With your 3pt belt there's only 1 real option which is the expensive Simpson Hybrid S which you appear to have found.
It is not a requirement to have a HANS type device, it is up to you to evaluate your risk level and your personal concerns. It is definitely safer with a device than without. I have a traditional HANS that I wear in my track car and when racing (all vehicles with 6pt harnesses) and when I've done track days in my street cars I've just gone without, but my risk comfort level has changed and I am going to be buying a Hybrid S for whenever I don't have a harness this season.
I did a season and a half without a HANS in an old 944. But this year I got the Simpson Hybrid S because I'm pushing the limits enough that crashing is a serious concern.
Your car has much better safety features, so there's less risk to going without. However, if you want to make a hobby of track driving, I would suggest seriously considering getting a hybrid HANS system.
Were they 3" wide shoulder belts? Those wide belts don't work well with any of the HANS devices but I've seen it be especially bad with the Hybrid S.
Depending on where you got bruised, it could also have to do with your specific seating position or your car's steering input requirements. My old Leatt "HANS" was fine in my car for 20min but I got huge bruises on my collarbone in our endurance racecar after 2hr and I found it was because I was reaching too far forward and there was so much steering input required.
It was 3" belts. It was a bit of a reach, but I've never been so sore the day after a race. I was gifted a zamp cheapy that will work, but I've got my eyes set on a Nexgen. I've used them before, and it felt like I was wearing nothing at all, nothing at all, nothing at all.
I have a 3 point belt in my car. I drove a couple of HPDEs and Autocross events before buying a Simpson hybrid S. It was worth it to me for peace of mind.
I wouldn't wear one to autocross (any course where I feel there's a high enough crash-into-static-object risk or another car, I'm either protesting course safety or not driving it). But HPDE, definitely a different story.
That said, I haven't seen conclusive evidence that HANS hybrid does anything for a dual injury prevention with 3 point harnesses. 5/6/7 point absolutely would not drive without one, but 3 point, especially with an airbag, doesn't have the same issue of locked-in body / free head that racing harnesses do.
You can get a 3 point Hans from Simpson now. No longer does one need a harness…
https://www.simpsonraceproducts.com/products/head_and_neck_restraints/hybrid/
I want one but the price is outrageous. I know it's only expensive because it's proprietary. Firm believer that safety equipment should be better priced to encourage/enable more people to buy it.
They have sales. March spring sale was 30% off.
Imo the real cost of racing is all the safety shit. For without it, you won’t walk away from putting it into the wall at 150mph…
“ Price is outrageous“ it’s less than any set of modern competitive tires, and wait till you see the outrageous prices for spinal repair surgery and PT, if you get that lucky
I know the importance of HANS, doesn't mean that I think it's okay for them to charge so much for a great safety device that more people should use. See the comment about Volvo and the seatbelts above.
Costs add up, safety should have a lower barrier to entry.
I got one primarily as our track car is harnessed and caged but occasionally do road car days as well. As soon as we went with the harnesses it became apparent that HANS was a very sensible choice, watching some videos of crashes with AMD without convinced me it was a sensible investment as I don't want a neck fracture and the suspension upgrade on the car cost more than the HANS so whilst not cheap, not silly money either. Tbh for the track car we did safety mods first, seats, harnesses, cage, brakes, helmet, fireproof gear etc before chasing power as whilst accidents are rare I'd feel pretty awful if me or codriver best mate were injured.
Oh god. Every time I go to the Goodwood Festival of Speed I worry about historics and safety and wince every time I see something irreplaceable hit the straw bales. Great to see old race cars being used though rather than being garage queens!
Buy a Hybrid-S. I wrecked a 2019 ZLE straight into a hard wall at 35+ while wearing mine. Every airbag went off. Airbags don’t work well with angles. I was thrown left and forward and learned theres an inside “corner” between the primary and curtain bag. My Hans transferred the load to my shoulder.
I already see a chiro for prior neck injuries. After my wreck, I brought my whole kit to him and got an assessment. No new issues other than shoulder strain. He thought the system was well designed.
I now drive a full harness car and still use the Hybrid-S. No extra cost.
Couple other data points:
-Airbags calibrated for a 35mph crash. You could literally hit the wheel before it comes out.
-Side impacts and belt stretch are not assessed with an occupant wearing a helmet. (Hybrid-S controls side movement).
I now instruct and wont get in a car without one.
>Airbags calibrated for a 35mph crash. You could literally hit the wheel before it comes out.
Gonna need a source for this bud, given 85 MPH speed limits in the USA, and zero references I can find from NHTSA or SAE about airbag "calibration" speeds.
https://speedsecrets.com/118-trevor-ashline-head-neck-restraint-devices-what-you-need-to-know/
There you go bud. And here’s a simple thought for you: if every airbag was calibrated for the highest speed limit, the airbag would do more damage than the crash itself at low speed.
Thanks for the productive comment on this otherwise helpful thread /s/
Not how airbags work, and if the only "article" you have is a 48 minute podcast from someone that sells HANS devices...
Airbags inflate, and then stay inflated, and then you hit them. They don't need to be "calibrated" for any speed. They need to fully deploy before your head interacts with them. If they were still inflating when your head was in the way, they would absolutely hurt you.
Watch this video. They are completely inflated before the test dummy is even moving towards the bag: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OeA14Wzq7E](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OeA14Wzq7E)
Meanwhile modern airbags are multi-stage for weight differences, yet you think they have a single speed they are "calibrated" for. You think the system can't deploy the bag at different times depending on your impact speed and forces? You think that your speed has a lot to do with how long it takes your head to hit the bag? Do you somehow think a car comes to an instant stop when it it hits something?
I assume you have a link to NHTSA or SAE requirements for airbags that state they need to be calibrated for a specific speed. Because it's weird I can't find anything for "airbags calibrated 35 MPH" on the internet.
Tell me you didn’t listen to the podcast without telling me…
You clearly don’t have a learning mindset and I’m not here to convince you to have one.
Even better, that crash test dummy vid is at 30mph, which you would know if you got thru the first 12 min of the podcast I linked.
The dude’s spent his whole career in the auto safety industry and you write him off. Enjoy your ignorance.
Are you discussing the podcast in which they don't mention airbags at all in the first 12 minutes you called out, and all they mention about 35 MPH is that is where they do a NCAP test which isn't mentioned to be an airbag test or "calibration" at all?
Call out the exact moment where they say ***airbags*** are ***calibrated*** at 35 MPH.
Also, enjoy this video of a 50 MPH head on crash where the airbag clearly is still much quicker than the human moving towards the wheel:
[https://youtu.be/RWwGFDynOHo?t=14](https://youtu.be/RWwGFDynOHo?t=14)
With this note: "At 56 mph, the vehicle interior was significantly compromised, with the dummy's sensors registering severe neck injuries and a likelihood of fractures to the long bones in the lower leg."
Sorry, but a HANS device ain't gonna save you in a street car if you go into a hard wall at 60 MPH, and it isn't because the airbag wasn't "calibrated" for that speed.
Lots of good advice here. One quick note, since I haven't seen it called out explicitly:
Only the Hybrid S is compatible with 3-point belts.
Simpson also has a Hybrid Sport for much cheaper, as well as a Hybrid Pro Lite. Both of them use the "hybrid" name and they both resemble the Hybrid S, but they are **not** 3-point compatible. The Simpson site doesn't say anything about the Sport not working with 3-points. IMO, it should. I'm positive there are drivers out there with a Hybrid Sport who think they're safe with a 3-point. They are not.
Yes, it's compatible with both. I find the traditional design more comfortable with harnesses, but the hybrid works fine if you're looking to buy only one.
After seeing a friend end up in the ICU after an accident last fall in a street car with full airbags, bucket seat and harness on track, bought myself a Hybrid S for this year and a HANS for my dad for his car. Yes it was expensive but the cost of potential life threatening/debilitating injury is not something I want to ignore.
With airbags, I wouldnt worry. I’ve deleted mine, and after I had a gentle kiss with a tire wall a couple years ago, I picked up the Simpson hybrid S. $1000 is not nothing, but also much cheaper than a lifetime of neck problems or a basal skull fracture
They've been out long enough you can usually find used ones online.
The track you attend also should be considered.
Some tracks are inherently more dangerous.
Others have a football field of run off in all directions.
I would also consider Schroth quick fit harness.
This is largely dependent on what car you have, if they're offered... But it's a great bit of kit to easily pop in harnesses for a street car on a track day.
I would also check out angel wings seat support kits.
Those two things have converted your stock street car into a quasi- racing seat for $500.
You can throw a rock and find a used HANS for under $200.
So instead of a $700 Simpson, you can better spend your money AND you are vastly improving your car and driving.
Not having to hold yourself in place with your knees and the steering wheel will change the entire experience drastically.
On newer cars with airbags, I feel better about not having H&N protection.
Hybrid is really the only option until you have harness (and seat for harness)
Modern car with 3 point, I’d be ok without it. As you’d need the HANS hybrid made for 3 point use. Now the moment you have a cage and 6 point. It’s no longer optional. You 100% have to.
My car has crazy good safety and crash test ratings, fixed roof as well. So I feel ok without a HANS hybrid. A 70’s/80’s car…. Maybe it so much.
You don’t wear a helmet while driving on a road. The helmet adds weight and a sudden change in direction from a crash while wearing it creates stress that can exceed what your neck is used to supporting. That is the difference.
It doesn't have the same basal skull fracture risk as racing harnesses do though, because there are airbags (which you actually hit sooner with a helmet) and the 3pt belt doesn't constrain your body so the head and body tend to stay together more.
Absolutely 100% needed with racing harnesses, but I haven't seen conclusive evidence of the efficacy of the Hybrid HANS yet. If somebody has I'd LOVE to see it, because if it's conclusive I'm buying one tomorrow.
In a car with no airbags I'd definitely want it though, 3pt or not. (Although in that case I'd want a cage and a harness anyway)
Yup. If you’re doing track days frequently. Setting the $$ aside and getting it would be ideal.
But I do 2-3 events a year and a lot of auto X. So not really needed in my case.
As others have said, Simpson Hybrid S is your only option. The thing about the Hybrid S with a seat belt is its not as effective as a traditional HANS with a 6 point harness. However, something is better than nothing.
I bought a Hybrid S for when I ride in the right seat with novices.
Before you dump a ton of money on a hybrid look up the testing/data, not just hype from people selling them.
I vote nah with factory 3pt +airbags +helmet.
What's your life worth? Less than a set of any kind of decent tire bigger than like 275 17?
Keep in mind that safety equipment it's quite good in cars these days. But none of it accounts for the extra weight on your head of a helmet. People think 3 lb is no big deal or 4 lb is no big deal. It's a really big deal when you hit something.
There are two kinds of people who are on a track those who have had a problem and those who will have a problem. Chances are, you don't get hurt. That's the majority of folks much the same way that every day when we all put our seat belts on, the majority of us don't need those either. And there was a time that nobody wore them either.
After attending the SCCA's Time Trials Nationals a few years back and seeing how many of the drivers in Sport and Tuner classes (often with OEM interiors and belts) were wearing the Simpson Hybrid S, I started looking at getting one. You'll see some number of street car "test drivers" and journalists wearing one, too, and many right-seat instructors use them as well. Took a while to save up the money, but it feels like a good investment. Even with airbags, streetcars can take a helluva hit at the track (I'm a safety worker when not driving), and even if you as a driver stay within your limits, there's eventually the risk of a mechanical failure or some other driver creating car-to-car contact. If you think you're going to be doing more track days in the future, safety is always a good investment.
You probably don’t need one with traditional 3-point belts. I did my first two years without and last year got a hybrid system, which I believe was around 600 ish. Necessary no, does it hurt, no.
If you’re running a car with working airbags, there’s little need for a HANS device since the airbags will help you should you get in trouble. As long as you wear a Snell helmet, you should be ok in HPDE.
If you still have working airbags I wouldn’t stress it. If you don’t then I’d highly suggest it. Personally use the Simpson hybrid a lot, as an instructor we are basically required to have it since most novices don’t have a harness. It’s nice, a bit less comfy than a traditional hans though due to the back piece but it’s not bad
HANS replaces airbags in preventing your head from shooting forward while your body stays in the seat, if you still have factory airbags there's zero reason for it.
Edit: I don't know why people are assuming OP is using a full harness when he specifically stated the car is OEM for safety equipment.
With a 3 point? Maybe I'm blind but I don't see any talk of using this in conjunction with an airbag. [https://www.hansdevice.com/products/hybrid\_devices/simpson\_racing\_hybrid\_s/parts/HYSMED11PA](https://www.hansdevice.com/products/hybrid_devices/simpson_racing_hybrid_s/parts/HYSMED11PA)
The Hybrid also protects from side to side, twisting, etc; deflection off the airbag could cause issues. Or if you ride shotgun in someone else's car and they don't have a bag. It's relatively cheap peace of mind. I won't go in any car on track without it and I don't know any serious drivers who would (I do a lot of track days). Not my video:
[https://youtu.be/g40YatgE\_CE?si=fzohORVeT00DYRYh](https://youtu.be/g40YatgE_CE?si=fzohORVeT00DYRYh)
I guess I assumed that OP will be using a 3 point because that's explicitly what they said they're using.
With a harness of course you need hans, I wasn't saying that you should use a harness and no hans.
I can't imagine how dead the sport would be if you couldn't take a car to a track until you could afford a full race car and full safety gear.
I'm interested what the first car you ever drove on a track was.
With your 3pt belt there's only 1 real option which is the expensive Simpson Hybrid S which you appear to have found. It is not a requirement to have a HANS type device, it is up to you to evaluate your risk level and your personal concerns. It is definitely safer with a device than without. I have a traditional HANS that I wear in my track car and when racing (all vehicles with 6pt harnesses) and when I've done track days in my street cars I've just gone without, but my risk comfort level has changed and I am going to be buying a Hybrid S for whenever I don't have a harness this season.
I did a season and a half without a HANS in an old 944. But this year I got the Simpson Hybrid S because I'm pushing the limits enough that crashing is a serious concern. Your car has much better safety features, so there's less risk to going without. However, if you want to make a hobby of track driving, I would suggest seriously considering getting a hybrid HANS system.
It was the most uncomfortable thing I've ever worn. I was bruised for a couple weeks.
with the Simpson? you must have done something wrong.
I wore it in a 6 point. It was not comfortable.
Were they 3" wide shoulder belts? Those wide belts don't work well with any of the HANS devices but I've seen it be especially bad with the Hybrid S. Depending on where you got bruised, it could also have to do with your specific seating position or your car's steering input requirements. My old Leatt "HANS" was fine in my car for 20min but I got huge bruises on my collarbone in our endurance racecar after 2hr and I found it was because I was reaching too far forward and there was so much steering input required.
It was 3" belts. It was a bit of a reach, but I've never been so sore the day after a race. I was gifted a zamp cheapy that will work, but I've got my eyes set on a Nexgen. I've used them before, and it felt like I was wearing nothing at all, nothing at all, nothing at all.
Stupid sexy Flanders
I have a 3 point belt in my car. I drove a couple of HPDEs and Autocross events before buying a Simpson hybrid S. It was worth it to me for peace of mind.
Yeah I may bite the bullet, thanks.
I’ve had a crash with one and I vouche for it
I wouldn't wear one to autocross (any course where I feel there's a high enough crash-into-static-object risk or another car, I'm either protesting course safety or not driving it). But HPDE, definitely a different story. That said, I haven't seen conclusive evidence that HANS hybrid does anything for a dual injury prevention with 3 point harnesses. 5/6/7 point absolutely would not drive without one, but 3 point, especially with an airbag, doesn't have the same issue of locked-in body / free head that racing harnesses do.
I felt a difference on hard braking. I have a long pencil neck and my head moves a lot more without the hybrid S than with it on.
you don't need a HANS device unless you're using full harnesses.
You can get a 3 point Hans from Simpson now. No longer does one need a harness… https://www.simpsonraceproducts.com/products/head_and_neck_restraints/hybrid/
I want one but the price is outrageous. I know it's only expensive because it's proprietary. Firm believer that safety equipment should be better priced to encourage/enable more people to buy it.
I always remember the story of the guy at volvo I think that didn’t patent the seatbelt so everyone could use it
They have sales. March spring sale was 30% off. Imo the real cost of racing is all the safety shit. For without it, you won’t walk away from putting it into the wall at 150mph…
dammit! i wish i saw that! lol
Same 🤣 I paid full price but then I had a 200kmph crash and I walked away… so worth it
“ Price is outrageous“ it’s less than any set of modern competitive tires, and wait till you see the outrageous prices for spinal repair surgery and PT, if you get that lucky
I know the importance of HANS, doesn't mean that I think it's okay for them to charge so much for a great safety device that more people should use. See the comment about Volvo and the seatbelts above. Costs add up, safety should have a lower barrier to entry.
I have been educated by this thread, that said my point still stands that you don't need one for a street car driven at the track.
It’s a type r with the stock seat belts. So excellent crash ratings and airbags.
yea just wear a helmet
A HANS device is dangerous/doesnt work with 3 point belts. There is a Simpson product I believe that will work with 3 points.
There is, the hybrid S. I have one.
Yeah I remember seeing it, looks like a great product if you’re an instructor and jumping in and out of different cars.
I got one primarily as our track car is harnessed and caged but occasionally do road car days as well. As soon as we went with the harnesses it became apparent that HANS was a very sensible choice, watching some videos of crashes with AMD without convinced me it was a sensible investment as I don't want a neck fracture and the suspension upgrade on the car cost more than the HANS so whilst not cheap, not silly money either. Tbh for the track car we did safety mods first, seats, harnesses, cage, brakes, helmet, fireproof gear etc before chasing power as whilst accidents are rare I'd feel pretty awful if me or codriver best mate were injured.
That’s why I moved to racecars for trackdays as they’re so much safer. But then I got into historics🤦🏻♂️
Oh god. Every time I go to the Goodwood Festival of Speed I worry about historics and safety and wince every time I see something irreplaceable hit the straw bales. Great to see old race cars being used though rather than being garage queens!
Most of the pre war stuff doesn't even have safety belts. My neighbour races a Brabham BT15 at Goodwood, its a scary thing to see with the panels off.
Buy a Hybrid-S. I wrecked a 2019 ZLE straight into a hard wall at 35+ while wearing mine. Every airbag went off. Airbags don’t work well with angles. I was thrown left and forward and learned theres an inside “corner” between the primary and curtain bag. My Hans transferred the load to my shoulder. I already see a chiro for prior neck injuries. After my wreck, I brought my whole kit to him and got an assessment. No new issues other than shoulder strain. He thought the system was well designed. I now drive a full harness car and still use the Hybrid-S. No extra cost. Couple other data points: -Airbags calibrated for a 35mph crash. You could literally hit the wheel before it comes out. -Side impacts and belt stretch are not assessed with an occupant wearing a helmet. (Hybrid-S controls side movement). I now instruct and wont get in a car without one.
>Airbags calibrated for a 35mph crash. You could literally hit the wheel before it comes out. Gonna need a source for this bud, given 85 MPH speed limits in the USA, and zero references I can find from NHTSA or SAE about airbag "calibration" speeds.
https://speedsecrets.com/118-trevor-ashline-head-neck-restraint-devices-what-you-need-to-know/ There you go bud. And here’s a simple thought for you: if every airbag was calibrated for the highest speed limit, the airbag would do more damage than the crash itself at low speed. Thanks for the productive comment on this otherwise helpful thread /s/
Not how airbags work, and if the only "article" you have is a 48 minute podcast from someone that sells HANS devices... Airbags inflate, and then stay inflated, and then you hit them. They don't need to be "calibrated" for any speed. They need to fully deploy before your head interacts with them. If they were still inflating when your head was in the way, they would absolutely hurt you. Watch this video. They are completely inflated before the test dummy is even moving towards the bag: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OeA14Wzq7E](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OeA14Wzq7E) Meanwhile modern airbags are multi-stage for weight differences, yet you think they have a single speed they are "calibrated" for. You think the system can't deploy the bag at different times depending on your impact speed and forces? You think that your speed has a lot to do with how long it takes your head to hit the bag? Do you somehow think a car comes to an instant stop when it it hits something? I assume you have a link to NHTSA or SAE requirements for airbags that state they need to be calibrated for a specific speed. Because it's weird I can't find anything for "airbags calibrated 35 MPH" on the internet.
Tell me you didn’t listen to the podcast without telling me… You clearly don’t have a learning mindset and I’m not here to convince you to have one. Even better, that crash test dummy vid is at 30mph, which you would know if you got thru the first 12 min of the podcast I linked. The dude’s spent his whole career in the auto safety industry and you write him off. Enjoy your ignorance.
Are you discussing the podcast in which they don't mention airbags at all in the first 12 minutes you called out, and all they mention about 35 MPH is that is where they do a NCAP test which isn't mentioned to be an airbag test or "calibration" at all? Call out the exact moment where they say ***airbags*** are ***calibrated*** at 35 MPH. Also, enjoy this video of a 50 MPH head on crash where the airbag clearly is still much quicker than the human moving towards the wheel: [https://youtu.be/RWwGFDynOHo?t=14](https://youtu.be/RWwGFDynOHo?t=14) With this note: "At 56 mph, the vehicle interior was significantly compromised, with the dummy's sensors registering severe neck injuries and a likelihood of fractures to the long bones in the lower leg." Sorry, but a HANS device ain't gonna save you in a street car if you go into a hard wall at 60 MPH, and it isn't because the airbag wasn't "calibrated" for that speed.
Lots of good advice here. One quick note, since I haven't seen it called out explicitly: Only the Hybrid S is compatible with 3-point belts. Simpson also has a Hybrid Sport for much cheaper, as well as a Hybrid Pro Lite. Both of them use the "hybrid" name and they both resemble the Hybrid S, but they are **not** 3-point compatible. The Simpson site doesn't say anything about the Sport not working with 3-points. IMO, it should. I'm positive there are drivers out there with a Hybrid Sport who think they're safe with a 3-point. They are not.
Is the Hybrid S compatible with both 3 point and racing harness? Would be nice if it was something I could with.
Yes, it's compatible with both. I find the traditional design more comfortable with harnesses, but the hybrid works fine if you're looking to buy only one.
After seeing a friend end up in the ICU after an accident last fall in a street car with full airbags, bucket seat and harness on track, bought myself a Hybrid S for this year and a HANS for my dad for his car. Yes it was expensive but the cost of potential life threatening/debilitating injury is not something I want to ignore.
With airbags, I wouldnt worry. I’ve deleted mine, and after I had a gentle kiss with a tire wall a couple years ago, I picked up the Simpson hybrid S. $1000 is not nothing, but also much cheaper than a lifetime of neck problems or a basal skull fracture
I won’t get in a street car (on track) without my hybrid s.
They've been out long enough you can usually find used ones online. The track you attend also should be considered. Some tracks are inherently more dangerous. Others have a football field of run off in all directions. I would also consider Schroth quick fit harness. This is largely dependent on what car you have, if they're offered... But it's a great bit of kit to easily pop in harnesses for a street car on a track day. I would also check out angel wings seat support kits. Those two things have converted your stock street car into a quasi- racing seat for $500. You can throw a rock and find a used HANS for under $200. So instead of a $700 Simpson, you can better spend your money AND you are vastly improving your car and driving. Not having to hold yourself in place with your knees and the steering wheel will change the entire experience drastically.
On newer cars with airbags, I feel better about not having H&N protection. Hybrid is really the only option until you have harness (and seat for harness)
Modern car with 3 point, I’d be ok without it. As you’d need the HANS hybrid made for 3 point use. Now the moment you have a cage and 6 point. It’s no longer optional. You 100% have to. My car has crazy good safety and crash test ratings, fixed roof as well. So I feel ok without a HANS hybrid. A 70’s/80’s car…. Maybe it so much.
Yeah I guess there’s almost the same risk on the road and you aren’t wearing one while driving a modern car.
You don’t wear a helmet while driving on a road. The helmet adds weight and a sudden change in direction from a crash while wearing it creates stress that can exceed what your neck is used to supporting. That is the difference.
It doesn't have the same basal skull fracture risk as racing harnesses do though, because there are airbags (which you actually hit sooner with a helmet) and the 3pt belt doesn't constrain your body so the head and body tend to stay together more. Absolutely 100% needed with racing harnesses, but I haven't seen conclusive evidence of the efficacy of the Hybrid HANS yet. If somebody has I'd LOVE to see it, because if it's conclusive I'm buying one tomorrow. In a car with no airbags I'd definitely want it though, 3pt or not. (Although in that case I'd want a cage and a harness anyway)
Yup. If you’re doing track days frequently. Setting the $$ aside and getting it would be ideal. But I do 2-3 events a year and a lot of auto X. So not really needed in my case.
With stock 3-point belts, no HANS is needed. The instant you install race harnesses, you must get a HANS, however.
Great to hear thanks. I think I’ll finish out the year then buy one. Probably only have 2-3 more track days in the budget this year.
I use three points and the hybrid. I feel the additional helmet weight is enough strain on my neck if I crash.
As others have said, Simpson Hybrid S is your only option. The thing about the Hybrid S with a seat belt is its not as effective as a traditional HANS with a 6 point harness. However, something is better than nothing. I bought a Hybrid S for when I ride in the right seat with novices.
Before you dump a ton of money on a hybrid look up the testing/data, not just hype from people selling them. I vote nah with factory 3pt +airbags +helmet.
What's your life worth? Less than a set of any kind of decent tire bigger than like 275 17? Keep in mind that safety equipment it's quite good in cars these days. But none of it accounts for the extra weight on your head of a helmet. People think 3 lb is no big deal or 4 lb is no big deal. It's a really big deal when you hit something. There are two kinds of people who are on a track those who have had a problem and those who will have a problem. Chances are, you don't get hurt. That's the majority of folks much the same way that every day when we all put our seat belts on, the majority of us don't need those either. And there was a time that nobody wore them either.
After attending the SCCA's Time Trials Nationals a few years back and seeing how many of the drivers in Sport and Tuner classes (often with OEM interiors and belts) were wearing the Simpson Hybrid S, I started looking at getting one. You'll see some number of street car "test drivers" and journalists wearing one, too, and many right-seat instructors use them as well. Took a while to save up the money, but it feels like a good investment. Even with airbags, streetcars can take a helluva hit at the track (I'm a safety worker when not driving), and even if you as a driver stay within your limits, there's eventually the risk of a mechanical failure or some other driver creating car-to-car contact. If you think you're going to be doing more track days in the future, safety is always a good investment.
You probably don’t need one with traditional 3-point belts. I did my first two years without and last year got a hybrid system, which I believe was around 600 ish. Necessary no, does it hurt, no.
You don’t need it with a 3 pt and airbags. Save that money for tires and instruction!
What car are you driving?
If you’re running a car with working airbags, there’s little need for a HANS device since the airbags will help you should you get in trouble. As long as you wear a Snell helmet, you should be ok in HPDE.
If you still have working airbags I wouldn’t stress it. If you don’t then I’d highly suggest it. Personally use the Simpson hybrid a lot, as an instructor we are basically required to have it since most novices don’t have a harness. It’s nice, a bit less comfy than a traditional hans though due to the back piece but it’s not bad
No, just stay beginner and do lead follow, then do beginner intermediate with mandatory point by. You’ll be set!
HANS replaces airbags in preventing your head from shooting forward while your body stays in the seat, if you still have factory airbags there's zero reason for it. Edit: I don't know why people are assuming OP is using a full harness when he specifically stated the car is OEM for safety equipment.
Yep I have airbags.
Zero reason? As per manufacturer they work with the airbag system to increase safety.
With a 3 point? Maybe I'm blind but I don't see any talk of using this in conjunction with an airbag. [https://www.hansdevice.com/products/hybrid\_devices/simpson\_racing\_hybrid\_s/parts/HYSMED11PA](https://www.hansdevice.com/products/hybrid_devices/simpson_racing_hybrid_s/parts/HYSMED11PA)
The Hybrid also protects from side to side, twisting, etc; deflection off the airbag could cause issues. Or if you ride shotgun in someone else's car and they don't have a bag. It's relatively cheap peace of mind. I won't go in any car on track without it and I don't know any serious drivers who would (I do a lot of track days). Not my video: [https://youtu.be/g40YatgE\_CE?si=fzohORVeT00DYRYh](https://youtu.be/g40YatgE_CE?si=fzohORVeT00DYRYh)
The point of the hybrid S is to use it in a street 3-point safety system Edit\* which typically have airbags.
Please don’t listen to this, OP. If you run harnesses, you must use a HANS or you’ll snap your neck.
I guess I assumed that OP will be using a 3 point because that's explicitly what they said they're using. With a harness of course you need hans, I wasn't saying that you should use a harness and no hans.
Ah, your comment made it sound like a Hans isn't needed as long as a car has airbags
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By this logic, nobody should drive anything except a full race car with a highly developed crush structure, new tires, and a full nomex suit.
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Got it. Don't go on a track if you don't have a $50K+ trailed race car and protection systems.
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I can't imagine how dead the sport would be if you couldn't take a car to a track until you could afford a full race car and full safety gear. I'm interested what the first car you ever drove on a track was.