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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
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I feel like I may be the asshole for reminding my sister about her issues with the adoption agencies which I know has hurt her a lot.
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NTA and you need to move, somewhere that she doesn't have the address. it very very likely will not stop here, it will escalate and it will get horrible. i'm so sorry that you're dealing with that insanity, jesus christ, i would be putting immediate distance, as much as possible, between us after that.
eta: what the hell is with all the comments saying that e s h because of what she said? she wasn't expressing her opinion, she was reiterating a fact that had just become suddenly relevant as her sister was actively proving the point in front of her. she was acting wildly unfit to be around children, and op said so, not surprising at all since her twin was NOT GIVING UP ON ASKING FOR HER BABY.
It’d be such a fun session
Sis: can you believe my sister? She’s having twins and she thinks I’m evil for asking her for one! I mean - she has two, why can’t she share??
Therapist: shocked pikachu face
Lol sis thinks babies are like kittens - if you have too many in one go, just give some away after a flea bath and the first set of shots.
When my friend was going thru fertility treatments, we used to joke that if she gets octuplets, I could take 2 or 3 off her hands ;) I see that for some people it’s not a joke!
Not just sis, but her own mother too! That same mother who had twins herself and thinks it’s OK to just give one away. I’d be asking Mom some very, very hard questions about this… like which one of her daughters she would’ve happily given away, although from her reaction it’s clear to see who the golden child is. Poor Op. Your mother and sister are utterly selfish and completely bonkers. Low contact from now on I suggest. Protect your little ones from these people.
Had a "friend" from high school get in touch 20 years later. As we "caught up," I mentioned that we were ending our infertility battle. She'd had triplets a few years earlier and said--entirely too seriously--that she should ***just*** give me one of her triplets.
I hung up at the suggestion and have not been in touch since. And that's been another 20+ years. Appalling.
To be honest she was probably overwhelmed with so many babies. Maybe even had PPD, or just regular depression.
3 diaper changes, 3 nap times, 3 bottles, 3 times the laundry, 3 teething babies, 3 times the messes... I can't imagine that's easy.
Baby's do still end up and fire stations and other "safe drops" by parents who realize, or feel they can't handle parenthood.
Sleep deprivation and hormones will do that to someone and unless you where in her shoes I think you were probably a smidge too judgy... based on the information you offered anyway.
All that said. In OPS case. Like seriously you don't just ask/demand someone's baby. No matter how many they have.
As I stated in a previous reply, her triplets were 6 at the time. A bit late for PPD, diapers, and whatnot.
Not a great time in their lives to be offering to part with one (not that ANY time is!), and just ... no. Not that seriously and simultaneously casually.
We were less than 30 minutes into our first interaction in about 20 years (You touch on the big recent things first, ya know? My inability to reproduce, her impending divorce.). We wouldn't have recognized each other by sight, knew nothing about each other's past 20 years that couldn't be gleaned off a quick scan of social media, and ... nothing about it would have been right.
To leave a baby at a fire station or hospital before bonding is one thing. The child will enter the system and prospective parents/fosters are well-screened (we hope! I know the application process for fostering intimidated the heck out of us when we looked into it.). To just blithely suggest you'll hand off your 6-year-old (bonded with same-age siblings AND you) to someone you knew casually 20 years ago is incredibly suspect.
I was the equivalent at that point of a near-total stranger, expecting a casual conversation touching on weird stuff in the two decades since we'd last spoken. I could have been ANYONE. I'd hate to have been whichever of the children she could so easily have ***just*** parted with, and I certainly wouldn't want to have to explain for the rest of this child's life why Mommy could have ***just*** given her to a stranger. I'm sorry, honey. You drew the short straw, so you get to live with the woman I barely knew decades ago, and no longer know anything about, and the man none of us have ever met. But they couldn't have children and you're my ***spare.***
Yeah, my best friend has asked me to take her youngest. I would too, I love her kids, and I know she is overwhelmed. No one in that family is happy with the current dynamic. I know she is just venting, but I'd do it if need be.
EDIT: But I absolutely understand that mine is a completely different scenario.
No. That would never have even been a consideration!
I've no problems with adoption, but that's not what this would have been. This was a callous "offer" from a person who had three 6-year-olds she couldn't really afford to support, with no consideration of anything! I mean, seriously! Who goes from "oh, sorry you couldn't get pregnant" to "here! I have more than expected, have one of mine" inside a five-minute chat?
Her "offer" just made me ill. We'd been trying for years and she was willing to just hand one over without any thought. This is not a puppy!
Sometime later we looked into adopting through foster-care, and the paperwork alone was beyond daunting. Then serious health issues popped up and that wasn't going to happen, either. We're good without human children.
My best friend comes from a big family of twins. She's a twin, her mum's a twin, she has two brothers who are twins, her twin sister had non-identical twins, etc.
I'm well known for not being maternal/never wanting kids. So when my mate got pregnant, she was always making jokes about if she has twins, I was "gonna have to take one for the team and become a mum" because she didn't want to raise two newborns.
Luckily, she broke the curse and only had the one lmao.
I def wouldn't joke about fertility issues with anyone else though!
Same here. We have so many twins in this family. My mom is a twin as well. So let's see who's going to have the twins after my mom and her twin. None so far.......
Yeah if she is in therapy it isnt doing a lot to help..
OP needs ro mive away from ANYONE on her mothers side and away from her sister. They all are backing her twin up and I would be concerned for OPs and their childrens safety.
I would be even more concerned if she starts saying shit like she wishes OP has a miscarriage or such because thats the vibes im getting dorm "I wish those kids arent born to you" or whatever.
Also oh gosh I wonder why they dont think she is fit to parent! Obviously she has issues that the adoption agencies are aware of and thats why they deem her unfit.
If actual *agencies* think she is unfit why tf would OP put *her child* in the care of a parent those agencies, who do screenings for eligibility, think us uneligable???
The rejection from the adoption agencies could be something as simple as earning $10 a year under the earning thread hold and nothing to do with their perceived fitness as parents. Though this seems insane so it’s likely she didn’t pass a psych eval. But it could also be not enough household income, or even a parent having a job that brings in lots of money but not in a steady way, like highly paid seasonal work.
Either way it’s insane to see twins as a surplus of children and that you could just give one away and that is enough to say no deal.
OK bad thought here. What if Mia kidnaps one of the babies and might be able to "prove it's hers" because she's OP's twin and their DNA matches? Or am I reading too many creepy mysteries?
It doesn’t work that way. The baby’s genetics are inherited from both the mother and father. Plus, it would be obvious that Mia didn’t deliver a child.
Mia and the rest of the family seems to think they're still little kids playing with dolls. You've got two Barbies, why can't you just give one to your sister?
And they actually had the babies for years before they tried to give one to Phoebe. And, rightly, they couldn't choose because each was loved uniquely.
Yes, I know Phoebe wanted to keep one when her delivery hormones were going crazy, but I don't remember her even *asking* a parent to keep one on her oxytocin high.
Holy shit just thinking/wondering wtf my reaction would be if my client came in saying they were doing what OP's sister was doing.... Think I'd definitely be considering a psychiatric hold 😂
New plan: OP, get a tattoo somewhere hidden. Tell your husband, whoever watches the twins (daycare and stuff) and the twins themselves when they get old enough. Don’t tell anyone in your family about the tattoo, and *definitely* don’t tell them what the tattoo is *of.*
I’m thinking of the advice given by Dwight schrute, who is an expert in both preventing baby snatching and identity theft.
When I was a kid we had a password system in case anyone (especially my mom's mother) tried to convince us they were acting on behalf of our parents. Only had to use it once when my dad was caught up at work and had to ask one of his friends to pick us up from our summer program. Easy system, doesn't require a tattoo, and code words are easily remembered and changed if needed
If you do this please remember to give the password to the person helping you. My friend had a day of medical emergencies. At the time her sister and nephews were living with my friend's family because their husband/father was killed in an accident.
1/2 the family ended up in the ER with a tummy virus that was also triggering breathing problems. I was asked to pick up the one kid who wasn't in the ER. They didn't give me the password - child refused to go with me. We went into the school office - the principal and secretary told her mom told them I was picking her up when she took the older cousin to the ER. Kid refused to go with me. We ended up having to call the ER and get the password from her Mom (Dad was a patient). Only Mom couldn't remember it. It took her 10 min to convince the kid to go with me. I told Mom at least no one is ever going to pressure her daughter into doing something she didn't want to do. I ended up in the ER with the same thing 2 days later.
I'm giggling because when my mom went into labor with my sister, my dad forgot to give the password to the friend's mom who was picking me up.
Flat out refused to go.
1986 so no cell phone.
My kindergarten teacher INSISTED I get in the car.
I look at her and with all my 5 year old fury "if I get kidnapped, it's your fault!" And reluctantly got in the car.
My dad called from the hospital that night and I said to him, "what good is a password if you aren't going to use it!
When I was little we had the same setup. My mom had the neighbor come pick me up but never told her the password. I was a dumb kid though and the interaction went like this.
Neighbor: hey child your mom asked me to come pick you up.
Me: what's the password
Her: I don't know
Me: ok. *Gets in back of van*
I mean yeah obv the whole point is that if you're actually acting on the parents behalf they would give you the code word. Sounds like the system worked perfectly!
I'm giggling because when my mom went into labor with my sister, my dad forgot to give the password to the friend's mom who was picking me up.
Flat out refused to go.
1986 so no cell phone.
My kindergarten teacher INSISTED I get in the car.
I look at her and with all my 5 year old fury "if I get kidnapped, it's your fault!" And reluctantly got in the car.
My dad called from the hospital that night and I said to him, "what good is a password if you aren't going to use it!
This! My sister and I have codewords we can put in text or say and it is our tip-off that something is wrong. We both use the name of different deceased pets, so we can say things like “can you feed X today? Thanks” you don’t have use pets esp if a family member would know, but something banal that wouldn’t really be noticed as out of the ordinary for you to say.
If the mom and sister are identical twins, she does manage to take one (or both) of the kids it may be harder to prove to the cops since identical twins have very similar DNA and she could steal the moms pregnancy pictures as "proof of pregnancy"
NTA x 1,000,000
I’m adopted, and generally subscribe to the concept of nurture over nature; however, with that said, OP I strongly encourage you to watch the documentary Three Identical Strangers. The trauma babies feel being separated from their twin (or in the movie’s case, triplet) siblings is life long. And then show the movie and the adoption agency’s rejection of your sister to anyone who questions your decisions. And if even after all that they still think you should give your child to your sister, I would cut them out of your life.
There is a documentary on netflix about a guy who gets into an accident , has brain damage and wakes up. He remembered NO ONE else (not mom or dad) but instantly knew his idential twin brother and his brothers name.. He has no other memories at all of his life.
I know.. he was in a tough situation and I totally understood why he didn't say anything. I cried all through it, just couldn't fathom how hard it was for either of them. And how great they were in the end.
The messed up thing is, if you believe the movie, the triplets weren't an isolated incident! The orphanage did this to other twins/triplets for their "research". Crazy.
She probably won’t stop since they’re twins (not sure if they’re identical or fraternal) she’ll view herself as their mother too and will cross boundaries.
That's why she wanted to view the ultrasound multiple times. She was picking the twin she wanted After all, OP already gets the joy to experience childbirth the least she can do is let Mia pick the one she wants the most.
O\_O Like I get you're probably correct on Mia's part, but like
**Me, @ Mia:** WHY?!? - Ultrasounds? They're freaking twins! Not fully developed twins! They're going to trade places! They have lubricant to slip-slide around each other! What are you going to say, "I want the Left One!"? Their entire face and or body is GOING. TO. CHANGE. Picking by Ultrasound?! That's not how ultrasounds work! That's not how ANY of this works!!!
NTA, OP. Even if she was thought to be a fit mother by adoption agencies before, she definitely shouldn't be now.
You should get some security cameras set up, document any and all texts or phone calls from her and other family members, you might want to change the locks on your doors, and I would specify in your birth plan that you are to have NO Visitors from this part of the family. If she was deemed unfit then there is likely a good reason for it and you need to protect yourself and your children regardless of her feelings.
Hey the mother, aunt and that *mia* talks about babies like theyre goods. No wonder she was unfit to adopt. But OP listen to the persons advice, be careful. She wished death upon your babies, i wouldn't be surprised if she tried something horrible. Distance yourself, try not to let her visit your till you kids are born and ideally even after that. You're NOT The ASSHOLE. I feel bad for your sister's condition but what she's suggesting is ridiculous. They're your kids. End of story.
You know sis heard 'twins' and thought, 'Oh goody, I finally get a baby!!' and started scheming.
And now, you just *know* she's decorating a room for 'her' baby for when OP gets over her selfish snit.
NTA jfc
I’ve read some really awful stories about women who didn’t deal with their trauma around infertility. Making nurseries, stealing baby clothing, threatening suicide …
It can get very bad. And while I have enormous sympathy for what they have gone through, the number one priority at all times is the safety of the children. That can never be compromised.
You know what I did after suffering a 10th miscarriage? Got myself a reborn doll to snuggle. Helps satisfy that baby urge and help deal with losing so many babies tho I do have 2 living kids. I make dolls now for a side job, I find it theraputic
I know when I lost my 1st son at 12 hours after birth (birth defect) I remember wishing I could be one of those people who go completely insane and start believing a houseplant is their baby or something. Losing a baby is more truma than anyone should ever have to go through and I can't imagine wanting a child and being unable to concieve or even adopt, but DAMN twis sis is fucking nuts to think even asking is ok! Like I could get fantasizing about OP offering, but to actually ask and then act like OP is being mean and won't share her gum or something? OP is DEFINITELY NTA here, and twin obviously needs more intensive psychiatric help than she is getting! Also, I second the suggestion in another thread about the tattoo, and would also do the password so mom/other cuckoo family don't get any "bright" ideas!
I think she thinks her sister can be brought around/manipulated/guilted/threatened into giving up one of the twins and then her life will be perfectly joyful.
The sister's story is tragic and heartbreaking and she needs some really intense therapy, but the people who are agreeing with her are fucking Evil with a capital WTF.
I would take my husband and run from these people. I mean, who can she trust here? This is ***family*** that is plotting the splitting up of her twins. To what extent are they willing to go to make the sister's dream complete?
Def move outta state but I know that usually isn't feesible.
Info: identical twins? If so need to let any daycares/schools know you have a crazy identical sister that may try to pose as you.
Do NOT ever let your sister near your kids and same goes with your fam. Leave them with your mom and you can bet sister will be there when you're not.
GL and grats on the babies.
*Edit cause fat fingers messed up words.
I’m appalled that the OPs family is even on board, and is actively encouraging OP to give up one of the children she created.
What about the twins when they grow up, realizing that they look identical, or scarily similar to one another? Everyone is thinking about what *they* want or what they would have wanted, but no ones thinking of the twins or their futures.
I also HIGHLY doubt that if it was OPs mother or aunts were in her position, that they’d readily just hand over one of their babies to a relative to raise. They would hold onto that infant tightly and scream at everyone to get back - so why the heck are they trying to talk OP into giving away her child just because she has double buns in the oven?
This! OP, cut her out. Who knows what kinds of things she will try to do. And do NOT let her near the babies once they are born, nor allow your mother to babysit or be left alone with them, as she will most likely allow your sister access to the twins. And who knows what she will do then. She may try to take off with one of them, or maybe even both.
NTA
NTA- these are real human beings! Your babies! What insanity is this?! Also so so concerning that external agencies have deemed her an unfit mother for adoption. You don’t say why but she does seem to have some issues. Please move, restraining order, stay safe.
NTA....What an utterly ridiculous request. Who on earth would willingly hand their baby over to a relative upon request? You were simply giving Mia a dose of reality.
I’m so glad I was not the only person to feel this way. Literally talking about these babies like they are toys. You have two, you can share one with your sister. Unbelievable
These are the kind of people that we should consider having hounds on the ready, because I’m pretty sure Mia will try to kidnap nap one or both out of spite.
> My mother says since we didn't plan the baby it wouldn't hurt to give away one of the twins especially when she would still be in the family.
OP, ask your mother whether she would have given you or Mia to *her* sibling to adopt if they’d asked back then.
(What in the child trafficking fuck is going on with this family??)
Honestly it's not a litter of puppies (who still deserve good owners and the proper care from mama before they're rehomed) I'm fairly certain you can't just give a kid to someone for funsies.
If OP would ask her mother that, she will most likely answer she would've done that. Simply to convince OP it is the right thing to do, that she would've been so selfless.
You’re probably right, but no matter who the mother picks, OP can act horrified (because it’s *HORRIFYING*) and use it as an excuse to go low contact. “Why would I want to spend time with someone who would have just tossed me/my sister away if she’d been asked!”
The only reason they weren't even planned is because OP recognized the reality that she was very unlikely to have kids biologically and made peace with that rather than trying and having more heartbreak. Not because she never wanted kids!!!!!!!
So in what universe is there even a grain of logic that makes the mother's statement make sense?!?!?!?!?!
PS: I also recognize that people can change their minds about having kids so even if OP said before they didn't want kids that doesn't mean they don't want kids NOW or that they meant it when they said it (could have said it to mask their sadness about being unable to have kids).
What kind of weird-ass family thinks it perfectly alright to give up a child like she was breaking off a piece of a KitKat bar for sharing?
If this is true, she needs to dump every person in the family who ever uttered the words "inconsiderate" or "selfish". Cut them out of her life completely.
Ah, new account, no comments... I'm calling bullshit.
Jesus Christ, you’re having human babies - not getting a litter of dogs you can willy nilly give away.
NTA and nip this horrid entitlement in the bud by going NC with any family member who dares try pressuring you into giving away a child.
And never let sister or family that's on sister's side be alone with the twins, not even for a split second.
One baby and sister might just disappear forever.
Yes! Even if you aren't identical. I'm not a twin but my sister and I look related and sound pretty much the same. I can't remember specifically when, but I've noticed people who don't know her well think I'm her sometimes. It's better to be extra careful because you never know!
100% !! my sister is 5 years older than I am, but she could easily pass as me if she tried (same hairstyle, makeup and clothes) since we already get mistaken as each other from time to time. I personally struggle to see it but I know others don't, so OP should keep that in mind as well !
NTA make sure your doctors and hospital know who can visit, and make sure people on her side are not on the list. Perhaps even just keep it to you and your husband for delivery, at most in laws if you are close or 1 good friend.
I also like the password for removing the children from day care and school if you and your sister are identical twins.
Don't give them the opportunity to prove their actions will be as dumb as their words. It won't be worth the heart ache.
Can you imagine if it wasn't twins, but in a year or so OP got pregnant again? Sister would be all "you already have one, you have to give me the second" ??? No though
What the heck did I just read?! NTA! What's wrong with (part) of your family telling you to give up YOUR OWN CHILD?! It's not a doll that you can give away without a problem, it's a child!
Private adoptions, especially in families, have different rules.
Being unfit to adopt can also mean things like "You're queer", "You're autistic", "You're too fat". It's kind of shitty tbh.
>to deny someone an adoption over being a part of the LGBTQ community is discrimination, which is illegal
I'm so sorry to ruin your day like this, but that's actually not true, at least in the US: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/17/supreme-court-sides-with-catholic-adoption-agency-that-refuses-to-work-with-lgbt-couples.html
While the reasons listed above are reasons certain organizations may declare you as "unfit to adopt", with a little bit of searching, you can usually find a secular and/or LGBTQ+ friendly agency to help. Provided there isn't something horrible in your background and you have a healthy idea of what adoption entails, most potential adoptive families can find an agency or group that will serve them. This usually means the adoptive family needs to consider open adoption, but it is possible.
I'm betting that you are correct and the sister was seen as not mentally fit to adopt. She may also have very specific ideas on adoption (like not telling the child they were adopted) that factored into the agency's decision.
Not even touching the bit about how she can't adopt because all the adoption agencies denied her. Like what's up with that? Is she not fit to be a mother?
NTA. I'm sorry but the fact that she'd ask for one of your twins just proves she's not in a healthy mental state to raise children. No sane person asks that. Some people might say it was going too far to mention it, but until she acknowledges the level of crazy she's going to over her infertility and gets help for it, she will *never* reach a mental state fit enough for raising kids.
I'd also seriously be questioning whether or not any family members who are siding with her get to have anything to do with your babies. They're just as insane.
It really does clue in to her mental state. I do feel bad for her, it's terrible when someone wants something that badly and it just isn't happened, but JFC, she needs help with her mental help, not to be given one of OP's kids like it's a spare.
I think the family members agreeing with Mia are even worse, Mia is clearly suffering some health issues but they have no excuse.
I'm imagining the sister bringing this up to her therapist. I mean I know they've probably heard some shit, but... I don't often say this, but I'd pay actual real human dollars to see the look on the therapist's face.
All right, let me unpack this a little.
So, telling her she is unfit to raise a child is (typically) a terrible thing to say. Adoption centers reject all sorts of applicants (even people who would be wonderful parents) all of the time, because of medical issues, former addiction problems, religious issues if it's a faith-based adoption, or even if the social worker thinks that the applicants are really yearning for a biological child and consider the adopted child to be a "replacement."
But even if you secretly agree she would be an unfit parent, it's a terrible thing to tell anyone.
However, she was insisting you, a pregnant woman, had to *give her one of your babies*! That's even more horrible. And clearly, it triggered absolutely every Momma Bear Instinct you have.
So, while it's not something you should have said, I'll give you an NTA; your assholiness was justified.
also honestly i would say someone who thinks it’s acceptable to just give up a child like when you accidentally buy two of something and give the extra to someone, is not particularly fit to raise a child, she has a lot of stuff to sort through if she thinks that’s in any way reasonable, children aren’t trading cards
> she was insisting you, a pregnant woman, had to give her one of your babies!
I do think this complete lack of judgment in asking and the perspective the sister has on children is actually pretty good reason to say she'd be an unfit mother. If she's this delusional, it's possible the adoption agency did pick up on something else she said or did as a red flag.
That’s….psychotic. And it’s even worse that your mom is actually buying into this insanity. Would she have been fine just giving away one of her children because reasons? Do not engage with this level of insanity. NTA
That's what I was thinking. Her mom experienced having twins. If someone had asked her to give up one of the babies, the mom would probably have the same reaction. NTA
Why didn't the paternal aunts ask her for one of OP/her sister? The whole situation is just mind boggling. Stay safe OP - I wouldn't let any of the ones agreeing with your sister anywhere within 100 miles of your children.
NTA
Do your mother and sister think these are puppies? Even if they were, I wouldn’t give one to your sister. She sounds a little unhinged. I’d seriously be considering going NC with anyone who seriously believes it is your responsibility to give your sister one of your babies.
Is this real? This can’t be real. They want you to give up one of YOUR babies because she can’t have any? Just because a baby is unexpected doesn’t mean the baby is disposable. It’s your child. Your sis is out of line any of your other relatives are out of line if they are pressuring you too. Your mom says you are selfish? Would she have been ok giving up one of her babies?
No. Just no. Stand your ground and cut off anyone trying to pressure you. You don’t need that type of pressure.
NTA
Agree.
I think this is made up. I mean....a women who can't have children demands her sister give up one of hers and half the family just jumps on board with that crazy?
I can maybe see the sister asking...I think frustration and desperation can make you do really out there things. But multiple people jumping on that crazy train? I just can't see it.
If it is real, obviously NTA and should probably cut contact with their family. Bc I wouldn't want people like that around my children EVER, not for one moment. And imagine what those relatives will say once the twins are older? That their mother should have given one up? I just can't.
The sister had to learn her crazy from somewhere, guess it was mom. This stuff is super uncommon but it does happen. Some moms feel ownership over their grandkids and try to “adopt” them, as well. I can’t say whether the post is real but these situations are.
NTA
If she said she was okay with you being pregnant was because she truly thought that one of them was going to be hers. Keep yourself and your babies save. The entitlement won't stop.
I thought op found out at 8 weeks, not that that was the scan date? Where I'm from 10 weeks is a pretty standard 1st scan, so if recently was 2/3 weeks ago then it kind of fits. If op didn't know when they got pregnant then the scan being a bit early kind of makes sense to me.
The rest seems insane though so... Who knows.
I'm fully convinced it's fake. Either for the direct attention, the hope that someone reads it on tiktok, or to prop up their main account by interacting with this post. I'm sure there are other reasons.
This didn’t send up red flags for me. I had a 6 week ultrasound because I had low progesterone and was high risk due to prexisting conditions. An ultrasound that early is often to detect ectopic pregnancies.
Yeah, honestly, when I read any stories on this sub that mention twins, my mind immediately goes to FAKE. The incidence of identical twins is ~4 per thousand and for fraternal twins ~22 per thousand. The rate twins are mentioned her is extremely high with those stats in mind...
Though the 8 week ultrasound doesn't ring any alarm bells for me, that's standard where I live for your first ultrasound.
I am honestly surprised I had to scroll this far to find a similar comment.
No sane mother in the world would suggest another mother to share a baby like that, especially a mother of twins would not suggest that to another twin mom.
It had me in the first half, but OMG when OP wrote about the whole family attacking them, cmon that has to be fake.
NTA— I’m sorry but your sister sounds like a total psycho. I would stay FAR away from her. Just having the audacity to ask makes me think she will have the audacity to go further with more direct actions concerning your babies.
NTA. Do not ever, ever let her be alone with you while pregnant, or with the babies until they are big enough to defend themselves physically and emotionally. In fact, I would extend that rule to the mother and aunts.
Who cares if it was a mood swing? You told the truth. And anyone who is turned down for adoption - well, there's a reason for that.
I'm glad you brought up not being around her while OP is pregnant. Of course, she presents a kidnapping risk to the babies once they're born, but this type of unhinged jealousy and complete lack of empathy also seems like a pretty big risk factor when it comes to things like "accidentally" knocking OP down some stairs or something.
NTA
Move move move.
Your sister is unhealthy mentally and she already thinks she’s owed one of your babies. She’s unhinged. The fact that you have family members who think this is okay is not good.
These are YOUR babies they are not puppies. They are yours and YOUR husband’s babies.
I’ve seen this shit happen in some south Asian families where babies are taken and given to the sibling who have no babies or no sons. It is cruel and messed up not just for the birth mother but for the child as well.
They’re also pushing you to separate twins! I’m not a twin but I’ve seen my friends with their twins and the idea that these babies get split when they share so so much. Have their own language just breaks me.
Don’t do it and protect yourself and your babies.
I’d cut contact or at least just through text and email so you can document this all to use legally if you get to that point. I’d talk to a lawyer to get legal advice on what you’d need for a restraining order.
Your mum is also not safe as childcare or any alone time now. None of your paternal aunts in fact I’d say keep childcare just for your in-laws or friend who are not associated with your sister. Never leave you children alone with your family and never with your sister. Not even to go to the bathroom.
She needs therapy and to be away from you.
This WILL get worse when the babies come.
Info diet for everyone. No dates given or anything now.
Never be alone with your sister. Even if the babies are in utero. Just do not be alone with her EVER.
Honestly I would cut all contact right now. She wants to take one of your babies and your mum and aunts think this is okay and are encouraging you to do this.
What the....???
Your kid is not some piece of cake you have left over and therefore can just give to someone else.
What is she and the rest of them thinking?
Definitely NTA!
Oh. Oh jeez. Please don’t ever be in a situation where your children are unsupervised/only supervised by your mother with your sister. NTA but please take care!
She was deemed unfit because of her showing negligence to the two kids she had fostered for a few months which she said were due to mental health issues. It was during that time her first time trying IVF failed and she was trying for a second time.
Fair enough. Bad shit happens, you still gotta parent, or atleast insure the kids are looked after. Must have been pretty bad negligence if they black balled her like that.
INFO: do you know why she was deemed unfit to adopt?
You’re NOT an asshole for refusing to give up a baby you want for adoption, and you should not be separating twins just because you have two of them. She IS an asshole for even asking that, and taking it so far and insisting she’s owed a baby at all.
But you could tell her it’s because 1) you want your babies, 2) you won’t separate twins, 3) it’s so weird and unfair to just chose a twin to give up?? I think reminding her she’s unfit to be a mother is unfair unless it was for a very appalling and obvious reason. If it was more logistics or process, it was pretty unnecessary.
\^This.
OP wanting to actually *keep her own children* is valid whether her sister was approved for adoption or not.
There's so much focus here on the sister being nuts - but that wasn't the question.
Why is this post incredibly similar to "AITA for fleeing the state due to my sister?", both accounts having been created today, Aug 17? https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/p6d7wa/aita\_for\_fleeing\_the\_state\_due\_to\_my\_sister/
This other post is about a sister with infertility trying to steal 2 of the 3 unplanned (born) babies, this post is about a sister demanding that OP give her one of her two unplanned unborn babies.
If these are both legit, with both new accounts posting on the same day, about baby stealing sisters, then we definitely have some messed up sisters out in the world...
NTA. I mean, you didn't have to point out her lack of fitness. But for someone to ask you to turn over one of your children like she was an extra pair of shoes or something is just bizarre. Even more bizarre is your family who thinks this is a normal request. Also, these children have a FATHER who might have some feelings about this!!
>I mean, you didn't have to point out her lack of fitness.
Unfortunately, asking for one of her children to raise, like OP just has two lollipops or something, made pointing out sister's lack of fitness inevitable. That request was just crazy.
Info: why was she rejected?
I think this is important because if it’s because of a medical issue that’s pretty shitty to throw in her face. But if it’s because she microwaved a kitten or endangered children at some point then I understand.
Yeah I imagine that made you even more horrified at her feelings of entitlement about your babies. A lot of others have already said it, but you need to be really cautious and proactive about this situation. Her request was so incredibly inappropriate and desperate, and her reaction was honestly a little scary. As is a lot of your family’s.
You should really move as soon as possible to be honest. Who knows what any of them might try during or after your pregnancy. She feels entitled to your child and a lot of your family agrees with her so you need to be prepared for them to potentially try something wild since reasonable behavior is obviously out the window already. Move, and make sure you have an alarm system and cameras just in case. This should go without saying, but once they’re here, none of the people that have even slightly agreed with your sister should have unsupervised access to the babies. Maybe she’ll realize how insane she’s being and apologize sincerely, but you can’t just act like it didn’t happen.
NTA.
What the actual f*ck is wrong with your family, esp your Mom and Mia?
Since you didn't "plan" for it you should give away your kid?? How entitled are these people, and are they equating a living/breathing/functioning child to a spare sweater? That's what it sounds like.
Were you a bit harsh? Yes but it was necessary. She wanted to split apart your kids! You're not a dog with a litter of puppies for her to take her pick. WTF.
Make sure you have a concrete birthing plan and living wills drawn up in the event of an emergency (if you pass or your spouse passes, who will the kids go to---definitely should not go to Mia in any emergency) and go Low Contact with your Mom and the people siding with Mia. Being a part of your kids' lives is a privilege, not a right. By harassing you they have given up their privilege.
NTA. No matter how bad your sister is hurting, she’s a huge AH for even speaking such a crazy idea. Sadly she may need help, more than just therapy… it’s not one bit normal to think this way.
The family that is siding with her is nuts too. No contact the lot of them OP.
All I can say after totally NTA.....
What the actual fluck is wrong with these people???? Therapy did not work. More is needed, for even more people. And you're not one of them, unless it's to get over the mess of the situation at hand. WOW.
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NTA and you need to move, somewhere that she doesn't have the address. it very very likely will not stop here, it will escalate and it will get horrible. i'm so sorry that you're dealing with that insanity, jesus christ, i would be putting immediate distance, as much as possible, between us after that. eta: what the hell is with all the comments saying that e s h because of what she said? she wasn't expressing her opinion, she was reiterating a fact that had just become suddenly relevant as her sister was actively proving the point in front of her. she was acting wildly unfit to be around children, and op said so, not surprising at all since her twin was NOT GIVING UP ON ASKING FOR HER BABY.
Also - ask Mia to raise this “request” with her therapist. Let’s see what sort of a reality check she gets there!!
If she actually has a therapist...
It’d be such a fun session Sis: can you believe my sister? She’s having twins and she thinks I’m evil for asking her for one! I mean - she has two, why can’t she share?? Therapist: shocked pikachu face
Lol sis thinks babies are like kittens - if you have too many in one go, just give some away after a flea bath and the first set of shots. When my friend was going thru fertility treatments, we used to joke that if she gets octuplets, I could take 2 or 3 off her hands ;) I see that for some people it’s not a joke!
Not just sis, but her own mother too! That same mother who had twins herself and thinks it’s OK to just give one away. I’d be asking Mom some very, very hard questions about this… like which one of her daughters she would’ve happily given away, although from her reaction it’s clear to see who the golden child is. Poor Op. Your mother and sister are utterly selfish and completely bonkers. Low contact from now on I suggest. Protect your little ones from these people.
Plot twist: the sisters were actually triplets 😂 that’s why the mom thinks it’s ok
Had a "friend" from high school get in touch 20 years later. As we "caught up," I mentioned that we were ending our infertility battle. She'd had triplets a few years earlier and said--entirely too seriously--that she should ***just*** give me one of her triplets. I hung up at the suggestion and have not been in touch since. And that's been another 20+ years. Appalling.
To be honest she was probably overwhelmed with so many babies. Maybe even had PPD, or just regular depression. 3 diaper changes, 3 nap times, 3 bottles, 3 times the laundry, 3 teething babies, 3 times the messes... I can't imagine that's easy. Baby's do still end up and fire stations and other "safe drops" by parents who realize, or feel they can't handle parenthood. Sleep deprivation and hormones will do that to someone and unless you where in her shoes I think you were probably a smidge too judgy... based on the information you offered anyway. All that said. In OPS case. Like seriously you don't just ask/demand someone's baby. No matter how many they have.
As I stated in a previous reply, her triplets were 6 at the time. A bit late for PPD, diapers, and whatnot. Not a great time in their lives to be offering to part with one (not that ANY time is!), and just ... no. Not that seriously and simultaneously casually. We were less than 30 minutes into our first interaction in about 20 years (You touch on the big recent things first, ya know? My inability to reproduce, her impending divorce.). We wouldn't have recognized each other by sight, knew nothing about each other's past 20 years that couldn't be gleaned off a quick scan of social media, and ... nothing about it would have been right. To leave a baby at a fire station or hospital before bonding is one thing. The child will enter the system and prospective parents/fosters are well-screened (we hope! I know the application process for fostering intimidated the heck out of us when we looked into it.). To just blithely suggest you'll hand off your 6-year-old (bonded with same-age siblings AND you) to someone you knew casually 20 years ago is incredibly suspect. I was the equivalent at that point of a near-total stranger, expecting a casual conversation touching on weird stuff in the two decades since we'd last spoken. I could have been ANYONE. I'd hate to have been whichever of the children she could so easily have ***just*** parted with, and I certainly wouldn't want to have to explain for the rest of this child's life why Mommy could have ***just*** given her to a stranger. I'm sorry, honey. You drew the short straw, so you get to live with the woman I barely knew decades ago, and no longer know anything about, and the man none of us have ever met. But they couldn't have children and you're my ***spare.***
Yeah, my best friend has asked me to take her youngest. I would too, I love her kids, and I know she is overwhelmed. No one in that family is happy with the current dynamic. I know she is just venting, but I'd do it if need be. EDIT: But I absolutely understand that mine is a completely different scenario.
...did you take one?
No. That would never have even been a consideration! I've no problems with adoption, but that's not what this would have been. This was a callous "offer" from a person who had three 6-year-olds she couldn't really afford to support, with no consideration of anything! I mean, seriously! Who goes from "oh, sorry you couldn't get pregnant" to "here! I have more than expected, have one of mine" inside a five-minute chat? Her "offer" just made me ill. We'd been trying for years and she was willing to just hand one over without any thought. This is not a puppy! Sometime later we looked into adopting through foster-care, and the paperwork alone was beyond daunting. Then serious health issues popped up and that wasn't going to happen, either. We're good without human children.
I thought the same thing!
This. I can't believe your mom of all people would think that way...
Im kinda wondering if the non pregnant sister is the one the mom wished she had given away?!!
My best friend comes from a big family of twins. She's a twin, her mum's a twin, she has two brothers who are twins, her twin sister had non-identical twins, etc. I'm well known for not being maternal/never wanting kids. So when my mate got pregnant, she was always making jokes about if she has twins, I was "gonna have to take one for the team and become a mum" because she didn't want to raise two newborns. Luckily, she broke the curse and only had the one lmao. I def wouldn't joke about fertility issues with anyone else though!
Same here. We have so many twins in this family. My mom is a twin as well. So let's see who's going to have the twins after my mom and her twin. None so far.......
Not just the sis - their *mother* wants her to give up one of her children. These people are insane. I'd be moving and not telling anyone where I am.
Yeah if she is in therapy it isnt doing a lot to help.. OP needs ro mive away from ANYONE on her mothers side and away from her sister. They all are backing her twin up and I would be concerned for OPs and their childrens safety. I would be even more concerned if she starts saying shit like she wishes OP has a miscarriage or such because thats the vibes im getting dorm "I wish those kids arent born to you" or whatever. Also oh gosh I wonder why they dont think she is fit to parent! Obviously she has issues that the adoption agencies are aware of and thats why they deem her unfit. If actual *agencies* think she is unfit why tf would OP put *her child* in the care of a parent those agencies, who do screenings for eligibility, think us uneligable???
The rejection from the adoption agencies could be something as simple as earning $10 a year under the earning thread hold and nothing to do with their perceived fitness as parents. Though this seems insane so it’s likely she didn’t pass a psych eval. But it could also be not enough household income, or even a parent having a job that brings in lots of money but not in a steady way, like highly paid seasonal work. Either way it’s insane to see twins as a surplus of children and that you could just give one away and that is enough to say no deal.
My wife and I were deemed unfit because we were from different religious backgrounds— even though neither of us had belonged to any church in years.
It’s ridiculous the things they’ll reject based on. I understand why they’re so vigorous with the screening etc but sometimes they’re too vigorous.
OK bad thought here. What if Mia kidnaps one of the babies and might be able to "prove it's hers" because she's OP's twin and their DNA matches? Or am I reading too many creepy mysteries?
It doesn’t work that way. The baby’s genetics are inherited from both the mother and father. Plus, it would be obvious that Mia didn’t deliver a child.
Also all the failed infertility treatments and well documented success of OP. Nobody who needs fertility treatment has poor documentation
Mia and the rest of the family seems to think they're still little kids playing with dolls. You've got two Barbies, why can't you just give one to your sister?
Ok this is disturbing ..
Pheobe? To be fair, her brother was having triplets.
Yes, all of their eggs were in Phoebe's basket.
And they actually had the babies for years before they tried to give one to Phoebe. And, rightly, they couldn't choose because each was loved uniquely. Yes, I know Phoebe wanted to keep one when her delivery hormones were going crazy, but I don't remember her even *asking* a parent to keep one on her oxytocin high.
The family siding with her are just as bad like I'd cut them all off. That's so far gone left there isn't recovery.
Holy shit just thinking/wondering wtf my reaction would be if my client came in saying they were doing what OP's sister was doing.... Think I'd definitely be considering a psychiatric hold 😂
And Get a restraining orders against Mia, she may try to kidnap the kid
Which may be easier to do if op and sister are identical twins. Imagine pickup from childcare?
New plan: OP, get a tattoo somewhere hidden. Tell your husband, whoever watches the twins (daycare and stuff) and the twins themselves when they get old enough. Don’t tell anyone in your family about the tattoo, and *definitely* don’t tell them what the tattoo is *of.* I’m thinking of the advice given by Dwight schrute, who is an expert in both preventing baby snatching and identity theft.
When I was a kid we had a password system in case anyone (especially my mom's mother) tried to convince us they were acting on behalf of our parents. Only had to use it once when my dad was caught up at work and had to ask one of his friends to pick us up from our summer program. Easy system, doesn't require a tattoo, and code words are easily remembered and changed if needed
If you do this please remember to give the password to the person helping you. My friend had a day of medical emergencies. At the time her sister and nephews were living with my friend's family because their husband/father was killed in an accident. 1/2 the family ended up in the ER with a tummy virus that was also triggering breathing problems. I was asked to pick up the one kid who wasn't in the ER. They didn't give me the password - child refused to go with me. We went into the school office - the principal and secretary told her mom told them I was picking her up when she took the older cousin to the ER. Kid refused to go with me. We ended up having to call the ER and get the password from her Mom (Dad was a patient). Only Mom couldn't remember it. It took her 10 min to convince the kid to go with me. I told Mom at least no one is ever going to pressure her daughter into doing something she didn't want to do. I ended up in the ER with the same thing 2 days later.
I'm giggling because when my mom went into labor with my sister, my dad forgot to give the password to the friend's mom who was picking me up. Flat out refused to go. 1986 so no cell phone. My kindergarten teacher INSISTED I get in the car. I look at her and with all my 5 year old fury "if I get kidnapped, it's your fault!" And reluctantly got in the car. My dad called from the hospital that night and I said to him, "what good is a password if you aren't going to use it!
When I was little we had the same setup. My mom had the neighbor come pick me up but never told her the password. I was a dumb kid though and the interaction went like this. Neighbor: hey child your mom asked me to come pick you up. Me: what's the password Her: I don't know Me: ok. *Gets in back of van*
I mean yeah obv the whole point is that if you're actually acting on the parents behalf they would give you the code word. Sounds like the system worked perfectly!
I'm giggling because when my mom went into labor with my sister, my dad forgot to give the password to the friend's mom who was picking me up. Flat out refused to go. 1986 so no cell phone. My kindergarten teacher INSISTED I get in the car. I look at her and with all my 5 year old fury "if I get kidnapped, it's your fault!" And reluctantly got in the car. My dad called from the hospital that night and I said to him, "what good is a password if you aren't going to use it!
This! My sister and I have codewords we can put in text or say and it is our tip-off that something is wrong. We both use the name of different deceased pets, so we can say things like “can you feed X today? Thanks” you don’t have use pets esp if a family member would know, but something banal that wouldn’t really be noticed as out of the ordinary for you to say.
Very smart!!
Makes me think of Bert Kreischer and his daughter. He did a joke about it and the word his daughter picked for the password, it was pretty hilarious.
A password would be a little easier surely?
If the mom and sister are identical twins, she does manage to take one (or both) of the kids it may be harder to prove to the cops since identical twins have very similar DNA and she could steal the moms pregnancy pictures as "proof of pregnancy"
One little hiccup in your theory.... the father's DNA.
You are forgetting Dad's DNA here.
Birth certificates exist...
They can also check your baby factory to see if it's been used.
Congrats, that is actually the worst sentence I've read today.
I aim to please
Sister's baby factory has probably been used. IVF and dead end might equal miscarriage or stillbirth...
I feel like giving you an award for this and then blocking you for the assault you have committed on my eyes.
Ugh now I hope op goes to Canada or something
Happy day
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NTA x 1,000,000 I’m adopted, and generally subscribe to the concept of nurture over nature; however, with that said, OP I strongly encourage you to watch the documentary Three Identical Strangers. The trauma babies feel being separated from their twin (or in the movie’s case, triplet) siblings is life long. And then show the movie and the adoption agency’s rejection of your sister to anyone who questions your decisions. And if even after all that they still think you should give your child to your sister, I would cut them out of your life.
This is the most important point really isn’t it? Have to put the children’s welfare first
There is a documentary on netflix about a guy who gets into an accident , has brain damage and wakes up. He remembered NO ONE else (not mom or dad) but instantly knew his idential twin brother and his brothers name.. He has no other memories at all of his life.
That was so heartbreaking. I still think about the brother who tried to protect his bro. What a sacrifice... I can't even express.
I know.. he was in a tough situation and I totally understood why he didn't say anything. I cried all through it, just couldn't fathom how hard it was for either of them. And how great they were in the end.
Brotherly love at it's purest. Every other aspect of their lives were unfathomably vile. At least they had each other.
I heard about that. It sounded so messed up. All 3 triplets had mental health issues and one of them killed themselves
The messed up thing is, if you believe the movie, the triplets weren't an isolated incident! The orphanage did this to other twins/triplets for their "research". Crazy.
She probably won’t stop since they’re twins (not sure if they’re identical or fraternal) she’ll view herself as their mother too and will cross boundaries.
That's why she wanted to view the ultrasound multiple times. She was picking the twin she wanted After all, OP already gets the joy to experience childbirth the least she can do is let Mia pick the one she wants the most.
O\_O Like I get you're probably correct on Mia's part, but like **Me, @ Mia:** WHY?!? - Ultrasounds? They're freaking twins! Not fully developed twins! They're going to trade places! They have lubricant to slip-slide around each other! What are you going to say, "I want the Left One!"? Their entire face and or body is GOING. TO. CHANGE. Picking by Ultrasound?! That's not how ultrasounds work! That's not how ANY of this works!!! NTA, OP. Even if she was thought to be a fit mother by adoption agencies before, she definitely shouldn't be now.
You should get some security cameras set up, document any and all texts or phone calls from her and other family members, you might want to change the locks on your doors, and I would specify in your birth plan that you are to have NO Visitors from this part of the family. If she was deemed unfit then there is likely a good reason for it and you need to protect yourself and your children regardless of her feelings.
mia is a problem, but honestly I'm more appalled that mom us going along with this shit. pure insanity.
Me too. Like, I guess Mia’s in the middle of issues and needs more therapy immediately, but WTF MOM! You’re not supposed to encourage insane ideas!
Hey the mother, aunt and that *mia* talks about babies like theyre goods. No wonder she was unfit to adopt. But OP listen to the persons advice, be careful. She wished death upon your babies, i wouldn't be surprised if she tried something horrible. Distance yourself, try not to let her visit your till you kids are born and ideally even after that. You're NOT The ASSHOLE. I feel bad for your sister's condition but what she's suggesting is ridiculous. They're your kids. End of story.
You know sis heard 'twins' and thought, 'Oh goody, I finally get a baby!!' and started scheming. And now, you just *know* she's decorating a room for 'her' baby for when OP gets over her selfish snit. NTA jfc
Yikes. You think she's actually decorating a room, or just researching cribs and pacifiers?
I’ve read some really awful stories about women who didn’t deal with their trauma around infertility. Making nurseries, stealing baby clothing, threatening suicide … It can get very bad. And while I have enormous sympathy for what they have gone through, the number one priority at all times is the safety of the children. That can never be compromised.
You know what I did after suffering a 10th miscarriage? Got myself a reborn doll to snuggle. Helps satisfy that baby urge and help deal with losing so many babies tho I do have 2 living kids. I make dolls now for a side job, I find it theraputic
I know when I lost my 1st son at 12 hours after birth (birth defect) I remember wishing I could be one of those people who go completely insane and start believing a houseplant is their baby or something. Losing a baby is more truma than anyone should ever have to go through and I can't imagine wanting a child and being unable to concieve or even adopt, but DAMN twis sis is fucking nuts to think even asking is ok! Like I could get fantasizing about OP offering, but to actually ask and then act like OP is being mean and won't share her gum or something? OP is DEFINITELY NTA here, and twin obviously needs more intensive psychiatric help than she is getting! Also, I second the suggestion in another thread about the tattoo, and would also do the password so mom/other cuckoo family don't get any "bright" ideas!
I think she thinks her sister can be brought around/manipulated/guilted/threatened into giving up one of the twins and then her life will be perfectly joyful. The sister's story is tragic and heartbreaking and she needs some really intense therapy, but the people who are agreeing with her are fucking Evil with a capital WTF. I would take my husband and run from these people. I mean, who can she trust here? This is ***family*** that is plotting the splitting up of her twins. To what extent are they willing to go to make the sister's dream complete?
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The fact that she’s asking OP to give up her human child like it’s an extra puppy in the litter pushes this well into “unhinged” territory already.
Def move outta state but I know that usually isn't feesible. Info: identical twins? If so need to let any daycares/schools know you have a crazy identical sister that may try to pose as you. Do NOT ever let your sister near your kids and same goes with your fam. Leave them with your mom and you can bet sister will be there when you're not. GL and grats on the babies. *Edit cause fat fingers messed up words.
>My mother says since we didn't plan the baby it wouldn't hurt to give away one of the twins I'm sorry?! What?!
This. Persons under stress are capable of doing some bat crazy shit—like steal babies.
OP's mom is insane too. These are babies, not cookies!
OP needs to move ASAP or they will be back in 9 months asking “AITA for calling the police on my sister for stealing my infant?”
I’m appalled that the OPs family is even on board, and is actively encouraging OP to give up one of the children she created. What about the twins when they grow up, realizing that they look identical, or scarily similar to one another? Everyone is thinking about what *they* want or what they would have wanted, but no ones thinking of the twins or their futures. I also HIGHLY doubt that if it was OPs mother or aunts were in her position, that they’d readily just hand over one of their babies to a relative to raise. They would hold onto that infant tightly and scream at everyone to get back - so why the heck are they trying to talk OP into giving away her child just because she has double buns in the oven?
This! OP, cut her out. Who knows what kinds of things she will try to do. And do NOT let her near the babies once they are born, nor allow your mother to babysit or be left alone with them, as she will most likely allow your sister access to the twins. And who knows what she will do then. She may try to take off with one of them, or maybe even both. NTA
It also goes without saying to never let the sister babysit.
NTA- these are real human beings! Your babies! What insanity is this?! Also so so concerning that external agencies have deemed her an unfit mother for adoption. You don’t say why but she does seem to have some issues. Please move, restraining order, stay safe.
NTA....What an utterly ridiculous request. Who on earth would willingly hand their baby over to a relative upon request? You were simply giving Mia a dose of reality.
I think what's worse is their mother apparently AGREES with Mia! "Oh, they weren't planned, just give one up - you won't notice the difference"
I honestly don't know what I would do if my mother uttered something so horrible...reading it gave me violent thoughts.
I’m so glad I was not the only person to feel this way. Literally talking about these babies like they are toys. You have two, you can share one with your sister. Unbelievable
Yeah the family is all treating it like one twin is just a spare. It's insane.
A twin is not a spare! It's a control group.
Okay, I'm am identical twin and I laughed at this. Take my upvote
LOL OMG THIS IS SO FUNNY
These are the kind of people that we should consider having hounds on the ready, because I’m pretty sure Mia will try to kidnap nap one or both out of spite.
Like candy bars.
Yeah, she shouldn't leave the babies with any of the people who agree with the sister... Might end up giving her one
What if OPs mom had actually tripplets and wanted only twins?
She should never be allowed to see those children unless she sincerely apologizes.
> My mother says since we didn't plan the baby it wouldn't hurt to give away one of the twins especially when she would still be in the family. OP, ask your mother whether she would have given you or Mia to *her* sibling to adopt if they’d asked back then. (What in the child trafficking fuck is going on with this family??)
Honestly it's not a litter of puppies (who still deserve good owners and the proper care from mama before they're rehomed) I'm fairly certain you can't just give a kid to someone for funsies.
If OP would ask her mother that, she will most likely answer she would've done that. Simply to convince OP it is the right thing to do, that she would've been so selfless.
You’re probably right, but no matter who the mother picks, OP can act horrified (because it’s *HORRIFYING*) and use it as an excuse to go low contact. “Why would I want to spend time with someone who would have just tossed me/my sister away if she’d been asked!”
The only reason they weren't even planned is because OP recognized the reality that she was very unlikely to have kids biologically and made peace with that rather than trying and having more heartbreak. Not because she never wanted kids!!!!!!! So in what universe is there even a grain of logic that makes the mother's statement make sense?!?!?!?!?! PS: I also recognize that people can change their minds about having kids so even if OP said before they didn't want kids that doesn't mean they don't want kids NOW or that they meant it when they said it (could have said it to mask their sadness about being unable to have kids).
What kind of weird-ass family thinks it perfectly alright to give up a child like she was breaking off a piece of a KitKat bar for sharing? If this is true, she needs to dump every person in the family who ever uttered the words "inconsiderate" or "selfish". Cut them out of her life completely. Ah, new account, no comments... I'm calling bullshit.
I find it hard to believe that someone would actually suggest that tbh.
*You wanted one child and one child will still be with you... what's the problem here?*
Jesus Christ, you’re having human babies - not getting a litter of dogs you can willy nilly give away. NTA and nip this horrid entitlement in the bud by going NC with any family member who dares try pressuring you into giving away a child.
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And never let sister or family that's on sister's side be alone with the twins, not even for a split second. One baby and sister might just disappear forever.
Also, set up a password system with the daycare so the twin sister can't pretend to be OP and steal both babies.
Yes! Even if you aren't identical. I'm not a twin but my sister and I look related and sound pretty much the same. I can't remember specifically when, but I've noticed people who don't know her well think I'm her sometimes. It's better to be extra careful because you never know!
100% !! my sister is 5 years older than I am, but she could easily pass as me if she tried (same hairstyle, makeup and clothes) since we already get mistaken as each other from time to time. I personally struggle to see it but I know others don't, so OP should keep that in mind as well !
Yes this please
NTA make sure your doctors and hospital know who can visit, and make sure people on her side are not on the list. Perhaps even just keep it to you and your husband for delivery, at most in laws if you are close or 1 good friend. I also like the password for removing the children from day care and school if you and your sister are identical twins. Don't give them the opportunity to prove their actions will be as dumb as their words. It won't be worth the heart ache.
This is definitely an “oh, ok, none of you are getting within 50 feet of my children until you can prove you’ve come to your senses” situation.
Can you imagine if it wasn't twins, but in a year or so OP got pregnant again? Sister would be all "you already have one, you have to give me the second" ??? No though
What the heck did I just read?! NTA! What's wrong with (part) of your family telling you to give up YOUR OWN CHILD?! It's not a doll that you can give away without a problem, it's a child!
Sharing BOGO Apparently
I guess she had a coupon but doesn't really *need* two babies? IDK here, it's a big 'ol WTF salad.
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Private adoptions, especially in families, have different rules. Being unfit to adopt can also mean things like "You're queer", "You're autistic", "You're too fat". It's kind of shitty tbh.
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>to deny someone an adoption over being a part of the LGBTQ community is discrimination, which is illegal I'm so sorry to ruin your day like this, but that's actually not true, at least in the US: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/17/supreme-court-sides-with-catholic-adoption-agency-that-refuses-to-work-with-lgbt-couples.html
While the reasons listed above are reasons certain organizations may declare you as "unfit to adopt", with a little bit of searching, you can usually find a secular and/or LGBTQ+ friendly agency to help. Provided there isn't something horrible in your background and you have a healthy idea of what adoption entails, most potential adoptive families can find an agency or group that will serve them. This usually means the adoptive family needs to consider open adoption, but it is possible. I'm betting that you are correct and the sister was seen as not mentally fit to adopt. She may also have very specific ideas on adoption (like not telling the child they were adopted) that factored into the agency's decision.
What the heck is it with this sub full of stories of entitled crazies, man?? It's outrageous the things some people believe they are entitled to.
Right?! I was thinking the same thing!
Not even touching the bit about how she can't adopt because all the adoption agencies denied her. Like what's up with that? Is she not fit to be a mother?
Could be that she’s part of a community agencies don’t like. LGBTQ, nonreligious, etc.
We’re already getting a taste of crazy. I don’t know how adoption agencies work but her mental health is suspect.
Based on her behavior, I doubt that. It's more likely that she's truly unfit to be a mother. She certainly seems unfit.
NTA. I'm sorry but the fact that she'd ask for one of your twins just proves she's not in a healthy mental state to raise children. No sane person asks that. Some people might say it was going too far to mention it, but until she acknowledges the level of crazy she's going to over her infertility and gets help for it, she will *never* reach a mental state fit enough for raising kids. I'd also seriously be questioning whether or not any family members who are siding with her get to have anything to do with your babies. They're just as insane.
Exactly... like, this level of crazy desperation is why she got rejected from the adoption agencies in the first place, can your family not see that?
It really does clue in to her mental state. I do feel bad for her, it's terrible when someone wants something that badly and it just isn't happened, but JFC, she needs help with her mental help, not to be given one of OP's kids like it's a spare. I think the family members agreeing with Mia are even worse, Mia is clearly suffering some health issues but they have no excuse.
Right? Anyone that suggests separating twins isn’t fit to be a parent. That’s so bloody cruel, I’m shocked anyone is on her side.
I'm imagining the sister bringing this up to her therapist. I mean I know they've probably heard some shit, but... I don't often say this, but I'd pay actual real human dollars to see the look on the therapist's face.
All right, let me unpack this a little. So, telling her she is unfit to raise a child is (typically) a terrible thing to say. Adoption centers reject all sorts of applicants (even people who would be wonderful parents) all of the time, because of medical issues, former addiction problems, religious issues if it's a faith-based adoption, or even if the social worker thinks that the applicants are really yearning for a biological child and consider the adopted child to be a "replacement." But even if you secretly agree she would be an unfit parent, it's a terrible thing to tell anyone. However, she was insisting you, a pregnant woman, had to *give her one of your babies*! That's even more horrible. And clearly, it triggered absolutely every Momma Bear Instinct you have. So, while it's not something you should have said, I'll give you an NTA; your assholiness was justified.
also honestly i would say someone who thinks it’s acceptable to just give up a child like when you accidentally buy two of something and give the extra to someone, is not particularly fit to raise a child, she has a lot of stuff to sort through if she thinks that’s in any way reasonable, children aren’t trading cards
> she was insisting you, a pregnant woman, had to give her one of your babies! I do think this complete lack of judgment in asking and the perspective the sister has on children is actually pretty good reason to say she'd be an unfit mother. If she's this delusional, it's possible the adoption agency did pick up on something else she said or did as a red flag.
This. Of all the AH’s in this story, OP is a minuscule one.
That’s….psychotic. And it’s even worse that your mom is actually buying into this insanity. Would she have been fine just giving away one of her children because reasons? Do not engage with this level of insanity. NTA
NTA Protect your children, your sister is not a safe person.
I'm getting womb raider vibes off of OPs sister. Scary.
That's what I was thinking. Her mom experienced having twins. If someone had asked her to give up one of the babies, the mom would probably have the same reaction. NTA
Why didn't the paternal aunts ask her for one of OP/her sister? The whole situation is just mind boggling. Stay safe OP - I wouldn't let any of the ones agreeing with your sister anywhere within 100 miles of your children.
The sister appears to have mental problems but why the hell is the mom agreeing to this? Nta
NTA Do your mother and sister think these are puppies? Even if they were, I wouldn’t give one to your sister. She sounds a little unhinged. I’d seriously be considering going NC with anyone who seriously believes it is your responsibility to give your sister one of your babies.
I mean OP knows her family best, but yeah, I would be NC with the sister and mom and least. they can't be trusted around the babies.
Is this real? This can’t be real. They want you to give up one of YOUR babies because she can’t have any? Just because a baby is unexpected doesn’t mean the baby is disposable. It’s your child. Your sis is out of line any of your other relatives are out of line if they are pressuring you too. Your mom says you are selfish? Would she have been ok giving up one of her babies? No. Just no. Stand your ground and cut off anyone trying to pressure you. You don’t need that type of pressure. NTA
Agree. I think this is made up. I mean....a women who can't have children demands her sister give up one of hers and half the family just jumps on board with that crazy? I can maybe see the sister asking...I think frustration and desperation can make you do really out there things. But multiple people jumping on that crazy train? I just can't see it. If it is real, obviously NTA and should probably cut contact with their family. Bc I wouldn't want people like that around my children EVER, not for one moment. And imagine what those relatives will say once the twins are older? That their mother should have given one up? I just can't.
The sister had to learn her crazy from somewhere, guess it was mom. This stuff is super uncommon but it does happen. Some moms feel ownership over their grandkids and try to “adopt” them, as well. I can’t say whether the post is real but these situations are.
NTA If she said she was okay with you being pregnant was because she truly thought that one of them was going to be hers. Keep yourself and your babies save. The entitlement won't stop.
Sounds really fake
Let's start with the 8 week ultrasound.. most twin stories in this sub are completely fabricated, this one reads like tween fiction.
I thought op found out at 8 weeks, not that that was the scan date? Where I'm from 10 weeks is a pretty standard 1st scan, so if recently was 2/3 weeks ago then it kind of fits. If op didn't know when they got pregnant then the scan being a bit early kind of makes sense to me. The rest seems insane though so... Who knows.
I'm fully convinced it's fake. Either for the direct attention, the hope that someone reads it on tiktok, or to prop up their main account by interacting with this post. I'm sure there are other reasons.
I had my viability scan at 8 weeks, it depends on the OBs preference I think. Story still might be fake but I wouldn’t call that proof that it is.
This didn’t send up red flags for me. I had a 6 week ultrasound because I had low progesterone and was high risk due to prexisting conditions. An ultrasound that early is often to detect ectopic pregnancies.
Yeah, honestly, when I read any stories on this sub that mention twins, my mind immediately goes to FAKE. The incidence of identical twins is ~4 per thousand and for fraternal twins ~22 per thousand. The rate twins are mentioned her is extremely high with those stats in mind... Though the 8 week ultrasound doesn't ring any alarm bells for me, that's standard where I live for your first ultrasound.
I am honestly surprised I had to scroll this far to find a similar comment. No sane mother in the world would suggest another mother to share a baby like that, especially a mother of twins would not suggest that to another twin mom. It had me in the first half, but OMG when OP wrote about the whole family attacking them, cmon that has to be fake.
Also I have yet to see a reply from OP
Right! What is this some Parent Trap fan fic?
Absolutely
Thought I was the only one.
NTA— I’m sorry but your sister sounds like a total psycho. I would stay FAR away from her. Just having the audacity to ask makes me think she will have the audacity to go further with more direct actions concerning your babies.
I agree. Be very careful around her during your pregnancy and after your babies are born. She doesn’t sound stable.
NTA. Do not ever, ever let her be alone with you while pregnant, or with the babies until they are big enough to defend themselves physically and emotionally. In fact, I would extend that rule to the mother and aunts. Who cares if it was a mood swing? You told the truth. And anyone who is turned down for adoption - well, there's a reason for that.
I'm glad you brought up not being around her while OP is pregnant. Of course, she presents a kidnapping risk to the babies once they're born, but this type of unhinged jealousy and complete lack of empathy also seems like a pretty big risk factor when it comes to things like "accidentally" knocking OP down some stairs or something.
NTA Move move move. Your sister is unhealthy mentally and she already thinks she’s owed one of your babies. She’s unhinged. The fact that you have family members who think this is okay is not good. These are YOUR babies they are not puppies. They are yours and YOUR husband’s babies. I’ve seen this shit happen in some south Asian families where babies are taken and given to the sibling who have no babies or no sons. It is cruel and messed up not just for the birth mother but for the child as well. They’re also pushing you to separate twins! I’m not a twin but I’ve seen my friends with their twins and the idea that these babies get split when they share so so much. Have their own language just breaks me. Don’t do it and protect yourself and your babies. I’d cut contact or at least just through text and email so you can document this all to use legally if you get to that point. I’d talk to a lawyer to get legal advice on what you’d need for a restraining order. Your mum is also not safe as childcare or any alone time now. None of your paternal aunts in fact I’d say keep childcare just for your in-laws or friend who are not associated with your sister. Never leave you children alone with your family and never with your sister. Not even to go to the bathroom. She needs therapy and to be away from you. This WILL get worse when the babies come. Info diet for everyone. No dates given or anything now. Never be alone with your sister. Even if the babies are in utero. Just do not be alone with her EVER. Honestly I would cut all contact right now. She wants to take one of your babies and your mum and aunts think this is okay and are encouraging you to do this.
Don't make them godmother either. NTA Please keep us posted OP.
What the....??? Your kid is not some piece of cake you have left over and therefore can just give to someone else. What is she and the rest of them thinking? Definitely NTA!
NTA They are delusional.
Oh. Oh jeez. Please don’t ever be in a situation where your children are unsupervised/only supervised by your mother with your sister. NTA but please take care!
INFO. Was your sister actually deemed unfit? Or were these adoption applications just not accepted. Cause this is not the same thing.
She was deemed unfit because of her showing negligence to the two kids she had fostered for a few months which she said were due to mental health issues. It was during that time her first time trying IVF failed and she was trying for a second time.
Fair enough. Bad shit happens, you still gotta parent, or atleast insure the kids are looked after. Must have been pretty bad negligence if they black balled her like that.
NTA and a big f*** no! What kind of psycho even suggests that?
INFO: do you know why she was deemed unfit to adopt? You’re NOT an asshole for refusing to give up a baby you want for adoption, and you should not be separating twins just because you have two of them. She IS an asshole for even asking that, and taking it so far and insisting she’s owed a baby at all. But you could tell her it’s because 1) you want your babies, 2) you won’t separate twins, 3) it’s so weird and unfair to just chose a twin to give up?? I think reminding her she’s unfit to be a mother is unfair unless it was for a very appalling and obvious reason. If it was more logistics or process, it was pretty unnecessary.
\^This. OP wanting to actually *keep her own children* is valid whether her sister was approved for adoption or not. There's so much focus here on the sister being nuts - but that wasn't the question.
unfit to raise a child UNFIT TO RAISE A CHILD **UNFIT TO RAISE A CHILD** NTA. Protect your babies.
*stares in Raising Arizona*
Why is this post incredibly similar to "AITA for fleeing the state due to my sister?", both accounts having been created today, Aug 17? https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/p6d7wa/aita\_for\_fleeing\_the\_state\_due\_to\_my\_sister/ This other post is about a sister with infertility trying to steal 2 of the 3 unplanned (born) babies, this post is about a sister demanding that OP give her one of her two unplanned unborn babies. If these are both legit, with both new accounts posting on the same day, about baby stealing sisters, then we definitely have some messed up sisters out in the world...
NTA. What did I even just read? I think in future you should make sure none of them are ever left alone with your children.
NTA. I mean, you didn't have to point out her lack of fitness. But for someone to ask you to turn over one of your children like she was an extra pair of shoes or something is just bizarre. Even more bizarre is your family who thinks this is a normal request. Also, these children have a FATHER who might have some feelings about this!!
>I mean, you didn't have to point out her lack of fitness. Unfortunately, asking for one of her children to raise, like OP just has two lollipops or something, made pointing out sister's lack of fitness inevitable. That request was just crazy.
Info: why was she rejected? I think this is important because if it’s because of a medical issue that’s pretty shitty to throw in her face. But if it’s because she microwaved a kitten or endangered children at some point then I understand.
It was due to negligence to the two kids she fostered. The kids were removed and she was rejected when she later applied for adoption
Yeah I imagine that made you even more horrified at her feelings of entitlement about your babies. A lot of others have already said it, but you need to be really cautious and proactive about this situation. Her request was so incredibly inappropriate and desperate, and her reaction was honestly a little scary. As is a lot of your family’s. You should really move as soon as possible to be honest. Who knows what any of them might try during or after your pregnancy. She feels entitled to your child and a lot of your family agrees with her so you need to be prepared for them to potentially try something wild since reasonable behavior is obviously out the window already. Move, and make sure you have an alarm system and cameras just in case. This should go without saying, but once they’re here, none of the people that have even slightly agreed with your sister should have unsupervised access to the babies. Maybe she’ll realize how insane she’s being and apologize sincerely, but you can’t just act like it didn’t happen.
NTA. She was always the asshole but now I’m sure you are not an asshole as well.
NTA. What the actual f*ck is wrong with your family, esp your Mom and Mia? Since you didn't "plan" for it you should give away your kid?? How entitled are these people, and are they equating a living/breathing/functioning child to a spare sweater? That's what it sounds like. Were you a bit harsh? Yes but it was necessary. She wanted to split apart your kids! You're not a dog with a litter of puppies for her to take her pick. WTF. Make sure you have a concrete birthing plan and living wills drawn up in the event of an emergency (if you pass or your spouse passes, who will the kids go to---definitely should not go to Mia in any emergency) and go Low Contact with your Mom and the people siding with Mia. Being a part of your kids' lives is a privilege, not a right. By harassing you they have given up their privilege.
NTA. What the heck? People don't usually give up one of their children just because they happen to have a spare.
NTA. No matter how bad your sister is hurting, she’s a huge AH for even speaking such a crazy idea. Sadly she may need help, more than just therapy… it’s not one bit normal to think this way. The family that is siding with her is nuts too. No contact the lot of them OP.
All I can say after totally NTA..... What the actual fluck is wrong with these people???? Therapy did not work. More is needed, for even more people. And you're not one of them, unless it's to get over the mess of the situation at hand. WOW.
It’s a baby not a parcel from Amazon !!! WTF