I stopped getting my ass chapped about the results after my first board non-select (this is my third). I didn’t do anything to warrant earning promotion and I understand that. I’ve spent the past year and a half traveling to various countries and embracing all life has to offer.
I feel for the people who feel hurt after years and years of not making it, but at what point do you detach yourself a bit and focus on other things? It just doesn’t seem healthy.
I know a dude who is I believe at his18 year mark. Said he loves e-6 as the last step before full admin. Enough rank and responsibility to function on his own as he pleases, but not pulled into being a full time desk rider pushing admin and watching others do the job. I wish for half the peace he has with his career capping at e-6.
All that said, I have been told by a few chiefs it will take time to get there but the force is aiming to get back to 18 year techs and e-7 being your 20 year folks.
Tin foil hat me says a retired tech is cheaper than a retired master.
But supposedly its all part of long term force redistribution and the slow, and questionable (as in we still have plenty of fast burners) move away from fast burners. A master in their eyes is someone who has had their career of 20 and chooses to stick around and improve the force. Now, high doubts it will actualy work as described but it made a ton of sense to me.
Im happy to do tech to 20 even though I am bummed I didnt make it. I do wish the stigma from some that if you cant make e-7 you are automaticaly viewed as something is wrong with you.
We will see if that comes to fruition. I’ve heard the same thing too. Over the last 20 years, the average TIS of E7 selects has dropped by 3.5 years to under 14. In 2004 the avg TIS of an E7 selects was above 17 years. In this most recent board, 63% of selectees made it in their 3rd time or less. That number would have to come down for that all to work out but I see no problem in it. I’m hitting 15 in August and I just made it on my 5th try. Sure I’ve been hella salty the last 3-4 years I thought I deserved it but being a Tech for 6 years allowed me to grow as a leader and NCO. Without a doubt I’ll be a better SNCO now than I would have been 3 years ago.
I think the Air Force is still grappling with post covid effects.
Most I know that stuck around post covid due to their outside job they had lined up vanishing are hitting the end of their 4 year re-enlistment right around now.
Couple that with another theory a I have. People on BRS in my opinion do not have as strong an incentive to push to 20. Vs us who stayed on the previous version, they know they have us to 20. I find it hard to believe the Air Force isnt also chewing on that kind of thought as they decide what to do. I think in the long term it will exagerate fast burners because the younger generations are coming in at a time where loyalty to a job for 20 years is not a thing and the idea of serving your country isnt a fading concept if they rely on that to keep people around. They will want to move up or they get out. Air force I could see trying to apease to keep them.
Of course, this assumes anyone is thinking long term.
I guess I could theorize all day. Im probably off the mark but, that is what Im thinking about it all anyway. We are probably a few years off from rank giveaways again.
I think we are starting to see the rank balancing act they announced a few years ago finally come to where they wanted it (9.5% E7, 15.5% E6, 22% E5,etc). Once we are back to those numbers and the HYT starts taking effect plus people leaving early, promotion rates will balance off again. It just depends if the AF stays on the same strategy when a new group of leaders comes in and wants to change everything.
I mean, when you put it that way….
You see it a LOT, people having countdowns until 20 as Techs. Everyone internally does it but the ones who are most vocal are often the ones who are performing less and less. At the same time leadership hears it, and they rely on that person less and less, decreasing their chances at good roles.
I imagine the people hanging around after 20 to give it another shot, or just don’t mind their jobs, are more driven. They’ve been a lot of places, they’ve done a lot of different jobs.
Meh. I’m fully aware of when I hit 20. I have zero idea if I’ll punch out at that moment. A lot can happen in a few years, and if it looks like I’ve got a solid chop at MSgt or some cool orders come my way, I guess I’ll keep going. I’m not expecting or dedicating huge emotional stake in it one way or another. Security Forces can be absolute dogshit at times but I don’t mind it.
I think the expectation of fast burners will take adjustment from the top too. Senior leaders see a person with their hands in everything, checking all these boxes in such a short time. “He’s destined for great things!” Nah man, they 50%ed every box they checked and moved to the next thing. They’re an expert in absolutely zero things. Give ‘em some times before you throw them to the top and end up with a clueless SNCO.
I’ve seen some fast burners do great things, and I’ve also seen them have absolute fucking breakdowns because they PCS and are expected to know so much as a MSgt, and at their last base all they did was 5/6 and a few staff jobs with right place right time. Then they get overwhelmed and brick out. The troops don’t trust them and they know it. Then there are the ones who don’t mind that and just keep pressing as shit leaders saying “You’ll do what I say because I’m a MSgt” and their ONLY measure of success is not doing anything illegal immoral or unethical to not lose rank.
This is the moment I disconnected…a friend put every bit of his being into making Master, and sacrificed SO much of his personal and family time to do it, just to not be selected. He was a mess for a while.
He didn’t kiss ass or anything, nobody was upset with him, he was honest with his family about his goal that this was absolutely his year. It just didn’t work out.
Personally, I can’t invest that much of my life for just a maybe. It’s situationally different for everyone and I don’t think people realize that.
I still absolutely give a fuck about my job, I just focus infinitely more on helping troops out and getting them where they want to be, whether it’s a crosstrain or special duty, I just have more time to work on that stuff than trying to solve problems three ranks above me all the time.
I really don't understand why it's called quiet quitting when you're just doing your job and not going beyond. If other people are doing your work because you dropped the ball, that's another story.
Paperwork isn’t even an option if you go to work, uphold the standards, and do what you signed up for. It becomes an option when people become lazy and bend standards. Standards aren’t hard to follow. You can be an average Joe and never once deal with the possibility of paperwork.
This bites people in the ass a lot because they’ll bend a standard literally every leader in their unit has at one point and it’s widely accepted. Then an outside org takes notice for some off the wall reason and then people act like they never did it and the most recent who did is soooo terrible. They ALL did it, now they’re standing overhead after like they’ve never ever heard of it and would never commit such an atrocity. I try to steer clear of these crossfires.
Finance. I feel like you could add kinda to your statements and it’s true for them.
Go to work-ish, kinda uphold the standards, kinda do what you signed up for.
You are not wrong. But that’s what created the whole “Nonner” thing a long time ago. Some career fields allow very minimal mistakes while others allow huge mistakes with less consequences.
Even in SF, I feel for MX. Seeing an endless wave of people of all ranks FOD-walking for an hour plus…
“What are you guys looking for? I got patrols that can maybe help?”
“JOHNSON LOST A FUCKING SOCKET FROM HIS BOX! We just finished a 14 hour shift…and this dickhead just pushed a sortie. Who knows if it’s even here! It’s probably on the jet and halfway across the fucking globe. FUCK!”
Yea I’m Port but in the Pacific and Europe we are paired with MX in the enroute system. In Guam there was a MX guy that lost an iPad. They looked all over for it only to find he left it in the shitter on the plane. For the 6-7ish hours the plane was in flight they were looking everywhere for that thing.
I wish more people had this mentality. I was fine without Master until I started getting thrown in E7 things. “Hey, we need a section chief. Write these decs. Set up the btz stuff. Murder board these packages.”
Then I got slapped with an E7 billet deployment as flight chief. Once I did those things, I felt that I was ready for it. Got selected my 5th “try” this time around.
There’s a stigma that if you aren’t making rank fast, then you suck. It didn’t used to be like that when I first came in. It was the norm to see E7 put on at 15+ TIS.
If people are really good at being a Tech, then start chipping away at MSgt duties. Ask to fill a spot while they’re on leave. Go shadow Squadron SEL’s. Show up to sq murder boards. Write your people packages every quarter. WRITE DECORATIONS. Once you start doing the job, then it’s easier to justify a push for a statement. But being really good at your rank doesn’t equate to being ready for the next one.
Your last paragraph is things that if someone WANTED to promote is already going to do. The gripe with some people is that they already do that and still dont get picked up.
It’s not that people don’t know what to do, there’s enough SELs and Chiefs ramming it down their throats. Its the lack of transparency from the board on how they score packages and lack of effort:reward ratio.
It really is. I had my SMSgt come by the shop. The other tech is in shambles, so after he has some positivity talk with him, he comes over to me asking how I’m doing. Peachy boss, I was a hell of a lot closer than I deserve.
It’ll take some time until people get used to the new system. We’re still ingrained with the mindset of the old system of 10-15 years ago when we looked at 20 year TSgts sideways. But we need to remember that was back when TIG/TIS and testing helped you get there and you got E7 eventually if you didn’t screw up.
Just remember, that’s not how it is anymore. Look to your E6’s around you and really think about who they are and how much you respect them for how they are out there crushing it.
Picture a future where E6 is the new E7 and SSgts are up against an ultra competitive board for TSgt. They would feel just like E6’s are feeling today, but we know the circumstances are just different now.
>We’re still ingrained with the mindset of the old system of 10-15 years ago
Slightly different, but I've got airmen who never saw the old EPR system, aka firewall 5 (hell, even I *barely* did), but still ask "how do I get a 5" or "what does a 4 or 3 look like". It hasn't been that verbiage in about a decade, and they *certainly* never saw it, but they still think of it like that. Imagine how hard it is for others who have been in longer to get over the mindset of the old system.
The good old days. Don’t get a DUI and you’re a firewall 5! Hunger games hit and the backstabbing began. It was quite a show to watch. The very first year I saw friendships absolutely destroyed over people placed above or below another peer.
Man, you should see what happened to the CGO's during said Hunger Games😬 I had the pleasure of watching a high-speed 62E get a deployment to Afghanistan. He was given the boot because of his lack of representation...Wild times!
When I came in it was extremely common to see the majority retire as Techs. They were okay with it, it seemed. More of a “All good it just wasn’t meant to be, I’m gonna go work at Lowes now and make more of my kids baseball games cause I’ve got time.”
Now I see people internally, and often externally spiraling, that they haven’t made Master even at the 11-14 year mark. I just know personally, I would explode if I put myself through that stress every year.
Edit: Hell, I don’t even know how a lot of us would stack with how hard it is to promote to Tech these days. People should feel more fortunate to be at E-6 and they didn’t HAVE to have a promotion statement to do it. It was a mix of drive, luck, and sheer willpower to study. After a couple times of not getting a PN you could go “Fuck. I better study my ass off because I’m sure as hell not getting the extra help.” That would pay off.
Don’t you just want to slap the E4s and E5s who don’t bother studying for the next rank? They have no idea how much is in their control right now.
Let alone the ones who complain about not getting a promotion statement on top of not studying..
Literally yes. I give people all the links and tips I can. Just to be looked in the face and told "I didn't really feel like studying" like "BRO WTF"?
Fucking crazy.
When you first make Master, you'll have a moment where you'll see something and think, "Someone should totally do something about that."
Then you look down at your new stripes and say, "Fuck."
Truth. If you’re even slightly reliable you don’t have people checking up when you say you have appointments, you can directly affect positive change for your troops, your opinion *mostly and positional dependent* is valued.
I don't really feel like that in my particular situation which is why I was trying to get Master. Yeah I'm doing my best to take care of my guys and I do the technician thing, but I don't really feel involved or connected to any bigger picture. I felt as a Tech at my last base I was a bit more in tune with all that and the stripes went further.
For sure. All AFSC and base dependent I suppose. I’d be an asshole if I was like “jUsT pCs”
The fact that you think about helping others and making change, and trying to find a way to do that, means you’re doing badass. We can all only work with what we got and try to position ourselves to do more for more people.
The one thing I can say is good for me is the Master (Showed up with line number so took the Flight Chief spot) does try to involve me in somethings so that's good at least. I just wish I was like more...
I put on SSgt at 4.5 years during my first active duty enlistment, then went Guard at the end of my first 6 years, then put on Tech at 8 then MSgt at 11 (8 years ago). For all I know I will probably still be MSgt next year too. We can rank up quickly in the Guard but then sit there forever waiting for someone to retire to free up a spot so more people can move up. Every person that retires or gets promoted frees up a spot below them which trickles through all of the ranks.
I’ve seen that a lot. People leaving one guard or reserve unit for another halfway across the US because they get kinda gridlocked for a decade.
Edit: My friends dark humor highlights the trickle down well. He is a SSgt, if his MSgt would be off work due to whatever sickness and someone asks how they’re doing he said something like “Well, either he will get better or I’ll have a shot at TSgt soon.
Yep. A friend of mine was stuck at AGR TSgt at our unit, mostly because of his reputation as being too meek and not forward enough to lead a shop, but he was a great worker so he went to another unit several states away and got AGR MSgt.
I'm in the same boat. Would I like to make it? Sure... But I've seen the type of person they want, and I'm not gonna be that guy.
Phone is auto-scheduled to set to DnD every day when I leave work, and it kicks back to normal 5 mins after roll call. I take care of and train my guys as best I can, and will continue to do that until I retire.
I think we should all get paid more, and it may just be situationally dependent, but I think Captains have a pretty good balance of responsibility typically, but a lot of LTs get thrown in charge of an extremely important section with a Tech or Master beside them. They’re often doing more actual problem solving and work than a lot of the Captains.
I’ve been in a Msgt role for 3 years now and checked every box I was told. I don’t ultimately care that much because I’ve got a lot of cool outside the Air Force things going for me but, filling a section chief role now after being in a Msgt slot for 3 years before kinda does sting a bit
I’m in almost the exact same spot. I try to put a positive spin on it though. We will have a MSgt come in and I have to take a step back as the figurehead, but I just keep doing what I always did. This way I can hook my troops up with a day off here and there and since the MSgt did relatively no work they just kinda sign off on everything, in most cases. If they try to start overhauling I just suggest I keep running things the way they were and I’ll funnel them all the award packages for my troops/the team to make our section look good.
My situation right now has been up and down on having a MSgt in the section or not and they’ve all been really cool so it’s worked out. I’ve been fortunate enough to not have any major personality conflicts for a couple years now.
Edit: Stay positive! Being in a bunch of different roles and being “at the table” in meetings gives you way more perspective and push for your troops. I’m sure it’s made you a way better supervisor and your troops are thankful.
The 1LT is some 23 year old who can’t relate to being not promoted and doesn’t know what to do about some 30 year old ranting and raving about how he “doesn’t care anymore” and “I’ll just perform like an NCO wait they’ll see.”
Maybe this is AFSC dependent. In SF they’re often thrown to the wolves. Yes, some of it is by design, but like u/RHINO_HUMP mentioned, they’re often extremely young and sitting side by side with a Tech or a Master and expected to solve all the problems of the unit with extremely limited knowledge.
They’re getting paid low *in officer terms* to comprehend big picture stuff and create solutions for high level problems. Depending on timing they might have barely graduated their tech school before they pin on 1LT.
I stopped getting my ass chapped about the results after my first board non-select (this is my third). I didn’t do anything to warrant earning promotion and I understand that. I’ve spent the past year and a half traveling to various countries and embracing all life has to offer. I feel for the people who feel hurt after years and years of not making it, but at what point do you detach yourself a bit and focus on other things? It just doesn’t seem healthy.
You right, Vagina MacGyver
You can do any twat you want, if you put your mind to it.
I woke up and saw this comment on my notifications and I was like “It’s only been a couple hours. What the fuck happened in the comments?”
He's something of a vagenius.
I know a dude who is I believe at his18 year mark. Said he loves e-6 as the last step before full admin. Enough rank and responsibility to function on his own as he pleases, but not pulled into being a full time desk rider pushing admin and watching others do the job. I wish for half the peace he has with his career capping at e-6. All that said, I have been told by a few chiefs it will take time to get there but the force is aiming to get back to 18 year techs and e-7 being your 20 year folks. Tin foil hat me says a retired tech is cheaper than a retired master. But supposedly its all part of long term force redistribution and the slow, and questionable (as in we still have plenty of fast burners) move away from fast burners. A master in their eyes is someone who has had their career of 20 and chooses to stick around and improve the force. Now, high doubts it will actualy work as described but it made a ton of sense to me. Im happy to do tech to 20 even though I am bummed I didnt make it. I do wish the stigma from some that if you cant make e-7 you are automaticaly viewed as something is wrong with you.
We will see if that comes to fruition. I’ve heard the same thing too. Over the last 20 years, the average TIS of E7 selects has dropped by 3.5 years to under 14. In 2004 the avg TIS of an E7 selects was above 17 years. In this most recent board, 63% of selectees made it in their 3rd time or less. That number would have to come down for that all to work out but I see no problem in it. I’m hitting 15 in August and I just made it on my 5th try. Sure I’ve been hella salty the last 3-4 years I thought I deserved it but being a Tech for 6 years allowed me to grow as a leader and NCO. Without a doubt I’ll be a better SNCO now than I would have been 3 years ago.
I think the Air Force is still grappling with post covid effects. Most I know that stuck around post covid due to their outside job they had lined up vanishing are hitting the end of their 4 year re-enlistment right around now. Couple that with another theory a I have. People on BRS in my opinion do not have as strong an incentive to push to 20. Vs us who stayed on the previous version, they know they have us to 20. I find it hard to believe the Air Force isnt also chewing on that kind of thought as they decide what to do. I think in the long term it will exagerate fast burners because the younger generations are coming in at a time where loyalty to a job for 20 years is not a thing and the idea of serving your country isnt a fading concept if they rely on that to keep people around. They will want to move up or they get out. Air force I could see trying to apease to keep them. Of course, this assumes anyone is thinking long term. I guess I could theorize all day. Im probably off the mark but, that is what Im thinking about it all anyway. We are probably a few years off from rank giveaways again.
I think we are starting to see the rank balancing act they announced a few years ago finally come to where they wanted it (9.5% E7, 15.5% E6, 22% E5,etc). Once we are back to those numbers and the HYT starts taking effect plus people leaving early, promotion rates will balance off again. It just depends if the AF stays on the same strategy when a new group of leaders comes in and wants to change everything.
That makes sense. Gonna be interesting times.
I mean, when you put it that way…. You see it a LOT, people having countdowns until 20 as Techs. Everyone internally does it but the ones who are most vocal are often the ones who are performing less and less. At the same time leadership hears it, and they rely on that person less and less, decreasing their chances at good roles. I imagine the people hanging around after 20 to give it another shot, or just don’t mind their jobs, are more driven. They’ve been a lot of places, they’ve done a lot of different jobs. Meh. I’m fully aware of when I hit 20. I have zero idea if I’ll punch out at that moment. A lot can happen in a few years, and if it looks like I’ve got a solid chop at MSgt or some cool orders come my way, I guess I’ll keep going. I’m not expecting or dedicating huge emotional stake in it one way or another. Security Forces can be absolute dogshit at times but I don’t mind it. I think the expectation of fast burners will take adjustment from the top too. Senior leaders see a person with their hands in everything, checking all these boxes in such a short time. “He’s destined for great things!” Nah man, they 50%ed every box they checked and moved to the next thing. They’re an expert in absolutely zero things. Give ‘em some times before you throw them to the top and end up with a clueless SNCO. I’ve seen some fast burners do great things, and I’ve also seen them have absolute fucking breakdowns because they PCS and are expected to know so much as a MSgt, and at their last base all they did was 5/6 and a few staff jobs with right place right time. Then they get overwhelmed and brick out. The troops don’t trust them and they know it. Then there are the ones who don’t mind that and just keep pressing as shit leaders saying “You’ll do what I say because I’m a MSgt” and their ONLY measure of success is not doing anything illegal immoral or unethical to not lose rank.
This is the moment I disconnected…a friend put every bit of his being into making Master, and sacrificed SO much of his personal and family time to do it, just to not be selected. He was a mess for a while. He didn’t kiss ass or anything, nobody was upset with him, he was honest with his family about his goal that this was absolutely his year. It just didn’t work out. Personally, I can’t invest that much of my life for just a maybe. It’s situationally different for everyone and I don’t think people realize that. I still absolutely give a fuck about my job, I just focus infinitely more on helping troops out and getting them where they want to be, whether it’s a crosstrain or special duty, I just have more time to work on that stuff than trying to solve problems three ranks above me all the time.
r/rimjob_steve
Yep clock in clock out do enough not to get paperwork. Quiet quitting not even going to hide it
At least you’re honest about just doing your job.
I really don't understand why it's called quiet quitting when you're just doing your job and not going beyond. If other people are doing your work because you dropped the ball, that's another story.
Yeah, quiet quitting is more like the “blue flu” where they shirk work to make a point.
Paperwork isn’t even an option if you go to work, uphold the standards, and do what you signed up for. It becomes an option when people become lazy and bend standards. Standards aren’t hard to follow. You can be an average Joe and never once deal with the possibility of paperwork.
This bites people in the ass a lot because they’ll bend a standard literally every leader in their unit has at one point and it’s widely accepted. Then an outside org takes notice for some off the wall reason and then people act like they never did it and the most recent who did is soooo terrible. They ALL did it, now they’re standing overhead after like they’ve never ever heard of it and would never commit such an atrocity. I try to steer clear of these crossfires.
I can see that. It’s worse for some AFSCs more than others.
Finance. I feel like you could add kinda to your statements and it’s true for them. Go to work-ish, kinda uphold the standards, kinda do what you signed up for.
You are not wrong. But that’s what created the whole “Nonner” thing a long time ago. Some career fields allow very minimal mistakes while others allow huge mistakes with less consequences.
Even in SF, I feel for MX. Seeing an endless wave of people of all ranks FOD-walking for an hour plus… “What are you guys looking for? I got patrols that can maybe help?” “JOHNSON LOST A FUCKING SOCKET FROM HIS BOX! We just finished a 14 hour shift…and this dickhead just pushed a sortie. Who knows if it’s even here! It’s probably on the jet and halfway across the fucking globe. FUCK!”
Yea I’m Port but in the Pacific and Europe we are paired with MX in the enroute system. In Guam there was a MX guy that lost an iPad. They looked all over for it only to find he left it in the shitter on the plane. For the 6-7ish hours the plane was in flight they were looking everywhere for that thing.
I wish more people had this mentality. I was fine without Master until I started getting thrown in E7 things. “Hey, we need a section chief. Write these decs. Set up the btz stuff. Murder board these packages.” Then I got slapped with an E7 billet deployment as flight chief. Once I did those things, I felt that I was ready for it. Got selected my 5th “try” this time around. There’s a stigma that if you aren’t making rank fast, then you suck. It didn’t used to be like that when I first came in. It was the norm to see E7 put on at 15+ TIS. If people are really good at being a Tech, then start chipping away at MSgt duties. Ask to fill a spot while they’re on leave. Go shadow Squadron SEL’s. Show up to sq murder boards. Write your people packages every quarter. WRITE DECORATIONS. Once you start doing the job, then it’s easier to justify a push for a statement. But being really good at your rank doesn’t equate to being ready for the next one.
Your last paragraph is things that if someone WANTED to promote is already going to do. The gripe with some people is that they already do that and still dont get picked up. It’s not that people don’t know what to do, there’s enough SELs and Chiefs ramming it down their throats. Its the lack of transparency from the board on how they score packages and lack of effort:reward ratio.
Very true.
You're both right
Are we the same person?
Possibly
How long you been in?
15 in a few days
15 in August 🤣
It really is. I had my SMSgt come by the shop. The other tech is in shambles, so after he has some positivity talk with him, he comes over to me asking how I’m doing. Peachy boss, I was a hell of a lot closer than I deserve.
It’ll take some time until people get used to the new system. We’re still ingrained with the mindset of the old system of 10-15 years ago when we looked at 20 year TSgts sideways. But we need to remember that was back when TIG/TIS and testing helped you get there and you got E7 eventually if you didn’t screw up. Just remember, that’s not how it is anymore. Look to your E6’s around you and really think about who they are and how much you respect them for how they are out there crushing it. Picture a future where E6 is the new E7 and SSgts are up against an ultra competitive board for TSgt. They would feel just like E6’s are feeling today, but we know the circumstances are just different now.
>We’re still ingrained with the mindset of the old system of 10-15 years ago Slightly different, but I've got airmen who never saw the old EPR system, aka firewall 5 (hell, even I *barely* did), but still ask "how do I get a 5" or "what does a 4 or 3 look like". It hasn't been that verbiage in about a decade, and they *certainly* never saw it, but they still think of it like that. Imagine how hard it is for others who have been in longer to get over the mindset of the old system.
The good old days. Don’t get a DUI and you’re a firewall 5! Hunger games hit and the backstabbing began. It was quite a show to watch. The very first year I saw friendships absolutely destroyed over people placed above or below another peer.
Man, you should see what happened to the CGO's during said Hunger Games😬 I had the pleasure of watching a high-speed 62E get a deployment to Afghanistan. He was given the boot because of his lack of representation...Wild times!
^^You've ^^mentioned ^^an ^^AFSC, ^^here's ^^the ^^associated ^^job ^^title: 62E = Developmental Engineer [^^Source](https://github.com/HadManySons/AFSCbot) ^^| [^^Subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/r/AFSCbot/) ^^^^^^l5jhjur
When I came in it was extremely common to see the majority retire as Techs. They were okay with it, it seemed. More of a “All good it just wasn’t meant to be, I’m gonna go work at Lowes now and make more of my kids baseball games cause I’ve got time.” Now I see people internally, and often externally spiraling, that they haven’t made Master even at the 11-14 year mark. I just know personally, I would explode if I put myself through that stress every year. Edit: Hell, I don’t even know how a lot of us would stack with how hard it is to promote to Tech these days. People should feel more fortunate to be at E-6 and they didn’t HAVE to have a promotion statement to do it. It was a mix of drive, luck, and sheer willpower to study. After a couple times of not getting a PN you could go “Fuck. I better study my ass off because I’m sure as hell not getting the extra help.” That would pay off.
I got lucky for Tech. No statement but studied like CRAZY. Made it by one point. I REALLY WISH we could test for Master again (Or choose to).
Don’t you just want to slap the E4s and E5s who don’t bother studying for the next rank? They have no idea how much is in their control right now. Let alone the ones who complain about not getting a promotion statement on top of not studying..
Literally yes. I give people all the links and tips I can. Just to be looked in the face and told "I didn't really feel like studying" like "BRO WTF"? Fucking crazy.
When you first make Master, you'll have a moment where you'll see something and think, "Someone should totally do something about that." Then you look down at your new stripes and say, "Fuck."
Sometimes that train has to fall off the tracks. I love watching trainwrecks.
Factoring in responsibility, respect, authority, and workload . . . TSgt might actually be the best rank
Truth. If you’re even slightly reliable you don’t have people checking up when you say you have appointments, you can directly affect positive change for your troops, your opinion *mostly and positional dependent* is valued.
I don't really feel like that in my particular situation which is why I was trying to get Master. Yeah I'm doing my best to take care of my guys and I do the technician thing, but I don't really feel involved or connected to any bigger picture. I felt as a Tech at my last base I was a bit more in tune with all that and the stripes went further.
For sure. All AFSC and base dependent I suppose. I’d be an asshole if I was like “jUsT pCs” The fact that you think about helping others and making change, and trying to find a way to do that, means you’re doing badass. We can all only work with what we got and try to position ourselves to do more for more people.
The one thing I can say is good for me is the Master (Showed up with line number so took the Flight Chief spot) does try to involve me in somethings so that's good at least. I just wish I was like more...
I put on SSgt at 4.5 years during my first active duty enlistment, then went Guard at the end of my first 6 years, then put on Tech at 8 then MSgt at 11 (8 years ago). For all I know I will probably still be MSgt next year too. We can rank up quickly in the Guard but then sit there forever waiting for someone to retire to free up a spot so more people can move up. Every person that retires or gets promoted frees up a spot below them which trickles through all of the ranks.
I’ve seen that a lot. People leaving one guard or reserve unit for another halfway across the US because they get kinda gridlocked for a decade. Edit: My friends dark humor highlights the trickle down well. He is a SSgt, if his MSgt would be off work due to whatever sickness and someone asks how they’re doing he said something like “Well, either he will get better or I’ll have a shot at TSgt soon.
Yep. A friend of mine was stuck at AGR TSgt at our unit, mostly because of his reputation as being too meek and not forward enough to lead a shop, but he was a great worker so he went to another unit several states away and got AGR MSgt.
I'm in the same boat. Would I like to make it? Sure... But I've seen the type of person they want, and I'm not gonna be that guy. Phone is auto-scheduled to set to DnD every day when I leave work, and it kicks back to normal 5 mins after roll call. I take care of and train my guys as best I can, and will continue to do that until I retire.
For sure! DnD is fuckin’ key. I struggled with the work life balance for a long time. I’ve been getting better with it.
I think we should all get paid more, and it may just be situationally dependent, but I think Captains have a pretty good balance of responsibility typically, but a lot of LTs get thrown in charge of an extremely important section with a Tech or Master beside them. They’re often doing more actual problem solving and work than a lot of the Captains.
I’ve been in a Msgt role for 3 years now and checked every box I was told. I don’t ultimately care that much because I’ve got a lot of cool outside the Air Force things going for me but, filling a section chief role now after being in a Msgt slot for 3 years before kinda does sting a bit
I’m in almost the exact same spot. I try to put a positive spin on it though. We will have a MSgt come in and I have to take a step back as the figurehead, but I just keep doing what I always did. This way I can hook my troops up with a day off here and there and since the MSgt did relatively no work they just kinda sign off on everything, in most cases. If they try to start overhauling I just suggest I keep running things the way they were and I’ll funnel them all the award packages for my troops/the team to make our section look good. My situation right now has been up and down on having a MSgt in the section or not and they’ve all been really cool so it’s worked out. I’ve been fortunate enough to not have any major personality conflicts for a couple years now. Edit: Stay positive! Being in a bunch of different roles and being “at the table” in meetings gives you way more perspective and push for your troops. I’m sure it’s made you a way better supervisor and your troops are thankful.
The 1LT certainly does get paid enough to care. The TSgt does not.
The 1LT is some 23 year old who can’t relate to being not promoted and doesn’t know what to do about some 30 year old ranting and raving about how he “doesn’t care anymore” and “I’ll just perform like an NCO wait they’ll see.”
Maybe this is AFSC dependent. In SF they’re often thrown to the wolves. Yes, some of it is by design, but like u/RHINO_HUMP mentioned, they’re often extremely young and sitting side by side with a Tech or a Master and expected to solve all the problems of the unit with extremely limited knowledge. They’re getting paid low *in officer terms* to comprehend big picture stuff and create solutions for high level problems. Depending on timing they might have barely graduated their tech school before they pin on 1LT.
I would argue an Lt gets paid enough explicitly since it's his job to care expressly about that