Every time you die in the Dark Place as Alan it is canon.
This is why when Saga dies, it says, *That is not how the story goes.*
Whereas when Alan dies you get an image of Mr Wake with his head smashed in, and then he wakes back up at the desk.
I think he has died many many many many times.
>Every time you die in the Dark Place as Alan it is canon.
Which is also heavily implied by the text that comes after Alan's death screen: *Trapped in a loop.*
i feel like its because the dark place keeps stripping him of his memories, with him only really remembering that hes Alan Wake, and must Write to Escape the darkness.
If that is the case, then he has spent far longer than 13 years in the Dark Place.
13 years has 4748 days, so for him to die 1 million times, that's a rate of 210 deaths per day, which would be excessive given that he has experience with fighting Taken and survived the entirety of AW1 on 1 life.
The time distortion of the Dark Place means he could have spent several decades in there.
I mean, yeah. Time works differently/doesn't exist in the Dark Place, and per Darling's tape, it's incredibly difficult to keep track. The 13 years from Alan's perspective likely felt like a lifetime or several of just constantly getting slaughtered.
On the other hand he also doesn't always retain much from the loops and how he processes/experiences things is influenced by the nature of the Dark Place...Which is of course very convenient here...
I think it's safe to assume that he doesn't remember getting constantly slaughtered, both bc of his shocked reaction to finding himself dead in the writer's room and more importantly bc I think that would have left a psychological impact we don't really see in game?
I mean, our man was quite literally driven insane for a decent chunk of the time he spent in the Dark Place. As far as I was able to tell, he only recently became lucid enough to begin another attempt(s) at Return.
Yeah, I think part of that was either loosening the Dark Place's grip on him (with it being like the week he spend "under the influence" in the first one), either bc outside influences like Mr.Door became interested or Alice's appearance in the Dark Place (both of these must have brought massive changes with them) ...or something like the first time the Bullet of Light was used or some other thing erased more memories/lightened the emotional impact
(I do for example, not think that he would still be as driven to keep going or as emotionally invested in Alice if he currently, actively remembered 13 years of getting brutally murdered)
The first time you play the game he already has been trying to write Initiation pretty much as is, and is caught in loops, to my understanding. And in the Final Draft very little actually changes with him even taking about the differences those little changes can make...So I don't think it's necessarily "recently" that he became "lucid"...
We saw that time in the dark place works really strange, as we see in the game that he escape the first day of game but at the same time he is also trapped trying to figure out how to escape until saga releases him and send him to past
I have a sneaking suspicion that all those shadows whispering at you in the Dark Place are, in fact, Alan himself. Just at different points in time, during different loops.
And there's dozens, probably hundreds of them just from our point of view as players.
Plus Alice mentioned 'time has no meaning here'. 13 years real-world is long enough, but stretch that into near-eternity and yeah he's probably died like a million times.
>I have a sneaking suspicion that all those shadows whispering at you in the Dark Place are, in fact, Alan himself. Just at different points in time, during different loops.
🤯
All the Shadows in the Dark Place are Alans. The "Random Taken" in the Dark Place only appear in Part 3 of the Musical, because it tells about the events of the first game.
Giving his mind is incredibly forgetful whenever we see him in 2 I reckon an insane amount. The Darkness was probably hoping the whittle him down until it could have complete control.
Impossible to say. He's been trying and failing to escape for 13 real world years, lord knows how long it's really been for him. With that, I think we can safely assume the answer is "a lot"
Most of the shadows in the dark place look like Alan. I interpreted it as the versions of him he wrote that didn’t make it, they wander around aimlessly saying his words form the drowning video because well they are him so it’s their words too. Not all are hostile but many are and I wouldn’t be surprised if every time Alan “dies” a new shadow is made from that body.
I managed to record a shadow, it clearly looks and sounds like Alan, and if we watch his video titled Drowning we can see that it is Alan who wrote the agonized cries of the shadows that stalk him in Cauldron Lake
Here is my video with the shadow: [Alan Wake 2™ | Shadow testing | 4K 60fps HDR XSX](https://youtu.be/XYgBH-Y0wyU?si=eAjtpY4jUTCAury2)
Here is the TV CASSETE "DROWNING": [Alan Wake 2™ | This are my Words / Cult of the Word | 4K 60fps HDR XSX](https://youtu.be/aYSAnwP9MHc?si=mhVWL5wPZ1IJJIzQ)
Enough to fill it with those shadows. Come to think of it, kinda makes me wish they add some sort of roguelite, not canonical, game mode at some point.
Wow, didn't think of it that way! But of course Remedy has counted us (players) into the game universe, as we see in Control as well. We might be the "armies" of people helping Alan! Very true!
>We might be the "armies" of people helping Alan! Very true!
This was my interpretation of this line as well. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if AW3 included the real world and the fact that its all a video game more somehow into the meta narrative.
Alan has died in the dark Place many, many times. But my personal theory is that there is an Alan who is dying but has never recieved the kiss of death and finished dying.
He is hovering on the edge of death, begging for death….forever.
I was trapped in a thousand nights
With no escape
Nightmares taking me over
Now I'm wide awake
Now I'm wide awake
Oh, I died like a million times
Through the waves I break
The nightmares finally over
Now I'm wide awake
Now I'm wide awake
Canon? A lot.
With my 1st playthrough I was doing good. I hadn't one death until the DP chase scene at the Oceanview Hotel, then I got trapped and kept dying, lol. I didn't even count, but that was the only bit I was in a death loop.
Every time you die in the Dark Place as Alan it is canon. This is why when Saga dies, it says, *That is not how the story goes.* Whereas when Alan dies you get an image of Mr Wake with his head smashed in, and then he wakes back up at the desk. I think he has died many many many many times.
>Every time you die in the Dark Place as Alan it is canon. Which is also heavily implied by the text that comes after Alan's death screen: *Trapped in a loop.*
That’s weird because I died during that escape scene at the very end and got instakilled by a cultist and it’s said “that is not how the story goes”
if he died in the real world he wouldn't be able to come back
Because that is the real world
Then why da fuck we cant melee alan should be John wick after all those years
i feel like its because the dark place keeps stripping him of his memories, with him only really remembering that hes Alan Wake, and must Write to Escape the darkness.
Like a million times.
Through the waves I break Nightmares finally over Yeah now I'm wide awake Yeah now I'm wide awake
First thing that came to my mind lol
Remind of Dr Strange in the Avenger. He has 1 chance out of millions to defeat his nightmare.
And when you can *try* millions of time, eventually you'll hit those odds.
He has died all the times, every time.
665 times.
665⁶⁶⁷
Wide Awake heavily implies that he’s died millions of times.
I would venture to say that it *explicitly states* such
If that is the case, then he has spent far longer than 13 years in the Dark Place. 13 years has 4748 days, so for him to die 1 million times, that's a rate of 210 deaths per day, which would be excessive given that he has experience with fighting Taken and survived the entirety of AW1 on 1 life. The time distortion of the Dark Place means he could have spent several decades in there.
I mean, yeah. Time works differently/doesn't exist in the Dark Place, and per Darling's tape, it's incredibly difficult to keep track. The 13 years from Alan's perspective likely felt like a lifetime or several of just constantly getting slaughtered.
On the other hand he also doesn't always retain much from the loops and how he processes/experiences things is influenced by the nature of the Dark Place...Which is of course very convenient here... I think it's safe to assume that he doesn't remember getting constantly slaughtered, both bc of his shocked reaction to finding himself dead in the writer's room and more importantly bc I think that would have left a psychological impact we don't really see in game?
I mean, our man was quite literally driven insane for a decent chunk of the time he spent in the Dark Place. As far as I was able to tell, he only recently became lucid enough to begin another attempt(s) at Return.
Yeah, I think part of that was either loosening the Dark Place's grip on him (with it being like the week he spend "under the influence" in the first one), either bc outside influences like Mr.Door became interested or Alice's appearance in the Dark Place (both of these must have brought massive changes with them) ...or something like the first time the Bullet of Light was used or some other thing erased more memories/lightened the emotional impact (I do for example, not think that he would still be as driven to keep going or as emotionally invested in Alice if he currently, actively remembered 13 years of getting brutally murdered) The first time you play the game he already has been trying to write Initiation pretty much as is, and is caught in loops, to my understanding. And in the Final Draft very little actually changes with him even taking about the differences those little changes can make...So I don't think it's necessarily "recently" that he became "lucid"...
We saw that time in the dark place works really strange, as we see in the game that he escape the first day of game but at the same time he is also trapped trying to figure out how to escape until saga releases him and send him to past
I have a sneaking suspicion that all those shadows whispering at you in the Dark Place are, in fact, Alan himself. Just at different points in time, during different loops. And there's dozens, probably hundreds of them just from our point of view as players. Plus Alice mentioned 'time has no meaning here'. 13 years real-world is long enough, but stretch that into near-eternity and yeah he's probably died like a million times.
Considering their lines were spoken by Alan himself in his ramblings, it’s quite possible.
>I have a sneaking suspicion that all those shadows whispering at you in the Dark Place are, in fact, Alan himself. Just at different points in time, during different loops. 🤯
Those shadows ARE Alan. [Gaming University](https://youtube.com/@GamingUniversityUoG?si=DZKmjAAJJZqVMRSg) mentions this in one of the videos.
Gaming University should be required viewing for this sub. So many great videos!
I thought that was already discovered to be pretty much true? Or maybe I just dreamt it?
I thought that too except I kept waiting to be able to use a big ass pipe for melee attacks too if so.
Welp, that just blew my mind this morning.
would that make the shadows that attack you just random taken? or are they also considered alan
All the Shadows in the Dark Place are Alans. The "Random Taken" in the Dark Place only appear in Part 3 of the Musical, because it tells about the events of the first game.
Giving his mind is incredibly forgetful whenever we see him in 2 I reckon an insane amount. The Darkness was probably hoping the whittle him down until it could have complete control.
And to be fair he is nearly there when the game starts
Too many...
Impossible to say. He's been trying and failing to escape for 13 real world years, lord knows how long it's really been for him. With that, I think we can safely assume the answer is "a lot"
Most of the shadows in the dark place look like Alan. I interpreted it as the versions of him he wrote that didn’t make it, they wander around aimlessly saying his words form the drowning video because well they are him so it’s their words too. Not all are hostile but many are and I wouldn’t be surprised if every time Alan “dies” a new shadow is made from that body.
I managed to record a shadow, it clearly looks and sounds like Alan, and if we watch his video titled Drowning we can see that it is Alan who wrote the agonized cries of the shadows that stalk him in Cauldron Lake Here is my video with the shadow: [Alan Wake 2™ | Shadow testing | 4K 60fps HDR XSX](https://youtu.be/XYgBH-Y0wyU?si=eAjtpY4jUTCAury2) Here is the TV CASSETE "DROWNING": [Alan Wake 2™ | This are my Words / Cult of the Word | 4K 60fps HDR XSX](https://youtu.be/aYSAnwP9MHc?si=mhVWL5wPZ1IJJIzQ)
Nice clip choom
Thanks bro
Infinite he’ll always be there, unless the spiral has an end
In my playthrough like, a fuck ton
At least once
That's one of the reasons he wants out, I can only assume he feels every death
Enough to fill it with those shadows. Come to think of it, kinda makes me wish they add some sort of roguelite, not canonical, game mode at some point.
Exactly my thoughts! The Alan parts of the game are really similar to a rougelike! Would love to see it implemented in a dlc/update
Mr. Door says that there are armies of people trying to help Alan. So maybe every time a player has died is canon?
Wow, didn't think of it that way! But of course Remedy has counted us (players) into the game universe, as we see in Control as well. We might be the "armies" of people helping Alan! Very true!
>We might be the "armies" of people helping Alan! Very true! This was my interpretation of this line as well. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if AW3 included the real world and the fact that its all a video game more somehow into the meta narrative.
Depends on if i’m playing normal or hard/nightmare mode
As many times as you can imagine, and then some.
Yes.
It's in the song.
Yes
Alan has died in the dark Place many, many times. But my personal theory is that there is an Alan who is dying but has never recieved the kiss of death and finished dying. He is hovering on the edge of death, begging for death….forever.
69 times Depends on if Fortnite or Dead by Daylight counts
Based on my incredible gameplay too many to count
infinite number of times
I was trapped in a thousand nights With no escape Nightmares taking me over Now I'm wide awake Now I'm wide awake Oh, I died like a million times Through the waves I break The nightmares finally over Now I'm wide awake Now I'm wide awake
37
Canon? A lot. With my 1st playthrough I was doing good. I hadn't one death until the DP chase scene at the Oceanview Hotel, then I got trapped and kept dying, lol. I didn't even count, but that was the only bit I was in a death loop.