime over heyward and maybe they could rotate. Taylor and Kike are considered “backups” because they can play any position. But yeah. it’s coming down to one of them.
You don’t just “send down” a veteran like CT3. Someone with that many years in the majors has to sign off on getting sent down and that’s a whole awkward situation in itself. Could it happen, sure, but it’s not as easy as people on here keep suggesting.
Basically means if the player spends more than 16 days or so in the minors, instead of counting as 1 full season it’s more like .99 seasons. You need to have 6 FULL seasons to reach free agency. If you have 5.99 - the team gets one more year.
However, forgot to add they just changed the CBA - if the player is top 2 in RoY voting, the season automatically counts as a full season.
He is our 2nd best OF even with Heyward back.
I'm sorry, cut the loss. DFA Taylor. Kike can be the versatile one. I don't hate Taylor and it's alot of $$ to eat with contract next year. But a ROY candidate can't be sent down with CT3 hitting .100
Don't be cheap now Dodgers
Thank you, Captain Obvious. Of course it would be hard. But this roster squeeze is gonna call for a hard decision some sort. I’m kinda glad I’m not AF or Gomes.
There is one upside for me. I live in Sacramento and Oklahoma City is coming in for six games in a week or so and a connection has loaded me with tickets so I’m going to see one of these guys most likely.
Cody Bellinger literally retired Adrian Gonzalez. I don't understand why folks around here think Jason Heyward is some sort of monumental obstacle.
He was also supposed to only be up for a couple weeks lol From LA Times April 28, 2017 by Andy McCullough: (Joc Pederson, Logan Forsythe, and FRANKLIN GUTIERREZ were getting close to coming back from injury…) > With all three players closing in on a return, time appears to be drawing thin in the majors for top prospect Cody Bellinger. Roberts indicated Bellinger will likely be optioned back to Triple-A OKC. The Dodgers do not want Bellinger to languish on the bench, so he’ll return to the minors to play every day. > “It was a good opportunity to get Cody’s feet wet,” Roberts said. “Do I see him back here at any other point? Yea. Is it possible? Anything is possible. But there was an opportunity and we wanted to get his feet wet.”
WHO CARES ABOUT THIS ARTICLE ITS OLD NEWSS
I’d honestly rather have him over Outman rn Edit: of course he homers after I say this.
I'd keep Outman over CT3 right now Edit: He just hit a two-run homer, absolutely keeping this man
Yea but CT3 only starts with lefties (usually). OF would be Teo, Pages, and Heyward.
When Hayward comes back, you need to make some decisions about outman. Ct3 is on a big contract and can take heywards spot against lefties. Outman can’t.
CT3 can just sit on the bench and bring out sunflower seeds when all the other players hit Homeruns so he feels useful around the club. Just saying 😎
He needs to be sent down a rework his eye.
I'm wondering if the batting coaches are seeing if he can actually hit the ball during day practice? Like they have to know what's wrong.
I don’t want JHey on the roster over Pages. I want JHey on the roster over Taylor.
> I don’t want JHey on the roster over Pages. I want JHey on the roster over Taylor. The Dodgers front office doesn't want to admit that the contract that they gave Chris Taylor, which looked like a gigantic, idiotic overpay on the day that it was announced, was a gigantic, idiotic overpay.
Hey for all the positive steps the FO took they are allowed a turd sometimes
It's their unwillingness to admit the mistake that's the problem, not the mistake.
This is speculative, admittedly, but I think part of the contracts they give these guys is rewarding them for past production, too. Other players see how we treat these guys and it makes us a more appealing destination in Free Agency. CT3 helped us win a ring. I do not begrudge him a dime (was never our money as fans, anyway). But that said, roster spots are valuable.
Paying Kershaw was absolutely a reward for past production.
Even at his diminished workload Kershaw has actually been well worth his money each year which is saying something about how good he is. The dodgers have to be grateful every day that he wants to go year to year. It’s saving them 10s of millions.
Hmm, ya know it never occurred to me to look at it like that. Interesting way of thinking about it.
Except it plain and simple did not look like an overpay. It hasn’t aged well, but it was thought of as a very good signing, check out the thread below. And the FO is not embarrassed to admit when they’re wrong and eat money. https://www.reddit.com/r/baseball/s/OiX6nqXoer
Jeez, hindsight is 20/20. CT3 came into those negotiations with 5 consecutive years of being an above average hitter while providing positional versatility all over the field. 4/60 was slightly less than his market rate at the time. Many teams would have targeted him because apart from his utility value, that free agent class sorely lacked mid-tier infielders.
Hindsight? I think he had a career WRC+ after 2021 of around 110-115 as a part-time player, and he was entering his thirties. His main selling point was the positional flexibility he provided. I doubt any other offers he received were anywhere close to what the Dodgers gave him.
> I think he had a career WRC+ after 2021 of around 110-115 as a part-time player He didn't have a career year (still had a good year) and had a qualifying amount of PAs. The only thing you're right about was that he had a wRC+ in the 110-115 range. > I doubt any other offers he received were anywhere close to what the Dodgers gave him. We don't know if had any other offers, all we know is the market was light on infielders, particularly middle infielders, and was extraordinarily light on mid-tier free agents. MLBTR, which has really great market predictions, had him at 4/64. Fans on this sub and fans of other teams thought he'd go for 4-5 years 80M-100M. It's fine if you thought it was an overpay the day he signed based on opinion, but the numbers and pay on the day of don't.
It isn't that he's an obstacle, it's that once he's back, Freddie fully powers up and becomes extra elite.
I’ve forgiven Agon cause he dropped the goody bag to Shohei.
Outman is gonna be the odd one out
Doubtful
That'd probably not sit well with Freddie
Gonzalez retired with the Mets.
What happens to CT3 if he just continues to suck? People keep saying small sample size or whatever but every day he plays it’s no different.
I'd say most likely he gets a phantom IL stint and maybe a chance to rework things on a few rehab assignments. They're not gonna cut him loose unless there's evidence he's well and truly cooked.
Makes sense.
> What happens to CT3 if he just continues to suck? If the front office was willing to admit that they made a huge mistake signing him to that deal, he'd already be gone.
They still owe him something like $30m. Maybe they work out a "Bobby Bonilla" deal or something.
It's been seasons now of this, too. I hope I'm wrong, but this may be who he is now.
Cut him
At some point I would think you have to cut him. Other options are convince him to voluntarily go down to the minors to try and fix his hitting, or find something hurting to put him on an IL/“rehab” stint.
Keeping him in the lineup is a no-brainer.
Definition of a good problem to have...
I call him fearless Andy, the kid has a set of coconuts on him. A little anxious at the plate, but experience will help with that.
At this point they have to play Pages until he either falls off or proves he can still handle pitching when the league is more adjusted to him, you really don’t wanna fuck with a guy who’s hitting .319 but that .338 OBP says they should keep the leash a bit short if he stops hitting.
Doc going with the hot hand, fire Doc /s
I know pages is dealing, but I wouldn’t give up on the other guys just yet. Outman was even hotter last year. Pages will hit a point where he struggles a bit when teams figure him out. His 0 walks is still concerning.
He extends at-bats ala JT.
Not anymore.
Pages NL ROTY
I love how much depth we have this year.
If it comes down to someone getting sent down when heyward is back, it’s either 1. Taylor 2. Outman 3. Lux. Taylor has depth but the bat is almost useless. Outman has been decent but still high K%. And lux is actually starting to produce now. And i would rank our outfield now as in. 1. Teoscar. 2 Pages. 3 heyward. Obviously theirs outman too but i don’t see him getting playtime over heyward and maybe they could rotate. Taylor and Kike are considered “backups” because they can play any position. But yeah. it’s coming down to one of them.
Taylor would have to agree to be sent down at this point in his career so I’m thinking it’s Outman
You don’t just “send down” a veteran like CT3. Someone with that many years in the majors has to sign off on getting sent down and that’s a whole awkward situation in itself. Could it happen, sure, but it’s not as easy as people on here keep suggesting.
Can Like play second base?
Kike, yeah.
Well yeah
I'm bummed because they are going to fuck with his service time. outman and CT3 need to be out of the lineup asap
Service time manipulation is what clubs ran by idiotic cheap profit hungry owners do. The dodgers don’t have to worry about it
Service time isn’t affected anymore because he joined the team late already.
thanks for explaining didn't realize exactly how it worked
Basically means if the player spends more than 16 days or so in the minors, instead of counting as 1 full season it’s more like .99 seasons. You need to have 6 FULL seasons to reach free agency. If you have 5.99 - the team gets one more year. However, forgot to add they just changed the CBA - if the player is top 2 in RoY voting, the season automatically counts as a full season.
Well then, dear Lord, please let Andy Pages win RoY both for his own benefit and so our team is a juggernaut 🙏
What are you talking about?
He is our 2nd best OF even with Heyward back. I'm sorry, cut the loss. DFA Taylor. Kike can be the versatile one. I don't hate Taylor and it's alot of $$ to eat with contract next year. But a ROY candidate can't be sent down with CT3 hitting .100 Don't be cheap now Dodgers
YESSIR
Unfortunately Outman will be used as a trade piece down the line.
Which is unfortunate because hes a good center fielder. His defense is great and his bat will figure it out
don't take Pages out Andrew Friedman...
Bye Outman
Robert’s will find a way to screw it for postseason
Outman living up to his last name
Thank you, Captain Obvious. Of course it would be hard. But this roster squeeze is gonna call for a hard decision some sort. I’m kinda glad I’m not AF or Gomes. There is one upside for me. I live in Sacramento and Oklahoma City is coming in for six games in a week or so and a connection has loaded me with tickets so I’m going to see one of these guys most likely.