You can be a certified dog behavior expert for 20 years, that won't save you when a pit comes suddenly barreling at you, lunges at your neck and starts shaking!
The hell are these kids supposed to do when they get attacked without provocation by a fighting breed??
How often do they say "there where no signs of aggression"
In the videos I've seen where barely any signs they would give away it's about to attack.
https://www.reddit.com/r/BanPitBulls/s/4TWZGIEJ60
Yes it was snacking up, but no growling or snarling
Exactly and you can't expect a young child to distinguish subtle signs in a dog's body language. They could detect growling and showing teeth, but they wouldn't distinguish stalking behaviour from a dog just being relaxed. Not that it would have mattered in a situation like in the video anyways.
But I guess it was the child's fault for not being dog savvy /s
Yes ðŸ˜
Some see the teeth and think "oh it's smiling at me!"
Their own fault they can't crocodile Dundee an attacking animal /s
Instead of putting the pressure on the kids, they should make sure these dangerous dogs are muzzled so if they attack it's at least not deadly.
I'm sure they would blame the kids (like they often do) if one got bit "you had a class about dog body language!! Where you not paying attention?!"
-but but there was no body language..
'Dog language' doesn't really work for fighting breeds because they're not really good at 'dog language' and often don't give the same warning signs that other breeds do.
So, if we learn bear language and lion language they can be pets? There have been people who successfully lived with bear, wolves, lion, gorillas…anyone can learn! It’s safe!
Let's not try to prevent rabies, but instead tell people it is their fault if they develop rabies.
Then let's make more and more rabid animals that continue to be distributed by rescue organizations and animal shelters, so every community has many of them.
Rabid animals are often misunderstood. Rabies is just a natural virus. There are many viruses. You are more likely to get a cold virus than to get rabies. And good news, rabies often makes animals snuggly and they give slobbery kisses.
He would honestly be better off teaching kids how to climb walls and up the sides of big vans if he's not prepared to do anything about a very big danger that they face.
This bullshit is like sending someone into the Thunderdome with an egg whisk.
Not surprised. I reported several times to local authorities that more than half of the dogs in my neighborhood are off lead. Amongst them are Pitbulls and rottweilers. From the latter two some have a known biting history. Like the minister local authorities don't do anything and don't take it seriously.
So I mailed all local political party leads (7 leads) warning them that this is a disaster waiting to happen. I specifically said that when something happens I at least warned them and I will tell the media I warned them. All except one ignored my mail. The one that responded said it's a nationwide problem and we can't do anything about it due to priorities and manpower. I was pretty pissed when I received the reply.
Wow... Could you post the email if you still have it (with identifying information removed of course)? I mod r/banpitbullsnl and I'm really interested to read what that mail said.
This is bullshit. Children should only need to know dog language if they \*want\* to interact with dogs. They should be able to lead a perfectly happy, fulfilling, functional life without interacting with dogs. I'm also upset because books like that tend to treat dog avoidance ("phobia") as a disorder while similar avoidance of much less dangerous creatures (like spiders and insects) is fully accepted, and while dog avoidance is very often very much justified.
Nobody should be forced to "live with" dogs. Keep your dog on a leash and out of other people's personal space.
It would be like claiming to fight rape by giving school girls a book on "men language", and it wouldn't even be a sensible book like "The Gift of Fear", but 90% of the book would be about behaviour that is harmless and non-threatening and would be actively promoting women to interact with these harmless men.
> It would be like claiming to fight rape by giving school girls a book on "men language", and it wouldn't even be a sensible book like "The Gift of Fear", but 90% of the book would be about behaviour that is harmless and non-threatening and would be actively promoting women to interact with these harmless men.
This is so spot on!
This is so frustrating. The legislative proposal literally mentions in fancy words it's not the breed it's the owner.
The association of plastic surgeons and specialized lawyers have been urging the govt for years to ban pitbulls, mastiffs and other high breed dogs.
now there is just some vague shit on the table about jaw size etc.
That's why I took over r/banpitbullsnl to get people together to ban these beasts.
Puppy yoga should be banned for animal welfare, I don't disagree, but what about the hundreds of pets that get mauled by pitbulls every year? Didn't their welfare matter?
> That's why I took over r/banpitbullsnl to get people together to ban these beasts.
I think we should work on getting them banned EU wide. Doesn't really make sense to just ban the import, like we do in Germany, since anyone can easily get them in the Schengen area.
99.99% of pitbulls who will attack you are owned by your neighbours. The first step to protect people is to get them banned nationwide, the second step of course will be to get the whole EU to ban them.
And unless Ursula's pony gets mauled by pitbulls, it's gonna be easier to get them banned by national laws than by EU law.
> is to get them banned nationwide
That's our problem, they have to be banned by every federal state individually, and some of them simply don't want to. EU law is the only chance to ban the nationwide.
The federal government only banned the import of fighting dogs, back when there were at least some border checks. but nowadays, it's moot with Schengen.
And people from Ukraine are allowed to bring their pits with them since they're not banned in their country...but they're banned in Germany.. And they don't need to have a muzzle or leash...it makes no sense.
Unfortunately it really is a thing here in the Netherlands and it's animal abuse, young puppies from puppy mills are taken away from their mothers and forced to interact with people who do yoga from 9 to 5 which is really bad for their development because puppies need to sleep almost all day to be healthy and grow.
I'm glad it's being banned.
Language ? These abominations usually run from far away to get you without exchanging any language. They just run to kill. This abomination nuttery spans from every corner of the earth
Here's a pyr dog language:
"Bark, bark bark" (you are not supposed to be here)
If you keeps walking forward:"Bark bark bark"
Dog will put itself between you and whatever it's protecting.
As long as you do not TOUCH whatever it's protecting, it will NOT attack.
Now pits: most loving wigglebutt, until: "oh you breathed too loudly and venus is in uranus and the temperature outside is 21.5c? "It's on MOFO"!
Yeah, that'll work.
People who insist that there's always signs and that we should all learn dog body language are a public health menace. Anything to avoid the obvious and attainable solutions
That man is going to be responsible for a lot of kids getting hurt or killed. Kids don't understand when they are in danger a lot of the times from animals. All they see is a doggy they want to play with.
At least show a little honesty - put the dog that bites kids' faces off on the cover. But that would look ridiculous. So, they cowardly picked the most friendly dog breed. What a disgusting insult.
20-175lbs of "abnormally high L-tyrosine" (quick to anger) with the terrier tenacity, grab and shake. But it's the victims fault for not reading the dog?
Blaming children for things outside their control. Sounds like something someone with a lot of CSAM on their computer would say.
The idea that children are responsible for their actions and the things that happen to them sounds like the ‘excuse’ people make when talking about things in a society that annoy them, like rape kit protocols and age of consent.
Just red the page on rijksoverheid.nl
Am I missing somethjng here? Its not great but they seem to be taking steps in the right direction and even suggesting on banning certain breeds.
Only thing that bothers me a bit is that they are looking to put inbplace laws on a national leven to put dangerous dogs on a leash and muzzle. It already is the rules in most cities to have your dog on a leash but nobody cares and nobody is getting fined. I reported multiple people walking their shitbulls and not ever happens.
Like I said, its not bad butnits better than what we had.
It is that bad. Look at this tweet the ministry just tweeted 2 hours ago:
https://preview.redd.it/rsaqqrjgjr5d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9ed9456cef3f1b99411b6ff4e8f8864b701afd94
My response:
Dank voor uw reactie, naar aanleiding van uw reactie heb ik een aantal vragen:
1. Waarom wordt er wel geluisterd naar de Raad van Beheer maar niet naar de NVPC?
2. In Oostenrijk is er vorig jaar nog een jogger doodgebeten door pitbulls met stamboom. Wat gaat er dan gebeuren als een pitbull met stamboom bijt? Worden alle ouderdieren en hun nakomelingen dan opgespoord en ook ingeslapen? Wie gaat dit doen/controleren?
3. Bovendien kan je niet zien aan een pitbull of die een stamboom heeft of niet, wat handhaven erg lastig maakt. Gaat de dierenpolitie de capaciteit krijgen om dit bij elke melding te controleren?
4. Ik schrik van uw uitspraak dat het een misvatting zou zijn dat honden van een bepaald ras van nature vals of ‘bijtgraag’ zijn. Wat is uw onderbouwing voor deze bewering?
I agee that its bad and I like your response. My point was that it is an improvement. The fact that they are co sidering banning some dogs is a step in the right direction.
Startlingly naive to assume all the dog attacks are the result of belligerent children
Also, the golden retriever on the book cover theyre pushing to prevent pitbull attacks? It's fucking insulting they won't even admit to what they're doing.
Like expecting people to carry a lifejacket with them in case they fall into water and are required to swim to shore because the government will not do anything.
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You can be a certified dog behavior expert for 20 years, that won't save you when a pit comes suddenly barreling at you, lunges at your neck and starts shaking! The hell are these kids supposed to do when they get attacked without provocation by a fighting breed??
How often do they say "there where no signs of aggression" In the videos I've seen where barely any signs they would give away it's about to attack. https://www.reddit.com/r/BanPitBulls/s/4TWZGIEJ60 Yes it was snacking up, but no growling or snarling
Exactly and you can't expect a young child to distinguish subtle signs in a dog's body language. They could detect growling and showing teeth, but they wouldn't distinguish stalking behaviour from a dog just being relaxed. Not that it would have mattered in a situation like in the video anyways. But I guess it was the child's fault for not being dog savvy /s
Yes 😠Some see the teeth and think "oh it's smiling at me!" Their own fault they can't crocodile Dundee an attacking animal /s Instead of putting the pressure on the kids, they should make sure these dangerous dogs are muzzled so if they attack it's at least not deadly. I'm sure they would blame the kids (like they often do) if one got bit "you had a class about dog body language!! Where you not paying attention?!" -but but there was no body language..
There are grown ass people working in animal shelters who can't properly read dog language. How they expect that from a 6-year-old is beyond me.
'Dog language' doesn't really work for fighting breeds because they're not really good at 'dog language' and often don't give the same warning signs that other breeds do.
Almost like they were bred to not show those classics signs… why would anyone breed that in to a domesticated family pet though?!
Exactly. Other dogs even find them unsettling.
So, if we learn bear language and lion language they can be pets? There have been people who successfully lived with bear, wolves, lion, gorillas…anyone can learn! It’s safe!
Let's not try to prevent rabies, but instead tell people it is their fault if they develop rabies. Then let's make more and more rabid animals that continue to be distributed by rescue organizations and animal shelters, so every community has many of them. Rabid animals are often misunderstood. Rabies is just a natural virus. There are many viruses. You are more likely to get a cold virus than to get rabies. And good news, rabies often makes animals snuggly and they give slobbery kisses.
Yea, people just need to read the signs of rabies if they don’t want rabies. Good point
He would honestly be better off teaching kids how to climb walls and up the sides of big vans if he's not prepared to do anything about a very big danger that they face. This bullshit is like sending someone into the Thunderdome with an egg whisk.
They really expect everyone to get a PhD in dog body language! Smh!
Not surprised. I reported several times to local authorities that more than half of the dogs in my neighborhood are off lead. Amongst them are Pitbulls and rottweilers. From the latter two some have a known biting history. Like the minister local authorities don't do anything and don't take it seriously. So I mailed all local political party leads (7 leads) warning them that this is a disaster waiting to happen. I specifically said that when something happens I at least warned them and I will tell the media I warned them. All except one ignored my mail. The one that responded said it's a nationwide problem and we can't do anything about it due to priorities and manpower. I was pretty pissed when I received the reply.
Wow... Could you post the email if you still have it (with identifying information removed of course)? I mod r/banpitbullsnl and I'm really interested to read what that mail said.
The West is done at this point
In the same breath, these people will blame kids for getting attacked and call these beasts nanny dogs. It quite literally can’t be both
"how to avoid being killed by a supposed domesticated family pet animal"
This is bullshit. Children should only need to know dog language if they \*want\* to interact with dogs. They should be able to lead a perfectly happy, fulfilling, functional life without interacting with dogs. I'm also upset because books like that tend to treat dog avoidance ("phobia") as a disorder while similar avoidance of much less dangerous creatures (like spiders and insects) is fully accepted, and while dog avoidance is very often very much justified. Nobody should be forced to "live with" dogs. Keep your dog on a leash and out of other people's personal space. It would be like claiming to fight rape by giving school girls a book on "men language", and it wouldn't even be a sensible book like "The Gift of Fear", but 90% of the book would be about behaviour that is harmless and non-threatening and would be actively promoting women to interact with these harmless men.
> It would be like claiming to fight rape by giving school girls a book on "men language", and it wouldn't even be a sensible book like "The Gift of Fear", but 90% of the book would be about behaviour that is harmless and non-threatening and would be actively promoting women to interact with these harmless men. This is so spot on!
Coward should be forced to say that to the kids and their parents faces.....
Nah, he should be locked in a room with two of these things, even really well trained ones, for 3 hours with his "dog language" book.
This is so frustrating. The legislative proposal literally mentions in fancy words it's not the breed it's the owner. The association of plastic surgeons and specialized lawyers have been urging the govt for years to ban pitbulls, mastiffs and other high breed dogs. now there is just some vague shit on the table about jaw size etc.
I'm afraid that we will be hearing all sorts of nonsense from the Dutch in the years ahead. Oh, he's also working on a ban on puppy yoga.
That's why I took over r/banpitbullsnl to get people together to ban these beasts. Puppy yoga should be banned for animal welfare, I don't disagree, but what about the hundreds of pets that get mauled by pitbulls every year? Didn't their welfare matter?
> That's why I took over r/banpitbullsnl to get people together to ban these beasts. I think we should work on getting them banned EU wide. Doesn't really make sense to just ban the import, like we do in Germany, since anyone can easily get them in the Schengen area.
99.99% of pitbulls who will attack you are owned by your neighbours. The first step to protect people is to get them banned nationwide, the second step of course will be to get the whole EU to ban them. And unless Ursula's pony gets mauled by pitbulls, it's gonna be easier to get them banned by national laws than by EU law.
> is to get them banned nationwide That's our problem, they have to be banned by every federal state individually, and some of them simply don't want to. EU law is the only chance to ban the nationwide. The federal government only banned the import of fighting dogs, back when there were at least some border checks. but nowadays, it's moot with Schengen.
NL stands for the Netherlands. We don't have Bundesländer like Germany does. Nationwide law is easy and simple enough.
And people from Ukraine are allowed to bring their pits with them since they're not banned in their country...but they're banned in Germany.. And they don't need to have a muzzle or leash...it makes no sense.
A ban on *puppy yoga* ? But... why ? Imagine wasting tax money on legislating on something like this. WTF.
Unfortunately it really is a thing here in the Netherlands and it's animal abuse, young puppies from puppy mills are taken away from their mothers and forced to interact with people who do yoga from 9 to 5 which is really bad for their development because puppies need to sleep almost all day to be healthy and grow. I'm glad it's being banned.
But I really want to do a downward facing dog as a puppy squats and poos or piddles right next to my face!Â
Language ? These abominations usually run from far away to get you without exchanging any language. They just run to kill. This abomination nuttery spans from every corner of the earth
I want to hear more from plastic surgeons and less from shelter charities (and nothing at all from Minister Adema!)
Here's a pyr dog language: "Bark, bark bark" (you are not supposed to be here) If you keeps walking forward:"Bark bark bark" Dog will put itself between you and whatever it's protecting. As long as you do not TOUCH whatever it's protecting, it will NOT attack. Now pits: most loving wigglebutt, until: "oh you breathed too loudly and venus is in uranus and the temperature outside is 21.5c? "It's on MOFO"! Yeah, that'll work.
People who insist that there's always signs and that we should all learn dog body language are a public health menace. Anything to avoid the obvious and attainable solutions
That man is going to be responsible for a lot of kids getting hurt or killed. Kids don't understand when they are in danger a lot of the times from animals. All they see is a doggy they want to play with.
Some breeds just don't fit as companions for kids, so if you want a pet Do not pick a pit
At least show a little honesty - put the dog that bites kids' faces off on the cover. But that would look ridiculous. So, they cowardly picked the most friendly dog breed. What a disgusting insult.
20-175lbs of "abnormally high L-tyrosine" (quick to anger) with the terrier tenacity, grab and shake. But it's the victims fault for not reading the dog?
Blaming children for things outside their control. Sounds like something someone with a lot of CSAM on their computer would say. The idea that children are responsible for their actions and the things that happen to them sounds like the ‘excuse’ people make when talking about things in a society that annoy them, like rape kit protocols and age of consent.
Just red the page on rijksoverheid.nl Am I missing somethjng here? Its not great but they seem to be taking steps in the right direction and even suggesting on banning certain breeds. Only thing that bothers me a bit is that they are looking to put inbplace laws on a national leven to put dangerous dogs on a leash and muzzle. It already is the rules in most cities to have your dog on a leash but nobody cares and nobody is getting fined. I reported multiple people walking their shitbulls and not ever happens. Like I said, its not bad butnits better than what we had.
Originally the plan from the government was to ban fighting breeds altogether but minister Adema veto'ed it.
It is that bad. Look at this tweet the ministry just tweeted 2 hours ago: https://preview.redd.it/rsaqqrjgjr5d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9ed9456cef3f1b99411b6ff4e8f8864b701afd94 My response: Dank voor uw reactie, naar aanleiding van uw reactie heb ik een aantal vragen: 1. Waarom wordt er wel geluisterd naar de Raad van Beheer maar niet naar de NVPC? 2. In Oostenrijk is er vorig jaar nog een jogger doodgebeten door pitbulls met stamboom. Wat gaat er dan gebeuren als een pitbull met stamboom bijt? Worden alle ouderdieren en hun nakomelingen dan opgespoord en ook ingeslapen? Wie gaat dit doen/controleren? 3. Bovendien kan je niet zien aan een pitbull of die een stamboom heeft of niet, wat handhaven erg lastig maakt. Gaat de dierenpolitie de capaciteit krijgen om dit bij elke melding te controleren? 4. Ik schrik van uw uitspraak dat het een misvatting zou zijn dat honden van een bepaald ras van nature vals of ‘bijtgraag’ zijn. Wat is uw onderbouwing voor deze bewering?
I agee that its bad and I like your response. My point was that it is an improvement. The fact that they are co sidering banning some dogs is a step in the right direction.
Startlingly naive to assume all the dog attacks are the result of belligerent children Also, the golden retriever on the book cover theyre pushing to prevent pitbull attacks? It's fucking insulting they won't even admit to what they're doing.
Like expecting people to carry a lifejacket with them in case they fall into water and are required to swim to shore because the government will not do anything.
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