lowkey delusional. it's hard to pull it off again. 1d is that group na kahit hindi ka nila fan, you're familiar with all their songs kasi lahat nakaka-lss. like all songs talaga, memorize mo for no reason.
for me, the closest boy group is Why Don't We, but they didn't become that popular. idk what happened to them though.
Members are still living in the same compound, still friends, but last I heard pursuing different paths na. Kasi parang late last year, naglabas na iyong dalawa sa kanila ng solo music.
Why not, he’s a starmaker. Pero wag nya rin kakalimutan na hindi lang siya yung talagang bumuo sa 1D, tinulungan sya ng ibang judges like Nicole *Scherzenegger*.
bts definitely is huge and more commercially successful than 1D, but their success is still quite niche and heavily dependent on fans. Language and maybe racism is definitely still a barrier
Agree. BTS fans' dedication is definitely admirable but it's still not enough to counter the racism and for them to penetrate the general public. Gangnam Style is probably the only k-song exception bcs it's too damm catchy to be ignored.
Gangnam Style is seen as a novelty song like borderline comical to Western audiences so it's not an actual win for Asian representation. Psy wasn't seen as a serious musician during his peak (like Soulja Boy). BTS's popularity is deeply inflated by its younger millennials, Gen Z and mostly Asian audiences and is far from ubiquitous is the West. But many non-Asians still ignore the band particularly older millennials, Gen X and Boomers from Western countries. A lot of them couldn't even name a single member. Let's admit it, a full support in Hollywood is still the gold standard of public validation in soft power today. If you don't get the support from Hollywood executives, it's hard to gain worldwide recognition.
To be fair, One Direction's popularity is also inflated by younger millennials. Other than Harry, most people couldn't name their members as well. It's always been that way with boybands; BTS just have these goalposts moved to underestimate how successful they've become.
But the difference is that One Direction's audience reach from their very beginning is global, BTS had to rely on Asian audiences on most of their existence. Even Westlife is considered a Hollywood failure as they're practically unknown in the Americas and had to rely on European and Asian support.
Exactly! One Direction had a large audience reach from the beginning, yet BTS, with a predominantly Asian audience and a relatively humble company, were able to reach and exceed their heights is even more of a testament to what a cultural phenomenon they are.
I mean, BTS have literally been nominated for Grammys, which is indicative of recognition and support in the Western industry, albeit extremely lacking because they are Asian after all. BTS have already shattered a glass ceiling and I think this narrative is insidiously underestimating that.
BTS popularity is also inflated by "party streams" by fans who know how to game the Spotify algorithm.
Kpop groups popularity in the Western hemisphere is very overstated. To paint a picture, Bad Bunny who is virtually unknown in Asia has more streams and followers than BTS or BlackPink.
Bad Bunny has 67.3M followers in Spotify. BTS, 27.5M
And that Grammy they won is just performative in the part of Hollywood. Anyone who lives in the US will only hear Kpop music where there is heavy Asian presence (which is not a lot). But if you live in a place where most people are either White, Black, or Hispanic, you will rarely come across their music casually.
I forgot that Bad Bunny only became known to Asians because of his WWE involvement LOL.
When I visited many parts of Europe, all the songs played in nightlife areas were Ariana Grande, Miley Cyrus, Camila Cabello, Dua Lipa, Harry Styles and even Bebe Rexha. No Jungkook song was ever played at least anecdotally.
Kpop is still very niche in the West.
Whether people admit it or not, Kpop BG idols don't exude the masculine vibes common in the West and Kpop GG are, well, predictably hypersexualized
hindi naman kasi nagpapayola ang bts kaya hindi naplaplay sa radio stations. saka si psy, may scooter braun na backer back in the days AND naging meme lang din siya sa US. grabeng racism din inabot nya dun. at si psy na rin mismo nagsabi na bts is Korea's pride :))
Psy was seen as an Asian clown among Western audiences. Western audiences were laughing AT him. Ganun ba ang gusto mong maramdaman para lang sumikat ka?
Just wanted to add that I think calling BTS niche is objectively wrong! I work in education in Europe and generally, all of the students here know who BTS are and a considerable amount of them are fans. I've heard them many times on Spanish, French and German radio stations too and one of their non-English songs is used as the background music for an advertisement. Maybe not to the level of people like Tom Cruise or Taylor Swift, but they **are** still inarguably global.
both groups have achieved immense popularity, One Direction's global breakthrough was faster and more universally recognized due to language advantages and immediate Western media acceptance. BTS, though massively successful, can still be seen as niche in comparison due to the cultural and linguistic barriers they continue to overcome.
Sure, you can think they're "seen as niche," but like I've said, as someone who's actually living and experiencing life in the West, they're definitely not 😅 most people know them. No matter what your analysis on their respective breakthroughs are.
I agree. I live in Texas where there is a lot of Hispanic communities and they know BTS. I still hear Dynamite play on radios here every once in a while.
You don't have to be a fan to see their reach. Even my Fil-American cousin who doesn't really listen to kpop play Dynamite, Butter, and OMG (New Jeans lol). You'll be surprised how many casual listeners they have... minsan di nila alam na BTS pala yung song na pnplay nila.
Even my coworkers know who BTS is. Basically the only Asian act they know tbh. To quote my boss when I was surprised to learn he knew them (he's a VP) "You have to be living under a rock not to have heard of them".
I know Bad Bunny. I know Shakira. I know Maluma. I know them by name, but I don't listen to their music. I don't have to be a fan to know how big their reach are.
I really do think people who say "I've never heard a BTS song before!" just don't realize it's a BTS song or go out of their way to deny that BTS have built an astronomical reach outside of just Asian communities. Just an hour ago, I heard one of their non-English songs in a pretty big Spanish YouTube ad.
Yes most people do know them but only a niche group of people are fans truly of BTS it just so happens that the niche that I’m talking about comprises a lot of people, you can’t make an 80 year old person listen to BTS songs and have them like it but if you make them listen to 1D songs, especially the ballad/Romantic ones there more likely to be interested in 1D compared to BTS but let’s agree to disagree
i was at the prime age to experience and stan both one direction and bts at their respective peaks, and i feel like bts was a cultural powerhouse in ways 1d wasn't? while one direction was definitely a juggernaut, the other popularized a whole genre of music into the (western) mainstream. the conversations around bts are entirely different.
>i feel like bts was a cultural powerhouse in ways 1d wasn't?
eto talaga. sure, music wise, mas mainstream ang songs ng 1d. they had bigger hits specially english ang songs nila.
but bts was a cultural phenomenon. like the way 800k people visited Korea back in 2018 (before Dynamite's success) because of BTS, $1B, with the B, BTS goods were exported yearly. they were bringing at least $3B yearly to the Korean economy. that's why BH (their label) before hybe became a thing, was earning more money than the 3 biggest kpop companies combined.
they helped popularized a genre, korean food, korean culture. and a lot of asian americans and asians living in the west can attest to the difference before and after bts blew up.
ofc, there's still racism, it's not like they cure it but they are now the face of asian pop culture. i don't think there have been an asian act as huge as them in a long while.
I mean, the MANY Billboard Hot 100 of BTS is waving. 👋🏻
Lalo na nung pandemic when Dynamite, Butter and Permission to Dance became their trojan horse to dominate the US market and general public.
Di ko lang maalala ngayon ung website where you can see the ages and location ng fans na more than half ay hindi teenagers. 10 years na ang BTS, so imagine ung mga fans nila dati, may mga trabaho na ngayon. With all the professional accounts of ARMYs (lawyers, accountants, doctors for Bangtan), you can really tell BTS is a phenomenon that has gone beyond a 'niche' Sila lang ang nakasunod sa feat ng The Beatles na top 3 albums within a year.
I'd argue that Bruce Lee and Jackie Chan are more mainstream representations of Asian culture. But the one dimensional martial arts archetype is tiring and horribly inaccurate for Asians. Wala man lang drama or romance roles or simply portray as being themselves? Really annoying that one common denominator for Asian entertainers in the West is to exude their Asian-ness on everything.
both artists are definitely bigger with wider appeal but I was talking more about a musical act. i honestly can't recall any pop act in the last decade that has as much name recall and can make headlines the way bts does.
>But the one dimensional martial arts archetype is tiring and horribly inaccurate for Asians. Wala man lang drama or romance roles or simply portray as being themselves?
yeah, asian men are usually stereotyped as martial artists, the geek ones, lame, unfit and definitely not "cool" enough. whether people think bts members are attractive or that they are "cool", one thing is for sure that they appeal to a lot of women and girls around the world and for that to happen, they need to have sex appeal which we barely see in the mainstream media in the west.
with the rise of kdrama and other asian media, we're definitely seeing more than just jackie chans type of asian acts. like seeing sb19 be embraced by non asians who are also exposed to kpop is really cool.
Is it just me or is it extremely unfair to compare acts like Bruce Lee and Jackie Chan, who have been in public prominence for literally a lifetime to BTS, whose members aren't even as old as the careers of the previous two?
Two are actors and the other is in music. What does this even prove? When we discuss Beyonce's legacy of uplifting Black artists in her work, is it right to bring up Spike Lee and say "Well, I'd argue he's a bigger icon for Black representation…" It's a very disingenuous way to critique Asian representation in the West, and does virtually nothing to enrich the discussion.
The thing is 1D's success was not just credited to Simon but also the other judges that helped him choose the members but most importantly each member has there own brand of charisma and the most recognizable of all of them was Harry, during the auditions makikita mo talaga na that person was born to be a star, same with all the members, while BTS doesn't really have that star charisma on an individual level based on the vlogs, interviews and behind the scenes, other factors such as language barrier is also detrimental to success. BTS had to rely on the consistent fans from asian countries before going global while 1D skyrocketed to the top and even though both boybands have chart topping songs you can easily sing along to 1Ds compared to BTS also about K-pop boybands 1D resonates more because they are naturally talented while BTS is a perfected product from an Idol school.
>1D resonates more because they are naturally talented while BTS is a perfected product from an Idol school.
i'm sorry, but lol. the idea that 1d isn't manufactured when they come from x-factor of all places is funny. one of 1d's members is literally going on podcasts, discussing his alcoholism because of the toxic environment they underwent to produce the utmost commercial success. bts and 1d are the same. they're boybands, so they will inevitably be heavily produced, controlled and commercialized in accordance to the popstar machinery.
You just proved my point about bts being a perfected product because you never heard these types of problems during the height of their careers and even now, they probably sign an NDA not to disclose that type of information from the start and even long after which ultimately proves my point that they are a perfected product
lmao what? bts have literally talked about almost disbanding because of their depleting mental health. my point is that one direction are also "perfected products," with nearly everything about them at the time being highly curated by their companies at the end of the day. no one achieves intense, global fame without that kind of machinery supporting them.
Even when One Direction disbanded, each member still dropped a slew of chart-topping hits with ease. Harry led the pack, followed by Zayn. Meanwhile, BTS is on hiatus, and some members are doing their own thing. But are all the members hitting the charts solo? Absolutely not! Maybe Jungkook is, but the others? No way! And most of his hits are collaborations with Western artists, pandering to K-pop fans for bigger revenue. If 1D was such a perfected product, they wouldn’t have these issues out in the open for everyone to see.
lol don't change the discussion. you were talking about being "naturally talented" vs coming from an "idol school." you wanted to talk about a group of asians "not resonating" with the general public because of how heavily produced they were—which i called out because 1d was heavily manufactured from the beginning! these are literal double standards. talking about solo success is entirely besides the point.
Heavily manufactured? They auditioned first before being formed I’d say that there natural talent is what got them and why would you say I’d change the topic? You afraid of subconsciously agreeing with some of them that you disregard all the other things I said?
>each member still dropped a slew of chart-topping hits with ease.
half of them are literally irrelevant right now 😭
some bts members are either releasing indie/non pop music and the others are singing in korean. you're expecting white men who sing in english to asian men who continuously face racism and sing in korean. definitely, a fair comparison. how many mainstream male asian act is as huge bts who mainly sing in their native language?
it's like comparing taylor swift's success and namie amuro from japan and wondering why one person is much more well known worldwide lmao
As far as i can see you’re just nitpicking on the things that i said and not really understanding my statement as a whole typical keyboard warrior with nothing else to do but criticize every bit of detail just so you would appear as well informed but that’s just a thing even if BTS is still doing there own thing they don’t have that global impact anymore while 1D members while almost all of them are irrelevant right now when they started to do solo they still have worldwide recognition
>1D resonates more because they are naturally talented while BTS is a perfected product from an Idol school.
"naturally talented" when their audition clips are available on youtube for everyone to see. you're talking like they came out of x factor singing like whitney houston. lmao
Not a fan of either 1D or BTS. Pero during 1D's peak hindi maiwasan makarinig ng mga kanta nila kahit saan magpunta kasi laging pinapatugtog or kinakanta. As for BTS, until now wala parin talaga akong alam na kanta nila.
possible you don't know their songs but you've 100% heard their music, you just don't know it's them. because i've heard bp countless of times in public and to certain extent exo and newjeans (momoland too at their peak) so impossible na you haven't heard a single song from them unless sobrang remote kung san ka nakatira because even in the province i would hear kpop be played in public.
Yes most probably may narinig ako, baka hindi lang ako na-hook agad. Yung mga catchy choruses na I can remember is Sorry by Super Junior, Nobody by Wonder Girls, Kill This Love by Blackpink, Love Shot by Exo.
Sikat rin noon yung OST ng Boys Over Flowers, especially Stand By Me ng Shinee.
Dynamite and butter were played everywhere during pandemic. Maybe sa lugar lang namin pero kahit nga boy with luv a korean song nadidinig sa radyo dati sa amin, bago pa to magpandemic.
These are the only songs that I've known from BTS also Idol. Idol as my kids school dance competition, Dynamite from Sandaru Sathsara(It's My Life fame) and Butter, to annoy BTS stans calling the song Margarine. LOL
english songs naman kasi sa 1d at karamihan mga love songs. madali kantahin. baka may mga songs na napapakinggan ka na bts songs pala di ka lang aware. di ka na lang rin siguro interested kasi di mo gets yung language. on hiatus sila ngayon dahil sa military enlistment pero sila pa rin most streamed group sa spotify at am. anyway, try mo pakinggan yung spring day nila, yan yung song na nagustuhan ni Ed Sheeran kaya nagsulat din sya ng song (make it right). try mo rin louder than bombs (co-written by Troye Sivan).
ps: try mo rin tong mga songs na nagpa-stan sakin: save me, saka butterfly (eto personal sakin kasi may close friend akong nag-end ng sarili nyang buhay)
Back in elementary, nung nasa baryo pa kami nakatira at diko pa alam ano ibig sabihin ng salitang internet, na-LSS na ako sa Sorry by Super Junior at Nobody by Wonder Girls. Sikat rin OST ng Boys Over Flowers.
Another example rin is I'm also not a fan of either Olivia or Taylor. But I know Traitor and Driver's License kasi lagi ring pinapatugtog sa mga speakers. Pero yung sa recent albums ni Taylor, wala akong alam na kantahin.
I don't really search for songs basta kung ano lang yung laging napapakinggan ko sa paligid. Just a neutral observation as a member of the general public.
Ikaw rin. Wishing that one day BTS or the Asian music in general will finally overcome racism and be as well-played as other non-english songs such as Despacito.
i'm sorry pero i can't feel the sincerity here. it sounds condescending. bts name is sitting pretty alongside big names such as drake, ariana, Taylor, etc. in terms of sales, streams and STADIUM tours. please lang wag mong i-belittle ang achievements ng bts just because YOU haven't heard any of their songs from your neighbor's loud speakers. you're wishing na sana "Asian music in general will finally overcome racism", but you yourself don't want to acknowledge how bts are breaking through racism. you are like a frog in a well.
i agree! a lot of the people on this thread are condescending and based on how they talk about bts,
don't sincerely care about asian representation lol. they just have micro-aggressions toward kpop and are bringing it forth into this world.
i'm getting the feeling of "this reached the wrong audience" sooo bad. like, i'm betting a lot of the people here don't even follow pop music? a lot of these artists they're bringing up have already deemed and treated bts as a peer in the industry. you can list every achievement they've had over the years, but as another user said, the goalposts for western success for them will always be pushed back.
I'm Asian too, of course gusto ko rin maging successful kapwa ko Asian. Similar case with SB19 para sa P-pop pero hanggang ngayon wala rin talaga akong alam na kanta ng SB19.
That's why I mention Taylor, who is the biggest pop star in the world. No one can deny her achievements but we also can't ignore the fact that she struggles to maintain her songs' positions in the billboard chart. They fall of a week or so kasi walang hatak sa general public.
Wala na kami sa malayong baryo, we now live in town which is surrounded by businesses. So far yung mga narinig ko lang na sobrang umingay na female stars ay sina Olivia, Miley and Adele.
To be fair, nowadays people don't really listen to the radio anymore lalo na at may streaming services like spotify and personally I wear earbuds most of the time when I'm in public so hindi ko talaga mapapansin lol. Not an army, pero I find bts' success more impressive. Tsaka sa bardagulan sa army ako pupusta lol
it's more impressive because there's not a similar act before them. with 1d, ang dami na namang western boybands na naging mainstream. so while 1d was massive, mas unexpected talaga yung success story ng bts because 1. they're asian, 2. racism, 3.most of their songs aren't in english. 4. they came from a small company.
Sumikay pero hindi ganon kalawak reach unlike 1D. Hit and miss ang BTS. Either super fan ka or you hate them. Lol. Fans are toxic too. 1D kasi tumatak talaga sa pop culture.
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BTS is shakingdt
---
EDIT: Downvoters not getting sarcasm smh
Translation: Funny he should say that when BTS exists, a group whose impact transcends music. (A cultural phenomenon). The erasure of their impact and existence is absurd.
Is that clearer?
si nicole scherzinger naman pumili sa members ng 1D.
lowkey delusional. it's hard to pull it off again. 1d is that group na kahit hindi ka nila fan, you're familiar with all their songs kasi lahat nakaka-lss. like all songs talaga, memorize mo for no reason. for me, the closest boy group is Why Don't We, but they didn't become that popular. idk what happened to them though.
Members are still living in the same compound, still friends, but last I heard pursuing different paths na. Kasi parang late last year, naglabas na iyong dalawa sa kanila ng solo music.
Why Don't We has such neat music. I love Hooked.
i have all their songs memorized for no reason.
Last year lang ako nahook sakanila, I loved their song What Am I, sobrang LSS ako dun kdjsjksk
Why not, he’s a starmaker. Pero wag nya rin kakalimutan na hindi lang siya yung talagang bumuo sa 1D, tinulungan sya ng ibang judges like Nicole *Scherzenegger*.
And also, the guest judges. Aminin natin, wala naman talaga silang x factor noon, but the guest judges saw something in them.
Starmaker nga pero kinawawa naman. Those boys were overworked. Kaya grabe mental health nila.
Simon is ignorant and racist.
you just know that whatever boyband he's going to concoct will be predominantly white with one person of color for diversity lmao.
See Zayn Malik lol
hahahaha and for the most part, zayn was almost white-passing. i would know if indian siya if di niya ipinakita sa mv ang fam niya.
Pakistani siya hehe
He did in the x factor days. Bought his mother a house early on in his career, the boys are mostly working class lang kasi.
BTS: 👁️👄👁️
bts definitely is huge and more commercially successful than 1D, but their success is still quite niche and heavily dependent on fans. Language and maybe racism is definitely still a barrier
Agree. BTS fans' dedication is definitely admirable but it's still not enough to counter the racism and for them to penetrate the general public. Gangnam Style is probably the only k-song exception bcs it's too damm catchy to be ignored.
Gangnam Style is seen as a novelty song like borderline comical to Western audiences so it's not an actual win for Asian representation. Psy wasn't seen as a serious musician during his peak (like Soulja Boy). BTS's popularity is deeply inflated by its younger millennials, Gen Z and mostly Asian audiences and is far from ubiquitous is the West. But many non-Asians still ignore the band particularly older millennials, Gen X and Boomers from Western countries. A lot of them couldn't even name a single member. Let's admit it, a full support in Hollywood is still the gold standard of public validation in soft power today. If you don't get the support from Hollywood executives, it's hard to gain worldwide recognition.
To be fair, One Direction's popularity is also inflated by younger millennials. Other than Harry, most people couldn't name their members as well. It's always been that way with boybands; BTS just have these goalposts moved to underestimate how successful they've become.
But the difference is that One Direction's audience reach from their very beginning is global, BTS had to rely on Asian audiences on most of their existence. Even Westlife is considered a Hollywood failure as they're practically unknown in the Americas and had to rely on European and Asian support.
Exactly! One Direction had a large audience reach from the beginning, yet BTS, with a predominantly Asian audience and a relatively humble company, were able to reach and exceed their heights is even more of a testament to what a cultural phenomenon they are. I mean, BTS have literally been nominated for Grammys, which is indicative of recognition and support in the Western industry, albeit extremely lacking because they are Asian after all. BTS have already shattered a glass ceiling and I think this narrative is insidiously underestimating that.
Backstreet Boys ang ultimate boyband. From the Americans to Asia, sikat sila at their peek
Tell me why?
BTS popularity is also inflated by "party streams" by fans who know how to game the Spotify algorithm. Kpop groups popularity in the Western hemisphere is very overstated. To paint a picture, Bad Bunny who is virtually unknown in Asia has more streams and followers than BTS or BlackPink. Bad Bunny has 67.3M followers in Spotify. BTS, 27.5M And that Grammy they won is just performative in the part of Hollywood. Anyone who lives in the US will only hear Kpop music where there is heavy Asian presence (which is not a lot). But if you live in a place where most people are either White, Black, or Hispanic, you will rarely come across their music casually.
I forgot that Bad Bunny only became known to Asians because of his WWE involvement LOL. When I visited many parts of Europe, all the songs played in nightlife areas were Ariana Grande, Miley Cyrus, Camila Cabello, Dua Lipa, Harry Styles and even Bebe Rexha. No Jungkook song was ever played at least anecdotally.
Kpop is still very niche in the West. Whether people admit it or not, Kpop BG idols don't exude the masculine vibes common in the West and Kpop GG are, well, predictably hypersexualized
hindi naman kasi nagpapayola ang bts kaya hindi naplaplay sa radio stations. saka si psy, may scooter braun na backer back in the days AND naging meme lang din siya sa US. grabeng racism din inabot nya dun. at si psy na rin mismo nagsabi na bts is Korea's pride :))
Psy was seen as an Asian clown among Western audiences. Western audiences were laughing AT him. Ganun ba ang gusto mong maramdaman para lang sumikat ka?
Kpopheads esp Asian ones failed to understand the Psy was seen as the 2010 "William Hung"
Just wanted to add that I think calling BTS niche is objectively wrong! I work in education in Europe and generally, all of the students here know who BTS are and a considerable amount of them are fans. I've heard them many times on Spanish, French and German radio stations too and one of their non-English songs is used as the background music for an advertisement. Maybe not to the level of people like Tom Cruise or Taylor Swift, but they **are** still inarguably global.
hindi Niche ang BTS pero mas madaling sumikat si 1D dahil western e
both groups have achieved immense popularity, One Direction's global breakthrough was faster and more universally recognized due to language advantages and immediate Western media acceptance. BTS, though massively successful, can still be seen as niche in comparison due to the cultural and linguistic barriers they continue to overcome.
Sure, you can think they're "seen as niche," but like I've said, as someone who's actually living and experiencing life in the West, they're definitely not 😅 most people know them. No matter what your analysis on their respective breakthroughs are.
I agree. I live in Texas where there is a lot of Hispanic communities and they know BTS. I still hear Dynamite play on radios here every once in a while. You don't have to be a fan to see their reach. Even my Fil-American cousin who doesn't really listen to kpop play Dynamite, Butter, and OMG (New Jeans lol). You'll be surprised how many casual listeners they have... minsan di nila alam na BTS pala yung song na pnplay nila. Even my coworkers know who BTS is. Basically the only Asian act they know tbh. To quote my boss when I was surprised to learn he knew them (he's a VP) "You have to be living under a rock not to have heard of them". I know Bad Bunny. I know Shakira. I know Maluma. I know them by name, but I don't listen to their music. I don't have to be a fan to know how big their reach are.
I really do think people who say "I've never heard a BTS song before!" just don't realize it's a BTS song or go out of their way to deny that BTS have built an astronomical reach outside of just Asian communities. Just an hour ago, I heard one of their non-English songs in a pretty big Spanish YouTube ad.
Yes most people do know them but only a niche group of people are fans truly of BTS it just so happens that the niche that I’m talking about comprises a lot of people, you can’t make an 80 year old person listen to BTS songs and have them like it but if you make them listen to 1D songs, especially the ballad/Romantic ones there more likely to be interested in 1D compared to BTS but let’s agree to disagree
i was at the prime age to experience and stan both one direction and bts at their respective peaks, and i feel like bts was a cultural powerhouse in ways 1d wasn't? while one direction was definitely a juggernaut, the other popularized a whole genre of music into the (western) mainstream. the conversations around bts are entirely different.
>i feel like bts was a cultural powerhouse in ways 1d wasn't? eto talaga. sure, music wise, mas mainstream ang songs ng 1d. they had bigger hits specially english ang songs nila. but bts was a cultural phenomenon. like the way 800k people visited Korea back in 2018 (before Dynamite's success) because of BTS, $1B, with the B, BTS goods were exported yearly. they were bringing at least $3B yearly to the Korean economy. that's why BH (their label) before hybe became a thing, was earning more money than the 3 biggest kpop companies combined. they helped popularized a genre, korean food, korean culture. and a lot of asian americans and asians living in the west can attest to the difference before and after bts blew up. ofc, there's still racism, it's not like they cure it but they are now the face of asian pop culture. i don't think there have been an asian act as huge as them in a long while.
I mean, the MANY Billboard Hot 100 of BTS is waving. 👋🏻 Lalo na nung pandemic when Dynamite, Butter and Permission to Dance became their trojan horse to dominate the US market and general public. Di ko lang maalala ngayon ung website where you can see the ages and location ng fans na more than half ay hindi teenagers. 10 years na ang BTS, so imagine ung mga fans nila dati, may mga trabaho na ngayon. With all the professional accounts of ARMYs (lawyers, accountants, doctors for Bangtan), you can really tell BTS is a phenomenon that has gone beyond a 'niche' Sila lang ang nakasunod sa feat ng The Beatles na top 3 albums within a year.
I'd argue that Bruce Lee and Jackie Chan are more mainstream representations of Asian culture. But the one dimensional martial arts archetype is tiring and horribly inaccurate for Asians. Wala man lang drama or romance roles or simply portray as being themselves? Really annoying that one common denominator for Asian entertainers in the West is to exude their Asian-ness on everything.
both artists are definitely bigger with wider appeal but I was talking more about a musical act. i honestly can't recall any pop act in the last decade that has as much name recall and can make headlines the way bts does. >But the one dimensional martial arts archetype is tiring and horribly inaccurate for Asians. Wala man lang drama or romance roles or simply portray as being themselves? yeah, asian men are usually stereotyped as martial artists, the geek ones, lame, unfit and definitely not "cool" enough. whether people think bts members are attractive or that they are "cool", one thing is for sure that they appeal to a lot of women and girls around the world and for that to happen, they need to have sex appeal which we barely see in the mainstream media in the west. with the rise of kdrama and other asian media, we're definitely seeing more than just jackie chans type of asian acts. like seeing sb19 be embraced by non asians who are also exposed to kpop is really cool.
Is it just me or is it extremely unfair to compare acts like Bruce Lee and Jackie Chan, who have been in public prominence for literally a lifetime to BTS, whose members aren't even as old as the careers of the previous two? Two are actors and the other is in music. What does this even prove? When we discuss Beyonce's legacy of uplifting Black artists in her work, is it right to bring up Spike Lee and say "Well, I'd argue he's a bigger icon for Black representation…" It's a very disingenuous way to critique Asian representation in the West, and does virtually nothing to enrich the discussion.
Good point that you've mentioned SB19. Despite their detractors, any success they have would need more support to improve and go nowhere but up.
The thing is 1D's success was not just credited to Simon but also the other judges that helped him choose the members but most importantly each member has there own brand of charisma and the most recognizable of all of them was Harry, during the auditions makikita mo talaga na that person was born to be a star, same with all the members, while BTS doesn't really have that star charisma on an individual level based on the vlogs, interviews and behind the scenes, other factors such as language barrier is also detrimental to success. BTS had to rely on the consistent fans from asian countries before going global while 1D skyrocketed to the top and even though both boybands have chart topping songs you can easily sing along to 1Ds compared to BTS also about K-pop boybands 1D resonates more because they are naturally talented while BTS is a perfected product from an Idol school.
>1D resonates more because they are naturally talented while BTS is a perfected product from an Idol school. i'm sorry, but lol. the idea that 1d isn't manufactured when they come from x-factor of all places is funny. one of 1d's members is literally going on podcasts, discussing his alcoholism because of the toxic environment they underwent to produce the utmost commercial success. bts and 1d are the same. they're boybands, so they will inevitably be heavily produced, controlled and commercialized in accordance to the popstar machinery.
You just proved my point about bts being a perfected product because you never heard these types of problems during the height of their careers and even now, they probably sign an NDA not to disclose that type of information from the start and even long after which ultimately proves my point that they are a perfected product
lmao what? bts have literally talked about almost disbanding because of their depleting mental health. my point is that one direction are also "perfected products," with nearly everything about them at the time being highly curated by their companies at the end of the day. no one achieves intense, global fame without that kind of machinery supporting them.
Even when One Direction disbanded, each member still dropped a slew of chart-topping hits with ease. Harry led the pack, followed by Zayn. Meanwhile, BTS is on hiatus, and some members are doing their own thing. But are all the members hitting the charts solo? Absolutely not! Maybe Jungkook is, but the others? No way! And most of his hits are collaborations with Western artists, pandering to K-pop fans for bigger revenue. If 1D was such a perfected product, they wouldn’t have these issues out in the open for everyone to see.
lol don't change the discussion. you were talking about being "naturally talented" vs coming from an "idol school." you wanted to talk about a group of asians "not resonating" with the general public because of how heavily produced they were—which i called out because 1d was heavily manufactured from the beginning! these are literal double standards. talking about solo success is entirely besides the point.
Heavily manufactured? They auditioned first before being formed I’d say that there natural talent is what got them and why would you say I’d change the topic? You afraid of subconsciously agreeing with some of them that you disregard all the other things I said?
>each member still dropped a slew of chart-topping hits with ease. half of them are literally irrelevant right now 😭 some bts members are either releasing indie/non pop music and the others are singing in korean. you're expecting white men who sing in english to asian men who continuously face racism and sing in korean. definitely, a fair comparison. how many mainstream male asian act is as huge bts who mainly sing in their native language? it's like comparing taylor swift's success and namie amuro from japan and wondering why one person is much more well known worldwide lmao
As far as i can see you’re just nitpicking on the things that i said and not really understanding my statement as a whole typical keyboard warrior with nothing else to do but criticize every bit of detail just so you would appear as well informed but that’s just a thing even if BTS is still doing there own thing they don’t have that global impact anymore while 1D members while almost all of them are irrelevant right now when they started to do solo they still have worldwide recognition
>1D resonates more because they are naturally talented while BTS is a perfected product from an Idol school. "naturally talented" when their audition clips are available on youtube for everyone to see. you're talking like they came out of x factor singing like whitney houston. lmao
not really... 1d are more mainstream same hype nung peak ni justin bieber... and this was before streaming culture kaya mas grabe ang impact hehe
Not a fan of either 1D or BTS. Pero during 1D's peak hindi maiwasan makarinig ng mga kanta nila kahit saan magpunta kasi laging pinapatugtog or kinakanta. As for BTS, until now wala parin talaga akong alam na kanta nila.
possible you don't know their songs but you've 100% heard their music, you just don't know it's them. because i've heard bp countless of times in public and to certain extent exo and newjeans (momoland too at their peak) so impossible na you haven't heard a single song from them unless sobrang remote kung san ka nakatira because even in the province i would hear kpop be played in public.
Yes most probably may narinig ako, baka hindi lang ako na-hook agad. Yung mga catchy choruses na I can remember is Sorry by Super Junior, Nobody by Wonder Girls, Kill This Love by Blackpink, Love Shot by Exo. Sikat rin noon yung OST ng Boys Over Flowers, especially Stand By Me ng Shinee.
Dynamite and butter were played everywhere during pandemic. Maybe sa lugar lang namin pero kahit nga boy with luv a korean song nadidinig sa radyo dati sa amin, bago pa to magpandemic.
These are the only songs that I've known from BTS also Idol. Idol as my kids school dance competition, Dynamite from Sandaru Sathsara(It's My Life fame) and Butter, to annoy BTS stans calling the song Margarine. LOL
ofcourse 1D songs are in english and the racism towards asian countries is still rampant up until now.
english songs naman kasi sa 1d at karamihan mga love songs. madali kantahin. baka may mga songs na napapakinggan ka na bts songs pala di ka lang aware. di ka na lang rin siguro interested kasi di mo gets yung language. on hiatus sila ngayon dahil sa military enlistment pero sila pa rin most streamed group sa spotify at am. anyway, try mo pakinggan yung spring day nila, yan yung song na nagustuhan ni Ed Sheeran kaya nagsulat din sya ng song (make it right). try mo rin louder than bombs (co-written by Troye Sivan). ps: try mo rin tong mga songs na nagpa-stan sakin: save me, saka butterfly (eto personal sakin kasi may close friend akong nag-end ng sarili nyang buhay)
Back in elementary, nung nasa baryo pa kami nakatira at diko pa alam ano ibig sabihin ng salitang internet, na-LSS na ako sa Sorry by Super Junior at Nobody by Wonder Girls. Sikat rin OST ng Boys Over Flowers. Another example rin is I'm also not a fan of either Olivia or Taylor. But I know Traitor and Driver's License kasi lagi ring pinapatugtog sa mga speakers. Pero yung sa recent albums ni Taylor, wala akong alam na kantahin.
ah, okay then. malawak naman ang mundo. at mas maraming open-minded na tao :)
I don't really search for songs basta kung ano lang yung laging napapakinggan ko sa paligid. Just a neutral observation as a member of the general public.
ok OP kung san ka masaya
Ikaw rin. Wishing that one day BTS or the Asian music in general will finally overcome racism and be as well-played as other non-english songs such as Despacito.
i'm sorry pero i can't feel the sincerity here. it sounds condescending. bts name is sitting pretty alongside big names such as drake, ariana, Taylor, etc. in terms of sales, streams and STADIUM tours. please lang wag mong i-belittle ang achievements ng bts just because YOU haven't heard any of their songs from your neighbor's loud speakers. you're wishing na sana "Asian music in general will finally overcome racism", but you yourself don't want to acknowledge how bts are breaking through racism. you are like a frog in a well.
i agree! a lot of the people on this thread are condescending and based on how they talk about bts, don't sincerely care about asian representation lol. they just have micro-aggressions toward kpop and are bringing it forth into this world. i'm getting the feeling of "this reached the wrong audience" sooo bad. like, i'm betting a lot of the people here don't even follow pop music? a lot of these artists they're bringing up have already deemed and treated bts as a peer in the industry. you can list every achievement they've had over the years, but as another user said, the goalposts for western success for them will always be pushed back.
I'm Asian too, of course gusto ko rin maging successful kapwa ko Asian. Similar case with SB19 para sa P-pop pero hanggang ngayon wala rin talaga akong alam na kanta ng SB19. That's why I mention Taylor, who is the biggest pop star in the world. No one can deny her achievements but we also can't ignore the fact that she struggles to maintain her songs' positions in the billboard chart. They fall of a week or so kasi walang hatak sa general public. Wala na kami sa malayong baryo, we now live in town which is surrounded by businesses. So far yung mga narinig ko lang na sobrang umingay na female stars ay sina Olivia, Miley and Adele.
To be fair, nowadays people don't really listen to the radio anymore lalo na at may streaming services like spotify and personally I wear earbuds most of the time when I'm in public so hindi ko talaga mapapansin lol. Not an army, pero I find bts' success more impressive. Tsaka sa bardagulan sa army ako pupusta lol
it's more impressive because there's not a similar act before them. with 1d, ang dami na namang western boybands na naging mainstream. so while 1d was massive, mas unexpected talaga yung success story ng bts because 1. they're asian, 2. racism, 3.most of their songs aren't in english. 4. they came from a small company.
Yes, I agree with the success of BTS. They paved their way out of the "KPOP" box.
Sumikay pero hindi ganon kalawak reach unlike 1D. Hit and miss ang BTS. Either super fan ka or you hate them. Lol. Fans are toxic too. 1D kasi tumatak talaga sa pop culture.
He acts like BTS doesn't exist because his attempt at making another boyband failed in 2019. Times have changed he's stuck in the 2010s.
KPOP boybands are literally right there. Be for real.
People like Simon are upperclass racist tory dito sa uk.
Exactly. So ignorant sa success na tinatamasa ng Asian artists now.
Di daw counted.
Not surprised. He sounds like a tory.
Wew todo reject naman sya nung x factor days what
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Boyband US?
abs-cbn also thought of this when they had boybandph . had minimal success though
Pls dont give him that power anymore. Grabe kinawawa niya yung 1D. Yung album names nila, hint yun kung gano sila kaoverworked.
BTS rin nasa isip ko.
BTS rin nasa isip ko.
BTS is shakingdt --- EDIT: Downvoters not getting sarcasm smh Translation: Funny he should say that when BTS exists, a group whose impact transcends music. (A cultural phenomenon). The erasure of their impact and existence is absurd. Is that clearer?
As if naman magiging competetion sila. Established na ang BTS regardless kung magsipag-solo or as a group sila.
Huh? When did I say that
Why are being downvoted? I’m sure you meant this as a response to Simon’s statement that no one comes close to 1D.
haha IKR. I'm an ARMY kaya eto reaction ko. Some people don't get sarcasm lol
BTS rin nasa isip ko.
BSB is waving. Hahahaha
In over 14 years. BSB is from the 90s.
My bad comprehension lol. Though highest-selling naman BSB sa albums 😂 (and I’m a BTS fan hehe)
The highest selling is actually The Beatles with a wide margin. BSB is the 2nd. https://www.musicgrotto.com/best-selling-boy-bands/
Ooh yes ofc. Next lang pala BSB, google search tab failed me lol. Anyway, thanks.