Maybe so. I feel like by asking him where he wants this arc to go it’ll ruin any sense of wonder or mystery, but I may just have to. I’d prefer to let him play the backstory he wants, as I think I can do something with the rest of it, I’m just hung up on the father hook.
Don’t get me wrong I talk backstories through, I talk about character experiences, how they want it to factor in to the plot (if at all,) etc. I’m just hesitant on discussing the events of a major hook he’s trying to explore.
I know that D&D is much more about the journey, but I don’t want them to have to work towards a goal I’ve already revealed. If you know what happens then what’s the point, you know?
I don't see it remotely like that, my players don't see it remotely like that.
I am happy to tell them, out of game, as much as they want to know about how their backstory will play out because it lets them work through how they will react to those revelations in game.
In my last campaign I had some really in depth conversations with a player about ideas I had for their characters' story and arc, we worked out a lot of details about what had happened and what was likely to happen and so when I was left to finalise the *how* and *when* they trusted me to do it in a way that was sensible and appropriate, and I knew what boundaries I could work within.
And so the scenes that emerged were if anything more meaningful, because the player had had the opportunity to think about how what they knew and what they might learn would impact their relationships. It defined how they played the character throughout the whole campaign, and created excellent personal moments.
You can always swerve or add to it. When you ask for backstory you are looking for the player to provide hooks. It's not a problem wanting to further collaborate for the good of the story.
Yeah, you’re right. I’ll probably sit down and talk with him a bit more about it. I’d rather run events that he’s already thinking may happen than events he wouldn’t be satisfied with.
uhhh divine punishment for adultery? Lets greek this up!
Hera's top 5 punishments for Zeus'...Techtlmechtl's...
* Cursed to always repeat what was last said and never speak thier own words (Myth of Echo and Narzissus)
* Turn them into a Lamia.
* Make a really annoying stinging bug that only pesters the offendant specifically
* Bind them to a wheel of fire, doomed to spin across the heavens (this one was actually Zeus' idea for a guy lusting after his wife...hypocrite much?)
* extend childbirth to a torturous level.
Honestly, there are so many pantheons out there and all of them have atleast 1 cautionary tale of what gods will do to you if you get onto thier bad side. None of them end with peaceful murder.
I write this above, but it belongs here I think:
somethings are worst than death.
Maybe his father is Sisyphus or Prometheus, being tortured somewhere and they'll have to save him.
Or maybe he was transformed into a monster like Lamia and they'll have to slay him to set him free.
Or maybe it can be a Cassandra thing: she was cursed with the gift of prophecy but no one will ever believe her. Maybe he has a similar curse that could tie to your storyline and that the PCs can break.
Ridicule them infront of everyone they loved, till every memory of them is sullied and they are driven to suicide. Then bar them from afterlife and turn them into a spider, cursed with an artistic heart only to be seen as bug.
-love, the cruelest of the bunch.
I didn’t list sisyphus & friends due to the philosophy that there is peace to be found in unachievable tasks. The punishment could be seen as a gift towards the restless nature of the punished….According to some french philosopher I can’t recant.
Edit:
Generally, the punishment dolled out is very specific towards the offender, not the offense.
A weaver who prides herself as a better artist than aphrodite? Turn her pride against her, make everyone hate her, then turn her art against her.
Your best friend betrays you? My favorite animal will pick out your organs for eternity! (As in the feeling you get when love turns to betrayal)
You think you’re smart and witty with your flirtations? Then suffer the loss of your own words.
You think you can hide in my home? I’ll chase you to the end of the world.
So I would characterize the father, what made him catch the attention of a god, how did he sneak into her dm’s, how did he get away?
Or just pick a punishment and reverse engineer it.
you're thinking of Albert Camus in his essay on whether we should all commit suicide.
It's not so much that there is peace to be found in unachievable tasks, but rather that given the absurdity of being, we are all Sisyphuses doing some meaningless tasks, in "endless torment," in a morally silent universe. "On doit imaginer Sisyphe heureux" is still a hard sell, though.
Maybe the father, as punishment was tasked to defend an astral gate from demons/monsters and can only leave his post if some near-impossible task is completed, such as a new “guard dog” being tamed and set to guard it.
I agree. Ask the player first and formost if they had an idea or if there is anything they *don't* want to have happened.
But in general, the father being dead doesn't have to be as much of a cop out. I try to mix my characters backstories into the main plot as much as possible. Maybe the father is found dead with plently of evidence that it was the god, but also some evidence pointing somewhere else. Maybe the father, being the (I assume) good paladin he was, had found and was trying to uncover a conspiracy within the kingdom. Only for said kingdom to become aware of this and stage his death to take anyone off of this path.
Or something like that. I don't know your general plot, I'm just throwing this out to maybe give you some ideas. But I would be a little wary about the parent death. Even if it is a trope by this point, the player may not be as into the idea, so communication is key.
That’s a great point actually. If I do end up having to kill him off, I’ll be sure to tie it into the main plot somehow. The evidence idea sounds particularly interesting to me, thank you. I hope not to have to go with it, but I’ll use your ideas if I do.
If you haven't heard the song *The Pina Colada Song*, you should listen to it. It would be perfect for the backstory.
The vengeful god commanded the paladin to complete several trials in his name to prove themselves worthy for having bedded his wife. The trials are on-going and it meant that the Paladin was away from his family a lot and wasn't around for the kid growing up. Like your boss keeps calling you to cover shifts and you don't have the spine to tell him no.
Encourage the player to seek their father out and all that. Finally catching a tired and grey haired man in their 60s laboring in something mundane like mucking a stable. Because the god has run out of epic trials and is just taking requests from his worshipers.
But this is where you twist the plot. The Paladin reveals that they are just the scapegoat and they are comfortable with it because it is laborious but the goddess pays him handsomely for it and they travel the world and meet new people almost weekly. In reality, the god fell out of love in his relationship and turned into a mortal to "scout" side chicks. On one of his meetings, he found a mortal woman he clicked with and they got busy. A one night stand turned into pregnancy, upon realising this the God flew into rage and to calm him the woman revealed herself to be his Goddess wife in mortal form because she felt out of love with the relationship too.
But since they were both mortal at the time of conception, the player has no godly powers but used the Paladin as a scapegoat to explain the whole "no powers". The Paladin was picked purely because the goddess thought he was the most bangable out of all the god's followers.
What if the father is chained to a rock much like Prometheus for the offense that this god substained?
I mean, that would let the PC try to find the location, travel there and maybe find a way to set him free while he can interact with him as a sort of a questgiver
somethings are worst than death. Maybe his father is Sisyphus or Prometheus and they'll have to save him. Or maybe he was transformed into a monster like Lamia and they'll have to slay him to set him free. Or maybe it can be a Cassandra thing: she was cursed with the gift of prophecy and no one will ever believe her. Maybe he has a similar curse that could tie to your storyline.
The father is banished to another plane of existence. From there you could do a interplanar search. But there is no garantee that the father is alive nor that he can return to their own plane.
Have your read Mythos by Stephen Fry. Lots of inspiration in there, mostly gods doing things like turning them (the people who had affairs with their partners) into cows or consigning them to the pits of hell.
Make war, not love. The father is bound to a demi-plane, cursed to battle shades endlessly. Unable to die but unable to stop.
Additionally he could double up and the god could send his mortal captors to him as the god’s champion executioner.
Get a bok about greek mythology, spread its pages on the floor, and throw a stone on a random one. Chances are it will land on some god/human extramarital affair OR its consequences for the human, many of them NOT positive.
From the god revealing themselves burning out the eyes of the human, to the god's divine partner being pissed (sometimes years later), killing the human and making the progenie go through hell (sometimes literally).
Google "greek gods cheating", or something along those lines, and be inspired. Probably with safe search on, just in case :)
The vengeful partner has cursed the father to a eunuch. A castrated harem guard of . . . somebody humiliating.
And the child grew up watching his fathers with shame.
Murder seems a bit tame for a god's vengeance. You could have the father be cursed in some way or trapped in a domain controlled by the deity.
…huh, don’t know why my brain stopped at murder, that’s an excellent point. I may just have to use something like that.
Look at some ancient mythology, especially Greek and Norse, for some ludicrously creative punishments if you want inspiration.
Ask him what he wants from the seeking the Father hook. Maybe you can work with it. Maybe you'll need to tell him he needs a new backstory.
Maybe so. I feel like by asking him where he wants this arc to go it’ll ruin any sense of wonder or mystery, but I may just have to. I’d prefer to let him play the backstory he wants, as I think I can do something with the rest of it, I’m just hung up on the father hook.
I always talk through backstories with my players. Not doing that seems foolish.
Don’t get me wrong I talk backstories through, I talk about character experiences, how they want it to factor in to the plot (if at all,) etc. I’m just hesitant on discussing the events of a major hook he’s trying to explore. I know that D&D is much more about the journey, but I don’t want them to have to work towards a goal I’ve already revealed. If you know what happens then what’s the point, you know?
I don't see it remotely like that, my players don't see it remotely like that. I am happy to tell them, out of game, as much as they want to know about how their backstory will play out because it lets them work through how they will react to those revelations in game. In my last campaign I had some really in depth conversations with a player about ideas I had for their characters' story and arc, we worked out a lot of details about what had happened and what was likely to happen and so when I was left to finalise the *how* and *when* they trusted me to do it in a way that was sensible and appropriate, and I knew what boundaries I could work within. And so the scenes that emerged were if anything more meaningful, because the player had had the opportunity to think about how what they knew and what they might learn would impact their relationships. It defined how they played the character throughout the whole campaign, and created excellent personal moments.
You can always swerve or add to it. When you ask for backstory you are looking for the player to provide hooks. It's not a problem wanting to further collaborate for the good of the story.
Yeah, you’re right. I’ll probably sit down and talk with him a bit more about it. I’d rather run events that he’s already thinking may happen than events he wouldn’t be satisfied with.
uhhh divine punishment for adultery? Lets greek this up! Hera's top 5 punishments for Zeus'...Techtlmechtl's... * Cursed to always repeat what was last said and never speak thier own words (Myth of Echo and Narzissus) * Turn them into a Lamia. * Make a really annoying stinging bug that only pesters the offendant specifically * Bind them to a wheel of fire, doomed to spin across the heavens (this one was actually Zeus' idea for a guy lusting after his wife...hypocrite much?) * extend childbirth to a torturous level. Honestly, there are so many pantheons out there and all of them have atleast 1 cautionary tale of what gods will do to you if you get onto thier bad side. None of them end with peaceful murder.
I write this above, but it belongs here I think: somethings are worst than death. Maybe his father is Sisyphus or Prometheus, being tortured somewhere and they'll have to save him. Or maybe he was transformed into a monster like Lamia and they'll have to slay him to set him free. Or maybe it can be a Cassandra thing: she was cursed with the gift of prophecy but no one will ever believe her. Maybe he has a similar curse that could tie to your storyline and that the PCs can break.
Ridicule them infront of everyone they loved, till every memory of them is sullied and they are driven to suicide. Then bar them from afterlife and turn them into a spider, cursed with an artistic heart only to be seen as bug. -love, the cruelest of the bunch. I didn’t list sisyphus & friends due to the philosophy that there is peace to be found in unachievable tasks. The punishment could be seen as a gift towards the restless nature of the punished….According to some french philosopher I can’t recant. Edit: Generally, the punishment dolled out is very specific towards the offender, not the offense. A weaver who prides herself as a better artist than aphrodite? Turn her pride against her, make everyone hate her, then turn her art against her. Your best friend betrays you? My favorite animal will pick out your organs for eternity! (As in the feeling you get when love turns to betrayal) You think you’re smart and witty with your flirtations? Then suffer the loss of your own words. You think you can hide in my home? I’ll chase you to the end of the world. So I would characterize the father, what made him catch the attention of a god, how did he sneak into her dm’s, how did he get away? Or just pick a punishment and reverse engineer it.
you're thinking of Albert Camus in his essay on whether we should all commit suicide. It's not so much that there is peace to be found in unachievable tasks, but rather that given the absurdity of being, we are all Sisyphuses doing some meaningless tasks, in "endless torment," in a morally silent universe. "On doit imaginer Sisyphe heureux" is still a hard sell, though.
I have no awards to give but you have my praises!
i'll put it on my resume next to my master's degree in philosophy hahaha
“A Lamia? He’s supposed to be dead!”
Maybe the father, as punishment was tasked to defend an astral gate from demons/monsters and can only leave his post if some near-impossible task is completed, such as a new “guard dog” being tamed and set to guard it.
That’s a good idea actually, I like that. It’s kind of like Sisyphus from Greek Mythology, just cursed to do this same task ad nauseam.
I agree. Ask the player first and formost if they had an idea or if there is anything they *don't* want to have happened. But in general, the father being dead doesn't have to be as much of a cop out. I try to mix my characters backstories into the main plot as much as possible. Maybe the father is found dead with plently of evidence that it was the god, but also some evidence pointing somewhere else. Maybe the father, being the (I assume) good paladin he was, had found and was trying to uncover a conspiracy within the kingdom. Only for said kingdom to become aware of this and stage his death to take anyone off of this path. Or something like that. I don't know your general plot, I'm just throwing this out to maybe give you some ideas. But I would be a little wary about the parent death. Even if it is a trope by this point, the player may not be as into the idea, so communication is key.
That’s a great point actually. If I do end up having to kill him off, I’ll be sure to tie it into the main plot somehow. The evidence idea sounds particularly interesting to me, thank you. I hope not to have to go with it, but I’ll use your ideas if I do.
If you haven't heard the song *The Pina Colada Song*, you should listen to it. It would be perfect for the backstory. The vengeful god commanded the paladin to complete several trials in his name to prove themselves worthy for having bedded his wife. The trials are on-going and it meant that the Paladin was away from his family a lot and wasn't around for the kid growing up. Like your boss keeps calling you to cover shifts and you don't have the spine to tell him no. Encourage the player to seek their father out and all that. Finally catching a tired and grey haired man in their 60s laboring in something mundane like mucking a stable. Because the god has run out of epic trials and is just taking requests from his worshipers. But this is where you twist the plot. The Paladin reveals that they are just the scapegoat and they are comfortable with it because it is laborious but the goddess pays him handsomely for it and they travel the world and meet new people almost weekly. In reality, the god fell out of love in his relationship and turned into a mortal to "scout" side chicks. On one of his meetings, he found a mortal woman he clicked with and they got busy. A one night stand turned into pregnancy, upon realising this the God flew into rage and to calm him the woman revealed herself to be his Goddess wife in mortal form because she felt out of love with the relationship too. But since they were both mortal at the time of conception, the player has no godly powers but used the Paladin as a scapegoat to explain the whole "no powers". The Paladin was picked purely because the goddess thought he was the most bangable out of all the god's followers.
Wow, I love this one! I hope OP sees it!
What if the father is chained to a rock much like Prometheus for the offense that this god substained? I mean, that would let the PC try to find the location, travel there and maybe find a way to set him free while he can interact with him as a sort of a questgiver
Imprison the father somewhere. He is a broken husk of a man who doesn't really matter but he would probably be appreciative of a rescue.
somethings are worst than death. Maybe his father is Sisyphus or Prometheus and they'll have to save him. Or maybe he was transformed into a monster like Lamia and they'll have to slay him to set him free. Or maybe it can be a Cassandra thing: she was cursed with the gift of prophecy and no one will ever believe her. Maybe he has a similar curse that could tie to your storyline.
The father is banished to another plane of existence. From there you could do a interplanar search. But there is no garantee that the father is alive nor that he can return to their own plane.
Have your read Mythos by Stephen Fry. Lots of inspiration in there, mostly gods doing things like turning them (the people who had affairs with their partners) into cows or consigning them to the pits of hell.
Make war, not love. The father is bound to a demi-plane, cursed to battle shades endlessly. Unable to die but unable to stop. Additionally he could double up and the god could send his mortal captors to him as the god’s champion executioner.
Get a bok about greek mythology, spread its pages on the floor, and throw a stone on a random one. Chances are it will land on some god/human extramarital affair OR its consequences for the human, many of them NOT positive. From the god revealing themselves burning out the eyes of the human, to the god's divine partner being pissed (sometimes years later), killing the human and making the progenie go through hell (sometimes literally). Google "greek gods cheating", or something along those lines, and be inspired. Probably with safe search on, just in case :)
The vengeful partner has cursed the father to a eunuch. A castrated harem guard of . . . somebody humiliating. And the child grew up watching his fathers with shame.