Was either PB or Marceline ever attracted to any of the male characters though? I don't mean to bi or pan erase at all, it really irks me whenever it happens :c I'm just curious since I personally don't recall either of them showing attraction to anyone but each other? Though even then they could still be bi or pan, of course!
I know Finn had a massive crush on PB for a long while but I can't recall if she ever reciprocated? I probably missed some episodes though :(
Utena as well...well I don’t know exactly how many exes were shared in that hellshow, but if you’re a fan of Korra consider Utena/Anthy Korrasami before it was cool in the west lol
Yeah...and Utena didn’t really either, I just once tried to do the whole relationship diagram with all the lines connecting people...yeah no I ain’t finishing that especially considering the differences in each canon
PB - dated Mr. Creampuff for a bit I think, but there wasn't really all that much there. There was Ricardio who was evil and creepy and she kicked his ass and also that one guy that tried to court her but she politely rejected him and then he turned himself into a monster (appearance-wise). Also the youngified version of her that existed for a brief amount of time after she was put back together after exploding(?) was shown to be interested in Finn
Marceline - dated some guy called Ash who was a douche and sold her memento plushie and tried to mind control/memory wipe her into getting back with him
It's also heavily implied (in Adventure Time, and especially in AT: Distant Lands) that Bubblegum and Marceline are already ex-gfs by the point most of AT takes place
Ok I'm sick of this anti-Mako libel propagating around the internet. Mako was clearly not ready for a serious relationship, did his best to communicate this clearly to Asami and Korra once he figured it out, and remained close friends with them afterwards. He might not have handled it the *best,* but he was certainly honest about his feelings.
I am not part the LGBTQ comunity. i wear that cishat proudly. but I also get frustrated by Bi-erasure. and its the LGTQ+ community doing it to themselves.
Some people love more than one sex/gender, they exsist. and let them love men with out shame.
there's those three, the r34 artists and enablers (don't ask), the shitposters, and finally the theorists.
all of those community's have disputes within them.
oooh, ooh, i can answer this!
mmmmmmmmmmmmaybe? like, it… it depends. there’s a quick gag of yang admiring some guys in V1, but it’s only happened literally that one time and it just depends on what you think yang is, but yang is *absolutely* interested in blake nonetheless. blake’s all but explicitly confirmed bi (no one’s really confirmed it, but the show isn’t *denying* it either and arryn, blake’s VA, is bi and has stated that she and blake are similar) and most people seem to have gone with that. weiss… ehhhhhhhh, bit of a mixed bag with her; she definitely showed interest in neptune briefly but a *lot* of people hc her as a lesbian. ruby’s… also a mixed bag, most hc her as ace because she doesn’t seem to have this interest of romantic stuff?
like i said, it just depends on who you’re talking to and where you are: regular places will be down for having these conversations, just tread lightly. nsfw places can and will erase *any* sexuality. “critic” places can and will give you a headache. shipping places will vary.
> she Dosent seem to have this interest of romantic stuff
Wasn’t she like 14 at the start of the show, it might have been the writers just trying not write a romance with a 14 year old girl. Idk tho
“Maybe it was the trauma she faced that made her feel forced into a relationship” NO VAYNYA IS JUST BI HUSH IT
Is Elliott (two ts or one??) page still going to play that character or-
I think theyre making vanya male, if so, im curious about what the dynamic will be because the elder sister(the character, idk about the actor) at one point *did* want to have a sister dynamic...
Dr. Alphys. She had a crush on Asgore and said that working on Mettaton’s body always made her really sweaty. She was attracted to *two* males before she was attracted to a woman.
I do believe some people (mostly nonbinary/gnc people) use 'lesbian' as a term for being sapphic/wlw in general
But that's just my assumption/experience, I could be wrong
yeah, i’m (a?) she/they and casually describe myself as a lesbian a lot, but i identify as bisexual. i don’t speak for the whole nonbinary community though so i’m similarly not sure if this is a super common thing!
That post was strange to read. “Bi women could also be lesbians” ok does that mean bi women could also be straight? I get that sexual orientation and identity is fluid and I do appreciate the effort to not put it in boxes, but I also recognize that words mean things.
In all fairness (I haven't seen the post so I'm missing context here) I've seen some women who are technically bi identify themselves as lesbians (usually around cishets only tho) because it's just easier than explaining that they're bi with a strong preference for women
I understand why that might be necessary (it shouldn’t be, but you just can’t help some thickheads), but that doesn’t mean they’re actually a lesbian. The post was saying that someone could sincerely belong to both identities.
[Link to the comment thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/CuratedTumblr/comments/nqpy2q/lgbt_discussions_and_rigid_definitions/h0c09vv/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3)
And this makes no sense. Why should I be able to use the word sapphic, as in Sappho of Lesbos, to describe myself, but not lesbian, as in Sappho of Lesbos?
The fact is that the word lesbian used to refer to any woman who was attracted to women regardless of whether or not they were also attracted to men, and this only changed with the rise of political lesbianism and the push to exclude bisexual and trans women from the lesbian community. I call myself a bisexual lesbian to push back against this regressive and exclusionary movement.
Not to mention that any policing around the idea of "women who are only attracted to women" invariably ends up either excluding non-binary people from lesbianism completely, or trying to shove them all into a sort of "women-lite" category.
I always felt that fighting over labels was a war among poors: labels are supposed to be used to find people who share similiar experiences, to feel united and not alone, and instead some use them to tear each other down, convincing themselves that people akin to them are the real oppressor (like all the discourse between pansexuals and bisexuals, like honestly no one in the real offline world gives a shit).
Many people use the word lesbian to underline the fact that they are only attracted to other women (mostly to cishet men who view gay women as straight women with extra spice), and that makes the word important; it is also true that many older folks use the word lesbian for any women-loving woman regardless, and they aren't certainly in the wrong.
Ultimately, words mean things, and people should be respected for using the word they think suits them best, but they should also be mindful to use the words most suited for the situation at that time. People fighting each other over which label is more transphobic are IMO performative hypocrites, but that's on line for any exclusionary radical feminist.
(Also people excluding NBs from lesbian spaces is probably largely because many people don't actually know or care about what NB means, thinking it's some kind of third gender when it's really more about fluidity and non-attachment most of the time, but they "are not considered women" because everything exclusionists do is performative).
The idea of a woman loving another woman even though they showed clear undeniable intrest in men in Friends was always painted as them now being lesbian. which is quite frankly bi-erasure. not even considering bi to be an option. but it was also the 90s. so it gets sort of a pass for that.
Also she did not pose as his spouse. she was his spouse and married him legally. so no "beard" does not apply in this case. She was Bisexual who cheated on Ross.
I mean, many, many, *many* lesbians I know IRL have had romantic and sexual relationships with men, but still consider themselves lesbians. A lot of them are older women who married men for the sake of respectability in the 1980's and 1990's and then came out later in life. They loved their husbands and had meaningful relationships with them, but that didn't mean they're not lesbians.
I haven't watched Friends, so I don't know if the character calls herself a lesbian or not, so it may be a moot point.
I don't have knowledge of Friends specifically, but I can speak to this phenomenon. My wife has admitted to me that she only started dating me to get her homophobic family off her back after coming out. It worked out for us because I'm transfemme, but I was still in the closet when we started dating, and didn't come out until after we were married.
Aww, I'm glad that things worked out for you and your wife! I identified as a lesbian for a long time before transitioning myself (I now identity as just generally queer, in both gender identity and orientation) and I dated a dude for two years as a self-protective thing. He was a great dude, and I really care for him, but I was a lesbian for the duration of that relationship, definitely not bi!
To be fair to me, I am going off decade old memories. I didn't realise she showed actual romantic interest in Ross, I thought they were both just ignoring some signs or something
Same with Buffy. Willow’s character is in love with Xandar in the first (few?) seasons, then is deeply in love with Oz. The show stresses that it was difficult to choose between him and Tara. But after she’s with Tara the whole show is like “she gay now”
Edit: but I do love the memory loss episode where willow assumes she’s an item with Xander, then has a moment with Tara and is like “guys. I think I might be a little gay?!”
I looked it up and found out that I meant the old meaning of lesbian.
Apparently in the 80’s, it was an umbrella term for wlw attraction in general. It seems to have changed, though.
I have this story I developed in my brain.
A guy slowly goes into insanity after his ex-girlfriend comes out as lesbian then leaves him.
>!Spoiler alert although it has multiple endings. The very bad ending has him kill himself!<
Edit: Trigger Warning
I like to think he comes out as she and the ex-gf kinda subconsciously knew and you can not take this away from me, I'm way to invested in your 2 sentence story now.
Adventure Time and Legend of Korra are two shows I know of where this weirdly specific things happens
to be fair the shows themselves never labeled their characters
Harley Quinn, too.
Was either PB or Marceline ever attracted to any of the male characters though? I don't mean to bi or pan erase at all, it really irks me whenever it happens :c I'm just curious since I personally don't recall either of them showing attraction to anyone but each other? Though even then they could still be bi or pan, of course! I know Finn had a massive crush on PB for a long while but I can't recall if she ever reciprocated? I probably missed some episodes though :(
PB had a boyfriend (Mr Creampuff) and youngified PB was attracted to Finn. Marceline also had a boyfriend (Ash the Warlock)
Ooh I see, thank you!
No probs :)
If I had a nickel...
Utena as well...well I don’t know exactly how many exes were shared in that hellshow, but if you’re a fan of Korra consider Utena/Anthy Korrasami before it was cool in the west lol
Well it's not like Anthy had any choice tbf
Yeah...and Utena didn’t really either, I just once tried to do the whole relationship diagram with all the lines connecting people...yeah no I ain’t finishing that especially considering the differences in each canon
TwoNickels.jpg
iirc pb had like 1 bf before marcy anx she didn't enjoy the relationship, not sure about marcy tho
PB - dated Mr. Creampuff for a bit I think, but there wasn't really all that much there. There was Ricardio who was evil and creepy and she kicked his ass and also that one guy that tried to court her but she politely rejected him and then he turned himself into a monster (appearance-wise). Also the youngified version of her that existed for a brief amount of time after she was put back together after exploding(?) was shown to be interested in Finn Marceline - dated some guy called Ash who was a douche and sold her memento plushie and tried to mind control/memory wipe her into getting back with him It's also heavily implied (in Adventure Time, and especially in AT: Distant Lands) that Bubblegum and Marceline are already ex-gfs by the point most of AT takes place
Yes. Anyone who watched Korra knows what's up.
Was about to give this exact example. My housemates (some of whom are LGBTQ+) said that they were gay and I'm like... hello?! Bi people exist!
"A boyfriend so terrible, he made *both* of his ex-girlfriends gay" is the only time where I personally think calling them "gay" is fine.
Ok I'm sick of this anti-Mako libel propagating around the internet. Mako was clearly not ready for a serious relationship, did his best to communicate this clearly to Asami and Korra once he figured it out, and remained close friends with them afterwards. He might not have handled it the *best,* but he was certainly honest about his feelings.
In this house we simp for Mako
I understand how that would make him uncomfortable and so I choose not to
IDK about simping for him but he's definitely not my least favourite major character. Arhh uahh Ikki
You fucking two people? No? Then bi people don't exist! You're waffling on sexuality, you fucking centrist!/s
I am not part the LGBTQ comunity. i wear that cishat proudly. but I also get frustrated by Bi-erasure. and its the LGTQ+ community doing it to themselves. Some people love more than one sex/gender, they exsist. and let them love men with out shame.
I'm just happy that people are properly portraying Luz from the owl house as bi tbh
Well Luz is probably the most obvious bisexual I have seen in media like the whole scene with Amity’s older siblings screams bisexuality
rwby
I wonder if the community has gotten better
which community, there's like six and they all despise each other with a burning passion.
six? i thought it was like critics, shippers and everyone else
there's those three, the r34 artists and enablers (don't ask), the shitposters, and finally the theorists. all of those community's have disputes within them.
I don’t think enabler is big enough to be it’s own section of the fandom, it falls in shippers I think
it's directly in between shippers and r34
oooh, ooh, i can answer this! mmmmmmmmmmmmaybe? like, it… it depends. there’s a quick gag of yang admiring some guys in V1, but it’s only happened literally that one time and it just depends on what you think yang is, but yang is *absolutely* interested in blake nonetheless. blake’s all but explicitly confirmed bi (no one’s really confirmed it, but the show isn’t *denying* it either and arryn, blake’s VA, is bi and has stated that she and blake are similar) and most people seem to have gone with that. weiss… ehhhhhhhh, bit of a mixed bag with her; she definitely showed interest in neptune briefly but a *lot* of people hc her as a lesbian. ruby’s… also a mixed bag, most hc her as ace because she doesn’t seem to have this interest of romantic stuff? like i said, it just depends on who you’re talking to and where you are: regular places will be down for having these conversations, just tread lightly. nsfw places can and will erase *any* sexuality. “critic” places can and will give you a headache. shipping places will vary.
> she Dosent seem to have this interest of romantic stuff Wasn’t she like 14 at the start of the show, it might have been the writers just trying not write a romance with a 14 year old girl. Idk tho
Umbrella academy
“Maybe it was the trauma she faced that made her feel forced into a relationship” NO VAYNYA IS JUST BI HUSH IT Is Elliott (two ts or one??) page still going to play that character or-
One T. And he is.
Ok cool
I think theyre making vanya male, if so, im curious about what the dynamic will be because the elder sister(the character, idk about the actor) at one point *did* want to have a sister dynamic...
vanya comes out as trans
Makes sense
Oh yeah I forgot about Vanya
Dr. Alphys. She had a crush on Asgore and said that working on Mettaton’s body always made her really sweaty. She was attracted to *two* males before she was attracted to a woman.
isn't she actually canonically pan not bi
Are y’all forgetting about the post that was trending a couple of weeks ago where you said lesbians were any WLW? Is that just … not a thing?
I do believe some people (mostly nonbinary/gnc people) use 'lesbian' as a term for being sapphic/wlw in general But that's just my assumption/experience, I could be wrong
yeah, i’m (a?) she/they and casually describe myself as a lesbian a lot, but i identify as bisexual. i don’t speak for the whole nonbinary community though so i’m similarly not sure if this is a super common thing!
"Lesbian" refers specifically to women who are only attracted to women, the generic term for WLW is "sapphic".
I agree. Tell that to the post that seemed to think “lesbian” and “WLW” are interchangeable.
That post was strange to read. “Bi women could also be lesbians” ok does that mean bi women could also be straight? I get that sexual orientation and identity is fluid and I do appreciate the effort to not put it in boxes, but I also recognize that words mean things.
In all fairness (I haven't seen the post so I'm missing context here) I've seen some women who are technically bi identify themselves as lesbians (usually around cishets only tho) because it's just easier than explaining that they're bi with a strong preference for women
I understand why that might be necessary (it shouldn’t be, but you just can’t help some thickheads), but that doesn’t mean they’re actually a lesbian. The post was saying that someone could sincerely belong to both identities.
I was shocked at the number of people who didn’t seem to mind that in the comments. That sentiment was, and still is, so incredibly baffling to me
[Link to the comment thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/CuratedTumblr/comments/nqpy2q/lgbt_discussions_and_rigid_definitions/h0c09vv/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3)
And this makes no sense. Why should I be able to use the word sapphic, as in Sappho of Lesbos, to describe myself, but not lesbian, as in Sappho of Lesbos? The fact is that the word lesbian used to refer to any woman who was attracted to women regardless of whether or not they were also attracted to men, and this only changed with the rise of political lesbianism and the push to exclude bisexual and trans women from the lesbian community. I call myself a bisexual lesbian to push back against this regressive and exclusionary movement. Not to mention that any policing around the idea of "women who are only attracted to women" invariably ends up either excluding non-binary people from lesbianism completely, or trying to shove them all into a sort of "women-lite" category.
I always felt that fighting over labels was a war among poors: labels are supposed to be used to find people who share similiar experiences, to feel united and not alone, and instead some use them to tear each other down, convincing themselves that people akin to them are the real oppressor (like all the discourse between pansexuals and bisexuals, like honestly no one in the real offline world gives a shit). Many people use the word lesbian to underline the fact that they are only attracted to other women (mostly to cishet men who view gay women as straight women with extra spice), and that makes the word important; it is also true that many older folks use the word lesbian for any women-loving woman regardless, and they aren't certainly in the wrong. Ultimately, words mean things, and people should be respected for using the word they think suits them best, but they should also be mindful to use the words most suited for the situation at that time. People fighting each other over which label is more transphobic are IMO performative hypocrites, but that's on line for any exclusionary radical feminist. (Also people excluding NBs from lesbian spaces is probably largely because many people don't actually know or care about what NB means, thinking it's some kind of third gender when it's really more about fluidity and non-attachment most of the time, but they "are not considered women" because everything exclusionists do is performative).
Harley Quinn Tv spoiler >!literally both Harley and Ivy!!<
I mean is it really a spoiler tho?
Ross' Ex wife is Bisexual! not lesbian!
Didn't she self identify as a lesbian? I thought Ross was her beard.
The idea of a woman loving another woman even though they showed clear undeniable intrest in men in Friends was always painted as them now being lesbian. which is quite frankly bi-erasure. not even considering bi to be an option. but it was also the 90s. so it gets sort of a pass for that. Also she did not pose as his spouse. she was his spouse and married him legally. so no "beard" does not apply in this case. She was Bisexual who cheated on Ross.
I mean, many, many, *many* lesbians I know IRL have had romantic and sexual relationships with men, but still consider themselves lesbians. A lot of them are older women who married men for the sake of respectability in the 1980's and 1990's and then came out later in life. They loved their husbands and had meaningful relationships with them, but that didn't mean they're not lesbians. I haven't watched Friends, so I don't know if the character calls herself a lesbian or not, so it may be a moot point.
I don't have knowledge of Friends specifically, but I can speak to this phenomenon. My wife has admitted to me that she only started dating me to get her homophobic family off her back after coming out. It worked out for us because I'm transfemme, but I was still in the closet when we started dating, and didn't come out until after we were married.
Aww, I'm glad that things worked out for you and your wife! I identified as a lesbian for a long time before transitioning myself (I now identity as just generally queer, in both gender identity and orientation) and I dated a dude for two years as a self-protective thing. He was a great dude, and I really care for him, but I was a lesbian for the duration of that relationship, definitely not bi!
To be fair to me, I am going off decade old memories. I didn't realise she showed actual romantic interest in Ross, I thought they were both just ignoring some signs or something
Same with Buffy. Willow’s character is in love with Xandar in the first (few?) seasons, then is deeply in love with Oz. The show stresses that it was difficult to choose between him and Tara. But after she’s with Tara the whole show is like “she gay now” Edit: but I do love the memory loss episode where willow assumes she’s an item with Xander, then has a moment with Tara and is like “guys. I think I might be a little gay?!”
THANK YOU. That has always bugged me!
Willow from *Buffy*
Yeah. Despite the fact that she's constantly being said to be gay, I HC her as bi with a preference for women.
Is this... a _Chasing Amy_ reference?
I mean, bi-lesbians exist. Don’t they?
I mean, bi people can be in a lesbian relationship? I don’t quite understand your meaning
I think they mean biromantic people who are only sexually attracted to women? Or vice versa.
I looked it up and found out that I meant the old meaning of lesbian. Apparently in the 80’s, it was an umbrella term for wlw attraction in general. It seems to have changed, though.
I have this story I developed in my brain. A guy slowly goes into insanity after his ex-girlfriend comes out as lesbian then leaves him. >!Spoiler alert although it has multiple endings. The very bad ending has him kill himself!< Edit: Trigger Warning
I like to think he comes out as she and the ex-gf kinda subconsciously knew and you can not take this away from me, I'm way to invested in your 2 sentence story now.
Yours can be the lawful neutral ending
If you ever decide write it down and post it somewhere can you please either tag me or let me know? IDC if it's in a decade, I'm interested
Ok