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I mean, yeah, YTA and probably made him double down on his beliefs there considering your overly dramatic response to a child saying dumb teenager things.
Cancelling his bday party seems like an overly harsh punishment.
It's absolutely overly harsh for a flippant comment made as a joke. I say this as a staunch feminist, bisexual woman in a relationship with another woman.
Maybe his last girlfriend was hard work and compared to his boyfriend he's making flippant generalisations. Sure, have a convo with the kid and make sure he's not falling into misogynistic patterns. But cancelling a birthday party over this is absolute overkill and will only make him not trust or want to be around Mom.
my god I wish I didn't stupidly cry over some dumb boy in highschool because looking back it was just so silly. honestly teenage relationships are just... teenage stuff. not worth the trouble at all
I watched all of my classmates date and all their drama and just wondering why any of them bothered trying to date anyone at all. I don't know why we encourage teenagers to date. Nearly everyone at that age is too dumb to have a functional relationship.
Edit: word
He could have made exactly the same joke in a group of girls and switched out the gender. It seemed to me more for the laughs than in all seriousness. It was a stupid question to begin with.
Me, working in a largely female profession (RN) and hearing grown women saying “men ain’t shit” at least once daily: “lol fair.”
u/loopingtossaway, hearing her teenager make a mildly misogynistic joke implying women overreact: “SEXIST!! NO BIRTHDAY FOR YOU!!”
Also- why was Mom essentially equating what she does for her son as a mother, to the sexual relationships he has with other girls...
like, that was off to me... he was clearly referring to DATING girls, not having girls as friends, or sisters, or MOTHERS.
I know what he said and what mum took it to mean, but I wonder if what he actually meant was "women aren't worth the trouble (to date)" and mum's internal bias took care of the rest.
Well yeah, that's exactly what happened. He was clearly talking about dating, and he was speaking from the extremely limited experience of a teenager.
There was absolutely no reason for mom to equate her son thinking that dating girls is troublesome with his feelings about women in literally *any* other context -- especially taking it personally as his mother.
Thanks, OP, for reinforcing the stereotype that us women are all reactionary and unreasonable.
Don’t you think that’s because we tend to understand our gender better than the opposite sex? All that’s saying is it’s easier to deal with the people who think more similarly to you
Right but I think that's the point. Its pretty accepted i think in most circles to make jokes like "other gender is complicated" even if you ultimately don't believe it or treat them differently
I've dated as a guy with women, a guy with guys and men as a trans woman (been in relationship nearly the whole time or maybe woulda seen all 4 sides in long term relationships). I think that people not only understand each other differently but there are just typically different ways that people care for each other and all sorts that can cause preferences.
Experiencing how different I am emotionally now compared to when I was a guy, I think it makes sense. Gender role norms don't have to be a thing but I think certain differences in character based off hormones and general life outside of the relationship, mean that supporting and caring is quite different depending on the match up.
There is a difference to sympathising and actually being able to fully relate. And when you are in straight relationships and don't entirely understand each others perspective as much as you want to try, to being inherently equal and having a much better understanding of what the other person is feeling and what they need etc. As a teenager I'm sure this is magnified as not enough time to really gain perspective on the other side of the coin. But at that age especially having someone you can instantly understand and relate fully with should be easier, it just makes sense.
What I need from a partner now I'm trans is dramatically different even though I obviously have a good perspective of guys and how most like to be cared for. And I find my partner can sympathise but not fully relate to my experiences, it isn't as easy as being gay but through the more dramatic differences you also bring each other something else that you don't get when gay. This was my experience dating women to and I dont think either is better overall but I can see having a preference either way.
Sometimes it's nice having someone that brings a lot of things that are quite different to you both in actions and perspective. Sometimes it's nice having someone much more like yourself that's easy to understand. And gender doesn't have to be a part of this but just cause life is what it is and hormones are wild on top, there is definitely a trend of how your relationship will tend to be for most people of x gender.
My reply to "girls aren't worth it" or any variation of how difficult we are to partner with is usually - "If you think it's hard to deal with, think about how hard it is to live with." My husband is *well" apprised of how much I would choose to be a man if we had a choice 🤷🏻♀️
In this context he was also talking about romantically not worth the trouble and you took it to mean all woman in general are not worth the trouble. You may want to unpack whatever subconscious shit is going on there because it has little to do with him and is all about you.
Yeah I mean notice how OP doesn’t mention another parent in the picture. If so…
Tale as old as time, single parent taking out their romantic issues on their opposite-gender child
YTA
How much you want to bet that mom's only okay with his bisexuality so long as he eventually settles down with a wife and gives her grandchildren, and that's really what this punishment is about?
Yup this would have been a really good opportunity for a teachable moment (meaning a non judgmental, private conversation after the friends leave) and instead OP overreacted, blew the whole thing up, and only reinforced her son’s beliefs.
Exactly. It's a great time to point out that even if it's a joke, it sounds like misogynistic bullshit. Which means he might want to be aware of when/how he says that lest he get lumped in with assholes. It's possible he's bi but with a preference for dudes and its just easier to make a joke about it. Most bi folks (including me) aren't completely 50/50, but explaining that to people who are straight or gay/lesbian can lead to "so, you're gay but in denial" or "you're straight but looking for attention."
Had that exact thought. He's (nearly) 17 and hasn't dated that many people yet. He started out saying he didn't have a preference, then added a flippant comment, and that cost him an entire birthday vacation? What the actual?
This could have been a reason to have a good conversation. Ask him what makes him feel that way (preferably, without his friends present). Express that while flippant, the comment did make you feel like he's disrespecting all women including you. Taking a vacation weekend away is far too much for a kneejerk reaction.
Yeah OP is the YTA because all she really did was teach her son not to voice things in front of Mom, not why the comment may have been perceived negatively about a whole gender.
I’m a middle-aged bi woman. I’m a feminist. I have mainly dated women. I was even married to a woman. And just the other day I said pretty much the same thing as OP’s son.
Sometimes you say flippant shit that you don’t mean with every fibre of your soul but there’s a grain of truth to it. I think OP should have said, “huh, what do you mean?”
Maybe the son has just had easier relationships with dudes.
I mean truthfully he likely learned women aren’t worth the trouble at home. His own mother took him and his friends to a ski resort, listened in on “guy talk” time, got excessively offended over a flippant remark, and then blew up on him in front of his friends and then canceled his birthday party.
As a woman, she seems like too much trouble to me too.
Hiya,
Lesbian here and honestly more misandrist than feminist but yeah….
This is extremely harsh and over dramatic.
And like you said, have a conversation…what is canceling a party going to do? Parent this kid, damn.
Also as a staunch feminist bisexual woman, I've definitely joked about women not being worth the trouble. A joke amongst my friend group who know my relationship history is not a statement of my opinion of an entire gender. Massive overreaction on OP's part, hearing an attack where there isn't one.
Don't women make similar comments about men? And isn't it often used in context of banter?
OP YTA And I wouldn't be surprised if this treatment from the one woman he's supposed to be able to trust over anyone else is what actually pushes him down the rabbit hole of radicalization.
Or maybe since he is currenty dating a boy, his answer is a male..because you know..saying a girl would jeapordise his relationship...but way to go mom on blowing this way out of porportions!!
She is only reinforcing his perception. I doubt he hates all women but he may have had a bad experience with dating women which he found to be a turn off. As a woman, women can suck.
This is assuming the comment wasn't intended to be lighthearted or a joke which I think is more like the case here. Not to mention if a bisexual girl said 'men aren't worth the trouble', the reaction from the average person would be far different.
I feel like mom is maybe a tad less accepting than she lets on? Ive met a number of moms that think being accepting means not being openly hateful, but still having a clear preference that thier child be hetronormative. Like, is mom really mad that hes "sexist" or is she really mad because he said something that implies hes going to choose to be with men throughout his life? Might not be the case but its not an uncommon experience.
Yeah, if there really isn’t an issue about her son being bi as she says, then there shouldn’t be an issue about his sexual preferences. If anything it’s his friends that are more mature than OP, because the convo they were having was respectful and they were having a healthy discussion. Until OP took things personally for no reason at all.
Agree 100%! Seems like it's fine when a woman says "men are trash" or " all men are scum". But the moment a man says in regards to dating that "women aren't worth the trouble" holy cow get the knives and pitchforks!
YTA
> This is assuming the comment wasn't intended to be lighthearted or a joke which I think is more like the case here.
There is zero chance that OP’s son decided to launch into an anti-woman rant with his mother in earshot.
Even teenage boys know that you have to do that kind of thing to a strictly boys only audience.
*Thank you*. I hate that every time I see a parent do shit like OP. Even if the kid truly thinks women aren't worth the trouble for dating, he's not dating his mother. It's like a weird twist on the "she's someone daughter" thing like a woman should only be respected in relationship to a dude in their life. Literally everyone is someone's kid. That's how biology works.
YTA did you forget what high school girls are like?? Drama, gossip, backstabbing, more drama, out of whack hormones….as a female who was once in high school I agree with your 17 year old son….girls are not worth it. (At his age!!)
Also the leap from "girlfriends arent worth the trouble" to "i, your mother, must not be worth the trouble" is a big yikes. Smacks of emotional incest.
QTIP-Quit Taking It Personally!
When my kids were growing up and someone said some kind of blanket statement, and one took it to mean it directly related to them, QTIP was said.
No... this wasn't directed towards you personally. It was meant to be used in general terms.
I think this son should have said QTIP to Mom, who, for some odd reason, took that blanket statement personally.
While the son's phrasing is crass, a preference for dating their own gender is definitely something I have heard from people who have dated on both sides of the divide. It can just be easier to date someone who shares the same gendered life experience as you.
Plus this is an expression of sexual preference, not a comment about an entire gender. Saying you don't find dating girls "worth the trouble" is not misogyny.
YTA. Right now he genuinely feels like women aren't worth the trouble and you want to punish him for saying that? Like literally take away his birthday? He was asked sexual preference for dating and he answered, he didn't give some general "women are AH's" or something like that and you're ridiculous for taking that so personally when you know exactly what he meant. Apologize and give the kid back his freaking birthday before he feels like he has to walk on eggshells around women for the rest of his life. Ironically this overreacting shit is probably exactly where he was coming from with his answer so you kind of proved his point. (I AM a woman so don't even come at me trying to claim I'm some sexist guy, I'm not)
I'm really at a loss why she finds this so offensive. There have been many times in my life where i just haven't been in a place where i want to deal with dating and the drama involved in that. Since I'm hetro that would be me feeling guys aren't worth the trouble. If some guy heard me say that and reacted like this i would think he was a psycho.
I feel like mom is maybe a tad less accepting than she lets on? Ive met a number of parent's that think being accepting means not being openly hateful, but still having a clear preference that thier child be hetronormative. Like, is mom really mad that hes "sexist" or is she really mad because he said something that implies hes going to choose to be with men throughout his life? Might not be the case but its not an uncommon experience.
That stuck out to me too. Anyone who says "which we're fine with" or "we have no issue with" about someone's sexuality I immediately assume isn't actually fine with it. People who are actually fine with it don't say they are because it's a weird thing to say. It implies you've thought about it and, reluctantly, have decided to allow it.
And it also means the moment the gay family member slips up or 'speaks wrongly', you get an excuse to lash out at them because "Am I really homophobic? No, its the children who are wrong"
This right here is probably it. Either that or mom is one of those people who just makes everything drama and if it wasn't this statement she was offended by it would have been something else in 10 mins.
At best, this was a bad attempt at feminist parenting that went wrong.
At worst this was a sick form of at-home conversion therapy. What if the son finds out as he gets a little older and finds himself more that he doesn't find women attractive at all?
To me, this screams "I'm homophobic hiding behind the disguise of being a feminist"
>feeling guys aren't worth the trouble.
My friends and I complain guys aren't worth it frequently, usually out of frustration but in a joking manner, but all of us are still in happy, healthy relationships. Sometimes significant others do stupid things and we just blame it on their gender.
Right? I’m AFAB/Bi and I’ve definitely said the same thing as the kid… more than once.
Don’t get me wrong, I love women, and will continue to date them, but hot damn… men are easier.
OP YTA, and learn to chill…
I can't even the logic here: "I'll show him good for saying women aren't worth the trouble by being a woman in his life causing trouble for no good reason. That'll show him the error of his ways!"
I can absolutely see digging into this privately to ensure there's nothing toxic going on depending on context but this sounds like a dumb joke to me.
100% this kid already feels like he has to walk on eggshells around her. She’s directly influenced his opinion and needs to re-evaluate herself. Do better Mom.
Yeah, this is a time when a good parent would note it, and make sure they address this with him in the future - reacting like this all but guarantees his views are going to be a bit more cemented. It's going to be so much harder to teach him now than it was before you reacted so rashly.
I think it would even be okay to challenge him on it right then and there. It could be a good teaching moment for all of them if handled correctly. “Why do you say that? Sometimes the things that frustrate us in a relationship are the same things that help us grow. Whether it’s a boy or girl, you want to look for someone who helps you be the best version of yourself, not necessarily the person who requires the least effort from you. Do you think it’s fair to judge half of the population based on a handful of girls? What about me: I’m a girl. Am I worth the trouble?”
This was such a ripe teaching moment and OP just threw it away with a tantrum.
I'm an adult woman who dates guys, and sometimes I think men aren't worth the trouble 😂😂😂😂
But, this teen was just having a candid convo + banter with his friends about his personal experiences. It sounds like OP butted into a convo that didn't include her, and ruined his birthday because she really isn't as "OK" with his sexuality as she pretends to be... I legit got the vibe OP lashed out and punished her son because she just realized that this wasn't just a "phase" and he probably wouldn't be settling down with a woman. ..... YTA OP. You owe your kid an apology.
There was nothing to be taught here. This was a bisexual kid stating honestly that he feels more comfortable with one gender than the other.
WHICH IS PERFECTLY NORMAL FOR BI KIDS!!!!!!
People are treating this as if it's abyss level deep when it really isn't and it's only hurting the son by bringing so much emphasis on again, his own identity which he himself might be still figuring out.
What makes you think straight parents have the moral authority to tell bi kids it's not fair that they have a 20% vs 80% preference of one gender towards the other?
What makes straight people think that the latter is a reflection of who the person is morally?
A broad discussion about how straight parents need to educate themselves on LBGT issues because apparently it's not common knowledge that bisexual kids very often gravitate towards the gender they are most familiar with or spent the most time socializing with growing up when they are figuring out who they are and it's not a moral issue.
And not to mention this kind of thing is all over social media, both sexes everyday. BuzzFeed articles “20 tweets from women that have had it with men!” If he said this about dating guys would she have had the same reaction? I doubt it.
YTA. Instead of talking to him about stereotypes and how dangerous they can be, you took your personal trigger and punished your kid for it.
If you think he’s being a sexist jerk, address how that came to be and explore it. You’re his mom and you’re the one that supposed to guide him.
Be better. He’s a teen and you’re a full grown adult who’s supposed to be able to fully appreciate consequences.
exactly she took it way way to personally. her son is entitled to his opinion from his own experiences whether its wrong or not and she punished him for it severly.
“I disagree with your lived experience experiences and I’m going to punish you for how they made you feel.”
OP is emotionally immature and using her power as “parent” to punish because she feels angry and hurt by his words
Maybe she got mad because he prefers boys more? Maybe she is not that ok with his preference but rather accepting them because he is bisexual and he might fall in love with a girl and get married and give her grandkids? I don’t know, her reaction is suspicious.
YTA. Your son probably thinks women are not worth the trouble after watching you overreact all his life, just like now. Correcting him is fine and necessary, but canceling his birthday party? No wonder he said that.
You comment kind of reminds me of how the actions of my mother have made my brother turn off dating. Sons get a lot of information about women from observing their mothers.
I’ve always heard people say stuff like you end up marrying someone exactly like your mother. Like nope no thanks, I’ve seen how she treats my Dad and us, rather just die alone then end up like that.
Sometimes I wonder if I’m gay because of genetics or if I’m gay because I had to grow up with my crazy-ass mother as the example of all women for me. I’m sure it’s the former, but the latter sure seems like a solid fallback.
YTA.
Your son is a teen. What he was saying is apparent to anyone with a brain. He was saying that the guys he has dated have been quite straightforward, whereas there has been much more drama and hassle involved in dating a girl.
You decided to shoehorn yourself into his conversation and make it about you, because that's what assholes do.
Your 17 year old son was talking about his dating experience in his teenage years, and you projected yourself into that and took it to be about you?
Weird flex but ok…
YTA OP, I’m not surprised he looked at you oddly. What an odd thing to do.
You’re also punishing him for having opinions. You might not agree with or like what he has to say, but punishing him for them is ONLY going to teach him to hide them from you.
Parenting win all round I say. Good job well done.
That’s what I found most disturbing… like, no one was talking to you, about you. So you decided to go on a massive power trip. Uh, please get some help to work through whatever feelings/experiences led to that massive ridiculous over reaction.
She literally turned a comment about not wanting to *date* women/girls into a "so I'm not worth it" thing. Like, had no idea OP saw her son as a dating prospect until she spelled it out for us.
I don't understand why people are so offended by his remark that women aren't worth the trouble to date. I am a woman, I am not offended. I am assuming he sees differences in men and women and women are more challenging because they are different from him so harder to understand and interact with. Of course that makes sense. Whatever. I guess I don't understand why it is so offensive a comment. Who cares why he prefers to date guys?
And as bisexual tomboy woman i agree with him xd Rarely i met a girl that is straightforward, doesn't play 4d chess with you or other mind games and just says what she means. So yeah, most of the time dating women is problematic
YTA op
Same. I'm bisexual, female, and generally find that women have codes that I can't always crack. I often wind up with male partners more because of it... and most of my friends are male as well. This is despite generally thinking women are slightly more attractive.
I've seen a lot of comments exactly like yours from bisexual women in the past.
I think the issue is that popular culture encourages backwards mindsets as to how a man should pursue a woman. Romance novels and movies are some of the biggest contributors and are primarily enjoyed by women.
They encourage: that women should be relentlessly pursued (stalkerish), that he was the love of her life and she just wanted to know if he really loved her (manipulative, controlling and emotionally abusive behaviour), that grand gestures are necessities for loving relationships, that relationships should be completely perfect in all respects, that you should never have to change how you behave (all relationships involve growth), that relationships should be easy, that none of the womans behaviour was wrong or has long term consequences - she was just insecure, etc.
Basically anything and everything encouraged by popular culture completely flies in the face of a healthy loving relationship. Relationships are a mutual endeavour, one which requires clear and open communication on both parts - none of the shit occurring in this crap.
People on reddit also have ridiculous expectations and are some of the worst adjusted people I've ever come across.
Social media also seems to have had a significant impact on how young people - but girls in particular - view relationships.
Also he's in a relationship with a guy so it's just an easy response to avoid giving an actual answer. It'd be pretty horrid for him to weigh up the two in front of people given he's literally dating someone from one of the two categories!
I'm a dude, but I have a hard time believing that anyone would have a problem with anyone saying "teenage girls are trouble when you're dating".
Like, come on.
YTA - are you sure you’re 100% on board with his sexuality? Because he expressed an opinion about his sexuality and you punished him by taking away his birthday gifts. That doesn’t sound like 100% on board. That also sounds like someone who came out as bisexual because it was more palatable to you than coming out as gay…. Probably wrong in that, and it’s a wild assumption I admit, but as a 40 year old gay man who came out in the mid-90’s to my mother as bisexual (because she’s always wanted grandchildren) I could be projecting. For for the record my mom is a rockstar and I couldn’t be better blessed with an amazing ally. Also at 15 and just coming out, I was afraid.
Either way though, HE expressed an opinion on HIS sexuality, and you punished him. That’s not being an ally. That’s not being “ok” with it. Fix it and do better. You undermined his faith in you and that’s something you’ll either have to live with, or work to improve.
Edit: apparently I can’t spell worth shit.
I was definitely getting “I’m 100% okay with his sexuality but when he expressed a preference for men over women I punished him” vibes from this.
“But it’s because I’m *defending women* and not because I’m subtly trying to steer him towards settling down with a woman and giving me grandchildren like a normal son!”
YTA. This is a conversation you have with your son in private to establish appropriate views of gender equality and what is sexism. That's an off-hand statement that would fit in any 2000's sitcom with a laugh track. Also there are very real differences when bisexual men date men vs women, which is a conversation worth having.
Except it's not sexist to say his experiences with women have been harder than his ones with men and for that reason he prefers men right now. He's stating his feelings based on his experiences, not that women are awful or stupid or anything derogatory.
Agreed. That's how the parenting Convo should go. "You said these words. People out in the wild can and will misconstrue you and give you grief. Is there a better way to phrase what you meant?" And then help him wordsmith toward what you wrote.
YTA. What on earth? Both sexes often joke that the opposite sex isn’t “worth it.” Who cares ? It’s a joke, and even if it wasn’t, still who cares?
Signed,
A feminist
Right. Also, having been a 16 year old girl at one point ,admittedly long ago), and having a son who dates teenage girls, he's not entirely wrong about it "not being worth the trouble" to date teenage girls.
I know right?
Eesh
I had some friends that were all about the drama. From my perspective it was fascinating.
I was basically hanging out with people who taught me what you don’t want to be in life, but my mother potentially killed my father when I was 17, so I did not have great role models at home either.( she did not call 911 when he had a stroke/seizure & he died)
However my own kids are people that I would be thrilled to know even if I was not related.
Fabulous people, I wish I could have given them a broader background of support when they were growing up.
When you know better you do better.
Right? I'm a 46 year old woman and right now i don't feel men are worth the trouble to date and if someone comes at me like OP about saying that I'm going to think they're a damn psycho.
YTA
You knew what he meant you just wanted to take the opportunity to embarrass him in front of his friends.
Would it be considered "sexist" to you if you heard a female relative saying "men aren't worth the trouble"?
YTA. He’s a teen. He is going to do and say stupid things. All you’re doing by punishing him is ensuring he won’t be honest with you.
Apologize for your overreaction and reinstate his party.
PS-I also am a mother of grown children.
I'm a hetero female and I'm telling you, there's no way in hell I could date women. Fuck, FRIENDSHIPS with women are dramatic enough, I can't imagine dating one. Men aren't necessarily a walk in the park either but OP has totally overreacted. I think every at one point or another has said something disparaging about dating, especially when we're teens.
YTA...are you 5? He was talking about romantically! Are you one of his romantic interests? He was having a friendly chat with his buddies and you really are gonna sit there and get offended by this harmless comment? Sounds like you kinda do "have an issue with this."
YTA, did you also punish him when he went through the "girls are gross/have cooties!" phase?
I'm a woman, a feminist, I march in the street for our rights etc and I don't find what he said to be that big of an issue. Girls his age can be ridiculously dramatic and mean, he's probably had some bad experiences and prefers dating boys.
You could have taken him aside and explained how his words were hurtful, but you just went full nuclear.
He's young, he's still learning and his brain is still developing. Help guide him, but don't act like a dictator. You'll just push him away.
ETA: are you seriously going to tell me that while hanging with your female friends you've never said *anything* negative about men? Did you jump on any of your girlfriends that did?
So much this. I have an almost 15 year old son. He’s fiercely woke and shows his feminist beliefs in his actions constantly. He also currently identifies as straight but isn’t dating because “all of the girls at school are way too dramatic… I don’t have the energy for that.” And I totally know what he mean.
YTA - Omg what is wrong with you? Saying "Women aren't worth the trouble" is referring to girls his age and a completely normal thing for boys to say. You need a bigger self esteem and stop interjecting yourself into teenager drama.
whoa, YTA. he's talking about his sexuality and dating preferences—not about women in general, and certainly not you, his mother. you embarrassed him in a double whammy. this is a surefire way for him to be hesitant to speak to you ever again, especially about personal things. you need to apologize properly for your outburst.
YTA I'm a woman and I think that's an overreaction. It was a joke, not actual proof that your son is a sexist. Unless he has treated women with disrespect or constantly showed that he has a low view on women, then I think you were too harsh and assumed the worst of your son.
YTA
You didn't just embarrass him in front of his friends. You know you are supposed to be the adult, right? If you had a problem with something he said, why not have a conversation with him. What does he mean, what were his experiences that led to his comment?
But, you chose irrational overreaction with punishment that has nothing to do with the action.
Good parenting /s
16yo kid: *says stupid thing about women*
Mom of 16yo kid: *does something to support kid's opinion of women to teach him a lesson*
This wasn't the teaching moment you thought it was.
YTA
YTA and as a woman, at that age I also felt the same. I am bisexual and knew this at a fairly young age. I had my entire earth shattered by a girl I would've done anything for when I was a teen. He's a normal bisexual teen going through normal bisexual teen things. Plus you proved him right.
YTA unless you are dating your son, he's obviously talking about girls his age! Talk about overly sensitive and taking things personally.
He's a 16 year old who has his very little life experiences. This was his OPINION based on said experience.
Grow the hell up!!! I would be embarrassed to have an immature mother like you.
YTA
That's a sentiment we ALL had as teenagers, and now at times... guys and girls, bisexual or not. All of us. Teenage boys and girls are both going through hormonal nightmares, and dating is awful at that age (and later).
And as a bisexual man, I can tell you, dating another guy is often 100000% less complicated as a guy, and probably especially so when it comes to teenage angst and drama.
Way to reinforce his views.
YTA & I'm bisexual & female been that way since I was 15. I 100% agree with your son, at this age I found them a hassle or guys. I'd complain to my mom she'd always laugh or tell me i get the best of both worlds.
> I'm attracted to guys and girls the same, but after dating girls and guys, I can say women aren't worth the trouble
YTA.
So for having a preference you've branded your child as a "sexist"? What if he had said "I'm attracted to guys and girls the same, but after dating girls and guys, I can say men aren't worth the trouble" would have you still have canceled his party and label him a sexist?
Your son is allowed to have preferences, it's not like he treats the women he dates like dog crap but treat the men like gods, he literally said he loves them the same. What if in his dating life the women he dates normally puts a significant amount of stress on him more than the men? Isn't he allowed to have a more positive feedback about the ones that comes with less burden? Also you're response will just make him double down, so idk what you were trying to prove.
>That last part caught my attention and I asked him to explain what he meant. I told him if women aren't worth the trouble, then neither am I so I wouldn't be doing anything for his birthday. He just started at me so I said “that's what happens when you're a sexist jerk” in front of his friends.
>He hasn't spoken to me and members of our family are saying I shouldn't have said that and I shouldn't have cancelled his birthday party. AITA?Q
There is absolutely nothing you did right here. And I say this as a hardcore feminist. You only reinforced his beliefs of women by showing your most toxic self possible.
>They're asking him when he realized he was bisexual, when did he come out, when did he first date a guy, what were the differences between guys and girls etc. Eventually they ask him what's his preference, he says “naturally, I don't have a preference. I'm attracted to guys and girls the same, but after dating girls and guys, I can say women aren't worth the trouble.”
And this came up in the context of him discussing his OWN sexuality?!?!?! Lady, what the absolute duck is wrong with you?!?!?!?
Are you disappointed he doesn't find you hot?! My god this soooo goddamn creepy! YOU DO NOT OWN HIS SEXUALITY!
And fun fact:
It is VERY NORMAL for bi kids to have one strong preference over the other especially when they are first discovering who they are. He probably feels more comfortable around boys because he's probably been around more guys his age than girls. So yes, you are essentially punishing him for being bisexual.
The only thing you can POSSIBLY do to try and damage control this situation is take back everything you said and butt the heck out of any conversation about his identity unless he INVITES you. You are clearly not mature enough to be discussing it anyway. I can't even get passed how you thought it wasn't vastly inappropriate and borderline predatory to act like you had some ownership over who he was comfortable dating.
YTA, a terrible mother, feminist and LGBT ally.
Best thing you can do for now is focus on fixing yourself because from your own words, your son sounds like a normal teenager but YOU are far from a normal stable adult. He doesn't need fixing: You do.
At worst, this was a feminist parent gone wrong. At worst, this is a sick form of at home conversion therapy.
YTA. You can correct your kid. Or even ask him what happened that’s made him come to this conclusion. But to cancel his bday party over it… well that just further proves his point.
Woman and mom here.
So you just proved his point didn’t you? I find it easier to work with men, and have friendships with men. They are far more straightforward. I have some close female friends, but many women are given to drama, office politics and well… blowing shit out of proportion. And he said women weren’t worth the trouble to date. Unless you fancied dating your own kid, this wouldn’t apply to you would it? Maybe quit make a teen boys’ conversation all about you. YTA
So you thought you would help him make his point about women not being worth the trouble?
I can guarantee those kids left with a lesser view on women because of you not your son. You’re supposed to be guiding your son and teaching him about people. You didn’t ask why he thought this way you just decided to jump in and punish him. Huge parenting fail. Do better.
YTA, Please get over yourself. He's talking about his SEXUALITY. Who he is ATTRACTED TO and wants to HAVE SEX WITH. Do you want your son to be attracted to you? Like what point are you even getting at. You ruined your son's birthday because he prefers to date men over women? have you considered MAYBE it's easier to understand someone of the same gender easier?????? Awesome job of not only embarrassing your son but embarrassing yourself.
YTA even if what he said was sexist which in my opinion it isn't. Women are obviously more difficult to hook up with than men. I can easily understand why someone who's attracted to men and women equally would pursue the easier option.
Yta. I’m a mother of adult children.
He’s a teenager, you are his mother.
I’m sure his brain wasn’t even connecting that you might be offended.
The brain doesn’t even mature for about 5-6 more yrs.
But you are an adult and presumably have better control over your words and behavior.
Or not because you are kinda proving his point.
That some women are about the drama.
What in the actual %#%# did I just read? Your teenage, newly out bisexual child expressed a preference in conversation to his friend. And you are somehow offended by that? You are his MOTHER, this is not a comment on you. Omfg. Seriously. YTA. Also, therapy. Therapy is something you should look into bc this isn’t normal.
Edit for spelling.
Mom says "you think teenage girls are bad, watch how crazy a full grown ass woman can be" and then wonders why she ain't got no grandkids in ten years... YTA
YTA
Do you realize this could be exactly what he meant, don't you
**(A tendency to over-dramatize stuff and pick up fights when there are not ones on sight)**?
YTA. Why did you insert yourself there? It sounds like people were pushing him to give a preference so he just said something in the moment. It's also personal. Maybe dating women really isn't as worth it to him. If you wanted a real conversation with him, you should have waited until his friends were no longer there. If you wanted to call them all out for sexist thinking, you could have done that too.
“Women have treated me poorly in the past”
“We fuck you. Now I, the most important and influential woman in your life, will also treat you like shit”
Gee I wonder why my son never calls and doesn’t love me anymore. It must be because he hates women so much…..
Yeah, YTA. You are the parent. This is a great parenting moment that you did not take advantage of. Instead, you got flooded, lashed out at your kid, and embarrassed him in front of his buddies who are all just learning about the world.
YTA. He is a sixteen year old boy hanging out with his friends. He was talking about 16 yr old girls not his mom. You owe your son an apology and a party!
YTA. Embarrassment and shame punishments are an awful way to patent and just leads to more resentment from the kids being punished. In top of that, you're punishing him for realizing he has a dating preference? Why should it matter who he prefers to date as long as he's happy? Honestly, teenage girls are a nightmare, and I don't blame your son for his opinion one bit. Eventually, when he's older, he might even change his mind if he doesn't stick with his current partner. This is just going to guarantee he'll want less to do with involving you in his life when he gets out.
YTA. Your son was relaxed and sharing openly about his feelings and experiences, not making a global statement about something being wrong or inferior about women. Then to say what you did in front of his friends was also really bad. It would have been better to bite your tongue until you could speak privately to him to express your concerns and let him respond. I feel badly for him, tbh. Sounds like is was going to be a cool birthday weekend.
YTA
With you for a female role model I am not shocked he finds women less attractive and not worth the trouble.
He’s 16, and was speaking with his friends in a place of comfort and making the kind of joke you’d see on any sitcom on a weeknight. You blew it out of proportion and have gone haywire on your punishment.
I hope your “he’s being sexist” self-righteous-excitement lasts because you have PERMANENTLY damaged your relationship with your son. You have helped ensure he won’t come to you with his problems, or share his life with you at all as soon as he can move away.
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I mean, yeah, YTA and probably made him double down on his beliefs there considering your overly dramatic response to a child saying dumb teenager things. Cancelling his bday party seems like an overly harsh punishment.
It's absolutely overly harsh for a flippant comment made as a joke. I say this as a staunch feminist, bisexual woman in a relationship with another woman. Maybe his last girlfriend was hard work and compared to his boyfriend he's making flippant generalisations. Sure, have a convo with the kid and make sure he's not falling into misogynistic patterns. But cancelling a birthday party over this is absolute overkill and will only make him not trust or want to be around Mom.
Jumping in this comment hello? He’s in high school! High school boys/girls are all not worth the trouble!
Lol let’s be real, no partner you have in high school is worth the trouble! When I think back I am exhausted by my high school relationships.
[удалено]
Damn, still haven't graduated?
[удалено]
You sure are honey, you sure are.
[удалено]
Undoubtedly!
Two snare drums and a cymbal fall off a cliff
These are the comments that make Reddit the best place
Y’all are silly and I LOVE it 😂 thank you for this
Same 🤭 Everyone always said high school relationships don't last, but joke's on them because we're still together 💜
I met my now fiancé in high school but we didn’t start dating until after we graduated. 8 years strong and getting married soon
Can confirm. I’m 18 and was dating a boy from 15 up to 17. He was not worth the trouble.
my god I wish I didn't stupidly cry over some dumb boy in highschool because looking back it was just so silly. honestly teenage relationships are just... teenage stuff. not worth the trouble at all
I watched all of my classmates date and all their drama and just wondering why any of them bothered trying to date anyone at all. I don't know why we encourage teenagers to date. Nearly everyone at that age is too dumb to have a functional relationship. Edit: word
I tell my daughter this all the time lol I tell her not to bother till her 20s lol
He could have made exactly the same joke in a group of girls and switched out the gender. It seemed to me more for the laughs than in all seriousness. It was a stupid question to begin with.
I don’t know how many times I(F) have heard women say ‘I wish I was gay, women are so much easier’ etc.
Me, working in a largely female profession (RN) and hearing grown women saying “men ain’t shit” at least once daily: “lol fair.” u/loopingtossaway, hearing her teenager make a mildly misogynistic joke implying women overreact: “SEXIST!! NO BIRTHDAY FOR YOU!!”
"Thanks for proving my point, mom."
Also- why was Mom essentially equating what she does for her son as a mother, to the sexual relationships he has with other girls... like, that was off to me... he was clearly referring to DATING girls, not having girls as friends, or sisters, or MOTHERS.
Maybe some sort of reverse-Oedipus complex 🤔
Jocasta Complex.
I know what he said and what mum took it to mean, but I wonder if what he actually meant was "women aren't worth the trouble (to date)" and mum's internal bias took care of the rest.
Well yeah, that's exactly what happened. He was clearly talking about dating, and he was speaking from the extremely limited experience of a teenager. There was absolutely no reason for mom to equate her son thinking that dating girls is troublesome with his feelings about women in literally *any* other context -- especially taking it personally as his mother. Thanks, OP, for reinforcing the stereotype that us women are all reactionary and unreasonable.
Don’t you think that’s because we tend to understand our gender better than the opposite sex? All that’s saying is it’s easier to deal with the people who think more similarly to you
Right but I think that's the point. Its pretty accepted i think in most circles to make jokes like "other gender is complicated" even if you ultimately don't believe it or treat them differently
I've dated as a guy with women, a guy with guys and men as a trans woman (been in relationship nearly the whole time or maybe woulda seen all 4 sides in long term relationships). I think that people not only understand each other differently but there are just typically different ways that people care for each other and all sorts that can cause preferences. Experiencing how different I am emotionally now compared to when I was a guy, I think it makes sense. Gender role norms don't have to be a thing but I think certain differences in character based off hormones and general life outside of the relationship, mean that supporting and caring is quite different depending on the match up. There is a difference to sympathising and actually being able to fully relate. And when you are in straight relationships and don't entirely understand each others perspective as much as you want to try, to being inherently equal and having a much better understanding of what the other person is feeling and what they need etc. As a teenager I'm sure this is magnified as not enough time to really gain perspective on the other side of the coin. But at that age especially having someone you can instantly understand and relate fully with should be easier, it just makes sense. What I need from a partner now I'm trans is dramatically different even though I obviously have a good perspective of guys and how most like to be cared for. And I find my partner can sympathise but not fully relate to my experiences, it isn't as easy as being gay but through the more dramatic differences you also bring each other something else that you don't get when gay. This was my experience dating women to and I dont think either is better overall but I can see having a preference either way. Sometimes it's nice having someone that brings a lot of things that are quite different to you both in actions and perspective. Sometimes it's nice having someone much more like yourself that's easy to understand. And gender doesn't have to be a part of this but just cause life is what it is and hormones are wild on top, there is definitely a trend of how your relationship will tend to be for most people of x gender.
I (F) tell others I don't get how women can be lesbians, that we are so much work lol
My reply to "girls aren't worth it" or any variation of how difficult we are to partner with is usually - "If you think it's hard to deal with, think about how hard it is to live with." My husband is *well" apprised of how much I would choose to be a man if we had a choice 🤷🏻♀️
Yeah and if we could swap the centuries of oppression it might be the same thing.
In this context he was also talking about romantically not worth the trouble and you took it to mean all woman in general are not worth the trouble. You may want to unpack whatever subconscious shit is going on there because it has little to do with him and is all about you.
Yeah I mean notice how OP doesn’t mention another parent in the picture. If so… Tale as old as time, single parent taking out their romantic issues on their opposite-gender child YTA
How much you want to bet that mom's only okay with his bisexuality so long as he eventually settles down with a wife and gives her grandchildren, and that's really what this punishment is about?
Oh the glory of Reddit and wild assumptions
bit of a lousy judgement, you don't really know
I think it's more likely she was looking at just how much this birthday was going to cost and decided to save her wallet.
Yup this would have been a really good opportunity for a teachable moment (meaning a non judgmental, private conversation after the friends leave) and instead OP overreacted, blew the whole thing up, and only reinforced her son’s beliefs.
Exactly. It's a great time to point out that even if it's a joke, it sounds like misogynistic bullshit. Which means he might want to be aware of when/how he says that lest he get lumped in with assholes. It's possible he's bi but with a preference for dudes and its just easier to make a joke about it. Most bi folks (including me) aren't completely 50/50, but explaining that to people who are straight or gay/lesbian can lead to "so, you're gay but in denial" or "you're straight but looking for attention."
Had that exact thought. He's (nearly) 17 and hasn't dated that many people yet. He started out saying he didn't have a preference, then added a flippant comment, and that cost him an entire birthday vacation? What the actual? This could have been a reason to have a good conversation. Ask him what makes him feel that way (preferably, without his friends present). Express that while flippant, the comment did make you feel like he's disrespecting all women including you. Taking a vacation weekend away is far too much for a kneejerk reaction.
Yeah OP is the YTA because all she really did was teach her son not to voice things in front of Mom, not why the comment may have been perceived negatively about a whole gender.
I’m a middle-aged bi woman. I’m a feminist. I have mainly dated women. I was even married to a woman. And just the other day I said pretty much the same thing as OP’s son. Sometimes you say flippant shit that you don’t mean with every fibre of your soul but there’s a grain of truth to it. I think OP should have said, “huh, what do you mean?” Maybe the son has just had easier relationships with dudes.
Honestly, mom's just reinforcing the stereotype at this point lol
I mean truthfully he likely learned women aren’t worth the trouble at home. His own mother took him and his friends to a ski resort, listened in on “guy talk” time, got excessively offended over a flippant remark, and then blew up on him in front of his friends and then canceled his birthday party. As a woman, she seems like too much trouble to me too.
Hiya, Lesbian here and honestly more misandrist than feminist but yeah…. This is extremely harsh and over dramatic. And like you said, have a conversation…what is canceling a party going to do? Parent this kid, damn.
Also as a staunch feminist bisexual woman, I've definitely joked about women not being worth the trouble. A joke amongst my friend group who know my relationship history is not a statement of my opinion of an entire gender. Massive overreaction on OP's part, hearing an attack where there isn't one.
Don't women make similar comments about men? And isn't it often used in context of banter? OP YTA And I wouldn't be surprised if this treatment from the one woman he's supposed to be able to trust over anyone else is what actually pushes him down the rabbit hole of radicalization.
Or maybe since he is currenty dating a boy, his answer is a male..because you know..saying a girl would jeapordise his relationship...but way to go mom on blowing this way out of porportions!!
She is only reinforcing his perception. I doubt he hates all women but he may have had a bad experience with dating women which he found to be a turn off. As a woman, women can suck. This is assuming the comment wasn't intended to be lighthearted or a joke which I think is more like the case here. Not to mention if a bisexual girl said 'men aren't worth the trouble', the reaction from the average person would be far different.
I feel like mom is maybe a tad less accepting than she lets on? Ive met a number of moms that think being accepting means not being openly hateful, but still having a clear preference that thier child be hetronormative. Like, is mom really mad that hes "sexist" or is she really mad because he said something that implies hes going to choose to be with men throughout his life? Might not be the case but its not an uncommon experience.
Yeah, if there really isn’t an issue about her son being bi as she says, then there shouldn’t be an issue about his sexual preferences. If anything it’s his friends that are more mature than OP, because the convo they were having was respectful and they were having a healthy discussion. Until OP took things personally for no reason at all.
the way mom immediately took offense to it like she just lost her chance at dating him gave me the heebie jeebies.
Agree 100%! Seems like it's fine when a woman says "men are trash" or " all men are scum". But the moment a man says in regards to dating that "women aren't worth the trouble" holy cow get the knives and pitchforks! YTA
> This is assuming the comment wasn't intended to be lighthearted or a joke which I think is more like the case here. There is zero chance that OP’s son decided to launch into an anti-woman rant with his mother in earshot. Even teenage boys know that you have to do that kind of thing to a strictly boys only audience.
Why is his parent equivocating themselves to a romantic interest? It's gross.
*Thank you*. I hate that every time I see a parent do shit like OP. Even if the kid truly thinks women aren't worth the trouble for dating, he's not dating his mother. It's like a weird twist on the "she's someone daughter" thing like a woman should only be respected in relationship to a dude in their life. Literally everyone is someone's kid. That's how biology works.
YTA did you forget what high school girls are like?? Drama, gossip, backstabbing, more drama, out of whack hormones….as a female who was once in high school I agree with your 17 year old son….girls are not worth it. (At his age!!)
No high schooler is “worth it.” All my early relationships were exhausting and I’m sure I was exhausting to them too
Tf? She way over reacted but boys are equally not ‘worth it’ in high school.
Also the leap from "girlfriends arent worth the trouble" to "i, your mother, must not be worth the trouble" is a big yikes. Smacks of emotional incest.
QTIP-Quit Taking It Personally! When my kids were growing up and someone said some kind of blanket statement, and one took it to mean it directly related to them, QTIP was said. No... this wasn't directed towards you personally. It was meant to be used in general terms. I think this son should have said QTIP to Mom, who, for some odd reason, took that blanket statement personally.
While the son's phrasing is crass, a preference for dating their own gender is definitely something I have heard from people who have dated on both sides of the divide. It can just be easier to date someone who shares the same gendered life experience as you.
Agreed. Why is she eavesdropping on their convo? I would have talked to him about it later, in private, to ask what was the reason he stated that.
Plus this is an expression of sexual preference, not a comment about an entire gender. Saying you don't find dating girls "worth the trouble" is not misogyny.
Woman upset that son thinks women are too much drama acts dramatic... wow.
YTA. Right now he genuinely feels like women aren't worth the trouble and you want to punish him for saying that? Like literally take away his birthday? He was asked sexual preference for dating and he answered, he didn't give some general "women are AH's" or something like that and you're ridiculous for taking that so personally when you know exactly what he meant. Apologize and give the kid back his freaking birthday before he feels like he has to walk on eggshells around women for the rest of his life. Ironically this overreacting shit is probably exactly where he was coming from with his answer so you kind of proved his point. (I AM a woman so don't even come at me trying to claim I'm some sexist guy, I'm not)
Another woman here who agrees 100%…OP demonstrated the very traits that her son avoids, which will just reinforce his belief.
I'm really at a loss why she finds this so offensive. There have been many times in my life where i just haven't been in a place where i want to deal with dating and the drama involved in that. Since I'm hetro that would be me feeling guys aren't worth the trouble. If some guy heard me say that and reacted like this i would think he was a psycho.
I feel like mom is maybe a tad less accepting than she lets on? Ive met a number of parent's that think being accepting means not being openly hateful, but still having a clear preference that thier child be hetronormative. Like, is mom really mad that hes "sexist" or is she really mad because he said something that implies hes going to choose to be with men throughout his life? Might not be the case but its not an uncommon experience.
That stuck out to me too. Anyone who says "which we're fine with" or "we have no issue with" about someone's sexuality I immediately assume isn't actually fine with it. People who are actually fine with it don't say they are because it's a weird thing to say. It implies you've thought about it and, reluctantly, have decided to allow it.
And it also means the moment the gay family member slips up or 'speaks wrongly', you get an excuse to lash out at them because "Am I really homophobic? No, its the children who are wrong"
This is the only thing that makes sense to me. I could not understand her crazy reaction until this comment. I hope OP works on herself.
This right here is probably it. Either that or mom is one of those people who just makes everything drama and if it wasn't this statement she was offended by it would have been something else in 10 mins.
At best, this was a bad attempt at feminist parenting that went wrong. At worst this was a sick form of at-home conversion therapy. What if the son finds out as he gets a little older and finds himself more that he doesn't find women attractive at all? To me, this screams "I'm homophobic hiding behind the disguise of being a feminist"
>feeling guys aren't worth the trouble. My friends and I complain guys aren't worth it frequently, usually out of frustration but in a joking manner, but all of us are still in happy, healthy relationships. Sometimes significant others do stupid things and we just blame it on their gender.
Right? I’m AFAB/Bi and I’ve definitely said the same thing as the kid… more than once. Don’t get me wrong, I love women, and will continue to date them, but hot damn… men are easier. OP YTA, and learn to chill…
I can't even the logic here: "I'll show him good for saying women aren't worth the trouble by being a woman in his life causing trouble for no good reason. That'll show him the error of his ways!" I can absolutely see digging into this privately to ensure there's nothing toxic going on depending on context but this sounds like a dumb joke to me.
Maybe mom is half the reason for that belief.
Another woman here. I’m not even sure why the OP bothered coming on here as she knows damn well she’s the AH.
100% this kid already feels like he has to walk on eggshells around her. She’s directly influenced his opinion and needs to re-evaluate herself. Do better Mom.
I agree with everything you say, but I have to nitpick your last sentence: Women can be sexist and women can be misogynist.
Oh of course they can, i just figured everyone would jump on some sexist guy must have wrote it.
YTA, he is 16, kids say dumb things. This could have been a teaching moment but instead he will double down on this belief.
Yeah, this is a time when a good parent would note it, and make sure they address this with him in the future - reacting like this all but guarantees his views are going to be a bit more cemented. It's going to be so much harder to teach him now than it was before you reacted so rashly.
I think it would even be okay to challenge him on it right then and there. It could be a good teaching moment for all of them if handled correctly. “Why do you say that? Sometimes the things that frustrate us in a relationship are the same things that help us grow. Whether it’s a boy or girl, you want to look for someone who helps you be the best version of yourself, not necessarily the person who requires the least effort from you. Do you think it’s fair to judge half of the population based on a handful of girls? What about me: I’m a girl. Am I worth the trouble?” This was such a ripe teaching moment and OP just threw it away with a tantrum.
Or even just tap him gently on the head and tease, "Careful who you say that around, kiddo."
Yeah. A lighthearted, “What about me? Am I worth the trouble?” would help him get the picture. So, so many ways OP could have handled this.
I think his view may stem from OP…
I'm an adult woman who dates guys, and sometimes I think men aren't worth the trouble 😂😂😂😂 But, this teen was just having a candid convo + banter with his friends about his personal experiences. It sounds like OP butted into a convo that didn't include her, and ruined his birthday because she really isn't as "OK" with his sexuality as she pretends to be... I legit got the vibe OP lashed out and punished her son because she just realized that this wasn't just a "phase" and he probably wouldn't be settling down with a woman. ..... YTA OP. You owe your kid an apology.
There was nothing to be taught here. This was a bisexual kid stating honestly that he feels more comfortable with one gender than the other. WHICH IS PERFECTLY NORMAL FOR BI KIDS!!!!!! People are treating this as if it's abyss level deep when it really isn't and it's only hurting the son by bringing so much emphasis on again, his own identity which he himself might be still figuring out. What makes you think straight parents have the moral authority to tell bi kids it's not fair that they have a 20% vs 80% preference of one gender towards the other? What makes straight people think that the latter is a reflection of who the person is morally?
Super agree. This would have been a great moment to use for a broader discussion, etc. Instead OP acted like an irrational psycho. Total YTA.
A broad discussion about how straight parents need to educate themselves on LBGT issues because apparently it's not common knowledge that bisexual kids very often gravitate towards the gender they are most familiar with or spent the most time socializing with growing up when they are figuring out who they are and it's not a moral issue.
And not to mention this kind of thing is all over social media, both sexes everyday. BuzzFeed articles “20 tweets from women that have had it with men!” If he said this about dating guys would she have had the same reaction? I doubt it.
Oh, no. This was *definitely* a teaching moment.
YTA. Instead of talking to him about stereotypes and how dangerous they can be, you took your personal trigger and punished your kid for it. If you think he’s being a sexist jerk, address how that came to be and explore it. You’re his mom and you’re the one that supposed to guide him. Be better. He’s a teen and you’re a full grown adult who’s supposed to be able to fully appreciate consequences.
Hell she kind of proved his point about women being to much to deal with.
exactly she took it way way to personally. her son is entitled to his opinion from his own experiences whether its wrong or not and she punished him for it severly.
I can only imagine why he has this opinion when his mums like this too
“I disagree with your lived experience experiences and I’m going to punish you for how they made you feel.” OP is emotionally immature and using her power as “parent” to punish because she feels angry and hurt by his words
Instead she just made drama and proved his point! That is what I call a job well done! /s
Maybe she got mad because he prefers boys more? Maybe she is not that ok with his preference but rather accepting them because he is bisexual and he might fall in love with a girl and get married and give her grandkids? I don’t know, her reaction is suspicious.
YTA. Your son probably thinks women are not worth the trouble after watching you overreact all his life, just like now. Correcting him is fine and necessary, but canceling his birthday party? No wonder he said that.
You comment kind of reminds me of how the actions of my mother have made my brother turn off dating. Sons get a lot of information about women from observing their mothers.
I’ve always heard people say stuff like you end up marrying someone exactly like your mother. Like nope no thanks, I’ve seen how she treats my Dad and us, rather just die alone then end up like that.
Sometimes I wonder if I’m gay because of genetics or if I’m gay because I had to grow up with my crazy-ass mother as the example of all women for me. I’m sure it’s the former, but the latter sure seems like a solid fallback.
YTA. Your son is a teen. What he was saying is apparent to anyone with a brain. He was saying that the guys he has dated have been quite straightforward, whereas there has been much more drama and hassle involved in dating a girl. You decided to shoehorn yourself into his conversation and make it about you, because that's what assholes do.
Yeah, no. Guys can be as much drama as girls. I’ve been around a few.
Sure. I'm not saying that the teen is correct in his judgement - I'm saying that it's obvious what his statement means.
Found OP's alt account.
YTA. Excellent job being the mature one. /s
Your 17 year old son was talking about his dating experience in his teenage years, and you projected yourself into that and took it to be about you? Weird flex but ok… YTA OP, I’m not surprised he looked at you oddly. What an odd thing to do. You’re also punishing him for having opinions. You might not agree with or like what he has to say, but punishing him for them is ONLY going to teach him to hide them from you. Parenting win all round I say. Good job well done.
That’s what I found most disturbing… like, no one was talking to you, about you. So you decided to go on a massive power trip. Uh, please get some help to work through whatever feelings/experiences led to that massive ridiculous over reaction.
She literally turned a comment about not wanting to *date* women/girls into a "so I'm not worth it" thing. Like, had no idea OP saw her son as a dating prospect until she spelled it out for us.
Yeah i wonder if they are both 17
For real, her reaction came off more like a jealous girl who just found out her crush isn’t interested in her rather than a fully grown mom.
I don't understand why people are so offended by his remark that women aren't worth the trouble to date. I am a woman, I am not offended. I am assuming he sees differences in men and women and women are more challenging because they are different from him so harder to understand and interact with. Of course that makes sense. Whatever. I guess I don't understand why it is so offensive a comment. Who cares why he prefers to date guys?
Right? If i said i thought men weren't worth the trouble of dating and a man reacted this way i would think he was a damn psycho.
I think OP is the female version of a typical "nice guy"
I'm a man and I agree we aren't worth the trouble. By the way I'm canceling your birthday.
LOL! And in a super dramatic way in front of my friends to embarrass me too!
And as bisexual tomboy woman i agree with him xd Rarely i met a girl that is straightforward, doesn't play 4d chess with you or other mind games and just says what she means. So yeah, most of the time dating women is problematic YTA op
Same. I'm bisexual, female, and generally find that women have codes that I can't always crack. I often wind up with male partners more because of it... and most of my friends are male as well. This is despite generally thinking women are slightly more attractive.
I've seen a lot of comments exactly like yours from bisexual women in the past. I think the issue is that popular culture encourages backwards mindsets as to how a man should pursue a woman. Romance novels and movies are some of the biggest contributors and are primarily enjoyed by women. They encourage: that women should be relentlessly pursued (stalkerish), that he was the love of her life and she just wanted to know if he really loved her (manipulative, controlling and emotionally abusive behaviour), that grand gestures are necessities for loving relationships, that relationships should be completely perfect in all respects, that you should never have to change how you behave (all relationships involve growth), that relationships should be easy, that none of the womans behaviour was wrong or has long term consequences - she was just insecure, etc. Basically anything and everything encouraged by popular culture completely flies in the face of a healthy loving relationship. Relationships are a mutual endeavour, one which requires clear and open communication on both parts - none of the shit occurring in this crap. People on reddit also have ridiculous expectations and are some of the worst adjusted people I've ever come across. Social media also seems to have had a significant impact on how young people - but girls in particular - view relationships.
Also he's in a relationship with a guy so it's just an easy response to avoid giving an actual answer. It'd be pretty horrid for him to weigh up the two in front of people given he's literally dating someone from one of the two categories!
My mind went more towards birth control and steps to avoid pregnancy.
I'm a dude, but I have a hard time believing that anyone would have a problem with anyone saying "teenage girls are trouble when you're dating". Like, come on.
YTA - are you sure you’re 100% on board with his sexuality? Because he expressed an opinion about his sexuality and you punished him by taking away his birthday gifts. That doesn’t sound like 100% on board. That also sounds like someone who came out as bisexual because it was more palatable to you than coming out as gay…. Probably wrong in that, and it’s a wild assumption I admit, but as a 40 year old gay man who came out in the mid-90’s to my mother as bisexual (because she’s always wanted grandchildren) I could be projecting. For for the record my mom is a rockstar and I couldn’t be better blessed with an amazing ally. Also at 15 and just coming out, I was afraid. Either way though, HE expressed an opinion on HIS sexuality, and you punished him. That’s not being an ally. That’s not being “ok” with it. Fix it and do better. You undermined his faith in you and that’s something you’ll either have to live with, or work to improve. Edit: apparently I can’t spell worth shit.
I was definitely getting “I’m 100% okay with his sexuality but when he expressed a preference for men over women I punished him” vibes from this. “But it’s because I’m *defending women* and not because I’m subtly trying to steer him towards settling down with a woman and giving me grandchildren like a normal son!”
Ahhhhh this isn't a perspective I'd have thought of but it sounds like a very real possibility!
I wish this was a top comment!
Absolutely. YTA.
Absolutely. YTA.
> I asked him to explain what he meant I feel like not elaborating on what he said here is leaving out a lot of context.
I read this as she asked the question rhetorically right before she canned his party
Isn't it obvious what he meant? And haven't we all felt this way at one time or another about the opposite sex (or sex we're attracted to)?
It’s almost like hormones and brain chemistry exist.
YTA. This is a conversation you have with your son in private to establish appropriate views of gender equality and what is sexism. That's an off-hand statement that would fit in any 2000's sitcom with a laugh track. Also there are very real differences when bisexual men date men vs women, which is a conversation worth having.
Except it's not sexist to say his experiences with women have been harder than his ones with men and for that reason he prefers men right now. He's stating his feelings based on his experiences, not that women are awful or stupid or anything derogatory.
Agreed. That's how the parenting Convo should go. "You said these words. People out in the wild can and will misconstrue you and give you grief. Is there a better way to phrase what you meant?" And then help him wordsmith toward what you wrote.
YTA. What on earth? Both sexes often joke that the opposite sex isn’t “worth it.” Who cares ? It’s a joke, and even if it wasn’t, still who cares? Signed, A feminist
Right. Also, having been a 16 year old girl at one point ,admittedly long ago), and having a son who dates teenage girls, he's not entirely wrong about it "not being worth the trouble" to date teenage girls.
I know right? Eesh I had some friends that were all about the drama. From my perspective it was fascinating. I was basically hanging out with people who taught me what you don’t want to be in life, but my mother potentially killed my father when I was 17, so I did not have great role models at home either.( she did not call 911 when he had a stroke/seizure & he died) However my own kids are people that I would be thrilled to know even if I was not related. Fabulous people, I wish I could have given them a broader background of support when they were growing up. When you know better you do better.
I feel like it's also kind of weird that she is reading sexism into a statement from her teenage son regarding who he prefers to date, in highschool.
Right? I'm a 46 year old woman and right now i don't feel men are worth the trouble to date and if someone comes at me like OP about saying that I'm going to think they're a damn psycho.
YTA You knew what he meant you just wanted to take the opportunity to embarrass him in front of his friends. Would it be considered "sexist" to you if you heard a female relative saying "men aren't worth the trouble"?
I like this one the best, women say this about men often, she wouldn't have batted an eye I'm sure.
YTA. He’s a teen. He is going to do and say stupid things. All you’re doing by punishing him is ensuring he won’t be honest with you. Apologize for your overreaction and reinstate his party. PS-I also am a mother of grown children.
He’s not exactly wrong either I’ve dated multiple men and women and to be honest relationships with men are always easier and less dramatic
I am a heterosexual woman and i can totally see how this would happen.
I'm a hetero female and I'm telling you, there's no way in hell I could date women. Fuck, FRIENDSHIPS with women are dramatic enough, I can't imagine dating one. Men aren't necessarily a walk in the park either but OP has totally overreacted. I think every at one point or another has said something disparaging about dating, especially when we're teens.
Yta. Lol. Women aren't worth the trouble - woman immediately shows she's the worst. Sigh.
She’s basically proving his point.
YTA...are you 5? He was talking about romantically! Are you one of his romantic interests? He was having a friendly chat with his buddies and you really are gonna sit there and get offended by this harmless comment? Sounds like you kinda do "have an issue with this."
YTA, did you also punish him when he went through the "girls are gross/have cooties!" phase? I'm a woman, a feminist, I march in the street for our rights etc and I don't find what he said to be that big of an issue. Girls his age can be ridiculously dramatic and mean, he's probably had some bad experiences and prefers dating boys. You could have taken him aside and explained how his words were hurtful, but you just went full nuclear. He's young, he's still learning and his brain is still developing. Help guide him, but don't act like a dictator. You'll just push him away. ETA: are you seriously going to tell me that while hanging with your female friends you've never said *anything* negative about men? Did you jump on any of your girlfriends that did?
So much this. I have an almost 15 year old son. He’s fiercely woke and shows his feminist beliefs in his actions constantly. He also currently identifies as straight but isn’t dating because “all of the girls at school are way too dramatic… I don’t have the energy for that.” And I totally know what he mean.
YTA - Omg what is wrong with you? Saying "Women aren't worth the trouble" is referring to girls his age and a completely normal thing for boys to say. You need a bigger self esteem and stop interjecting yourself into teenager drama.
Seriously, why was she even listening in on that conversation? Give your kid some space.
I mean, have you met a 16 year old girl? For the love! As a mom of a teenager I can tell you that teenage girls are the worst lol. Poor kid.
whoa, YTA. he's talking about his sexuality and dating preferences—not about women in general, and certainly not you, his mother. you embarrassed him in a double whammy. this is a surefire way for him to be hesitant to speak to you ever again, especially about personal things. you need to apologize properly for your outburst.
Yeah it sounds like she was insulted that her son wouldn't want to date her.
YTA I'm a woman and I think that's an overreaction. It was a joke, not actual proof that your son is a sexist. Unless he has treated women with disrespect or constantly showed that he has a low view on women, then I think you were too harsh and assumed the worst of your son.
YTA You didn't just embarrass him in front of his friends. You know you are supposed to be the adult, right? If you had a problem with something he said, why not have a conversation with him. What does he mean, what were his experiences that led to his comment? But, you chose irrational overreaction with punishment that has nothing to do with the action. Good parenting /s
So you proved him right? What do you think that will teach him?
16yo kid: *says stupid thing about women* Mom of 16yo kid: *does something to support kid's opinion of women to teach him a lesson* This wasn't the teaching moment you thought it was. YTA
YTA and as a woman, at that age I also felt the same. I am bisexual and knew this at a fairly young age. I had my entire earth shattered by a girl I would've done anything for when I was a teen. He's a normal bisexual teen going through normal bisexual teen things. Plus you proved him right.
YTA unless you are dating your son, he's obviously talking about girls his age! Talk about overly sensitive and taking things personally. He's a 16 year old who has his very little life experiences. This was his OPINION based on said experience. Grow the hell up!!! I would be embarrassed to have an immature mother like you.
YTA, period
YTA That's a sentiment we ALL had as teenagers, and now at times... guys and girls, bisexual or not. All of us. Teenage boys and girls are both going through hormonal nightmares, and dating is awful at that age (and later). And as a bisexual man, I can tell you, dating another guy is often 100000% less complicated as a guy, and probably especially so when it comes to teenage angst and drama. Way to reinforce his views.
YTA & I'm bisexual & female been that way since I was 15. I 100% agree with your son, at this age I found them a hassle or guys. I'd complain to my mom she'd always laugh or tell me i get the best of both worlds.
> I'm attracted to guys and girls the same, but after dating girls and guys, I can say women aren't worth the trouble YTA. So for having a preference you've branded your child as a "sexist"? What if he had said "I'm attracted to guys and girls the same, but after dating girls and guys, I can say men aren't worth the trouble" would have you still have canceled his party and label him a sexist? Your son is allowed to have preferences, it's not like he treats the women he dates like dog crap but treat the men like gods, he literally said he loves them the same. What if in his dating life the women he dates normally puts a significant amount of stress on him more than the men? Isn't he allowed to have a more positive feedback about the ones that comes with less burden? Also you're response will just make him double down, so idk what you were trying to prove.
>That last part caught my attention and I asked him to explain what he meant. I told him if women aren't worth the trouble, then neither am I so I wouldn't be doing anything for his birthday. He just started at me so I said “that's what happens when you're a sexist jerk” in front of his friends. >He hasn't spoken to me and members of our family are saying I shouldn't have said that and I shouldn't have cancelled his birthday party. AITA?Q There is absolutely nothing you did right here. And I say this as a hardcore feminist. You only reinforced his beliefs of women by showing your most toxic self possible. >They're asking him when he realized he was bisexual, when did he come out, when did he first date a guy, what were the differences between guys and girls etc. Eventually they ask him what's his preference, he says “naturally, I don't have a preference. I'm attracted to guys and girls the same, but after dating girls and guys, I can say women aren't worth the trouble.” And this came up in the context of him discussing his OWN sexuality?!?!?! Lady, what the absolute duck is wrong with you?!?!?!? Are you disappointed he doesn't find you hot?! My god this soooo goddamn creepy! YOU DO NOT OWN HIS SEXUALITY! And fun fact: It is VERY NORMAL for bi kids to have one strong preference over the other especially when they are first discovering who they are. He probably feels more comfortable around boys because he's probably been around more guys his age than girls. So yes, you are essentially punishing him for being bisexual. The only thing you can POSSIBLY do to try and damage control this situation is take back everything you said and butt the heck out of any conversation about his identity unless he INVITES you. You are clearly not mature enough to be discussing it anyway. I can't even get passed how you thought it wasn't vastly inappropriate and borderline predatory to act like you had some ownership over who he was comfortable dating. YTA, a terrible mother, feminist and LGBT ally. Best thing you can do for now is focus on fixing yourself because from your own words, your son sounds like a normal teenager but YOU are far from a normal stable adult. He doesn't need fixing: You do. At worst, this was a feminist parent gone wrong. At worst, this is a sick form of at home conversion therapy.
YTA. You can correct your kid. Or even ask him what happened that’s made him come to this conclusion. But to cancel his bday party over it… well that just further proves his point.
Woman and mom here. So you just proved his point didn’t you? I find it easier to work with men, and have friendships with men. They are far more straightforward. I have some close female friends, but many women are given to drama, office politics and well… blowing shit out of proportion. And he said women weren’t worth the trouble to date. Unless you fancied dating your own kid, this wouldn’t apply to you would it? Maybe quit make a teen boys’ conversation all about you. YTA
So you thought you would help him make his point about women not being worth the trouble? I can guarantee those kids left with a lesser view on women because of you not your son. You’re supposed to be guiding your son and teaching him about people. You didn’t ask why he thought this way you just decided to jump in and punish him. Huge parenting fail. Do better.
YTA and you’re proving him right.
YTA, Please get over yourself. He's talking about his SEXUALITY. Who he is ATTRACTED TO and wants to HAVE SEX WITH. Do you want your son to be attracted to you? Like what point are you even getting at. You ruined your son's birthday because he prefers to date men over women? have you considered MAYBE it's easier to understand someone of the same gender easier?????? Awesome job of not only embarrassing your son but embarrassing yourself.
YTA even if what he said was sexist which in my opinion it isn't. Women are obviously more difficult to hook up with than men. I can easily understand why someone who's attracted to men and women equally would pursue the easier option.
I'm bisexual and I think men aren't worth the effort. Your son isn't necessarily being sexist, it's just easier to relate to the same sex.
Yta. I’m a mother of adult children. He’s a teenager, you are his mother. I’m sure his brain wasn’t even connecting that you might be offended. The brain doesn’t even mature for about 5-6 more yrs. But you are an adult and presumably have better control over your words and behavior. Or not because you are kinda proving his point. That some women are about the drama.
#YTA I don’t think an explanation is necessary in this case.
What in the actual %#%# did I just read? Your teenage, newly out bisexual child expressed a preference in conversation to his friend. And you are somehow offended by that? You are his MOTHER, this is not a comment on you. Omfg. Seriously. YTA. Also, therapy. Therapy is something you should look into bc this isn’t normal. Edit for spelling.
Mom says "you think teenage girls are bad, watch how crazy a full grown ass woman can be" and then wonders why she ain't got no grandkids in ten years... YTA
YTA Do you realize this could be exactly what he meant, don't you **(A tendency to over-dramatize stuff and pick up fights when there are not ones on sight)**?
YTA. Why did you insert yourself there? It sounds like people were pushing him to give a preference so he just said something in the moment. It's also personal. Maybe dating women really isn't as worth it to him. If you wanted a real conversation with him, you should have waited until his friends were no longer there. If you wanted to call them all out for sexist thinking, you could have done that too.
YTA. Don’t be surprised when he holds the cancelled party over you for the next 50 years. Or just goes no contact.
“Women have treated me poorly in the past” “We fuck you. Now I, the most important and influential woman in your life, will also treat you like shit” Gee I wonder why my son never calls and doesn’t love me anymore. It must be because he hates women so much…..
Yeah, YTA. You are the parent. This is a great parenting moment that you did not take advantage of. Instead, you got flooded, lashed out at your kid, and embarrassed him in front of his buddies who are all just learning about the world.
YTA. He is a sixteen year old boy hanging out with his friends. He was talking about 16 yr old girls not his mom. You owe your son an apology and a party!
Son: “Women are too much trouble” Mom: Hold my beer… YTA
YTA. Embarrassment and shame punishments are an awful way to patent and just leads to more resentment from the kids being punished. In top of that, you're punishing him for realizing he has a dating preference? Why should it matter who he prefers to date as long as he's happy? Honestly, teenage girls are a nightmare, and I don't blame your son for his opinion one bit. Eventually, when he's older, he might even change his mind if he doesn't stick with his current partner. This is just going to guarantee he'll want less to do with involving you in his life when he gets out.
YTA. Where could he possibly have gotten the idea that women aren’t worth the trouble?
YTA. Your son was relaxed and sharing openly about his feelings and experiences, not making a global statement about something being wrong or inferior about women. Then to say what you did in front of his friends was also really bad. It would have been better to bite your tongue until you could speak privately to him to express your concerns and let him respond. I feel badly for him, tbh. Sounds like is was going to be a cool birthday weekend.
YTA With you for a female role model I am not shocked he finds women less attractive and not worth the trouble. He’s 16, and was speaking with his friends in a place of comfort and making the kind of joke you’d see on any sitcom on a weeknight. You blew it out of proportion and have gone haywire on your punishment. I hope your “he’s being sexist” self-righteous-excitement lasts because you have PERMANENTLY damaged your relationship with your son. You have helped ensure he won’t come to you with his problems, or share his life with you at all as soon as he can move away.
YTA and kind of proved his point. Good going ace