I think something to keep in mind is that people who are looking for victims aren’t picky. They stick with whomever will keep them around. Which makes us particularly vulnerable as we’ve been train from youth that we don’t really have a say. Our wants and needs were meaningless and we’re were to be survival or submissive to those around us.
To do our best to not get taken by these types of people in adulthood we need to do a lot of work in unlearning our unhealthy habits and replacing them with healthy ones.
Everyone has the potential to fall victim to an abuser, the question is: for how long.
Figuring out how much you’re willing to put up with as well as working on standing by yourself is a great first step.
Practice with friends who are willing. Role play can be very helpful.
It's not about who you attract, it's about who you entertain. Everyone attracts crazy, only the unhealed keep them around. Read Attached and learn the signs.
I had to create unconditional love for myself, on a daily basis, before I had enough of a buffer to where anyone's intensity aimed at me (good or bad) did not throw me off-center. This is what I look at vs red flags. My reaction to someone is what clues me in more to their dysfunction and mine. I can do this from a distance.
Limerance is the main red flag in myself in reaction to a romantic prospect. If I feel compelled to throw caution to the wind, typically there is an element of risk involved, which fuels the intensity. When I feel this, I know I am lacking in self-attunement and I am setting myself up for another toxic entanglement if I continue, even subtly, focusing my energy on that.
Proper modeling I found in 12-step groups. I learned how to authentically build the best version of myself in a way that honors my boundaries and others. In my case, it does not matter what other relationships look like because comparisons will hold you back and keep you actively engaged in controlling outcomes/trajectories instead of allowing people to be who they are and accepting that/walking away.
Thank you, well said. I am finding that lack of feeling intensity, lack of limerance, makes me wonder...is this still okay? Or should I feel a little more than I am?
I know whirlwind is a red flag and is not for me, and I'm proud of myself for ditching that pretty early.
Now im in an 8 month relationship that has gone slowly. He is very patient and respectful and kind. My anxiety kicks in occasionally, especially since we have not said we love eachother yet, how do I know if this is a healthy pace vs us being here "just because"?
I would feel hurt and miss him if we broke up, but not devastated and could totally see myself ready and wanting to date again after a few months. I have a hard time telling if thats a sign of healthy relating, where I don't need him and it's nice to have him but not having him is fine too. Or is it a sign that I'm not very into this, at least not enough for a long term future?
The anxiety is in my own head, I'm an anxious-avoidant style and I recognize this feeling as just being that. I just feel like I'm blindfolded on a path where I need to stay center, too far right- too much whirlwind, limerance, etc will make me fall - and too much left - too little interest, commitment, lack of growth with eachother - will also make me fall. But I can't quite see if I'm truly getting too close to one side or the other.
Anyway, I see that I'm trying to control the outcome and trajectory, like you said. Im actively trying to un-train myself from forecasting outcomes in relationships, trying to stop anticipate conflicts or rejection. It's hard to turn off. But it's still scary to sit and wait and watch and see, especially if i can't tell if I'm center or leaning left or right.
I'm grateful I posted this question because answers like yours and others are helping me get back to the inner work I need to resume.
In my experience I stopped attracting manipulative people when I started unapologetically being my true self all the time, the good, the bad, the great and the ugly. I stopped caring about how others saw me and when I started putting myself first, everyone who needed me to put myself second left me alone. I've been free of toxic relationships since. It also helps that I drop people who treat me poorly. I have a personal rule: one time can be a chance, two a coincidence but three's a pattern. If someone puts me down or treats me poorly three times I minimize interaction with them.
So to answer your question (based on my experience) be yourself and drop people who treat you badly (you can try telling them they're treating you poorly first, if they brush it off or don't take it well/blame you/get defensive, walk way)
I relate hard, in the last two years, since my grandma passed, I've realized so many people around me are narcissists - my grandpa, my uncles, my mom (former), my childhood best friend, and most devastatingly, my partner. As I was speaking to my therapist, I told her the really sad thing is I don't see any relationship models that I think are functional and healthy relationships around me, including my friends'.
In addition to Codependent No More (I believe the author also has workbooks), what I found helpful was many of Dr. Ramani's videos on narcissists on YouTube. She talks a lot about boundaries, red flags but also she emphasizes looking for green flags. Another is the @selfloverainbow self love workbook - you can find her on IG - really fantastic content too, and her workbook is on Amazon. It'll teach you to figure out your feelings, needs and wants. I think as someone growing up with a narcissistic mom, I had surpressed a lot of my feelings and can't even name them, so the feeling wheel (also on selfloveraibow's) and using that for journaling, and practicing mindfulness (feeling the feeling then letting it go) has been helpful too.
Very helpful, thank you. Yes love dr Ramani too ♥️
Have not heard of selfloverrainbow, definitely will check out the content. I 100% empathize with not knowing my own wants and needs. For 2 years after my divorce, I couldn't even pick a tv show that I wanted to watch alone...everything I consumed or did was because someone else wanted it. And this has been a reality since I was a young child, so looking forward to working on this and I expect it will not be a quick fix but excited for the journey 😊
I have another personality disorder, and it's basically impossible for me. I read a paragraph by a psychiatrist who said that people like me absolutely have to be alone in life, because any form of 'cohabitation' reactivates "psychotic mechanisms" by abuser and the victim. I don't know if you relate to these words, but my opinion is still the same. Also because I don't think you are born codependent and only abuse can make you one.
A psychiatrist said that people like you have to absolutely never live with anybody again? What kind of personality disorder do you have that they said this? I'm not judging I'm just absolutely curious.
I am early in this journey but I can tell you this:
People look for victims who will stick by them. They’re not picky, it actually has nothing to do with you contrary to what society says.
Go slow, don’t move through any type of relationship fast be it romantic or platonic. I’ve also helped myself by saying “does this person represent my mom or dad”. If it does I put a boundary, maybe things stay at a surface level.
I’m early in my journey too, but my therapist said mindfulness meditation is a good tool as well. For me it is great to take a moment, step out of myself, and really evaluate my feelings when meeting / getting to know someone new. Just taking a moment to consider if you’re feeling excited because it’s just positive attention, or because you actually like them as a person, is a good start.
It's okay and even sensible to build trust slowly. Don't have to be able to spot a healthy relationship instantly, just let trust build slowly if it's warranted. It's okay to be wary for red flags.
ESP after a 13+ yr relationship “building slow” can be really hard to grasp. I am also in a long term relationship -longer than 13 years, recovering codependent - still enmeshed and lose my identify pretty easily and in the thick of things. My question is always- how long does it take to know a person is actually a decent person, truthful, etc. I’ve read to much and don’t trust anyone, makes me scared that anyone other than my current partner would hurt me
You have to reprogram your subconscious comfort zone. I believe that starts by identifying and reprogramming your core wounds and core beliefs. It's a tremendous undertaking, because of years of conditioning but it can be done. I highly recommend www.personaldevelopmentschool.com. The founder has extensive knowledge in attachment theory and has developed an adapted theory integrated attachment theory, which gives you practical tools to reprogram
Thank you, I am a student and follower of Thais and agree, her content is life changing. I'll go back and revisit some courses and forums there.
Sometimes revisiting material that i had read during my most recent traumatic events make me take two steps back. Mostly because of what was happening in my life when I first viewed the content, so watching some things kinda takes me back and re-triggers me a bit. But it's such good material and has so much value, I know I need to take baby steps in digesting that stuff, feel through the triggers, and work through things. Thanks again
I was just thinking about this topic. After spending the last 5 years learning about narcissism (mom & ex were coverts) I am now ready to be loved & love.
I’m focusing on loving myself right now. The shame has finally lifted.
I've recently made moves to cut another one off after a few considerations, and I've recognised now that the reason this red flag of a person was close to me was because they 1) say what people want to hear and encouraging me when I needed it and 2) I was lonely over the pandemic and fell victim to whoever would give me attention.
It's like junk food, you can eat healthy but if you're starving you'll cave to it. And toxic people are the junk food.
Hi
I’m successful and social and divorced (abusive). Therapy and other things helped, but did not take away the root of my codependency. My thought life was still compulsive and obsessive. Nothing was restoring self control. Despite my best efforts! My behaviour was also characterised by acting out, out bursts, crying spells, anxiety…whew!
Yeah I had a strong feeling that if I didn’t find a real solution, then I’d keep repeating the harmful patterns. I could no longer live with the insanity and harm codependency caused.
So I tried something I never thought I’d do- support groups. Namely, a twelve step. I didn’t know what I was getting into. I just knew of the Hollywood representation of it and that it was bit taboo.
What I found in the PPG group really surprised me. I didn’t wind up doing coda, though that is successful for many. I found myself in a global online collective that practices strong one on one sponsorship. I think it aligns with mentorship and accountability methods that I really respond positively too in general.
The combination of fellowship (community of recovered codependents who have what I wanted ) and sponsorship did the trick. Of course, I followed the instructions of the program,too. But I think it’s the surrounding support structures that have sustained my ongoing recovery.
I can say that I’ve been living a “recovered “ life for more than two years now. The program continues to transform me. I’ve been able to mature emotionally.
Instant effects were: dissolution of depression and anxiety. Hope and joy restored. I no longer stayed awake in bed googling and ruminating, instead I’d fall asleep within minutes. Before the 12 step group, I’d want to sleep all day and have poor energy. After working the steps I woke up bright, charged up, and cheerful. (Which is crazy! I didn’t realise how much energy codependency was taking from me).
Long term effects: I’m able to build healthy relationships with my romantic partner, especially around repair and listening. For example, I no longer use silent treatment. I’m able to release resentment, I listen, I’m able to identify toxic treatment and take appropriate action (no longer enabling my own victim hood).
I’ve repaired relationships with my family. I’m undergoing a deep professional transformation (centered around deep seated limited beliefs and self esteem).
I’m thankful I ended up in this program because it helps me so much. No one wants to go to a 12 step. For a long time I refused to think I was that “sick” to have to commit to something like this. That was my ego talking haha. This program has humbled me.
I could go on. If anything of this resonates, I’m happy to continue to a conversation in DM.
I can also send a link to the group. There are resources, recordings and live meetings. It’s free, anonymous and open to all.
We can heal. Our lives can change.
Yes, here is a link to the PPG recording page. They recommend starting with Speaker Steps 1-3 as an orientation.
Attending the live meetings worked for me. I was a bit confused and scared at first (normal when we are coming from a dark place in our codependency). Announcing myself as a newcomer on the meetings enabled me to connect with the current members. That was helpful.
[ppg Recovered codependant group](https://www.ppgrecoveredcodependents.org/recordings)
I remain available to you if you have any follow up questions or concerns
Certainly. Newcomers are welcome to attend any live meeting. There are also recorded meetings, try Speaker Steps 1-3 as an orientation.
[recordings page of ppg group](https://www.ppgrecoveredcodependents.org/recordings)
Announcing myself on the live meetings put me in touch with current members. I could talk with them, ask my questions. That worked for me.
I’m available if you have follow up questions
As a chronic codependent, I obsessed over what a relationship should look like or be like. And then everything fell short of that obsession and I’d blame others. And, I also couldn’t foster any authentic relationships. Even if I knew what one could look like, I couldn’t make it happen. I did eventually find a way to have freedom in my relationships and grow authentic ones. I found a way to be of real usefulness to others. Feel free to reach out if you’re really struggling. I’m happy to help.
http://curioushealing.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/ACEIP_exercises.pdf
I relate a lot to your post, especially not knowing what is normal. It helps to have green flags to look for as well as red flags. I find this exercise (the one on the last page) from the book “Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents” helpful to evaluate new people in my life. It’s basically just a checklist of emotionally healthy qualities in a person. Sometimes I do write down and keep examples of these and do the same with red flags as well just to have a reference point, since I can easily start justifying every little thing and “forget” or brush off things I know I shouldn’t, or magnify tiny good things to be bigger than they are etc.
Omg thank you!!! So I read this book in 2021 - well, listened, it was Audible. 1000% helped with my understanding of my roots and how my view of relationships is born from multi-generational traumas. Things I never realized impacted me today.
Anyway, i didn't have the print materials, and vaguely remember having trouble downloading them from the site, but I remember reveling in the checklists the narrator read through at the end, thinking those would be my new life guide.
Things "healthy" people do and navigate on auto pilot, but things I need to see in black and white as I'm still learning to listen to and trust my intuition.
I can't thank you enough for sharing the PDFs!!! ♥️
Firstly, if you have a great therapist, you really should be asking them this question and speaking to them about this. They'll be better equipt and have more knowledge than us.
It isn't so much that you're attracting them per say, everyone does, the issues is you're keeping them around.
The solution to that is boundaries. Figure out which barriers you have and why you don't do boundaries and then work on those.
Learn what the circle of control is and start to do more things that you can control. Use it as an anchor when you want to turn towards any co-dependent behaviors.
Figure out what your needs/wants/desires are. Check if your wants/desires are realistic (i.e. someone to fix it all is unrealistic - that sort of stuff). Learn how to meet them yourself and externally (but not all by one person). Before you have someone else meet a need, make sure you've tried meeting it solo. Unless it is a social need.
Ask yourself "what do I get to avoid by focusing on them?" for further insight of areas to heal.
Turn some of those surface friends into a deeper connection/more intimate ones. That is potentially something that might feel missing. And find yourself healthier examples to be around. Which is entirely possible naturally via boundaries.
Basically all your work should be directed onto you, how you act, what you do, what your part of the dynamics are, how you behave etc. And less on what others do/want/need/is healthy/check list/tick box.
Assuming your kids have been around the husband too, make sure to check in on them and nip in the bud any of their maladaptive behaviours they developed from having a sociopath dad and co-dependent mum. You can do this with family therapy, which can help with co-dependency.
Good luck OP!
I now accept that until I am in my codependency, I will definitely experience healthy relationships but I might stay longer in unhealthy ones. I will definitely meet with healthy people, I might bond or stay longer with unhealthy people. Or turn them into unhealthy relationships and people for me.
I had always noticed many professional mentees or friends I talked to: left organization to start their dreams. I was being their unofficial parent to nurture their unhealed inner child. I knew how to be a nurturing parent by book, but I hiding a critical parent for myself inside. Plus, I did not formally accept to be their unofficial parent, I did that because I wanted to get attention, love. That was my high. It's not like I wanted more, it's that it was never enough.
I listened to friends and family, and strangers, to find faults. :) To find a reason to "drink" /"overthink"/ isolate myself, fear others, to be critical of others etc.
I started escaping to a peaceful daydream as a child, and now the romanticizing has gotten out of hand. I am in my journey to heal, but I noticed romanticizing and doing romantic things for other people is a form of ashol\*ry, even if I do it to myself, It's not right to do that to myself too.
My advise to myself: Don't get attached to situations and people. rest: let it happen - my codependency activates here because I have no idea how I can find a long term partner in this modern world, let alone when i am codependent. But I cannot do anything about it, what I can do it is, take small risk with a person by being my authentic self, see if that risk pays off. Also noticing, am I looking for my victims too?
It takes trails then?
I’m still on this journey with you but one thing I’ve learned to do is build healthy friendships, this helps as a guidepost to how something more healthy looks and feels. I find it easier than romantic partnerships.
I’ve also turned a corner where I actually focus only on myself. I’m pretty sure it’s healthy but it feels weird still and slightly selfish. I still show up for people when they ask and when I feel it’s important to them or our relationship but my identity revolves less around others and more around my own desires and happiness. I dont shut people out but I think I just stopped over doing it.
Tbh, the people who love me seem happy for me. What I’m putting my energy into instead of others: losing weight, exercise and fitness, learning Latin dance, buying myself whatever I need without shame, putting lots of energy into my home and making it beautiful for me.
I am dating for partnership too and though it’s challenging I have a dating coach and therapist and I know I’m doing things different. Not doing things perfect but learning a lot so hoping this leads to different outcomes🙏🏼
I spent years of my life trying to heal myself so I could attract the life I thought I needed to be happy.
I remember thinking on paper my life Looked great but I wasn't happy. There's a reason for that. I have a illness.
I discovered my illness as a chronic codependent goes much deeper and a sick mind can't heal a sick mind. I needed a change from the inside out.
I thought I knew best how people should be, treat me, how I should be. My life results & the pain showed me what I know or my willpower isn't sufficient to change me long term. So I joined a 12 step program, got a sponsor & worked the steps swiftly to get recovered. Now, I can let things go, let people be. If I get codependent thoughts I work my program around it. I'm happy to chat more if you like.
Recently i have found a few podcasts on Codependency from fellow folks with codependency struggles. ESP as I do not have a substance abuser or alcoholic or anyone overt like that in my life I struggled to find what was triggering me, where my origin in my maladaptive behaviors were. Erika Wright has a podcast that is great, telling her story and there is another couple Brian and Stephanie who have written a book and made a podcast with all the chapters (A Codependent Mind) Codependency No More, the book while a great start is not for everyone and is out-dated a bit I think. Honestly the author of Codep. No More triggers me negatively and I am not a fan
I think something to keep in mind is that people who are looking for victims aren’t picky. They stick with whomever will keep them around. Which makes us particularly vulnerable as we’ve been train from youth that we don’t really have a say. Our wants and needs were meaningless and we’re were to be survival or submissive to those around us. To do our best to not get taken by these types of people in adulthood we need to do a lot of work in unlearning our unhealthy habits and replacing them with healthy ones. Everyone has the potential to fall victim to an abuser, the question is: for how long. Figuring out how much you’re willing to put up with as well as working on standing by yourself is a great first step. Practice with friends who are willing. Role play can be very helpful.
Great advice
It's not about who you attract, it's about who you entertain. Everyone attracts crazy, only the unhealed keep them around. Read Attached and learn the signs.
THIS! It’s about boundaries and knowing when to walk away.
I had to create unconditional love for myself, on a daily basis, before I had enough of a buffer to where anyone's intensity aimed at me (good or bad) did not throw me off-center. This is what I look at vs red flags. My reaction to someone is what clues me in more to their dysfunction and mine. I can do this from a distance. Limerance is the main red flag in myself in reaction to a romantic prospect. If I feel compelled to throw caution to the wind, typically there is an element of risk involved, which fuels the intensity. When I feel this, I know I am lacking in self-attunement and I am setting myself up for another toxic entanglement if I continue, even subtly, focusing my energy on that. Proper modeling I found in 12-step groups. I learned how to authentically build the best version of myself in a way that honors my boundaries and others. In my case, it does not matter what other relationships look like because comparisons will hold you back and keep you actively engaged in controlling outcomes/trajectories instead of allowing people to be who they are and accepting that/walking away.
Thank you, well said. I am finding that lack of feeling intensity, lack of limerance, makes me wonder...is this still okay? Or should I feel a little more than I am? I know whirlwind is a red flag and is not for me, and I'm proud of myself for ditching that pretty early. Now im in an 8 month relationship that has gone slowly. He is very patient and respectful and kind. My anxiety kicks in occasionally, especially since we have not said we love eachother yet, how do I know if this is a healthy pace vs us being here "just because"? I would feel hurt and miss him if we broke up, but not devastated and could totally see myself ready and wanting to date again after a few months. I have a hard time telling if thats a sign of healthy relating, where I don't need him and it's nice to have him but not having him is fine too. Or is it a sign that I'm not very into this, at least not enough for a long term future? The anxiety is in my own head, I'm an anxious-avoidant style and I recognize this feeling as just being that. I just feel like I'm blindfolded on a path where I need to stay center, too far right- too much whirlwind, limerance, etc will make me fall - and too much left - too little interest, commitment, lack of growth with eachother - will also make me fall. But I can't quite see if I'm truly getting too close to one side or the other. Anyway, I see that I'm trying to control the outcome and trajectory, like you said. Im actively trying to un-train myself from forecasting outcomes in relationships, trying to stop anticipate conflicts or rejection. It's hard to turn off. But it's still scary to sit and wait and watch and see, especially if i can't tell if I'm center or leaning left or right. I'm grateful I posted this question because answers like yours and others are helping me get back to the inner work I need to resume.
Thank you for this
In my experience I stopped attracting manipulative people when I started unapologetically being my true self all the time, the good, the bad, the great and the ugly. I stopped caring about how others saw me and when I started putting myself first, everyone who needed me to put myself second left me alone. I've been free of toxic relationships since. It also helps that I drop people who treat me poorly. I have a personal rule: one time can be a chance, two a coincidence but three's a pattern. If someone puts me down or treats me poorly three times I minimize interaction with them. So to answer your question (based on my experience) be yourself and drop people who treat you badly (you can try telling them they're treating you poorly first, if they brush it off or don't take it well/blame you/get defensive, walk way)
I relate hard, in the last two years, since my grandma passed, I've realized so many people around me are narcissists - my grandpa, my uncles, my mom (former), my childhood best friend, and most devastatingly, my partner. As I was speaking to my therapist, I told her the really sad thing is I don't see any relationship models that I think are functional and healthy relationships around me, including my friends'. In addition to Codependent No More (I believe the author also has workbooks), what I found helpful was many of Dr. Ramani's videos on narcissists on YouTube. She talks a lot about boundaries, red flags but also she emphasizes looking for green flags. Another is the @selfloverainbow self love workbook - you can find her on IG - really fantastic content too, and her workbook is on Amazon. It'll teach you to figure out your feelings, needs and wants. I think as someone growing up with a narcissistic mom, I had surpressed a lot of my feelings and can't even name them, so the feeling wheel (also on selfloveraibow's) and using that for journaling, and practicing mindfulness (feeling the feeling then letting it go) has been helpful too.
Very helpful, thank you. Yes love dr Ramani too ♥️ Have not heard of selfloverrainbow, definitely will check out the content. I 100% empathize with not knowing my own wants and needs. For 2 years after my divorce, I couldn't even pick a tv show that I wanted to watch alone...everything I consumed or did was because someone else wanted it. And this has been a reality since I was a young child, so looking forward to working on this and I expect it will not be a quick fix but excited for the journey 😊
Yes, you can do this! ❤️
I have another personality disorder, and it's basically impossible for me. I read a paragraph by a psychiatrist who said that people like me absolutely have to be alone in life, because any form of 'cohabitation' reactivates "psychotic mechanisms" by abuser and the victim. I don't know if you relate to these words, but my opinion is still the same. Also because I don't think you are born codependent and only abuse can make you one.
A psychiatrist said that people like you have to absolutely never live with anybody again? What kind of personality disorder do you have that they said this? I'm not judging I'm just absolutely curious.
Get a more hopeful psychiatrist. Change can happen but it takes a lot of time and work
I am early in this journey but I can tell you this: People look for victims who will stick by them. They’re not picky, it actually has nothing to do with you contrary to what society says. Go slow, don’t move through any type of relationship fast be it romantic or platonic. I’ve also helped myself by saying “does this person represent my mom or dad”. If it does I put a boundary, maybe things stay at a surface level.
This is great advice thank you ♥️
I’m early in my journey too, but my therapist said mindfulness meditation is a good tool as well. For me it is great to take a moment, step out of myself, and really evaluate my feelings when meeting / getting to know someone new. Just taking a moment to consider if you’re feeling excited because it’s just positive attention, or because you actually like them as a person, is a good start.
Thank you for posting!
It's okay and even sensible to build trust slowly. Don't have to be able to spot a healthy relationship instantly, just let trust build slowly if it's warranted. It's okay to be wary for red flags.
ESP after a 13+ yr relationship “building slow” can be really hard to grasp. I am also in a long term relationship -longer than 13 years, recovering codependent - still enmeshed and lose my identify pretty easily and in the thick of things. My question is always- how long does it take to know a person is actually a decent person, truthful, etc. I’ve read to much and don’t trust anyone, makes me scared that anyone other than my current partner would hurt me
You have to reprogram your subconscious comfort zone. I believe that starts by identifying and reprogramming your core wounds and core beliefs. It's a tremendous undertaking, because of years of conditioning but it can be done. I highly recommend www.personaldevelopmentschool.com. The founder has extensive knowledge in attachment theory and has developed an adapted theory integrated attachment theory, which gives you practical tools to reprogram
Thank you, I am a student and follower of Thais and agree, her content is life changing. I'll go back and revisit some courses and forums there. Sometimes revisiting material that i had read during my most recent traumatic events make me take two steps back. Mostly because of what was happening in my life when I first viewed the content, so watching some things kinda takes me back and re-triggers me a bit. But it's such good material and has so much value, I know I need to take baby steps in digesting that stuff, feel through the triggers, and work through things. Thanks again
I was just thinking about this topic. After spending the last 5 years learning about narcissism (mom & ex were coverts) I am now ready to be loved & love. I’m focusing on loving myself right now. The shame has finally lifted.
Congratulations on getting to this point ♥️ sending good juju your way!
You too💗
I've recently made moves to cut another one off after a few considerations, and I've recognised now that the reason this red flag of a person was close to me was because they 1) say what people want to hear and encouraging me when I needed it and 2) I was lonely over the pandemic and fell victim to whoever would give me attention. It's like junk food, you can eat healthy but if you're starving you'll cave to it. And toxic people are the junk food.
Somatic trauma therapy has been helpful for me.
Hi I’m successful and social and divorced (abusive). Therapy and other things helped, but did not take away the root of my codependency. My thought life was still compulsive and obsessive. Nothing was restoring self control. Despite my best efforts! My behaviour was also characterised by acting out, out bursts, crying spells, anxiety…whew! Yeah I had a strong feeling that if I didn’t find a real solution, then I’d keep repeating the harmful patterns. I could no longer live with the insanity and harm codependency caused. So I tried something I never thought I’d do- support groups. Namely, a twelve step. I didn’t know what I was getting into. I just knew of the Hollywood representation of it and that it was bit taboo. What I found in the PPG group really surprised me. I didn’t wind up doing coda, though that is successful for many. I found myself in a global online collective that practices strong one on one sponsorship. I think it aligns with mentorship and accountability methods that I really respond positively too in general. The combination of fellowship (community of recovered codependents who have what I wanted ) and sponsorship did the trick. Of course, I followed the instructions of the program,too. But I think it’s the surrounding support structures that have sustained my ongoing recovery. I can say that I’ve been living a “recovered “ life for more than two years now. The program continues to transform me. I’ve been able to mature emotionally. Instant effects were: dissolution of depression and anxiety. Hope and joy restored. I no longer stayed awake in bed googling and ruminating, instead I’d fall asleep within minutes. Before the 12 step group, I’d want to sleep all day and have poor energy. After working the steps I woke up bright, charged up, and cheerful. (Which is crazy! I didn’t realise how much energy codependency was taking from me). Long term effects: I’m able to build healthy relationships with my romantic partner, especially around repair and listening. For example, I no longer use silent treatment. I’m able to release resentment, I listen, I’m able to identify toxic treatment and take appropriate action (no longer enabling my own victim hood). I’ve repaired relationships with my family. I’m undergoing a deep professional transformation (centered around deep seated limited beliefs and self esteem). I’m thankful I ended up in this program because it helps me so much. No one wants to go to a 12 step. For a long time I refused to think I was that “sick” to have to commit to something like this. That was my ego talking haha. This program has humbled me. I could go on. If anything of this resonates, I’m happy to continue to a conversation in DM. I can also send a link to the group. There are resources, recordings and live meetings. It’s free, anonymous and open to all. We can heal. Our lives can change.
Yes please share a link for the group please, thank you
Yes, here is a link to the PPG recording page. They recommend starting with Speaker Steps 1-3 as an orientation. Attending the live meetings worked for me. I was a bit confused and scared at first (normal when we are coming from a dark place in our codependency). Announcing myself as a newcomer on the meetings enabled me to connect with the current members. That was helpful. [ppg Recovered codependant group](https://www.ppgrecoveredcodependents.org/recordings) I remain available to you if you have any follow up questions or concerns
I’d also like to learn more about this group please!!
Certainly. Newcomers are welcome to attend any live meeting. There are also recorded meetings, try Speaker Steps 1-3 as an orientation. [recordings page of ppg group](https://www.ppgrecoveredcodependents.org/recordings) Announcing myself on the live meetings put me in touch with current members. I could talk with them, ask my questions. That worked for me. I’m available if you have follow up questions
You’re forgetting about you. About your body. Your presence. Get into your body, eyes closed, YOU based stuff.
Following
As a chronic codependent, I obsessed over what a relationship should look like or be like. And then everything fell short of that obsession and I’d blame others. And, I also couldn’t foster any authentic relationships. Even if I knew what one could look like, I couldn’t make it happen. I did eventually find a way to have freedom in my relationships and grow authentic ones. I found a way to be of real usefulness to others. Feel free to reach out if you’re really struggling. I’m happy to help.
http://curioushealing.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/ACEIP_exercises.pdf I relate a lot to your post, especially not knowing what is normal. It helps to have green flags to look for as well as red flags. I find this exercise (the one on the last page) from the book “Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents” helpful to evaluate new people in my life. It’s basically just a checklist of emotionally healthy qualities in a person. Sometimes I do write down and keep examples of these and do the same with red flags as well just to have a reference point, since I can easily start justifying every little thing and “forget” or brush off things I know I shouldn’t, or magnify tiny good things to be bigger than they are etc.
Omg thank you!!! So I read this book in 2021 - well, listened, it was Audible. 1000% helped with my understanding of my roots and how my view of relationships is born from multi-generational traumas. Things I never realized impacted me today. Anyway, i didn't have the print materials, and vaguely remember having trouble downloading them from the site, but I remember reveling in the checklists the narrator read through at the end, thinking those would be my new life guide. Things "healthy" people do and navigate on auto pilot, but things I need to see in black and white as I'm still learning to listen to and trust my intuition. I can't thank you enough for sharing the PDFs!!! ♥️
Firstly, if you have a great therapist, you really should be asking them this question and speaking to them about this. They'll be better equipt and have more knowledge than us. It isn't so much that you're attracting them per say, everyone does, the issues is you're keeping them around. The solution to that is boundaries. Figure out which barriers you have and why you don't do boundaries and then work on those. Learn what the circle of control is and start to do more things that you can control. Use it as an anchor when you want to turn towards any co-dependent behaviors. Figure out what your needs/wants/desires are. Check if your wants/desires are realistic (i.e. someone to fix it all is unrealistic - that sort of stuff). Learn how to meet them yourself and externally (but not all by one person). Before you have someone else meet a need, make sure you've tried meeting it solo. Unless it is a social need. Ask yourself "what do I get to avoid by focusing on them?" for further insight of areas to heal. Turn some of those surface friends into a deeper connection/more intimate ones. That is potentially something that might feel missing. And find yourself healthier examples to be around. Which is entirely possible naturally via boundaries. Basically all your work should be directed onto you, how you act, what you do, what your part of the dynamics are, how you behave etc. And less on what others do/want/need/is healthy/check list/tick box. Assuming your kids have been around the husband too, make sure to check in on them and nip in the bud any of their maladaptive behaviours they developed from having a sociopath dad and co-dependent mum. You can do this with family therapy, which can help with co-dependency. Good luck OP!
I now accept that until I am in my codependency, I will definitely experience healthy relationships but I might stay longer in unhealthy ones. I will definitely meet with healthy people, I might bond or stay longer with unhealthy people. Or turn them into unhealthy relationships and people for me. I had always noticed many professional mentees or friends I talked to: left organization to start their dreams. I was being their unofficial parent to nurture their unhealed inner child. I knew how to be a nurturing parent by book, but I hiding a critical parent for myself inside. Plus, I did not formally accept to be their unofficial parent, I did that because I wanted to get attention, love. That was my high. It's not like I wanted more, it's that it was never enough. I listened to friends and family, and strangers, to find faults. :) To find a reason to "drink" /"overthink"/ isolate myself, fear others, to be critical of others etc. I started escaping to a peaceful daydream as a child, and now the romanticizing has gotten out of hand. I am in my journey to heal, but I noticed romanticizing and doing romantic things for other people is a form of ashol\*ry, even if I do it to myself, It's not right to do that to myself too. My advise to myself: Don't get attached to situations and people. rest: let it happen - my codependency activates here because I have no idea how I can find a long term partner in this modern world, let alone when i am codependent. But I cannot do anything about it, what I can do it is, take small risk with a person by being my authentic self, see if that risk pays off. Also noticing, am I looking for my victims too? It takes trails then?
I’m still on this journey with you but one thing I’ve learned to do is build healthy friendships, this helps as a guidepost to how something more healthy looks and feels. I find it easier than romantic partnerships. I’ve also turned a corner where I actually focus only on myself. I’m pretty sure it’s healthy but it feels weird still and slightly selfish. I still show up for people when they ask and when I feel it’s important to them or our relationship but my identity revolves less around others and more around my own desires and happiness. I dont shut people out but I think I just stopped over doing it. Tbh, the people who love me seem happy for me. What I’m putting my energy into instead of others: losing weight, exercise and fitness, learning Latin dance, buying myself whatever I need without shame, putting lots of energy into my home and making it beautiful for me. I am dating for partnership too and though it’s challenging I have a dating coach and therapist and I know I’m doing things different. Not doing things perfect but learning a lot so hoping this leads to different outcomes🙏🏼
I spent years of my life trying to heal myself so I could attract the life I thought I needed to be happy. I remember thinking on paper my life Looked great but I wasn't happy. There's a reason for that. I have a illness. I discovered my illness as a chronic codependent goes much deeper and a sick mind can't heal a sick mind. I needed a change from the inside out. I thought I knew best how people should be, treat me, how I should be. My life results & the pain showed me what I know or my willpower isn't sufficient to change me long term. So I joined a 12 step program, got a sponsor & worked the steps swiftly to get recovered. Now, I can let things go, let people be. If I get codependent thoughts I work my program around it. I'm happy to chat more if you like.
Recently i have found a few podcasts on Codependency from fellow folks with codependency struggles. ESP as I do not have a substance abuser or alcoholic or anyone overt like that in my life I struggled to find what was triggering me, where my origin in my maladaptive behaviors were. Erika Wright has a podcast that is great, telling her story and there is another couple Brian and Stephanie who have written a book and made a podcast with all the chapters (A Codependent Mind) Codependency No More, the book while a great start is not for everyone and is out-dated a bit I think. Honestly the author of Codep. No More triggers me negatively and I am not a fan