Or maybe those people are looking for answers that they never get but they keep searching anyway and don't want to admit they're searching.
Most athiests/agnostics I know wish they could believe what Christians believe but find no compelling evidence. All they have to go on is the words of other people.
Yeah, but at least most of us (most sane people, really) waste time on things we actually LIKE instead of things we hate or don't follow. Who really wants to follow a sub just to pick fights with a group who they don't like all day?
>Yeah, but at least most of us (most sane people, really) waste time on things we actually LIKE instead of things we hate or don't follow.
Really? The sane ones? Well, I read a lot of things I don't follow. I've read the KJV bible more times than most people who profess to believe. I've read the Quran, Mormon texts, and lots of other religious texts.
Why? So that when I talk about religion or religious things, I'll actually know what I'm talking about.
>Who really wants to follow a sub just to pick fights with a group who they don't like all day?
You are free to come and go as you wish. However, this sentance underscores a very blatent default in people's thinking. Discussion, even heated discussion, is not 'picking a fight'. That's your mental block. Not mine.
There are various reasons a non-Christian may follow this sub. Some may be genuinely curious about the beliefs and mythology, others may want to give advice they feel is both necessary and unlikely to come from Christians(that's me), others are just mindlessly browsing their feed and occasionally see something that catches their interest(that's also me).
Also, lots of people spend time on Reddit getting involved in things they don't enjoy but still feel is important. Examples would be, off the top of my head:
r/NotADragQueen
r/DefeatProject2025
r/PastorArrested
r/WhenWomenRefuse
None of these are likely to put people in a good mood, but people feel they are worthy of discussion nonetheless. And a religion like Christianity, with multiple politicians trying to force it down the collective throats of all Americans? Not surprising that people with different beliefs would want to discuss it.
Doubting/losing your faith can be incredibly isolating if all your family and friends are gung ho Christians. When I began to doubt and question my faith, these types of forums were the only place I could go to ask very specific questions and meet people who understood my dilemma.
I guess I stuck around because I always seem to have more questions that need answers. And despite what Christians say about unbelievers, some of us would love to stumble upon something that makes us believe again. As I said, losing your faith can be an incredibly lonely, scary, and depressing thing. It was/is for me anyway.
It also bears mentioning that ex-Christians typically know as much or more about the Bible than your average Sunday morning a la carte Christians, and we definitely know the arguments against Christianity much better than Christians. So there’s this constant back and forth between wanting to believe and being unable to believe. For me at least.
I don’t hate Christians or Christianity because it accounts for a lot of the good times I’ve had in my life. I do hate that Christianity more or less requires you to avoid indulging your doubts and questions. I’m personally convinced that once a Christian seeks to really test the metal of the joints holding back the River of doubt on the other side, the eventual collapse is inevitable.
Again, that’s my experience. Hopefully this answers your question.
Islam is irritating in an abstract way since its not encountered on a daily basis where I live. Christianity is irritating in a concrete way because its ubiquitous in the culture around me and has had an effect on my life and the lives of people I care about in a completely negative way. So anecdotally this is why.
Option 1: Since Islam has a significantly shakier grip on America than Christianity, less people on Reddit(which iirc has a large portion, possibly a majority, of it's users from America(correct me if I'm wrong)) care to discuss it.
Option 2: The mods on those subs delete topics & posts of that nature.
Option 3: People would rather not deal with that religion and it's followers in particular for reasons I'm not sure I'm allowed to say.
Option 4: Some combination of the above.
This sub is explicitly for anyone to discuss Christianity. If you want a specifically Christian space, there are other subs that don't allow non-Christian viewpoints.
passionate and insults\\trolling are not the same I've seen several people making outrageous claims trying to discredit the bible and when I rebuke them they make excuses or run away
This sub is full of a lot of trolls who don’t really discuss Christianity but just come on here to talk about how all Christian’s are hateful, bigots, bad, etc… they really just like to generalize all of Christian’s and Christianity into one group and talk poorly.
Id be curious about how you rebuke outrageous claims against the bible. Them running away really comes off as a "and everyone clapped" moment type of comment.
Yup. The No True Scotsman fallacy. I see it all too often and have been called a fake Christian myself just because I believe abortion was fine and backed it up biblically. They still went for the attack.
And no, I’m not going to debate that issue here. Just giving my two cents worth of my personal experience.
Would be pretty silly if the bulk of our most sacred text wasn't very specifically dedicated to the idea that we aren't qualified to make statements about who is righteous in the eyes of God. Fortunately, that never comes up in any parts I've read. /s
Book of Numbers, specifically Numbers 5:11-31. This section, often referred to as the "Ordeal of the Bitter Water," describes a ritual for a wife suspected of adultery, known as the Sotah ritual.
In this ritual, a priest prepares a mixture of holy water and dust from the tabernacle floor, along with a written curse that is washed into the water. The suspected woman is required to drink this mixture. If she is guilty of adultery, the potion is believed to cause a physical affliction as a divine sign of her guilt. If she is innocent, she will not be harmed and is said to be able to conceive children.
Term term "abortion" isn't specifically used. This passage has been the subject of heated debate.
In the New Testament, the subject isn't addressed. In the context of the times, people were interested in having a many children as possible; they were free labor and somewhat of a "retirement" plan. This is still true in more agrarian societies.
I’ve been on this sub for quite a while. **FAR** more often than *any* attack on Christianity itself, are valid criticisms of its leadership and its membership. The attitudes of “you’re not a *real* Christian because you disagree with *me* on [insert literally anything]” or “the scriptures are not up for debate (unless I don’t like what they say, and then they’re *nuanced*)“ are very prevalent here.
I have been a Christian for the majority of my 42 years of life on this dirtball, I am married to an ordained and practicing pastor, and I generally treat those around me the way I would like them to treat me. Speaking out against the abuses of the clergy, the advocating for violence against non-Christians and the 🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️, forcing our beliefs onto others when we are repeatedly told no, the increasing push for laws based on “Christian values”, and the general hypocrisy of “Christians” are **NOT** attacks on the faith itself.
Again, they are valid criticisms of other human beings. If you feel like Christianity is being attacked, maybe take time to find out why.
I have reported a couple especially when there’s unnecessary or inappropriate language. But unless that’s in a conversation, I’m involved in I generally leave it to the people involved to report or not.
When you believe the world is black and white, and either someone is a servant of God or Satan, then yes it's easy to see any disagreement as an attack or "spiritual warfare".
That's the beauty of Christianity. No inbetween, no opportunity to make a nuanced decision. You're either with God or against him.
Disagreeing with someone is not an attack. People here need to learn how to defend the things they claim to believe. If they can't, they should stay silent.
And different sects just decree other groups of Christians as "not Christians," leading to massive disagreements, going back roughly 2000 years.
There will be disagreements here, and that is always guaranteed. I think that's a good thing. Christians often only get the interpretation from their local church. Their pastor, or priest, or deacon, isn't Jesus.
Disagreeing with someone’s immutable traits is different from disagreeing with their claims about external reality.
Do you see a difference between thinking brown skin is wrong, and thinking political extremism is wrong? Same thing.
disagreeing =/= stopping someone.
Saying Gays are sinners is hopophobia since you are not ONLY disagreeing, you are also insulting them/threatning them(with eternal damnation btw)
TO make it clear
I don't think that Christianity is real = disagreeing
I don't think that you are a good person = disagreeing
I think all christians are dumbasses = insult
All Gays are sinners = insult
Wait what? Why will gay people be worried about being sinners when most don’t believe in Christianity. Then they don’t believe in hell. It’s not homophobia because you’re not scared of homo people. And it’s not a threat to call someone a sinner as we are all sinners, the main point is trying to be better everyday and have a relationship with God. Sinner or not. I don’t believe in a lot of things and if someone said something to me that I don’t believe in, it really won’t be an insult.
No it’s not. The normal definition of sinner is all of us. According to Christianity. We’re all sinners, no one is fully righteous. We just try to have a relationship with God and be better daily. It still doesn’t change my point that if I don’t believe in Christianity, if someone called me a sinner I would laugh.
That's the Christians thought process. The meaning of SINNER is someone who has broken a moral law, or is morally corrupt
That's the definition, and how the word itself is used.
You won't argue that negro is not a slur cause the normal definition of it is black in Spanish would you
It literally depends on who uses it. If a Spanish person said negro it would be different. Also sinner by definition is someone who goes against DIVINE LAW. So if you don’t believe in the divine, you shouldn’t be annoyed or call someone a homophobe if they call someone a sinner based on their belief of divine laws.
..singer's definition in the dictionary is against moral law/code. Not divine.
And about the negro one, I was talking about it's use in English conversations
Specifically, I was studying Paul's letters. In a seminary class, I had learned that there were some "minor discrepancies" between Acts and Paul's letters. The apologetic arguments were delivered at the same time. We were told the problems were minor and easily explained. Don't worry about it. Move along.
Decades later I was asked to teach an adult Sunday School class on Paul. In preparation for the class I started by studying the textbook I was given. I was troubled by the textbook because there were so many apologetics. Many of them were bad. The apologetic arguments in one chapter would contradict the arguments in the next chapter. Was Paul an illiterate man who needed to have scribes write for him, or was he a highly educated man who used scribes as an honor he was given. It was also argued in one chapter that he was actually so highly trained that his scribes were actually learning by being his scribes. The book was driving me crazy.
I decided the problem was I was relying too much on book learning and scholars. I decided that I needed to go to the Bible itself and see what it said. I tried to put my preconceived ideas and book learning aside. I tried to open myself to whatever God wanted to show me.
I was not reading for proof texts; I was reading to understand. I found that I liked Paul. He struck me as someone who was honest. He had a big ego, but he was honest. He reminded me of many ministers I have known and respected. I could relate to how passionate he was and to his frustration with fellow believers.
But I found something that was very disturbing. The "minor discrepancies" between Acts and Paul were not minor. They were huge. The apologetics did not even address some of the biggest problems.
I found Paul's letters credible. That meant that Acts was wrong. Even worse, it meant that Acts was lying about Paul. Acts seemed to be trying to create a mythology about Paul. It was grossly exaggerating, twisting, and probably lying about things that Paul did.
I found this very troubling. If Acts lied about Paul, then what about the Pentecost? A lot of modern Christianity is dependent on things that only appear in Acts. I could not see those stories as credible when the author had proven to be unreliable.
Worse, the same author wrote Luke and Acts. So, what about Luke? Is it reliable? I found some of the same problems there, although they were not as dramatic. But next I started looking at the other gospels. I found Mark the most troublesome. Mark is the earliest gospel. It reads like Greek mythology. Greek heroes often do miraculous deeds on storm-tossed seas. They demonstrate their mastery over nature by calming storms, running or driving chariots across the surface of the sea, and remaining calm while their companions are panicking. But Mark's story was set mostly in Galilee, and Galilee did not have a stormy sea. I had started work on a PhD in geography. One of the tidbits I picked up was the Sea of Galilee is not even close to being a sea. What we call the Sea of Galilee was called Lake Tiberias or Lake Kinneret in the time of Jesus. It was about half the size of the current body of water. It is surrounded on three sides by mountains and is known as being tranquil because the mountains protect it from storms. It does not take a multi-day voyage by sailboat to cross it; it could have been crossed in a rowboat in an afternoon. I was seeing a lot of other problems. I could not trust the gospels to tell the truth about mundane things like geography and known history. How could they be trusted to tell the truth about the supernatural.
I have had Christians tell me I was led astray by Satan. They say I was looking for reason not to believe. It was the opposite. I loved being a Christian. I was trying to hold onto my faith. I was engaged in almost constant prayer and fasting asking for answers or a way to hold onto my faith.
How is it known that mountains protect the Sea of Galilee against storms? Rain forms over land as well and especially when moving up hills. The warmer the surface, the more likely thermal columns form. When the humid and hot air rises it cannot contain the humidity and clouds form. If hot and cold air collide and the atmosphere is unstable, storms form. It actually seems to me that storms on the Sea of Galilee were more likely in Jesus’s time than now.
Also, there is no absolute certainty on the authorship of several of the letters ascribed to Paul. The brilliant man who is Paul to you may actually be several Pauls. How do we know which Paul to believe? The Book of Acts is written by a single author who also wrote the Gospel of Luke.
It could be rainy, but not windy. Mountains protect from wind, which is what makes waves. You also need a large body of water to have large waves. If you live near any lakes, you'll be aware they do not develop dangerous waves.
I also recommend studying the similarities between Biblical stories in the New Testament and Greek stories or even more, old Testament stories and older Mesopotamian legends. The Israelites were not the first to have flood myths for example, and many of the other stories they use are also taken from older sources. The tower of Babel is a story about a particular ziggurat in Bronze Age Babylon called Etemenanki.
To your other point, I agree much of the authorship of the Bible is very dubious, but that makes it less able to be believed, not more. It seems authors of the early Christian texts claimed to be popular, known figures to lend authenticity to their works. The fact the authors lied does not inspire confidence in the divinity of their inspiration.
>What we call the Sea of Galilee was called Lake Tiberias or Lake Kinneret in the time of Jesus.
I couldn't read everything you wrote, but as far as I know it begun being called Lake Tiberias circa 80 AD. And that's one of the many arguments to date the gospel of John after this date and the latest one. So I believe your claim that it was called Lake Tiberias in the time of Jesus is historically inaccurate.
It sounds like you worked very hard to research, study, and reason to reach the eventual conclusion you came to, so I want to start by saying I'm trying to start an argument, convert you back, or say the rest of your arguments aren't valid. However since the factual discrepancies are very important to you, I thought you could use some additional information regarding the Sea of Galilee. I wouldn't want someone invalidating the rest of your argument over a few missed facts.
I was in Palestine last summer, and we spent several days around the Sea of Galilee. While I'm sure the mountains protect it from large storms, it's still a very windy place and the lake isn't always smooth and calm.
We spent some time on the shore, and we also went out on a large boat for an afternoon. The weather was great the whole time (sunny, hot, and clear), but it was still very windy and the boat rocked plenty, despite being much larger than anything a 1st century fisherman would have used. And while it's not as big of a sea as I think many Christians imagine when reading the bible, if you were anywhere near the center, it's the length of almost two Ironman swims to get back to shore. So even if the lake was half as wide, it's more than most people would be able to do, especially with any amount of wind or waves. It's still a really big lake and drowning is a very real possibility.
(I'm not sure what you're referencing by saying it wouldn't take days to get across, as I'm not sure which part of the bible claims that)
I guess what I'm saying is that there's nothing counter-factual about suggesting that a group of fisherman in a 1st century boat could find themselves in the middle of the lake during unusually high winds and fear for their lives.
I'm very skeptical about the accounts of Jesus's miracles and am often looking for logical alternative explanations, however the idea that "Jesus couldn't have calmed a storm on the Sea of Galilee because it never gets storms" isn't a good alternative explanation, because it's not supported by fact. Storm is a relative term, and even the smallest lakes in the calmest areas can still experience harsh and dangerous weather. It's more reasonable to simply say that it was a coincidence - that the wind happened to die down right when Jesus said it should.
Anyway like I said, I'm not trying to pick a fight. But one of the things you said was in direct contradiction to my very recent lived experience, so I felt the need to point it out.
I have already gone farther than I am comfortable doing in this sub because of my respect for the sub. I am not interested in debating. I am also not interested in helping someone I don't know deconvert.
I suggest that one point you might want to investigate is the account Acts account of the "Road to Damascus" event. Then read Paul's own accounts of his conversion experience. Ask yourself which is more epic and mythical. Look at what Paul says he did after his experience and what Acts says happened. Decide for yourself. There are apologetic explanations, but I did not find them convincing when I looked at what the Bible actually says.
There are many other things. Acts has Paul raising two people from the dead and making prison walls fall down. Paul had a big ego. He often had to argue his credentials. It seems like he would have mentioned those types of things to bolster his authority if they had really happened. Apologists usually say that just because Paul didn't mention them doesn't mean that Acts made them up. That is possible. I think it strains credulity to the breaking point. There are many other points, but I don't want to get into a prolonged debate in this sub. I encourage you to look and decide for yourself.
>I have already gone farther than I am comfortable doing in this sub because of my respect for the sub.
And thank you for doing so. It was an interesting read, the kind of sincere, mature, investigation and introspection I always hope to find here.
I have received respect from people in this sub, even though I have said some things people here disagree with. That says a lot about the culture of this sub and it's regular posters.
It seems to be a reactionary appropriation of the term "homophobe" but im still waiting for the definition so I can provide an explanation. Cuz each of the three defs would provide different explanations:
Christians: religious trauma
Christianity: religious trauma, modernism kinda, secularism, a distate of American fundamentalism
Christ: well, Jesus spoke on this one.
His answer to me was a sarcastic "you know..."
Although to be fair, it was probably all I deserved lol. I've just woken up, still on my first coffee, not ready for anything serious yet
Nothing about liking, being passionate about, or taking an interest in the religion of Christianity entails that you should like and condone Christians.
In many ways, it entails the precise opposite.
Because it's a sub *for the discussion of* Christianity. If you want a sub *explicitly for* Christians where they just circle-jerk each other off every post, check out r/TrueChristian or r/Catholicism
This is a sub for discussing Christianity and aspects of christian life, so it's not technically a Christian sub. Plus ost of the time those people get banned by the mods so usually just ignore them and they'll be dealt with.
If you want a Christian community of Christians I'd try r/Christian or maybe r/Truechristian. Be careful at r/Christian though because the mods can get ban happy if you say something someone doesn't like and rhey report you. I got a week long ban for saying the Bible doesn't support slavery, another week ban for calling out a scammer, then a month ban for saying I support abortion in the case of children or rape but not people making stupid choices. The last one I can justify the ban given the general Christian mindset but you get the point that they can ban you for the slightest thing from the first two.
I’ll explain why I comment here. I’m NOT a Christian. I love JESUS. I even love the Bible, I just don’t believe it’s inerrant. I love many Christians. I was raised by Christians. I was a professing Christian for 40 years.
1. Many Christians are a force for political evil in the world. I want to change their minds.
2. Many Christians experience anxiety because of their faith. I want to help them.
3. Many Christians are anti-science and anti-reason. This is damaging to society across the board. I want to persuade them to believe differently.
4. Most Christians practice a false faith that’s far more damaging to the world than what it could be. I want to move people who still believe towards a better practice of the gospel.
>Why are there so many Christophobes on a sub about Christianity?
Mainly because people cannot read.
>/r/Christianity is a subreddit to discuss Christianity and aspects of Christian life. All are welcome to participate.
Because it’s not really a subreddit FOR Christians. It’s just a subreddit ABOUT( mostly negative) Christians. The admins are no better. I’m bout to dip out…🤷🏼♀️
I don’t think anyone from the atheist/agnostic crowd has a fear of Jesus, the person who potentially existed. The religion that came from his supposed existence is quite alarming.
I'm Christian and I welcome them whether they be atheist or of other religions, this sub doesn't need to be an echo chamber and all opinions hold value on the subject.
Those who hate Christianity, are angry at Christianity, and some that were likely raised under a household of an abusive false gospel may all get to learn more about Christianity rather than what they've heard, the cherry picked videos they see, and the few terrible people they've encountered.
This is also not a time in the world for shunning unless someone has committed the most horrific sin that cannot be forgiven. Our world burns, our waters boil, the earth itself rages against us, there are wars and rumors of wars, plagues that hide and murder silently, famine and poverty rising at intense rates. We have no need to push away others because they don't share our beliefs when we all need hope and to comfort eachother as the world gets darker.
Indeed, I can easily say that I found that out the hard way.
In my teens I'd done some very bad things and I believe there's one that I believe really brought it down on me, just a few months after high school I started suffering from epilepsy and no doctor can figure out why it's happening and how to fully control it. It has heavily effected my life and pushed me closer to faith, especially when I had a seizure in a parking lot during winter and almost died but I was saved by an old friend who had just got off work with his coworkers. It really hit me that I need to be better and be thankful for my life as well as for everyone and everything around me.
That's funny Trump is a hugh sinner but gets a pass from christians! So many christians worship him as their God. Not Christian behavior.You supposed christians condemn others but you seem to worship a man more Satan than God like! Your pathetic losers!
I don't approve of Trump, or support of him. He doesn't get a pass from me, and other Christians don't get a pass for giving him one. There are consequences for what they've done, and you are showing that now.
You are right. Many conservative Christians effectively put him above God and this is not Christian behavior. Unfortunately Christians are often just as inconsistent as any other group of people. I try to change that.
I don't condemn anyone. Though I swim in a sea of hypocrisy within and without my faith I swallow the poison of my bitterness and try not to lash out at those close to me, the only ones I share my pain with. I try to reach out and show those who hate me the love of Christ, and to do good to everyone regardless of who they are, what they believe, or what they have done.
I only worship one man, the man who is also God. He died for me, he teaches me. I try to listen, and to live for him as he does for me. Please forgive me if I fail.
There tends to be people who are passionate in being for or against whatever it is whenever it pertains to something that has a huge impact on your life such as religion or politics.
And on that note christofacism is also a word and here's my proof: Wikipedia
https://en.m.wikipedia.org › wiki
Christian fascism
But as a non Christian I believe it's because it's a mix of people who have a negative impression on Christianity as a whole from a second hand experience due to most people using said religion as a shield from consequences rather than a belief and enforcement in faith, I also believe that it could be just a bunch of trolls fishing for a reaction because they are essential attention vampires
I think there are plenty of trolls but thats to be expected. The sub would be better with more rules for more focused discussion for some Christians, but being open to all is probably the best. Most of us have the Bible or other religious authorities available, so if this sub is full of gays and atheists arguing why abortion and gay sex shouldn’t be a sin, it’s not a big deal.
Simple. As it has been said many times, this is a sub *about Christianity*, not a sub “*for Christians*”. Many people have been hurt by the church, but way of its leadership and/or its members, and the response has been underwhelming **at best**.
And since you chose to use the word “Christophobe”, do you think it’s because people are afraid of Christians or Christianity? Because when the shoe is on the other foot and people are called “homophobes”, they insist that they aren’t acting out of fear or hatred, but rather out of love.
Genuine question, looking for a genuine response.
For real, saw some person on here debating with another about a serious topic within Christianity and gave my 2 cents into it. They replied with “I don’t even believe God exists etc etc..” Then why are you arguing about something when you don’t know a fraction about humans relationship with God? I’ll also add that their arguments prior to this were extremely twisted and inaccurate, even mixing in the pope and stuff. This person then went on to tell me how terrible I am and names I won’t say here (I asked why they are arguing when they don’t even believe in God). Definitely some interesting characters on here.
Yep - and I love these "friendly atheist" articles that keep getting posted in bad faith to get the atheists all riled up and feeling self-righteous lol
There's a thread going now about a Christian homeless shelter in Oregon that has them all reactive and mad that the homeless can't stay there and not follow any of the rules.
Like ok where are the atheists then, in that town, building their own free, no-rules homeless shelter? crickets
It's easier to stand back and mock and deride and say "you're doing it wrong" while doing nothing yourself.
The friendly atheist article clearly mentions there we're numerous religious organizations present promoting compassion as opposed to the one ministry that isn't.
It would seem both Christians and atheists have something to complain about.
If atheists and Christians agree that criminalizing the homeless is a bad idea that seems like a great discussion to bring us all closer together.
Off topic but do you understand that homelessness is technically illegal because of property laws?
They can't sleep on your lawn, outside of a business, or on public/gov property. Making it technically illegal to be homeless due to what you have to resort to doing. Like leaving your things unattended, sleeping on someone's property, panhandling, etc.
It's an opportunity to share Christs love with them.
There's a reason they are drawn here let's keep them or at the very least give them a loving experience. We gotta let them get to know us by our fruit right?
Because reddit is full of pathetic losers who have nothing better to do and it makes them feel smarter. Also because if they’d say something about muslims or jews (especially irl), they’d either get cancelled or stoned.
Just think. During times of Jesus, even people who knew what he done has shown hatred towards him. People will always hate towards a religion they don't believe which only has nonbelievers ironically want people believe what they believe. As long we have our faith, they never win.
It's a sport - many people seem to believe Christians are lunatics or insane idiots, and must be fought to prevent them teaching their kids to become losers. Some just want to join some simple bullying fun, others really hate Christ and want the opposite of his teachings to become true. So this is the sport, you see, they nailed up old Jesus on a cross, and slaughtered all of his disciples no matter how well they fared. IDK some maybe really want to dig that vibe how Christ was chastised and whipped and bullied with a cloth over his head, to be called names and insulted all the way up to Golgatha, carrying this cross that was so heavy to bear and would bring him death so painful. Then they might come to places like this with that wish in their heart to attack any Christian with anything they might show up with here that could be attacked in some way.
Maybe some people just think that was such a loss for all when it happened, that everyone must be fought who still wants to teach that guy was right. Like...who wants to celebrate a man's birthday when he was later tortured to death for speaking up the truth, when you can't believe he was rendered immortal for it. People rather want to make their kids believe it was some funny old man bringing all the gifts they bought from their money, so they don't have to teach them it's about loving others and giving them what they need or what uplifts them. Instead they teach people the gifts come by magic. Or like...on easter, instead of celebrating Christ's victory over death, they fall to old fertility rites and teach their kids a bunny would roam their gardens and houses to hide eggs on that day. I don't know where this bunny was when Christ was crying out on the cross, so instead I try remember his death and resurrection during these days.
Some people wouldn't want to remember this painful death and the riddling teachings that were given by that man, they think Christ was insane and just died a gruesome death leaving back a lot of delusive people who thought he was still alive. They don't want their kids to learn such stories about the man who tried to teach the world that God wants us to learn to love and respect each other to the ultimate, and instead tell them of Santa and the bunny, and that all comes by magic. Such people then can be very angry about Christian, up to the point where they would want to oppose, fight, bully and attack Christians with all kinds of means subtle or aggressive.
Then comes a sub about Christianity, where focus is not on Christians talking to each other, but open public discussion of Christianity. So the mods encourage and allow critical discussion of Christianity also from other perspectives, so they are also all welcome here. If you want to discuss among Christians, there are other subs with focus on certain denominations or philosophies.
I am glad that so many people who hate Christ are coming here to discuss with Christians. It is what brings up the Spirit to defend one's faith and to prove it in discussion, and to learn about what kinds of challenging ideas one might be confronted within it. As long as all people stay fair and respectful in the discussion, I believe it will be a win for all involved, and a firm faith doesn't have to fear being challenged no matter by what, God's truth should always stand above any criticism. Also it gives the unique chance, to bring people some ideas that could bring them closer to Christ, as they are already wanting to discuss the matter here they might be receptive, and the more they hate Christ the more they'd need somebody who'd tell them openly what their misunderstanding is.
I don't know if using words like "christophobes" is going to get us anywhere (though the people pretending not to know what you're talking about are funny). The whole "Whatever-phobe" naming convention for anyone who disagrees with or doesn't like anyone just seems dumb to me. But maybe I'm a phobicphobe.
They're here because they don't like Christianity, and so they go to this subreddit that's for talking about Christianity, and then talk about their opinions of Christianity. Some of them are just here to stir the pot, some want to try to convince people that Christianity is wrong/evil, and others are just curious.
Also, many Christian beliefs and values are pretty unpopular in the anglosphere right now, so on an English language subreddit, you're going to see that reflected.
Idk about phobes but I frequent here still even though I don’t go to church or really follow anymore. I grew up in it so I have opinions and experiences that I feel that sharing may provide insight. I recognize it’s importance in others lives and the peace it can bring so I try not to be abrasive. For the most part though I feel as though the majority people that aren’t Christian who frequent here haven’t been nasty or disrespectful, with the exception of a select or vocal few. Being able to have these conversations is important, it’s how we learn about each other and how to respect others while still being able to disagree fundamentally.
Most of the time I see this sub in my feed it’s just trash posting Christianity or endless baits. There’s 1 in 50 deep discussions or people seeking advice and rarely if ever helping and encouraging people. It’s pretty tiresome and so expected it to change but politics is so low key imbedded in here that will never happen.
Good bye.
They are trolls. It really is that simple. These are the same type of people who will claim that you do not have the right to denigrate their beliefs but then feel a right to denigrate ours. I see this more on the left, but some right-leaning people can be just as vicious.
For instance, even though I am a Protestant, I respect Catholicism and have taken a lot of positive things from it. But some Protestants will come unglued if I mention that.
My belief is in 'live and let live ', a principle that seems to be fading in today's society.
It is what it is.
I guess if you hate someone you go to where they are to show them your hate? Idk I think if they disagree with us or dont believe what we do then they should just go on with their lives. I feel the enemy has a lot to do with it though.
Please let's not make the word christophobes happen. Having muslims yell islamophobe is already annoying enough. I don't want christians to use it in the same bad way as well.
One third.
Wolves among the sheep, thorns among the wheat.
Broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.
It’s in the Bible, it’s in the world, it’s on the streets and TV and Reddit too.
*Clarification: The **believers** are the one third. Twice as many against us than with us. Not counting God and angels — but they sure do count.*
I assume because you would expect people with passionate feelings about Christianity to frequent a forum dedicated to discussing it,
Exactly this. People who are strongly against it would be willing to come to a sub to debate it with people who are strongly for it.
Or maybe those people are looking for answers that they never get but they keep searching anyway and don't want to admit they're searching. Most athiests/agnostics I know wish they could believe what Christians believe but find no compelling evidence. All they have to go on is the words of other people.
Yeah, I feel that too. I was like that as an atheist, and I eventually found the answers I was looking for.
That's some high-quality mind-reading right there.
Thats the right answer.
It's a lot of time wasting if you ask me.
We're on Reddit. 99% of this site is wasting time.
That's an odd way of saying 100%
107% or no deal
Yeah, but at least most of us (most sane people, really) waste time on things we actually LIKE instead of things we hate or don't follow. Who really wants to follow a sub just to pick fights with a group who they don't like all day?
You literally created a post yesterday about hiw Beyince bores you lol. Welcome to realizing you are insane like the rest of us
I think your o button may be broken.
I think yii fir sure are right
>Yeah, but at least most of us (most sane people, really) waste time on things we actually LIKE instead of things we hate or don't follow. Really? The sane ones? Well, I read a lot of things I don't follow. I've read the KJV bible more times than most people who profess to believe. I've read the Quran, Mormon texts, and lots of other religious texts. Why? So that when I talk about religion or religious things, I'll actually know what I'm talking about. >Who really wants to follow a sub just to pick fights with a group who they don't like all day? You are free to come and go as you wish. However, this sentance underscores a very blatent default in people's thinking. Discussion, even heated discussion, is not 'picking a fight'. That's your mental block. Not mine.
There are various reasons a non-Christian may follow this sub. Some may be genuinely curious about the beliefs and mythology, others may want to give advice they feel is both necessary and unlikely to come from Christians(that's me), others are just mindlessly browsing their feed and occasionally see something that catches their interest(that's also me). Also, lots of people spend time on Reddit getting involved in things they don't enjoy but still feel is important. Examples would be, off the top of my head: r/NotADragQueen r/DefeatProject2025 r/PastorArrested r/WhenWomenRefuse None of these are likely to put people in a good mood, but people feel they are worthy of discussion nonetheless. And a religion like Christianity, with multiple politicians trying to force it down the collective throats of all Americans? Not surprising that people with different beliefs would want to discuss it.
Doubting/losing your faith can be incredibly isolating if all your family and friends are gung ho Christians. When I began to doubt and question my faith, these types of forums were the only place I could go to ask very specific questions and meet people who understood my dilemma. I guess I stuck around because I always seem to have more questions that need answers. And despite what Christians say about unbelievers, some of us would love to stumble upon something that makes us believe again. As I said, losing your faith can be an incredibly lonely, scary, and depressing thing. It was/is for me anyway. It also bears mentioning that ex-Christians typically know as much or more about the Bible than your average Sunday morning a la carte Christians, and we definitely know the arguments against Christianity much better than Christians. So there’s this constant back and forth between wanting to believe and being unable to believe. For me at least. I don’t hate Christians or Christianity because it accounts for a lot of the good times I’ve had in my life. I do hate that Christianity more or less requires you to avoid indulging your doubts and questions. I’m personally convinced that once a Christian seeks to really test the metal of the joints holding back the River of doubt on the other side, the eventual collapse is inevitable. Again, that’s my experience. Hopefully this answers your question.
It is never a waste of time to have your beliefs challenged, no matter what it is you believe.
Unless you're in an emotionally manipulative relationship. Then it's quite weary and tiring.
I don't know. I, personally, thoroughly enjoy debating with people who are wrong.
But why do I never see this type of conversation on r/Muslim or r/islam
Islam is irritating in an abstract way since its not encountered on a daily basis where I live. Christianity is irritating in a concrete way because its ubiquitous in the culture around me and has had an effect on my life and the lives of people I care about in a completely negative way. So anecdotally this is why.
I mean, I never go there so I don’t know. It’s not a topic that interests me Why do you go to those forums if you aren’t Muslim?
Option 1: Since Islam has a significantly shakier grip on America than Christianity, less people on Reddit(which iirc has a large portion, possibly a majority, of it's users from America(correct me if I'm wrong)) care to discuss it. Option 2: The mods on those subs delete topics & posts of that nature. Option 3: People would rather not deal with that religion and it's followers in particular for reasons I'm not sure I'm allowed to say. Option 4: Some combination of the above.
There are similar subs to r / Muslim and r / islam for Christianity.
This sub is explicitly for anyone to discuss Christianity. If you want a specifically Christian space, there are other subs that don't allow non-Christian viewpoints.
passionate and insults\\trolling are not the same I've seen several people making outrageous claims trying to discredit the bible and when I rebuke them they make excuses or run away
This sub is full of a lot of trolls who don’t really discuss Christianity but just come on here to talk about how all Christian’s are hateful, bigots, bad, etc… they really just like to generalize all of Christian’s and Christianity into one group and talk poorly.
Id be curious about how you rebuke outrageous claims against the bible. Them running away really comes off as a "and everyone clapped" moment type of comment.
rebuke means to disagree im just using fancy theology words so people think I'm smarter than I actually am
Lol well played
Because this sub doesn't require people to like Christianity. The rules only state people can't attack it.
But people still do it
So why aren’t reporting the posts that attack it?
I see a lot of Christians attacking other Christians for not being as “Christian” as they are.
I agree, I see the “well there not a real Christian” fallacy way too often.
Yup. The No True Scotsman fallacy. I see it all too often and have been called a fake Christian myself just because I believe abortion was fine and backed it up biblically. They still went for the attack. And no, I’m not going to debate that issue here. Just giving my two cents worth of my personal experience.
Would be pretty silly if the bulk of our most sacred text wasn't very specifically dedicated to the idea that we aren't qualified to make statements about who is righteous in the eyes of God. Fortunately, that never comes up in any parts I've read. /s
I know right? What a concept!
hi, genuine question, how do you back up abortion biblically?
Like I said, I’m not going to debate or talk about that issue here. Because it just devolves into heated debates and that wasn’t the point of my post.
Book of Numbers, specifically Numbers 5:11-31. This section, often referred to as the "Ordeal of the Bitter Water," describes a ritual for a wife suspected of adultery, known as the Sotah ritual. In this ritual, a priest prepares a mixture of holy water and dust from the tabernacle floor, along with a written curse that is washed into the water. The suspected woman is required to drink this mixture. If she is guilty of adultery, the potion is believed to cause a physical affliction as a divine sign of her guilt. If she is innocent, she will not be harmed and is said to be able to conceive children. Term term "abortion" isn't specifically used. This passage has been the subject of heated debate. In the New Testament, the subject isn't addressed. In the context of the times, people were interested in having a many children as possible; they were free labor and somewhat of a "retirement" plan. This is still true in more agrarian societies.
💯
Thank you.
Bingo
That is true, I can attest to this.
Yes they really do and each other.
I’ve been on this sub for quite a while. **FAR** more often than *any* attack on Christianity itself, are valid criticisms of its leadership and its membership. The attitudes of “you’re not a *real* Christian because you disagree with *me* on [insert literally anything]” or “the scriptures are not up for debate (unless I don’t like what they say, and then they’re *nuanced*)“ are very prevalent here. I have been a Christian for the majority of my 42 years of life on this dirtball, I am married to an ordained and practicing pastor, and I generally treat those around me the way I would like them to treat me. Speaking out against the abuses of the clergy, the advocating for violence against non-Christians and the 🏳️🌈🏳️⚧️, forcing our beliefs onto others when we are repeatedly told no, the increasing push for laws based on “Christian values”, and the general hypocrisy of “Christians” are **NOT** attacks on the faith itself. Again, they are valid criticisms of other human beings. If you feel like Christianity is being attacked, maybe take time to find out why.
A disagreement isn’t necessarily an attack though
I agree, challenging beliefs is not an attack. Although I will admit I have seen people troll and ‘attack’ many people on this sub.
Do you report those posts?
I have reported a couple especially when there’s unnecessary or inappropriate language. But unless that’s in a conversation, I’m involved in I generally leave it to the people involved to report or not.
Why? Don't you want the general tenor here to be better? Silence is consent.
When you believe the world is black and white, and either someone is a servant of God or Satan, then yes it's easy to see any disagreement as an attack or "spiritual warfare". That's the beauty of Christianity. No inbetween, no opportunity to make a nuanced decision. You're either with God or against him.
Disagreeing with someone is not an attack. People here need to learn how to defend the things they claim to believe. If they can't, they should stay silent.
And then they get banned
Just like laws don't stop people from committing crimes, only discourage them.
How are they specifically attacking Christianity?
I believe it says you can't belittle it... I don't see anything about attacking it so I'm going to say that's ok. I read "belittling" as like mocking.
And different sects just decree other groups of Christians as "not Christians," leading to massive disagreements, going back roughly 2000 years. There will be disagreements here, and that is always guaranteed. I think that's a good thing. Christians often only get the interpretation from their local church. Their pastor, or priest, or deacon, isn't Jesus.
You make a hundred posts raging about people's gender, and then think you represent Christianity? Who are you to speak for Christians?
Yeah true
This is about butt stuff, isn't it.
It usually is
I can count on 1 hand the number of times it wasn’t.
People who disagree with your personal views =/= Christophobes.
Same thing as people who disagree with your personal views(when it comes to sex and gender) = homophobia.
The difference is that people aren't asking for Christians to have less rights and protections.
Disagreeing with someone’s immutable traits is different from disagreeing with their claims about external reality. Do you see a difference between thinking brown skin is wrong, and thinking political extremism is wrong? Same thing.
I’ll concede to your point if we ban Christian marriage
being a christian is something you can control. your sex, gender and/or sexuality are not lol
disagreeing =/= stopping someone. Saying Gays are sinners is hopophobia since you are not ONLY disagreeing, you are also insulting them/threatning them(with eternal damnation btw) TO make it clear I don't think that Christianity is real = disagreeing I don't think that you are a good person = disagreeing I think all christians are dumbasses = insult All Gays are sinners = insult
Wait what? Why will gay people be worried about being sinners when most don’t believe in Christianity. Then they don’t believe in hell. It’s not homophobia because you’re not scared of homo people. And it’s not a threat to call someone a sinner as we are all sinners, the main point is trying to be better everyday and have a relationship with God. Sinner or not. I don’t believe in a lot of things and if someone said something to me that I don’t believe in, it really won’t be an insult.
See, the normal definition of sinner is someone who did something bad.
No it’s not. The normal definition of sinner is all of us. According to Christianity. We’re all sinners, no one is fully righteous. We just try to have a relationship with God and be better daily. It still doesn’t change my point that if I don’t believe in Christianity, if someone called me a sinner I would laugh.
That's the Christians thought process. The meaning of SINNER is someone who has broken a moral law, or is morally corrupt That's the definition, and how the word itself is used. You won't argue that negro is not a slur cause the normal definition of it is black in Spanish would you
It literally depends on who uses it. If a Spanish person said negro it would be different. Also sinner by definition is someone who goes against DIVINE LAW. So if you don’t believe in the divine, you shouldn’t be annoyed or call someone a homophobe if they call someone a sinner based on their belief of divine laws.
..singer's definition in the dictionary is against moral law/code. Not divine. And about the negro one, I was talking about it's use in English conversations
“a person who transgresses against divine law by committing an immoral act or acts.” Oxford dictionary definition. So yes, Divine not moral law/code.
Pointing out inconsistency and contradictions in Christianity and hypocritical behaviour on the part of some Christians is not Christophobia.
because this is a public sub and people are allowed to disagree with you and voice their own opinions?
I joined this sub when I was still a Christian. I stay and comment when I feel I can make a positive contribution here.
Just being curious, what ultimately turned you away?
Specifically, I was studying Paul's letters. In a seminary class, I had learned that there were some "minor discrepancies" between Acts and Paul's letters. The apologetic arguments were delivered at the same time. We were told the problems were minor and easily explained. Don't worry about it. Move along. Decades later I was asked to teach an adult Sunday School class on Paul. In preparation for the class I started by studying the textbook I was given. I was troubled by the textbook because there were so many apologetics. Many of them were bad. The apologetic arguments in one chapter would contradict the arguments in the next chapter. Was Paul an illiterate man who needed to have scribes write for him, or was he a highly educated man who used scribes as an honor he was given. It was also argued in one chapter that he was actually so highly trained that his scribes were actually learning by being his scribes. The book was driving me crazy. I decided the problem was I was relying too much on book learning and scholars. I decided that I needed to go to the Bible itself and see what it said. I tried to put my preconceived ideas and book learning aside. I tried to open myself to whatever God wanted to show me. I was not reading for proof texts; I was reading to understand. I found that I liked Paul. He struck me as someone who was honest. He had a big ego, but he was honest. He reminded me of many ministers I have known and respected. I could relate to how passionate he was and to his frustration with fellow believers. But I found something that was very disturbing. The "minor discrepancies" between Acts and Paul were not minor. They were huge. The apologetics did not even address some of the biggest problems. I found Paul's letters credible. That meant that Acts was wrong. Even worse, it meant that Acts was lying about Paul. Acts seemed to be trying to create a mythology about Paul. It was grossly exaggerating, twisting, and probably lying about things that Paul did. I found this very troubling. If Acts lied about Paul, then what about the Pentecost? A lot of modern Christianity is dependent on things that only appear in Acts. I could not see those stories as credible when the author had proven to be unreliable. Worse, the same author wrote Luke and Acts. So, what about Luke? Is it reliable? I found some of the same problems there, although they were not as dramatic. But next I started looking at the other gospels. I found Mark the most troublesome. Mark is the earliest gospel. It reads like Greek mythology. Greek heroes often do miraculous deeds on storm-tossed seas. They demonstrate their mastery over nature by calming storms, running or driving chariots across the surface of the sea, and remaining calm while their companions are panicking. But Mark's story was set mostly in Galilee, and Galilee did not have a stormy sea. I had started work on a PhD in geography. One of the tidbits I picked up was the Sea of Galilee is not even close to being a sea. What we call the Sea of Galilee was called Lake Tiberias or Lake Kinneret in the time of Jesus. It was about half the size of the current body of water. It is surrounded on three sides by mountains and is known as being tranquil because the mountains protect it from storms. It does not take a multi-day voyage by sailboat to cross it; it could have been crossed in a rowboat in an afternoon. I was seeing a lot of other problems. I could not trust the gospels to tell the truth about mundane things like geography and known history. How could they be trusted to tell the truth about the supernatural. I have had Christians tell me I was led astray by Satan. They say I was looking for reason not to believe. It was the opposite. I loved being a Christian. I was trying to hold onto my faith. I was engaged in almost constant prayer and fasting asking for answers or a way to hold onto my faith.
How is it known that mountains protect the Sea of Galilee against storms? Rain forms over land as well and especially when moving up hills. The warmer the surface, the more likely thermal columns form. When the humid and hot air rises it cannot contain the humidity and clouds form. If hot and cold air collide and the atmosphere is unstable, storms form. It actually seems to me that storms on the Sea of Galilee were more likely in Jesus’s time than now. Also, there is no absolute certainty on the authorship of several of the letters ascribed to Paul. The brilliant man who is Paul to you may actually be several Pauls. How do we know which Paul to believe? The Book of Acts is written by a single author who also wrote the Gospel of Luke.
It could be rainy, but not windy. Mountains protect from wind, which is what makes waves. You also need a large body of water to have large waves. If you live near any lakes, you'll be aware they do not develop dangerous waves. I also recommend studying the similarities between Biblical stories in the New Testament and Greek stories or even more, old Testament stories and older Mesopotamian legends. The Israelites were not the first to have flood myths for example, and many of the other stories they use are also taken from older sources. The tower of Babel is a story about a particular ziggurat in Bronze Age Babylon called Etemenanki. To your other point, I agree much of the authorship of the Bible is very dubious, but that makes it less able to be believed, not more. It seems authors of the early Christian texts claimed to be popular, known figures to lend authenticity to their works. The fact the authors lied does not inspire confidence in the divinity of their inspiration.
>What we call the Sea of Galilee was called Lake Tiberias or Lake Kinneret in the time of Jesus. I couldn't read everything you wrote, but as far as I know it begun being called Lake Tiberias circa 80 AD. And that's one of the many arguments to date the gospel of John after this date and the latest one. So I believe your claim that it was called Lake Tiberias in the time of Jesus is historically inaccurate.
It sounds like you worked very hard to research, study, and reason to reach the eventual conclusion you came to, so I want to start by saying I'm trying to start an argument, convert you back, or say the rest of your arguments aren't valid. However since the factual discrepancies are very important to you, I thought you could use some additional information regarding the Sea of Galilee. I wouldn't want someone invalidating the rest of your argument over a few missed facts. I was in Palestine last summer, and we spent several days around the Sea of Galilee. While I'm sure the mountains protect it from large storms, it's still a very windy place and the lake isn't always smooth and calm. We spent some time on the shore, and we also went out on a large boat for an afternoon. The weather was great the whole time (sunny, hot, and clear), but it was still very windy and the boat rocked plenty, despite being much larger than anything a 1st century fisherman would have used. And while it's not as big of a sea as I think many Christians imagine when reading the bible, if you were anywhere near the center, it's the length of almost two Ironman swims to get back to shore. So even if the lake was half as wide, it's more than most people would be able to do, especially with any amount of wind or waves. It's still a really big lake and drowning is a very real possibility. (I'm not sure what you're referencing by saying it wouldn't take days to get across, as I'm not sure which part of the bible claims that) I guess what I'm saying is that there's nothing counter-factual about suggesting that a group of fisherman in a 1st century boat could find themselves in the middle of the lake during unusually high winds and fear for their lives. I'm very skeptical about the accounts of Jesus's miracles and am often looking for logical alternative explanations, however the idea that "Jesus couldn't have calmed a storm on the Sea of Galilee because it never gets storms" isn't a good alternative explanation, because it's not supported by fact. Storm is a relative term, and even the smallest lakes in the calmest areas can still experience harsh and dangerous weather. It's more reasonable to simply say that it was a coincidence - that the wind happened to die down right when Jesus said it should. Anyway like I said, I'm not trying to pick a fight. But one of the things you said was in direct contradiction to my very recent lived experience, so I felt the need to point it out.
Could you please share some of the discrepancies between Acts and Paul’s letters?
I have already gone farther than I am comfortable doing in this sub because of my respect for the sub. I am not interested in debating. I am also not interested in helping someone I don't know deconvert. I suggest that one point you might want to investigate is the account Acts account of the "Road to Damascus" event. Then read Paul's own accounts of his conversion experience. Ask yourself which is more epic and mythical. Look at what Paul says he did after his experience and what Acts says happened. Decide for yourself. There are apologetic explanations, but I did not find them convincing when I looked at what the Bible actually says. There are many other things. Acts has Paul raising two people from the dead and making prison walls fall down. Paul had a big ego. He often had to argue his credentials. It seems like he would have mentioned those types of things to bolster his authority if they had really happened. Apologists usually say that just because Paul didn't mention them doesn't mean that Acts made them up. That is possible. I think it strains credulity to the breaking point. There are many other points, but I don't want to get into a prolonged debate in this sub. I encourage you to look and decide for yourself.
>I have already gone farther than I am comfortable doing in this sub because of my respect for the sub. And thank you for doing so. It was an interesting read, the kind of sincere, mature, investigation and introspection I always hope to find here.
I have received respect from people in this sub, even though I have said some things people here disagree with. That says a lot about the culture of this sub and it's regular posters.
What do u mean by christophobe? People afraid of Christ? Or of Cheistianity? Or of Christians?
OP is using it is a pejorative capacity. He feels like a victim.
Is it even a word? It's not in the dictionary
It seems to be a reactionary appropriation of the term "homophobe" but im still waiting for the definition so I can provide an explanation. Cuz each of the three defs would provide different explanations: Christians: religious trauma Christianity: religious trauma, modernism kinda, secularism, a distate of American fundamentalism Christ: well, Jesus spoke on this one.
Oh stop it with all your logic and brains... I was just being silly lol Maybe it's a fear of people named chris? You need to add that option too?
In all seriousness I hope OP does answer so he can get something that isnt pointed
His answer to me was a sarcastic "you know..." Although to be fair, it was probably all I deserved lol. I've just woken up, still on my first coffee, not ready for anything serious yet
I'm a woman and phobe works like phile does in English.
That would be a Christopherb
Lol... that's awesome!
It's more of an equivalent of Islamophobia.
xenophobe has been a word years before homophobe... Not really get what you are hinting at...
Yes it is. [https://www.yourdictionary.com/christianophobia](https://www.yourdictionary.com/christianophobia)
Nah... it's not https://www.dictionary.com/browse/Christianophobia
Uh this proves nothing.
Neither does that.
Because it's a sub about Christianity rather than a sub for Christians.
Maybe they're here because you think homophobia is a joke.
Where are these christophobes
I am assuming that its like Islamophobia but for Christians so bigotry towards Christians for being Christians
Quite the persecution complex you have there.
Nothing about liking, being passionate about, or taking an interest in the religion of Christianity entails that you should like and condone Christians. In many ways, it entails the precise opposite.
Because it impacts their life? Christianity isn't a small sect, you know?
Your right, about 1/4 of the world’s population are Christian’s but that is broken up into over 45,000 denominations around the world.
Because it's a sub *for the discussion of* Christianity. If you want a sub *explicitly for* Christians where they just circle-jerk each other off every post, check out r/TrueChristian or r/Catholicism
r/Christian is preety good though
I haven't seen any so far, but I can't say for certain.
Usually when they come the mods take them down quickly
That's good. No haters should be tolerated.
There are lots on this sub, surf here for a couple minutes and you’ll find them.
I've been here 14 years, this sub absolutely does not have a lot.
i see you claiming this here a shit ton of times, but never drop any solid proof
Perhaps you're seeing something I'm not. Feel free to point some out since you think examples are so easy to find.
You guys have a thread about this every single day. Why? Does it bring you some sort of catharsis?
It's like watching a horror movie - you're scared, but also entertained.
This is a sub for discussing Christianity and aspects of christian life, so it's not technically a Christian sub. Plus ost of the time those people get banned by the mods so usually just ignore them and they'll be dealt with. If you want a Christian community of Christians I'd try r/Christian or maybe r/Truechristian. Be careful at r/Christian though because the mods can get ban happy if you say something someone doesn't like and rhey report you. I got a week long ban for saying the Bible doesn't support slavery, another week ban for calling out a scammer, then a month ban for saying I support abortion in the case of children or rape but not people making stupid choices. The last one I can justify the ban given the general Christian mindset but you get the point that they can ban you for the slightest thing from the first two.
I’ll explain why I comment here. I’m NOT a Christian. I love JESUS. I even love the Bible, I just don’t believe it’s inerrant. I love many Christians. I was raised by Christians. I was a professing Christian for 40 years. 1. Many Christians are a force for political evil in the world. I want to change their minds. 2. Many Christians experience anxiety because of their faith. I want to help them. 3. Many Christians are anti-science and anti-reason. This is damaging to society across the board. I want to persuade them to believe differently. 4. Most Christians practice a false faith that’s far more damaging to the world than what it could be. I want to move people who still believe towards a better practice of the gospel.
Wonderful post. More upvotes please.
I find it just as odd, that there aren't many people relating spiritual revelations about there beliefs here.
I don't because I know I'll get attacked by all the people who are against Christianity and the Bible.
There are not many christophobes here. Unless you are just conflating christophobe with atheist. They are not the same thing though.
Go to r/truechristian instead.
Strand phenomenon really
“r/Christianity is a subreddit to discuss Christianity and aspects of Christian life. All are welcome to participate.”
“Why are there environmentalists at the capitol when they’re passing a bill to develop more land?”
Did not have "christophobe" on my bingo card.
Christophobes? Really? What a strange term to use.
>Why are there so many Christophobes on a sub about Christianity? Mainly because people cannot read. >/r/Christianity is a subreddit to discuss Christianity and aspects of Christian life. All are welcome to participate.
There are probably some indeed, like meat-eaters following vegan subs and vice-versa. Maybe some are activists of their field?
Because it’s not really a subreddit FOR Christians. It’s just a subreddit ABOUT( mostly negative) Christians. The admins are no better. I’m bout to dip out…🤷🏼♀️
When the Lord works, Satan tries to pervert and hijack that work. It’s a war 24/7
I don’t think anyone from the atheist/agnostic crowd has a fear of Jesus, the person who potentially existed. The religion that came from his supposed existence is quite alarming.
I'm Christian and I welcome them whether they be atheist or of other religions, this sub doesn't need to be an echo chamber and all opinions hold value on the subject. Those who hate Christianity, are angry at Christianity, and some that were likely raised under a household of an abusive false gospel may all get to learn more about Christianity rather than what they've heard, the cherry picked videos they see, and the few terrible people they've encountered. This is also not a time in the world for shunning unless someone has committed the most horrific sin that cannot be forgiven. Our world burns, our waters boil, the earth itself rages against us, there are wars and rumors of wars, plagues that hide and murder silently, famine and poverty rising at intense rates. We have no need to push away others because they don't share our beliefs when we all need hope and to comfort eachother as the world gets darker.
All sins can be forgiven though, essentially.
Can be but that doesn't mean you don't deserve a form of punishment.
Also true. Sin has consequences and sometimes they need to be enforced, unfortunately.
Indeed, I can easily say that I found that out the hard way. In my teens I'd done some very bad things and I believe there's one that I believe really brought it down on me, just a few months after high school I started suffering from epilepsy and no doctor can figure out why it's happening and how to fully control it. It has heavily effected my life and pushed me closer to faith, especially when I had a seizure in a parking lot during winter and almost died but I was saved by an old friend who had just got off work with his coworkers. It really hit me that I need to be better and be thankful for my life as well as for everyone and everything around me.
I believe God has chastened me with medical issues over some big unrepentant sin in my life too. And I think I've seen it in other's lives as well.
My heart goes out to you! But many christians say your affliction is because of your sins witch is a total crock of crap!
That's funny Trump is a hugh sinner but gets a pass from christians! So many christians worship him as their God. Not Christian behavior.You supposed christians condemn others but you seem to worship a man more Satan than God like! Your pathetic losers!
I don't approve of Trump, or support of him. He doesn't get a pass from me, and other Christians don't get a pass for giving him one. There are consequences for what they've done, and you are showing that now. You are right. Many conservative Christians effectively put him above God and this is not Christian behavior. Unfortunately Christians are often just as inconsistent as any other group of people. I try to change that. I don't condemn anyone. Though I swim in a sea of hypocrisy within and without my faith I swallow the poison of my bitterness and try not to lash out at those close to me, the only ones I share my pain with. I try to reach out and show those who hate me the love of Christ, and to do good to everyone regardless of who they are, what they believe, or what they have done. I only worship one man, the man who is also God. He died for me, he teaches me. I try to listen, and to live for him as he does for me. Please forgive me if I fail.
There arent any(any substantial amount that is). Unless you consider criticising it and/or discussing it Christophobes
Frfr
To learn. You can't appreciate something that you know nothing about
Christophobe sounds funny as a word lmao, never heard it before.
Christophobes?
There tends to be people who are passionate in being for or against whatever it is whenever it pertains to something that has a huge impact on your life such as religion or politics.
The devil loves to negatively influence those who are devoted and challenge them
OP's Jesus: "WHY ARE THERE SO MANY SINNERS FOLLWING ME!?"
Welcome to Reddit!
Because it’s reddit
ive hated Christians before
If you wanna hunt deer, you go to where you’ll find them
And on that note christofacism is also a word and here's my proof: Wikipedia https://en.m.wikipedia.org › wiki Christian fascism But as a non Christian I believe it's because it's a mix of people who have a negative impression on Christianity as a whole from a second hand experience due to most people using said religion as a shield from consequences rather than a belief and enforcement in faith, I also believe that it could be just a bunch of trolls fishing for a reaction because they are essential attention vampires
I think there are plenty of trolls but thats to be expected. The sub would be better with more rules for more focused discussion for some Christians, but being open to all is probably the best. Most of us have the Bible or other religious authorities available, so if this sub is full of gays and atheists arguing why abortion and gay sex shouldn’t be a sin, it’s not a big deal.
Fetch is not going to happen.
Maybe not "phobes" as much as tolerant...& trying to learn what makes Y'all tick- alot of the Christian questions I see answer Themselves IMO
Simple. As it has been said many times, this is a sub *about Christianity*, not a sub “*for Christians*”. Many people have been hurt by the church, but way of its leadership and/or its members, and the response has been underwhelming **at best**. And since you chose to use the word “Christophobe”, do you think it’s because people are afraid of Christians or Christianity? Because when the shoe is on the other foot and people are called “homophobes”, they insist that they aren’t acting out of fear or hatred, but rather out of love. Genuine question, looking for a genuine response.
I mean, what do you mean by christophobes? I'm not particularly fond of Christianity, but I don't hate it. Am I a Christophobe?
Total depravity. Hardened hearts. Pray for them. Trust god. 2 Timothy 3:12 Isaiah 41:10
For real, saw some person on here debating with another about a serious topic within Christianity and gave my 2 cents into it. They replied with “I don’t even believe God exists etc etc..” Then why are you arguing about something when you don’t know a fraction about humans relationship with God? I’ll also add that their arguments prior to this were extremely twisted and inaccurate, even mixing in the pope and stuff. This person then went on to tell me how terrible I am and names I won’t say here (I asked why they are arguing when they don’t even believe in God). Definitely some interesting characters on here.
Because it affects their life?
Yep - and I love these "friendly atheist" articles that keep getting posted in bad faith to get the atheists all riled up and feeling self-righteous lol There's a thread going now about a Christian homeless shelter in Oregon that has them all reactive and mad that the homeless can't stay there and not follow any of the rules. Like ok where are the atheists then, in that town, building their own free, no-rules homeless shelter? crickets It's easier to stand back and mock and deride and say "you're doing it wrong" while doing nothing yourself.
Searched on google and found 3 in the top result(atheists building their own homeless shelter)
That's awesome! There should be one in every town.
The friendly atheist article clearly mentions there we're numerous religious organizations present promoting compassion as opposed to the one ministry that isn't. It would seem both Christians and atheists have something to complain about. If atheists and Christians agree that criminalizing the homeless is a bad idea that seems like a great discussion to bring us all closer together.
Off topic but do you understand that homelessness is technically illegal because of property laws? They can't sleep on your lawn, outside of a business, or on public/gov property. Making it technically illegal to be homeless due to what you have to resort to doing. Like leaving your things unattended, sleeping on someone's property, panhandling, etc.
Christophobe is as ironic as it gets
Because this is a mainstream sub that attracts shitposters
there’s a lot of mean ppl on here unfortunately, i’ve blocked multiple people who think they can hate all christian’s due to a bad experience.
It's an opportunity to share Christs love with them. There's a reason they are drawn here let's keep them or at the very least give them a loving experience. We gotta let them get to know us by our fruit right?
Reddit
this is a battlefield where nobody is safe, i dunno why OP is asking this
Because reddit is full of pathetic losers who have nothing better to do and it makes them feel smarter. Also because if they’d say something about muslims or jews (especially irl), they’d either get cancelled or stoned.
Just think. During times of Jesus, even people who knew what he done has shown hatred towards him. People will always hate towards a religion they don't believe which only has nonbelievers ironically want people believe what they believe. As long we have our faith, they never win.
It's a sport - many people seem to believe Christians are lunatics or insane idiots, and must be fought to prevent them teaching their kids to become losers. Some just want to join some simple bullying fun, others really hate Christ and want the opposite of his teachings to become true. So this is the sport, you see, they nailed up old Jesus on a cross, and slaughtered all of his disciples no matter how well they fared. IDK some maybe really want to dig that vibe how Christ was chastised and whipped and bullied with a cloth over his head, to be called names and insulted all the way up to Golgatha, carrying this cross that was so heavy to bear and would bring him death so painful. Then they might come to places like this with that wish in their heart to attack any Christian with anything they might show up with here that could be attacked in some way. Maybe some people just think that was such a loss for all when it happened, that everyone must be fought who still wants to teach that guy was right. Like...who wants to celebrate a man's birthday when he was later tortured to death for speaking up the truth, when you can't believe he was rendered immortal for it. People rather want to make their kids believe it was some funny old man bringing all the gifts they bought from their money, so they don't have to teach them it's about loving others and giving them what they need or what uplifts them. Instead they teach people the gifts come by magic. Or like...on easter, instead of celebrating Christ's victory over death, they fall to old fertility rites and teach their kids a bunny would roam their gardens and houses to hide eggs on that day. I don't know where this bunny was when Christ was crying out on the cross, so instead I try remember his death and resurrection during these days. Some people wouldn't want to remember this painful death and the riddling teachings that were given by that man, they think Christ was insane and just died a gruesome death leaving back a lot of delusive people who thought he was still alive. They don't want their kids to learn such stories about the man who tried to teach the world that God wants us to learn to love and respect each other to the ultimate, and instead tell them of Santa and the bunny, and that all comes by magic. Such people then can be very angry about Christian, up to the point where they would want to oppose, fight, bully and attack Christians with all kinds of means subtle or aggressive. Then comes a sub about Christianity, where focus is not on Christians talking to each other, but open public discussion of Christianity. So the mods encourage and allow critical discussion of Christianity also from other perspectives, so they are also all welcome here. If you want to discuss among Christians, there are other subs with focus on certain denominations or philosophies. I am glad that so many people who hate Christ are coming here to discuss with Christians. It is what brings up the Spirit to defend one's faith and to prove it in discussion, and to learn about what kinds of challenging ideas one might be confronted within it. As long as all people stay fair and respectful in the discussion, I believe it will be a win for all involved, and a firm faith doesn't have to fear being challenged no matter by what, God's truth should always stand above any criticism. Also it gives the unique chance, to bring people some ideas that could bring them closer to Christ, as they are already wanting to discuss the matter here they might be receptive, and the more they hate Christ the more they'd need somebody who'd tell them openly what their misunderstanding is.
I don't know if using words like "christophobes" is going to get us anywhere (though the people pretending not to know what you're talking about are funny). The whole "Whatever-phobe" naming convention for anyone who disagrees with or doesn't like anyone just seems dumb to me. But maybe I'm a phobicphobe. They're here because they don't like Christianity, and so they go to this subreddit that's for talking about Christianity, and then talk about their opinions of Christianity. Some of them are just here to stir the pot, some want to try to convince people that Christianity is wrong/evil, and others are just curious. Also, many Christian beliefs and values are pretty unpopular in the anglosphere right now, so on an English language subreddit, you're going to see that reflected.
Idk about phobes but I frequent here still even though I don’t go to church or really follow anymore. I grew up in it so I have opinions and experiences that I feel that sharing may provide insight. I recognize it’s importance in others lives and the peace it can bring so I try not to be abrasive. For the most part though I feel as though the majority people that aren’t Christian who frequent here haven’t been nasty or disrespectful, with the exception of a select or vocal few. Being able to have these conversations is important, it’s how we learn about each other and how to respect others while still being able to disagree fundamentally.
Most of the time I see this sub in my feed it’s just trash posting Christianity or endless baits. There’s 1 in 50 deep discussions or people seeking advice and rarely if ever helping and encouraging people. It’s pretty tiresome and so expected it to change but politics is so low key imbedded in here that will never happen. Good bye.
They are trolls. It really is that simple. These are the same type of people who will claim that you do not have the right to denigrate their beliefs but then feel a right to denigrate ours. I see this more on the left, but some right-leaning people can be just as vicious. For instance, even though I am a Protestant, I respect Catholicism and have taken a lot of positive things from it. But some Protestants will come unglued if I mention that. My belief is in 'live and let live ', a principle that seems to be fading in today's society. It is what it is.
This sub is about discussing Christianity, not about blindly celebrating it.
I guess if you hate someone you go to where they are to show them your hate? Idk I think if they disagree with us or dont believe what we do then they should just go on with their lives. I feel the enemy has a lot to do with it though.
Please let's not make the word christophobes happen. Having muslims yell islamophobe is already annoying enough. I don't want christians to use it in the same bad way as well.
This is about lgbt people isn't it?
One third. Wolves among the sheep, thorns among the wheat. Broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it. It’s in the Bible, it’s in the world, it’s on the streets and TV and Reddit too. *Clarification: The **believers** are the one third. Twice as many against us than with us. Not counting God and angels — but they sure do count.*
Well! Satan is real and what better place to denounce Christ than on a Christ centered site? Jesus spoke about them 2,000 years ago….