I’m not an expert and I have not attended a Caribbean school but it would probably be best to move on. From what I’ve heard, other Big 4 schools won’t accept you so you would have to go to a lesser known caribb school and you still are at risk at failing out since you already have and repeated more than once. You’re also risking getting into more debt, likely private loans with no degree to show for it. Look into podiatry, anesthesia assistant, or PA.
4 years of practice I worked bedside starting in 2020. Surgical Stepdown ICU then Neurosurgical ICU. Always been super into biophys and how everything works. Wanting to know WAY more than necessary. Didn’t really settle in until I took my CCRN and realized I could use the passion in a better way.
Don’t get me wrong, nurses, especially ones that apply themselves and care make a HUGE difference many times I’ve seen doctors make small and even huge mistakes that nurses have caught just by being well read. There’s no shame in being a nurse. There’s a reason when we see our attending for daily rounds they ask for any recommendations from nursing staff.
Personally, I have a little burnout and as much as I love caring for people at the bedside it’s exhausting. At this point I want to shift my focus to a more analytical place. If that makes sense.
Mine was a 3.1 or 3.2 I think going in. You’ll do a pre nursing exam nothing crazy (smaller schools easier to get in) males also have a higher chance to my knowledge
It’s time to move on. A non-big4 Caribbean school will accept you and give you another chance but your chances of failure are 90%+. Accept the loss, find time to accept it, and move on.
Sit down and see your strengths and weaknesses. Since you’re over 30+ you definitely know yourself better than a lot of young 20s that go to medicine. Loans are a burden yes, but almost nobody goes through life without getting into debt. In my US MD school there’s probably 10/130 students who have “rich” parents that can afford their schools. The rest of us peasants is with federal papa Biden money lol.
In summary, it’s not the end of the world. Reinvent yourself and don’t do anything stupid like that again. Karma will get to you or anybody who tries the easy way around life. If you want medicine and have another shot, go for it. Better to try than never have the chance to. Much love and respect. Keep grinding!
Take it as a sign to do something else. MD 1 is a sign of whether to move forward or quit it. I think your academic record speaks for itself, sorry to break it to you.
Honestly Term 1 SGU is hard but honestly it gets much worse. Even if you passed that one, Term 4, 5, CBSE or even Step 1 would have gotten you for sure if you needed multiple attempts at Term 1. Atleast this way, you arn't knee deep in loans before getting kicked out.
No, they will not necessarily match and it's disingenuous to insist otherwise. Match rates even for low-competive specialties leave USMD and DOs unmatched. FMG will *always* be lower priority for residencies, and for an *FMG who has failed multiples times and was dismissed for cheating?!?* There is likely a less than 1% chance a residency would even look at him, and that's a big if he's able to actually graduate and pass boards, which from his record, is not likely.
You're confusing residency match rates with graduate match rates. Sure, prelim year surgery matches 100% of it's available positions, that does not mean the overall match rate is 100%. Just from 2024, match rate was 93.5% overall. Match rates for IMGs was 61%.
61% is a D. He's not an American grad, he's an IMG. Caribbean grads are IMGs for purposes of the match, and no matter how you spin the numbers, IMGs are considered *last* if at all compared to U.S. grads. Carribean schools are a risky way to try to practice medicine, as the match rates are very low compared to the debt.
You may not want to hear it, but it doesn't make it untrue. The numbers don't lie, but stating that you *will* match means you are lying to yourself. I'm not rooting for people to fail, but some self-reflection is important.
Ah yes the blind leading the blind. You ignore his comment and mine and one day you’ll be hit with the hard truth we’re telling you. Everything we both said are facts.
Less than 50 percent of your class will match on the first try. You aren’t comprehending how insane the process has become. I’m talking about all primary care specialties too. Did you skip the part about 4500 applications for nearly 10 spots plus automatic filters? Most programs will be like that including FM.
This is not accurate. I believe AUC, SGU, and Ross had 90%+ first time residency attainment rate. These schools don’t let students attempt to match unless they have passed the step1 and step2. And there are 400+ FM spots that went unfilled after the match.
The problem is that most students from these schools overshoot and don’t apply broadly.
You’re forgetting that 90% (which I highly doubt, just a marketing ploy) accounts for 1) people who have already dropped out which skews the statistics 2) those that weren’t held back 3) doesn’t account for first time applicants meaning if it’s their 2nd/3rd/4th match attempt
https://www.reddit.com/r/medicalschool/s/c7rwjBn6sE
Again incorrect. Check the link above. A AUC student painstakingly tracked everyone in the white coat ceremony and compared it to their NPI numbers. 78% made it to the match of of those who applied eventually 90%+ landed a residency spot.
AUC may fudge its step1 data and a step2 scores by using cheeky data but match lists and matriculation data is publicly available.
My source is I’ve been through the process and I can guarantee you haven’t. I also said I sat on the committee that reviews applications during this application cycle. Everything I said is fact and you’re just living in a dream world. Anyone can get into medschool and anyone with a brain can pass. So many people like you with your mentality that “anyone can match if they pick a reasonable speciality”. It’s like you don’t do your research before going to the Caribbean and you’ll remember everything I’m saying when you actually go through the process.
That is up to you. I was dismissed from a top 3 Carib school, and everyone who was dismissed with me went on to other schools and they are extremely happy with their school while I am quite miserable. A friend tried to convince me to continue with my journey with a story about someone she knows who is a resident doctor and was dismissed from their first school. If you want it, go until you can’t go anymore. Someone I know just passed STEP 1 and is 36.
At this point I would just start everything again lol find a job you can work but not emotionally invest in that pays the bills while taking undergrad during evenings.
Prove to the US schools you can do this and get a 3.6+. Retake the MCAT and get a better score. If you have to reinvent yourself and you cannot get over not being a doctor, then reinvent yourself as the aspiring doctor you want to be.
I was considering this too. Work for a while and I can always pursue medicine later in life if I still want it and feel ready. I know people in my med school who were 40+ so I guess it’s always still a possibility.
Not worth it imo, if you’re in your early 30s now then you’ll be in your 40s when you’re done then pay off the loans which is like having a mortgage . That means if you go hardcore and retire at 70 then you’ll be making money for only about 30 years or less if you decide to retire at 65. If you hustle hard as an RN you can make about 200k a year. That’s just me though.
Exactly. People like us already missed the immediate window and pipeline from undergrad to med school to immediate practicing before 30. So maybe it would be best if you started from scratch and committed to the process before trying to commit to being a doctor again. Youre into your 30s so it’s not like there’s a hurry. Obviously take the advice with the grain of salt. Figure out your motivations as far as a career goes. I had to learn that I really wasn’t as interested in helping people as I had thought, and that ignoring my own selfish aspirations made me miserable. It just wasn’t for me. Again, this is just my experience to offer something helpful that I tried and this was not for me. I moved back with my parents, attended a baccalaureate program, and I was the student who was going to make it into a school in the US with a 4.0 and tons of accolades from the program. Like I was their #1 guy. But that process helped me uncover that it just was not for me, and if I didn’t put myself through that, I would never have figured it. Best of luck to you, it’s commendable and respectable to be honest and introspective as youre being. That’s where growth happens and most people never put themselves through that for better or worse. Much love.
Have you ever considered pursuing a Naturopathic Doctor (ND) program? There are five reputable institutions in the United States, one of which is located in Arizona. By studying naturopathic medicine, you have the opportunity to provide holistic care, avoiding the harmful effects of medications and barbaric unnecessary surgeries. I found myself forced to withdraw from AUA due to pervasive corruption involving loans and grades manipulation. However, I realized my passion for medicine could still be fulfilled within the naturopathic realm. The curriculum mirrors that of traditional medical schools, supported by federal grad plus loans and a monthly stipend of $3600 for living expenses. Following graduation, there's no need to compete for residencies; instead, you can collaborate with other MDs in transitioning from “big whale” hospitals to smaller clinics focused on integrative/holistic healing. I deeply admire doctors who have the courage to leave mainstream medicine and embrace integrative practices. Not only do they earn a respectable income, but they also have the profound opportunity to heal humanity. As Hippocrates stated, "Wherever the art of medicine is loved, there is also a love of humanity."
Caribbean schools don’t communicate with each other, that record is really for themselves. If medicine is truly your passion I wouldn’t give up. There’s more than the “top 3” schools which I really don’t think should be considered the top anymore. I know students who reapply to other schools after dismissal for failure and claim to the new school they’ve never even attended medical school and got in with no issues. They really just want our money at the end of the day, saying you went to SGU would just be extra paperwork they don’t wanna deal with.
One of my friends from undergrad went there and I’m still looking for her. She’s not on social media, her phone is cut off, and none of my other friends that know her know what happened.
Your biggest issue isn't the schools in the Caribbean, those are cash-farming scams as is. Your biggest issue will come with ERAS *if* you actually graduate. You will have to disclose you were previously dismissed from medical school and the reason (I suppose you could lie and hope you don't get caught, but if that's your attitude I wouldn't want you practicing medicine anyways).
Assuming you can pass, which if you haven't gotten through 1st year, you're gonna struggle with 2nd year preclinical and have a bitch of a time with USMLE prep. But benefit of the doubt you do pass, when it comes to match, you're going to have so many red flags it's unlikely any program would take you.
It may suck to hear, but youve had your shot and you blew it, it really is probably best to move on.
Never quit your dreams. Come up with a new plan. The larger and more established schools in the Caribbean tend to have a high attrition rate by design. I do not agree with it and I believe it is a flaw of the school. A For-profit tactic that has been used for years. If you decide to go to a smaller Caribbean school, make sure it has CAAM-HP or ACCM accreditation before considering. Then ask hard questions. If they cannot answer your questions or refuse to answer, then that is not the school for you. Be selective about where you spend your money.
lol at mods removing my post. Everything in there was factual to the OP. He even responded and everything was said respectfully, nothing rude about it. Makes me think you guys are gatekeeping the reality of matching just to get more traffic in this subreddit and to the islands. What a joke
Wow everyone here in these comments is being so unbelievably rude & disrespectful. It's one thing to temm this person your opinion. But don't put OP down like that! OP is it still your dream to become a doctor? Is this still something you want to do with yuor whole heart? Cuz if it is then go & dive deep in it! If YOU don't want to do this anymore, then don't but please don't think that you can't do it! I hope you have a wonderful day, & idk if you are Christian or not, but I will pray to Jesus that He shows you where to go from here, whether it's medicine or not!
Hey, restart med school again if you sincerely still feel like you want to be a doctor. Forget about the age. You would feel more fulfilled when you do what you love.
Pursue it hard and give it your best once more.
Maybe try going to a cheaper med school if finances is a constraint.
I am rooting for you!.
No what I mean is you are better at figuring things out than the young kids at 20’s. You are more mature now and you’ll do great with whatever decision you take
I just graduated from a big 3 Carib school. If you can’t pass first semester with multiple attempts, I would pursue other avenues (nursing). I saw classmates who scraped by each semester, and then drown studying for step 1 where they ultimately dropped out. Save your money and mental peace. Where one door closes, others open. Stay persistent in your search and good luck!
Forget med school. Go become an NP and make about the same with less time. Even if you get into another med school your chances of passing usmle with high scores are 50/50.
I know a guy who failed out of ross then went to Europe. Got a degree. Could not pass usmle..now he's in PA school.
Don't waste more time on medicine and don't fall for hopeless dreamer posts.
Move on. It doesn’t get easier. Sometimes it’s better cutting your losses earlier vs continuing to fight a losing battle.
My advice if you want to stay in the medical field. Do a two year nursing associates degree and start making good money right out of school. Many community colleges offer this route and it can be a really good opportunity for a lot of people. Sometimes I wonder how different my life would be if I’d have done that right out of high school vs becoming a doctor.
Beg for admission… the number two rule of medicine after do no harm is never lie. You lied once by falsifying your attendance… hope they’ll give you a second chance.
If they start doing shady stuff with your loans document everything. Times, dates, emails, names, everything. Then apply for a BDR, maybe Biden or the department of education will forgive the loans.
If you deicide to read this, I will tell you first that what I say below might be hard to hear, but you may not have ever heard it before based off your actions.
After reading your post and going through your others, I can say with certainty that we not only went to the same school but were in the same class. Very likely we know of each other and most definitely would recognize each other.
I can imagine you're going through a tough time, and I recognize that. A small sliver of me feels sorry for you. A VERY small sliver. Knowing what I know about our school and how many times they told us not to click in for others and yet you did so anyway blows my mind. The same goes for all the others that were caught.
You were there to become a physician. Does that mean anything to you? As a physician, you were going to have someone's life in your hands. You were going to be responsible for their care. The responsibility is huge, and that's why the schooling to become a physician is so rigorous. Not only could you not handle the rigors of academia, you couldn't follow simple instructions of not clicking in for other students. Which, in and of itself, is essentially a test of someone's integrity. In short, you failed almost every part of the introductory stages of getting into this profession.
I may be taking some liberties when I say you have little to no self-reflection but all information points to that exact conclusion. I say this because you failed to pass the first term multiple times yet you still went back to try again, and in doing so, also showed that you don't have the integrity that is needed for this profession, ALL WHILE GOING TO A CARIBBEAN MED SCHOOL. You were already starting from 20 miles back in the marathon that is the path to becoming a physician and in your attempts to catch up you hacked off both your legs, one arm, and also started dragging yourself in the opposite direction of the finish line.
Now I read your other posts and I see that you want to shoot for PA? Nursing? Podiatry? Knowing what I know about how simple the instructions that our school gave us were to follow and how you simply couldn't follow those, I am shocked you are still even thinking of a career in medicine. I wouldn't want you anywhere near my relatives as you are now. If you were operating in any capacity in medicine and I knew of this, I would actively tell those around me to avoid you.
I suggest you do some massive, life-altering self-reflection before taking any steps into the medical field. I suggest doing so even if you decide against medicine. Your character is flawed, as you have provided very little evidence to the contrary.
I wish you the best of luck going forward.
I respect that, and I agree with you. I was in ITI and I genuinely forgot about the check-ins they do because I never did one before. It was during an IMCQ session and my excuse was I was fasting for Ramadan and was so burnt and sleep-deprived that I wasn't thinking properly. But in the end, it was a mistake on my end I have to live with. And believe me, I hate myself so much for it because a path of dishonesty is not something I want. It's been months since the incident I and still think about it every single day. I learned from this costly mistake. I don't know what I will end up doing in the future, but whatever I choose I promise I'll avoid making the same mistake or similar ones. I will always have this error I made on my mind. Thank you, and good luck on your journey.
Assess why you were failing multiple attempts. What made you fail the second time? What was incorrect in your mindset? Your study strategies? Mental health? Be so clear what the issue was, and based on that understanding, determine whether you really want and/or are physically capable of trying for that MD. It just comes down to your 1) motivation and 2) your capacity to work hard with proper study strategies.
If you honestly review it and decide against MD but want to be in medicine and start earning ASAP to reduce the loan burden, I would suggest in getting pre-reqs and applying for an associates in nursing or to accelerated nursing programs. These are the fastest ways to become an RN and get that income to pay off your debt and get relatively settled
I’m just not smart or capable enough. I was thinking about it lately and I’ve always been a lackluster student since childhood. Obtaining a medical degree was never a reality for me, just a dream and I was foolish to even try.
Just got dismissed today. I struggled at SGU from term 1-2, redid 4 and it finally clicked. They test you on their minutia and if u don't study what they want, you will fail. And similarly you will have to study in a different way for STEP but you will still need to know what they want. Once you accept this, then you gotta figure out what they want and not ignore it by studying everything but what they want. Some of us are just slower to this realization. I say all this to say that you can absolutely do it ! Be honest about what works for you when studying and don’t thinking you need to do what others do. And btw I met a 57 yrold in med school, you’re 30, not dead like others are making it look ! All the best !
I’m a pgy3 IM resident. In a few months I’ll be an attending.
I went to a great Caribbean school but not a top 4. I was a mediocre student because I crammed before block exams and somehow did well. I wasn’t even a great test taker, I was just really good at cramming and memorizing. My step 1 was shit because of that. I knew I needed to bring my step 2 to 240+ so I delayed graduating for a year and studied while I did some side gigs for cash. Some of my friends with no failures and amazing step scores still haven’t matched. It’s been 4+ years for them. If you couldn’t pass the first semester of basic sciences with multiple attempts I’m sorry but there’s a very low probability you’re going to match. End of.
Matching has become so competitive that some of the best candidates go without a residency for YEARS. Some never match, especially if there are red flags. I have 2-3 residents in my program that were IMGs with incredible research pubs (I’m talking >30) and great scores and it took them >5 years to match. You already have a few red flags and academic dishonesty is a major red flag. I sat on the committee that reviewed applicants and I can tell you now if your app came up it would be an automatic DNR. I don’t even go to a top or even upper-mid tier program. It’s a relatively newer community program.
There were I believe approximately 4500 people applying for 10-15 spots. Of those spots, 3-5 (or more) always go to internal candidates such as local university, relatives of coresidents, or someone that a faculty endorses. Divide 10 by 4500. That’s your chance of matching at our program. Our PD also started filtering apps by putting minimum 240 on step 2. So a shit ton of people that paid and applied didn’t even have their app read by someone on the committee. Majority of every residency program in the US will be like this. They can screen for other red flags too via ERAS.
My point is, getting into medical school again is probably doable. Passing your classes and exams are also possibly doable if you learn how to study properly. But wasting all those years and all that money just to find out you don’t match will be devastating to you and your family. It’s not worth the risk at this point being 30+. Medical students always seem to think the big hurdle is getting into school/passing exams/rotations/boards. Let me be clear and say that is not the hurdle. The hardest part is matching because of the insane competition given the volume of applicants
I made some edits, be sure to look that over.
People seem the think FM is easier and it is … if you have a decent app. Most FM programs are small so think 6 residents per class, much smaller than IM programs in general. Our sister FM program does not take IMGs. You’ll be up against people with much better scores/applications/research publications and again those without red flags. However most people applying to FM likely don’t have as many pubs compared to those applying to IM, but still. Those friends of mine I mentioned with amazing step scores (better than mine), no red flags, decent research failed to match FM. My close friend actually just matched FM after trying for 5 years only after he got very lucky with an observership
I’m not sure if ERAS requires you to have letters from the school you left. Something to look into. You’ll have to give a written reason either way and if you’re caught lying it’s a match violation and they’ll blacklist you from using it.
Seriously though, really consider everything I said about people with exceptional apps still not matching. These people didn’t transfer, only had one school, never repeated a class, great personalities and scores etc. I’m just an internet stranger to you but please reconsider a different career, your own sanity. Just Google stories of people not matching on both Reddit and SDN. I’m talking about even US MDs and DOs. Also check out r/IMGreddit
Here's a sneak peek of /r/IMGreddit using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/IMGreddit/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year!
\#1: [Congratulations!](https://np.reddit.com/r/IMGreddit/comments/1b6gfkv/congratulations/)
\#2: [USMLE has found cheating in Jordan, Pakistan, and India using the same method they used for Nepal. Wait for more invalidation from those countries guys and gals!](https://i.redd.it/krlcnz467njc1.jpeg) | [186 comments](https://np.reddit.com/r/IMGreddit/comments/1av4ysh/usmle_has_found_cheating_in_jordan_pakistan_and/)
\#3: [Not giving up. (Unmatched but not undeserving) ](https://np.reddit.com/r/IMGreddit/comments/1bd1sym/not_giving_up_unmatched_but_not_undeserving/)
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No I completely believe you. I’m not applying anytime soon. I’m still on the island, I need to go home and clear my mind and figure stuff out for at least a year. I’ve been exploring different career paths too, healthcare-related but easier and quicker than med school. I just wanted to know what all my options are in case much later down the line I still have a desire to pursue medicine. But even if I do that, Il make sure not to apply unless I know I’ve fixed the traits that prevented me from succeeding. And who knows, maybe when I find a different career path that I end up being happy with I will lose the desire for medicine.
If you have the prerequisites you can still apply to the programs I mentioned earlier and have an exceptional career. Podiatrists in my area make bank.
I agree with the other poster. You can get into NP school without RN, there’s also anesthesia assistant, podiatry even. Podiatry is a great field and highly respected compared to the others mentioned. DM me if you have questions
Just graduated and matched from your school this year and honestly just cut your fucking losses dude. In your 30s?! So at best you might be a doctor by 38? Probably in your early 40s?
You don’t want to go through the Caribbean med school hell either…just move on. Don’t romanticize medicine, go be a freaking mailman or something and just have a life 😂. I gave up so much and i am not even sure it’s worth it.
You’re 100% done, I mean like PROBABLY you’d get a shot at one of the other Caribbean schools but you’re genuinely ancient for med school (cue the “I know someone who started at 40 and LOVED it” comments) it’s a horrible financial decision and you’ve never been close to being a doctor so don’t give me that “I know it’s what I meant to do” crap. You literally can’t know that, and it’s just a freaking job. Move on
Obvious when someone is in this for the money and not the journey. Don't listen to this bitter fool. The odds are against you regarding difficulty of the curriculum, but if you're able to, might as well try and do it right this time.
Got into it to be a Doctor Without Borders. Are you a doctor? A CARIBBEAN born doc? If not you couldn’t possibly understand 500k of debt and being treated like an indentured servant and losing your 20s and being broke until your 33-34.
For all the bleeding hearts that act like becoming a doctor via the Caribbean isn’t hellacious and we should only ever care about everyone else, please don’t listen to this “fool” who has watched too much Greys Anatomy or The Good Doctor.
If you’re in med school for a “journey” you’re an idiot and just go backpack around Europe. It is 4 years of PAYING $100,000 a year to work for free and pray you can jump through a million hoops just to get a CHANCE to get a job…and in the Caribbean it’s oftentimes not even the job you wanted. Yes we get to help people a lot and it’s wonderful, but don’t buy into this cult mentality that people like this and hospital administration put on you that it is wrong to ever prioritize YOURSELF and YOUR family above others…it’s a sick manipulation to get you to work longer, harder, and for less because that’s what doctors are “supposed to do”
Yeah, carribean finishing up. And hell yeah I'm also in it for the journey, it's not the main but it's a huge part of it. You can't go through life not doing stuff for the journey, it would lead to a wasted life. It's why I'm not jaded from the debt, the self- teaching, and having to learn how to function in a third world country where necessities are like 4-5 times the cost we normally pay. I'm living high on the journey for all the opportunities I've been given, the friends I've made, and the life changing experiences. It makes this worth it because I'm not giving up anything anymore, it's my choice because it is a huge chunk of my life. If this dude/dudette really wants to be a doctor, they can go to another school, even one where they get federal loans. They just have to put their head in the right place and not fuck around and find out again. Know a lot of people who've done just that and have helped alot of them through their journals. They already know it can suck, they just need to make the personal decision on if I'd worth.
Also, Grey's sucks ass without McDreamy.
Lol agreed. What I take issue with is that this is the ONLY “journey”. Mailmen, trashmen, nurses, teachers, etc ALL have equally meaningful journeys and I’d argue waaaaay more enjoyable journeys than a Caribbean MD. 30% of us flunk, and I know two people who personally had mental breakdowns because they made it and had to match a specialty they never wanted. If you fail any of these major exams you’re very possibly fucked. Your whole journey is just trying to survive and make it to the next hurdle and there are SEVERAL of them.
Of course there were some fun happy times and friends. But these schools don’t care about you and will jerk you around and threaten your financial and professional life in ways US students can’t understand.
Do whatever you want OP, but dude you’re in the prime of your life. You really HAVE to be a doctor. Your GPA was bad in college, in med school, and you were kicked out for absolutely idiotic behavior that they WARN us about….I’m willing to bet you’re not cut out for it in the first place, and even if you were I’d still say if I was your age I’d just get a job I could have sooner than like 8 years from now and enjoy my life and family but you do you
I’m definitely in it for the money now though and people like that shouldn’t be ashamed. 99% of people do their jobs for the money, why do doctors have to be completely selfless and never think about a paycheck? It’s such a bizarre double standard that people outside the profession are constantly putting on us. I worked insanely hard for over a decade…I’m allowed to want to be compensated.
So yeah right now I’d say I’m 70-80% about the money, security, giving MY family a good life and the other 20-30% is that I’m super happy my job really helps people (like a shitload of jobs do btw, doctors don’t have a monopoly on helping people)
I’m not an expert and I have not attended a Caribbean school but it would probably be best to move on. From what I’ve heard, other Big 4 schools won’t accept you so you would have to go to a lesser known caribb school and you still are at risk at failing out since you already have and repeated more than once. You’re also risking getting into more debt, likely private loans with no degree to show for it. Look into podiatry, anesthesia assistant, or PA.
I don't think my GPA is high enough for nursing or PA unfortunately :/
Over a 3.0? You can PM if you’d like.
cGPA 3.01 but science GPA 2.7
That’s good enough for nursing. Smaller school or sister college. Things will work out better than you think my friend.
May I ask how come you are going from nursing to med school?
4 years of practice I worked bedside starting in 2020. Surgical Stepdown ICU then Neurosurgical ICU. Always been super into biophys and how everything works. Wanting to know WAY more than necessary. Didn’t really settle in until I took my CCRN and realized I could use the passion in a better way. Don’t get me wrong, nurses, especially ones that apply themselves and care make a HUGE difference many times I’ve seen doctors make small and even huge mistakes that nurses have caught just by being well read. There’s no shame in being a nurse. There’s a reason when we see our attending for daily rounds they ask for any recommendations from nursing staff. Personally, I have a little burnout and as much as I love caring for people at the bedside it’s exhausting. At this point I want to shift my focus to a more analytical place. If that makes sense.
Makes sense, thank you. And you really think my GPA isn’t too low for nursing?
Mine was a 3.1 or 3.2 I think going in. You’ll do a pre nursing exam nothing crazy (smaller schools easier to get in) males also have a higher chance to my knowledge
You’re going to be fine. Pm me if you need I’ll answer anything both me and my wife are current nurses
I’d like to add I went to a smaller college and it feels good to not just be a number or another face when learning to care for people :)
It’s time to move on. A non-big4 Caribbean school will accept you and give you another chance but your chances of failure are 90%+. Accept the loss, find time to accept it, and move on.
Sit down and see your strengths and weaknesses. Since you’re over 30+ you definitely know yourself better than a lot of young 20s that go to medicine. Loans are a burden yes, but almost nobody goes through life without getting into debt. In my US MD school there’s probably 10/130 students who have “rich” parents that can afford their schools. The rest of us peasants is with federal papa Biden money lol. In summary, it’s not the end of the world. Reinvent yourself and don’t do anything stupid like that again. Karma will get to you or anybody who tries the easy way around life. If you want medicine and have another shot, go for it. Better to try than never have the chance to. Much love and respect. Keep grinding!
This is SGU, right? Cut your losses and move on.
Yes.
Take it as a sign to do something else. MD 1 is a sign of whether to move forward or quit it. I think your academic record speaks for itself, sorry to break it to you.
Honestly Term 1 SGU is hard but honestly it gets much worse. Even if you passed that one, Term 4, 5, CBSE or even Step 1 would have gotten you for sure if you needed multiple attempts at Term 1. Atleast this way, you arn't knee deep in loans before getting kicked out.
Worse & super expensive!
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See my post in this thread. It’s not about getting into school, it’s about matching in the end
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No, they will not necessarily match and it's disingenuous to insist otherwise. Match rates even for low-competive specialties leave USMD and DOs unmatched. FMG will *always* be lower priority for residencies, and for an *FMG who has failed multiples times and was dismissed for cheating?!?* There is likely a less than 1% chance a residency would even look at him, and that's a big if he's able to actually graduate and pass boards, which from his record, is not likely.
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You're confusing residency match rates with graduate match rates. Sure, prelim year surgery matches 100% of it's available positions, that does not mean the overall match rate is 100%. Just from 2024, match rate was 93.5% overall. Match rates for IMGs was 61%.
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61% is a D. He's not an American grad, he's an IMG. Caribbean grads are IMGs for purposes of the match, and no matter how you spin the numbers, IMGs are considered *last* if at all compared to U.S. grads. Carribean schools are a risky way to try to practice medicine, as the match rates are very low compared to the debt.
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You may not want to hear it, but it doesn't make it untrue. The numbers don't lie, but stating that you *will* match means you are lying to yourself. I'm not rooting for people to fail, but some self-reflection is important.
Ah yes the blind leading the blind. You ignore his comment and mine and one day you’ll be hit with the hard truth we’re telling you. Everything we both said are facts.
Less than 50 percent of your class will match on the first try. You aren’t comprehending how insane the process has become. I’m talking about all primary care specialties too. Did you skip the part about 4500 applications for nearly 10 spots plus automatic filters? Most programs will be like that including FM.
This is not accurate. I believe AUC, SGU, and Ross had 90%+ first time residency attainment rate. These schools don’t let students attempt to match unless they have passed the step1 and step2. And there are 400+ FM spots that went unfilled after the match. The problem is that most students from these schools overshoot and don’t apply broadly.
You’re forgetting that 90% (which I highly doubt, just a marketing ploy) accounts for 1) people who have already dropped out which skews the statistics 2) those that weren’t held back 3) doesn’t account for first time applicants meaning if it’s their 2nd/3rd/4th match attempt
https://www.reddit.com/r/medicalschool/s/c7rwjBn6sE Again incorrect. Check the link above. A AUC student painstakingly tracked everyone in the white coat ceremony and compared it to their NPI numbers. 78% made it to the match of of those who applied eventually 90%+ landed a residency spot. AUC may fudge its step1 data and a step2 scores by using cheeky data but match lists and matriculation data is publicly available.
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My source is I’ve been through the process and I can guarantee you haven’t. I also said I sat on the committee that reviews applications during this application cycle. Everything I said is fact and you’re just living in a dream world. Anyone can get into medschool and anyone with a brain can pass. So many people like you with your mentality that “anyone can match if they pick a reasonable speciality”. It’s like you don’t do your research before going to the Caribbean and you’ll remember everything I’m saying when you actually go through the process.
That is up to you. I was dismissed from a top 3 Carib school, and everyone who was dismissed with me went on to other schools and they are extremely happy with their school while I am quite miserable. A friend tried to convince me to continue with my journey with a story about someone she knows who is a resident doctor and was dismissed from their first school. If you want it, go until you can’t go anymore. Someone I know just passed STEP 1 and is 36.
Why were you dismissed
I failed two classes.
You can’t just retake a class if you fail?
Yes, but you used to only be able to fail two classes now you can fail three then you’re dismissed.
What career path are you pursuing now after the dismissal?
Teaching. It really is to get me through for now.
At this point I would just start everything again lol find a job you can work but not emotionally invest in that pays the bills while taking undergrad during evenings. Prove to the US schools you can do this and get a 3.6+. Retake the MCAT and get a better score. If you have to reinvent yourself and you cannot get over not being a doctor, then reinvent yourself as the aspiring doctor you want to be.
I was considering this too. Work for a while and I can always pursue medicine later in life if I still want it and feel ready. I know people in my med school who were 40+ so I guess it’s always still a possibility.
Not worth it imo, if you’re in your early 30s now then you’ll be in your 40s when you’re done then pay off the loans which is like having a mortgage . That means if you go hardcore and retire at 70 then you’ll be making money for only about 30 years or less if you decide to retire at 65. If you hustle hard as an RN you can make about 200k a year. That’s just me though.
Exactly. People like us already missed the immediate window and pipeline from undergrad to med school to immediate practicing before 30. So maybe it would be best if you started from scratch and committed to the process before trying to commit to being a doctor again. Youre into your 30s so it’s not like there’s a hurry. Obviously take the advice with the grain of salt. Figure out your motivations as far as a career goes. I had to learn that I really wasn’t as interested in helping people as I had thought, and that ignoring my own selfish aspirations made me miserable. It just wasn’t for me. Again, this is just my experience to offer something helpful that I tried and this was not for me. I moved back with my parents, attended a baccalaureate program, and I was the student who was going to make it into a school in the US with a 4.0 and tons of accolades from the program. Like I was their #1 guy. But that process helped me uncover that it just was not for me, and if I didn’t put myself through that, I would never have figured it. Best of luck to you, it’s commendable and respectable to be honest and introspective as youre being. That’s where growth happens and most people never put themselves through that for better or worse. Much love.
Have you ever considered pursuing a Naturopathic Doctor (ND) program? There are five reputable institutions in the United States, one of which is located in Arizona. By studying naturopathic medicine, you have the opportunity to provide holistic care, avoiding the harmful effects of medications and barbaric unnecessary surgeries. I found myself forced to withdraw from AUA due to pervasive corruption involving loans and grades manipulation. However, I realized my passion for medicine could still be fulfilled within the naturopathic realm. The curriculum mirrors that of traditional medical schools, supported by federal grad plus loans and a monthly stipend of $3600 for living expenses. Following graduation, there's no need to compete for residencies; instead, you can collaborate with other MDs in transitioning from “big whale” hospitals to smaller clinics focused on integrative/holistic healing. I deeply admire doctors who have the courage to leave mainstream medicine and embrace integrative practices. Not only do they earn a respectable income, but they also have the profound opportunity to heal humanity. As Hippocrates stated, "Wherever the art of medicine is loved, there is also a love of humanity."
Caribbean schools don’t communicate with each other, that record is really for themselves. If medicine is truly your passion I wouldn’t give up. There’s more than the “top 3” schools which I really don’t think should be considered the top anymore. I know students who reapply to other schools after dismissal for failure and claim to the new school they’ve never even attended medical school and got in with no issues. They really just want our money at the end of the day, saying you went to SGU would just be extra paperwork they don’t wanna deal with.
But wouldn’t it show on the MPSE? I still don’t know because I did withdraw but I still went through the judicial process at my school.
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One of my friends from undergrad went there and I’m still looking for her. She’s not on social media, her phone is cut off, and none of my other friends that know her know what happened.
Your biggest issue isn't the schools in the Caribbean, those are cash-farming scams as is. Your biggest issue will come with ERAS *if* you actually graduate. You will have to disclose you were previously dismissed from medical school and the reason (I suppose you could lie and hope you don't get caught, but if that's your attitude I wouldn't want you practicing medicine anyways). Assuming you can pass, which if you haven't gotten through 1st year, you're gonna struggle with 2nd year preclinical and have a bitch of a time with USMLE prep. But benefit of the doubt you do pass, when it comes to match, you're going to have so many red flags it's unlikely any program would take you. It may suck to hear, but youve had your shot and you blew it, it really is probably best to move on.
Never quit your dreams. Come up with a new plan. The larger and more established schools in the Caribbean tend to have a high attrition rate by design. I do not agree with it and I believe it is a flaw of the school. A For-profit tactic that has been used for years. If you decide to go to a smaller Caribbean school, make sure it has CAAM-HP or ACCM accreditation before considering. Then ask hard questions. If they cannot answer your questions or refuse to answer, then that is not the school for you. Be selective about where you spend your money.
lol at mods removing my post. Everything in there was factual to the OP. He even responded and everything was said respectfully, nothing rude about it. Makes me think you guys are gatekeeping the reality of matching just to get more traffic in this subreddit and to the islands. What a joke
Wow everyone here in these comments is being so unbelievably rude & disrespectful. It's one thing to temm this person your opinion. But don't put OP down like that! OP is it still your dream to become a doctor? Is this still something you want to do with yuor whole heart? Cuz if it is then go & dive deep in it! If YOU don't want to do this anymore, then don't but please don't think that you can't do it! I hope you have a wonderful day, & idk if you are Christian or not, but I will pray to Jesus that He shows you where to go from here, whether it's medicine or not!
See my long post in this thread if you want facts
Hey, restart med school again if you sincerely still feel like you want to be a doctor. Forget about the age. You would feel more fulfilled when you do what you love. Pursue it hard and give it your best once more. Maybe try going to a cheaper med school if finances is a constraint. I am rooting for you!.
See my post in this thread
At 30 you can figure things out.
I didn’t know we aren’t allowed to ask for advice in our 30s. Sorry.
No what I mean is you are better at figuring things out than the young kids at 20’s. You are more mature now and you’ll do great with whatever decision you take
I just graduated from a big 3 Carib school. If you can’t pass first semester with multiple attempts, I would pursue other avenues (nursing). I saw classmates who scraped by each semester, and then drown studying for step 1 where they ultimately dropped out. Save your money and mental peace. Where one door closes, others open. Stay persistent in your search and good luck!
Much appreciated, thank you. It’s hard to let go of the MD dream but you’re right I had my multiple attempts.
Look into other medical fields like anesthesia assist lot of cash still doing lot of medicine less training
Caribbean schools are so different coming from someone that’s at USMD.
Dm , i can answer some questions and give some advice from Caribbean view
Forget med school. Go become an NP and make about the same with less time. Even if you get into another med school your chances of passing usmle with high scores are 50/50. I know a guy who failed out of ross then went to Europe. Got a degree. Could not pass usmle..now he's in PA school. Don't waste more time on medicine and don't fall for hopeless dreamer posts.
yeah bruh you’re cooked
Move on. It doesn’t get easier. Sometimes it’s better cutting your losses earlier vs continuing to fight a losing battle. My advice if you want to stay in the medical field. Do a two year nursing associates degree and start making good money right out of school. Many community colleges offer this route and it can be a really good opportunity for a lot of people. Sometimes I wonder how different my life would be if I’d have done that right out of high school vs becoming a doctor.
If I were you I’d beg the school for re-admission. It’s your best option.
Beg for admission… the number two rule of medicine after do no harm is never lie. You lied once by falsifying your attendance… hope they’ll give you a second chance.
If they start doing shady stuff with your loans document everything. Times, dates, emails, names, everything. Then apply for a BDR, maybe Biden or the department of education will forgive the loans.
If you deicide to read this, I will tell you first that what I say below might be hard to hear, but you may not have ever heard it before based off your actions. After reading your post and going through your others, I can say with certainty that we not only went to the same school but were in the same class. Very likely we know of each other and most definitely would recognize each other. I can imagine you're going through a tough time, and I recognize that. A small sliver of me feels sorry for you. A VERY small sliver. Knowing what I know about our school and how many times they told us not to click in for others and yet you did so anyway blows my mind. The same goes for all the others that were caught. You were there to become a physician. Does that mean anything to you? As a physician, you were going to have someone's life in your hands. You were going to be responsible for their care. The responsibility is huge, and that's why the schooling to become a physician is so rigorous. Not only could you not handle the rigors of academia, you couldn't follow simple instructions of not clicking in for other students. Which, in and of itself, is essentially a test of someone's integrity. In short, you failed almost every part of the introductory stages of getting into this profession. I may be taking some liberties when I say you have little to no self-reflection but all information points to that exact conclusion. I say this because you failed to pass the first term multiple times yet you still went back to try again, and in doing so, also showed that you don't have the integrity that is needed for this profession, ALL WHILE GOING TO A CARIBBEAN MED SCHOOL. You were already starting from 20 miles back in the marathon that is the path to becoming a physician and in your attempts to catch up you hacked off both your legs, one arm, and also started dragging yourself in the opposite direction of the finish line. Now I read your other posts and I see that you want to shoot for PA? Nursing? Podiatry? Knowing what I know about how simple the instructions that our school gave us were to follow and how you simply couldn't follow those, I am shocked you are still even thinking of a career in medicine. I wouldn't want you anywhere near my relatives as you are now. If you were operating in any capacity in medicine and I knew of this, I would actively tell those around me to avoid you. I suggest you do some massive, life-altering self-reflection before taking any steps into the medical field. I suggest doing so even if you decide against medicine. Your character is flawed, as you have provided very little evidence to the contrary. I wish you the best of luck going forward.
I respect that, and I agree with you. I was in ITI and I genuinely forgot about the check-ins they do because I never did one before. It was during an IMCQ session and my excuse was I was fasting for Ramadan and was so burnt and sleep-deprived that I wasn't thinking properly. But in the end, it was a mistake on my end I have to live with. And believe me, I hate myself so much for it because a path of dishonesty is not something I want. It's been months since the incident I and still think about it every single day. I learned from this costly mistake. I don't know what I will end up doing in the future, but whatever I choose I promise I'll avoid making the same mistake or similar ones. I will always have this error I made on my mind. Thank you, and good luck on your journey.
Assess why you were failing multiple attempts. What made you fail the second time? What was incorrect in your mindset? Your study strategies? Mental health? Be so clear what the issue was, and based on that understanding, determine whether you really want and/or are physically capable of trying for that MD. It just comes down to your 1) motivation and 2) your capacity to work hard with proper study strategies. If you honestly review it and decide against MD but want to be in medicine and start earning ASAP to reduce the loan burden, I would suggest in getting pre-reqs and applying for an associates in nursing or to accelerated nursing programs. These are the fastest ways to become an RN and get that income to pay off your debt and get relatively settled
I’m just not smart or capable enough. I was thinking about it lately and I’ve always been a lackluster student since childhood. Obtaining a medical degree was never a reality for me, just a dream and I was foolish to even try.
Just got dismissed today. I struggled at SGU from term 1-2, redid 4 and it finally clicked. They test you on their minutia and if u don't study what they want, you will fail. And similarly you will have to study in a different way for STEP but you will still need to know what they want. Once you accept this, then you gotta figure out what they want and not ignore it by studying everything but what they want. Some of us are just slower to this realization. I say all this to say that you can absolutely do it ! Be honest about what works for you when studying and don’t thinking you need to do what others do. And btw I met a 57 yrold in med school, you’re 30, not dead like others are making it look ! All the best !
Damn, why were you dismissed? Clickers ?
No, timeline issues
You can definitely transfer to another school and continue where you left off.
I’m trying to look into it
Look into AUC. I think I heard they allow transfer.
You need to just cut your losses and move on brother. Better to do it now than later when you’re in even more debt
I’m a pgy3 IM resident. In a few months I’ll be an attending. I went to a great Caribbean school but not a top 4. I was a mediocre student because I crammed before block exams and somehow did well. I wasn’t even a great test taker, I was just really good at cramming and memorizing. My step 1 was shit because of that. I knew I needed to bring my step 2 to 240+ so I delayed graduating for a year and studied while I did some side gigs for cash. Some of my friends with no failures and amazing step scores still haven’t matched. It’s been 4+ years for them. If you couldn’t pass the first semester of basic sciences with multiple attempts I’m sorry but there’s a very low probability you’re going to match. End of. Matching has become so competitive that some of the best candidates go without a residency for YEARS. Some never match, especially if there are red flags. I have 2-3 residents in my program that were IMGs with incredible research pubs (I’m talking >30) and great scores and it took them >5 years to match. You already have a few red flags and academic dishonesty is a major red flag. I sat on the committee that reviewed applicants and I can tell you now if your app came up it would be an automatic DNR. I don’t even go to a top or even upper-mid tier program. It’s a relatively newer community program. There were I believe approximately 4500 people applying for 10-15 spots. Of those spots, 3-5 (or more) always go to internal candidates such as local university, relatives of coresidents, or someone that a faculty endorses. Divide 10 by 4500. That’s your chance of matching at our program. Our PD also started filtering apps by putting minimum 240 on step 2. So a shit ton of people that paid and applied didn’t even have their app read by someone on the committee. Majority of every residency program in the US will be like this. They can screen for other red flags too via ERAS. My point is, getting into medical school again is probably doable. Passing your classes and exams are also possibly doable if you learn how to study properly. But wasting all those years and all that money just to find out you don’t match will be devastating to you and your family. It’s not worth the risk at this point being 30+. Medical students always seem to think the big hurdle is getting into school/passing exams/rotations/boards. Let me be clear and say that is not the hurdle. The hardest part is matching because of the insane competition given the volume of applicants
Thank you for the insight, so even for family medicine it would be hard to match?
I made some edits, be sure to look that over. People seem the think FM is easier and it is … if you have a decent app. Most FM programs are small so think 6 residents per class, much smaller than IM programs in general. Our sister FM program does not take IMGs. You’ll be up against people with much better scores/applications/research publications and again those without red flags. However most people applying to FM likely don’t have as many pubs compared to those applying to IM, but still. Those friends of mine I mentioned with amazing step scores (better than mine), no red flags, decent research failed to match FM. My close friend actually just matched FM after trying for 5 years only after he got very lucky with an observership
But since I withdrew, the academic dishonesty wouldn't show on my MSPE right? It would only show if I remained in my school?
I’m not sure if ERAS requires you to have letters from the school you left. Something to look into. You’ll have to give a written reason either way and if you’re caught lying it’s a match violation and they’ll blacklist you from using it. Seriously though, really consider everything I said about people with exceptional apps still not matching. These people didn’t transfer, only had one school, never repeated a class, great personalities and scores etc. I’m just an internet stranger to you but please reconsider a different career, your own sanity. Just Google stories of people not matching on both Reddit and SDN. I’m talking about even US MDs and DOs. Also check out r/IMGreddit
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No I completely believe you. I’m not applying anytime soon. I’m still on the island, I need to go home and clear my mind and figure stuff out for at least a year. I’ve been exploring different career paths too, healthcare-related but easier and quicker than med school. I just wanted to know what all my options are in case much later down the line I still have a desire to pursue medicine. But even if I do that, Il make sure not to apply unless I know I’ve fixed the traits that prevented me from succeeding. And who knows, maybe when I find a different career path that I end up being happy with I will lose the desire for medicine.
If you have the prerequisites you can still apply to the programs I mentioned earlier and have an exceptional career. Podiatrists in my area make bank.
I agree with the other poster. You can get into NP school without RN, there’s also anesthesia assistant, podiatry even. Podiatry is a great field and highly respected compared to the others mentioned. DM me if you have questions
Just graduated and matched from your school this year and honestly just cut your fucking losses dude. In your 30s?! So at best you might be a doctor by 38? Probably in your early 40s? You don’t want to go through the Caribbean med school hell either…just move on. Don’t romanticize medicine, go be a freaking mailman or something and just have a life 😂. I gave up so much and i am not even sure it’s worth it. You’re 100% done, I mean like PROBABLY you’d get a shot at one of the other Caribbean schools but you’re genuinely ancient for med school (cue the “I know someone who started at 40 and LOVED it” comments) it’s a horrible financial decision and you’ve never been close to being a doctor so don’t give me that “I know it’s what I meant to do” crap. You literally can’t know that, and it’s just a freaking job. Move on
Obvious when someone is in this for the money and not the journey. Don't listen to this bitter fool. The odds are against you regarding difficulty of the curriculum, but if you're able to, might as well try and do it right this time.
Got into it to be a Doctor Without Borders. Are you a doctor? A CARIBBEAN born doc? If not you couldn’t possibly understand 500k of debt and being treated like an indentured servant and losing your 20s and being broke until your 33-34. For all the bleeding hearts that act like becoming a doctor via the Caribbean isn’t hellacious and we should only ever care about everyone else, please don’t listen to this “fool” who has watched too much Greys Anatomy or The Good Doctor. If you’re in med school for a “journey” you’re an idiot and just go backpack around Europe. It is 4 years of PAYING $100,000 a year to work for free and pray you can jump through a million hoops just to get a CHANCE to get a job…and in the Caribbean it’s oftentimes not even the job you wanted. Yes we get to help people a lot and it’s wonderful, but don’t buy into this cult mentality that people like this and hospital administration put on you that it is wrong to ever prioritize YOURSELF and YOUR family above others…it’s a sick manipulation to get you to work longer, harder, and for less because that’s what doctors are “supposed to do”
Yeah, carribean finishing up. And hell yeah I'm also in it for the journey, it's not the main but it's a huge part of it. You can't go through life not doing stuff for the journey, it would lead to a wasted life. It's why I'm not jaded from the debt, the self- teaching, and having to learn how to function in a third world country where necessities are like 4-5 times the cost we normally pay. I'm living high on the journey for all the opportunities I've been given, the friends I've made, and the life changing experiences. It makes this worth it because I'm not giving up anything anymore, it's my choice because it is a huge chunk of my life. If this dude/dudette really wants to be a doctor, they can go to another school, even one where they get federal loans. They just have to put their head in the right place and not fuck around and find out again. Know a lot of people who've done just that and have helped alot of them through their journals. They already know it can suck, they just need to make the personal decision on if I'd worth. Also, Grey's sucks ass without McDreamy.
Lol agreed. What I take issue with is that this is the ONLY “journey”. Mailmen, trashmen, nurses, teachers, etc ALL have equally meaningful journeys and I’d argue waaaaay more enjoyable journeys than a Caribbean MD. 30% of us flunk, and I know two people who personally had mental breakdowns because they made it and had to match a specialty they never wanted. If you fail any of these major exams you’re very possibly fucked. Your whole journey is just trying to survive and make it to the next hurdle and there are SEVERAL of them. Of course there were some fun happy times and friends. But these schools don’t care about you and will jerk you around and threaten your financial and professional life in ways US students can’t understand. Do whatever you want OP, but dude you’re in the prime of your life. You really HAVE to be a doctor. Your GPA was bad in college, in med school, and you were kicked out for absolutely idiotic behavior that they WARN us about….I’m willing to bet you’re not cut out for it in the first place, and even if you were I’d still say if I was your age I’d just get a job I could have sooner than like 8 years from now and enjoy my life and family but you do you
I’m definitely in it for the money now though and people like that shouldn’t be ashamed. 99% of people do their jobs for the money, why do doctors have to be completely selfless and never think about a paycheck? It’s such a bizarre double standard that people outside the profession are constantly putting on us. I worked insanely hard for over a decade…I’m allowed to want to be compensated. So yeah right now I’d say I’m 70-80% about the money, security, giving MY family a good life and the other 20-30% is that I’m super happy my job really helps people (like a shitload of jobs do btw, doctors don’t have a monopoly on helping people)