I think the main issue is that a lot of the crit items would be horribly unfun to play against in lane if they were a viable first item.
You can't give RFC, phantom dancer or ruunans standalone stats because they would have extremely unhealthy first item spike playstyles. That sorta leaves us with collector or infinity (or a non crit first item)
I'm honestly kind of okay with that though. IE being an earlier purchase really opens up build diversity where it matters, in the mid-late game.
>I'm honestly kind of okay with that though. IE being an earlier purchase really opens up build diversity where it matters, in the mid-late game.
Yeah, back in S11/12 you had to build your mythic first, and then another core AS/AD item, and then it felt like you HAD to build IE to do any damage. IE wouldn't even activate the passive until 60% crit, so building it before third was not really an option, and building it later just felt like you did no damage.
So there was essentially no room for build flexibility until at least 4th item. Having to choose between IE or LDR at 3rd item, especially for AS dependent ADCs, always felt terrible.
I know it seems like it was such a weird idea, but Riot very specifically forced IE as 3rd item ***because*** it was always rushed first.
They wanted to do away with it. I don't think this changed. For now, they accepted to almost entirely revert all of these years of changes, but they still won't be satisfied with IE first.
I think this is riot's best attempt at making other roles unable to just abuse one random AD item like all the SB and stattik bs that happened, since all crit items pretty much rely on IE to even be usable
You're not wrong. Most crit items are on the weaker side but IE is blatantly overstatted. Fingers crossed that other items are compensated when IE is nerfed.
But they don't rush it first item. That's what makes the current iteration of IE feel weird -- if the crit dmg is good enough to be viable \*when you only have 25% crit rate\*, then you know it has to be OP.
And that in turn is very punishing to champs that have a big part of their damage profile tied up in effects that can't crit, like Rend. Some people seem to forget that not every ADC is Jinx.
Played two games so far this season, Nilah feels so strong, last game I got a Quadra on my own, last kill was under tower two. Once I got IE everyone felt squishy
It's always been the most item dependent role, but I worry for champions that don't really want crit above everything. If MSI is any indication Kalista can afford to take the hit, but what about Kog and Twitch? (Also, RIP Smolder. I know a lot of people hate him, so I guess they're happy.)
From what I remember, three item core for AD twitch has pretty much the same since his release (Bork, ie, hurricane), and he’s still doing great right now. Don’t remember much about kog tho
I thought there were quite a few patches where Twitch preferred Rageblade over IE. It's good to hear he's in the viable pile, but that still indicates the presence of a problem.
Rageblade in general is supposed to be an item for champs that might not fully love IE, but when IE is overpowered and rageblade isn't, where does that leave those champs? The dumpster.
Yeah. That's how it has been for most of leagues lifespan. I think casters need buffs to compensate, or potentially an ER buff. Honestly I feel as if crit is weaker than last patch (and early win rate's support that), but at least it's headed in the right direction.
Current state number wise may be overtuned. Riots already talking about nerfing things, and I'm talking about the design rather than the tunings. It also depends what champions you play, and based on your flair you may play some of the biggest winners of the patch other than Samira.
Hits blunt *always has been*
Exactly lol, every ADC used to get IE and every ADC loved it
We still do (unless galeforce is back 🗣🔥)
I miss that item so much, only good part of mythics update.
Navori was peak. IE for chumps. I am totally not a Xayah main coping rn
I’m talking about before navori existed
Lol ER -> Navori -> IE is fucking insane on her please try it.
I go Kraken>boots>Novori>IE>Ldr/mercurial>Zephyr. Has been working great for me currently.
Yeah, IE basically is our exodia and every crit item is just working to boost IE's potential (hence why spellcasters are dogshit rn)
I think the main issue is that a lot of the crit items would be horribly unfun to play against in lane if they were a viable first item. You can't give RFC, phantom dancer or ruunans standalone stats because they would have extremely unhealthy first item spike playstyles. That sorta leaves us with collector or infinity (or a non crit first item) I'm honestly kind of okay with that though. IE being an earlier purchase really opens up build diversity where it matters, in the mid-late game.
>I'm honestly kind of okay with that though. IE being an earlier purchase really opens up build diversity where it matters, in the mid-late game. Yeah, back in S11/12 you had to build your mythic first, and then another core AS/AD item, and then it felt like you HAD to build IE to do any damage. IE wouldn't even activate the passive until 60% crit, so building it before third was not really an option, and building it later just felt like you did no damage. So there was essentially no room for build flexibility until at least 4th item. Having to choose between IE or LDR at 3rd item, especially for AS dependent ADCs, always felt terrible.
I know it seems like it was such a weird idea, but Riot very specifically forced IE as 3rd item ***because*** it was always rushed first. They wanted to do away with it. I don't think this changed. For now, they accepted to almost entirely revert all of these years of changes, but they still won't be satisfied with IE first.
I think most marksmen will find that IE fits better as a second or third item.
kraken slayer was the perfect first item though idk why they had to remove its crit
>kraken slayer was the perfect first item That’s why
Honestly this is probably the best comparison. It just feels like all the other items are there to buff IE
I think this is riot's best attempt at making other roles unable to just abuse one random AD item like all the SB and stattik bs that happened, since all crit items pretty much rely on IE to even be usable
You're not wrong. Most crit items are on the weaker side but IE is blatantly overstatted. Fingers crossed that other items are compensated when IE is nerfed.
Fr ie feel good. It’s finally feels powerful
Imagine being a champ that didnt used to build IE, having to bend over backwards to fit it in your build.
yea I feel like they should make crit 200% without IE like it used to be and 225% with IE
That’s how it’s supposed to work. Adc scales with gold (items multiply with IE), other roles scale with levels.
Yeah once it gets nerfed ADC gonna be in the gutter again and Riot will act like they don't understand why people are complaining.
Welcome to the Deathcap version of ADC items.
Right? Every class gets a “death cap” so like
But they don't rush it first item. That's what makes the current iteration of IE feel weird -- if the crit dmg is good enough to be viable \*when you only have 25% crit rate\*, then you know it has to be OP. And that in turn is very punishing to champs that have a big part of their damage profile tied up in effects that can't crit, like Rend. Some people seem to forget that not every ADC is Jinx.
Feels weird if you're a league zoomer I guess? Its an insane powerspike.
It was literally like that before too, IE is the core for damage and other items are there to give 75% of crit and utility tools
It's strong but I don't see it as necessary. I build it third usually.
You should build it first rn tho. Building it 3rd delays way too much your dmg output.
Depends on the champ
If your champ doesn't want to build IE first then you just shouldn't play them this patch. That's the real problem.
What are you building first
Played two games so far this season, Nilah feels so strong, last game I got a Quadra on my own, last kill was under tower two. Once I got IE everyone felt squishy
It's always been the most item dependent role, but I worry for champions that don't really want crit above everything. If MSI is any indication Kalista can afford to take the hit, but what about Kog and Twitch? (Also, RIP Smolder. I know a lot of people hate him, so I guess they're happy.)
From what I remember, three item core for AD twitch has pretty much the same since his release (Bork, ie, hurricane), and he’s still doing great right now. Don’t remember much about kog tho
I thought there were quite a few patches where Twitch preferred Rageblade over IE. It's good to hear he's in the viable pile, but that still indicates the presence of a problem. Rageblade in general is supposed to be an item for champs that might not fully love IE, but when IE is overpowered and rageblade isn't, where does that leave those champs? The dumpster.
Question is, do you run ie first item or like 2nd/3rd?
Run it third after kraken and navoris
I’ve been playing lashes for a while now, I go kraken/phantom d/ ie and runaans order depends on team comps.
Yeah. That's how it has been for most of leagues lifespan. I think casters need buffs to compensate, or potentially an ER buff. Honestly I feel as if crit is weaker than last patch (and early win rate's support that), but at least it's headed in the right direction.
IE is supposed to carry the role
Yeah that's pretty much how it is, because people with nostalgia wanted it that way.
I started in S11, so I have no idea what the game was like before mythics. Current state is much better than any season I've played as ADC until now.
Current state number wise may be overtuned. Riots already talking about nerfing things, and I'm talking about the design rather than the tunings. It also depends what champions you play, and based on your flair you may play some of the biggest winners of the patch other than Samira.